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2021 NBA Offseason Thread: Business as Usual? -- Trades/Free Agency/Retirements/Etc.

Patrick Bateman

By Patrick Bateman
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Mitch Cumsteen
Mitch Cumsteen

Just another genius take from you.... we should celebrate an ignorant man doubling down his ignorance and further propagate misinformation about something that would save lives.  Good for him, indeed,

Jhawk
Jhawk

You have to understand that a vaccine that was developed in 6 months could warrant some hesitancy over a vaccine that was developed 60 years ago and has had trials upon trials upon trials. You can be

Mitch Cumsteen
Mitch Cumsteen

This post has no place on the basketball board and I'm furious at myself for even replying...  but if you think that MRNA vaccines were only been developed for 6 months and that's all the research beh

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Jhawk

Jhawk 1075

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6 hours ago, Fastbreak said:

every single one of these dudes had to be vaccinated (for many things) to attend any kind of school.  I wish they could see this anti-vax shit is just political theatre from fucking despicable people.

Including you Kyrie...

image.png.b3a72a48e199a5a510880875a3c25d87.png

You have to understand that a vaccine that was developed in 6 months could warrant some hesitancy over a vaccine that was developed 60 years ago and has had trials upon trials upon trials. You can be pro-vaccine and understand that we still don’t know the long term ramifications of this vaccine because we literally haven’t had time to do long term studies. Here is the process according to the FDA:

1. Animal trials in preclinical research. That is reviewed by the FDA before human testing even starts. According to the FDA 1 of about 1000 compounds make it past this stage. 
2. Phase 1 clinical trials.  20-80 healthy volunteers are tested and monitored over the course of 1 year. 

3. Phase 2. 100-300 patients with the specific disease are tested and monitored. This runs about 2 years. Placebos and blind studies are used. 
4. Phase 3. Thousands of patients are monitored to review side effects of the medicine. This phase has all types of patients and takes 3 years. 
5. A new drug application is put together consisting of thousands of pages of research and process. The FDA has 60 days to decide if they will CONTINUE to review the application. They FDA reviews manufacturing plants and processes at Thai time. 
 

According to the FDA this is a 12-15 year process and the original volunteers could begin to show adverse long term effects that halt the entire approval process. 
 

If you can’t see why some young, healthy, low risk individuals might be hesitant to get a vaccine that literally hasn’t had time to go through established scientific processes and protocols for safety then are you making it politics or are they? No one that is hesitant has said anything about politics, only you have. I’m pro vaccine for the record. 
 

I’ll edit to add that kyrie might have. He’s an idiot. 

Edited by Jhawk
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d2o

d2o 1602

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50 minutes ago, Jhawk said:

You have to understand that a vaccine that was developed in 6 months could warrant some hesitancy over a vaccine that was developed 60 years ago and has had trials upon trials upon trials. You can be pro-vaccine and understand that we still don’t know the long term ramifications of this vaccine because we literally haven’t had time to do long term studies. Here is the process according to the FDA:

1. Animal trials in preclinical research. That is reviewed by the FDA before human testing even starts. According to the FDA 1 of about 1000 compounds make it past this stage. 
2. Phase 1 clinical trials.  20-80 healthy volunteers are tested and monitored over the course of 1 year. 

3. Phase 2. 100-300 patients with the specific disease are tested and monitored. This runs about 2 years. Placebos and blind studies are used. 
4. Phase 3. Thousands of patients are monitored to review side effects of the medicine. This phase has all types of patients and takes 3 years. 
5. A new drug application is put together consisting of thousands of pages of research and process. The FDA has 60 days to decide if they will CONTINUE to review the application. They FDA reviews manufacturing plants and processes at Thai time. 
 

According to the FDA this is a 12-15 year process and the original volunteers could begin to show adverse long term effects that halt the entire approval process. 
 

If you can’t see why some young, healthy, low risk individuals might be hesitant to get a vaccine that literally hasn’t had time to go through established scientific processes and protocols for safety then are you making it politics or are they? No one that is hesitant has said anything about politics, only you have. I’m pro vaccine for the record. 
 

I’ll edit to add that kyrie might have. He’s an idiot. 

At this point something like 3B people have been vaccinated.   If that isn't enough of a trial, I'm not sure what would be.   Further if they can see what KAT went through this past yr and think "eh, I'll take my chances" or "COVID isnt real"  then fuck them and anything they stand for. 

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Jhawk

Jhawk 1075

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1 minute ago, d2o said:

At this point something like 3B people have been vaccinated.   If that isn't enough of a trial, I'm not sure what would be.   Further if they can see what KAT went through this past yr and think "eh, I'll take my chances" or "COVID isnt real"  then fuck them and anything they stand for. 

Can you show me the data on what the long term side effects might be? Let’s just use a number in the future. Say... 3 year side effects?

I never stated that billions haven’t been vaccinated and volume doesn’t equate to time. Not one of the 3.8billion people have had the vaccination for more than 12 months.  We built billions of square feet of buildings with asbestos only to realize that was a bad idea years down the line. Also, I never stated “covid isn’t real”. The shifting of the scope of the argument doesn’t make one party more right than the other. 
 

I’ll state once again, you don’t have to like their position but if you can’t understand their position (I don’t) then maybe that says more about you than them. 

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Jhawk

Jhawk 1075

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3 minutes ago, Fastbreak said:

The Polio vaccine was tested in less than a year in 1954.  I'm fairly sure there wasn't this level of hesitancy.  To say the vaccine has not been made political is ingenious.  If either Kryrie or Wigs knows 1 of the testing facts you posted, I would give you nice bridge in Arizona.

And now we have decades of data and that vaccine has continued to be proven safe over the long haul.

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d2o

d2o 1602

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8 minutes ago, Jhawk said:

Can you show me the data on what the long term side effects might be? Let’s just use a number in the future. Say... 3 year side effects?

I never stated that billions haven’t been vaccinated and volume doesn’t equate to time. Not one of the 3.8billion people have had the vaccination for more than 12 months.  We built billions of square feet of buildings with asbestos only to realize that was a bad idea years down the line. Also, I never stated “covid isn’t real”. The shifting of the scope of the argument doesn’t make one party more right than the other. 
 

I’ll state once again, you don’t have to like their position but if you can’t understand their position (I don’t) then maybe that says more about you than them. 

And if they cannot understand how vaccination is bigger than just them then it says MUCH more about them than it does me.

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Kermit

Kermit 3158

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Posted
13 minutes ago, Jhawk said:

Can you show me the data on what the long term side effects might be? Let’s just use a number in the future. Say... 3 year side effects?

I never stated that billions haven’t been vaccinated and volume doesn’t equate to time. Not one of the 3.8billion people have had the vaccination for more than 12 months.  We built billions of square feet of buildings with asbestos only to realize that was a bad idea years down the line. Also, I never stated “covid isn’t real”. The shifting of the scope of the argument doesn’t make one party more right than the other. 
 

I’ll state once again, you don’t have to like their position but if you can’t understand their position (I don’t) then maybe that says more about you than them. 

I can tell you what the long term side effects of actually contracting Covid-19 are.

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Mitch Cumsteen

Mitch Cumsteen 18550

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2 hours ago, Jhawk said:

You have to understand that a vaccine that was developed in 6 months could warrant some hesitancy over a vaccine that was developed 60 years ago and has had trials upon trials upon trials. You can be pro-vaccine and understand that we still don’t know the long term ramifications of this vaccine because we literally haven’t had time to do long term studies. Here is the process according to the FDA:

1. Animal trials in preclinical research. That is reviewed by the FDA before human testing even starts. According to the FDA 1 of about 1000 compounds make it past this stage. 
2. Phase 1 clinical trials.  20-80 healthy volunteers are tested and monitored over the course of 1 year. 

3. Phase 2. 100-300 patients with the specific disease are tested and monitored. This runs about 2 years. Placebos and blind studies are used. 
4. Phase 3. Thousands of patients are monitored to review side effects of the medicine. This phase has all types of patients and takes 3 years. 
5. A new drug application is put together consisting of thousands of pages of research and process. The FDA has 60 days to decide if they will CONTINUE to review the application. They FDA reviews manufacturing plants and processes at Thai time. 
 

According to the FDA this is a 12-15 year process and the original volunteers could begin to show adverse long term effects that halt the entire approval process. 
 

If you can’t see why some young, healthy, low risk individuals might be hesitant to get a vaccine that literally hasn’t had time to go through established scientific processes and protocols for safety then are you making it politics or are they? No one that is hesitant has said anything about politics, only you have. I’m pro vaccine for the record. 
 

I’ll edit to add that kyrie might have. He’s an idiot. 

This post has no place on the basketball board and I'm furious at myself for even replying...  but if you think that MRNA vaccines were only been developed for 6 months and that's all the research behind it, then you are fucking ignorant. It's a combination of blind luck that they were already working on these vaccines for corona viruses and scientific brilliance that we have a vaccine, yet idiots like you are spreading this bullshit and people are needlessly getting sick and/or dying. Fuck off with this bullshit. Anybody who doesn't get vaccinated is willfully ignorant and quite frankly, deserves whatever Darwin award winning fate that befalls them.

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Jhawk

Jhawk 1075

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Where did I say MRNA vaccines were developed in 6 months?  THIS MRNA VACCINE WAS DEVELOPED IN LESS THAN A YEAR. Just because a vaccine fits inside a certain category of vaccine doesn’t mean it gets automatic approval because another vaccine that is similar got approval. 
 

but I agree. Let’s just stop talking about it and get back to basketball. 

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aggie08

aggie08 21512

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If you're a "normal" person working a "normal" job (i.e. you're not galavanting around the planet meeting hundreds of people), then I don't care anymore if you're vaccinated (other than contributing to overrunning hospitals). I have a handful of dumbass friends who won't get vaccinated. I think they're gullible idiots who consume garbage information sources, but it is what it is. America.

But, if your job is, literally, to travel across half the states in country and interact closely with dozens of new people every day, and you're being paid millions to be there for your team--all while being in close communication with some of the best doctors and medical personnel available--then you're a fucking piece of shit for not getting vaccinated. I hope they find a way to not pay them. Consequences.

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Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman 3918

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6 hours ago, Jhawk said:

You have to understand that a vaccine that was developed in 6 months could warrant some hesitancy over a vaccine that was developed 60 years ago and has had trials upon trials upon trials. You can be pro-vaccine and understand that we still don’t know the long term ramifications of this vaccine because we literally haven’t had time to do long term studies. Here is the process according to the FDA:

1. Animal trials in preclinical research. That is reviewed by the FDA before human testing even starts. According to the FDA 1 of about 1000 compounds make it past this stage. 
2. Phase 1 clinical trials.  20-80 healthy volunteers are tested and monitored over the course of 1 year. 

3. Phase 2. 100-300 patients with the specific disease are tested and monitored. This runs about 2 years. Placebos and blind studies are used. 
4. Phase 3. Thousands of patients are monitored to review side effects of the medicine. This phase has all types of patients and takes 3 years. 
5. A new drug application is put together consisting of thousands of pages of research and process. The FDA has 60 days to decide if they will CONTINUE to review the application. They FDA reviews manufacturing plants and processes at Thai time. 
 

According to the FDA this is a 12-15 year process and the original volunteers could begin to show adverse long term effects that halt the entire approval process. 
 

If you can’t see why some young, healthy, low risk individuals might be hesitant to get a vaccine that literally hasn’t had time to go through established scientific processes and protocols for safety then are you making it politics or are they? No one that is hesitant has said anything about politics, only you have. I’m pro vaccine for the record. 
 

I’ll edit to add that kyrie might have. He’s an idiot. 

And if a player or person still clings to this rather flimsy excuse to continue to live without taking a vaccine in a global pandemic than that is their right here in America.  However, the NBA is a private enterprise and therefore, if a league decides it wants to have all of it's players and staff should be vaccinated for health and safety purposes, than that player, or executive, or support staff doesn't have to continue to participate in the league.  Maybe Ice Cube's 3 man league will pick them up, but it still should be a mandate and those persons who it's important to not get vaccinated need to start walking the walk.  Don't take the vaccine, sit out, and don't get paid.  That should be the choice, but the choice would still be their's.

Conversely......

 

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Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman 3918

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1 minute ago, Jhawk said:

This has probably been answered before but does a max contract work on dollar figures or percentage of cap space? If dollars, a max contract now might be a 40% discount with the next media deal. 

Percentage of the cap in the initial year with 8% raises for the duration of the contract.

 

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Jhawk

Jhawk 1075

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Posted (edited)
On 9/27/2021 at 10:48 AM, d2o said:

 

Well this was kept on the low.     So Zion is going to miss yet another training camp and be out of shape all season.   This is going swimmingly

I can’t be the only one who thinks being 280 pounds is too much even for his frame given the way he uses it right? I’d like to see how he injured the foot. Did he roll an ankle and it break? Get stepped on? If it was just running and jumping in normal basketball then I don’t think this bodes well for his long term health and stability in the league. Might be time to get down to 250 and see how things work out. 

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d2o

d2o 1602

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1 hour ago, Jhawk said:

I can’t be the only one who thinks being 280 pounds is too much even for his frame given the way he uses it right? I’d like to see how he injured the foot. Did he roll an ankle and it break? Get stepped on? If it was just running and jumping in normal basketball then I don’t think this bodes well for his long term health and stability in the league. Might be time to get down to 250 and see how things work out. 

Been saying since before he was drafted.   He needs to lose weight.   Not only does it effect his long term prospects it would help him be in shape and be available for 35 mins+/gm without he being gassed.

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d2o

d2o 1602

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1 hour ago, Loch Ness Monster said:

Believe 96% of doctors are vaccinated. Nah would rather trust "research" like Facebook memes and this one guy on youtube with an 11th grade education.

Kyrie and Wiggins can fuck off.

The "I'm doing my own research" shit is hilarious and will never not be.   You and your internet searches are going to learn more than Drs and scientists all over the world?  GTFOH

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aggie08

aggie08 21512

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2 hours ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:


Well didnt he say he wasn’t going to use his voice to encourage vaccinations ?

He could have said something to the effect of: "My employer didn't give me much of a choice, so I did what I had to do. Next question."

I'll give him the same credit that I gave the ex-President when he finally publicly admitted to being vaccinated: thank you for finally doing the bare minimum.

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MNLonghornFUKM

MNLonghornFUKM 8817

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He could have said something to the effect of: "My employer didn't give me much of a choice, so I did what I had to do. Next question."
I'll give him the same credit that I gave the ex-President when he finally publicly admitted to being vaccinated: thank you for finally doing the bare minimum.

Do you think he was vaxxed when he attended that party, was exposed, but missed zero games during the playoffs?
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ztejas

ztejas 43526

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On 9/28/2021 at 11:16 AM, Jhawk said:

I can’t be the only one who thinks being 280 pounds is too much even for his frame given the way he uses it right? I’d like to see how he injured the foot. Did he roll an ankle and it break? Get stepped on? If it was just running and jumping in normal basketball then I don’t think this bodes well for his long term health and stability in the league. Might be time to get down to 250 and see how things work out. 

It's a shame because he truly has potential to be one of the greats. I just don't think he takes the game seriously enough. If Chuck can get his ass in shape so can Zion. 

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Sbbruin

Sbbruin 21865

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On 9/27/2021 at 8:43 AM, Jhawk said:

Can you show me the data on what the long term side effects might be? Let’s just use a number in the future. Say... 3 year side effects?

 

In the history of vaccines, no side effects manifested themselves longer than 3-4 weeks after injection.  And this isn't some DNA modifying cancer producing vaccine.  It simply identifies the spike protein that allows the virus to replicate and develops antibodies to destroy the spike protein, the eliminating it's ability to replicate enough to make you very sick.  There isn't going to be a mass die-off of humanity in a few years from all the sheep who took the vaccine.

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Sawbonz

Sawbonz 27580

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Posted (edited)
On 9/27/2021 at 10:44 AM, Jhawk said:

And now we have decades of data and that vaccine has continued to be proven safe over the long haul.

You do know that tens of thousands of people died from the polio vaccine when it first rolled out don’t you? The technology behind this vaccine has been around for over a decade. There is literally no postulated mechanism by which long-term side effects from this vaccine would be plausible. If you had any background in molecular biology, immunology, you would know this to be the case. There was a time when lay people trusted scientists. Now apparently doctors and scientists are part of some global conspiracy with the Chinese, the far left Democrats, the communist corporations, and the hospital pharmaceutical complex. I wonder why that is?

Edited by Sawbonz
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