CFP expansion discussion

[Huckleberry 32703]

21 minutes ago, Horn of Gabriel said:

For SEC to get 5 in, they need their conf champ, plus 4 of the 6 at-large spots.  Possible?  Sure.  Likely?  Hmm, we'll see I guess.  I can easily buy 3 and maybe 4 but 5?  I haven't looked into the past several years, would the top-12 rankings support that?

Regardless, the following is true:

• SEC has gotten and will get in the short/medium term more teams into the CFP than the other conferences
• That won't change until SEC starts losing on the field

You're right they won't get 5 in and usually not 4. But the stuff at the end is cute.

2013 SEC BCS Games

Oklahoma 45, Alabama 31
Florida St. 34, Auburn 31

2014 SEC CFP and NY6 BCS Games

TCU 42, Ole Miss 3
Georgia Tech 49, Mississippi St. 34
Ohio St. 42, Alabama 35

Over two seasons the SEC got its collective ass kicked on the biggest stage over and over again. 0-5. Do you want to guess what the 2015 preseason Top 10 looked like? The SEC had three teams in it even though by the end of the season they only had one team that deserved it (Ole Miss squeaked in at #10 in the postseason poll but weren't that good).

It's not about beating them on the field. They have won the PR war because other leagues didn't even fight it.

 

Edited June 17, 2021 by Huckleberry

[DanTheHorn 4901]

1 hour ago, Horn of Gabriel said:

For SEC to get 5 in, they need their conf champ, plus 4 of the 6 at-large spots.  Possible?  Sure.  Likely?  Hmm, we'll see I guess.  I can easily buy 3 and maybe 4 but 5?  I haven't looked into the past several years, would the top-12 rankings support that?

Regardless, the following is true:

• SEC has gotten and will get in the short/medium term more teams into the CFP than the other conferences
• That won't change until SEC starts losing on the field
• You can't beat them on the field w/o getting teams into the playoff, which means...
• You need to do everything you can as a conference to get more teams eligible for the playoff, not kowtow to some idea that RR is "best," or "more pure," "most real" way of getting to 1 true champion, b/c the people who matter with regard to CFP access have demonstrated that they don't care about that
• Which is the reason why people upthread are advocating for BIG12 conference wide shift in scheduling to take out the RR and replicate part of the SEC model for scheduling.  Less in-conf, more OOC, more wins, fewer losses, which...
• Starts the process of breaking the self-fulfilling prophecy the SEC has set up.  Right now we're fighting w/ one hand tied behind our back.  I don't like fighting on an unlevel playing field.

['stache 21774]

The round robin is great. P-5 should be realigned into 6-8 divisions of ten teams each. Round robin, 3 non-con, division winners get a playoff bid. If you can get to 8 divisions, no at large. Decide it on the fucking field already.

[ButtFumble 5158]

3 hours ago, Al_4_ISU said:

You realize 3 of the 5 power conferences play 9 games, right?  Big 10 and Pac 12 both have divisions and a CCG and 9 conference games.

do you realize the Big 10 came out pretty much one year after implementing the 9 game schedule and said it was a mistake

the coaches in the PAC 12 have not been happy with it for a long time because they know it hurts them

here are the articles on the PAC 12

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/1661887-nine-game-conference-schedule-gives-pac-12-a-college-football-playoff-advantage

the one above specifically talks about the strength of schedule advantage for the SEC SEC SEC even with an 8 game conference schedule and talks the same nonsense about "we play 9" and of course comes to the conclusion that "no one gives a shit"

https://www.si.com/college/2015/11/15/pac-12-college-football-playoff-oregon-stanford

in the above article even the idiot larry scott talks about the guaranteed 6 extra losses for the PAC 12 because of the extra conference game

then he basically shits on some of the garbage in the Big 10 and talks about how it does not matter if they play 9 conference games because "no one is scared of those teams" when the reality is those teams are not like the Big 12 because those teams in the Big 10 are happy to take a loss and collect a check and they are happy to live through tOSU and having 14 teams helps as well because it keeps top teams away from some of the garbage as much

then larry does the idiotic "deepest conference in the country" (hahaha yea whatever larry no one fucking cares and no one will believe that until you beat more teams OOC especially ones that are not MWC or BYU)

it also states pretty much every PAC 12 coach would go to 8 games

https://www.bruinsnation.com/2014/5/2/5674212/jim-mora-and-pac-12-coaches-wonder-why-sec-afraid-to-play-nine

hahahah that is rich jim mora calling out others for "being scared".....you got fucking fired jim try mixing in a win of relevance.....and david shaw........slow rolling to 9 conference games, missing the CFP and probably eventually getting fired.....keep up that 9 game "not scared of conference games" crap and keep missing the playoffs and getting fired eventually

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/2015/11/18/nine-game-conference-schedule-dents-pac-12s-playoff-chances/76011964/

yet another.....funny I am sure mike will not be looking for the SEC SEC SEC to play 9 conference games now that he coaches in the SEC SEC SEC at least for the next 2 seasons and probably not much longer than that (before he is fired)

 

and to the OU fan.....yes there is a chance that the Big 12 could lose greater than 50% of the additional OOC games, but that is where ADs start to earn their money and adjust their schedules much more frequently than scheduling 8 years out and saying "done" and there is PLENTY of opportunities every year to change up schedules, but it is rarely done because ADs are lazy about it......this is a long term process for the Big 12 it is not something that makes a massive immediate difference guaranteed in year one it is a long term process to make the bottom teams more competitive and to allow the top teams to not be weighed down by them and to be able to schedule for their needs and fans

it was proven mathematically in the article I posted that fewer conference games helps the top teams the most

all of the PAC 12 coaches past and present know the SEC SEC SEC (and ACC) have an advantage with 8 conference games.....the only stupid arguments they can make for 9 games are worthy of mockery and they get plenty of it as they are left out of the playoffs and the SEC SEC SEC gets at least 1 team in every year.....and as of now fan and financial support for the PAC 12 keeps declining and their conference network fails

and the issue is that much worse with the Big 12 and only 10 teams and as to adding new teams there are none that benefit the Big 12, that would no cost existing teams large amounts of money, and that would have the budget and fan and donor support to compete long term

 

 

[Zeus 5950]

4 hours ago, Al_4_ISU said:

You realize 3 of the 5 power conferences play 9 games, right?  Big 10 and Pac 12 both have divisions and a CCG and 9 conference games.

Big 10 has 14 teams and the Pac 12 doesn't ever get a team in the playoff. 

Either way, this conference sucks. Maybe it's just the style of play or the eye test (that nobody watches?), but the reputation of the big 12 is shit. 

The only way to correct this is to wipe Oklahoma off the face of the fucking planet by whooping their ass twice next year and every year. Then when in the playoffs play a fucking down or two of good defense.

 

[Zeus 5950]

3 hours ago, Huckleberry said:

You're right they won't get 5 in and usually not 4. But the stuff at the end is cute.

2013 SEC BCS Games

Oklahoma 45, Alabama 31
Florida St. 34, Auburn 31

2014 SEC CFP and NY6 BCS Games

TCU 42, Ole Miss 3
Georgia Tech 49, Mississippi St. 34
Ohio St. 42, Alabama 35

Over two seasons the SEC got its collective ass kicked on the biggest stage over and over again. 0-5. Do you want to guess what the 2015 preseason Top 10 looked like? The SEC had three teams in it even though by the end of the season they only had one team that deserved it (Ole Miss squeaked in at #10 in the postseason poll but weren't that good).

It's not about beating them on the field. They have won the PR war because other leagues didn't even fight it.

 

You walk into the CFP committee happy hour and this guy smacks your wife's ass

what do you do?

[camel at sea 589]

4 hours ago, Al_4_ISU said:

The 12 team playoff could be a blast, but it has to have some structural protections to prevent it from becoming an SEC circle jerk.

The committee membership is the "structural protection."  

After your six champs get in, you can probably pencil in two more from the B1G and SEC most years just because of the number of members both conferences will have on the committee.  That's ten of the 12 right there.  The SEC *might* get one of the two remaining bids but most likely those last two spots will be a competition between ND, Big 12 #2, PAC #2, and ACC #2.  

[Al_4_ISU 12409]

Big 10 has 14 teams and the Pac 12 doesn't ever get a team in the playoff. 
Either way, this conference sucks. Maybe it's just the style of play or the eye test (that nobody watches?), but the reputation of the big 12 is shit. 
The only way to correct this is to wipe Oklahoma off the face of the fucking planet by whooping their ass twice next year and every year. Then when in the playoffs play a fucking down or two of good defense.
 

The conference reputation sucks because ESPN doesn’t care about what happens between the Mississippi and the west coast because there aren’t that many big cities and eyeballs.

It’s really that simple. The Big 12’s reputation is simply not based in any kind of football reality

[ButtFumble 5158]

2 hours ago, Al_4_ISU said:

The conference reputation sucks because ESPN doesn’t care about what happens between the Mississippi and the west coast because there aren’t that many big cities and eyeballs.

It’s really that simple. The Big 12’s reputation is simply not based in any kind of football reality

it is based on "won truu campionz" and "errbodie play erwon" being a failure and the Big 12 having to go to get a vote to have a CCG

it is based on a drool cup wearing man toucher going through expansion stupidity and embarrassment because he was not getting any attention from the young men he had working for him

it is based on everyone looking at the conference as "Texas and OU" and Texas sucking and not even carrying that weight for the entire CFP history

and it is based on a stupid 9 game conference schedule where lower level teams serve as "wins" for other teams (mainly OU because Texas is not pulling their weight)

it is also based on only having 30 games per year where fans of other conferences and programs outside of the Big 12 really might give a shit what happens in those games

even with the PAC 12 they have 36 of those games and the Big 10 has 42 of those games so 12 more than the Big 12 once the Big 10 was dumb enough to go to 9 conference games

and it is based on the Big 12 mostly being in Texas, Oklahoma with 2 teams that recruit heavily into Texas (OU less so lately which has helped them perform better) and then some smaller populated states

it is based on the Big 12 mostly having a focus on gearing up to "win the Big 12: and thus they all play a similar style of football and even more so compete for the same type of recruits from a lot of the same areas......ISU being able to break away from that successfully is why they should be able to sustain winning for right now.....TCU placing an extreme focus on defense is why they are able to have good seasons......but the Big 12 mostly plays the same style of football, they focus too much on competing with "the rest of Big 12" and not nationally and the Big 12 thus does not draw as much national interest as they could

Edited June 17, 2021 by ButtFumble

[notre dame joe 172]

Well the Big12 CCG is hardly the first time someone dumbed down the season for a money grab. 

[Hurtlocker 2208]

14 hours ago, Dnaguy said:

[Narrator]: It won't.

The SEC will likely have 4-5 teams every year.

The 8 game conf schedule and divisions almost guarantees it. 

The top 2 teams from each division will all likely always make the playoff with a 5th team sneaking in every 3-4 years.

4-5 seems high.   Here's how the past 7 years would have played out:

 

[Dnaguy 11777]

3 hours ago, Hurtlocker said:

4-5 seems high.   Here's how the past 7 years would have played out:

 

 

But seriously, I'm guessing that whomever made up this graphic had more time to find the penultimate BCS / CFP rankings... the ones before the bowls / playoffs.

My brief 'research' looked at final rankings over the last 5-10 years and showed that the SEC constantly had 4 teams in the top 12. 

 

But hey, maybe the larger playoff shows the SEC's ass. I mean, if more teams make it to the playoffs only to shit the bed.... then the narrative changes, right?

 

[Narrorator]: It didn't

[Machinator 32097]

 

[utee94 15746]

3 hours ago, Dnaguy said:

But seriously, I'm guessing that whomever made up this graphic had more time to find the penultimate BCS / CFP rankings... the ones before the bowls / playoffs.

My brief 'research' looked at final rankings over the last 5-10 years and showed that the SEC constantly had 4 teams in the top 12. 

 

But hey, maybe the larger playoff shows the SEC's ass. I mean, if more teams make it to the playoffs only to shit the bed.... then the narrative changes, right?

 

[Narrorator]: It didn't

Yes, the graphic is based on the final CFP ranking which occurs BEFORE the post-season.  That's the only way to take a retroactive look at who the hypothetical Top 12 Playoff participants would have been,

I didn't quite believe that graphic either, but our perceptions are colored by recent history, where they've been putting 4 SEC teams into the Top 12 each year.  But it wasn't always that way.  In fact once, believe it or not, there was only ONE SEC team in the CFP Committee's season-ending Top 12. 

 

2020 Final CFP Committee Rankings (pre-bowls/CFP):

1. Alabama

2. Clemson

3. Ohio State

4.Notre Dame

5. Texas A&M

6. Florida

7. Oklahoma

8. Cincinnati

9. Georgia

10.Iowa State

11. Indiana

12. Coastal Carolina

4 SEC, 2 B12, 2 B1G, 1 ACC, 1 Independent, 1 AAC, 1 Sun Belt

---------------------------------------

2019 Final CFP Committee Rankings (pre-bowls/CFP)

1. LSU

2. Ohio State

3. Clemson

4. Oklahoma

5. Georgia

6. Oregon

7. Baylor

8. Wisconsin

9. Florida

10. Penn State

11. Utah

12. Auburn

4 SEC, 3 B1G, 2 B12, 2 PAC, 1 ACC

------------------------------------------

2018 Final CFP Committee Rankings (pre-bowls/CFP)

1. Alabama

2. Clemson

3. Notre Dame

4. Oklahoma

5. Georgia

6. Ohio State

7. Michigan

8. UCF

9. Washington 

10. Florida

11. LSU

12. Penn State

4 SEC, 3 B1G, 1 B12, 1 ACC,  1 PAC, 1 Independent, 1 AAC

----------------------------------------------

2017 Final CFP Committee Rankings (pre-bowls/CFP)

1. Clemson

2. Oklahoma

3. Georgia

4. Alabama

5. Ohio State

6. Wisconsin

7. Auburn

8. USC

9. Penn State

10. Washington

11. Miami

12. UCF

3 SEC, 3 B1G, 2 ACC, 2 PAC, 1 B12, 1 AAC

-------------------------------------------------------

2016 Final CFP Committee Rankings (pre-bowls/CFP)

1. Alabama

2. Clemson

3. Ohio State

4. Washington

5. Penn State

6. Michigan

7. Oklahoma

8. Wisconsin

9. USC

10. Colorado

11. Florida State

12. Oklahoma State

4 B1G, 3 PAC, 2 ACC, 2 B12, 1 SEC

------------------------------------------------------

2015  Final CFP Committee Rankings (pre-bowls/CFP)

1. Clemson

2. Alabama

3. Michigan State

4. Oklahoma

5. Iowa

6. Stanford

7. Ohio State

8. Notre Dame

9. Florida State

10. North Carolina

11. TCU

12. Ole Miss 

3 B1G, 3 ACC, 2 SEC, 2 B12, 1 Independent, 1 PAC

---------------------------------------------------------

2014 Final CFP Committee Rankings (pre-bowls/CFP)

1. Alabama

2. Oregon

3. Florida State

4. Ohio State

5. Baylor

6. TCU

7. Miss State

8. Michigan State

9. Ole Miss

10. Arizona

11. Kansas State

12. Georgia Tech

3 SEC, 3 B12, 2 B1G, 2 PAC, 2 ACC

 

 

[TXSooner518 2432]

Also you can't just look at top 12, because not all of the top 12 will get in.  

Both 2015 and 2019 above have an SEC team bolded at 12, but neither of those teams actually make the field, because there aren't 6 conference champs in the top 12 either of those seasons. So the conf champ below them would replace them. 

 

['stache 21774]

3 hours ago, Machinator said:

 

If I hear another coach complain about opt outs, roster management, tranfer portals, etc., I'm going to lose my fucking mind. It's almost as if they don't realize they make more in a week that most of their fans make in a year. Fucking deal with it or get a real job like the rest of us.

[Harrison Bergeron 1798]

I would just return to six, 12-team leagues. Each has two divisions with a championship game as the effective first round of the playoffs. Then you have six conference champions and two wild cards for the playoffs. Play the first round at the higher seeds home stadium and roll into the status quo.

[Machinator 32097]

 

[TXSooner518 2432]

Fuck that. Six best champions is way better. The P5 will all make it unless there is a combo of they have a fluke champion (because they stubbornly stick to arbitrary divisions instead of vastly superior pods and top 2 teams playing) AND two G5 champs are worthy, like last year with Cincy and Coastal.  If a P5 goes to pod system and 1 vs 2 title game, I would guarantee their champ makes the field every season.

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

1 hour ago, Harrison Bergeron said:

I would just return to six, 12-team leagues.

the problem there is that you would have to force some conferences to kick some teams out, and others to take teams in

there's no mechanism to do that-- I don't see how you can force the Big Ten to abandon Maryland and Rutgers, or force any schools into the Big 12 if they don't want to be there, or force the Big 12 to take new members it doesn't want

[Horn of Gabriel 1590]

1 hour ago, Machinator said:

 

Betting the fucking PAC and Rose Bowl find a way to sink this.  I have such a love/hate relationship w/ the Rose Bowl. On one had, they should be the all-time host of the CFP Championship.  The venue is just too perfect.  On the other hand fuck the Rose Bowl and their B1G/PAC hangup.

[notre dame joe 172]

3 hours ago, 'stache said:

If I hear another coach complain about opt outs, roster management, tranfer portals, etc., I'm going to lose my fucking mind. It's almost as if they don't realize they make more in a week that most of their fans make in a year. Fucking deal with it or get a real job like the rest of us.

I wonder how the opt-outs would respond to a proportional reduction in their scholarship.  Presumably they are heading to the NFL where they will make plenty per week. 

 

 

But back on topic, 'Savvy Jack Swarbrick' could easily have undone all the good work he did as AD with this BS arrangement.  He apparently designed a system that relegates his school to G5 status.

['stache 21774]

3 minutes ago, notre dame joe said:

I wonder how the opt-outs would respond to a proportional reduction in their scholarship.  Presumably they are heading to the NFL where they will make plenty per week. 

 

How would that work? They pay back a months worth of tuition? I think they'd be okay with that, meanwhile the schools and their administrators would look like complete pricks paying the coach $5 million, then bitching about scholarship dollars and kids doing what is best for their future. I seriously don't get how people don't understand the risk of injury costing kids generational wealth because you want to see them play in the RC Cola Bowl. Opting out of shitty bowl games is peak economic analysis and capitalism and is as rational an economic decision as one could dream up.

[Horn of Gabriel 1590]

24 minutes ago, notre dame joe said:

I wonder how the opt-outs would respond to a proportional reduction in their scholarship.  Presumably they are heading to the NFL where they will make plenty per week. 

 

 

But back on topic, 'Savvy Jack Swarbrick' could easily have undone all the good work he did as AD with this BS arrangement.  He apparently designed a system that relegates his school to G5 status.

Really?  Are ND fans worked up about not getting top 4?  Because, there's...a pretty clear path for ND to get a top 4 AQ...just not the one they want.

I'd argue ND has more, not less, access to CFP in the 12-team playoff.  Before you had to go undefeated or have things break just right with a loss. Now you can go 10-2 and probably still get in.  Oh and it completely takes away any pressure to join a conference, cementing ND's independent status b/c you get that without joining the ACC and not having to compete in a CCG.  Seems like a pretty fair trade, in fact I'm not sure Texas couldn't do the same, hmmm.

Edited June 18, 2021 by Horn of Gabriel

[Thiefery 4969]

On 6/17/2021 at 9:57 AM, TXSooner518 said:

Divisions are also terrible, and if you maintain the CCG, there should at least be pod scheduling and the top 2 teams playing, to avoid dipshittery where the 3 best teams are in one division, so you have some scrub team in the CCG which may cost the B12 a bid b/c if they win they may not be a top 6 champ. The only non-stupid part about the B12 CCG is that it's actually the top 2 teams in the conference. 

 

I think having 2 divisions is best because if you have another one or two loss team in a BIG12 south, who misses out on the CCG, they will still have a great shot at being an at large team

Now if I a one loss South champion gets upset by a 3 loss North Champ.. that would suck.. 

[TXSooner518 2432]

 
I think having 2 divisions is best because if you have another one or two loss team in a BIG12 south, who misses out on the CCG, they will still have a great shot at being an at large team
Now if I a one loss South champion gets upset by a 3 loss North Champ.. that would suck.. 

Your situation is much less likely than the situation of having a team with no shot at bid or bye. Also divisions are the reason for stupid schedule shit like aggy being in SEC a decade and still not played UGA at home. Pods allow a 14 team conf to play every team home and away in a 4 year period while keeping 3 annual rivals. Waaaaayyyy better.

[Thiefery 4969]

2 minutes ago, TXSooner518 said:

Your situation is much less likely than the situation of having a team with no shot at bid or bye. Also divisions are the reason for stupid schedule shit like aggy being in SEC a decade and still not played UGA at home. Pods allow a 14 team conf to play every team home and away in a 4 year period while keeping 3 annual rivals. Waaaaayyyy better.

technically a 12 school big 12 would also play every school in the north in 4 seasons, no?

[TXSooner518 2432]

technically a 12 school big 12 would also play every school in the north in 4 seasons, no?

Sure! So the biggest benefit for a 12 team conf is virtually guaranteeing a bid with best shot at a bye.

You do still get a more varied schedule playing more teams 3x every 4 years instead of some 4x and some 2x.

[Hurtlocker 2208]

13 hours ago, Dnaguy said:

 

But seriously, I'm guessing that whomever made up this graphic had more time to find the penultimate BCS / CFP rankings... the ones before the bowls / playoffs.

My brief 'research' looked at final rankings over the last 5-10 years and showed that the SEC constantly had 4 teams in the top 12. 

 

But hey, maybe the larger playoff shows the SEC's ass. I mean, if more teams make it to the playoffs only to shit the bed.... then the narrative changes, right?

 

[Narrorator]: It didn't

It came from this, someone went through to figure out top six champions, who got the bye, and who would have been in based off final week CFP rankings:

[Hurtlocker 2208]

8 hours ago, TXSooner518 said:

Also you can't just look at top 12, because not all of the top 12 will get in.  

Both 2015 and 2019 above have an SEC team bolded at 12, but neither of those teams actually make the field, because there aren't 6 conference champs in the top 12 either of those seasons. So the conf champ below them would replace them. 

 

If I remember right, when they announced the structure with the top six champs and all that, they said it completely assed 8, but in 12 only 4 teams in the top 12 over 7 years would have been knocked out.   Can't imagine many are going to cry about that.

Edited June 18, 2021 by Hurtlocker

[TXSooner518 2432]

If I remember right, when they announced the structure with the top six champs and all that, they said it completely assed 8, but in 12 only 4 teams in the top 12 over 7 years would have been knocked out.   Can't imagine many are going to cry about that.

Right! Wasn’t saying that’s a problem was just pointing out the list actually still overstated the SEC participation.

[notre dame joe 172]

5 hours ago, 'stache said:

How would that work? They pay back a months worth of tuition? I think they'd be okay with that, meanwhile the schools and their administrators would look like complete pricks paying the coach $5 million, then bitching about scholarship dollars and kids doing what is best for their future. I seriously don't get how people don't understand the risk of injury costing kids generational wealth because you want to see them play in the RC Cola Bowl. Opting out of shitty bowl games is peak economic analysis and capitalism and is as rational an economic decision as one could dream up.

Yeah and if they want to be strictly business than you recalculate a contract that wasn't quite completed.  I understand why they don't want to appear to be doing that.  They might change their tune if someone opts out of a bowl game that is now technically a playoff game.  Especially if said someone is already being compensated for his cough cough name image and likeness.

5 hours ago, Horn of Gabriel said:

Really?  Are ND fans worked up about not getting top 4?  Because, there's...a pretty clear path for ND to get a top 4 AQ...just not the one they want.

I'd argue ND has more, not less, access to CFP in the 12-team playoff.  Before you had to go undefeated or have things break just right with a loss. Now you can go 10-2 and probably still get in.  Oh and it completely takes away any pressure to join a conference, cementing ND's independent status b/c you get that without joining the ACC and not having to compete in a CCG.  Seems like a pretty fair trade, in fact I'm not sure Texas couldn't do the same, hmmm.

Yeah I have been saying since 2014 that the expanded playoff means that any ND team with a pulse will stumble into it.  I'll go further and say that a few of our #15ish teams would find their way to #12 if real tv ratings and dollars were on the line.  Right now the CFP's Rankings below #6 is purely academic. 

 

I really don't want to be rewarded for our mostly-predictable foul ups in florida. Or rather, the appropriate reward for an B grade 2-loss season is a berth in the Folger's Sleep-Through-It bowl.  I want ND to build teams that compete with the top teams and not collect ribbons of participation. 

[Had Enough 2057]

If I remember right, when they announced the structure with the top six champs and all that, they said it completely assed 8, but in 12 only 4 teams in the top 12 over 7 years would have been knocked out.   Can't imagine many are going to cry about that.

Somewhat irrelevant because the powers were jockeying for the top 4 spots now it’ll be 12.

Home games and byes are very significant advantages not only in winning game 1 but subsequent games.

The SEC and Big 10 still will jockey for every advantage.

I wouldn’t be surprised if more discussion happened with regards to seeding versus who made it in/got left out.

[Scooter Monzingo 820]

I’m guessing that in the end someone feels slighted in some way, my guess it will be about revenue distribution. And our wonderful lawmakers in congress will straighten it all out for us……..

[Harrison Bergeron 1798]

On 6/18/2021 at 2:12 PM, SwanderedTalent said:

the problem there is that you would have to force some conferences to kick some teams out, and others to take teams in

there's no mechanism to do that-- I don't see how you can force the Big Ten to abandon Maryland and Rutgers, or force any schools into the Big 12 if they don't want to be there, or force the Big 12 to take new members it doesn't want

Very true, but I would just re-jigger back to pre-2010 ... except aggy. Keep aggy independent. 

[BurntOrange&White 39661]

On 6/17/2021 at 9:48 AM, Al_4_ISU said:

Exactly.  Baylor was the one true champion.  TCU was clearly the better team by the end of the year.

The Big 12 got shit because they tried to say TCU was really the co-champ when Baylor beat them head to head.

I fully believe had they announced Baylor as the clear champion Baylor would have made it to the CFB playoff that year. The co-champion was used by the subjective committee to rationalize ohio state.

[Lidig8r 1856]

On 6/17/2021 at 3:36 PM, Al_4_ISU said:

The conference reputation sucks because ESPN doesn’t care about what happens between the Mississippi and the west coast because there aren’t that many big cities and eyeballs.

 

There is no dispute that the Mouse Network is the most powerful media organization in college football.

December 2020 it was announced the Mouse is taking the SEC away from CBS and will be its exclusive media partner.

The Mouse is on the hook for $3 BILLION over 10 years.

https://www.sportspromedia.com/news/sec-espn-abc-football-tv-rights-cbs

The Mouse isn't going to just give $300 MILLION EVERY YEAR to the Sister Eating Conference.

They are going to make up all of $ and more through corporate sponsorships, commercials, etc. But, they have to insure a good product that the corporate big boys will stay interested in and know that millions of eyeballs are being trained on the product. So, you keep your candy ass scheduling, schedule the Sisters of the Poor in November, get at least 2 teams in the expanded playoffs every year.

The Mouse is so powerful that it controls the narrative and frames the issues it wants. It doesn't have to be fair and equitable. It is in the Mouse Networks's best interest, and in the best interest of the Sister Eating Conference NOT to be even handed.

And that contract is on top of the other contract the Mouse and the Sister Eating Conference has covering events in men's and women's basketball, baseball and softball. It also does not include the SEC Network. All o those bring in additional revenue.  

And .. profit.

Edited June 22, 2021 by Lidig8r
cuz Imma a moron

[Al_4_ISU 12409]

I fully believe had they announced Baylor as the clear champion Baylor would have made it to the CFB playoff that year. The co-champion was used by the subjective committee to rationalize ohio state.

I don’t think it mattered. Ohio State was getting in regardless because of brand.

It was stupid because it was blatantly false, not because it had a bad effect.

[utee94 15746]

7 minutes ago, Al_4_ISU said:

I don’t think it mattered. Ohio State was getting in regardless because of brand.

It was stupid because I was blatantly false, not because it had a bad effect.

Yeah, the committee wasn't about to put in Baylor or any other non-traditional power with no fanbase, ahead of Ohio State.  

If it had been Texas and OU in that situation, instead of a couple of national nobodies like Baylor and TCU, then the committee would have had a tougher choice.  

But it wasn't, and they didn't.

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

On 6/20/2021 at 5:51 PM, Harrison Bergeron said:

I would just re-jigger back to pre-2010

the conference alignments weren't perfect in 2010 but they were certainly better

Agreed w/whoever said a round-robin within a numerically logical conference size, applied across multiple conferences, makes the most sense. I said that in (sigh) the realignment thread too. 

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

On 6/18/2021 at 6:50 PM, Hurtlocker said:

It came from this, someone went through to figure out top six champions, who got the bye, and who would have been in based off final week CFP rankings:

so this is cool, but I am not sure I buy the premise that these rankings would have been the same had they been selecting for 12 instead of 4. It's a lot easier to tell Shithead State "aw, rats, you just missed it, you were fifth!" when it doesn't matter. When it means Shithead State gets to host a first round game in a 40,000 seat stadium in Bumfuck, Mississippi, it's a different question. 

In the same way, it's a lot easier to say "we consider all comers, look who finished 10th and 11th!" when only four get in than it is to actually give those two shitbird programs spots in the playoff instead of a three-loss Michigan or USC team. 

[Harrison Bergeron 1798]

37 minutes ago, SwanderedTalent said:

the conference alignments weren't perfect in 2010 but they were certainly better

Agreed w/whoever said a round-robin within a numerically logical conference size, applied across multiple conferences, makes the most sense. I said that in (sigh) the realignment thread too. 

The fun of college football is the history and regional rivalries. I'm sure Big 10 fans get really worked up playing Maryland just as the bubba's spend all year thinking about beating Misery. Kansas-Missouri literally the bloodiest rivalry in the country. 

[SwanderedTalent 5761]

16 minutes ago, Harrison Bergeron said:

The fun of college football is the history and regional rivalries. I'm sure Big 10 fans get really worked up playing Maryland just as the bubba's spend all year thinking about beating Misery. Kansas-Missouri literally the bloodiest rivalry in the country. 

Bingo. For financial competition reasons, small geographically coherent conferences don't work within today's CFB model. But sharing a conference with a bunch of schools in your geographic footprint is a lot more interesting than playing schools 1500 miles away as a "conference" game.

/enough realignment talk

 

[Doc Sam Beckett 5784]

1 hour ago, SwanderedTalent said:

so this is cool, but I am not sure I buy the premise that these rankings would have been the same had they been selecting for 12 instead of 4. It's a lot easier to tell Shithead State "aw, rats, you just missed it, you were fifth!" when it doesn't matter. When it means Shithead State gets to host a first round game in a 40,000 seat stadium in Bumfuck, Mississippi, it's a different question. 

In the same way, it's a lot easier to say "we consider all comers, look who finished 10th and 11th!" when only four get in than it is to actually give those two shitbird programs spots in the playoff instead of a three-loss Michigan or USC team. 

100% this. It is cool, and it's all we have to go on, but the Pac 12 is not getting 3 teams in at any point in the playoff era. 

[utee94 15746]

1 hour ago, SwanderedTalent said:

so this is cool, but I am not sure I buy the premise that these rankings would have been the same had they been selecting for 12 instead of 4. It's a lot easier to tell Shithead State "aw, rats, you just missed it, you were fifth!" when it doesn't matter. When it means Shithead State gets to host a first round game in a 40,000 seat stadium in Bumfuck, Mississippi, it's a different question. 

In the same way, it's a lot easier to say "we consider all comers, look who finished 10th and 11th!" when only four get in than it is to actually give those two shitbird programs spots in the playoff instead of a three-loss Michigan or USC team. 

Totally agree with you there.  It's easy to "park" a hopeful but undesirable program outside the Top 4 and say "missed it by THAT much." 

It's something else entirely when those choices actually impact the playoff picture.

 

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