Biden to be indicted by "Citizens Grand Jury"

[Biff Tannen 45495]

1 hour ago, Hookah Horns said:

Kangaroo courts aren't illegal...they're just frowned upon, like masturbating on an airplane. 

[Gil Bang 25898]

30 minutes ago, Hookah Horns said:

Kangaroo courts aren't illegal...they're just frowned upon, like [s]masturbating[/s] [b]dipping[/b] on an airplane. 

I don't know of a particular law either, but as we know, there's a federal law against more or less everything. I'm sure they could cook something up. 

 

[TwiceHorn 31279]

1 hour ago, jimmyjazz said:

As usual, I'm flying by the seat of my pants.  To me, this seems to be an attempt to circumvent the rule of law.  Vigilante justice, as it were.  Is this not illegal in our world?

I admit, I am routinely dumbfounded by the shit that actually isn't illegal, but starting with (a) attorney and (b) our established justice system, it boggles the mind that this is kosher.  Obviously, the guy has had plenty of censures in his career, but damn, if you literally advocate for a "trial" of the President outside of the system we have in place to . . . try people . . . how is this not grounds for major penalties?  I guess there's the difference between talk and action, maybe?

Well, mostly because it's a bunch of nonsense talk.  So yeah.  For now, it's just make-believe, pretend crap.

Certainly, it's not conducive to engendering respect for the law or judiciary or other legal systems.  But that complaint is probably a little too abstract, unless it's coupled with some kind of criminal or unethical act.

It might be evidence of psychological problems that, like Lin Wood, expose him to investigation for fitness.

[jimmyjazz 45558]

I'd like to know how far one has to go down the path of advocating extra-judicial courts before one gets in deep shit. I would hope the answer would be "not very far", but hey, 1A and all that, I guess.  Or insanity.

[Goredho 17348]

Oh, look, the brown shits are back.

Edited April 9, 2021 by Goredho
brown shirts, but the typo is just as accurate

[SquishMitten 10401]

Honest question:  wouldn't such a circumvention of our justice system be grounds for disbarment, if not prosecution?  I mean, an attorney is an agent of the court, no?

I’d be pretty surprised if such a thing wasn’t grounds for disbarment. Of course, that probably wouldn’t matter to him. I assume he’s receiving more in donations from this kind of shit than he makes from actual legal work. And you don’t need a law license to practice in a fake court

ETA: to clarify, I’m talking about them going through with this whole plan and attempting to issue an arrest warrant for the president. Just talking about it might not actually be punishable. It’s just so insane it’s possible nobody ever thought about making it a crime

[Fudge Nuggets 19151]

3 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Well, to be prosecuted, there would have to be a criminal law on the books.  Criminal laws usually get enacted in response to an actual or perceived crime problem.

Inasmuch as this is as unprecedented as it is unbelievable, I can't think of a criminal law that clearly criminalizes this kind of behavior.

Similarly, I'm not sure there's an ethical rule that forbids this clearly and I'm relatively certain there's little or no precedent for discipline, let alone disbarment, for such a whacked out thing.

Dude, stop trying to justify this type of bullshit with legal mambo jumbo and just admit that your lot has no fucking spine and will never sanction one of their own.

[TwiceHorn 31279]

38 minutes ago, Fudge Nuggets said:

Dude, stop trying to justify this type of bullshit with legal mambo jumbo and just admit that your lot has no fucking spine and will never sanction one of their own.

Nah.

Because that's bullshit.

What Klayman is doing right now is basically LARPing.

Pretty much everyone has the right to LARP.  Until someone gets their eye put out.

 

Edited April 10, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[Beau Vine 54001]

3 hours ago, Hookah Horns said:

The best part is that he preemptively sued the bar displinary cmte members even before they made a recommendation on his punishment. Then they issued a 200 page analysis of all his shenanigans and somehow reasoned against disbarment, but recommended 33 months suspension. And he for some reason gets 3 months. After 3 decades of this shit he finally gets suspended for 90 whole days. 

TwiceHorn will be along shortly to waive his hands and declare how nuanced the situation is, and that disbarment is a very serious issue.  

 

 

Edited April 10, 2021 by Beau Vine
Whoops, he already did. Bravo!

[Beau Vine 54001]

12 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Pretty much everyone has the right to LARP. 

Yet ironically, it's illegal to practice law without a license.

[henrygandorf 29177]

at this point it seems like they're using president biden to get to hunter.  they want hunter so badly they can fucking taste it.

[Hookah Horns 3081]

20 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Nah.

Because that's bullshit.

What Klayman is doing right now is basically LARPing.

Pretty much everyone has the right to LARP.  Until someone gets their eye put out.

 

But looking at this loser's vexatious abuse of the courts for years on end, you have to admit that it's a disgrace this guy hasn't been disbarred. Which I think is more what @Fudge Nuggetsis getting at. 

[Hookah Horns 3081]

2 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

I'd like to know how far one has to go down the path of advocating extra-judicial courts before one gets in deep shit. I would hope the answer would be "not very far", but hey, 1A and all that, I guess.  Or insanity.

The line would be crossed around the time you start making plans to detain the accused (conspiracy to kidnap).

The LARPing defense likely won't fly. 

Edited April 10, 2021 by Hookah Horns

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

6 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

If there is one thing we have learned over the past 2-3 years, it's that militia members have two favorite hobbies:

1. Collecting firearms 
2. doing stupid illegal shit
3. documenting illegal shit
4. Fucking around
5. finding out
6. Informing on each other

Fixed for clarity 

[jimmyjazz 45558]

53 minutes ago, Hookah Horns said:

The line would be crossed around the time you start making plans to detain the accused (conspiracy to kidnap).

The LARPing defense likely won't fly. 

That smells a whole lot like the legal profession protecting their own.

And that fucking sucks.

[Mole 4320]

6 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

And I'd almost argue that Trump was able to play to these folks because he was incompetent

So one of the fears is that the next Trump won’t be such a moron, but I’m coming around to the idea that his idiocy and the movement’s effectiveness are deeply connected. Maybe the next chosen one will be even dumber because that’s what this movement thrives on. A smarter, more competent Trumpist might not have the necessary tools to wield power.

If that’s the case, I don’t think that makes the movement any less dangerous, it just makes it more maddening.

I’d also like to announce that the Court of Grand Citizens has indicted Ted Cruz for the crime of anthropomorphic impersonation.

[Sawbonz 27434]

9 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

Honest question:  wouldn't such a circumvention of our justice system be grounds for disbarment, if not prosecution?  I mean, an attorney is an agent of the court, no?

Shit man surly just needs to convene a citizens’ grand jury of our own and indict that stupid fuck

[956 Worldwide 34443]

I seem to recall some sort of people’s court “trying” and “convicting” GWB and several cabinet members for war crimes around the time of the Iraq invasion, or maybe after Abu Ghraib.  Pretty sure a people’s court was also a thing back in the hippie era.  Unless this goes beyond larping and publicity stunts, I’m not sure what you do about it. 

[Bama Llama 1447]

Definitely ten minutes 'til Wapner.

Donald Trump's Moronica was germinated in the fetid petri dish of a post-9/11 Idiocracy: This Time It's Real nation of screen watchers and social media addicts (as opposed to clever Surly posters), many of whom had never cast a vote in their lives.  And now they come at you spewing constitutional law.  The sad irony is that Joe and Mika often had this assclown on Morning Joe as a guest interviewee and commenter.  Jaysus, Mary and Joseph.

[Pasken 1309]

19 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

I wish that this was entirely sarcastic/joking.  It's not.  These psychopaths are enabling and empowering the dumber level of psychopaths.  The chance of some band of psychos attempting an armed "arrest" of Biden at some point in his tenure is uncomfortably north of zero.  40% (at least) of our country is clinically fucking insane.

It’s not 40% m. It’s probably closer to 15.

[TwiceHorn 31279]

12 hours ago, Beau Vine said:

TwiceHorn will be along shortly to waive his hands and declare how nuanced the situation is, and that disbarment is a very serious issue.  

 

 

Well, it is.  If not nuanced, it's a really bizarre situation that the law isn't tailored to remedy.

 

 

[TwiceHorn 31279]

11 hours ago, Hookah Horns said:

The line would be crossed around the time you start making plans to detain the accused (conspiracy to kidnap).

The LARPing defense likely won't fly. 

I agree with that.

 

12 hours ago, Hookah Horns said:

But looking at this loser's vexatious abuse of the courts for years on end, you have to admit that it's a disgrace this guy hasn't been disbarred. Which I think is more what @Fudge Nuggetsis getting at. 

That may be so. I know he's a jackhole, but I don't know specifics other than the wikipedia article.

It looks like where he's fucked around, he's been sanctioned and locally disbarred.

I don't have a good feel for when an attorneys litigation conduct gets to the point of revocation of law license.  That doesn't seem to happen too often.  One would think that being declared a vexatious litigant in multiple jurisdictions would start to get close, but I can't recall ever seeing that as a basis for discipline.

[pyrohornIII 4809]

Because we deserve some calm.  And this seemed as good a place as any to put this.  In fact it should be spread all over the damn country.

The Bob Ross Virtual Art Gallery.

 

[TwiceHorn 31279]

To that end, here's a story about a lawyer found to be a vexatious litigant and disbarred.  But he was disbarred for stealing client funds.  http://www.metnews.com/articles/2013/vexatious081213.htm

And since people seem to think I'm making up shit about attorneys' First Amendment rights interfering with the bar's ability to discipline them, here's a 60-year-old Supreme Court case on it . https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/360/622/

tl;dr a liberal lawyer made some intemperate remarks about the trial judge and government lawyers in a union racketeering case.  The Territoral Bar of Hawaii disciplined her on the ground that her remarks reflected poorly on the profession and the administration of justice.  Brennan and a majority reversed, holding that such vague notions of propriety didn't outweigh the First Amendment rights.

The cat really got out of the bag when the Supreme Court trashed the prohibition on lawyer advertising, again because First Amendment trumped the interest in keeping cheesedick motherfuckers off the TV and elsewhere.

I'm not making this shit up.  I'm not "waving my hands."  I'm telling you how it pretty much is (leaving some room for the vagary that inheres to any legal situation).  Sorry it doesn't comport with your sense of how it should be.

Edited April 10, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[SquishMitten 10401]

at this point it seems like they're using president biden to get to hunter.  they want hunter so badly they can fucking taste it.

Because every accusation...

It’s really Don Jr.

[David Dennison 18658]

On 4/9/2021 at 12:02 PM, Brisketexan said:

....until the "Heroic People's Militia of Greater Alabama, 4th Division, Mechanized [Rascal scooters]" decides to take action and execute on the "arrest warrant" issued by this "Heroic People's Court."

The GQP continues to actively foment violent insurrection.  They are going to keep doing so until it works.

So far, the government has successfully defended against the attempts.  I think we need to contemplate what the rest of us need to do when the government fails to do so.

I will totally watch the civil war on tee vee.

[Biff Tannen 45495]

20 hours ago, henrygandorf said:

at this point it seems like they're using president biden to get to hunter.  they want hunter so badly they can fucking taste it.

I have to think it's because they really want to nominate Jr if dotard doesn't run in 2024, but they know he'll have all this baggage, so they are trying to accuse Hunter of it first.

Edited April 10, 2021 by Biff Tannen
that's insane, but par for the course for these morons; Edit again because what SquishMitten said

[Serak The Preparer 3424]

19 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Nah.

Because that's bullshit.

What Klayman is doing right now is basically LARPing.

Pretty much everyone has the right to LARP.  Until someone gets their eye put out.

 

That is a bullshit and insulting analogy. When someone LARPs in the woods they don't impact anyone else. When Powell, this asshole, or other people abuse the legal system, it causes economic loss to individuals and organizations. If I was the target of one of these shitheads I would have to incur legal expense and be stressed as hell just because I don't know how to legally respond. I would know it's bullshit, you would know it's bullshit, but I would still have to deal with it.

Dismissing it as LARPing or other hobby is just another way of ignoring the legal profession's obligation to police their own.

[Mrs Whiggins 13049]

9 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

I have to think it's because they really want to nominate Jr if dotard doesn't run in 2024, but they know he'll have all this baggage, so they are trying to accuse Hunter of it first.

It hurts Joseph Biden, too. Hunter is his only surviving child and it is distracting to a point. In addition, if they can bother Hunter to the point that he lashes out, has to go into rehab, you name it, they will have more stories. But as you say, it deflects from Don Jr and also keeps people from wondering to what ends Ivanka is working. She went radio silent for the most part and several years ago, she was working with a speech coach, so most likely she is quietly doing her homework.

[TwiceHorn 31279]

24 minutes ago, Serak The Preparer said:

That is a bullshit and insulting analogy. When someone LARPs in the woods they don't impact anyone else. When Powell, this asshole, or other people abuse the legal system, it causes economic loss to individuals and organizations. If I was the target of one of these shitheads I would have to incur legal expense and be stressed as hell just because I don't know how to legally respond. I would know it's bullshit, you would know it's bullshit, but I would still have to deal with it.

Dismissing it as LARPing or other hobby is just another way of ignoring the legal profession's obligation to police their own.

I don't put what this guy is doing in this instance as anywhere near what Powell did.  She filed frivolous lawsuits and appears to be en route to being sanctioned.  She spewed lies and is getting her ass sued off for it, and, if things pan out as we suspect, may face discipline for that, too.

What Klayman is doing here (as opposed to some of the other shit he's pulled, which I am not talking about) is pure fantasy bullshit, it's not "abusing the legal system" in any way shape or form.

How on earth is Biden or anyone else going to have to respond to this other than by calling it bullshit, if he even responds at all.

Now, the game changes when these lunatics attempt to do anything beyond hold their little playskool court.  If they try to detain someone, or file a frivolous lawsuit, the game changes entirely.

It's stupid, vile, idiotic words.  Live Action Role Play fits it pretty damned exactly.  In fact, it wouldn't surprise me at all if nothing at all happens beyond that idiot video.

I agree that it's distasteful that a licensed attorney is doing this and Klayman is a huge piece of shit.  But most professions have a fair number of huge pieces of shit that keep their professional licenses.  Whether he should be disbarred for his other, actually judicial or legal actions is a separate question.

Edited April 10, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[Sbbruin 21734]

On 4/9/2021 at 1:21 PM, Orale said:

On 4/9/2021 at 1:15 PM, MC Fresh Breath said:

 
This is from last year but brought up again on reddit recently.   This dude's dying breaths were essentially Fuck the Libs Praise Trump.  That's the thing about cults.  
 
 

 

Fight the hood fight. I'm game.

There’s a thread for that.

[MC Fresh Breath 4074]

13 minutes ago, Sbbruin said:

There’s a thread for that.

Did you see what I was replying to with my post?

 

Edited April 10, 2021 by MC Fresh Breath

[TwiceHorn 31279]

Incidentally, Klayman has been doing this citizen's grand jury schtick for years.  citizensgrandjury.org.

And Klayman isn't the only perpetrator.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizen_grand_jury  One group, apparently not including Klayman, filed an indictment in the DC District Court, which was dismissed by Lambeth in two sentences.  If Klayman tried that, I'm sure he'd face sanctions.

Edited April 10, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[Sawbonz 27434]

32 minutes ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

It hurts Joseph Biden, too. Hunter is his only surviving child and it is distracting to a point.

I don’t see this distracting Biden at this point. Unless Hunter kills someone what is there left he can do to disappoint Biden?

 

This assumes of course he has come to terms with his son as an addict, and  all that goes with it, including the real possibility of losing him to an overdose 
 

 

[Goredho 17348]

The President is about to be found guilty by reason of the prosecution’s insanity.  That’s gotta be a first, am I right?

[henrygandorf 29177]

the fact that this type of shit isn't getting more attention just shows how desensitized we've all become to the general psychotic fuckery from the right.

they have completely normalized the nonsense.  their plan is working.

[jimmyjazz 45558]

1 hour ago, Serak The Preparer said:

Dismissing it as LARPing or other hobby is just another way of ignoring the legal profession's obligation to police their own.

I completely agree.  I also think the legal profession doesn't agree, at all.  Attorneys in general seem to feel they have no higher obligation than the man on the street, which, while possibly true, is monumentally fucked up and represents a whole lot of what is wrong with this country.

Edited April 10, 2021 by jimmyjazz

[TwiceHorn 31279]

35 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

I completely agree.  I also think the legal profession doesn't agree, at all.  Attorneys in general seem to feel they have no higher obligation than the man on the street, which, while possibly true, is monumentally fucked up and represents a whole lot of what is wrong with this country.

Most of attorney discipline is focused on the fact that lawyers are fiduciaries for their clients.  Anything that tends to implicate that or their trustworthiness with client funds gets acted on swiftly and certainly.  The second biggest area is incompetence or negligence in representation that works harm to the client, as in a loss of rights.

When it comes to the First Amendment, though, lawyers are pretty much just like the man in the street.  A big part of that is that today's unpopular, vile, seditious speech is tomorrow's Supreme Court case.  The First Amendment is pesky as fuck.

Edited April 10, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[Mrs Whiggins 13049]

1 hour ago, Sawbonz said:

I don’t see this distracting Biden at this point. Unless Hunter kills someone what is there left he can do to disappoint Biden?

 

This assumes of course he has come to terms with his son as an addict, and  all that goes with it, including the real possibility of losing him to an overdose 
 

 

The distraction was more about the latter sentiment and also how the press attention on Hunter is extreme. It's not only paparazzi level intrusion, but the possible issue with deranged people trying to harm his son might actually be more concerning to the President than if it were his own life. He seems like that type of person--to discount his own safety over others coming to harm.

[JimmyJames 12271]

Republicans have nothing on Joe who they want to attack and discredit, but try as they might they can’t. So instead as a result they attack his remaining son and wife. 
 

Tells you all you need to know about them. They are subhuman scum.

[Sawbonz 27434]

22 minutes ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

The distraction was more about the latter sentiment and also how the press attention on Hunter is extreme. It's not only paparazzi level intrusion, but the possible issue with deranged people trying to harm his son might actually be more concerning to the President than if it were his own life. He seems like that type of person--to discount his own safety over others coming to harm.

Hunter has a SS detail no?

[TwiceHorn 31279]

40 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Most of attorney discipline is focused on the fact that lawyers are fiduciaries for their clients.  Anything that tends to implicate that or their trustworthiness with client funds gets acted on swiftly and certainly.  The second biggest area is incompetence or negligence in representation that works harm to the client, as in a loss of rights.

When it comes to the First Amendment, though, lawyers are pretty much just like the man in the street.  A big part of that is that today's unpopular, vile, seditious speech is tomorrow's Supreme Court case.  The First Amendment is pesky as fuck.

The other thing about lawyers is that their very nexus to the legal system and to government that makes you think they should be held to a higher standard when speaking on those topics means that their speech is political in nature quite often, limitations on which (like lawyer discipline over such speech) receive the highest scrutiny from the courts.

[jimmyjazz 45558]

8 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

The other thing about lawyers is that their very nexus to the legal system and to government that makes you think they should be held to a higher standard when speaking on those topics means that their speech is political in nature quite often, limitations on which (like lawyer discipline over such speech) receive the highest scrutiny from the courts.

Except that it clearly doesn't.

[TwiceHorn 31279]

8 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Except that it clearly doesn't.

Hm?  I said limitations on such speech receive intense scrutiny from the courts, regardless of the speaker.

Edited April 10, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[jimmyjazz 45558]

1 minute ago, TwiceHorn said:

Hm?

The courts don't censure attorneys at anywhere near the rate they should.

My opinion, of course.  I go back to this case -- if one is an agent of the court, then one should not be trying to circumvent the court.  It's a very simple conclusion, based in right and wrong, not "the law", which is as often as not monumentally fucked up.

You should probably stop trying to change my mind, because you can't.

[TwiceHorn 31279]

3 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

The courts don't censure attorneys at anywhere near the rate they should.

My opinion, of course.  I go back to this case -- if one is an agent of the court, then one should not be trying to circumvent the court.  It's a very simple conclusion, based in right and wrong, not "the law", which is as often as not monumentally fucked up.

You should probably stop trying to change my mind, because you can't.

I'm not really.  I'm trying to explain why it is the way it is.

State bars and disciplinary committees have been trying to disicpline lawyers and place limitations on their speech as long as they've existed, all in the name of some sort of propriety.

The courts have slapped them down more often than not.  The bars and disciplinary committees have largely given up on it, or, to put it another way, when a discipline case involves speech, they choose their battles very carefully, because to lose would further weaken their ability to regulate.

Edited April 10, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[jimmyjazz 45558]

I don't care who is to blame.  This is a perfect example of how the system is fucked up.

 

[TwiceHorn 31279]

Just now, jimmyjazz said:

I don't care who is to blame.  This is a perfect example of how the system is fucked up.

 

Well like the First Amendment protects Nazis marching in Skokie, it protects members of the bar who say shitass things.  When they start to DO shitass things, the system starts to work.

[Mrs Whiggins 13049]

1 hour ago, Sawbonz said:

Hunter has a SS detail no?

It is offered to every immediate family member as well as the VP's family, so I'm going to assume so.

[Gil Bang 25898]

34 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Well like the First Amendment protects Nazis marching in Skokie, it protects members of the bar who say shitass things.  When they start to DO shitass things, the system starts to work.

I fucking hate Illinois nazis