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The 01-06-21 Select Committee Thread

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Js1

Js1 85744

Posted
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29 minutes ago, TheStoicPaisano said:

^ Raskin is awesome…Ireally like Joe Neguse out of CO for the younger (84 baby) generation.

kinzinger/Meijer/Cheney/Ohio St. Gonzalez join Ds to hold Bannon in contempt.

9 Rs voted in favor

Cheney (duh)
Fitzpatrick (Penn)
Gonzalez
Herrera Beutler
Katko
Kinzinger
Mace
Meijer
Upton

7/9 R votes today voted to impeach Trump.   Nancy Mace and Brian Fitzpatrick join the party.  

 

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Just to be clear, an official of the United States government AND a licensed attorney.....just asserted to Congress that his actions in assisting the Trump administration with respect to the admin's a

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31678

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, RomaVicta said:

I respect your opinion. However, this layperson was very impressed with his organization and oratory in both committee and impeachment trial. I see him as one of the great men of our day.

Jamie Raskin and his entire team impressed during the second impeachment trial.

Both men demonstrated the failure of rational thought, presentation of facts, and cogent argument against hate-based anti-truth villains seeking only power after power.

The GQP cares nothing about the United States, coming generations, or the fate of the world. It's a money-/power-grab that sees only present opportunity. And they are supported by the people they harm.

Idiot World End Times

As I said, he's a very good orator.

There were some things he did during the impeachment, I forget what anymore, that I thought were pretty obvious and easily avoided blunders that opened him and the committee to criticism, needlessly.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31678

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

pretty sure he gets locked up until he complies

No, that isn't the way criminal contempt works.  He will receive a sentence, assuming he's found guilty.  He may comply with the subpoena in order to mitigate that sentence.

The fun thing is that if he continues to disobey the subpoena, this can be done over and over again.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31678

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 10/20/2021 at 1:58 PM, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

being non-lawyerly, what's the implication here? is that an accelerated timeline? is that typical? need a little more context

The lawsuit was served yesterday.  Yes, that is accelerated and is evidence that the judge is grabbing this by the balls.

It is probably not unreasonable to expect resolution in the district court in six weeks or less.

Addendum:  Trump had to seek a TRO or other injunction to stop the National Archives from delivering up the documents.  That will be decided in short order, probably on a somewhat "abbreviated record," meaning with somewhat limited opportunity to develop facts/present a case.  Whatever judgment the court serves up on that TRO or preliminary injunction will be immediately appealable by either Trump or the Committee or the Archives.  So, that's going up on appeal, posthaste.

While the first injunction is being appealed, the judge can proceed to "fuller" proceedings on the questions and make the injunction ruling a final judgment.  Historically, rulings on preliminary injunctions become final unless there's some real surprise that develops in the case, which is not likely here.

So, while the DC Circuit chews on the appeal, the trial court should be wrapping up the case. I am pretty sure the courts will make short shrift of Trump's arguments, as they did in the tax cases.  Yes, even the Supreme Court.

The questions presented here are mostly questions of law, rather than evidence (who did what when to whom).  The only cumbersome aspect of it may be a review of the documents to be produced to determine if their contents should be subject to an executive privilege claim.

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 90041

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

No, that isn't the way criminal contempt works.  He will receive a sentence, assuming he's found guilty.  He may comply with the subpoena in order to mitigate that sentence.

The fun thing is that if he continues to disobey the subpoena, this can be done over and over again.

Be a shame if he was locked up and faced with a disease his crowd doesn't believe in.

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NWBuck

NWBuck 8590

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Posted

They'll say they were part of the planning of the public events, the "rally", in order to keep it safe. They'll deny being involved in anything involved in the attack on the capital.

And that will work... until the cell phone records are released.

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UDontKnow

UDontKnow 10502

Posted
Posted
22 minutes ago, NWBuck said:

They'll say they were part of the planning of the public events, the "rally", in order to keep it safe. They'll deny being involved in anything involved in the attack on the capital.

And that will work... until the cell phone records are released.

I would like to believe what you posted, but I have three concerns:

1.) Merrick Garland

2.) Merrick Garland

3.) Merrick Garland

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Macanudo

Macanudo 13081

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, UDontKnow said:

I would like to believe what you posted, but I have three concerns:

1.) Merrick Garland

2.) Merrick Garland

3.) Merrick Garland

And what has Merrick Garland done in the last 10 months to make you believe he has the cojones to do this?    

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RDCanecutter

RDCanecutter 26550

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, NWBuck said:

They'll say they were part of the planning of the public events, the "rally", in order to keep it safe. They'll deny being involved in anything involved in the attack on the capital.

And that will work... until the cell phone records are released.

You got a culture of taking pictures of everything incriminating, and bragging about it, a'ight.

You got at least a half-dozen politician/performance artists, several of whom were dropped on their heads as babies.

You got staffers, tons of weasely little staffers, who don't want to take the fall for any of this.

I think it'll be a slow start, but once the first one gets cornered, all of a sudden it'll be like watching a veterinarian pop out mango worms.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31678

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 10/30/2021 at 1:51 PM, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-attorney-told-pences-team-they-were-to-blame-during-capitol-riot-2021-10

It's pretty astonishing that that asshole was a law professor anywhere outside of some crack den like Liberty or Regent.

Holy fuck.  He's from Lewisville and a UD graduate.  Goddammit.

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

Posted
Posted
On 11/2/2021 at 9:56 PM, TwiceHorn said:

It's pretty astonishing that that asshole was a law professor anywhere outside of some crack den like Liberty or Regent.

Holy fuck.  He's from Lewisville and a UD graduate.  Goddammit.

Of course that asshole is from DFW and clerked for the greatest potted plant in Supreme Court history.

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bolverk

bolverk 29809

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With more subpoenas, the direction of the investigation is beginning to come more into focus.

At the Willard and the White House, the Jan. 6 Panel Widens Its Net
What went on at a five-star hotel near the White House the day before the riot could be a window into how a Trump-directed plot to upend the election ended in violence at the Capitol.

By Luke Broadwater and Mark Mazzetti
Nov. 9, 2021
Updated 8:12 p.m. ET
WASHINGTON — “We are essentially in a national emergency,” Michael T. Flynn declared on Jan. 5, during an interview with the internet conspiracy theorist Alex Jones recorded in a luxurious suite at the Willard Intercontinental Hotel near the White House.

“The truth is going to come out,” said Mr. Flynn, the former three-star general and national security adviser. “Donald Trump will continue to be president of the United States for the next four years.”

In another room of the five-star hotel, a phalanx of lawyers and political advisers for Mr. Trump — including Rudolph W. Giuliani, his personal lawyer; Bernard B. Kerik, a former New York City police commissioner; and John Eastman, a scholar working feverishly on a legal strategy to prevent Joseph R. Biden Jr. from assuming the presidency — had set up a kind of command post. On the hotel’s grand front steps, Roger J. Stone Jr., a longtime Trump adviser, was flashing his signature Nixon victory sign to fans as members of the Oath Keepers, a militant group, protected him.

What unfolded at the Willard Hotel in the hours before the Capitol riot has become a prime focus of the House committee investigating the Jan. 6 attack as the panel intensifies its scrutiny into whether there was any coordination or tie between those pushing a legal strategy to overturn the election results and those who stormed the Capitol that day as Congress met to count the electoral votes to formalize Mr. Biden’s victory.

This week, the committee issued subpoenas to several of Mr. Trump’s advisers who gathered there — including Mr. Flynn, Mr. Eastman and Mr. Kerik — and communications with Mr. Giuliani and Mr. Stone are among the materials investigators have demanded from the former president, who is stonewalling the inquiry.

On Tuesday, the committee announced 10 new subpoenas that seemed to expand the aperture of the inquiry even further, seeking information from top officials in Mr. Trump’s White House including Stephen Miller, his senior adviser; Keith Kellogg, the national security adviser to Vice President Mike Pence; Johnny McEntee, the former president’s personnel chief; and others.

In the past two days alone, the panel has nearly doubled the number of subpoenas it has issued, bringing the total to 35.

Spoiler

In recent weeks, the committee has hired new investigators, pored over thousands of documents and heard privately from a stream of voluntary witnesses, from rally planners and former Trump officials to the rioters themselves.

More than 150 witnesses have been interviewed, some of whom surprised investigators by proactively contacting the committee to testify, according to two people familiar with the investigation who described the confidential inquiry on the condition of anonymity.

The panel has learned details about how “Stop the Steal” rally organizers used deception to obtain permits from the Capitol Police to hold rallies near the Capitol; how Mr. Trump and White House officials coordinated with organizers of the rally whose attendees would later storm the Capitol; and how deeply Mr. Trump’s chief of staff, Mark Meadows, was involved in pushing false claims of widespread election fraud.

Working out of a nondescript office building at the bottom of Capitol Hill, the committee’s investigators have divided themselves into color-coded teams to pursue several avenues of inquiry. They are looking into:

  • The money trail. Investigators are scrutinizing the groups that funded the protests that preceded the violence, which involved rioters from at least 44 states, and promoted and spread lies online that helped radicalize the crowd.
  • Planning meetings. The panel is pressing for answers about gatherings at the Willard and other Washington hotels where Mr. Trump’s allies who were involved in the effort to overturn the election, including Stephen K. Bannon, Mr. Giuliani and Mr. Eastman, met in the hours before the riot.
  • Foreknowledge of violence. The most difficult piece of the investigation involves unearthing evidence that Mr. Trump or anyone in his inner circle had foreknowledge that violence was a possibility on Jan. 6, and whether they took any steps to either encourage or discourage the storming of the Capitol. Mr. Bannon, whom the House voted to hold in criminal contempt of Congress for defying a subpoena from the committee, predicted on his podcast a day before the riot that “all hell is going to break loose tomorrow.”

The committee wants to question Mr. Bannon about his presence at a meeting at the Willard on Jan. 5, when plans were discussed to try to block Congress’s formalization of the election the next day.

“Mr. Bannon was in the war room at the Willard on Jan. 6,” Representative Liz Cheney, Republican of Wyoming and the vice chairwoman of the committee, said during a recent hearing.

Mr. Stone, who was photographed with Mr. Flynn on Jan. 5, has claimed that he had departed his room at the Willard to leave town as rioters stormed the Capitol, after he decided against a plan to “lead a march” from the White House Ellipse to the Capitol, according to video posted to social media.

But the Willard was only one hub of Trump activity before the Jan. 6 riot, when members of the former president’s inner circle also congregated at the nearby Trump International and other hotels to plan their bid to invalidate the election results.

Mr. Flynn was also present at the Trump International Hotel on Jan. 5 for a meeting that included about 15 people, where the discussion centered on “how to put pressure on more members of Congress to object to the Electoral College results,” according to one attendee, Charles Herbster, a Republican candidate for governor of Nebraska.

Among those in attendance, according to Mr. Herbster, were Mr. Trump’s sons Eric and Donald Jr.; Mr. Giuliani; Senator Tommy Tuberville of Alabama; the Trump advisers Peter Navarro, Corey Lewandowski and David Bossie; and Mike Lindell, the MyPillow executive and conspiracy theorist.

Unlike Mr. Bannon, many witnesses who have received subpoenas have begun complying with the committee to varying degrees.

“We have a great many people who are cooperating,” said Representative Adam B. Schiff, Democrat of California and a member of the committee. “We’re conducting interviews and depositions almost every day.”

But some who have agreed to talk are unlikely to help the committee find the evidence of a conspiracy that it is seeking. Mr. Kerik, for instance, said he was eager to present investigators with examples of election fraud he claimed to have uncovered.

He said he hoped to be “able to present the evidence that we obtained about voting irregularities so that government officials could follow up,” but became angry when the committee described him as being “involved in efforts to promote false claims of election fraud” and working to “promote baseless litigation.”

The committee has not yet sent a subpoena to any member of Congress, even those far-right Republicans who fanned the flames of conspiracy and anger with election falsehoods and incendiary rhetoric in the buildup to the riot.

The F.B.I. said in March that it had no evidence of communications between the rioters and members of Congress during the deadly attack.

“In terms of the evidence of member involvement, we’re still at a very early stage of our investigation,” Mr. Schiff said.

Tom Van Flein, the chief of staff to Representative Paul Gosar, Republican of Arizona, who was deeply involved in the “Stop the Steal” effort, said he had not yet been asked to come in for an interview, despite being named in a documents request from the committee.

Mr. Van Flein denied that either he or his boss was involved in planning for events on Jan. 6 beyond the objections in the House to Mr. Biden’s victory.

“Congressman Gosar and other members of Congress have and had every right to attend rallies and speeches,” Mr. Van Flein wrote in an email. “None of the members could have anticipated what occurred later.”

At the center of the investigation is Mr. Trump himself, who has sued in federal court to block the release of documents related to Jan. 6 and directed his associates to refuse to cooperate with the committee, citing executive privilege.

The latest round of subpoenas reflected the panel’s effort to ascertain the former president’s every move on the day of the riot. It is demanding testimony from Nicholas Luna, one of Mr. Trump’s “body men” who was in the Oval Office as the former president pressured Mr. Pence to refuse to certify the election.

Also summoned was Mr. McEntee, who was reportedly in the Oval Office during a meeting with Mr. Trump and Mr. Pence when Mr. Giuliani suggested seizing Dominion voting machines, and Kayleigh McEnany, the former White House press secretary who was reportedly with Mr. Trump at times as he watched the attack.

The committee also wants to hear from Ben Williamson, a top aide to Mr. Meadows who the committee asserted had tried unsuccessfully to get Mr. Trump to issue a statement on Jan. 6 condemning the violence at the Capitol. Christopher Liddell, a former deputy White House chief of staff who investigators said tried to resign on the day of the riot but was persuaded not to do so, was also subpoenaed.

In its order to Mr. Miller, the committee said that he had helped to spread false claims of voter fraud in the election, and to encourage state legislatures to appoint alternate slates of electors in an effort to invalidate Mr. Biden’s victory.

Those scheduled to receive a subpoena on Tuesday either did not respond to a request for comment or could not be reached.

 

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Guest Lobo

Guest Lobo

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It’ll likely be dismissed, but if that story about Pence is true…we are way more fucked than I thought.  That means the Secret Service is compromised.  You know…the guys following Biden around right now?

”Mr. Vice President, get in the car sir!  The motorcade is leaving the Capitol Complex!”

Pence, “you and the fellas you go in ahead, Tim.  I’m just gonna grab an Uber.  Says here, it’s only 2 miles away.”

 

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Nice Guy Eddie

Nice Guy Eddie 13540

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You never know when one person decides to quietly help out someone who wants to do trouble. It wasn’t long ago an Oregon state lawmaker purposefully opened up a door which allowed demonstrators to illegally enter their Capitol building.

Trump lost another court request to delay the release of his Jan 6 records to congress on Friday. He was seeking a delay while he appealed. The judge told him that he hadn’t proved anything to create the need for a delay. Of course he will most likely ask a court of appeal today to reverse that decision and allow a delay while he appeals the overall ruling.

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Nice Guy Eddie

Nice Guy Eddie 13540

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Read this analysis on Trump's attempt to withhold the documents: https://www.cnn.com/2021/11/11/politics/trump-nixon-supreme-court-analysis-biskupic/index.html

Quote

More recently, the justices last year expressed concerns that congressional demands for presidential documents could arise from "impermissible purposes," such as to harass a president, and interfere with his official duties. In this new case, however, any possible distraction from duties dissolves because Trump no longer holds office.

I could see some justices using this same argument BUT from the standpoint that Trump could become President again in 2024. Therefore he should still retain exec privilege since Congress could use this tactic to harass a potential President. 

Don't get me wrong, that is bs, but we frequently see judges or justices engineer logic to meet their goal.

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Mrs Whiggins

Mrs Whiggins 13050

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2 minutes ago, DigglerontheHoof said:

So we'll finally get down to really investigating an attempted coup 3 years after it occurred.  Fan-fucking-tastic.  I'm sure that justice will prevail. 

No problem. I'm sure the 2022 GOP sweep will make sure that justice and accountability will be front and center.

 

It's A Wonderful LIfe is nearing its seasonal appearance, but George Bailey was a Communist (according to an original FBI memo of 1947--seriously! They mentioned that the film depicted bankers as 'Scrooge-types' and it maligned the upper class by implying that people who had money were mean and despicable characters) and that films in that style were common Communist propaganda. So, the Trump spin cycle wherein a brilliant misunderstood business man is the target of a witch hunt will soon have gullible Americans believing he is the Bailey coming to bail them out of their troubles and make America great again. How's that for the freaking simulation?

Too little, too late. Crumbs for the masses, champagne for the few.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31678

Posted
Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

I think they are expediting the whole thing.

Whenever injunctive relief is sought in the district court, there is an immediate appeal available when it is granted or denied.  In the appeals courts, preliminary injunction appeals are heard on an expedited basis, typically.  Add in the nature of this proceeding, and I think things will go "apace."

Trump himself asks for the following schedule on the injunction pending appeal:

President Trump also requests that the Court enter the following briefing schedule: The motion for an injunction pending appeal will be due no later than Friday, November 12; the Appellees’ response will be due three days after the opening brief; and Appellant’s reply will be due the day after the Appellees’ briefs are filed.

And the thing about these "prelminary" things is that once the "preliminaries" are over, it's pretty much over, over.  This is actually a different posture from the "subpoena" cases that puts things on a faster track, and the subject matter is more urgent.

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High Plains Drifter

High Plains Drifter 11055

Posted
Posted
7 hours ago, Lobo said:

It’ll likely be dismissed, but if that story about Pence is true…we are way more fucked than I thought.  That means the Secret Service is compromised.  You know…the guys following Biden around right now?

”Mr. Vice President, get in the car sir!  The motorcade is leaving the Capitol Complex!”

Pence, “you and the fellas you go in ahead, Tim.  I’m just gonna grab an Uber.  Says here, it’s only 2 miles away.”

 

 

I don't think the SS is compromised. I think they were just doing their job- protect the VPOTUS. There was a violent mob that couldn't be controlled that was calling for Pence's head. The most obvious way to protect him was to get him the fuck out of there.

I could be wrong, of course, but I don't think this is evidence of that level of conspiracy.

 

 

 

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Longhorn_Fan68

Longhorn_Fan68 33917

Posted
Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, High Plains Drifter said:

 

I don't think the SS is compromised. I think they were just doing their job- protect the VPOTUS. There was a violent mob that couldn't be controlled that was calling for Pence's head. The most obvious way to protect him was to get him the fuck out of there.

I could be wrong, of course, but I don't think this is evidence of that level of conspiracy.

 

 

 

really? you think the VP shirking the SS and saying he'll get an uber bc he feels safer is not eyebrow raising? am I reading your post wrong?

Edited by Longhorn_Fan68
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