Oklahoma bill to protect drivers who run over protesters signed into law

[Satchel 6,908]

 

A bill that could give drivers immunity if they feel threatened and run over a protester during a demonstration was signed into law this week by Oklahoma Governor Kevin Stitt.

House Bill 1674 was written by Rep. Kevin West, R-Moore, and Sen. Rob Standridge, R-Norman.

The bill makes it a misdemeanor punishable by up to a year in jail and a $5,000 fine to block a public street and grant criminal and civil immunity to motorists that kill or injure someone while fleeing a riot.

Supporters of the bill said it was prompted mostly by an incident in Tulsa last summer in which a pickup truck drove through a crowd gathered on a Tulsa interstate while protesting the death of George Floyd in Minneapolis

https://www.wfla.com/news/national/oklahoma-bill-to-protect-drivers-who-run-over-protesters-signed-into-law/

[Onboard 2.0 9,083]

Talk about open season.  

[Orale 1,087]

So when the Trumpkins have a rally in the street we can run their dumb asses over? Awesome!

[Satchel 6,908]

Republicans want to outlaw everything they don’t like. 

[atomheartbevo 89,447]

5 minutes ago, Satchel said:

Republicans want to outlaw everything they don’t like. 

Just need to start getting some brown or black people with "Antifa" bumper stickers to start driving around Republican rallies, and they'll change this law really quick.

[Js1 85,110]

Awful lot of DT posters suddenly zillowing homes in OK. This is their fantasy 

[BrickHorn 18,194]

These fascist MAGA dipshits sure went from “A Berkeley student disagreeing with me violates my sacred free speech rights!” to “We should be allowed to brutally murder anyone at a public assembly!” in record time. 

[UpperWestside 6,136]

Respect for human life and the ability to protest and express dissatisfaction with how we operate as a society takes a backseat again. This time to cars because reasons. I would enjoy sitting down and hearing the actual thoughts that led them to write this law. I want to hear why they do not respect the sanctity of life. 

[WhatTheBuck 28,712]

1 hour ago, BrickHorn said:

These fascist MAGA dipshits sure went from “A Berkeley student disagreeing with me violates my sacred free speech rights!” to “We should be allowed to brutally murder anyone at a public assembly!” in record time. 

RIP Heather Heyer. 

[JimmyJames 12,271]

Very surprising since normally Oklahoma is such a smart and rational state. 

[tantric superman 4,667]

I thought the transgender laws were hard to beat for sheer hatefulness and ugliness but this does a good job of making its case for legislation that is pure evil.

[Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13,546]

Now that's how you show contrition for Tulsa. 

[UDontKnow 10,439]

1 minute ago, tantric superman said:

I thought the transgender laws were hard to beat for sheer hatefulness and ugliness but this does a good job of making its case for legislation that is pure evil.

I can't see how the Federal Supreme Court will allow it to stand as it is currently constructed. I get the blocking a public street (and actually agree with it - should only protest in designated areas to prevent fire, EMS, and police from getting blocked or delayed in responding to emergencies). But automatic criminal and civil immunity is over the top - where is the burden of proof of intent to flee a so-called riot? 

[JimmyJames 12,271]

I think America should start negotiating with Mexico or any other country to see If they would somehow take Oklahoma, Arkansas, Mississippi and Alabama off our hands. Seriously what do they contribute to America?

[Pato del Muerto 52,342]

1 minute ago, UDontKnow said:

I can't see how the Federal Supreme Court will allow it to stand as it is currently constructed. I get the blocking a public street (and actually agree with it - should only protest in designated areas to prevent fire, EMS, and police from getting blocked or delayed in responding to emergencies). But automatic criminal and civil immunity is over the top - where is the burden of proof of intent to flee a so-called riot? 

Is it any different than the self defense castle shooting laws to scotus?

[UDontKnow 10,439]

3 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Is it any different than the self defense castle shooting laws to scotus?

I'm no attorney, but isn't Castle a doctrine and not an actual law? Not trying to be purposefully argumentative, but it seems like it would be easier to poke holes in a doctrine as opposed to a law that is absolute.

I guess this differs from Castle because Castle involves one's homestead where this has to do with city roads and streets (public property). Also, isn't there something where a 'threatened individual' is required to attempt to retreat before engaging in self-defense? Castle doesn't protect from civil suits if I recall correctly.

I hope the issue reaches SCOTUS and the correct decision is taken otherwise this law will only serve to be a lynchpin for more violence - like pouring accelerant on a burning fire.

[Nivek 16,859]

Republicans want to outlaw everything they don’t like. 

Party of limited government.

[Beau Vine 54,003]

41 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

I think America should start negotiating with Mexico or any other country to see If they would somehow take Oklahoma, Arkansas, Mississippi and Alabama off our hands. Seriously what do they contribute to America?

You left off Texas.

[washparkhorn 9,935]

This is akin to giving whisky and car keys to teenagers.

[NWBuck 8,547]

5 hours ago, JimmyJames said:

I think America should start negotiating with Mexico or any other country to see If they would somehow take Oklahoma, Arkansas, Mississippi and Alabama off our hands. Seriously what do they contribute to America?

I hope it's more successful than my five year campaign to trade Michigan to Canada for British Columbia.

[NWBuck 8,547]

8 hours ago, Satchel said:

 A bill that could give drivers immunity if they feel threatened and run over a protester during a demonstration... 

Between this and all the bullshit 'stand your ground' laws, the GOP has really done a good job of becoming the party of feelings. 

[Judge Roybeanbag 11,810]

Guess I’ll have to start carrying a couple of “throw-down” signs in my car if I go to Oklahoma.  

[Nice Guy Eddie 13,414]

Several states are also looking into denial of govt benefits if convicted of illegal protesting or participation in protests that result in property damage. Talking unemployment, state based welfare, housing assistance, etc. 

the message is clear to poor people, protest at your own economic risk. You don’t have a right to protest if you ever want assistance.  Very vindictive of certain govts.

[Pato del Muerto 52,342]

2 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Several states are also looking into denial of govt benefits if convicted of illegal protesting or participation in protests that result in property damage. Talking unemployment, state based welfare, housing assistance, etc. 

the message is clear to poor people, protest at your own economic risk. You don’t have a right to protest if you ever want assistance.  Very vindictive of certain govts.

No way a law will get by scotus that punishes people for something other people do. That has to be unconstitutional. 

[Goredho 17,348]

A riot reform bill is just so fucking Republican.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13,414]

18 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

No way a law will get by scotus that punishes people for something other people do. That has to be unconstitutional. 

I believe the law is more about scaring poor people, and putting them in their place. The right will say that they’re 100% for legal, peaceful protests but step out of line (by our definition) and face economic penalties.

[CooterBrown 17,911]

No way a law will get by scotus that punishes people for something other people do. That has to be unconstitutional. 

With the current SC, it passes easily.

[Poolflood 845]

This is the travesty? 

 

A motor vehicle operator who unintentionally causes injury or 
death to an individual shall not be criminally or civilly liable for 
the injury or death, if:

1. The injury or death of the individual occurred while the 
motor vehicle operator was fleeing from a riot, as defined in 
Section 1311 of Title 21 of the Oklahoma Statutes, under a 
reasonable belief that fleeing was necessary to protect the motor 
vehicle operator from serious injury or death; and
2. The motor vehicle operator exercised due care at the time of 
the death or injury.

 

[Fudge Nuggets 19,151]

20 hours ago, JimmyJames said:

I think America should start negotiating with Mexico or any other country to see If they would somehow take Oklahoma, Arkansas, Mississippi and Alabama off our hands. Seriously what do they contribute to America?

The rest of America would be thrilled to see Texas get thrown out on its ass as well. 

[Beau Vine 54,003]

8 minutes ago, Fudge Nuggets said:

The rest of America would be thrilled to see Texas get thrown out on its ass as well. 

Ironically, so would half of Texas.  

[washparkhorn 9,935]

15 minutes ago, Poolflood said:

unintentionally causes injury

The state of mind requirement for criminal culpability is the crux is the heart of the issue for me.

Reckless homicide should not be immune from criminal juries. That is a keystone in our social contract with one another. 

[Poolflood 845]

10 minutes ago, washparkhorn said:

The state of mind requirement for criminal culpability is the crux is the heart of the issue for me.

Reckless homicide should not be immune from criminal juries. That is a keystone in our social contract with one another. 

I'm sure you're a lawyer, and I'm not,  but....

 

1. The injury or death of the individual occurred while the 
motor vehicle operator was fleeing from a riot, as defined in 
Section 1311 of Title 21 of the Oklahoma Statutes, under a 
reasonable belief that fleeing was necessary to protect the motor 
vehicle operator from serious injury or death; and
2. The motor vehicle operator exercised due care at the time of 
the death or injury.

[washparkhorn 9,935]

18 minutes ago, Poolflood said:

I'm sure you're a lawyer, and I'm not,  but....

1. The injury or death of the individual occurred while the 
motor vehicle operator was fleeing from a riot, as defined in 
Section 1311 of Title 21 of the Oklahoma Statutes, under a 
reasonable belief that fleeing was necessary to protect the motor 
vehicle operator from serious injury or death; and
2. The motor vehicle operator exercised due care at the time of 
the death or injury.

We, as part of our tradition, typically criminalize actions of one who gambles with the lives of others.  The law in question provides broad protection for recklessness - albeit in a very narrow, but critical, set of circumstances. I am not sure that is good policy - for anyone regardless of team.

Edited April 26, 2021 by washparkhorn

[Poolflood 845]

3 minutes ago, washparkhorn said:

We, as part of our tradition, typically criminalize actions of one who gambles with the lives of others.  The law in question provides broad protection for recklessness - albeit in a very narrow, but critical, set of circumstances. I am not sure that is good policy - for anyone regardless of team.

That's not what it says at all.  It's pretty simple.  It's ok.  Fucking Oklahoma is stupid but this is just stupid clickbait.

[fattyflattie 4,636]

Reginald Denny law. 

[tantric superman 4,667]

1 hour ago, Poolflood said:

A motor vehicle operator who unintentionally causes injury or 
death to an individual shall not be criminally or civilly liable for 
the injury or death, if:

1. The injury or death of the individual occurred while the 
motor vehicle operator was fleeing from a riot, as defined in 
Section 1311 of Title 21 of the Oklahoma Statutes, under a 
reasonable belief that fleeing was necessary to protect the motor 
vehicle operator from serious injury or death; and
2. The motor vehicle operator exercised due care at the time of 
the death or injury.

[Hmbre97 6,297]

[washparkhorn 9,935]

I want the DA to have the ability to charge - or to refuse to prosecute charges - for these types of acts:

 

In this case, the DA declined to prosecute. That's an appropriate balance in my opinion.  YMMV

[Poolflood 845]

3 minutes ago, washparkhorn said:

I want the DA to have the ability to charge - or to refuse to prosecute charges - for these types of acts:

 

In this case, the DA declined to prosecute. That's an appropriate balance in my opinion.  YMMV

Truck driver in this case wasn't in fear of his life and certainly wasn't driving with due care.

I'm just not sure what the issue is with this part of the bill.

 

[washparkhorn 9,935]

2 minutes ago, Poolflood said:

Truck driver in this case wasn't in fear of his life and certainly wasn't driving with due care.

I'm just not sure what the issue is with this part of the bill.

 

He wasn't charged. DA declined. This is the method I prefer (to immunity).

[Poolflood 845]

4 minutes ago, washparkhorn said:

He wasn't charged. DA declined. This is the method I prefer (to immunity).

So you think there is a case that a motorist is trying to extricate from a "riot", is driving with due care, and fears for his life... you believe there could be a situation where he/she could be criminally or civilly liable?  I get your point re prosecutorial discretion, but that also ignores civil liability.

But I digress.  This is giving whiskey and car keys to teenagers. 

[washparkhorn 9,935]

1 minute ago, Poolflood said:

This is giving whiskey and car keys to teenagers. 

Amen.

[fattyflattie 4,636]

30 minutes ago, washparkhorn said:

I want the DA to have the ability to charge - or to refuse to prosecute charges - for these types of acts:

 

In this case, the DA declined to prosecute. That's an appropriate balance in my opinion.  YMMV

That shouldn’t be covered, and that dude needs to be prosecuted.  Imo this is more for the guy who was pulled out his old Ford in Portland (iirc) and had the fuck beat out of him for no reason.  

[TwiceHorn 31,282]

Actually, poolflood does have a point.  The circumstances under which "immunity" is granted pretty much exclude everything but good faith accidents.

And to washpark's point about discretion, there's enough fact questions in that statute that a goodly number of cases could be prosecuted where there's questions about the "good faith" of the driver (necessary fleeing, due care).

So the media is rather mischaracterizing it.  And Oklahoma Rs fucking love it.

Because this is another law that's more about symbolism than good policy.  And that's about all the GOP is good for.  Kudos, I guess, for actually passing a law, that's different.

Edited April 26, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[WhatTheBuck 28,712]

What about when the cops do it?

[Satchel 6,908]

How is claiming you ran protesters down because you feared for your life different from shooting someone because you were told in your gun class to always claim fear before unloading into your target?

[Poolflood 845]

29 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

What about when the cops do it?

Surely you understand the difference between civilians and cops?  

Look, this is clickbait bullshit.  Stupid headlines.  Red meat for the masses.

[Captainant 27,464]

22 minutes ago, Poolflood said:

Surely you understand the difference between civilians and cops?  

Look, this is clickbait bullshit.  Stupid headlines.  Red meat for the masses.

TFW cops are civilians

[WhatTheBuck 28,712]

47 minutes ago, Poolflood said:

Surely you understand the difference between civilians and cops?  

Look, this is clickbait bullshit.  Stupid headlines.  Red meat for the masses.

And red meat for white Republican voters who are desperately afraid of BLM protesters because they were fed a steady diet by Fox News of videos of vandalism and looting during mostly peaceful protests after the murder of George Floyd and by Trump’s relentless rhetoric about the same.

And no, just because they’re cops doesn’t give them the right to drive through a crowd of protestors. Or murder unarmed civilians. What is wrong with you?

[Poolflood 845]

6 hours ago, WhatTheBuck said:

And red meat for white Republican voters who are desperately afraid of BLM protesters because they were fed a steady diet by Fox News of videos of vandalism and looting during mostly peaceful protests after the murder of George Floyd and by Trump’s relentless rhetoric about the same.

And no, just because they’re cops doesn’t give them the right to drive through a crowd of protestors. Or murder unarmed civilians. What is wrong with you?

I can differentiate between a stupid headline and what the bill says.  Where did I excuse the cops?  The bill is aimed at civilians.  You really that obtuse?