CFP expansion discussion

[4th&Five 41461]

 

[SimonBolivar 10931]

Hell no it isn't a good idea for them, but I'm happy they think it is.

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[BurntOrange&White 39661]

2 minutes ago, Machinator said:

 

Why would that even be a thing anyway?

[BHMCruiser 1813]

I can't wait for a 11-3 Alabama's third string quarterback to block 15-0 UGA's extra point to win the NC

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[Bartles 769]

Bowlsby always goes that extra half-step with his quotes, throwing shade on East Lansing. I guarantee you if #4 Iowa State has to face #12 Miami in Tampa or something, he'll do a full 180.

(EDIT: I read it wrong, 6 vs 11 would be in Ames. But point remains

Edited June 10, 2021 by Bartles

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[TXSooner518 2432]

2 hours ago, BurntOrange&White said:

All should be neutral, especially given rankings are based on subjectivity of a committee 

No. The subjectivity of the committee slightly edging things is drastically outweighed by the prospect of eight CFP games coming from actual college stadiums on college campuses. I say 8 b/c I presume no way the semis or finals are neutral. Put the quarters on campuses and this is a solid plan. 

It maximizes meaning of conf titles and reg season: Can't get a bye without winning a conference title. Can't get a home quarter unless you are a Top 4 team. Still a benefit for fighting for a Top 8 spot if you aren't Top 4, b/c you get a home game. 

Brings more passion and excitement to the playoffs with home crowds/atmosphere. I would be MUCH more inclined to travel to an Oklahoma at Georgia quarterfinal than Oklahoma vs Georgia in the Fiesta Bowl quarterfinal. Who is traveling to neutral QF games? The top teams are saving trips and $$ for SF and finals. The lesser teams not paying to go watch a QF vs Bama in an NFL stadium. Similarly, I'm much more inclined to watch those games on TV if there is home atmosphere and college pageantry.

 

[clapclapclap 9000]

17 minutes ago, Machinator said:

 

I can't believe these idiots are bitching about having 4 playoffs games at New Year's bowls. 

It's gotdam college football, in theory the best are supposed to play on NYD or thereabouts.  Do they really think that there wouldn't still be a Rose/Orange/Sugar/Fiesta bowl and parades and trying to bring in tourists if the semi's were on campus?  Those bowls would just have lesser teams in them and still find a way and channel to play on during that holiday.

As noted, the top 4 get to skip a game, have the seeding advantage, and usually will get a geographic favorable bowl in the semi's.  That's enough advantage, especially since seeding is still a beauty contest.

Edited June 10, 2021 by clapclapclap

[TXSooner518 2432]

37 minutes ago, BurntOrange&White said:

Why would that even be a thing anyway?

It would allow bowl games to have better teams in them. If the next 5 best non-playoff bowls can't take playoff losers, then those games get teams ranked 13-22. If they can, they get teams ranked 5-18.  

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Edited June 10, 2021 by Machinator

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Edited June 10, 2021 by Machinator

[4th&Five 41461]

23 minutes ago, Machinator said:

 

Yeah, it not like the Packers or Bears have ever played in January!

[Barbacoa 1934]

I wish there was a real incentive to finish the season in the top 25. Would be nice if there was a separate 12 team tournament that teams still really wanted to win. Dont know what that would be though. 

[HtownHorn 14488]

3 hours ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

Fix this and I'll get on board with 12... Adds plenty of change potential including playing OU 3 times in a season with an actual home game among them.

Yeah, there is no way 4 likely P5 teams are going to give up those paydays for a bowl location. Of course, I would pool all the home games and each team gets a equal share of the total. So I would like to maximize the amount of on campus games vs. neutral site locations.

[HtownHorn 14488]

3 hours ago, conVINCEd said:

If this happens we need to ditch the conference championship game.  No reason to stick another L on your second best team.

This is correct. You already have every team playing each other, no reason you should set up the potential for the same teams to play each other 2 more times.

[camel at sea 589]

25 minutes ago, HtownHorn said:

This is correct. You already have every team playing each other, no reason you should set up the potential for the same teams to play each other 2 more times.

The biggest reason to play the CCG is that everyone else is doing it and it will be held against the conference champ in seeding if we don't do it.  

[Askew 362]

Couple of thoughts:

1) Big12 currently has the most ideal path to get one team into the CFP (1st and 2nd best team always play in CCG--winner will almost always go to CFP with that big win). In 2-division leagues, a weak division winner can win the CCG and knock out the #1 team; or a tough division can cannibalize itself (Pac 12). 

2) But Big 12 has the worst ability to have multiple top-12 teams. Round robin play is zero sum. Cross-divisional wins can really bump up the resumes of teams--think of a year where Bama and LSU both play eg Vandy. Bama and LSU both get an extra win, and none of the other SEC West teams take a loss. Relative rankings bump for all involved.

3) If 12-team playoff goes through, BIG 12 needs to immediately expand to get increase the available wins in conference, 10 wins looks like the magic number. Big 12 maxes out at about 3 10-win teams. The 14-team conferences max out at about 5 10-win teams. 

4) The first-round hosting/2nd-round bowls is actually a great way to quasi-punish the top teams. All of the lower seeds get some amazing program exposure, top teams get a bye but no exposure. Kind of like the NFL draft. 

Here's a slight variation to 12-team I would really want to see:

-First round is the NY6 Bowls. The 6 conference winners get the same bowl every year for tradition (Rose Bowl for Pac 12, Sugar for SEC, Cotton at Jerryworld for Big 12, Orange for ACC, etc). Conference winners play the six at-large. 

-NY 6 determines the seeding. Makes for interesting debate. Top-2 teams have a bye. Next 4 teams play the quarterfinals. 2 highest seeds host. This would eliminate any chance a Cincinnati ever hosts a game, unless it's a cinderella story which would make it awesome atmosphere. 

-The 2 previous Bye teams host the semis. 

-Championship at a neutral site. 

BUT hosting will work best in the first round when students are on campus, so this won't really work that well in practice. 

 

 

 

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5 hours ago, Machinator said:

 

I'm surprised the SEC didn't try to include something about avoiding rematches or having to play teams from the same conference.

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40 minutes ago, Askew said:

Couple of thoughts:

3) If 12-team playoff goes through, BIG 12 needs to immediately expand to get increase the available wins in conference, 10 wins looks like the magic number. Big 12 maxes out at about 3 10-win teams. The 14-team conferences max out at about 5 10-win teams. 

On the one hand, sounds nice.

On the other, nobody in the B12 wants a harder path to the playoffs.  That means bringing in some sisters-of-the-poor schools.  That doesn't help with the conference's image or getting more money per school.

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5 hours ago, JFKFC said:

The ND AD is on the panel that suggested a system where ND doesn't get a bye?

Foreshadowing ND joining a conference?

[GTX Horn 1707]

6 hours ago, BurntOrange&White said:

All should be neutral, especially given rankings are based on subjectivity of a committee 

There are few things better in sports than the atmosphere of big college football games on college campuses. With the exception of Texas-OU, neutral site games in college football dilute the energy and pageantry of college football and makes the sport feel more “corporate” so to speak. Nevertheless they’re going to end up making most of them neutral site probably just because of sponsorships and whatnot.

[ButtFumble 5158]

1 hour ago, Askew said:

3) If 12-team playoff goes through, BIG 12 needs to immediately expand to get increase the available wins in conference, 10 wins looks like the magic number. Big 12 maxes out at about 3 10-win teams. The 14-team conferences max out at about 5 10-win teams.

GTFO

if this happens the first thing the Big 12 needs to do is play fewer fucking conference games and give the members the chance to get 10 (or better yet 20) fucking wins without guaranteeing losses

the Big 12 does not need to pile on more dog shit into the fucking conference to get "wins" the way you get fucking "wins" that have meaning without dragging your conference down is go out and play teams from other conferences instead of beating up your own

if you want to think that some of the available dog shit for the Big 12 to expand with is a "good win" well here is a clue leave that dog shit in the conference they are in and play them while they are in that conference and beat them

that way the LOSS stays with their fucking conference instead of festering in the bottom of the Big 12 and the money stays with 10 members of the Big 12 instead of sharing it with some underfunded, low fan support, high debt, half ass facilities dog shit that you brought into the conference to suck cocks and provide "wins"

you do not help a conference by adding more shit to the bottom of the conference to fucking rot and eat away at conference revenues you help the conference by beating up on each other less and beating other conference's members more and leaving them with the loss and their shitty conference payouts

every conference game equals 1-1.....one fucking win and a GUARANTEED LOSS.....every OOC game means the chance to get a win without also taking that guaranteed loss

people need to stop pretending that available G5 dog shit will suddenly be looked at as a "quality win" because they get added to the Big 12.....they will just be stinking shit festering at the bottom of the Big 12 taking losses and losing fan support and costing money.....all the worse if the whole reason you brought them into the fucking conference is because you want "wins" which means you think they will lose a lot more than they win....which means they suck cocks and drag down the conference

1 less conference game means the chance for the conference to go 10-0 instead of a guaranteed 5-5.......two less means the chance for 20-0 instead of 10-10

so the Big 12 could spread .5 to 1 additional win per conference member throughout the conference.......if you assume you have a 12-0 team and an 11-1 team already well guess what any of those additional wins now make your lower level teams look a lot less shitty and that helps the conference more than anything

even if the conference goes 7-3 or 14-6 in those OOC games that is still from 2 to 4 more wins for the conference overall.....get more teams in bowl games.....have teams start the next year ranked higher....build on that over time

adding more shit to the conference just means you have more shit at the bottom of the conference battling to be 7-5 instead of 5-7 or trying to be the ones that do not fall to 2-10

DON'T FUCKING NEED IT......BEAT THOSE SHIT TEAMS YOU THINK SHOULD BE IN THE BIG 12 IN THEIR SHITTY CONFERENCE....LET THEIR FUCKING CONFERENCE EAT THOSE LOSSES

Edited June 11, 2021 by ButtFumble

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[Valmy77 13094]

Kind of pathetic and embarrassing that at no point since 2013 would we even be in a 12 team playoff. Bravo Chuck and Tom you miserable millionaire failures.

[Barbacoa 1934]

22 minutes ago, Valmy77 said:

Kind of pathetic and embarrassing that at no point since 2013 would we even be in a 12 team playoff. Bravo Chuck and Tom you miserable millionaire failures.

Its extremely pathetic and extremely embarrassing. We crashed hard and burned long. The only thing that can bring us back is what brought us back the last time. The right coach at the right time. We shall see.