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Nothing to see here -- just a town declaring a state of emergency before releasing body cam of police shooting!

Beau Vine

By Beau Vine
in Daily Texan

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Guest Lobo

Guest Lobo

Posted
Posted
31 minutes ago, InkaUtexas said:

You take the good, you take the bad
You take them both and there you have
The facts of life, the facts of life

image.png.9cddccd1532ceaf9350169dd288023a5.png

Where's the fifth one?  The cousin character, played by Stassneyhorn?  

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Wulaw Horn

Wulaw Horn 19098

Posted
Posted

I think one simple reform could more or less solve about 90% of all problems. 
No cop goes out without a camera that works. 
me very coo has to turn in the footage at the end of every shift or they don’t get paid.  
Anyone involved in any incident with a cop has full right to see the entire tape 

If the incident isn’t on tape it didn’t happen. 
 

Do that and you have full accountability for cops and checks and balances for citizens. My suspicion is you’d clean up like 90% of the problems if that happened and IA got involved whenever a citizen reviewed the video and made a claim. And- it wouldn’t even cost all that much money. And, the cops would have compelling evidence in court if they were in the right. 

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immortal13

immortal13 4059

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The fact that the video is In sole possession and control of the LEA at any point in time is absurd. It should be uploaded in real time to a third party for storage, back-up and distribution for legal cases. The current system is fucking ridiculous

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31495

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

I have a hypothesis I’d like to test:  Take all the bullets away from police officers and many POS cops would retire within one year.

I'm a fan of the idea, for sure.  But that's an aspect of it I hadn't really considered.  Seems like it would be the case.

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13216

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, Johnny Sack said:

I think if the public watched they probably would have more sympathy for the kind of fools cops have to deal with.  

I absolutely agree with this. I am against live body cams (much prefer immortal's idea of an independent 3rd party video storage/review department), I don't think most people realize some of the crap cops have to deal with.

If we did, we probably wouldn't structure all this the way we do. We'd see some meathead cops trying to deal with mentally ill people and realize the meathead cop isn't actually equipped to handle that person's needs and we'd focus more on social welfare and mental health professionals dealing with those types of vagrants and weirdos. We'd see Tactical Johnny walk up to a soccer mom's SUV with all his gear squeaking and wonder why some fat meter maid isn't handling that parking ticket instead. Rolling up with a well-armed partner to the elementary school to deal with an unruly 9-year-old who called her teacher a bitch and pushed over the bookshelf.

1) "Damn, they have to deal with a LOT of ridiculous crap, and a huge variety of things they obviously aren't trained for or naturally disposed to do!"

2) "Wait... how many shaved headed, Oakley-wearing, testosterone-clinic-visiting dudes with guns do we actually need in this community?"

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Cajun

Cajun 11714

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Posted
16 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

Sure, and look....it's pretty obvious what many of us SUSPECT happened.  And the scenario we suspect would be super shitty.  So I really, really, really hope our suspicions are wrong.  But we need the complete, unedited, information.

And if it shows the worst, then the law needs to come down fucking hard, because nowhere does it allow police officers to become self-appointed executioners because "the suspect was running away in his car."  But goddamit, I actually hope that he tried to run someone down or something that might justify a shooting, because goddammit, enough of this shit.

I'll put it out there.  The brave HEROES felt threatened b/c the now deceased was in a car and a car is a "WEAPON!".  From that point every single Hero had an automatic "Blast 'em!" switch go off in their heads b/c if that switch wasn't there how would they make it home to beat their wives on that evening?

If I'm wrong, I'm wrong.

Doubt I am.

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Cajun

Cajun 11714

Posted
Posted
9 hours ago, immortal13 said:

The fact that the video is In sole possession and control of the LEA at any point in time is absurd. It should be uploaded in real time to a third party for storage, back-up and distribution for legal cases. The current system is fucking ridiculous

Bing-Fucking-O!

There is absolutely zero reason that these fucks should have any control whatsoever over any of the video equipment, other than to wear it.

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BabaYaga

BabaYaga 15301

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18 hours ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

If body cam footage can't be released immediately after any incident (at least to immediate family) there's probably something being hidden.

Yep.  They're running cover to get out in front of this.  

Sunlight is still the best disinfectant.

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BrazilHorn

BrazilHorn 6612

Posted
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Cops just proving again and again that they shouldn't be trusted with guns. There is the old saying that if you only have a hammer then everything looks like a nail.

That is the mode that cops work in, they only have a gun in their heads, so everything is seemingly solved with gun.

Pull up on somewhere for a traffic stop? Come out with gun drawn.

Someone asks you a question? Pull gun on them

etc etc etc

At the rate these fucking cops are going Ben Crump is going to be a billionaire by Christmas.

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BabaYaga

BabaYaga 15301

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Quote

The search warrant issued for the Elizabeth City residence where Andrew Brown Jr. was shot and killed by law enforcement on Wednesday morning shows officers were looking for drugs, specifically crack cocaine, in the house and two vehicles, based on information from confidential informants.

The incident began when law enforcement went to the home at 421 Perry St. to serve the search warrant as well as arrest warrants for Brown, Pasquotank Sheriff Tommy Wooten II said last week.

D. Ryan Meads, an investigator for the Albemarle Drug Task Force with the Pasquotank Sheriff's Department, applied for the search warrant on Tuesday afternoon.

In the application for the warrant, Meads stated that he received information from the Dare County Narcotics Task Force regarding the alleged sale of illegal drugs by Brown.

The War on Drugs.  Just end it.  Today.  

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BabaYaga

BabaYaga 15301

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, BrazilHorn said:

Cops just proving again and again that they shouldn't be trusted with guns. There is the old saying that if you only have a hammer then everything looks like a nail.

That is the mode that cops work in, they only have a gun in their heads, so everything is seemingly solved with gun.

Pull up on somewhere for a traffic stop? Come out with gun drawn.

Someone asks you a question? Pull gun on them

etc etc etc

At the rate these fucking cops are going Ben Crump is going to be a billionaire by Christmas.

You don't know many cops do you?  The vast majority will never clear their holster over the course of their ENTIRE career (depending on their assignments of course).  If they do, it's in single digits.  Not firing.  Just clearing their holster.  More than three quarters of all LEOs retire having never fired their weapon on duty.  Ever.  

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Guest Lobo

Guest Lobo

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8 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

You don't know many cops do you?  The vast majority will never clear their holster over the course of their ENTIRE career (depending on their assignments of course).  If they do, it's in single digits.  Not firing.  Just clearing their holster.  More than three quarters of all LEOs retire having never fired their weapon on duty.  Ever.  

Good point.  My cousin (cop in Chicago) reminds me of that often.  The movie cliche is true about the cop that's pissed off at the perp for making him draw his weapon because now he has to do 3 days of paperwork. 

The problem with police and weapons, is much like the problem with general society and weapons.  The vast, vast majority of cops and citizens with weapons is totally fine, a bunch of non-incidents waiting to never happen.  The problem is a chunk of cops and a chunk of citizens should not ever have a fucking weapon, ever.  It's a small percentage, but that small percentage causes a lot of havoc.  We used to chalk it up as a cost of doing business or cost of liberty.  But we have the technology, the maturity, the oversight (no-knock warrants and other bullshit), the exposure (body cams, bystanders with cell phones), and the responsibility to clamp down on that small percentage of blood-thirsty cops with escalation issues and on the percentage of stupid/crazy citizens that need to arm themselves like it's the end of the world.  

This is not binary, we don't need to take guns away from all police.  We don't need to ban all guns for private use.  We can focus on that dangerous 5-10% sliver on the fringes and we can do it legally.  

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Wulaw Horn

Wulaw Horn 19098

Posted
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7 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

You don't know many cops do you?  The vast majority will never clear their holster over the course of their ENTIRE career (depending on their assignments of course).  If they do, it's in single digits.  Not firing.  Just clearing their holster.  More than three quarters of all LEOs retire having never fired their weapon on duty.  Ever.  

Yeah this right here. This is the typical way life goes down for a cop. I think lots of cops suck and some of them are a danger to the community, but for all the talk on here about them it ignores the fact that this is correct- majority never fire their weapon in anger. 

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InkaUtexas

InkaUtexas 25986

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Lobo said:

 

This is not binary, we don't need to take guns away from all police.  We don't need to ban all guns for private use.  We can focus on that dangerous 5-10% sliver on the fringes and we can do it legally.  

agree, but how do we forecast 90% correctly evil intent in advance? Look at the Indianapolis shooter. No way in hell should he have had weapons, but he did. 

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BabaYaga

BabaYaga 15301

Posted
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4 minutes ago, Lobo said:

The problem is a chunk of cops and a chunk of citizens should not ever have a fucking weapon, ever.  It's a small percentage, but that small percentage causes a lot of havoc.  We used to chalk it up as a cost of doing business or cost of liberty.  But we have the technology, the maturity, the oversight (no-knock warrants and other bullshit), the exposure (body cams, bystanders with cell phones), and the responsibility to clamp down on that small percentage of blood-thirsty cops with escalation issues and on the percentage of stupid/crazy citizens that need to arm themselves like it's the end of the world.  

Every garden has weeds - from the local PTA up to tier I SMU's.  No selection process is perfect.  You need high standards, a robust screening and training pipeline, and a mechanism to eject bad actors quickly and efficiently.  Firing a cop is like getting rid of a bill passed by Congress.  It takes a ridiculous amount of effort, time, and money.  

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BrazilHorn

BrazilHorn 6612

Posted
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14 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

You don't know many cops do you?  The vast majority will never clear their holster over the course of their ENTIRE career (depending on their assignments of course).  If they do, it's in single digits.  Not firing.  Just clearing their holster.  More than three quarters of all LEOs retire having never fired their weapon on duty.  Ever.  

Don't know a lot of cops but I do know there are a lot of people of color that would be alive today if the cops didn't kill them often over ticky tack stupid shit.

I also know that until the police chief of Minneapolis spoke out against Chauvin I had hardly ever seen a cop speak out against another one. To me if 99 "good" cops stay quiet and tacitly support the 1 bad one, you have 100 bad cops.

I am not anti-cop, I am anti-bad cop. Unfortunately there are a lot of them and a lot of cops who don't say/do jack shit to weed them out.

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BabaYaga

BabaYaga 15301

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3 minutes ago, InkaUtexas said:

agree, but how do we forecast 90% correctly evil intent in advance? Look at the Indianapolis shooter. No way in hell should he have had weapons, but he did. 

Not to derail, but this is what is so crazy about the gun laws we have today - we don't have the resources to enforce what we have right now.  To try and tie it back in, my thoughts are most LEO's would be staunch supporters of more resources poured into shoring these gaps up so these issues don't fall to them to have to deal with.  

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BabaYaga

BabaYaga 15301

Posted
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Just now, BrazilHorn said:

Don't know a lot of cops but I do know there are a lot of people of color that would be alive today if the cops didn't kill them often over ticky tack stupid shit.

I also know that until the police chief of Minneapolis spoke out against Chauvin I had hardly ever seen a cop speak out against another one. To me if 99 "good" cops stay quiet and tacitly support the 1 bad one, you have 100 bad cops.

I am not anti-cop, I am anti-bad cop. Unfortunately there are a lot of them and a lot of cops who don't say/do jack shit to weed them out.

This tired talking point needs to go away.  I know personally dozens of LEO's and follow my fare share via social media, podcasts, etc and 100% of them were shitting ALL OVER Chauvin from day one and never waivered.  

Jesus, internal affairs?  Heard of them?  Want to guess where almost 100% of their leads come from investigating bad cops?  Take a wild guess?  Other cops....Problem is most precincts are too small to have their own.  

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JBJ

JBJ 3655

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Posted
18 minutes ago, Judge Roybeanbag said:

Wonder if that's all of it, or their edited version of it?

The court will decide.

The city and a regional media org have also filed petitions.  Elizabeth City atty expects it to be a long process - I dunno what that might mean.  Looks like historically this takes a couple weeks.

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DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt

DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt 12301

Posted
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8 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

This tired talking point needs to go away.  I know personally dozens of LEO's and follow my fare share via social media, podcasts, etc and 100% of them were shitting ALL OVER Chauvin from day one and never waivered.  

Jesus, internal affairs?  Heard of them?  Want to guess where almost 100% of their leads come from investigating bad cops?  Take a wild guess?  Other cops....Problem is most precincts are too small to have their own.  

your cop drinking buddies would have done exactly what the other cops did while watching chauvin murder floyd. nada.

but regale us more with stories from your cop drinking buddies.

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DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt

DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt 12301

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17 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

giphy-downsized-large.gif

the look of a man that actually thinks police departments do a great job at holding themselves accountable and that pointing out the opposite with a virtually unlimited supply of evidence is a ¨tired talking point¨

none of your cop drinking buddies have ever filed a report with IA, by the way.

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fluff

fluff 87

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This talk reminds me of watching Lone Star Law on Animal Planet.   The one about the Texas Game Wardens.  It is amazing how non confrontational they are and just all around good guys that aren't out to get anyone.  I feel like the entire police system could take notes and if all officers behaved like the Texas Game Wardens, the world would be a much better place.   I know it is definitely a different deal on a different level, but I think there are definitely things to be learned about their general demeanor.

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Doc Reeves

Doc Reeves 6434

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42 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Every garden has weeds - from the local PTA up to tier I SMU's.  No selection process is perfect.  You need high standards, a robust screening and training pipeline, and a mechanism to eject bad actors quickly and efficiently.  Firing a cop is like getting rid of a bill passed by Congress.  It takes a ridiculous amount of effort, time, and money.  


That’s not the half of it. Once you get a bad actor fired, they can just get another job in a different city or with the Sheriffs dept

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BabaYaga

BabaYaga 15301

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9 minutes ago, fluff said:

This talk reminds me of watching Lone Star Law on Animal Planet.   The one about the Texas Game Wardens.  It is amazing how non confrontational they are and just all around good guys that aren't out to get anyone.  I feel like the entire police system could take notes and if all officers behaved like the Texas Game Wardens, the world would be a much better place.   I know it is definitely a different deal on a different level, but I think there are definitely things to be learned about their general demeanor.

Most GW's have masters degrees and the job placement is extremely competitive.  Virtually 100% of the people you stop are also armed and they know this.  It's also one of the most dangerous LE's jobs there is statistically.  We know our Warden well and have built a relationship with him over the years.  They don't F around and only a US Marshall has a greater jurisdiction.  They can go/do whatever they want if there is probable cause.  

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Captainant

Captainant 27680

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Posted
2 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

True, but that's another story

No, it's another chapter in the same story. If the police really gave a shit about policing their own, they wouldn't play a shell game with their bad apples - because the entire fucking orchard is rotten, not just one bunch.

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105155

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, fluff said:

This talk reminds me of watching Lone Star Law on Animal Planet.   The one about the Texas Game Wardens.  It is amazing how non confrontational they are and just all around good guys that aren't out to get anyone.  I feel like the entire police system could take notes and if all officers behaved like the Texas Game Wardens, the world would be a much better place.   I know it is definitely a different deal on a different level, but I think there are definitely things to be learned about their general demeanor.

A whole lot of this.  I've dealt with game wardens probably 20 times over the years (I'm outdoors a lot, or at least I used to be).  I had ONE who was kind of a dick -- gave us a hard time about "signing" our name on our license instead of "printing" it.  We were 19, we had all of our licenses and stamps, plugged shotguns -- we were good actors, didn't deserve getting a smartass lecture telling us we were lucky we weren't getting a citation.  Otherwise.....they've been measured, professional, and even pleasant -- we end up talking about where the fish are biting, how the dove are flying this year, etc.

And I've certainly had pleasant interactions with cops -- two in particular who regularly patrolled the area near our tailgate on foot over the years.  We got to know them, we'd share our food with them, chat about life and such.  It was good.  They knew the people in the area, they knew what looked right, and when something didn't look right.  It was a sort of "neighborhood policing" approach to a periodic "neighborhood."

That's what's most frustrating - most all of us believe that policing can be done right, because we've seen it done.  Most all of us believe that we need an actual police force.  Most all of us empathize with the most challenging aspect of a cop's job.  We just put all that together, and still see them under an umbrella of "treat human life and your fellow citizens with at least the dignity and respect required by law -- preferably more, because that de-escalates shit," and "put your duty to the community ahead of your 'code' of protection of your fellow cops."  We're really not demanding that much.....but to even speak such demands makes us enemies of the cops, and soldiers in the made-up "war on cops."  It's fucking maddening.

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BabaYaga

BabaYaga 15301

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Just now, Captainant said:

No, it's another chapter in the same story. If the police really gave a shit about policing their own, they wouldn't play a shell game with their bad apples - because the entire fucking orchard is rotten, not just one bunch.

So once you are fired, you are essentially given a dishonorable discharge and never allowed to work in the field again?  Can we do the same with teachers, bankers, and govt employees, politicians?

Every protection you reference is a byproduct of the police unions.  Gut them, and you get an immediate lift.  

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Captainant

Captainant 27680

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Just now, BabaYaga said:

So once you are fired, you are essentially given a dishonorable discharge and never allowed to work in the field again?  Can we do the same with teachers, bankers, and govt employees, politicians?

Every protection you reference is a byproduct of the police unions.  Gut them, and you get an immediate lift.  

Bad cops AREN'T fired - they're allowed to resign. Which lets them move along to the next town.

And last time I checked, teachers, bankers, and gov't employees (leaving politicians out since they're typically elected) don't make a habit of murdering minorities and hiding the evidence. But sure, bothsides bothsides thin blue line bothsides bothsides.

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