40 people shot in 3 days

[David Dennison 18661]

1 minute ago, Incredulity said:

Horseshit.

 A white person having a more lending options isn’t a BENEFIT of racism.

Not suffering from racism isn’t the same as benefiting.

It is when black people with the exact same financials don't have access to the same options.

[bad_teammate 13132]

2 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

Horseshit.

 A white person having a more lending options isn’t a BENEFIT of racism.

Not suffering from racism isn’t the same as benefiting.

In a competitive market, it is absolutely a benefit to have more options than someone else both in terms of choice (available houses) and means (available loans).

I have no idea how you cannot understand that.

[Incredulity 11555]

Just now, David Dennison said:

It is when black people with the exact same financials don't have access to the same options.

No

[Guest]

1 hour ago, burntorangebongos said:

Same on abortion. Stay out of women's reproductive rights, motherfucker.

You might have a point if I was considering laws restricting the liberty of people who have never had an abortion.

 

Possession of a firearm is no equal to terminating life( abortion.)  The additional action required with a firearm is exactly the differentiating factor.

 

Nice reach though.

[Incredulity 11555]

Just now, bad_teammate said:

In a competitive market, it is absolutely a benefit to have more options than someone else both in terms of choice (available houses) and means (available loans).

I have no idea how you cannot understand that.

Again not suffering isn’t the same as benefiting.  I have no idea how you cannot understand that.

[David Dennison 18661]

Just now, Incredulity said:

Again not suffering isn’t the same as benefiting.  I have no idea how you cannot understand that.

You benefit from not being profiled.

You benefit from not being a suspect.

You benefit from law enforcement assuming you aren't a criminal.

I have no idea how you cannot understand that.

[Chrispy 132]

10 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

BLM is an astonishingly peaceful movement given the violence perpetrated against them.

This is just sad.

Just tell them the truth and be honest, you believe they aren’t capable. The bigotry of low expectations. Disgusting.

[ndawg 1242]

1 minute ago, Incredulity said:

Again not suffering isn’t the same as benefiting.  I have no idea how you cannot understand that.

Inevitably, the conclusion of your semantic games will be that you don't really have any personal responsibility to help ensure everyone in the US gets an equal opportunity.

After all, you're not privileged. It's other people that are underprivileged. But that's not your fault. You're not one of the racists. You don't believe blacks should be forced to sit at the back of the bus. That's what a racist is, right?

[bad_teammate 13132]

2 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

Again not suffering isn’t the same as benefiting. 

You're being purposefully obtuse, but here we go anyway...

If Person A and Person B both want to buy the same house, but Person B saw it first and applied for the same loan at the same bank with the same financial situation and is denied, but then Person A is granted the loan and purchases the home. Did Person A benefit from the denial of Person B?

Simple question. Please answer.

[bad_teammate 13132]

1 minute ago, Chrispy said:

Just tell them the truth and be honest, you believe they aren’t capable. The bigotry of low expectations. Disgusting.

Can you provide a specific quote from me that indicates that I believe the the descendants of enslaved blacks are incapable? It would be interesting to see. The reality is that you do not seem to want to deal with the content of my post.

You say that slave-descended blacks should follow the model of Asian and Jewish immigrants. I say they literally cannot because Asian and Jewish immigrants had family connections that have remained intact for centuries while slave-descended blacks had their family connections actively destroyed by white supremacy for centuries. 

Slave-descended blacks had to attempt to rebuild family after the end of slavery, and were immediately met with Jim Crow laws that hindered their progress. And after the formal ending of Jim Crow (which was not that long ago), the systemic oppression from the government and financial sectors are still actively sabotaging the growth and development of black families.

Slave-descended blacks are just as capable as anyone else when they are not being actively sabotaged and oppressed.

[Johnny Sack 8397]

11 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

You benefit from not being profiled.

You benefit from not being a suspect.

You benefit from law enforcement assuming you aren't a criminal.

I have no idea how you cannot understand that.

So do females.  Are cops sexist?

[Incredulity 11555]

2 minutes ago, ndawg said:

Inevitably, the conclusion of your semantic games will be that you don't really have any personal responsibility to help ensure everyone in the US gets an equal opportunity.

After all, you're not privileged. It's other people that are underprivileged. But that's not your fault. You're not one of the racists. You don't believe blacks should be forced to sit at the back of the bus. That's what a racist is, right?

Words have meaning.  That isn’t semantics.

The accusation of benefits to whites from racism, specifically in todays society, is a serious claim.

Hypothetical situations regarding simultaneous timing of home loans are certainly possible, but statistically irrelevant.

[David Dennison 18661]

2 minutes ago, Johnny Sack said:

So do females.  Are cops sexist?

Black females. You sure about that?

[Johnny Sack 8397]

Just talking gender. Cops arrest more males. Males are way over represented in prisons. And males are far more frequently shot by cops. 

You disagree?

[Incredulity 11555]

1 minute ago, Johnny Sack said:

Just talking gender. Cops arrest more males. Males are way over represented in prisons. And males are far more frequently shot by cops. 

You disagree?

He hates “the patriarchy”, so he is fine with it

[David Dennison 18661]

2 minutes ago, Johnny Sack said:

Just talking gender. Cops arrest more males. Males are way over represented in prisons. And males are far more frequently shot by cops. 

You disagree?

Why is  that?

[Johnny Sack 8397]

Young white males are in prison and arrested far more than elderly black females.  That isn’t fair. 

[Johnny Sack 8397]

Just now, David Dennison said:

Why is  that?

Sexism. 

[David Dennison 18661]

Just now, Johnny Sack said:

Young white males are in prison and arrested far more than elderly black females.  That isn’t fair. 

Why is that?

[Johnny Sack 8397]

1 minute ago, David Dennison said:

Why is that?

Sexism and ageism.  Clearly. 

[David Dennison 18661]

Just now, Johnny Sack said:

Sexism and ageism.  Clearly. 

Clearly.

Now say what you really want to say.

[Johnny Sack 8397]

Cops discriminate agaonst and profile males.  And the young. Need to get this activist on the case

 

Edited May 5, 2018 by Johnny Sack

[Thatguy 8508]

On 5/3/2018 at 5:14 PM, deadshank said:

Being poor sucks.  No doubt.  Integrated neighborhoods would be a great idea if it would work but it won't becuase people are people.  The world is a hard place.

   It works because it gets kids who would otherwise have to go to inferior schools a chance to get a better education. It also allows people from lower income lifestyles to rub shoulders with people from the upper classes. Not sure if you know this, but part of the problem is not KNOWING what life can be like. If all you know is what you are in you won't strive to be different because you don't know what different is. But I am sure you aren't interested in that so.....

 

Also, "because" is spelled with the a before the u.

[David Dennison 18661]

1 minute ago, Johnny Sack said:

Cops discriminate agaonst and profile males.  And the young. 

And within that cohort, they discriminate against young black males more than young white males.

Are you OK with that?

[Chrispy 132]

15 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Can you provide a specific quote from me that indicates that I believe the the descendants of enslaved blacks are incapable? It would be interesting to see. The reality is that you do not seem to want to deal with the content of my post.

You say that slave-descended blacks should follow the model of Asian and Jewish immigrants. I say they literally cannot because Asian and Jewish immigrants had family connections that have remained intact for centuries while slave-descended blacks had their family connections actively destroyed by white supremacy for centuries. 

Slave-descended blacks had to attempt to rebuild family after the end of slavery, and were immediately met with Jim Crow laws that hindered their progress. And after the formal ending of Jim Crow (which was not that long ago), the systemic oppression from the government and financial sectors are still actively sabotaging the growth and development of black families.

Slave-descended blacks are just as capable as anyone else when they are not being actively sabotaged and oppressed.

You just said that black people can’t follow the Asian model, which I find to be an abhorrent comment, especially in 2018. You feel they need to have their hand held because they aren’t capable, well I think that’s nonsense. What you’re spewing is extremely condescending and damaging to the black psyche. 

[David Dennison 18661]

Just now, Chrispy said:

You just said that black people can’t follow the Asian model, which I find to be an abhorrent comment, especially in 2018. You feel they need to have their hand held because they aren’t capable, well I think that’s nonsense. What you’re spewing is extremely condescending and damaging to the black psyche. 

You're grossly mischaracterizing what he said so you can act shocked.

Stop with the pearl clutching. His point about history is a valid one.

[ndawg 1242]

20 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

Words have meaning.  That isn’t semantics.

The accusation of benefits to whites from racism, specifically in todays society, is a serious claim.

You have it wrong. The fact that words have meaning is exactly why we have wars over semantics.

If you can't see the benefits, then you just aren't looking.

[Thatguy 8508]

5 minutes ago, Chrispy said:

You just said that black people can’t follow the Asian model, which I find to be an abhorrent comment, especially in 2018. You feel they need to have their hand held because they aren’t capable, well I think that’s nonsense. What you’re spewing is extremely condescending and damaging to the black psyche. 

He is saying it takes time.....don't be obtuse!

[Slade 263]

6 minutes ago, Chrispy said:

You just said that black people can’t follow the Asian model, which I find to be an abhorrent comment, especially in 2018. You feel they need to have their hand held because they aren’t capable, well I think that’s nonsense. What you’re spewing is extremely condescending and damaging to the black psyche. 

Obtuse as hell. He spelled it out and you still mischaracterized what he was saying. 

[Chrispy 132]

1 minute ago, David Dennison said:

You're grossly mischaracterizing what he said so you can act shocked.

Stop with the pearl clutching. His point about history is a valid one.

His comments were very revealing and I found them extremely distasteful. I’ve gotten to the bottom of his minset, which I’m sure you share, and it’s absolutely appalling that he believes them to be so incapable. 

[David Dennison 18661]

3 minutes ago, Chrispy said:

His comments were very revealing and I found them extremely distasteful. I’ve gotten to the bottom of his minset, which I’m sure you share, and it’s absolutely appalling that he believes them to be so incapable. 

That's not what he believes. You are being disingenuous and it destroys any credibility your argument might have. You are using it as a rhetorical devise because your underlying argument is so weak.

[deadshank 24651]

6 minutes ago, Thatguy said:

   It works because it gets kids who would otherwise have to go to inferior schools a chance to get a better education. It also allows people from lower income lifestyles to rub shoulders with people from the upper classes. Not sure if you know this, but part of the problem is not KNOWING what life can be like. If all you know is what you are in you won't strive to be different because you don't know what different is. But I am sure you aren't interested in that so.....

 

Also, "because" is spelled with the a before the u.

I know how "because" is spelled, Wisenheimer.  I got it right the first time in the same post!  Hey, batting .500!  

My neighborhood IS integrated (to a degree).  It is integrated, not because of a mandate, but because the people  buying property in it can afford to live there.  Note: it's not THAT expensive.

/csb:  I have several Hispanic employees.  From Houston, we have done work as far away as Midland.  This meant a good 8-9 hour drive from Houston, stopping along the way for meals, fill ups and eventually staying in motels for an extended period of time.  My employees that made the trip for the first time were scared shitless of the thought of travelling like that.  Why?  They had never experienced it.  Of course, I went with them the first few times and showed them the ropes of out-of-town-living.  Not because I'm the smart white guy but because I had the experience.  

Using a credit card, keeping receipts, booking rooms, finding local branches of suppliers that we already have accounts with and so on were things they had never experienced.  Heck, they didn't even have luggage.  After the first trip they knew what to do and did it well.

So, yes, I agree with your that KNOWING / experience is a good thing.

[Chrispy 132]

2 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

That's not what he believes. You are being disingenuous and it destroys any credibility your argument might have. You are using it as a rhetorical devise because your underlying argument is so weak.

I fully understand what he’s implying. Making them the perpetual victim is extremely damaging. 

[ChiTownDoc 21102]

53 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

Again not suffering isn’t the same as benefiting.  I have no idea how you cannot understand that.

Wait, are you trying to say racism doesn't exist in lending/housing?  I mean that's just amazing if that's what you're insinuating?  What corner of the country are you tucked into?

Apologies in advance if I'm not understanding what you're saying or my sarcasm meter is failing me...

[David Dennison 18661]

Just now, Chrispy said:

I fully understand what he’s implying. Making them the perpetual victim is extremely damaging. 

You don't understand at all, as evidenced by your posts.

 

[Chrispy 132]

3 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

You don't understand at all, as evidenced by your posts.

 

No, I get it. Evil, white people hold down the black community. Lather, rinse, repeat. 

[David Dennison 18661]

Just now, Chrispy said:

No, I get it. Evil, white people hold down the black community. Lather, rinse, repeat. 

You do get it. You know exactly what has happened throughout this country's history. It obviously makes you uncomfortable and you feel guilty about it. 

Be better.

[Chrispy 132]

5 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

You do get it. You know exactly what has happened throughout this country's history. It obviously makes you uncomfortable and you feel guilty about it. 

Be better.

No, I expect more, you expect less. Pretty simple really. 

[David Dennison 18661]

1 minute ago, Chrispy said:

No, I expect more, you expect less. Pretty simple really. 

Just not from yourself.

 

[Incredulity 11555]

26 minutes ago, ChiTownDoc said:

Wait, are you trying to say racism doesn't exist in lending/housing?  I mean that's just amazing if that's what you're insinuating?  What corner of the country are you tucked into?

Apologies in advance if I'm not understanding what you're saying or my sarcasm meter is failing me...

No, I am saying racism in housing and lending does exist.  White people not suffering racism in housing and lending is NOT the same as white people benefiting from racism in housing and lending.

[Chrispy 132]

7 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Just not from yourself.

 

I’ve shared my advice, I’m saving one message board at a time, baby steps. 

[David Dennison 18661]

1 minute ago, Incredulity said:

No, I am saying racism in housing and lending does exist.  White people not suffering racism in housing and lending is NOT the same as white people benefiting from racism in housing and lending.

It is when they receive mortgages when black people with the exact same financial profile do not. That is a benefit.

[Johnny Sack 8397]

28 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

It is when they receive mortgages when black people with the exact same financial profile do not. That is a benefit.

If this still is common, should be a good lawsuit if true.  And easy to prove.  

[David Dennison 18661]

8 minutes ago, Johnny Sack said:

If this still is common, should be a good lawsuit if true.  And easy to prove.  

Yep. There are stories of settlements and judgments all over the internet machine.

[CooterBrown 17914]

 . 
They don't care about the City they like to use it to rub it in the other sides face with regards to a large number of failed Democratic ideas. 

The problem with that is even the successful cities are mostly liberal also.

[David Dennison 18661]

5 minutes ago, CooterBrown said:

The problem with that is even the successful cities are mostly liberal also.

 

Another problem is that successful progressive ideas are assimilated into the culture and everyone forgets that there was even a controversy when they were being implemented.

[ndawg 1242]

So much horse shit in this thread.

Racism isn't the mere assertion that Black Americans could do more to improve their situation. In fact, in a vacuum, that is unquestionably true, but only because it's a tautology. Everyone could always do more to improve their situation.

Your racism is revealed by the unwavering, unquestioned confidence some of y'all have that your understanding of their situation is automatically more accurate and valid than theirs. The assumption that if they lived their lives more like your idealistic vision of what a family is supposed to be, they'd suffer from less violence, or be better off. The presumption that, since you're not part of a community being torn apart by violence, you must know better. Since you're better off, it must be because you've figured out how to pull them bootstraps hard enough to improve your lot.

The pedestal you're standing on that provides such a vantage point has a name, and it's not "meritocracy." It's called "privilege." As much as many liberals have gotten carried away with it and used it to fuel their drug known as outrage, you should actually check yours.

Sure, you don't hold the belief that they are genetically inferior, or that they should use a different water fountain, or be forced to live in different neighborhoods. But your belief structure is compromised by racism nonetheless. Your stupid arguments about how librulism is actually racist are nonsense to anyone with half a brain.

Edited May 5, 2018 by ndawg

[ChiTownDoc 21102]

1 hour ago, Incredulity said:

No, I am saying racism in housing and lending does exist.  White people not suffering racism in housing and lending is NOT the same as white people benefiting from racism in housing and lending.

If all is equal except skin color and they go with the white guy over the colored guy how doesn’t the white guy benefit?  I’m confused.  

[bad_teammate 13132]

2 hours ago, Chrispy said:

I fully understand what he’s implying. Making them the perpetual victim is extremely damaging. 

There is no implication anywhere. I am exhaustive (and exhausting) in explaining exactly what my point is.

But I do appreciate, in a sense, how purposefully obtuse you're being. Laying bare the intellectual bankruptcy of your position with dishonest argumentation is a boon for me. Thanks.

[Guest]

28 minutes ago, ndawg said:

So much horse shit in this thread.

Racism isn't the mere assertion that Black Americans could do more to improve their situation. In fact, in a vacuum, that is unquestionably true, but only because it's a tautology. Everyone could always do more to improve their situation.

Your racism is revealed by the unwavering, unquestioned confidence some of y'all have that your understanding of their situation is automatically more accurate and valid than theirs. The assumption that if they lived their lives more like your idealistic vision of what a family is supposed to be, they'd suffer from less violence, or be better off. The presumption that, since you're not part of a community being torn apart by violence, you must know better. Since you're better off, it must be because you've figured out how to pull them bootstraps hard enough to improve your lot.

The pedestal you're standing on that provides such a vantage point has a name, and it's not "meritocracy." It's called "privilege." As much as many liberals have gotten carried away with it and used it to fuel their drug known as outrage, you should actually check yours.

Sure, you don't hold the belief that they are genetically inferior, or that they should use a different water fountain, or be forced to live in different neighborhoods. But your belief structure is compromised by racism nonetheless. Your stupid arguments about how librulism is actually racist are nonsense to anyone with half a brain.

It isn't necessarily idealism or what I think a family should be.  there are successes in all shapes and sizes when it comes to family.

Just make better fucking choices...

 

It isn't privileged to never have assaulted a fellow human being.  It isn't privileged to never have knocked off a liquor store. It isn't privileged not to do drugs.

 

Make better fucking choices and life turns out a hell of a lot better.

Edited May 5, 2018 by slorch