Oh nothing, just Michael Flynn calling for an open air coup

[jimmyjazz 45560]

2 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

There's plenty of retired officers who say batshit stuff.  I don't want the military in the habit of chasing after them.  Well, if they participate in something like January 6th, do something and take their pay or put them behind bars, but again, that could be left up to the civilian authorities.

I completely disagree.  He spoke at a conference that ostensibly supports violent takeover of the US government, and he backed that idea.  That's not ordinary "batshit stuff".  That's fomenting insurrection.  He belongs in jail.

[atomheartbevo 89452]

Just now, jimmyjazz said:

I completely disagree.  He spoke at a conference that ostensibly supports violent takeover of the US government, and he backed that idea.  That's not ordinary "batshit stuff".  That's fomenting insurrection.  He belongs in jail.

On the one hand, I agree 100%.

On the other, it'd make a martyr out of him, and give him an even larger platform.  Instead, he's being ridiculed (actually being ignored on Fox News), and he's strongly lumped himself in with the Qanon idiots.

It's kind of one of those things where, if somebody you don't like is making mistakes, don't help him out.  Let him continue to make himself look even more insane.

[washparkhorn 9935]

21 minutes ago, Bojack said:

@GRHorn, did Bob's finally manage to serve you with a cease and desist letter?

Brainlet Wojak pretending to have a big brain is perfect, @GRHorn

TLDR - the right cannot meme, example No. 512.

[GRHorn 105]

28 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

I completely disagree.  He spoke at a conference that ostensibly supports violent takeover of the US government, and he backed that idea.  That's not ordinary "batshit stuff".  That's fomenting insurrection.  He belongs in jail.

I agree he shouldn’t have said it, but under what statute could he be jailed? Paging surly lawyers. 

[jimmyjazz 45560]

25 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

On the one hand, I agree 100%.

On the other, it'd make a martyr out of him, and give him an even larger platform.  

That's too reminiscent of the way Democrats have handled things for decades.  It's time to drop the hammer on this bullshit.

[jimmyjazz 45560]

1 minute ago, GRHorn said:

I agree he shouldn’t have said it, but under what statute could he be jailed? Paging surly lawyers. 

Start with "court martial", dipshit.  I'm talking military law.

[conVINCEd 21468]

8 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Start with "court martial", dipshit.  I'm talking military law.

Can you be court martialed if you are no longer in the military?

[jimmyjazz 45560]

In case anyone is unaware of the oath:

"I, Michael Thomas Flynn, having been appointed an officer in the Army of the United States, as indicated above in the grade of Second Lieutenant, do solemnly swear that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter, so help me God.

So, the question becomes whether or not he can be court martialed for failing that oath, and in particular, failing it once retired.  The rest is details.

 

[jimmyjazz 45560]

2 minutes ago, conVINCEd said:

Can you be court martialed if you are no longer in the military?

That's why I said "reactivated", which is an angle I've read might be possible.  I am not an expert here.  I'm talking possibilities.  I'm sure there are plenty of what-have-yous involved.

[Biff Tannen 45500]

1 hour ago, jimmyjazz said:

I'm sure there are plenty of what-have-yous involved.

Some ins and outs as well.

[JimmyJames 12271]

3 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

That's why I said "reactivated", which is an angle I've read might be possible.  I am not an expert here.  I'm talking possibilities.  I'm sure there are plenty of what-have-yous involved.

I’m no expert on military law but one thing I do know is that when you are active they can do just about whatever they want so it’s not that much of a stretch to “reactivate” him especially given how high up he was and how low he has become. He’s a threat to the country and is probably still enjoying the privileges of his former rank. That’s a factor. 

[WhatTheBuck 28716]

1 hour ago, atomheartbevo said:

Just work on getting it through their heads that A) Trump is going to help drive up Democratic turnout and B) Trump has said that the left is making sure he's going to lose, and if Trump is telling the truth, then what's the point of voting if Trump himself says he's going to lose?

Seriously, when it comes up these days, I point out that Trump on the ballot would be great for Democrats, just like Hillary being on the ballot helped Trump.

If Comey had been responsible and either A) kept his fat mouth shut, or B) said that Trump was being investigated too, Hillary would probably have won the 2016 election. And hundreds of thousands of Americans wouldn’t have died unnecessarily. 

[atomheartbevo 89452]

1 hour ago, jimmyjazz said:

That's why I said "reactivated", which is an angle I've read might be possible.  I am not an expert here.  I'm talking possibilities.  I'm sure there are plenty of what-have-yous involved.

57 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

I’m no expert on military law but one thing I do know is that when you are active they can do just about whatever they want so it’s not that much of a stretch to “reactivate” him especially given how high up he was and how low he has become. He’s a threat to the country and is probably still enjoying the privileges of his former rank. That’s a factor. 

He's drawing his retirement pay, can go play golf or shop at the exchange or put on his uniform for certain events, but he's not getting intelligence briefings or anything like that.  

It just feels like a pretty dicey road to start chasing after retired military who act like asshole grifters, even with treason mixed in.  He's not going to be rallying the Rascal Brigades to roll on DC or anything.

[Js1 85117]

7 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

If Comey had been responsible and either A) kept his fat mouth shut, or B) said that Trump was being investigated too, Hillary would probably have won the 2016 election. And hundreds of thousands of Americans wouldn’t have died unnecessarily. 

Yeah but they’d trade the 600k deaths for the 4 that died in Benghazi anyway! 

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

4 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

He's drawing his retirement pay, can go play golf or shop at the exchange or put on his uniform for certain events, but he's not getting intelligence briefings or anything like that.  

It just feels like a pretty dicey road to start chasing after retired military who act like asshole grifters, even with treason mixed in.  He's not going to be rallying the Rascal Brigades to roll on DC or anything.

It's the military, not the Cosa Nostra or the Crips. It's not "blood-in, blood-out." He is as entitled to his batshit opinions as anyone else.

We need to chill on the idea of censorship and / or arresting or even fucking executing people whose views we don't like. It's the new version of letting the terrorists win. Flynn's ego will sink him sooner or later. 

It's funny -- both he and Trump were both once Democrats. Obama mocked Trump and fired Flynn, so now they are deranged Captain Ahabs leading a crew of morons to nowhere. 

 

 

[Captainant 27468]

8 hours ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

It's the military, not the Cosa Nostra or the Crips. It's not "blood-in, blood-out." He is as entitled to his batshit opinions as anyone else.

We need to chill on the idea of censorship and / or arresting or even fucking executing people whose views we don't like. It's the new version of letting the terrorists win. Flynn's ego will sink him sooner or later. 

It's funny -- both he and Trump were both once Democrats. Obama mocked Trump and fired Flynn, so now they are deranged Captain Ahabs leading a crew of morons to nowhere. 

I was curious about UCMJ for retirees and did some googling - fedsoc had the best breakdown and citation that I found in 30 seconds of searching:

Quote

But jurisdiction over military retirees stands out as peculiar. Article 2(a)(4) allows for the court-martial of regular component (Army, Navy, Marine, Air Force, Space Force, and Coast Guard) retirees who are entitled to pay, and Article 2(a)(6) allows for the court-martial of retirees who are part of the Fleet Reserve or Fleet Marine Corps Reserve. Moreover, despite their retiree status, these two groups are treated like active-duty members in that they are continuously subject to UCMJ jurisdiction.

...

Despite many challenges to these provisions, military courts have consistently found that the Constitution allows Congress to extend UCMJ jurisdiction to retirees. For instance, in the 2018 case United States v. Dinger, the Navy-Marine Corps Court of Criminal Appeals (CCA) concluded that it was “firmly convinced that those in a retired status remain ‘members’ of the land and Naval forces who may face court-martial.” Though the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Armed Forces (CAAF), the highest military appellate court, did not squarely address the jurisdictional question, it ultimately affirmed the CCA’s decision, and the Supreme Court denied Dinger’s petition for certiorari.   

So it seems the bright line is that if you're drawing retirement pay, you are still treated as active duty by the UCMJ

[Fudge Nuggets 19151]

14 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

It's kind of one of those things where, if somebody you don't like is making mistakes, don't help him out.  Let him continue to make himself look even more insane.

I take it you missed the 2016 Presidential election.  You may want to read up on it when you have the time. 

[Gatorubet 30120]

It's the military, not the Cosa Nostra or the Crips. It's not "blood-in, blood-out." He is as entitled to his batshit opinions as anyone else.

 

Uttering traitorous shit is not a Constitutional right.

He can advocate for the election of dead Rush Limbaugh’s corpse in the next POTUS election, but he can’t advocate treason.

[Captainant 27468]

8 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

Uttering traitorous shit is not a Constitutional right.

He can advocate for the election of dead Rush Limbaugh’s corpse in the next POTUS election, but he can’t advocate treason.

Respectfully, uttering traitorous shit sort of is a constitutional right. But if you're drawing pay from the US military, you are subject to some constraints on your rights - AKA the UCMJ. 

However Flynn is definitely crossing the line from words and into action and incitement

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

11 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:

Uttering traitorous shit is not a Constitutional right.

He can advocate for the election of dead Rush Limbaugh’s corpse in the next POTUS election, but he can’t advocate treason.

Treason is in the Constitution, as everybody seems to forget:

"Article III, Section 3, Clause 1: Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court."

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

1 minute ago, Captainant said:

Respectfully, uttering traitorous shit sort of is a constitutional right. But if you're drawing pay from the US military, you are subject to some constraints on your rights - AKA the UCMJ. 

However Flynn is definitely crossing the line from words and into action and incitement

Agree with this

[Mdhorn 5911]

18 hours ago, WhatTheBuck said:

If Comey had been responsible and either A) kept his fat mouth shut, or B) said that Trump was being investigated too, Hillary would probably have won the 2016 election. And hundreds of thousands of Americans wouldn’t have died unnecessarily. 

And Hillary didn't need the answers to beat a bloated idiot but Donna Brazile had to swing in for no particular reason except attention.  Fuck both of them.  

 

[WhatTheBuck 28716]

18 minutes ago, Mdhorn said:

And Hillary didn't need the answers to beat a bloated idiot but Donna Brazile had to swing in for no particular reason except attention.  Fuck both of them.  

 

Who could’ve predicted that a debate in Michigan would include a question about the poisoning of Flint’s water supply? Such a game changer!

[Captainant 27468]

3 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

Who could’ve predicted that a debate in Michigan would include a question about the poisoning of Flint’s water supply? Such a game changer!

It's ancient history at this point, but it's less the info that was shared and more that they felt that it was fair game to give preference to one candidate over another. 

Can we seriously not rerererere-litigate the 2016 election though? We sort of dealing with a simmering fascist movement and historic rollback of basic voting rights. 

[mchookem 16230]

On 6/2/2021 at 12:08 PM, Goredho said:

I'm saying I agree, but you've lost my heart and mind with the advocation of political genocide.  Good luck.

i am laughing at Fudge Nuggets, but i actually agree with you. 

however...the problem is that the 'other side' has no qualms with that approach. 

that's why they get away with it again and again and again.

one side is saying 'follow the rules!' and the other side is not even playing the same game.

it's a fundamental difference between those that gravitate to one side or the other.

it's quite the dilemma 🤔😒

[Biff Tannen 45500]

13 minutes ago, mchookem said:

i am laughing at Fudge Nuggets, but i actually agree with you. 

however...the problem is that the 'other side' has no qualms with that approach. 

that's why they get away with it again and again and again.

one side is saying 'follow the rules!' and the other side is not even playing the same game.

it's a fundamental difference between those that gravitate to one side or the other.

it's quite the dilemma 🤔😒

Yep. And here we are. The rules are now clear to anyone paying attention. Unfortunately, that doesn’t seem to include the current admin or half of congress.  

[Goredho 17349]

46 minutes ago, mchookem said:

i am laughing at Fudge Nuggets, but i actually agree with you. 

however...the problem is that the 'other side' has no qualms with that approach. 

that's why they get away with it again and again and again.

one side is saying 'follow the rules!' and the other side is not even playing the same game.

it's a fundamental difference between those that gravitate to one side or the other.

it's quite the dilemma 🤔😒

Indeed it is.  Whatever the answer is, and there are likely no good ones, I hope we can retain our humanity and not become that which we abhor.

[mchookem 16230]

Donald Trump brought out the worst in Americans, myself probably included. 😒

[Longhorn_Fan68 33844]

1 minute ago, mchookem said:

Donald Trump brought out the worst in Americans, myself probably included. 😒

4 banner years for Russia (one would assume)

[Mdhorn 5911]

4 minutes ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

4 banner years for Russia (one would assume)

Has the government severed all of the Russian tentacles from their networks?

[washparkhorn 9935]

47 minutes ago, Mdhorn said:

Has the government severed all of the Russian tentacles from their networks?

We keep the tentacles that might aid our allies and us as the Western Sphere separates us from the China Sphere.

But that is situation normal for U.S. Foreign Policy. 

[Bullneck 18987]

 

 

[tx 3 putt 76414]

3 hours ago, Bullneck said:

 

 

 

this is why you HANG all traitors !!!!!!!

 

 

[Underdog 28457]

Is this before or after Trump’s reinstatement?  

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19093]

 

[Biff Tannen 45500]

At what point do snipers come into this?  I mean good lord. 

[atomheartbevo 89452]

Hey Mikey, you're in Texas.  Catholics are the largest religious group in Texas.  You cool with taking orders from the Vatican?

[hpslugga 4044]

2 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

Hey Mikey, you're in Texas.  Catholics are the largest religious group in Texas.  You cool with taking orders from the Vatican?

See the thing is, most people in that catholic demographic are viewed as non-people by shitheads like Flynn. So they don’t really count

Edited November 14, 2021 by hpslugga

[Mrs Whiggins 13049]

7 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

Hey Mikey, you're in Texas.  Catholics are the largest religious group in Texas.  You cool with taking orders from the Vatican?

 

4 hours ago, hpslugga said:

See the thing is, most people in that catholic demographic are viewed as non-people by shitheads like Flynn. So they don’t really count

Michael Flynn was raised Catholic and AFAIK continues to be. Dominionists, or other folks who don't object to a theocratic form of government (Barr, etc and some would say the newest SCOTUS member Coney-Barrett) are not going to get that specific until they have persecuted and eliminated the more 'obvious' outlier groups/competition such as members of the Islamic, Jewish, Buddhist, and other faiths. Then things start getting more complicated as the circle of outliers widens. Look to various countries and times in history to compare and contrast. Eventually it seems to result in a 'forced' religion among the total populace who merely endures it so they can go along to live their life in some cases, or consistent back and forths with power in others.

 

So, Flynn doesn't seem to have an issue with American Catholics. Perhaps some of them have no problem ignoring the Vatican and picking and choosing whatever precepts they wish to deem acceptable and still believe they are 'faithful?' That seems to be a large part of many citizens, doesn't it? "I'm a Christian," one says and then *proceeds to ignore most of the teachings and parables of Jesus Christ.*

Edited November 14, 2021 by Mrs Whiggins

[Biff Tannen 45500]

1 hour ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

 

So, Flynn doesn't seem to have an issue with American Catholics. Perhaps some of them have no problem ignoring the Vatican and picking and choosing whatever precepts they wish to deem acceptable and still believe they are 'faithful?' That seems to be a large part of many citizens, doesn't it? "I'm a Christian," one says and then *proceeds to ignore most of the teachings and parables of Jesus Christ.*

This is pretty much it. It’s not about Christianity as much as it is about fear. Them mooslims and Jews are to be feared. As long as you’re near “Christianity”, you’re not as much of a threat. Being white also helps. 

[Pato del Muerto 52342]

And here I was thinking the bill of rights was important to these people

[Mrs Whiggins 13049]

8 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

And here I was thinking the bill of rights was important to these people

The only thing important is that it is Bill, not bill, and he is married to Hillary who should also be locked up.

[tx 3 putt 76414]

On 11/6/2021 at 8:01 PM, tx 3 putt said:

 

this is why you HANG all traitors !!!!!!!

 

 

this still holds true 

[tx 3 putt 76414]

On 11/6/2021 at 8:08 PM, Underdog said:

Is this before or after Trump’s reinstatement?  

He never left office !!!!

[Bama Chick 28596]

This is pretty much it. It’s not about Christianity as much as it is about fear. Them mooslims and Jews are to be feared. As long as you’re near “Christianity”, you’re not as much of a threat. Being white also helps. 

But what percentage of America’s Catholics are what these assholes would consider “white”?

There’s the determining factor.

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

6 minutes ago, Bama Chick said:

But what percentage of America’s Catholics are what these assholes would consider “white”?

There’s the determining factor.

Eh, not really. So long as they are Death Squad type Mezkins they would be fine with them.

[Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13547]

As long as it's Pastafarianism, I'm cool with one religion.

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20345]

 

[Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13547]

[Brisketexan 104636]

 

30% of our country believes in a cult. And not just a garden-variety “worship the leader” cult. No, it’s full-on batshit insane, with more nutbar tangents than you can shake a stick at.

And they’re willing to commit violence to take power.

We don’t recover from this. And do I blame them? No. They’re too stupid/mentally ill to be fully culpable. I blame the people who enable them and keep legitimizing them - the GQP and its voters.