Afghan War ending, foretold by The Onion 10 years Ago [DT thread ruined by politics]

[Clintonaldo 2576]

One thing I have learned is that the people for war are usually the people not having to go. This was always going to be shitty. 

[Brisketexan 105303]

What par of the Taliban is worth saving?

Of the Taliban? Nothing.

Of the millions of innocent human beings who just try to live their lives there? Like, all of them? We certainly shouldn’t murder them. Maybe I’m a bit touchy about that, being that I know two boys from there, who I’m guessing if they hadn’t managed to get out, you’d want to blow to shreds with a 500 lb bomb.

They’re just fucking kids trying to live their lives. Their mom - a SUPER simple woman - never wanted more than to have a family, cook for them, and make a home. A simple life that is the way for more people in this world than you can imagine.

But you’d want to kill all three of them if they were still there.

Ironic, being that her husband was killed by a Taliban bomb.

I bet Inka has a shitload more friends over there as well. He’d LOVE your idea to exterminate them all.

You need fucking help.

Happened to catch the international reporter for CNN (Clarissa Ward) on NPR’s Fresh Air this afternoon.

Worth a listen if you can track it down.

She is the one who was in Kabul last week that was quoted out of context as saying that the Taliban were peaceful or something like that.

She talks about the practical differences for rural Afghan women versus those in the city (basically that the rural women haven’t really seen much change in their lives over the last 20 years so going back to Taliban rule won’t be as significant a change, while for urban women their lives are basically over).

She also told the harrowing story of her own evacuation.

Pretty gut wrenching stuff.

Edit: found a link.

https://www.npr.org/2021/08/26/1031234338/cnn-clasrissa-ward-on-the-taliban-and-afghan-women

I caught that today as well, great stuff. And again, how about asking people what THEY want? Go to rural Afghanistan, and most of the women don’t care about school, or work opportunities. They want to bake bread, take care of their kids, laugh with the other village women. And that should be okay with us. Imposing educated western ideals on the world is arrogant as hell.

[The Ace of Aces 5194]

Have a friend in parliament in another county. We connected tonight and he was telling me stories of trying to get Afghan helpers out - ones who aided his nation. He estimates 50,000 are there. 

They might have saved 5,000 and all those are because American soldiers and the admin messaging to leave. 

While American politicians troll, some international counterparts thank us. 

Edited August 27, 2021 by The Ace of Aces

[TwiceHorn 31534]

2 hours ago, The Ace of Aces said:

Trump calls bin Laden a “one-hit wonder”. No wonder he cut a deal with the Taliban.  

 

The only thing driving that is that "he" got those two and that nigra got bin Laden.

He's such a childish cunt.

[Js1 85558]

54 minutes ago, DDD Dad said:

Happened to catch the international reporter for CNN (Clarissa Ward) on NPR’s Fresh Air this afternoon.

Worth a listen if you can track it down.

She is the one who was in Kabul last week that was quoted out of context as saying that the Taliban were peaceful or something like that.

She talks about the practical differences for rural Afghan women versus those in the city (basically that the rural women haven’t really seen much change in their lives over the last 20 years so going back to Taliban rule won’t be as significant a change, while for urban women their lives are basically over).

She also told the harrowing story of her own evacuation.

Pretty gut wrenching stuff.

Edit: found a link.

https://www.npr.org/2021/08/26/1031234338/cnn-clasrissa-ward-on-the-taliban-and-afghan-women

Clarissa Ward was also the reporter who tweeted there was no chance the US could evacuate 50k people in time. 

[Biff Tannen 45721]

Nicole with shades of TTom as of late. 

[Nicole44 22075]

1 minute ago, TwiceHorn said:

The only thing driving that is that "he" got those two and that nigra got bin Laden.

He's such a childish cunt.

It is easy for him because he wasn't a member of Congress back then. To be fair to his worthless ass I think if he had been a member of Congress back then he would not have voted for it. 

 

[DonkeyCigars 143]

2 hours ago, Mole said:

To the extent that retaliation serves actual purposes and protects our people, it’s good and sort of patriotic, but retaliating because we’re angry isn’t patriotism. Making American service members pay the price of our anger is the opposite of patriotism. I don’t care if the bad guys get the last lick as long as it’s the last lick.

So...Joe Biden saying this is what? Patriotic or Not-Patriotic, based off your standards? "We will not forgive. We will not forget. We will hunt you down and make you pay,". 

And I ask because I disagree with you. I think there is a utility and usefulness to advance the American state (and the safety, security and power of America at home and abroad) and unify folks around a shared sentiment of emotion, by reacting and retaliating because we are mad. There is a healthy and righteous anger that I think can be patriotic.

Now, specifically, is it patriotic to be angry and retaliate and fight fire with fire with a population of people who can't help but take potshots and attack you behind your back as you are actively trying to get the heck out of their hair? I personally think so. So does Joe Biden and I think that is cool of him, as our President.

And maybe that's just my personality, but for perspective: one of the least patriotic things I thought Trump did was to do nothing when North Korea handed over Otto Warmbier and said "oops, must have fell down the stairs in the dark and it was an accident but, uh, here is the body, kthnx bai". I thought inaction and non-response was the worst sort of politics and the opposite of patriotism.

 

Edited August 27, 2021 by DonkeyCigars

[Nicole44 22075]

1 minute ago, Js1 said:

Clarissa Ward was also the reporter who tweeted there was no chance the US could evacuate 50k people in time. 

Why are we Burnt Ends now and not Tree Fiddy? I wanted to spend a small bit of cash on someone who hates me for mermbership.

[staboner 4984]

this thread exploded. hmm. pun not intended. i see some American soldiers died. make sense with the post count. fucking shame man

no nuke friday in these parts. gonna make it i think. i have a beach, a beer and a dog. ya'll homies be cool. 

 

[Anastasis 23481]

22 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Of the millions of innocent human beings who just try to live their lives there? Like, all of them? We certainly shouldn’t murder them.

Shit happens.

[TwiceHorn 31534]

2 hours ago, DonkeyCigars said:

Are you saying that retaliation for today isn't patriotism?

 

I mean yeah, it's a kind of meatheaded 8th grade version of patriotism.  The kind that is very much en vogue these days.  You know, patriot eagle freedumb gun.

It is kind of an earmark of emotional maturity as a human, and by extension a nation, if you can feel the emotions that you are entitled to feel without acting on them and especially not acting under the influence of them.

[Bullneck 19206]

46 minutes ago, Nicole44 said:

So tell me who these upstanding men are from the Taliban? 

No one said they were upstanding.  We're just not interesting in nuking them.

 

13 minutes ago, Nicole44 said:

Why are we Burnt Ends now and not Tree Fiddy? I wanted to spend a small bit of cash on someone who hates me for mermbership.

No martyrdom, please.  

Girl you're jumping the shark.  Go to bed.

[hobbes2702 13061]

23 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

Nicole with shades of TTom as of late. 

Yea legit unstable. Seek help 

[DonkeyCigars 143]

2 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

I mean yeah, it's a kind of meatheaded 8th grade version of patriotism.  The kind that is very much en vogue these days.  You know, patriot eagle freedumb gun.

It is kind of an earmark of emotional maturity as a human, and by extension a nation, if you can feel the emotions that you are entitled to feel without acting on them and especially not acting under the influence of them.

So, what does that mean you are saying about Joe Biden and those who feel the way he does? Are you saying Joe Biden is a meathead and juvenile (on this matter)?

And maybe you are right, maybe it's immaturity to have a retaliatory policy and it reeks too much of Hammurabian harshness. I don't know about you, but I take comfort in knowing The Dude America abides. It feels good knowing that if you Mr. Foreign State makes an American bleed, you and yours bleed worse. And when the state stops making her citizens feel good (safe, secure, happy, etc.) then it's on perilous ground. We've seen that push back from some folks domestically, and a little too close to home in our streets a bit lately, haven't we.

[Deej 76903]

23 minutes ago, Nicole44 said:

I wanted to spend a small bit of cash on someone

Is this some sort of reverse Sugar Baby deal?

[Mole 4333]

2 minutes ago, DonkeyCigars said:

So...Joe Biden saying this is what? Patriotic or Not-Patriotic, based off your standards? "We will not forgive. We will not forget. We will hunt you down and make you pay,". 

And I ask because I disagree with you. I think there is a utility and usefulness to advance the American state (and the safety, security and power of America at home and abroad) and unify folks around a shared sentiment of emotion, by reacting and retaliating because we are mad. There is a healthy and righteous anger that I think can be patriotic.

Now, specifically, is it patriotic to be angry and retaliate and fight fire with fire with a population of people who can't help but take potshots and attack you behind your back as you are actively trying to get the heck out of their hair? I personally think so. So does Joe Biden and I think that is cool of him, as our President.

And maybe that's just my personality, but for perspective: one of the least patriotic things I thought Trump did was to do nothing when North Korea handed over Otto Warmbier and said "oops, must have fell down the stairs in the dark and it was an accident but, uh, here is the body, kthnx bai". I thought inaction and non-response was the worst sort of politics and the opposite of patriotism.

 

There’s a passage in Jim Bouton’s Ball Four, a great book about an aging and marginal baseball player hanging on in the big leagues. In the passage, he talks about having to act really mad after every loss even though it was just an act. He liked winning, but he didn’t see the point in throwing a tantrum after a loss.

I feel the same way every time a president gives the tough talk to the bad guys. It feels so pointless to me, but I guess it’s part of the job to act angry. If you need to blow up some bad guys, then blow them up. I don’t see the need for the act. I guess some people take solace in tough talk, but it seems dumb to me.

If a president initiates military action, putting American troops in danger, simply out of some righteous sense of vengeance, he’s a maniac. If there’s a valid strategic reason for it, that’s a sobering decision that carries the weight of life and death. If you have a strategic justification for killing the bad guys and the risks are acceptable, cool, but that’s not a choice made in anger.

Put more directly, no service members should be put at risk just because some fat redneck in College Station wants to act tough and angry. Some things are worth dying for, but not a demented identity and hurt national pride.

[washparkhorn 9939]

4 hours ago, David Dennison said:

Although it has most definitely been a shit show, it has also been a highly successful air lift.

Both things are true.

Best since the Berlin Airlift. Quite a demonstration of forward projecting power.

The boots on the ground and service members operating in that space - are doing the work of heroes in this standoff with the Tallywhackers and another ISIS Variant. 

The Taliban have reason to play nice. The international banking system has their money. There are rules for entry into the international world. 

Keep getting those people out.

[aggie08 21529]

1 minute ago, DonkeyCigars said:

So, what does that mean you are saying about Joe Biden and those who feel the way he does? Are you saying Joe Biden is a meathead and juvenile (on this matter)?

And maybe you are right, maybe it's immaturity to have a retaliatory policy and it reeks too much of Hammurabian harshness. I don't know about you, but I take comfort in knowing The Dude America abides. It feels good knowing that if you Mr. Foreign State makes an American bleed, you and yours bleed worse. And when the state stops making her citizens feel good (safe, secure, happy, etc.) then it's on perilous ground. We've seen that push back from some folks domestically, and a little too close to home in our streets a bit lately, haven't we.

But what does all that even mean in this context? Are we going to base some Seals in a bordering country and occasionally go in to kill some terrorists? How does that differ from the last 20 years? What happens when a helicopter crashes and we lose 20 guys in a country we're not even in anymore?

For once, I think the talk about payback is just empty words. And probably for the best.

[DonkeyCigars 143]

1 minute ago, Mole said:

There’s a passage in Jim Bouton’s Ball Four, a great book about an aging and marginal baseball player hanging on in the big leagues. In the passage, he talks about having to act really mad after every loss even though it was just an act. He liked winning, but he didn’t see the point in throwing a tantrum after a loss.

I feel the same way every time a president gives the tough talk to the bad guys. It feels so pointless to me, but I guess it’s part of the job to act angry. If you need to blow up some bad guys, then blow them up. I don’t see the need for the act. I guess some people take solace in tough talk, but it seems dumb to me.

If a president initiates military action, putting American troops in danger, simply out of some righteous sense of vengeance, he’s a maniac. If there’s a valid strategic reason for it, that’s a sobering decision that carries the weight of life and death. If you have a strategic justification for killing the bad guys and the risks are acceptable, cool, but that’s not a choice made in anger.

Put more directly, no service members should be put at risk just because some fat redneck in College Station wants to act tough and angry. Some things are worth dying for, but not a demented identity and hurt national pride.

I want to get to the meat of your posts, but I can't just let this slide so let me ask it first: are you suggesting that Biden is paying lip-service and is being inauthentic in his anger and passionate words in response to retaliation here for the deaths that happened today? Are you suggesting he is playing the part of the savvy, veteran politician and playing the game?

[Mole 4333]

1 minute ago, DonkeyCigars said:

I want to get to the meat of your posts, but I can't just let this slide so let me ask it first: are you suggesting that Biden is paying lip-service and is being inauthentic in his anger and passionate words in response to retaliation here for the deaths that happened today? Are you suggesting he is playing the part of the savvy, veteran politician and playing the game?

I have no idea if he believes it. I just think it’s dumb.

[DonkeyCigars 143]

1 minute ago, aggie08 said:

But what does all that even mean in this context? Are we going to base some Seals in a bordering country and occasionally go in to kill some terrorists? How does that differ from the last 20 years? What happens when a helicopter crashes and we lose 20 guys in a country we're not even in anymore?

For once, I think the talk about payback is just empty words. And probably for the best.

Joe Biden said this:

Quote

“I have also ordered my commanders to develop operational plans to strike ISIS-K assets, leadership and facilities. We will respond with force and precision at our time, at the place we choose and the moment of our choosing.”

It seems awfully (politically) foolish to be state your anger and intention to retaliate in such declarative ways if you don't really mean it and it's empty words. That's asking to be politically dunked on and a very glaring error, which makes me think you are wrong and that Biden is sincere. And I think a lot of Americans, including yours truly, appreciates that

[Nicole44 22075]

12 minutes ago, hobbes2702 said:

Yea legit unstable. Seek help 

[F250 28817]

12 minutes ago, DonkeyCigars said:

So, what does that mean you are saying about Joe Biden and those who feel the way he does? Are you saying Joe Biden is a meathead and juvenile (on this matter)?

And maybe you are right, maybe it's immaturity to have a retaliatory policy and it reeks too much of Hammurabian harshness. I don't know about you, but I take comfort in knowing The Dude America abides. It feels good knowing that if you Mr. Foreign State makes an American bleed, you and yours bleed worse. And when the state stops making her citizens feel good (safe, secure, happy, etc.) then it's on perilous ground. We've seen that push back from some folks domestically, and a little too close to home in our streets a bit lately, haven't we.

[Nicole44 22075]

13 minutes ago, Deej said:

Is this some sort of reverse Sugar Baby deal?

the fuck? 

[Mole 4333]

6 minutes ago, washparkhorn said:

Best since the Berlin Airlift. Quite a demonstration of forward projecting power.

If we weren’t so completely culturally broken, this would be a moment of great national pride. It doesn’t have to negate the justified criticisms of leadership, but these past two weeks have been heroic. Reuters says 100,100 evacuated since August 14.

[DonkeyCigars 143]

12 minutes ago, Mole said:

I have no idea if he believes it. I just think it’s dumb.

You give an interesting story from a book and conclude that "I guess it's part of the job of the President to act angry [and emptily gesture a response or retaliation when things like this happen]". I disagree and think that it's part of the job of the President to actually be angry when something like today happens, and to make those who dare bring violence and death to one of us, see those actions answered, swiftly, and with prejudice, because to act otherwise is a moral hazard.

Obviously there is calculus that needs to be done (e.g. this situation, which seems a slam dunk, versus, say, responding to Russia or China who can and will make life very painful for us), but it would appear changing course briefly to exterminate those too dumb to immediately hide after this sucker punch, a bunch of idiots who couldn't help themselves and hold their water until we were out the door and out of earshot, seems like a low calorie effort comparatively. 

Edited August 27, 2021 by DonkeyCigars

[elfenix 34332]

1 hour ago, Nicole44 said:

Can you imagine being in 2021 and still stuck in in the 1600's? . Sorry if people have to come to grips with that. I could care less how may of the taliban die or ISIS. They deserve it.

how much less?

[Nicole44 22075]

11 minutes ago, DonkeyCigars said:

I want to get to the meat of your posts, but I can't just let this slide so let me ask it first: are you suggesting that Biden is paying lip-service and is being inauthentic in his anger and passionate words in response to retaliation here for the deaths that happened today? Are you suggesting he is playing the part of the savvy, veteran politician and playing the game?

So if you "pretend" to care about people its ok? If you say the right words...its all good. Just prepare to attack. 

 

2 minutes ago, Mole said:

If we weren’t so completely culturally broken, this would be a moment of great national pride. It doesn’t have to negate the justified criticisms of leadership, but these past two weeks have been heroic. Reuters says 100,100 evacuated since August 14.

Basically, what this means to me is a bunch of broken bullshit it is what it is. Most people can see it. 

 

1 minute ago, elfenix said:

how much less?

A lot less. Let me put it to you this way...1,000 years. This is what they have chosen to do with it. Maybe they are right. Us womens should wear bullshit caftan/Scarves all over our bodies because the men in these countries are cunts. 

[InkaUtexas 26087]

4 hours ago, Nicole44 said:

Holy shit. My brother said the same thing. Russia failed. We failed. China...hmmm...

Will get its ass kicked. 

[MNLonghornFUKM 8817]

It seems awfully (politically) foolish to be state your anger and intention to retaliate in such declarative ways if you don't really mean it and it's empty words. That's asking to be politically dunked on and a very glaring error, which makes me think you are wrong and that Biden is sincere. And I think a lot of Americans, including yours truly, appreciates that

Biden doesn’t need help from his threats to get dunked on. The entire world knows he’s a feeble old man. Hell they’d probably feel guilty taking advantage of a senior citizen at this point. He fucking sucks

He’s going to hunt you down.

And make you pay!



The taliban are probably more afraid of the ANA

[elfenix 34332]

6 minutes ago, Nicole44 said:

A lot less.

[Nicole44 22075]

5 minutes ago, InkaUtexas said:

Will get its ass kicked. 

https://news.yahoo.com/russia-iran-china-hold-joint-081249567.html?fr=sycsrp_catchall

this ends very badly for US. They have held these joint exercises for years. 

[DonkeyCigars 143]

3 minutes ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

Biden doesn’t need help from his threats to get dunked on. The entire world knows he’s a feeble old man. Hell they’d probably feel guilty taking advantage of a senior citizen at this point. He fucking sucks

He’s going to hunt you down.

And make you pay!



The taliban are probably more afraid of the ANA

I disagree. Doesn't matter who is President, they theoretically hold the keys to the greatest army in the known world. Doesn't matter who is at the helm, if that person says I'm going to dispatch vengeance, you ought to believe it and know that check is guaranteed to be cashed.

That's the theory, at least, and I'm actually proud of ole Joey B for his response and seeming conviction. It means way more than the empty "the buck stops here with me" from a couple of weeks ago. That was just talk, if the buck really stops with you than that extends beyond just the initial action, but to the entire case-- to the fall-out and secondary and tertiary consequences and responses.

Biden was rad for his response, now let's see him action upon it.

[Nicole44 22075]

3 minutes ago, elfenix said:

[F250 28817]

3 minutes ago, Nicole44 said:

[Nicole44 22075]

How do I get @Bama Chick to be my friend? 

[Nicole44 22075]

1 minute ago, F250 said:

I have to say he should have won for 

Holy Shit what is going on with his bio? He should have won for Shadow of a Vampire. 

It reads like an obit. https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000353/bio#mini_bio

[aggie08 21529]

1 hour ago, DonkeyCigars said:

Joe Biden said this:

It seems awfully (politically) foolish to be state your anger and intention to retaliate in such declarative ways if you don't really mean it and it's empty words. That's asking to be politically dunked on and a very glaring error, which makes me think you are wrong and that Biden is sincere. And I think a lot of Americans, including yours truly, appreciates that

Do tell, what would satisfy your blood lust?

I would love some ISIS heads on a stick...without extending our stay in country...or endangering a single more American life...or relying on drone strikes acting on ANA (or Taliban?) intel and satellites. 

Ideas?

[Nicole44 22075]

8 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Do tell, what would satisfy your blood lust?

I would love some ISIS heads on a stick...without extending our stay in country...or endangering a single more American life...or relying on drone strikes acting on ANA (or Taliban?) intel and satellites. 

Ideas?

Ask them to meet in a public place. 

[washparkhorn 9939]

42 minutes ago, Nicole44 said:

How do I get ////////// to be my friend? 

to anyone. 

Take off the black Stetson, cowgirl.  It isn't you.

[hpslugga 4062]

2 hours ago, Clintonaldo said:

One thing I have learned is that the people for war are usually the people not having to go. This was always going to be shitty. 

That and they stumble and fall over themselves trying to defend their position with logic that's more tortured than an Abu Ghraib prisoner.

[Nicole44 22075]

2 minutes ago, washparkhorn said:

to anyone. 

Take off the black Stetson, cowgirl.  It isn't you.

[Nicole44 22075]

Hunt me down and put me in time out. 

[DonkeyCigars 143]

26 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Do tell, what would satisfy your blood lust?

I would love some ISIS heads on a stick...without extending our stay in country...or endangering a single more American life...or relying on drone strikes acting on ANA (or Taliban?) intel and satellites. 

Ideas?

As of tonight, Biden's response and commitment to retaliate was satisfying. By being swift and decisive I thought he responded with the gravity and seriousness needed and overall I thought was a leadership moment for Joe B. It's what I expected from the leader of the USA, no matter what side of the aisle or name on the back of the jersey.

What tactics or specifics would be satisfactory? I think his response there was a good one and captures my response to you well: Biden, like me, not being a military man and not wanting to pretend to be, asked his commanders for options. Get your options and make an optimal decision, that's a fair deal.

Edited August 27, 2021 by DonkeyCigars

[Longhorn_Fan68 33896]

1 hour ago, Nicole44 said:

How do I get @Bama Chick to be my friend? 

Step 1: don't be a vapid cunt.

Edited August 27, 2021 by Longhorn_Fan68

[aggie08 21529]

1 minute ago, DonkeyCigars said:

As of tonight, Biden's response and commitment to retaliate was satisfying. It felt swift and decisive and I thought was a leadership moment for Joe B.

What tactics or specifics would be satisfactory? I think his response there was a good one and captures my response to you well: Biden, like me, not being a military man and not wanting to pretend to be, asked his commanders for options. Get your options and make an optimal decision, that's a fair deal.

I'm sure Biden will do something to keep his word. My guess would be a drone strike or bombing in 6 months in an isolated region. We'll say we hit an ISIS stronghold, including some key targets. They'll say we hit an orphanage and a school for the blind. And that will mostly be that. Will that be good enough?

I get the need to say what he said--and, right now, he probably believes it--but once he cools down and talks to his military advisers, the options for real retribution in a country that we're abandoning to overwhelming public support are slim.

[Nicole44 22075]

Just now, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

Step 1: don't be a vapid cunt.

Step 2: Do not call me a cunt. 

Especially, in light of what has happened over the past 24 hours. Track me down. 

[DonkeyCigars 143]

8 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

I'm sure Biden will do something to keep his word. My guess would be a drone strike or bombing in 6 months in an isolated region. We'll say we hit an ISIS stronghold, including some key targets. They'll say we hit an orphanage and a school for the blind. And that will mostly be that. Will that be good enough?

I get the need to say what he said--and, right now, he probably believes it--but once he cools down and talks to his military advisers, the options for real retribution in a country that we're abandoning to overwhelming public support are slim.

I don't think that will be good enough. I think that would miss the mark and be a day late and a dollar short. I don't think that a "checking the box" approach to retaliation does much to help politically or emotionally, but I also don't necessarily agree with your estimation-- I felt like Biden's words and tone in his presser today was more in the realm of conviction than impulsiveness-- an impulsiveness you seem to think that his handlers and brass will talk him out of and cool him down from. Maybe I'm being naive now, but I hope his words tonight were not so cheaply stated.

Edited August 27, 2021 by DonkeyCigars

[Nicole44 22075]

10 minutes ago, Nicole44 said:

Step 2: Do not call me a cunt. 

Especially, in light of what has happened over the past 24 hours. Track me down. 

It is tired. Being called a cunt. No doubt the rest of the middle east can destroy your wanting to be a female. But hey...