Jake Ehlinger found dead near campus

[BurntOrange&White 39486]

3 hours ago, Eskimohorn said:

So if Jake did not intend to ingest Fetanyl w Xanax this was a homicide by poisoning, correct? But an accidental overdose means he intended to have some Fetanyl.

It can be both….it’s not one or the other. 
 

[closetohumping 17380]

37 minutes ago, El Diablo said:

What's the closest comparison that hasn't worked? DWI wreck killing someone/alcohol education? 

For sure.  That never worked.

[Harrison Bergeron 1798]

45 minutes ago, Zeus said:

Not trying to cloak room this thread but damn, it's right down the road.

EL PASO, Texas — Federal agents in this section of the southern border say they’ve seen a staggering 4,000 percent increase in fentanyl seizures over the last three years.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/immigration/fentanyl-seizures-u-s-southern-border-rise-dramatically-n1272676

 

It's scary as a parent that a stupid kid thinks they're taking one thing and ends up dying from a Fentanyl overdose. It's tragic we've turned over border policy to the cartels.

[Harrison Stafford 3325]

42 minutes ago, conVINCEd said:

If you really want unlaced Xanax, can you not just go to your doctor and tell them you are having anxiety issues?  Probably cheaper that way as well.  I have no idea what it is selling for on the street, but a month supply was something like $5 five years ago.  With a $40 copay for the office visit, you’re set for 6 months for $70.

Doctors are often reluctant to prescribe benzodiazepines (xanax is a benzo). There has been increasing attention into long-term risks of benzodiazepines, including potential for addiction, overdose and cognitive impairment. The overdose death rate among patients receiving both benzodiazepines and opioids is 10 times higher than those only receiving opioids, and benzo misuse is a serious concern.

[conVINCEd 21468]

1 minute ago, Harrison Stafford said:

Doctors are often reluctant to prescribe benzodiazepines (xanax is a benzo). There has been increasing attention into long-term risks of benzodiazepines, including potential for addiction, overdose and cognitive impairment. The overdose death rate among patients receiving both benzodiazepines and opioids is 10 times higher than those only receiving opioids, and benzo misuse is a serious concern.

Is this a recent development?  I last took it 5 or so years ago, and the doc was handing it out like candy.

[MirrOlure 14607]

1 hour ago, Helobious said:

My main point is no one is putting a gun to people’s heads and making them buy & take this stuff. If it was more widely known how dangerous it really is, that might turn many (obviously not all) people away from it. Sure we must curb the flow of it in here, but that’s just one facet of the issue. You can also simultaneously keep doctors from overprescribing similar drugs & create more public awareness of the danger. 3 angles of attack.

So, leaving aside the "personal responsibility" (or lack thereof) factors that lead to addiction.....

Addiction actually is the proverbial "gun to people's head" making them buy and take this stuff.  Regardless of how, why, or through whatever circumstances someone becomes addicted....dealing with and resolving the addiction is ultimately the only real answer.

And I speak from the perspective that if fentanyl was around 5 years ago as much as it is today, I'd very likely be referencing one or both of my sons in the past-tense.

[927 E. 41st 1124]

1 hour ago, Helobious said:

My main point is no one is putting a gun to people’s heads and making them buy & take this stuff. If it was more widely known how dangerous it really is, that might turn many (obviously not all) people away from it. Sure we must curb the flow of it in here, but that’s just one facet of the issue. You can also simultaneously keep doctors from overprescribing similar drugs & create more public awareness of the danger. 3 angles of attack.

Well, then we are largely in agreement. Taking street drugs is playing Russian roulette, especially now.

 

[Zeus 5943]

11 minutes ago, Harrison Stafford said:

Doctors are often reluctant to prescribe benzodiazepines (xanax is a benzo). There has been increasing attention into long-term risks of benzodiazepines, including potential for addiction, overdose and cognitive impairment. The overdose death rate among patients receiving both benzodiazepines and opioids is 10 times higher than those only receiving opioids, and benzo misuse is a serious concern.

even "wash your penis" and "take your meds" guy got whooped

[David Dennison 18603]

1 hour ago, El Diablo said:

What's the closest comparison that hasn't worked? DWI wreck killing someone/alcohol education? 

D.A.R.E. 

Just Say No.

"I learned it from watching YOU!!!"

 

[BurntOrange&White 39486]

24 minutes ago, Harrison Bergeron said:

It's scary as a parent that a stupid kid thinks they're taking one thing and ends up dying from a Fentanyl overdose. It's tragic we've turned over border policy to the cartels.

Nothing will fix it no matter how strict you try to make border policy. 

Edited October 22, 2021 by BurntOrange&White

[El Diablo 4232]

Just now, David Dennison said:

D.A.R.E. 

Just Say No.

"I learned it from watching YOU!!!"

 

Just needs more morgue shots, give it another try. 

Seriously though, I think education is going to have to play a large part in this epidemic, whether by the kids knowing someone who's OD'd or something less traumatic. All we had to worry about was paraquat. 

[CHIEF 5057]

I just know how I was in high school and college. Alcohol, hell yeah. A little pot, ok. That was about it in high school. Didn't have a real "big time" dealer until college, never had enough money to make my heart explode on coke. There were two things that I was offered but no way would I have taken them.

Heroin. I even knew at that point, not to fuck with it. It came with physical dependency that you couldn't get away from, and you would be on Methadone from now on if you did. Also, a very high chance of overdose.

PCP. Knew a guy that was a veterinarian's son, had beat his own brains out with a pipe when I was a kid. I had seen the videos of guys getting shot dozens of times, and it still took five or six police officers to wrestle them to the ground.

I had absolutely no interest in either of those two drugs, I had been educated about them. The problem is now any street drug, no matter how mild or unassuming, can be just as dangerous or more dangerous than either one. Knowing that would have undoubtedly set me straight.

CHIEF

[ultimaton 2966]

24 minutes ago, El Diablo said:

Just needs more morgue shots, give it another try. 

Seriously though, I think education is going to have to play a large part in this epidemic, whether by the kids knowing someone who's OD'd or something less traumatic. All we had to worry about was paraquat. 

Education and we need to get the testing strips out there and available to the public. Right now FTS are still illegal drug paraphernalia in many states. The genie is probably out of the bottle with fentanyl, but we can at least give people the chance to protect themselves.

Edited October 22, 2021 by ultimaton

[Guest]

I am straight up ignorant/ naive of the drug trade/ culture.

Question that is screaming to me: If fentanyl is so risky/ deadly with regard to purity issues, what makes it such a great cutting agent?  Aren't there  other equally cheap, but way safer inert substances?

Does fentanyl have desired effects on the user/ is it deliberately used as an enhancement?

[El Diablo 4232]

Just now, ultimaton said:

Education and we need to get the testing strips out there and available to the public. Right now FTS are still illegal drug paraphernalia in many states. The genie is probably out of the bottle with fentanyl, but we can at least give people the chance to protect themselves.

Mind boggling, that what I bolded is. 

[Jkwellborn 6649]

D.A.R.E. 
Just Say No.
"I learned it from watching YOU!!!"
 

this is your brain. This is your brain on drugs. Any questions?

I am straight up ignorant/ naive of the drug trade/ culture.
Question that is screaming to me: If fentanyl is so risky/ deadly with regard to purity issues, what makes it such a great cutting agent?  Aren't there  other equally cheap, but way safer inert substances?
Does fentanyl have desired effects on the user/ is it deliberately used as an enhancement?

Because the dope makers don’t care about the end user.

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, Jkwellborn said:

Because the dope makers don’t care about the end user.

I totally get that part.  100%, however, isn't there a less deadly fucking cutting agent?  Killing your customers seems like bad business, even for ice cream companies.  Corn starch or flour is cheap.  Why fentanyl?

Edited October 22, 2021 by slorch

[conVINCEd 21468]

3 minutes ago, slorch said:

I totally get that part.  100%, however, isn't there a less deadly fucking cutting agent?  Killing your customers seems like bad business, even for ice cream companies.

If you kill a few, but get the ones who don’t die more addicted, that’s probably a net gain.

[Guest]

article from 3 years ago.

https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/americas-heroin-epidemic/why-would-anyone-cut-heroin-fentanyl-it-s-cheap-these-n943796

[Harrison Bergeron 1798]

1 hour ago, BurntOrange&White said:

Nothing will fix it no matter how strict you try to make border policy. 

[Harrison Bergeron 1798]

26 minutes ago, conVINCEd said:

If you kill a few, but get the ones who don’t die more addicted, that’s probably a net gain.

Maybe this is obvious, but one basic thing I've never gotten about the whole lacing thing ... it's not like they say, "hey, I've added some fentanyl to your adderal." It's not like the guy who might be now addicted really knows what he's addicted to ... amiright?

[Passive Aggressive Coach 87]

43 minutes ago, conVINCEd said:

If you kill a few, but get the ones who don’t die more addicted, that’s probably a net gain.

I think that's exactly right. It's not like the dealer they bought from even knows. That happens way up the chain but it does make it much more addictive. I don't think they want to kill them but to the cartels it's a net gain. Can you imagine how many die just making it? 

Edited October 22, 2021 by Passive Aggressive Coach

[ultimaton 2966]

29 minutes ago, Harrison Bergeron said:

Maybe this is obvious, but one basic thing I've never gotten about the whole lacing thing ... it's not like they say, "hey, I've added some fentanyl to your adderal." It's not like the guy who might be now addicted really knows what he's addicted to ... amiright?

I imagine you might not now what's in it, but you know the high when you bought from dealer A is a lot better than than the high you got from the stuff from dealer B, so you start buying from dealer A exclusively.

[Jkwellborn 6649]

Cartels don’t give a shit if some ODs. Eggs and omelets. The deceased will be replaced by someone else that’s hooked on it.

[BrickTop 474]

To put it in perspective, a few years ago I got hurt on the job and caught an ambulance ride. While Enroute the medics gave me 100 mcg of fentanyl which is a pretty standard starting dose, I’m a pretty big guy no history of opioid use but it’s always had a high tolerance for pain meds. This shit absolutely snowed me, took away all pain immediately and I couldn’t reAlly feel anything. It’s hard to fathom that a potentially lethal dose is 2 mg which is 20x the amount I received. There are pills floating out there at 2mg and up to 5 mg. I have seem quite a few overdoses from this shit and the sad thing is it’s usually not the addicts or experienced users, they have a tolerance and are wary enough of it it’s the casual users who tend to fuck around and find out, Narcan isn’t as effective against it either. The problem is some of these first time users are going at it blind and aren’t getting a second chance.

[Augustus 3061]

2 hours ago, slorch said:

I totally get that part.  100%, however, isn't there a less deadly fucking cutting agent?  Killing your customers seems like bad business, even for ice cream companies.  Corn starch or flour is cheap.  Why fentanyl?

Slorch, I've worked in substance abuse treatment and now professional intervention for years.

Do you know what happens when a street dealer sells a bag of heroin that ends up killing the buyer by overdose?  Every user in a  20 block radius flocks to that dealer.  Because he's got the strongest shit.

They lace it with fentanyl because it's cheap, gets the user higher, reduces costs for the cartels, reinforces/sustains addiction, etc.

[Guest]

I did admit naivety.

I  is learning.  My personal philosophy was similar to Chief's up thread. drinkin, whatever.  Had friends who smoked pot, but I never did.  Never messed with the other shit.  i can live not knowing what it feels like... and not fucking myself up on accident.

[Augustus 3061]

Just now, slorch said:

I did admit naivety.

I  is learning.  My personal philosophy was similar to Chief's up thread. drinkin, whatever.  Had friends who smoked pot, but I never did.  Never messed with the other shit.  i can live not knowing what it feels like... and not fucking myself up on accident.

Very wise.

[David Dennison 18603]

25 minutes ago, slorch said:

I did admit naivety.

I  is learning.  My personal philosophy was similar to Chief's up thread. drinkin, whatever.  Had friends who smoked pot, but I never did.  Never messed with the other shit.  i can live not knowing what it feels like... and not fucking myself up on accident.

It's amazing to me how a drug as destructive as alcohol is routinely shrugged off as "whatever" by this society.

[Dnaguy 11740]

4 hours ago, conVINCEd said:

If you really want unlaced Xanax, can you not just go to your doctor and tell them you are having anxiety issues?  Probably cheaper that way as well.  I have no idea what it is selling for on the street, but a month supply was something like $5 five years ago.  With a $40 copay for the office visit, you’re set for 6 months for $70.

I'd ask for at least a 4 or 6 month prescription.

With GoodRx you could get this down even lower...... more like $50-55.

GoodRx prices in SA (only showing the lowest):

0.5 mg

30 day: Costco 6.89

60 day: Costco 9.28

90 day: HEB 10.23

120 day: HEB 10.89

180 day: HEB 10.96

1 mg

30 day: HEB 6.45

60 day: HEB 10.44

90 day:  HEB 11.53

120 day: HEB 12.63

 

Pro tip for those who don't know:

 

Costco pharmacy cash prices are very good. Often lower than GoodRx prices at any other pharmacy.....

BUTTTTTT

If you're a costco member, they have an ADDITIONAL lower price than even their cash price. You have to ask. It's not automatically done. I know it seems that way b/c they ask for your card when you check out at the pharmacy..... but you're not getting the lowest price. And their pharmacy checkout people are dogshit b/c they don't even know that there's an additional Costco discount program on scripts. They'll say you're getting the lowest price with the cash price. You are not.

Got to the drop off window every time you get your script. 

Look at the GoodRx price to compare. 

Then always show them what that is and ask them to see what the Costco cash price is AND the Costco discounted price is.

9/10 the discounted Costco price beats the GoodRx price.

 

Profit.

As long as you're getting generic drugs, you're likely to get much lower prices than with insurance.

you're welcome.

[XYZ 2154]

1 hour ago, Dnaguy said:

Pro tip for those who don't know:

 

Costco pharmacy cash prices are very good. Often lower than GoodRx prices at any other pharmacy.....

BUTTTTTT

If you're a costco member, they have an ADDITIONAL lower price than even their cash price. You have to ask. It's not automatically done. I know it seems that way b/c they ask for your card when you check out at the pharmacy..... but you're not getting the lowest price. And their pharmacy checkout people are dogshit b/c they don't even know that there's an additional Costco discount program on scripts. They'll say you're getting the lowest price with the cash price. You are not.

Got to the drop off window every time you get your script. 

Look at the GoodRx price to compare. 

Then always show them what that is and ask them to see what the Costco cash price is AND the Costco discounted price is.

9/10 the discounted Costco price beats the GoodRx price.

 

Profit.

As long as you're getting generic drugs, you're likely to get much lower prices than with insurance.

you're welcome.

Holy shit, I had no idea. Thanks.

Edited October 22, 2021 by XYZ

[Guest]

1 hour ago, David Dennison said:

It's amazing to me how a drug as destructive as alcohol is routinely shrugged off as "whatever" by this society.

It tends to be highly regulated.  Unless someone slips me a roofie or whatever,  the user knows what they are getting. That was the context of the comment.  Go to a party and drink the punch, you’re rolling the dice, for sure.  Not a lot if folks are dying from contaminated Keystone. 

[Harrison Stafford 3325]

5 hours ago, conVINCEd said:

Is this a recent development?  I last took it 5 or so years ago, and the doc was handing it out like candy.

Yes.  My doctor said the hoops to jump through when prescribing benzodiazepines have become smaller and higher.  Upon retiring several years ago, my doctor and I agreed I would quit Xanax cold turkey after taking 1 mg every evening for 15 years which allowed me to unwind and sleep.  The reason for the Xanax (job stress) was no longer a factor and I could stay at home as long as needed until my body had kicked the dependence.  It took about 10 days before the withdrawals abated and kicking that habit was the toughest thing I’ve done in this life.  Another ring should be added to Dante’s circles of hell for drug withdrawal.

[conVINCEd 21468]

2 minutes ago, Harrison Stafford said:

Yes.  My doctor said the hoops to jump through when prescribing benzodiazepines have become smaller and higher.  Upon retiring several years ago, my doctor and I agreed I would quit Xanax cold turkey after taking 1 mg every evening for 15 years which allowed me to unwind and sleep.  The reason for the Xanax (job stress) was no longer a factor and I could stay at home as long as needed until my body had kicked the dependence.  It took about 10 days before the withdrawals abated and kicking that habit was the toughest thing I’ve done in this life.  Another ring should be added to Dante’s circles of hell for drug withdrawal.

I quit it cold turkey as well after about a year.  I didn’t like the feeling it gave me when I was jonesing for a pill.  Did it over a long weekend.

[Sawbonz 27375]

2 hours ago, Dnaguy said:

I'd ask for at least a 4 or 6 month prescription.

Show me a doc that will write you a 6 month script for a benzo and I’ll show you a doc who won’t be writing any scripts 6 months later

[bigup2dahorns 3343]

[LTtxfan 48928]

Siap...

 

[pantone159 712]

5 hours ago, slorch said:

isn't there a less deadly fucking cutting agent?  Why fentanyl?

Nobody is intentionally adding it to Xanax. The cartels do, presumably, intentionally use fentanyl in their 'heroin' products. But they are sloppy/careless/negligent in cleaning their equipment and the fentanyl e.g. contaminates the pill press and then it gets into Xanax pills.

[TwiceHorn 31184]

7 hours ago, RollLeft said:

This isn't just an illegal drug problem.  Its simply a drug problem.  Fentanyl sucks.  

So much this.  Someone in the medical profession speak up about how many people are seizing up on this legal drug.  If you medical professionals don't I hope someone like @THUJONE can/will.  

Legal fentanyl tends to be sold in "packages" that make it extremely difficult to use recreationally/overdose.  The primary medical forms are patches and "lollipops," from which it would be extraordinarily difficult to obtain overdose quantities.

This isn't like oxycontin and hydro/oxycodone, where prescribed drugs are the problem.

 

[MotownHorn 1724]

8 hours ago, RollLeft said:

This isn't just an illegal drug problem.  Its simply a drug problem.  Fentanyl sucks.  

So much this.  Someone in the medical profession speak up about how many people are seizing up on this legal drug.  If you medical professionals don't I hope someone like @THUJONE can/will.  

Its a problem created by drug prohibition. History shows that any time you make a drug that people desire illegal, traffickers will find a way to transport it in the highest potency possible per unit. It was the case for alcohol (spirits over beer during prohibition), cannabis (today’s cannabis is way stronger than yesterday’s thanks to prohibition), and cocaine (crack). Fentanyl is popular on the black market because it packs the biggest punch per unit. It’s proliferation is a natural extension of the current popularity of opiates.  

Apologies if that’s too CR but I have a lot of thoughts, opinion, and information on drugs and drug policy. 

IMO Jake is alive today if recreational drug use is legal and regulated. Dude wanted a Xanax, not fentanyl. In a legal regulated market he would have just had a Xanax. Just like in a legal regulated market you get to buy Bud Light or an ipa or whatever and you know what you’re getting. You don’t buy Bud Light and end up with 12 oz of homemade moonshine.

Edited October 23, 2021 by MotownHorn

[Castilian Cum Stain 25]

So yo, i am going to Antartica and I am super super vertigo anxiety ocean whatever you call it. I am thinking of just going to my doctor and asking for a months supply as its a 19+ day excursion. Any recos????

[XYZ 2154]

2 hours ago, Castilian Cum Stain said:

So yo, i am going to Antartica and I am super super vertigo anxiety ocean whatever you call it. I am thinking of just going to my doctor and asking for a months supply as its a 19+ day excursion. Any recos????

Wrong thread, asshole.

[Patricio Swayze 17058]

Username checks out though.

[JesusSweatDuck 17780]

12 hours ago, Castilian Cum Stain said:

So yo, i am going to Antartica and I am super super vertigo anxiety ocean whatever you call it. I am thinking of just going to my doctor and asking for a months supply as its a 19+ day excursion. Any recos????

Start with a SSRI. That might actually solve the root of your anxiety

[Penche Gringo 145]

13 hours ago, pantone159 said:

Nobody is intentionally adding it to Xanax. The cartels do, presumably, intentionally use fentanyl in their 'heroin' products. But they are sloppy/careless/negligent in cleaning their equipment and the fentanyl e.g. contaminates the pill press and then it gets into Xanax pills.

Chapo, is that you?

[927 E. 41st 1124]

18 minutes ago, Penche Gringo said:

But they are sloppy/careless/negligent in cleaning their equipment and the fentanyl e.g. contaminates the pill press and then it gets into Xanax pills.

Yes, cleanliness is only second to safety with those assholes.

I hope there is a special level of hell waiting for the folks that put these "murder pills" out on the street.

[Bobby Layne 266]

15 hours ago, Harrison Stafford said:

Yes.  My doctor said the hoops to jump through when prescribing benzodiazepines have become smaller and higher.  Upon retiring several years ago, my doctor and I agreed I would quit Xanax cold turkey after taking 1 mg every evening for 15 years which allowed me to unwind and sleep.  The reason for the Xanax (job stress) was no longer a factor and I could stay at home as long as needed until my body had kicked the dependence.  It took about 10 days before the withdrawals abated and kicking that habit was the toughest thing I’ve done in this life.  Another ring should be added to Dante’s circles of hell for drug dealers! 

Fify

[Bobby Layne 266]

On 10/21/2021 at 10:07 PM, David Dennison said:

What should we do about it?

Pushback against China for manufacturing. Close the border. Persuade the culture that “getting high” means one thing to some folks, and sudden death to others. This didn’t happen overnight or in a vacuum. Those who want peace in the world should start with finding peace personally. Then with others. 

[Bobby Layne 266]

21 hours ago, ultimaton said:

Education and we need to get the testing strips out there and available to the public. Right now FTS are still illegal drug paraphernalia in many states. The genie is probably out of the bottle with fentanyl, but we can at least give people the chance to protect themselves.

(sarcasm alert) yeah sure. Like the kids always carry AIDS and other STD test kits when they go to a party/orgy. Discerning drug users will be sure not to put “dirty drugs” in their bodies. Test strips. Very sensible. But drug use isn’t sensible. It’s about changing how you feel …right now! Immediate gratification is the disease of America.  

[Degenerate Gardner 4081]

This remains some of the most pragmatic substance consumption advice you could give a kid if the goal is survival.

Things growing in the ground aren’t necessarily benign. You can get lost in the weeds here with toxic mushrooms and the many poppy products but don’t. Keep it simple, focus on reducing risk and avoid the fentanyl delivery devices.