Critical Race Theory policy in hiring at UT

[Serak The Preparer 3423]

1 hour ago, Macklemore said:

I’m not Icono. hayden horn ran an IP check on another and confirmed I wasn’t. My posting style isn’t like his and I don’t post in the CR.

It is absolutely stunning that a poster who doesn't understand the difference between a news article and an opinion piece / letter to the editor also doesn't understand that Hayden didn't confirm that you weren't Icono. He did not that you have a different IP, but also noted that this information is becoming more and more meaningless as connectivity changes.

[BabaYaga 15202]

11 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Where in the name of fuck did you get that from what I said.

And, sorry, I'm not sure I find your source 100% credible.

Not saying that, but the premise that this is "just a theory" like any other is disingenuous.  You may also not like the source and we can play the fun little game of "it's a right wing/left wing publication" ad hominem dance all we want, but there are dozens and dozens of examples like this popping up all over.

[Captainant 27309]

10 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Ah, the tried and true ad hominem attack on the publication, ignoring the actual citations of events that have been sourced in the publication.  Again, very compelling.  My dude.  

Baby aga. Cmon man. Did you read the article authored by Christopher Rufo?? The "whistleblower documents"(!!!) was a link to the authors own personal blog in which he took screenshots of a presentation slide deck to teachers.

Give me a fucking break.

[BabaYaga 15202]

12 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

Well shit, if someone's blog says an unnamed "whistleblower" reported these actions to them, well it fucking must have happened. That's totally a reliable source of information you have there. 

In other news, I was approached by a whistleblower who informed me that @BabaYaga is actually part of the insectoid race with the goal of planting eggs in all of our brains. Apparently, he also subsists primarily on feces. Again, this is from a totally real whistleblower. 

Oh, ok.  So NOW "anonymous" sources are verboten?  Cute, I'll let CNN and the rest of the MSM dial back from their "sources" over the last four years.  OR....you could also look at the dozens and dozens of other examples

[MissingInAction 24765]

10 hours ago, washparkhorn said:

Duck or Rabbit?

Penis

[TwiceHorn 31184]

8 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Oh, ok.  So NOW "anonymous" sources are verboten?  Cute, I'll let CNN and the rest of the MSM dial back from their "sources" over the last four years.  OR....you could also look at the dozens and dozens of other examples

Read the article carefully,  It's hysterical as fuck and shades alleged facts (what the proposed curriculum calls for versus what the actual curriculum teaches) badly to support a conclusion.

Nowhere does it allege that the curriculum is actually used.  Anyone can "propose" or "design" a curriculum.  It doesn't mean anyone is going to adopt and teach it.

And it starts off with the whistleblower's complaint to create the impression that the "diversity czar" or whatever is some kind of tyrant that mandates obediance.

It's really quite a masterpiece of making you think it says something that it doesn't:  that Buffalo schools use Fatima Morrell's curriculum. 

Edited May 21, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[Dahobbs 17420]

8 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Oh, ok.  So NOW "anonymous" sources are verboten?  Cute, I'll let CNN and the rest of the MSM dial back from their "sources" over the last four years.  OR....you could also look at the dozens and dozens of other examples

No, anonymous sources aren't verboten. But, whether or not I'll believe articles reporting on such sources depends upon the source of the article. I don't think Mr. Rufo's blog is a place where the highest levels of journalistic integrity are maintained. If professional fact based reporters like Reuters or the AP report on the story and confirms the existence of this whistleblower, then I'll give it much more credence. I'd even give similar credence to such reports from either Fox's or CNN's news desks. If it is coming from the opinion/entertainment divisions of either company, I'll ignore it until it is confirmed elsewhere. 

Seriously, I'll start a blog right now. And I'll post this verbatim:

"I was approached by a whistleblower who informed me that @BabaYaga is actually part of the insectoid race with the goal of planting eggs in all of our brains. Apparently, he also subsists primarily on feces. Again, this is from a totally real whistleblower." 

Would you trust that source? Why or why not? 

Edited May 21, 2021 by Dahobbs

[SmokeyTheBear 5562]

1 hour ago, Johnny Sack said:

Every kid at the school is privileged, including the black and brown ones.  We aren't paying for our kids to be indoctrinated with leftist class warfare bullshit.

 

1 hour ago, Johnny Sack said:

Our community disagrees.  And won't be doing it.

Chefs kiss

[BabaYaga 15202]

13 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Baby aga. Cmon man. Did you read the article authored by Christopher Rufo?? The "whistleblower documents"(!!!) was a link to the authors own personal blog in which he took screenshots of a presentation slide deck to teachers.

Give me a fucking break.

Gotcha.  So none of it happened.  None.  Zilch.  Nada.  Nor are all the other dozens and dozens and dozens of examples across the country actually happen either.  Again, compelling strategy.  Teachers in CA definitely DID NOT get CRT packets for their students covering “Permanence of Racism,” and “Whiteness as Property.”  Nor did the "Equity Audit Rubric...“grounded in Critical Race Theory”" in Sacramento ever happen.  Again, there are dozens and dozens of examples

Santa Clara parents ask school board to roll back "implicit bias training for their kids

Implicit bias curriculum

Edited May 21, 2021 by BabaYaga

[Dahobbs 17420]

2 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Gotcha.  So none of it happened.  None.  Zilch.  Nada.  Nor are all the other dozens and dozens and dozens of examples across the country actually happen either.  Again, compelling strategy.  Teachers in CA definitely DID NOT get CRT packets for their students covering “Permanence of Racism,” and “Whiteness as Property.”  Nor did the "Equity Audit Rubric...“grounded in Critical Race Theory”" in Sacramento ever happen.  Again, there are dozens and dozens of examples

I love the assertion of "examples" with no context and no reliable source on such incidents. I understand that you whole heartedly believe everything you are saying. But I'm saddened that you are unable to think critically about the sources of your information and their claims. 

[Pancho 44358]

43 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

This conflating these "teachings" on the same level as math/science is disingenuous. 

Do you have children yourself?  Tell me honestly how would you react to this?  This is utterly abhorrent.....and before some goalkeeper tries their tried and true "this isn't REAL CRT" nonsense, this is what you are seeing more and more of that parent have real issues with.

• Buffalo Public Schools teaches students that “all white people” perpetuate systemic racism and forces kindergarteners to watch a video of dead black children warning them about “racist police and state-sanctioned violence” who might kill them at any time.

Buffalo Public Schools diversity czar Fatima Morrell

There are dozens and dozens of other examples from across the country at all age levels.  

Or this:  A Cupertino, California, elementary school forces third-graders to deconstruct their racial and sexual identities, then rank themselves according to their “power and privilege.” They separate the eight-year-old children into oppressors and oppressed.

The author of this article is a radical right wing conservative, so this is not an objective take. 

[BabaYaga 15202]

1 minute ago, Dahobbs said:

I love the assertion of "examples" with no context and no reliable source on such incidents. I understand that you whole heartedly believe everything you are saying. But I'm saddened that you are unable to think critically about the sources of your information and their claims. 

Cute how we've moved from no examples, to no, I need better examples.  

On May 5, Governor Jay Inslee of Washington signed Senate Bill 5044 into law, which requires Critical Race Theory (CRT) training for all school staff, board directors, teachers, and administrators in public schools across the state.

My brother lives in Lacy.  He confirmed that his kids are being taught this in the classroom.  But sure, keep your head buried in the sand....

And we can't let the parents know.  Have to hide this from them.  From the "whiteness in Ed spaces"

[BabaYaga 15202]

6 minutes ago, Pancho said:

The author of this article is a radical right wing conservative, so this is not an objective take. 

Ad hominem.  Got it.  Thanks

[synoptic 138]

Most of the discussion seems to be on whether or not CRT is being taught in k-12 schools.  Is anyone in this thread advocating that it should be taught to k-12 students, or is there genral agreement that it should be college level subject only?

[Johnny Sack 8397]

2 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Cute how we've moved from no examples, to no, I need better examples.  

On May 5, Governor Jay Inslee of Washington signed Senate Bill 5044 into law, which requires Critical Race Theory (CRT) training for all school staff, board directors, teachers, and administrators in public schools across the state.

My brother lives in Lacy.  He confirmed that his kids are being taught this in the classroom.  But sure, keep your head buried in the sand....

And we can't let the parents know.  Have to hide this from them.  From the "whiteness in Ed spaces"

[TwiceHorn 31184]

Also, here's the Cupertino outrage document, at the bottom of the page: https://christopherrufo.com/woke-elementary/

I don't really find that very offensive.  It doesn't make any conclusions about anything, it's just a thought-provoker.  According to the article, the school in question is mostly non-white.  It also appears to be highly privileged, so must be full of Asians.

[Pancho 44358]

1 minute ago, BabaYaga said:

Ad hominem.  Got it.  Thanks

No, it's a biased article based on the author's political leanings.  That's enough to attack his argumentation, not his character.  

[BabaYaga 15202]

1 minute ago, TwiceHorn said:

Also, here's the Cupertino outrage document, at the bottom of the page: https://christopherrufo.com/woke-elementary/

I don't really find that very offensive.  It doesn't make any conclusions about anything, it's just a thought-provoker.  According to the article, the school in question is mostly non-white.  It also appears to be highly privileged, so must be full of Asians.

Quote

recently forced a class of third-graders to deconstruct their racial identities, then rank themselves according to their “power and privilege.” 

I do.  These are 3rd graders.  Are you serious?

[Johnny Sack 8397]

3 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Also, here's the Cupertino outrage document, at the bottom of the page: https://christopherrufo.com/woke-elementary/

I don't really find that very offensive.  It doesn't make any conclusions about anything, it's just a thought-provoker.  According to the article, the school in question is mostly non-white.  It also appears to be highly privileged, so must be full of Asians.

I find it extremely offensive.  And divisive.  And harmful to anyone who is subjected to that garbage.

[TwiceHorn 31184]

3 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Cute how we've moved from no examples, to no, I need better examples.  

On May 5, Governor Jay Inslee of Washington signed Senate Bill 5044 into law, which requires Critical Race Theory (CRT) training for all school staff, board directors, teachers, and administrators in public schools across the state.

My brother lives in Lacy.  He confirmed that his kids are being taught this in the classroom.  But sure, keep your head buried in the sand....

And we can't let the parents know.  Have to hide this from them.  From the "whiteness in Ed spaces"

Are you deliberately hiding your sources?  Sweet baby Jesus.  https://ladyliberty1885.com/

Do you read this kind of shit on the daily?

[BabaYaga 15202]

Just now, Pancho said:

No, it's a biased article based on the author's political leanings.  That's enough to attack his argumentation, not his character.  

Except you didn't attach his argumentation....

[Neonmoon 38127]

Like most subjects, it all boils down to one side having to explain to a less intelligent side why their evidence is not credible and why their arguments are flawed. The less intelligent side is either mentally incapable of understanding this new information, or is not open to processing new information because they want to believe what they want to believe not matter what. (Or a combination of the two) 

It is the same as it’s ever been. It will always be this way. That’s why progress is hard.

 

[TwiceHorn 31184]

Just now, BabaYaga said:

I do.  These are 3rd graders.  Are you serious?

Look at the document instead of the bullshit stated about the document.

I might agree that it's a bit advanced for third graders, particularly the writing sample.  Also, it seems to be a "slide deck" rather than an actual assignment and there's no real context for it.

[Johnny Sack 8397]

2 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

Like most subjects, it all boils down to one side having to explain to a less intelligent side why their evidence is not credible and why their arguments are flawed. The less intelligent side is either mentally incapable of understanding this new information, or is not open to processing new information because they want to believe what they want to believe not matter what. (Or a combination of the two) 

It is the same as it’s ever been. It will always be this way. That’s why progress is hard.

 

You really believe this bullshit, don't you?

[mchookem 16094]

1 minute ago, synoptic said:

Most of the discussion seems to be on whether or not CRT is being taught in k-12 schools.  Is anyone in this thread advocating that it should be taught to k-12 students, or is there genral agreement that it should be college level subject only?

i've posted twice now... TX passed the law this session that prevents teaching this K-12.

college students are old enough to discern for themselves...or, you know, not register for a fucking CRT class.

for TX, this whole thread is one giant 

[BabaYaga 15202]

Just now, TwiceHorn said:

Are you deliberately hiding your sources?  Sweet baby Jesus.  https://ladyliberty1885.com/

Do you read this kind of shit on the daily?

Hiding?  I clearly stated the conference.  Whiteness in Ed spaces.  The other items, such as the recent legislation is known as it was not a secret that this was passed.  And as stated, my nephew and niece has brought home CRT material.  I'll see if I can get a pic to post.  

[TwiceHorn 31184]

6 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Hiding?  I clearly stated the conference.  Whiteness in Ed spaces.  The other items, such as the recent legislation is known as it was not a secret that this was passed.  And as stated, my nephew and niece has brought home CRT material.  I'll see if I can get a pic to post.  

Well, you mentioned Washington, and the material you pasted, which is of dubious provenance, is, according to the source, from a teacher conference in North Carolina.  https://ladyliberty1885.com/2020/09/05/records-whiteness-in-ed-spaces-wcpss-edcamp-equity-2020/

And here is the actual document, which doesn't appear to be course material at all.  I can't tell what the fuck it is. https://drive.google.com/file/d/12Ftr8gmYnQnFDVTJR5YkBJ4lZrfyz_vU/view

 

Edited May 21, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[Macklemore 2899]

44 minutes ago, Serak The Preparer said:

It is absolutely stunning that a poster who doesn't understand the difference between a news article and an opinion piece / letter to the editor also doesn't understand that Hayden didn't confirm that you weren't Icono. He did not that you have a different IP, but also noted that this information is becoming more and more meaningless as connectivity changes.

First, I didn't post those quotes. I just said that I remember reading it in an op-ed in what I thought was the WSJ originally but later corrected to say it was actually published by the NY Post. I don't deny that I enjoy reading op-eds. I have favorite columnists at the WSJ and also like to have my personal beliefs challenged by reading columnists I disagree with like Krugman or Charles Blow. The WSJ and NYT usually select knowledgable people either engaged in the field professionally or academically for the topics they choose for their op-eds. Good op-eds have citations, are fact checked and have to go through some basic journalistic review before being published. Saying an op-ed from the WSJ is in the same category as a post here is fucking ridiculous but not surprising since no source, not even the WSJ, is good enough for posters of certain stripe.

Edited May 21, 2021 by Macklemore

[synoptic 138]

10 minutes ago, mchookem said:

i've posted twice now... TX passed the law this session that prevents teaching this K-12.

college students are old enough to discern for themselves...or, you know, not register for a fucking CRT class.

for TX, this whole thread is one giant 

Thanks for response.  But my question is not on what is being taught or allowed to be taught in k-12 in Texas.  My question is on who thinks CRT should be taught to kids.  Maybe there is general agreement that it shouldn't be, maybe not.  I really have no idea.  Most of the discussion seems to be saying it's not being taught, but that is a different thing than whether it should be or not.  

Edited May 21, 2021 by synoptic

[Dahobbs 17420]

7 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Cute how we've moved from no examples, to no, I need better examples.  

On May 5, Governor Jay Inslee of Washington signed Senate Bill 5044 into law, which requires Critical Race Theory (CRT) training for all school staff, board directors, teachers, and administrators in public schools across the state.

My brother lives in Lacy.  He confirmed that his kids are being taught this in the classroom.  But sure, keep your head buried in the sand....

And we can't let the parents know.  Have to hide this from them.  From the "whiteness in Ed spaces"

Rather than hide behind lazy generalizations and other's characterization of a law, why not just reference the actual text? Here it is: 

http://lawfilesext.leg.wa.gov/biennium/2021-22/Pdf/Bills/Senate Passed Legislature/5044-S.PL.pdf?q=20210521083347

Here is the part that I guess you find offensive:

Quote

 

NEW SECTION. Sec. 2. A new section is added to chapter 28A.415 RCW to read as follows: The definitions in this section apply throughout sections 3 and 5 through 7 of this act and RCW 28A.410.260 and 28A.415.445 unless the context clearly requires otherwise.

(1) "Cultural competency" includes knowledge of student cultural histories and contexts, as well as family norms and values in different cultures; knowledge and skills in accessing community resources and community and parent outreach; and skills in adapting instruction to students' experiences and identifying cultural contexts for individual students.

(2) "Diversity" describes the presence of similarities and differences within a given setting, collective, or group based on multiple factors including race and ethnicity, gender identity, sexual orientation, disability status, age, educational status, religion, geography, primary language, culture, and other characteristics and experiences.

(3) "Equity" includes developing, strengthening, and supporting procedural and outcome fairness in systems, procedures, and resource distribution mechanisms to create equitable opportunities for all individuals. The term also includes eliminating barriers that prevent the full participation of individuals and groups.

(4) "Inclusion" describes intentional efforts and consistent sets of actions to create and sustain a sense of respect, belonging, safety, and attention to individual needs and backgrounds that ensure the full access to engagement and participation in available activities and opportunities.

 

The point of the law is to train the school staff on these topics. I suppose elements of the law may have been informed by CRT. But it isn't about teaching CRT to children. What exactly do you find so offensive here? 

[CDAK 216]

4 hours ago, Pancho said:

There’s not really such thing as a “CRT professor.”  CRT is just a theory/framework.  There might be a prof who maybe teaches a grad class dissecting CRT and educates how to apply this theory critically, but CRT isn’t a discipline so there are no “CRT professors.”

You're being coy and pedantic. Is a "professor who studies CRT" acceptable nomenclature? What about a "professor who leverages CRT"? Twice compared it to philosophy and I think? it's fine to say "philosophy professor." But maybe that's incorrect terminology as well.

In your opinion, is it possible for a DEI initiative to leverage or be based on CRT? Perhaps the answer is "no." Maybe I should have said some DEI initiatives are based on antiracism. That is, I should have used "antiracism" instead of "CRT." 

3 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

OK, based on I guess is fair.  

I guess I should mention that I was taught torts by an adherent to the Critical Legal Studies movement.  He didn't try to indoctrinate all the students in the class with CLS, but he did bring it up on several occasions.  We were smart enough to understand that it was one of several views on any matter on which it was offered.  A lot of us kind of made fun of him because it was perceived as a fringey, radical school of thought. 

What it boiled down to was that any slight or perceived inequity in the law was always "traceable" to "the man."  It was too liberal at the time for even liberally oriented students. But it was interesting.  And it made me aware that there are at least potential inequities built into the law and that it often favors the one with the gold, so to speak.

Exposure of students, at least at the college level, and probably at advanced high school level, to things like CRT or even CLS (which is likely too legally nuanced for anyone but law students) probably isn't going to poison their minds any more than study of Karl Marx.  Or that sex ed is going to turn students into raving sex maniacs (tip, they don't need sex ed for that).

If people think any sort of critical studies are wrong, they should be willing to hash it out in public fora rather than preempt it altogether.  If you are afraid of what it teaches, then I ask what are you trying to hide?

I don't like being called "racist" or "white supremacist" anymore than the next whitey, but I have to admit that I have some blind spots and we all do because we can't walk a  mile in another man's shoes.  Those terms are losing some of their poison to me.  The goal of helping to eliminate those racial blind spots is laudable and if teaching the existence and a light overview of CRT helps with that, which I think it does or should, then I am ok with it.

I feel like you really want to tell stories about Harvard or Penn or whatever school you named earlier and CLS. I actually find the anecdotes somewhat interesting, so please keep posting them. But, I have no idea why you're responding to my post to convey your anecdotes.

[TwiceHorn 31184]

1 minute ago, synoptic said:

Thanks for response.  But my question is not on what is being taught or allowed to be taught in k-12 in Texas.  My question is on who thinks CRT should be taught to kids.  Maybe there is general agreement that it shouldn't be, maybe not.  I really have no idea.  Most of the the discussion seems to be saying its not being taught, but that is a different thing than whether is should be or not.  

I don't think CRT per se should be taught to K-12 students.  Maybe in an AP course.

Of course, exactly what it CRT is hard to ascertain.  I certainly don't have an issue with teaching aspects of what I'll call racial sensitivity for lack of a better term.

[BabaYaga 15202]

2 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Well, you mentioned Washington, and the material you pastes, which is of dubious provenance, is, according to the source, from a teacher conference in North Carolina.  https://ladyliberty1885.com/2020/09/05/records-whiteness-in-ed-spaces-wcpss-edcamp-equity-2020/

 

I do love how all the prior "anonymous" sources (for example) that Trump said this, or Trump said that, or the WH is in flames....nobody batted an eye.  And now we need a forensic dive into every source.  It's cute.  Even when sources are given.  We need "better" sources.  

I get your skepticism.  I really do.  This came on my radar with my brothers kids.  And before you think we are ANYTHING alike politically, his wife works at Evergreen and they are HARD left.  They're still family, but have taken their own political path.  This bothers them as well.  

[BabaYaga 15202]

1 minute ago, Dahobbs said:

What exactly do you find so offensive here? 

It's already made it's way into the curriculum, but please keep your hiding your head in the sand.

[TwiceHorn 31184]

1 minute ago, Dahobbs said:

Rather than hide behind lazy generalizations and other's characterization of a law, why not just reference the actual text? Here it is: 

http://lawfilesext.leg.wa.gov/biennium/2021-22/Pdf/Bills/Senate Passed Legislature/5044-S.PL.pdf?q=20210521083347

Here is the part that I guess you find offensive:

The point of the law is to train the school staff on these topics. I suppose elements of the law may have been informed by CRT. But it isn't about teaching CRT to children. What exactly do you find so offensive here? 

Yes most of this allegedly scary shit comes from teacher conferences.  Sure, it may make raging commies out of the teachers, but even that seems a stretch.  If it filters down into the curriculum actually taught, I'm not sure that that's bad.  Everyone had idiosyncratic teachers in high school that had a hardon for one thing or another.  Most students recognized it for what it was, if they were fanatical about it.

[BabaYaga 15202]

2 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

I'll call racial sensitivity for lack of a better term.

I have no issues here.  I do when kids are segregated into "oppressor and oppressed" categories

[mchookem 16094]

1 minute ago, synoptic said:

Thanks for response.  But my question is not on what is being taught or allowed to be taught in k-12 in Texas.  My question is on who thinks CRT should be taught to kids.  Maybe there is general agreement that it shouldn't be, maybe not.  I really have no idea.  Most of the the discussion seems to be saying its not being taught, but that is a different thing than whether is should be or not.  

gotcha.

1 minute ago, TwiceHorn said:

I don't think CRT per se should be taught to K-12 students.  Maybe in an AP course.

Of course, exactly what it CRT is hard to ascertain.  I certainly don't have an issue with teaching aspects of what I'll call racial sensitivity for lack of a better term.

yeah... that elementary school 'in-group/out-group' exercise i described on the previous page has been around since the 70s.

i see absolutely nothing wrong with it and in fact recall the experience to this day. however... i'm betting the new law will prohibit even that empathy-focused exercise going forward. because Texas.

[Dahobbs 17420]

6 minutes ago, Macklemore said:

First, I didn't post those quotes. I just said that I remember reading it in an op-ed in what I thought was the WSJ originally but later corrected to say it was actually published by the NY Post. I don't deny that I enjoy reading op-eds. I have favorite columnists at the WSJ and also like to have my personal beliefs challenged by reading columnists I disagree with like Krugman or Charles Blow. The WSJ and NYT usually select knowledgable people either engaged in the field professionally or academically for the topics they choose for their op-eds. Good op-eds have citations, are fact checked and have to go through some basic journalistic review before being published. Saying an op-ed from the WSJ is in the same category as a post here is fucking ridiculous but not surprising since no source, not even the WSJ, is good enough for posters of certain stripe.

Stop misquoting me. I said a letter to the editor is the same as a post here. That is because the only thing I could find matching your description from the WSJ was a letter to the editor. Only later did you clarify you actually meant the New York Post. You then posted the exact same article, just published in the New York Post as opposed to the City Journal. I said the OP-Eds have to stand on their own merits and the reputations of their authors. They don't represent the views of the paper or the editors of the paper. And, as opinion pieces, aren't subject to the same levels of journalistic review as news articles. 

[Dahobbs 17420]

3 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

It's already made it's way into the curriculum, but please keep your hiding your head in the sand.

What part of that law is offensive to you? What in the text do you have a problem with? 

[TwiceHorn 31184]

37 minutes ago, Johnny Sack said:

I find it extremely offensive.  And divisive.  And harmful to anyone who is subjected to that garbage.

Do you not hold power and privilege?  Do you have difficulty acknowledging that?

Do you have a problem teaching your children that they are materially blessed and that others aren't?

Because that's about all I really see here.  

I'll add that some of the language used is a big cringey to my ear, but it is currrent language and better that kids know what it means, at least.

Edited May 21, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[mchookem 16094]

found it!

 

[Macklemore 2899]

I see @Felix is doing his usual drive by negging bullshit. Why don't you stop being a fucking pussy and participate in the conversation. Are you too much of a chickenshit to do so?

[wildcat09 29187]

There sure is a shitload of opposition of critical thinking here from the least surprising posters ever.

Edited May 21, 2021 by wildcat09

[TwiceHorn 31184]

21 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

I do love how all the prior "anonymous" sources (for example) that Trump said this, or Trump said that, or the WH is in flames....nobody batted an eye.  And now we need a forensic dive into every source.  It's cute.  Even when sources are given.  We need "better" sources.  

I get your skepticism.  I really do.  This came on my radar with my brothers kids.  And before you think we are ANYTHING alike politically, his wife works at Evergreen and they are HARD left.  They're still family, but have taken their own political path.  This bothers them as well.  

Personally, I took most of that with a grain of salt, as well.  I like to drill down on my sources and figure out whether I think they're biased or not and get to bare facts if I can.

I think the media embarrassed itself running with every little rumor on Trump.  And they're doing it again with Biden.  Biden gives them a bit less ammo, however.

[BabaYaga 15202]

17 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Do you not hold power and privilege?  Do you have difficulty acknowledging that?

Do you have a problem teaching your children that they are materially blessed and that others aren't?

Because that's about all I really see here.  

This has boiled down from no examples.  To we need better examples.  To it's not that big of a deal.  

I have extreme concerns on how this is delivered.  Again, as stated forcing my child into an "oppressor/oppressed" category (as one example) as a small child is beyond disturbing.  If you do not.  That's fine, but let's not pretend that it's not happening.  

[TwiceHorn 31184]

23 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

I have no issues here.  I do when kids are segregated into "oppressor and oppressed" categories

The Cupertino document doesn't do that.

And, I think that's pretty "aggressive" for third graders in any event.

I can't quite articulate why, but if the Cupertino school is indeed 93% non-white, as the article says, it makes me wonder if it's somehow unduly negative for the brown and yellow kids to "discover" that they don't have much power, even if they have privilege.

[Dahobbs 17420]

1 minute ago, BabaYaga said:

This has boiled down from no examples.  To we need better examples.  To it's not that big of a deal.  

I have extreme concerns on how this is delivered.  Again, as stated forcing my child into an "oppressor/oppressed" category (as one example) as a small child is beyond disturbing.  If you do not.  That's fine, but let's not pretend that it's not happening.  

Jesus christ, have you ever missed the point. I don't think anyone ever doubted that something was taught to or by teachers. But identifying that something precisely and accurately is critical to discussing it. What you did was take the characterization from a right wing blog of events that may or may not have transpired and asserted that those things happened exactly as described in the blog. What we've asked you is reliable sources on the fact, not the spin, of what happened. The who, what, when, where, how questions.  You've been unable to provide that, instead relying entirely on insinuation and generalization. The few factual bits of information you've posted, the Cupertino document and the Washington law (ok, I posted the actual law) don't match the descriptions you and your sources gave them. 

I'll ask again on the Washington law, what part of the text of the statute do you find offensive? Why? 

[TwiceHorn 31184]

15 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

This has boiled down from no examples.  To we need better examples.  To it's not that big of a deal.  

I have extreme concerns on how this is delivered.  Again, as stated forcing my child into an "oppressor/oppressed" category (as one example) as a small child is beyond disturbing.  If you do not.  That's fine, but let's not pretend that it's not happening.  

I haven't seen any evidence yet that that is taking place.  I'm sure some radical-ass teacher has been spouting that for a couple of decades, though, before CRT was even a term.

I'm completely cool with acknowledging that I have and have had advantages over others.  In fact, I try to make gratitude a daily consideration.  There was a point in my life where I indulged the belief that I had earned my advantages and that my parents, in turn, earned those that they passed on to me.  Now, I am just amazed at how it all happened and feel lucky and blessed.  Dodging the death by alcoholism bullet brought a lot of that around.

If I had kids I would try to teach them the same and don't really have a problem with the school trying to teach that as well.

The only way we're going to overcome racism in this country (or anywhere else for that matter) is for individuals to engage higher thinking on issues of race and discrimination and how irrational, unjust, and inhuman it is to judge based on skin color or other differences.  And further, how issues of race permeate life and society and that it's not good enough just not to be overtly racist.

Edited May 21, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[We’reTexas 1467]

54 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Cute how we've moved from no examples, to no, I need better examples.  

On May 5, Governor Jay Inslee of Washington signed Senate Bill 5044 into law, which requires Critical Race Theory (CRT) training for all school staff, board directors, teachers, and administrators in public schools across the state.

My brother lives in Lacy.  He confirmed that his kids are being taught this in the classroom.  But sure, keep your head buried in the sand....

And we can't let the parents know.  Have to hide this from them.  From the "whiteness in Ed spaces"

Lol.

[wildcat09 29187]

1 hour ago, Johnny Sack said:

Being called a racist means nothing any more.  

And yet it seems to trigger the absolute shit out of you.