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Boo fucking hoo Ashli Babbitt

Gooby

By Gooby
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Neonmoon
Neonmoon

1. Firing on citizens is a very bad thing. It’s not end of America bad. That’s emotional and hyperbolic. Stopping the peaceful transfer of power actually literally ends American democracy. Time and ti

Longhornlove
Longhornlove

OOOOOOOhhhhh fact checkers, they aren't biased ever.  

Goredho
Goredho

@WinningIsHard is correct, Ashli Babbit shouldn’t have been killed.  Which is to say, the former President and those around him shouldn’t have tried to raise an insurrection against the President elec

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1 hour ago, Biff Tannen said:

I'm all for having all of these people committed, but is that a realistic solution?

I really don't know.  I'm sure her family/friends all thought she was harmless ('d be curious if any of it was manifesting while she was in the military), and had she not decided to go through that window/barricade after being told not to, she would still be seen by them as that enthusiastic little Trump supporter who got a few months probation and had to pay a fine for being in the Capitol.

If she had been Antifa lunging into a secure where Trump was at, MAGA would have been screaming for her execution.  But it was Democrats and Mitch/Pence in there instead.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31240

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15 hours ago, Biff Tannen said:

I'm all for having all of these people committed, but is that a realistic solution?

This strikes at the heart of the criminal justice system.

A huge percentage of crime is directly traceable to mental health issues, if not proximately caused by them.

Some, any, meaningful mental health treatment is preferable to a prison sentence in a dysfunctional environment among dysfunctional people.

But, that isn't the way it works.

 

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Homercles

Homercles 10205

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I’m actually grateful for her…my recollection was her getting shot was the breaking point for that particular waves of insane people in the Capitol.  Once people there saw that their actions could have actual consequences, it cooled them off.  Until that point their fever dream was still possible.  
 

I reserve the biggest ‘fuck you’ for the people who, after all the facts and video came out, continue to lament that these ‘souvenir seekers and harmless protestors’ (actual phrase I saw on Reddit) are being arrested.  It really cements to me that facts and critical thinking are powerless against confirmation bias in the age of the Internet.  

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Mrs Whiggins

Mrs Whiggins 13049

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1 minute ago, Homercles said:

I reserve the biggest ‘fuck you’ for the people who, after all the facts and video came out, continue to lament that these ‘souvenir seekers and harmless protestors’ (actual phrase I saw on Reddit) are being arrested.  It really cements to me that facts and critical thinking are powerless against confirmation bias in the age of the Internet.  

Definitely. I always bring back a laptop or two whenever we return from a trip. I phoned home from our last vacation and said to a neighbor, "Dude, you're getting a Dell!"

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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

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She should not have been the only one shot. 
 

The first attack wave should have been shot. Then, there is no insurrection. Would have ended it right there. 
 

But of course that’s not what the president wanted and Mike Pence’s life would not have been in jeopardy. 

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Nivek

Nivek 16843

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She should not have been the only one shot. 
 
The first attack wave should have been shot. Then, there is no insurrection. Would have ended it right there. 
 
But of course that’s not what the president wanted and Mike Pence’s life would not have been in jeopardy. 

I agree somewhat. It looks like some of the cops were feeling outgunned and did not want to escalate the fight with firearms (a first). But they should have opened fire when those traitors breached the Capitol building.
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3 hours ago, Nivek said:

I agree somewhat. It looks like some of the cops were feeling outgunned and did not want to escalate the fight with firearms (a first). But they should have opened fire when those traitors breached the Capitol building.

It was a long time ago (mid '90s) when I was in the Army, but part of our unit was going overseas to an area with some potential hostile locals, and we all had to do some brief, somewhat informal, crowd control training. I don't remember a lot of it (I wasn't going overseas and didn't care). I vaguely remember stuff about identifying who is driving it, and removing them from the equation - capturing/detaining if possible, or doing the equivalent of hammering the nose of a drunk guy spoiling for a fight, or kicking him in the balls, with the goal being to scare off the folks who aren't really confident/don't really want to be there, so that you're left dealing with a smaller group. Really remember that when dealing with a hostile mob, even when you're not outnumbered, but especially when outnumbered, to always act in a very concentrated and unified manner (shoulder-to-shoulder, etc.).  It was very informal though, and not training that an MP or other police would have gone through.

I saw those cops at the Capitol getting spread way out, and while some of it was poor training or command and control, I honestly think it was deliberately done by some trained individuals in the crowd.  A random group doesn't spontaneously do something that would be extremely effective at diluting the power of the law enforcement facing them, but at the same time could have been extremely dangerous if the cops had started firing.

In all of the BLM/Antifa protests, I don't recall any of the BLM/Antifa folks deliberately singling out and pulling cops out of line/groups of other cops and then assaulting those cops once they've separated them from the others.

It's also one thing to take out the leaders of a group and scare the shit out of the followers, but if a bunch of the followers are mentally ill, they aren't going to give a shit about leaders, and I wonder if that came into play.  Those cops knew a bunch of those qanon idiots were mentally ill.

I still think the cops should have been much more aggressive and never let the crowd get so close to the Capitol - I think you'd have seen the real estate agents and lawyers tuck their tails and run, leaving the militia-types and qanon idiots. 

The flip side is that the way those crowds were packed in so tightly, plenty of folks could have gotten very close to the cops with firearms, and the cops would not have known it until they were just a few feet away.  

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Bullneck

Bullneck 18983

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 7/29/2021 at 3:18 PM, atomheartbevo said:

I still think the cops should have been much more aggressive and never let the crowd get so close to the Capitol - I think you'd have seen the real estate agents and lawyers tuck their tails and run, leaving the militia-types and qanon idiots. 

I agree with this.  If they would have opened fire and hit 20 or so insurrectionists it would have thinned the herd pretty quick.  The cosplay boys would have been running for the exits.

Edited by Bullneck
herd, not heard
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16 minutes ago, Bullneck said:

I agree with this.  If they would have opened fire and hit 20 or so insurrectionists it would have thinned the heard pretty quick.  The cosplay boys would have been running for the exits.

And the cosplayers heading for the exits would have removed the meat shields for the hard-core militia types, at which point quite a few of those types would have bailed.

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Nivek

Nivek 16843

Posted
Posted
It was a long time ago (mid '90s) when I was in the Army, but part of our unit was going overseas to an area with some potential hostile locals, and we all had to do some brief, somewhat informal, crowd control training. I don't remember a lot of it (I wasn't going overseas and didn't care). I vaguely remember stuff about identifying who is driving it, and removing them from the equation - capturing/detaining if possible, or doing the equivalent of hammering the nose of a drunk guy spoiling for a fight, or kicking him in the balls, with the goal being to scare off the folks who aren't really confident/don't really want to be there, so that you're left dealing with a smaller group. Really remember that when dealing with a hostile mob, even when you're not outnumbered, but especially when outnumbered, to always act in a very concentrated and unified manner (shoulder-to-shoulder, etc.).  It was very informal though, and not training that an MP or other police would have gone through.
I saw those cops at the Capitol getting spread way out, and while some of it was poor training or command and control, I honestly think it was deliberately done by some trained individuals in the crowd.  A random group doesn't spontaneously do something that would be extremely effective at diluting the power of the law enforcement facing them, but at the same time could have been extremely dangerous if the cops had started firing.
In all of the BLM/Antifa protests, I don't recall any of the BLM/Antifa folks deliberately singling out and pulling cops out of line/groups of other cops and then assaulting those cops once they've separated them from the others.
It's also one thing to take out the leaders of a group and scare the shit out of the followers, but if a bunch of the followers are mentally ill, they aren't going to give a shit about leaders, and I wonder if that came into play.  Those cops knew a bunch of those qanon idiots were mentally ill.
I still think the cops should have been much more aggressive and never let the crowd get so close to the Capitol - I think you'd have seen the real estate agents and lawyers tuck their tails and run, leaving the militia-types and qanon idiots. 
The flip side is that the way those crowds were packed in so tightly, plenty of folks could have gotten very close to the cops with firearms, and the cops would not have known it until they were just a few feet away.  

My initial thought was the same, open fire and find out who is serious. It was a cop who stated that they wanted to deescalate because they were outgunned.

The whole thing is enraging.
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aggie08

aggie08 21414

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Fucking hell, they really do just do this shit on purpose. Piss off as many libs as possible, regardless of how big a piece a shit it makes you. He does just a rat's ass about Babbitt's plight or her "tragic" story. Or any of the rioters for that matter. It's all for the lulz

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Chewbacca

Chewbacca 7729

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 7/17/2021 at 11:53 AM, JimmyJames said:

She should not have been the only one shot. 
 

The first attack wave should have been shot. Then, there is no insurrection. Would have ended it right there. 
 

But of course that’s not what the president wanted and Mike Pence’s life would not have been in jeopardy. 

Yep.  You breach the barriers, the tear gas and rubber bullets come out.  You breach the building, you die.  That's what should have happened.

Edited by Chewbacca
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Red Five

Red Five 40627

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3 hours ago, Biff Tannen said:

Overheard a tucker Carlson snippet saying “we don’t know why she was shot”.  Um, pretty sure we do. 

Lets set aside for a moment that the Vice President and Speaker of the House were right down the hall. She broke into a building and was trying to climb through broken glass where on the other side were security officers with guns trained on her. Golly, I just can't seem to figure out how she got shot. 

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58 minutes ago, Red Five said:

Lets set aside for a moment that the Vice President and Speaker of the House were right down the hall. She broke into a building and was trying to climb through broken glass where on the other side were security officers with guns trained on her. Golly, I just can't seem to figure out how she got shot. 

She also had a military background.  There are plenty of Air Force bases that have areas that will get your ass shot if you fuck around and try to find out.

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tx 3 putt

tx 3 putt 76296

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23 hours ago, Red Five said:

Lets set aside for a moment that the Vice President and Speaker of the House were right down the hall. She broke into a building and was trying to climb through broken glass where on the other side were security officers with guns trained on her. Golly, I just can't seem to figure out how she got shot. 

 

she was an innocent tourist !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Born to Run

Born to Run 6558

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Im a 45 year old white male. I understand my privelege. What the fuck kinda of lives do these people have that they think they can act this way with zero consequence? I will not even raise my voice to a LEO for fear of getting my ass shot. Just an alternate reality.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31240

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I will have a hard time celebrating the death of most anyone, with a few exceptions.  I'm also more than a bit uneasy with most law-enforcement imposed deaths.

But the symbolism attached to someone's death is another matter, entirely.  Martyrdom for Ashli Babbitt is ridiculous, beyond stupid.

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WhatTheBuck

WhatTheBuck 28703

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57 minutes ago, lmao said:

Her politics were most likely abhorrent to me but I just can't support police shooting unarmed people.

If someone breaks into your house then you should definitely wait until you determine whether they’re armed or not before you shoot them.

Dumbass.

 

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