Left Behind: A Quick Dose Of Post Big 12 Reality

[LTtxfan 48727]

9 minutes ago, LTtxfan said:

Not necessarily... in 2024, kstate, jayhawks, okie lite, toads, and tech should all have competitive teams.

And the "Surly Fritz Fan" will keep us up to date on cougar high...  😋

And @Al_4_ISU will hopefully keep us updated and bemoan the cyclones football struggles  😋

['stache 21591]

59 minutes ago, LTtxfan said:

Not necessarily... in 2024, kstate, jayhawks, okie lite, toads, and tech should all have competitive teams.

And the "Surly Fritz Fan" will keep us up to date on cougar high...  😋

Hey now, that's not what this thread is about. Those programs didn't sufficiently kiss the UT ring, ergo, the PAC newcomers are the only programs people care about (it's hard to type that with a straight face), but the conference is still value-less, not lesser value as everyone has agreed, but zero value. The schools should probably just stop playing sports, or shut down entirely.

[LTbear 4082]

On 1/25/2024 at 9:48 AM, Al_4_ISU said:

I'm legit surprised that Wisconsin outdraws Aggy.  Not that Sconnies aren't passionate about their Badgers, but just given the relative populations of Texas and Wisconsin.

That said, TJ Altimore was probably more wrong than anyone on all this realignment shit the last go round. 

Way more competition for football viewership in Texas vs Wisconsin.

Edited January 29 by LTbear

[Al_4_ISU 12376]

1 hour ago, LTtxfan said:

And @Al_4_ISU will hopefully keep us updated and bemoan the cyclones football struggles  😋

Only if there's a thread about Big 12 football.

35 minutes ago, LTbear said:

Way more competition for football viewership in Texas vs Wisconsin.

True, but there are also way more people in general.

[Wulaw Horn 18919]

1 hour ago, 'stache said:

Hey now, that's not what this thread is about. Those programs didn't sufficiently kiss the UT ring, ergo, the PAC newcomers are the only programs people care about (it's hard to type that with a straight face), but the conference is still value-less, not lesser value as everyone has agreed, but zero value. The schools should probably just stop playing sports, or shut down entirely.

I mean, I think yall are the 3rd best conference in a world where people will only care about the top 2, but is that zero value?  of course not. But it's a real tallest midget situation and I don't know why anyone here would think differently.  

All the best- hope yall do well to the extent that I'm paying attention I guess.  Never had a problem with OSU. 

['stache 21591]

Just now, Wulaw Horn said:

I mean, I think yall are the 3rd best conference in a world where people will only care about the top 2, but is that zero value?  of course not. But it's a real tallest midget situation and I don't know why anyone here would think differently.  

All the best- hope yall do well to the extent that I'm paying attention I guess.  Never had a problem with OSU. 

We're going to be paid half of the amount paid to the teams in the top 2, but still quite a lot. That reflects less interest, but enough to sustain a decent media payout. Every fan on here of the "left behinds" agrees. I just don't understand the need to say over and over and over again that nobody will watch, like zero interest. There's even talk that stadiums are only full when OU and UT visit which has been disproven time and time again. It's just a lame narrative, especially when nobody is pushing back against the reality of diminished interest and diminished media payments commensurate with tv ratings. 

[closetojumping 62010]

48 minutes ago, 'stache said:

We're going to be paid half of the amount paid to the teams in the top 2, but still quite a lot. That reflects less interest, but enough to sustain a decent media payout. Every fan on here of the "left behinds" agrees. I just don't understand the need to say over and over and over again that nobody will watch, like zero interest. There's even talk that stadiums are only full when OU and UT visit which has been disproven time and time again. It's just a lame narrative, especially when nobody is pushing back against the reality of diminished interest and diminished media payments commensurate with tv ratings. 

This thread is hilarious because of the same shit going on almost weekly. The same posters show up and tell you guys that you basically won't get any money in the next media deal, that no one will watch Big 12 games next year because Texas and OU left, and that you should all be bowing down and thanking Texas for everything you've had so far. Then you guys take the bait and get spun up. Then you deny getting spun up. The rest of us thread regulars wind up generally and mildly entertained. Rinse and repeat. 

I'd personally like to see @Al_4_ISU and @statsman meet up in person with some of us as onlookers. I assume it would take less than 3 minutes before they're each speaking more and more loudly about their positions while not hearing word 1 of what the other guy is saying. I don't know how we make that happen unless Texas plays ISU in a bowl game down the line, but it would be a solid 10 minutes of absurdity.

[Guest]

Nobody is getting spun up except maybe the temperature on  Rodney Terry's coaching seat.

 

It'll be easier next season.

Edited January 29 by slorch

[closetojumping 62010]

2 minutes ago, slorch said:

Nobody is getting spun up except maybe the temperature on  Rodney Terry's coaching seat.

 

It'll be easier next season.

You guys get spun up all the time. Spare us your Pee Wee Herman "I meant to do that" imitation.

As to Rodney Terry, we're all hoping it gets so hot that Texas pulls a Tech maneuver and throws the guy out on his ass, Maude Adams-style, if he doesn't get his shit together to end this season. I hear Grant McCasland would be near the top of the list. We think Tech is going to continue to be a solid feeder system for coaches for Texas and other major athletic programs. 

[Guest]

LOlz.  Good luck with all that.  Go have a McMuffin in celebration of your conquests.

[statsman 5355]

14 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

This thread is hilarious because of the same shit going on almost weekly. The same posters show up and tell you guys that you basically won't get any money in the next media deal, that no one will watch Big 12 games next year because Texas and OU left, and that you should all be bowing down and thanking Texas for everything you've had so far. Then you guys take the bait and get spun up. Then you deny getting spun up. The rest of us thread regulars wind up generally and mildly entertained. Rinse and repeat. 

I'd personally like to see @Al_4_ISU and @statsman meet up in person with some of us as onlookers. I assume it would take less than 3 minutes before they're each speaking more and more loudly about their positions while not hearing word 1 of what the other guy is saying. I don't know how we make that happen unless Texas plays ISU in a bowl game down the line, but it would be a solid 10 minutes of absurdity.

Honestly, I’d rather get into it with a Baylor fan. Credit to Al_4_ISU for sticking up for the Cyclones, and the conference they’re in, but I really don’t feel the umbrage for them. 
 
Now, the Branch-Gainesians? We can have a ruction. 

Edited January 29 by statsman

[bolverk 29107]

6 hours ago, statsman said:

The worst thing they can do would be to think their programs deserve to exist at that level of relevance. They don’t. They need to start figuring out how to price games so 35,000 will buy tickets to watch Southern Missouri visit Lubbock. They need to get the campus community excited about that Thursday night showdown in Stillwater with TCU. 

 

2 hours ago, 'stache said:

We're going to be paid half of the amount paid to the teams in the top 2, but still quite a lot. That reflects less interest, but enough to sustain a decent media payout. Every fan on here of the "left behinds" agrees. I just don't understand the need to say over and over and over again that nobody will watch, like zero interest. There's even talk that stadiums are only full when OU and UT visit which has been disproven time and time again. It's just a lame narrative, especially when nobody is pushing back against the reality of diminished interest and diminished media payments commensurate with tv ratings. 

 

TV ratings, no question, will be down. Stadium attendance smack talk is just that. Yeah, the stadiums are smaller, but only West Virginia and Houston struggled with keeping their stadiums filled up this past season. Here's the average home attendance (percent capacity) for each of the "left behinds" in games not involving either UT or OU.

BYU 63,470 (97.0%)  
ISU 60,161 (97.8%)
TTU 54,491 (97.0%)
OSU 53,855 (100.0%)
KSU 51,957 (103.9%)
WVU 51,156 (85.3%)
TCU 46,751 (99.5%)
KU 45,665 (96.7%)
UCF 44,015 (99.6%)
BU 42,562 (94.3%)
UC 38,193 (100.3%)
UH 34,888 (87.2%)

[statsman 5355]

Attendance is based on tix sold, not used. The need to get seats for desirable games drives sales of tix for less desirable games. 
 
I mentioned this before- driving back from the Texas - KSU game, I went by BU’s home game against UH. It was going into OT. From the freeway, I could see the upper deck was sparsely populated. 
 
TV tries to not highlight poor attendances; it makes viewers wonder why they should care about the game if the home fans don’t. Still, there are plenty of times where we get views of a third to half empty B12 stadiums. 

[66BUFF 2539]

43 minutes ago, statsman said:

Attendance is based on tix sold, not used. The need to get seats for desirable games drives sales of tix for less desirable games. 
 
I mentioned this before- driving back from the Texas - KSU game, I went by BU’s home game against UH. It was going into OT. From the freeway, I could see the upper deck was sparsely populated. 
 
TV tries to not highlight poor attendances; it makes viewers wonder why they should care about the game if the home fans don’t. Still, there are plenty of times where we get views of a third to half empty B12 stadiums. 

Big 10 and SEC schools also have attendance issues.

 

[WelfareBuysMyWeed 5322]

8 hours ago, slorch said:

We aren't crying. 

We think you are ovulating all over this thread, not crying

[bolverk 29107]

2 hours ago, statsman said:

Attendance is based on tix sold, not used. The need to get seats for desirable games drives sales of tix for less desirable games. 
 
I mentioned this before- driving back from the Texas - KSU game, I went by BU’s home game against UH. It was going into OT. From the freeway, I could see the upper deck was sparsely populated. 
 
TV tries to not highlight poor attendances; it makes viewers wonder why they should care about the game if the home fans don’t. Still, there are plenty of times where we get views of a third to half empty B12 stadiums. 

That doesn't surprise me. First, I have no idea how many season tickets Baylor sells. Secondly, it was their second-worst-announced attendance last year. Third, they were heading into the season's final stretch with only three wins (one against Long Island University). I'm sure most fans had already given up on the season.

I don't doubt there may be some marginal effect on season tickets if Texas isn't on the schedule from fairweather fans looking to make a buck off their seats for that game, especially in Waco, which is just a short drive away from Austin and UT fans typically make that a home crowd. The same effect likely would apply to TCU and Houston, but that's certainly not the case in distance stadiums at Tech, OSU, KSU, etc.

Hell, neither Tech nor K State hosted UT or OU this past season, and they both did fine for the season. As a statman, I wouldn't think you'd make such a broad statement based on an anecdotal sample size of one home game observed from the freeway out of a universe of about 72 home games played by the leftovers all season.

Let's just see how next season plays out for them before making bold predictions about 50-60,000-seat stadiums struggling to fill 35,000 seats.

[Deej 76220]

I know it's probably been mentioned before, but with a 12 team playoff and the conference champ getting in, Big 12 teams really need to bump up the level of competition in their OOC games across the board. But it's the Big 12, so they probably won't. 

Edited January 30 by Deej

[WelfareBuysMyWeed 5322]

Would just like to mention that the Big 12 getting an automatic invite isn't a guarantee at all. It's the top 5 conference champions. For example, assuming OSU was the Big 12 champion in absence of Texas, they still weren't among the top 5 champions at the end of last season. Ignoring Texas, it would have been Michigan, Washington, Florida State, Alabama, and then SMU would have been the 5th auto bid. And then, even after them, Liberty would have been next in line above the Big 12. Ignoring Texas, OSU would have been the 7th highest ranked conference champion. Last year, the Big 12 wouldn't have even sniffed an autobid.

Get fucked, Bitch 12.

[Deej 76220]

All the more reason to up their OOC schedules. 

[WelfareBuysMyWeed 5322]

1 minute ago, Deej said:

All the more reason to up their OOC schedules. 

oh ya, I was posting that in agreement with your post

Only problem with that is that the Big 12 is made up of the kind of teams that good teams schedule as cupcakes, so more OoC might just make the Big 12 slide even further into irrelevancy.

Edited January 30 by WelfareBuysMyWeed

[Deej 76220]

Can't up their game by being pussies, but we all know that's exactly what they are. 

The Irate 8 are probably getting together with the league office to figure out the best way to fuck the new schools over.

Edited January 30 by Deej

[statsman 5355]

20 minutes ago, Deej said:

Can't up their game by being pussies, but we all know that's exactly what they are. 

The Irate 8 are probably getting together with the league office to figure out the best way to fuck the new schools over.

I don’t believe Yormark feels more loyalty to the incumbent schools than to the newcomers. I bet he plans on being buds with Deion. 

[TKthunder2 4959]

Big 12 gets a pity mention in ESPN’s “must watch” cfb games of 2024. (The ACC games are weak also).

https://athlonsports.com/college-football/espn-names-eight-cant-miss-college-football-games-for-2024-season-georgia-alabama-texas-michigan
 

Miami at Florida (which coach is going to get fired first game)
Texas at Michigan
Georgia at Alabama
Ohio St at Oregon
Georgia at Texas
Florida St at Notre Dame
Michigan at Ohio St
Utah at Oklahoma St

[WelfareBuysMyWeed 5322]

31 minutes ago, TKthunder2 said:

Utah at Oklahoma St

who in the flying fuck is dying to watch this shit? lol

[Satchel 6904]

12 hours ago, closetojumping said:

You guys get spun up all the time. Spare us your Pee Wee Herman "I meant to do that" imitation.

As to Rodney Terry, we're all hoping it gets so hot that Texas pulls a Tech maneuver and throws the guy out on his ass, Maude Adams-style, if he doesn't get his shit together to end this season. I hear Grant McCasland would be near the top of the list. We think Tech is going to continue to be a solid feeder system for coaches for Texas and other major athletic programs. 

I’d be skittish about going to the Tech well yet again. Hasn’t turned out well for Texas so far.

[South Austin 51681]

19 hours ago, 'stache said:

Hey now, that's not what this thread is about. Those programs didn't sufficiently kiss the UT ring, ergo, the PAC newcomers are the only programs people care about (it's hard to type that with a straight face), but the conference is still value-less, not lesser value as everyone has agreed, but zero value. The schools should probably just stop playing sports, or shut down entirely.

This a pretty snarky comment after a bunch of us pitched in and got you a brand new shine box for Christmas.

[closetohumping 17302]

8 hours ago, Deej said:

Can't up their game by being pussies, but we all know that's exactly what they are. 

The Irate 8 are probably getting together with the league office to figure out the best way to fuck the new schools over.

I think they’re still drinking the champagne for killing the pac.  Should be a hangover for the next three months and then it’ll be time to get to work

[Guest]

We have been collaborating on how to kill Texas and OU's basketball seasons.

Right?

Some a y'all reside in Crazytown.

[WelfareBuysMyWeed 5322]

12 minutes ago, slorch said:

We have been collaborating on how to kill Texas and OU's basketball seasons.

Right?

Some a y'all reside in Crazytown.

you reside in bitchville

[Guest]

You're on ignore, dipshit.  Because you're a dipshit.

[mdmost 42501]

Nice schedule, morons.

 

[BurntOrange&White 38890]

That shit is a nightmare to try and read, holy fuck.

[Vertigo 20208]

It's like someone shrunk an oversized bingo card and then shrunk it again to fit the file format. 

[Deej 76220]

The dozens of people interested will find a way to read it. 

[closetojumping 62010]

25 minutes ago, mdmost said:

Nice schedule, morons.

 

This goes back to what I said in this thread months ago that @Deej is touching on now and others have referenced as well. The non-conference scheduling is a problem.  14 of the 16 schools are playing FCS schools. 

The 2024 season, due to the rapid nature of the new conference teams coming into play, has several teams playing 10 conference games. That's a quality offset to FCS crap, for sure. In the future, that won't be happening. 

Given the nature of lacking blue bloods, there will be a voting bias against the conference. The offset needs to be quality non-con opponents. Any team that fails to win the conference and goes something like 11-2 (conference title loss) should likely be heading to the playoff. That considered, many years there is a strong likelihood that any or all of the Big 10, SEC and ACC could have 3rd place teams that are 10-2. We all know the Big 10 and SEC will get biased benefits of the doubt. So then you're left with the Big 12 and ACC arguing for one of the final spots. The Big 12 has 9 conference games, so that wins. But let's say the 10-2 ACC team is FSU with two conference losses and a win over UF and another P5 in their non-con. Is TCU or Baylor getting in over them? Not if their non-con is Tarleton State, North Texas and Air Force.

['stache 21591]

I think non-con is kind of a wash. The assumption will be that only the Big 12 champ gets in most years so just win. In that scenario, noncon wins and losses don't matter. If there is a close call between SEC 5th place and Big 12 2nd place, it'll 75% go to SEC regardless of the schedule, but OSU has home and home's with Arkansas, Oregon, Alabama, and Nebraska coming up, and I have a running bet that Bedlam will be played noncon in 2030-31. If that situation arises and we have a W against Oregon, or Bama, or even Neby if they ever are good again, it will help. Our FCS opponent next year is 2 time reigning champs South Dakota State. Thank goodness we have the QB situation figured out and not dealing with half the roster having portaled. If that game were last year it would have been South Bama on steroids.

Edited January 30 by 'stache

[Deej 76220]

1 minute ago, 'stache said:

I think non-con is kind of a wash. The assumption will be that only the Big 12 champ gets in most years so just win. In that scenario, noncon wins and losses don't matter. If there is a close call between SEC 5th place and Big 12 2nd place, it'll 75% go to SEC regardless of the schedule, but OSU has home and home's with Arkansas, Oregon, Alabama, and Nebraska coming up, and I have a running bet that Bedlam will be played noncon in 2030-31. If that situation arises and we have a W against Oregon, or Bama, or even Neby if they ever are good again, it will help. Our FCS opponent next year is 2 time reigning champs South Dakota State. Thank goodness we have the QB situation figured out and not dealing with half the roster having portaled. If that game were last year it would have been South Bama on steroids.

Seems like short term thinking and just being happy with one spot. 

[statsman 5355]

On October 12, Texas plays OU. Look at who has byes that weekend- Baylor, UH, OSU, TT and TCU

That’s one way to avoid an awkward observation 😂

Edited January 30 by statsman

['stache 21591]

7 minutes ago, Deej said:

Seems like short term thinking and just being happy with one spot. 

It's not exactly our choice, SEC and BIG will always have the benefit of the doubt, regardless of nonconference scheduling. 

[Deej 76220]

Just throw your hands up. Any excuse to keep a shitty schedule. Start winning against bigger names and maybe shit changes. More eyeballs, better recruits...

But the Big 12 leftovers are apparently exactly who we thought they were. 

[closetojumping 62010]

9 minutes ago, 'stache said:

I think non-con is kind of a wash. The assumption will be that only the Big 12 champ gets in most years so just win. In that scenario, noncon wins and losses don't matter. If there is a close call between SEC 5th place and Big 12 2nd place, it'll 75% go to SEC regardless of the schedule, but OSU has home and home's with Arkansas, Oregon, Alabama, and Nebraska coming up, and I have a running bet that Bedlam will be played noncon in 2030-31. If that situation arises and we have a W against Oregon, or Bama, or even Neby if they ever are good again, it will help. Our FCS opponent next year is 2 time reigning champs South Dakota State. Thank goodness we have the QB situation figured out and not dealing with half the roster having portaled. If that game were last year it would have been South Bama on steroids.

I guess I need to refresh my 12 game playoff thinking if the expectation is that the Big 12 will only be getting one team in most seasons. 

There are 16 teams in the conference. Seems like having 2 teams that are 11-2 or better each season is really likely. If 5 conference champions get in, that leaves 7 other spots. Even if the Big 10 and SEC get 1+2 in each season, that's 3 open spots. You'll have runners up in the ACC and Big 12, and 4th place finishers in the Big 10 and SEC arguing over those 3 spots. If the Big 12 is playing a respectable non-con, they seem like a lock for 1 of those spots, if not 2 of them. I guess Notre Dame fits in there somewhere as well for certain seasons. 

[Al_4_ISU 12376]

Tech's the only Big 12 school not playing 10 power conference games next year, and that's just because Wazzu got relegated.

Edited January 30 by Al_4_ISU

[Guest]

Things I'd love to see standardized across P5 or CFP teams, but will not likely ever happen:

9 Conference games

13 weeks to play 12 games

1 true road game in Non-con, not neutral.

No FCS opponents. Period.

[closetojumping 62010]

1 minute ago, Al_4_ISU said:

Tech's the only Big 12 school not playing 10 power conference games next year, and that's just because Wazzu got relegated.

That should be a given every season for every team. The bigger issue is around FCS schools versus any other FBS option for resume polishing. You're conference is going to be like the fat chick in the sack - you're going to have to work harder. Not saying it is right, but that's how it will be most seasons. So take objections away from the committee. A win over Air Force is better than a win over Tarleton State, inarguably. Play App State or Ohio (and, you know, win) instead of Northern Iowa or Albany.

['stache 21591]

Texas is one of very few programs that doesn't play FCS games, programs don't get knocked for winning those games. It's more important to have a P5 non-con opponent, and preferably a high level one, because a win in that game can make a difference. I'm happy to see OSU playing Oregon and Alabama, even Nebraska and Arkansas are respectable and could be really good or really bad by the time those games come up. 

[statsman 5355]

13 minutes ago, Al_4_ISU said:

Tech's the only Big 12 school not playing 10 power conference games next year, and that's just because Wazzu got relegated.

I see why they kept previously scheduled games with newcomers as non-con games. It’s a benefit for the media partners- more good games. 

[Al_4_ISU 12376]

27 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

That should be a given every season for every team. The bigger issue is around FCS schools versus any other FBS option for resume polishing. You're conference is going to be like the fat chick in the sack - you're going to have to work harder. Not saying it is right, but that's how it will be most seasons. So take objections away from the committee. A win over Air Force is better than a win over Tarleton State, inarguably. Play App State or Ohio (and, you know, win) instead of Northern Iowa or Albany.

You have no idea how badly I'd love to never play Northern Iowa (or any FCS school frankly) ever again.

And I'm pretty sure most of the Big 12 schools are doing this going forward.  It's not Art Briles and Bill Snyder scheduling any more.

Edited January 30 by Al_4_ISU

[BachelorTrek 2903]

19 minutes ago, 'stache said:

Texas is one of very few programs that doesn't play FCS games, programs don't get knocked for winning those games. It's more important to have a P5 non-con opponent, and preferably a high level one, because a win in that game can make a difference. I'm happy to see OSU playing Oregon and Alabama, even Nebraska and Arkansas are respectable and could be really good or really bad by the time those games come up. 

The Bugeaters (nebraska) must be still mad at Pacific for dropping football, since that was the Bugeaters' guaranteed win every year.  Lulz.

[Sbbruin 21588]

15 minutes ago, Al_4_ISU said:

You have no idea how badly I'd love to never play Northern Iowa (or any FCS school frankly) ever again.

And I'm pretty sure most of the Big 12 schools are doing this going forward.  It's not Art Briles and Bill Snyder scheduling any more.

We just played our first FCS opponents ever the last 2 years, because Michigan backed out of a home n home this season and last.  

[Deej 76220]

20 minutes ago, Sbbruin said:

because Michigan backed out of a home n home this season and last. 

Harbaugh must not have had any current tape on you guys.

Edited January 30 by Deej