Left Behind: A Quick Dose Of Post Big 12 Reality

[TKthunder2 4985]

16 minutes ago, tejas60 said:

Take a real close look at houston. 

lol touché 

[billfromlaketravis 11448]

I guess if the Big Ten can claim DC and NYC’s TV sets with Maryland and Rutgers, the Big 12 can do the same with U of H. 
 

Even when the team has been really good, there hasn’t been much local attention. Ed Oliver was the last high profile recruit they landed. I just don’t see them as a good value add. 

[TrashMaster G 17547]

13 hours ago, Mitch Cumsteen said:

Would still be better than Lowell. 

AI >> QI

[Hurtlocker 2212]

On 9/22/2024 at 6:20 PM, mdmost said:

I believe Big Noon Kickoff is going to Colorado UCF even though it's not their Big Noon game. Because Deion.

He's still pulling pretty good numbers for a mid team, including pulling over 3m against Colorado State.   Wonder what it will look like once his son and Hunter are gone.

[Hurtlocker 2212]

On 9/23/2024 at 3:36 PM, billfromlaketravis said:

I guess if the Big Ten can claim DC and NYC’s TV sets with Maryland and Rutgers, the Big 12 can do the same with U of H. 
 

Even when the team has been really good, there hasn’t been much local attention. Ed Oliver was the last high profile recruit they landed. I just don’t see them as a good value add. 

The DMA helps, but success or brand helps more.   The basketball team is paying off.    How the hell is the football team so gawdawful?    I mean if UCF can pull in 4* recruiting classes, after Florida, Florida State, and Miami get their pick, why can't you in Houston?    

[LTtxfan 49144]

[royiv 9261]

1 hour ago, Hurtlocker said:

He's still pulling pretty good numbers for a mid team, including pulling over 3m against Colorado State.   Wonder what it will look like once his son and Hunter are gone.

I doubt Deion will stick around after his son and Hunter are gone.

[statsman 5451]

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/college-football-tv-ratings/
 
Brett Yormark must absolutely adore Deion Sanders. 
 
Decent ratings for Utah-OSU and KSU-BYU. 
 
Check out ASU-TT, TCU-SMU and UH-Cincy! That’s pretty bad. 
 
 

Edited September 26 by statsman

[royiv 9261]

9 minutes ago, statsman said:

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/college-football-tv-ratings/
 
Brett Yormark must absolutely adore Deion Sanders. 
 
Decent ratings for Utah-OSU and KSU-BYU. 
 
Check out ASU-TT, TCU-SMU and UH-Cincy! That’s pretty bad. 
 
 

TCU-SMU was on the ACC’s flagship CW Sports deal for which SMU has foregone any TV revenues.

[TKthunder2 4985]

Big 12 got a new deal with CBS for basketball.

https://awfulannouncing.com/cbs/big-12-multiyear-agreement-mens-college-basketball-games.html

[Al_4_ISU 12451]

9 hours ago, TKthunder2 said:

Big 12 got a new deal with CBS for basketball.

https://awfulannouncing.com/cbs/big-12-multiyear-agreement-mens-college-basketball-games.html

Really pumped about this.  CBS did the ISU/KU game in Hilton last year, and it was a stunning broadcast.

If some of our ESPN+ content gets farmed out to CBSSN that would be great too.  It's far and away the best broadcast of the "Ocho" layer sports channels.

['stache 21797]

I just hope it’s not a bunch of paramount + exclusives. I have espn+ in the Hulu/Disney package and I like it for OSU baseball and softball. I ain’t buying another fucking app especially for basketball, at least until Lutz shows if he can actually turn our shitass program around.

[closetojumping 62565]

11 hours ago, statsman said:

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/college-football-tv-ratings/
 
Brett Yormark must absolutely adore Deion Sanders. 
 
Decent ratings for Utah-OSU and KSU-BYU. 
 
Check out ASU-TT, TCU-SMU and UH-Cincy! That’s pretty bad. 
 
 

I’m kind of ignorant on some of this, but I read the Friday night numbers as really strong. Is that wrong? It seems like this could become a pretty big deal with the way Fox is handling it and the numbers following. Hell, the freaking late night game on the CW on Friday drew over 500k. 

Also, is there any way to get data regarding the Texas/ULM stream? I know it was off in the hinterlands of the CFB landscape, but I’m wondering if there was any kind of bump due to Manning’s first start. 

[statsman 5451]

3 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

I’m kind of ignorant on some of this, but I read the Friday night numbers as really strong. Is that wrong? It seems like this could become a pretty big deal with the way Fox is handling it and the numbers following. Hell, the freaking late night game on the CW on Friday drew over 500k. 

Also, is there any way to get data regarding the Texas/ULM stream? I know it was off in the hinterlands of the CFB landscape, but I’m wondering if there was any kind of bump due to Manning’s first start. 

I googled for the numbers, wondering the same, and couldn’t find them. 

[Al_4_ISU 12451]

36 minutes ago, 'stache said:

I just hope it’s not a bunch of paramount + exclusives. I have espn+ in the Hulu/Disney package and I like it for OSU baseball and softball. I ain’t buying another fucking app especially for basketball, at least until Lutz shows if he can actually turn our shitass program around.

The articles indicate the extra games will be on big CBS and CBSSN.

They want more college hoops and the Big 12 is the best college hoops conference.  They aren't doing this to push content onto an app.

[Hurtlocker 2212]

11 hours ago, statsman said:

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/college-football-tv-ratings/
 
Brett Yormark must absolutely adore Deion Sanders. 
 
Decent ratings for Utah-OSU and KSU-BYU. 
 
Check out ASU-TT, TCU-SMU and UH-Cincy! That’s pretty bad. 
 
 

Colorado has stupid numbers, only two teams match them this season: Georgia and ND.  They're still the belle of the ball whether its Prime or whatever.   The B12 has had far more respectable numbers so far than expected overall.   The concern prior to this year was could they pull 2m+ games without Texas or OU in them.   If you remember how they laid them out in previous years, the big slots were always Texas or OU vs someone else, so there weren't a lot of opportunities to tell.  I think what we're seeing is you're not going to see big brand 6m+ games that you see from the Michigan or Texas' of the world, but the two mill plus games are definitely not only achievable, but should be expected often, which should help their revenue numbers going forward.  In realignment I did a quick count of teams in conferences who played in 2m games this season:

https://www.surlyhorns.com/board/topic/25-realignment-talk-not-going-away/?do=findComment&comment=6485966

Which doesn't copy over well, so here it is again -  Week 4 data, #p4 teams in 2m+ audience games:

• ND - 3
• ACC - 7  
• B1G - 16
• B12 - 14
• SEC - 24

Fun Facts:

• 85% of the ACC's games on this list occurred in weeks 0/1.   The only one after was Tennessee/NCSt
• Ohio State/Marshal drew 3.96m,  Clemson/NCSt ended up with 1.95m.    Even Florida/MSU drew 2.64m on ESPN in the same slot
• Fox is winning on Fridays.   Kstate/Arizona drew 2.7m while Ill/Nebraska going to overtime punched up to 4.2m.   I think ESPN only had two 2m+ Friday games for the entire regular season last year (Kstate/OkSt and Colorado/Stanford), Fox has two in their first two outings.   Expect them to market this more.
• There have been eight 6m+ games so far, all involve the big boys: 
  • Week 1 - Miami/Florida - 6.35m
  • Week 1 - Clemson/Georgia - 7.58m
  • Week 1 - ND/A&M - 7.62M
  • Week 1 - USC/LSU - 8.62m
  • Week 2 - Texas/Michigan - 9.2m
  • Week 3 - Georgia/Kentucky - 6.6m
  • Week 4 - Tenn/OU - 6.27m
  • Week 4 - USC/Michigan - 6.32m

 

[closetohumping 17435]

Utah vs BYU gonna be huge

[oldhorn2 430]

On 9/24/2024 at 5:23 PM, Hurtlocker said:

The DMA helps, but success or brand helps more.   The basketball team is paying off.    How the hell is the football team so gawdawful?    I mean if UCF can pull in 4* recruiting classes, after Florida, Florida State, and Miami get their pick, why can't you in Houston?    

I doubt if UH can come even close to competing with NIL money. Their Alum base is like they are in witness protection. Any money they toss in goes to the BB team....at least thats my guess....

['stache 21797]

Cincy-UH drawing 195K viewers sounds high actually, or fairly impressive tbh.

[Dnaguy 11920]

1 hour ago, 'stache said:

I just hope it’s not a bunch of paramount + exclusives. I have espn+ in the Hulu/Disney package and I like it for OSU baseball and softball. I ain’t buying another fucking app especially for basketball, at least until Lutz shows if he can actually turn our shitass program around.

This deal isn’t the best… every so often it drops to $30, but this is how I get no commercial paramount +.

Sportsline membership gives you paramount + 

https://www.sportsline.com/join/?irgwc=1&cbsclick=UQv0PpXZrxyPRMbWK%3ARv4U%3AjUkCyP2wtgX4pUo0&vndid=10451&sharedid=&ftag=PPM-09-10aag1f&clickid=10451

 

[Hurtlocker 2212]

2 hours ago, 'stache said:

Cincy-UH drawing 195K viewers sounds high actually, or fairly impressive tbh.

Yeah shit games are still shit games.   And most you don't see because they aren't rated on the streaming or conference channels, besides BTN, but that gives a hint.   The bulk of the games fall in the 50-500k range, that's why they package them on channel that pay per month.

[Francisco 2.0 32389]

What could possibly go wrong.

https://www.kcur.org/sports/2024-09-26/72-hours-before-kickoff-ku-has-no-signed-contract-with-the-chiefs-to-play-at-arrowhead-stadium

 

The University of Kansas announced in January that it would play some of its home football games at Arrowhead Stadium. Since that time, KU has been negotiating with the Chiefs and hadn't reached an agreement three days before the game.
 

 

Quote

They’re painting a Jayhawk on the field at Arrowhead Stadium.

University of Kansas Athletics said it plans to be there Friday to prepare the press box for Saturday’s football game against TCU.

KU head coach Lance Leipold is looking forward to playing at the home of the Chiefs.

”Hopefully, (fans) show up, are energetic and can help us when we need them," Leipold said.

Here’s the rub: KU and the Chiefs have yet to sign a contract allowing the Jayhawks to play at Arrowhead

 

Spoiler

“It’s complex,” KU Athletics spokesperson Daniel Berk said.

Berk wouldn’t go into detail about what those complexities are, except to say insurance coverage is one of them.

KU announced on Jan. 30 that it would play its home football games in Kansas City while rebuilding Memorial Stadium in Lawrence for $450 million. The first two were at Children’s Mercy Park in Kansas City, Kansas. The rest will be played at Arrowhead.

The day after KU announced the games away from the home field, KCUR filed a Kansas Open Records Request for the contracts.

Before the Jayhawks opened the season against Lindenwood University in August, KU provided the contract with Sporting KC for use if its park.

But week after week in response to follow-up questions, KU kept sending emails from the Custodian of Public Records saying it had “no determinative response to offer you at this time” concerning the Arrowhead contract. Every email ended the same, “Thank you for your attention and patience.”

Then Wednesday, KU sent an email saying “the University of Kansas does not have a final executed agreement” for the games at Arrowhead. It promised to provide the contract as soon as it was signed and reviewed by the university’s lawyers.

Berk said not to worry.

“It’s been six months of complex communications, but we fully expect to have an agreement,” he told KCUR.

However complex the contract with the Chiefs might be, the one with Sporting is brief and simple. The “Letter of Agreement” is only four pages long. KU paid Sporting $100,000 in rent and another $150,000 for game day operations, according to the deal obtained through the open records request.

Sporting KC retained all parking and concession revenue and got 20% of KU merchandise revenue sold at the park. KU was also obligated to reimburse Sporting for “reasonable” and “documented” expenses to repair any damage to the field.

The Chiefs did not return an email seeking comment.

 

[TKthunder2 4985]

2 hours ago, Hurtlocker said:

Colorado has stupid numbers, only two teams match them this season: Georgia and ND.  They're still the belle of the ball whether its Prime or whatever.   The B12 has had far more respectable numbers so far than expected overall.   The concern prior to this year was could they pull 2m+ games without Texas or OU in them.   If you remember how they laid them out in previous years, the big slots were always Texas or OU vs someone else, so there weren't a lot of opportunities to tell.  I think what we're seeing is you're not going to see big brand 6m+ games that you see from the Michigan or Texas' of the world, but the two mill plus games are definitely not only achievable, but should be expected often, which should help their revenue numbers going forward.  In realignment I did a quick count of teams in conferences who played in 2m games this season:

https://www.surlyhorns.com/board/topic/25-realignment-talk-not-going-away/?do=findComment&comment=6485966

Which doesn't copy over well, so here it is again -  Week 4 data, #p4 teams in 2m+ audience games:

• ND - 3
• ACC - 7  
• B1G - 16
• B12 - 14
• SEC - 24

Fun Facts:

• 85% of the ACC's games on this list occurred in weeks 0/1.   The only one after was Tennessee/NCSt
• Ohio State/Marshal drew 3.96m,  Clemson/NCSt ended up with 1.95m.    Even Florida/MSU drew 2.64m on ESPN in the same slot
• Fox is winning on Fridays.   Kstate/Arizona drew 2.7m while Ill/Nebraska going to overtime punched up to 4.2m.   I think ESPN only had two 2m+ Friday games for the entire regular season last year (Kstate/OkSt and Colorado/Stanford), Fox has two in their first two outings.   Expect them to market this more.
• There have been eight 6m+ games so far, all involve the big boys: 
  • Week 1 - Miami/Florida - 6.35m
  • Week 1 - Clemson/Georgia - 7.58m
  • Week 1 - ND/A&M - 7.62M
  • Week 1 - USC/LSU - 8.62m
  • Week 2 - Texas/Michigan - 9.2m
  • Week 3 - Georgia/Kentucky - 6.6m
  • Week 4 - Tenn/OU - 6.27m
  • Week 4 - USC/Michigan - 6.32m

 

Colorado is what it is. You can’t derive value out of them long term for Colorado or the Big 12. When BY presents his numbers with the Prime years included in them the first thing the networks will do is strip them out or discard those years altogether because it’s not representative of the value you’re paying for in their new contract. Now if Prime stay and finds the next Travis Hunter and continues to draw 4million viewers against FCS teams and 3 million against G5 teams for years to come then they will count. But for now those just aren’t representative.

After 4 weeks, other than Colorado who accounted for every 3 million+ viewers thus far, the FOX games have driven 5 of the 10 2 million+ games. ABC 1, ESPN 1, CBS 2, NBC 1. Repeating myself but this exposure with FOX is the biggest advantage the Big 12 has. They should be doing everything they can to take advantage of it.

3 rivalry games account for that too placement on NBC/CBS, a matchup with the SEC got them on ABC. The traditional conference games will primarily end up on FOX and ESPN. The Big 12 should continue to pursue more rivalry OOC games. Bedlam, Border War, Backyard Brawl, etc would enhance and boost their profile. If the goal is a bigger TV deal next time around, this is a major opportunity toward that.

Teams with 2million+ games

Colorado: 4
Oklahoma St, Utah, Baylor: 2
ISU, KSU, AZ, WVU: 1

Nothing too shocking other than Baylor in this list (likely just because they played Colorado and Utah but facts are facts)

The “Late” window has been used 5 out of the 6 weeks scheduled and I expect this to be a common theme for the new Big 12 when the 4corner schools play a lack luster game at home. They pull a million or so which is a good way to prop up a below average game with inflated viewership to help the overall picture.

The Big 12 also has had 6 weeknight games (mostly Friday) with another scheduled for next week. Colorado’s kick off game pulled ridiculous numbers, but other than them AZ/KSU on FOX did a respectable 2.5 million while the other averaged about 1.14 million.

[Texas Wahoo 3389]

3 hours ago, Al_4_ISU said:

The articles indicate the extra games will be on big CBS and CBSSN.

They want more college hoops and the Big 12 is the best college hoops conference.  They aren't doing this to push content onto an app.

It looks like all 20 of the newly sublicensed games will be on CBSSN, while the six already agreed to will stay on CBS, at least according to Paramount.

https://www.paramountpressexpress.com/cbs-sports/shows/college-basketball/releases/?view=110338-cbs-sports-and-big-12-expand-partnership-with-multi-year-agreement-for-additional-mens-college-basketball-games

Quote

As part of its extensive regular-season schedule, CBS Sports already broadcasts a minimum of six Big 12 men’s college basketball games annually on CBS, with those games streaming live on Paramount+. This new agreement adds 20 games per year to air on CBS Sports Network to bring the total number of Big 12 men’s basketball games to at least 26 per season across CBS Sports platforms.

 

[Al_4_ISU 12451]

6 minutes ago, Texas Wahoo said:

It looks like all 20 of the newly sublicensed games will be on CBSSN, while the six already agreed to will stay on CBS, at least according to Paramount.

https://www.paramountpressexpress.com/cbs-sports/shows/college-basketball/releases/?view=110338-cbs-sports-and-big-12-expand-partnership-with-multi-year-agreement-for-additional-mens-college-basketball-games

 

Strongly prefer to it to ESPN+ or U

[Texas Wahoo 3389]

16 minutes ago, Al_4_ISU said:

Strongly prefer to it to ESPN+ or U

As long as you have cable (or a cable-like streaming serveice), it is probably better.  It looks like CBS Sports Network games are not on Paramount Plus, so if you don't have cable, it looks like you're out of luck.

[Al_4_ISU 12451]

2 minutes ago, Texas Wahoo said:

As long as you have cable (or a cable-like streaming serveice), it is probably better.  It looks like CBS Sports Network games are not on Paramount Plus, so if you don't have cable, it looks like you're out of luck.

YouTubeTV has it

[thunderlounge 7815]

5 hours ago, oldhorn2 said:

Their Alum base is like they are in witness protection.

Can you blame them?

[ajax 2607]

Good on the Mormons

[Hurtlocker 2212]

3 hours ago, TKthunder2 said:

Colorado is what it is. You can’t derive value out of them long term for Colorado or the Big 12. When BY presents his numbers with the Prime years included in them the first thing the networks will do is strip them out or discard those years altogether because it’s not representative of the value you’re paying for in their new contract. Now if Prime stay and finds the next Travis Hunter and continues to draw 4million viewers against FCS teams and 3 million against G5 teams for years to come then they will count. But for now those just aren’t representative.

After 4 weeks, other than Colorado who accounted for every 3 million+ viewers thus far, the FOX games have driven 5 of the 10 2 million+ games. ABC 1, ESPN 1, CBS 2, NBC 1. Repeating myself but this exposure with FOX is the biggest advantage the Big 12 has. They should be doing everything they can to take advantage of it.

3 rivalry games account for that too placement on NBC/CBS, a matchup with the SEC got them on ABC. The traditional conference games will primarily end up on FOX and ESPN. The Big 12 should continue to pursue more rivalry OOC games. Bedlam, Border War, Backyard Brawl, etc would enhance and boost their profile. If the goal is a bigger TV deal next time around, this is a major opportunity toward that.

Teams with 2million+ games

Colorado: 4
Oklahoma St, Utah, Baylor: 2
ISU, KSU, AZ, WVU: 1

Nothing too shocking other than Baylor in this list (likely just because they played Colorado and Utah but facts are facts)

The “Late” window has been used 5 out of the 6 weeks scheduled and I expect this to be a common theme for the new Big 12 when the 4corner schools play a lack luster game at home. They pull a million or so which is a good way to prop up a below average game with inflated viewership to help the overall picture.

The Big 12 also has had 6 weeknight games (mostly Friday) with another scheduled for next week. Colorado’s kick off game pulled ridiculous numbers, but other than them AZ/KSU on FOX did a respectable 2.5 million while the other averaged about 1.14 million.

That's basically my point.   Prior the argument was they were incapable to pull 2ms on their own because every major slot was Texas or OU vs someone.  Those Fox/ABC slots were always filled by and pulled from the big boys.  Now they have to fill them with someone else and they have to prove they can get 2m+ consistently.   A few will hit 1m, some will hit 3m, but the count is how many 2ms can you rack up.   They don't need every game to be killer, if they can average 1-2 per week, they're golden.    They don't have the properties to get to 6m, that's not their role.   Oregon and Washington and Wisconsin and Clemson and Miami and Ole Miss doesn't get there alone either, they need to play USC or Ohio State or Michigan or Florida or Georgia or Alabama to sniff that, just like the Big 12 teams needed to play Texas or Oklahoma to get there.       And, for them it doesn't matter the time slots, the B12 has to prove is they can produce in the ones they're placed, they're on a 4-year test, be it Friday, late night, Fox, ESPN, whatever.   Through three weeks the numbers show they are capable, sustainable is another thing all together.

And agree, they need to get on the preseason match up wagon, their W1 is terrible.   That's all that's floating the ACC at the moment are a few big games in week 1, the rest is a lot of steamers.   They more they show they can produce the more TV will match them up. 

I think we're talking different things on Colorado.   I never said they could build a contract off them, I said, right now, they're the belle of the Q rating ball.  There is no product in CFB driving more PR and more casual eyeballs for basically nothing, than Colorado, they're out Oregoning Oregon.   I'm not sure if it's totally Prime, like people love to hate various personalities, or if it is the NIL situation, but they are pulling stupid numbers in games they have no reason pulling.   They are pulling numbers against properties the biggest programs aren't even doing.    Sustainable?   No idea. what if Prime does stay for a decade, what if he leaves and they get someone normal, but they average 9.5 wins a year like the early 90s, what if he leaves and they go back to sucksville?  What would it look like if he stayed and they actually won?    Way too many variables.     They are doing something that I can't really find a historic comparison to, but it's not nothing.   They're kind of like the Wrexham of CFB right now and there is no way to guess what 4 years from now will look like.   If you asked me last year, I would have said the bubble already burst, but it hasn't.   Watch FX give them their own show.

[statsman 5451]

4 minutes ago, Hurtlocker said:

That's basically my point.   Prior the argument was they were incapable to pull 2ms on their own because every major slot was Texas or OU vs someone.  Those Fox/ABC slots were always filled by and pulled from the big boys.  Now they have to fill them with someone else and they have to prove they can get 2m+ consistently.   A few will hit 1m, some will hit 3m, but the count is how many 2ms can you rack up.   They don't need every game to be killer, if they can average 1-2 per week, they're golden.    They don't have the properties to get to 6m, that's not their role.   Oregon and Washington and Wisconsin and Clemson and Miami and Ole Miss doesn't get there alone either, they need to play USC or Ohio State or Michigan or Florida or Georgia or Alabama to sniff that, just like the Big 12 teams needed to play Texas or Oklahoma to get there.       And, for them it doesn't matter the time slots, the B12 has to prove is they can produce in the ones they're placed, they're on a 4-year test, be it Friday, late night, Fox, ESPN, whatever.   Through three weeks the numbers show they are capable, sustainable is another thing all together.

And agree, they need to get on the preseason match up wagon, their W1 is terrible.   That's all that's floating the ACC at the moment are a few big games in week 1, the rest is a lot of steamers.   They more they show they can produce the more TV will match them up. 

I think we're talking different things on Colorado.   I never said they could build a contract off them, I said, right now, they're the belle of the Q rating ball.  There is no product in CFB driving more PR and more casual eyeballs for basically nothing, than Colorado, they're out Oregoning Oregon.   I'm not sure if it's totally Prime, like people love to hate various personalities, or if it is the NIL situation, but they are pulling stupid numbers in games they have no reason pulling.   They are pulling numbers against properties the biggest programs aren't even doing.    Sustainable?   No idea. what if Prime does stay for a decade, what if he leaves and they get someone normal, but they average 9.5 wins a year like the early 90s, what if he leaves and they go back to sucksville?  What would it look like if he stayed and they actually won?    Way too many variables.     They are doing something that I can't really find a historic comparison to, but it's not nothing.   They're kind of like the Wrexham of CFB right now and there is no way to guess what 4 years from now will look like.   If you asked me last year, I would have said the bubble already burst, but it hasn't.   Watch FX give them their own show.

Great analysis, and it’s too bad the B12 didn’t figure this out years ago. 
 
KSU was the single worst program in America, the one that Mississippi State looked down on. Snyder got there and adopted a strategy of playing nothing but patsies in non-conference. He treated the games like the NFL pre-season (he wanted to polish his team’s proficiencies), but the games counted, so he wanted wins. 
 
In unequal revenue sharing, this wasn’t so bad. TV didn’t want those crappy games and his program didn’t profit financially from them. 
 
Then, every little program in the Big XII adopted that practice, AND they had equal revenue sharing. 
 
Yes, the B12 needs to be like the divorced spouse that addresses all the issues their ex had been bitching about and try better the next time. 

[TKthunder2 4985]

22 minutes ago, Hurtlocker said:

That's basically my point.   Prior the argument was they were incapable to pull 2ms on their own because every major slot was Texas or OU vs someone.  Those Fox/ABC slots were always filled by and pulled from the big boys.  Now they have to fill them with someone else and they have to prove they can get 2m+ consistently.   A few will hit 1m, some will hit 3m, but the count is how many 2ms can you rack up.   They don't need every game to be killer, if they can average 1-2 per week, they're golden.    They don't have the properties to get to 6m, that's not their role.   Oregon and Washington and Wisconsin and Clemson and Miami and Ole Miss doesn't get there alone either, they need to play USC or Ohio State or Michigan or Florida or Georgia or Alabama to sniff that, just like the Big 12 teams needed to play Texas or Oklahoma to get there.       And, for them it doesn't matter the time slots, the B12 has to prove is they can produce in the ones they're placed, they're on a 4-year test, be it Friday, late night, Fox, ESPN, whatever.   Through three weeks the numbers show they are capable, sustainable is another thing all together.

And agree, they need to get on the preseason match up wagon, their W1 is terrible.   That's all that's floating the ACC at the moment are a few big games in week 1, the rest is a lot of steamers.   They more they show they can produce the more TV will match them up. 

I think we're talking different things on Colorado.   I never said they could build a contract off them, I said, right now, they're the belle of the Q rating ball.  There is no product in CFB driving more PR and more casual eyeballs for basically nothing, than Colorado, they're out Oregoning Oregon.   I'm not sure if it's totally Prime, like people love to hate various personalities, or if it is the NIL situation, but they are pulling stupid numbers in games they have no reason pulling.   They are pulling numbers against properties the biggest programs aren't even doing.    Sustainable?   No idea. what if Prime does stay for a decade, what if he leaves and they get someone normal, but they average 9.5 wins a year like the early 90s, what if he leaves and they go back to sucksville?  What would it look like if he stayed and they actually won?    Way too many variables.     They are doing something that I can't really find a historic comparison to, but it's not nothing.   They're kind of like the Wrexham of CFB right now and there is no way to guess what 4 years from now will look like.   If you asked me last year, I would have said the bubble already burst, but it hasn't.   Watch FX give them their own show.

We’re not far off, I was mostly using your post as a way to post my own thoughts and musings.

 

I think our only disagreement is around the term second tier. I don’t think the Big12 has any that I would permanently put in that tier with Oregon and Auburn, but on the year to year metric I could make that concession speaking of relative attractiveness of a team in a specific week/season.

Last week Arkansas/Auburn on ESPN had 2.0 million viewers while Utah/Okie St got 2.1 million on OTA FOX. So a ranked undefeated v ranked undefeated over the air match up barely out drew an unranked one loss team v and unranked one loss team on basic cable.

By this metric I feel comfortable enough to say the brands of Aub+Ark > Utah+OkSt when you equailze the scenario/network/etc.

Which then feels odd to say they are both 2nd tier teams.

[Hurtlocker 2212]

5 hours ago, TKthunder2 said:

We’re not far off, I was mostly using your post as a way to post my own thoughts and musings.

 

I think our only disagreement is around the term second tier. I don’t think the Big12 has any that I would permanently put in that tier with Oregon and Auburn, but on the year to year metric I could make that concession speaking of relative attractiveness of a team in a specific week/season.

Last week Arkansas/Auburn on ESPN had 2.0 million viewers while Utah/Okie St got 2.1 million on OTA FOX. So a ranked undefeated v ranked undefeated over the air match up barely out drew an unranked one loss team v and unranked one loss team on basic cable.

By this metric I feel comfortable enough to say the brands of Aub+Ark > Utah+OkSt when you equailze the scenario/network/etc.

Which then feels odd to say they are both 2nd tier teams.

Yeah I'm with you, but....they are.    If you're not in that top group, you're second.    Even Auburn needs to play Alabama to pull huge numbers.   They don't pull 4m playing Holy Cross.   The only ones who do that are the ones who run the sport, the top tier.   If you're not in that, you're second.    I think where we're likely crossing hairs is the implication there is a third and forth.   I don't believe there really is.  Its just where in that scatterpoint you are in any given year or do you belong at all.  But the same argument can be made against the seconds in the B1G/SEC that can be made in the the old B12, can you pull the numbers when not playing the big hitters?

To your point above, I'm not sure rankings really matter this time of year, more good games and good fan bases.    We should expect those four teams to draw similar ratings, just like when Arkansas/OkSt played and got 2.8m.   Only real difference, it went to OT, which holds viewers longer, which increases ratings.   More competitive, higher games, will push ratings up a bit.      As the season progresses, record will push it up or down, some because of where they get placed and some because of interest.   And, for sake of argument, ESPN is a T1 property any longer.   or at least a T1a or something.   It pulls very similar numbers to ABC/Fox because of College Gameday, everyone knows there is a game on, and all the post season, including the playoffs, (except for the new games) are on ESPN.   It isn't T2 like the rest of cable.

 

[LTtxfan 49144]

7 hours ago, ajax said:

Good on the Mormons

Hell yeah!!!  Thx @ajax !!!

[Hurtlocker 2212]

6 hours ago, statsman said:

Great analysis, and it’s too bad the B12 didn’t figure this out years ago. 
 
KSU was the single worst program in America, the one that Mississippi State looked down on. Snyder got there and adopted a strategy of playing nothing but patsies in non-conference. He treated the games like the NFL pre-season (he wanted to polish his team’s proficiencies), but the games counted, so he wanted wins. 
 
In unequal revenue sharing, this wasn’t so bad. TV didn’t want those crappy games and his program didn’t profit financially from them. 
 
Then, every little program in the Big XII adopted that practice, AND they had equal revenue sharing. 
 
Yes, the B12 needs to be like the divorced spouse that addresses all the issues their ex had been bitching about and try better the next time. 

The B12 isn't the only conference that schedules bitches.   Texas has always scheduled well with 10+ P5 games on the schedule, many other B12 teams did this too.   There are some SEC and ACC programs who still don't get to 10 per year.    I think Miami has 9 and may play one ranked team all year.   Quick spot check...NCState is 9, Auburn is 9, arkansas is 9, etc.

Everyone tries to game the system and get their advantage.   Its who wins the press tour about it.

[TKthunder2 4985]

1 hour ago, Hurtlocker said:

Yeah I'm with you, but....they are.    If you're not in that top group, you're second.    Even Auburn needs to play Alabama to pull huge numbers.   They don't pull 4m playing Holy Cross.   The only ones who do that are the ones who run the sport, the top tier.   If you're not in that, you're second.    I think where we're likely crossing hairs is the implication there is a third and forth.   I don't believe there really is.  Its just where in that scatterpoint you are in any given year or do you belong at all.  But the same argument can be made against the seconds in the B1G/SEC that can be made in the the old B12, can you pull the numbers when not playing the big hitters?

To your point above, I'm not sure rankings really matter this time of year, more good games and good fan bases.    We should expect those four teams to draw similar ratings, just like when Arkansas/OkSt played and got 2.8m.   Only real difference, it went to OT, which holds viewers longer, which increases ratings.   More competitive, higher games, will push ratings up a bit.      As the season progresses, record will push it up or down, some because of where they get placed and some because of interest.   And, for sake of argument, ESPN is a T1 property any longer.   or at least a T1a or something.   It pulls very similar numbers to ABC/Fox because of College Gameday, everyone knows there is a game on, and all the post season, including the playoffs, (except for the new games) are on ESPN.   It isn't T2 like the rest of cable.

 

Yeah, I respect your takes on here, so we can just agree to disagree.

I doubt see any way shape or form Houston and Cincy are in the same category as Auburn or Oregon. I can buy Okie St and Utah when ranked are about equal to those teams when unranked.

I think you clearly have 3rd (Washington State) and 4th tiers (Sam Houston)

 

I agree ESPN is close but the numbers prove out that it is a step below the OTA channels. It’s the clear tier 2 but to your point there isn’t a close third.

Third is ESPN2, FS1, and now the CW apparently.

Fourth tier would be conference networks, ESPNU, and now apparently truTV.

Not sure how to count streaming since it’s not well tracked or reported.

[WBT 20561]

1 hour ago, Hurtlocker said:

Texas has always scheduled well with 10+ P5 games on the schedule

 Not anymore.  Thanks secsecsec!

[closetojumping 62565]

7 hours ago, WBT said:

 Not anymore.  Thanks secsecsec!

Texas isn’t the only team pushing for 9 conference games and you have to assume that wins out. 

That will put Texas back to 10 P4 games because they’re going to continue to schedule a tough non-con. 

Supposedly, the one thing Texas really is pushing is ending the FCS bullshit. The networks aren’t fans of those games either. ULM and Kent State aren’t big ratings draws, but they absolutely outperform nonsense like playing Mercer or Furman. 

[Huckleberry 32848]

10 hours ago, LTtxfan said:

Hell yeah!!!  Thx @ajax !!!

You understand that he gets a notification when you quote him, you don't have to also @ him, right? 

[Hurtlocker 2212]

8 hours ago, TKthunder2 said:

Yeah, I respect your takes on here, so we can just agree to disagree.

I doubt see any way shape or form Houston and Cincy are in the same category as Auburn or Oregon. I can buy Okie St and Utah when ranked are about equal to those teams when unranked.

I think you clearly have 3rd (Washington State) and 4th tiers (Sam Houston)

 

I agree ESPN is close but the numbers prove out that it is a step below the OTA channels. It’s the clear tier 2 but to your point there isn’t a close third.

Third is ESPN2, FS1, and now the CW apparently.

Fourth tier would be conference networks, ESPNU, and now apparently truTV.

Not sure how to count streaming since it’s not well tracked or reported.

Well Washington State and Sam Houston are not P4 anymore and I'd conceed to you that Houston and Cinci have more to earn than Oregon and Auburn have to lose.   However, the original point someone made was that if you're not in the top 12 or 14 I think we mapped out, you're basically still just the B12 or ACC, just in a different blazer.    And, media wise, that does tend to play out.   We could argue attendance and stadiums and sure, there are clear differences regionally on who cares about their sport.   It's obvious that some programs fill their stadiums and some don't.   And its obvious that some fill them to 50-60 and some fill them to 70-80.  That isn't really where I was getting at with this though, which is, after the giant brands that always bring big numbers, what's left?

What's left tends to be defined by fan passion, record, and who you play.   The knock against the Big 12 was they only drew big when they played Texas and Oklahoma, but, at the same time, their flagship slots were always filled by Texas and Oklahoma, so where was the data supposed to come from?    The same argument holds true with any conference though.   Auburn draws like shit, unless it plays someone big.    Does the stadium rock.   Fuck ya.   But if Auburn was bigger than B12/ACC caliber, that Arkansas game would have hit much higher than 2m.  Florida, who can't win a fight against a box full of kittens, drew 2.6m against Mississippi State on ESPN.

Looking at the top 25 games of last year, Auburn appeared once.    The Iron Bowl.    Oregon appeared twice, their top game was against Colorado in the regular season (so who pulled that interest, Nike or Prime?) and the second game was the Pac12 champ game against Washington, which is kind of free money.    Colorado appeared five times for fuck all knows why reasons, against Oregon, Colorado State, Nebraska, TCU, and USC, so it could be argued Colorado was the top media dog in the Duck's match up that elevated the numbers.

Last year representation in top 25 games, (this includes post season - all games over 7m):

• Six: Alabama
• Five:  Michigan, Colorado
• Four: Ohio State, Texas
• Demarcation line
• Three: Penn State (Ohio State, Michigan and the Peach Bowl against Ole Miss), Washington (all were in the post season)
• Two: Oregon (Colorado and the Pac12 Champ game), FSU (both were against SEC foes), LSU, Georgia  (Both of Georgia and LSU's big games were against FSU and Alabama)
• One: Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, TCU, Missouri, Nebraska, USC, Colorado State, Iowa, Auburn, Tennessee, Notre Dame, Ole Miss (all of these games were against someone above them in this list)

[thunderlounge 7815]

TL;DR

[TKthunder2 4985]

3 hours ago, Hurtlocker said:

Well Washington State and Sam Houston are not P4 anymore and I'd conceed to you that Houston and Cinci have more to earn than Oregon and Auburn have to lose.   However, the original point someone made was that if you're not in the top 12 or 14 I think we mapped out, you're basically still just the B12 or ACC, just in a different blazer.    And, media wise, that does tend to play out.   We could argue attendance and stadiums and sure, there are clear differences regionally on who cares about their sport.   It's obvious that some programs fill their stadiums and some don't.   And its obvious that some fill them to 50-60 and some fill them to 70-80.  That isn't really where I was getting at with this though, which is, after the giant brands that always bring big numbers, what's left?

What's left tends to be defined by fan passion, record, and who you play.   The knock against the Big 12 was they only drew big when they played Texas and Oklahoma, but, at the same time, their flagship slots were always filled by Texas and Oklahoma, so where was the data supposed to come from?    The same argument holds true with any conference though.   Auburn draws like shit, unless it plays someone big.    Does the stadium rock.   Fuck ya.   But if Auburn was bigger than B12/ACC caliber, that Arkansas game would have hit much higher than 2m.  Florida, who can't win a fight against a box full of kittens, drew 2.6m against Mississippi State on ESPN.

Looking at the top 25 games of last year, Auburn appeared once.    The Iron Bowl.    Oregon appeared twice, their top game was against Colorado in the regular season (so who pulled that interest, Nike or Prime?) and the second game was the Pac12 champ game against Washington, which is kind of free money.    Colorado appeared five times for fuck all knows why reasons, against Oregon, Colorado State, Nebraska, TCU, and USC, so it could be argued Colorado was the top media dog in the Duck's match up that elevated the numbers.

Last year representation in top 25 games, (this includes post season - all games over 7m):

• Six: Alabama
• Five:  Michigan, Colorado
• Four: Ohio State, Texas
• Demarcation line
• Three: Penn State (Ohio State, Michigan and the Peach Bowl against Ole Miss), Washington (all were in the post season)
• Two: Oregon (Colorado and the Pac12 Champ game), FSU (both were against SEC foes), LSU, Georgia  (Both of Georgia and LSU's big games were against FSU and Alabama)
• One: Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, TCU, Missouri, Nebraska, USC, Colorado State, Iowa, Auburn, Tennessee, Notre Dame, Ole Miss (all of these games were against someone above them in this list)

I don’t disagree with the analysis but I feel like including conference championship games and post season bowl/playoff games skews the data even more significantly toward those having good seasons. I assume your just referencing the top 25 chart on sportmediawatch, but the post season significantly skews our success criteria.

Oregon/Washington drew 7 million and was the most watched game of the week during the regular season. Auburn was the number 2 game of the week twice last year against UGA and Bama drawing more than 6 million each time. All of these examples were overall top 15 games out of the 13 week regular cfb seasons.

For the Auburn example you could counter that they only draw because they played Bama/UGA and but Kentucky DID NOT draw 7 million playing those same teams. This to make shows there is a clear distinction from Auburn and Kentucky which is why I separate them into a different tiers based out their outcome driven values.

I typically consider 5 million+ viewers to be a major indicator of your program/year. Only 32 games pulled 5 million+ last year. Sure their are a few outliers like TCU, Colorado St, Duke, Maryland, and Georgia Tech where the Colorado or a power program is carrying most of the load, but in general those games are between teams in the top tier or one clearly in the elite of your second tier.

[Funk Doctor Spock 12178]

No one cares about the Big 12 other than their members, and a few games like Utah, CU, and occasionally Okie Lite. Maybe even UCF. Other than that, the conference is a dumpster fire. 

[Zeus 6014]

[Hurtlocker 2212]

On 9/27/2024 at 1:56 PM, TKthunder2 said:

I don’t disagree with the analysis but I feel like including conference championship games and post season bowl/playoff games skews the data even more significantly toward those having good seasons. I assume your just referencing the top 25 chart on sportmediawatch, but the post season significantly skews our success criteria.

Oregon/Washington drew 7 million and was the most watched game of the week during the regular season. Auburn was the number 2 game of the week twice last year against UGA and Bama drawing more than 6 million each time. All of these examples were overall top 15 games out of the 13 week regular cfb seasons.

For the Auburn example you could counter that they only draw because they played Bama/UGA and but Kentucky DID NOT draw 7 million playing those same teams. This to make shows there is a clear distinction from Auburn and Kentucky which is why I separate them into a different tiers based out their outcome driven values.

I typically consider 5 million+ viewers to be a major indicator of your program/year. Only 32 games pulled 5 million+ last year. Sure their are a few outliers like TCU, Colorado St, Duke, Maryland, and Georgia Tech where the Colorado or a power program is carrying most of the load, but in general those games are between teams in the top tier or one clearly in the elite of your second tier.

I don't disagree and that's why I highlighted those games as being skewed, but I didn't feel like doing an entire season review either.    It allowed a quicker breakdown to show where big numbers are pulled.   The top 25 is 7m+, you're not going to see a ton of different names going to 5m and, to your point, its only 7 more games.   

[Francisco 2.0 32389]

https://awfulannouncing.com/college-football/big-12-hate-watch-texas-oklahoma-problem.html

 

Quote

As we settle into the new normal of a twelve-team playoff and a shaken-up conference membership structure, a notable but not unexpected flaw of the Big 12 has emerged.

The Texas- and Oklahoma-less conference doesn’t have a historical powerhouse that fans will go out of their way to hate-watch when it seems like they’re going to lose.

If you asked fans of some of the biggest college football fanbases (Texas, Ohio State, Notre Dame, Alabama, Michigan, Georgia, Florida State, etc.), “Which teams do you go out of your way to watch lose?” you’d probably get back a list that includes all of those aforementioned teams.

 

Quote

It’s not just the major fanbases that root against college football’s upper crust. We ALL do. That’s a major part of being a college football fan.

Pro sports don’t have “upset alert” notifications during regular season games. Most college football fans’ Saturdays consist of watching their team and watching one or two big games not involving their team. However, it also includes flipping around to see if any of the Goliaths of college football are flirting with an unexpected loss.

And on most Saturdays, we get one or two of these satisfying upsets.

 

Spoiler

I attended Ohio State’s 35-7 win over Iowa this past weekend. During the game, you could feel the stadium gravitate towards the news that Alabama was on the ropes to Vanderbilt. The cell network within the stadium seemed to crash when that score was shared with the crowd. Stepping into my Uber after the game, Alabama’s perilous situation was the first thing the driver mentioned. He had the game on the radio and I did him one better by getting it on my phone for all to enjoy.

Hours later, highly ranked Tennessee, Michigan, and USC all went down in exciting fashion with Miami barely escaping the same fate. So much delight was taken in these developments because being a hater of teams, coaches, and fanbases is core to a college football fan’s DNA.

People were interested in these podcasts

That’s where the Big 12’s problem is. Which conference member would you tune in to watch lose a game?

I know the obvious answer is Colorado, but at the end of last year, nobody was watching the Buffaloes lose. There are strong cases to be made that Deion Sanders will not be there within five years, one way or another. Would you still hate-watch Colorado without him coaching there? Would you even care about Colorado?

A trio of Colorado games have registered as the conference’s most-watched games so far, with Week 5’s Colorado-UCF getting 4.17 million viewers, Week 2’s Colorado-Nebraska getting 5.67 million viewers, and Week 1’s Colorado-NDSU getting 4.76 million viewers.

While these are impressive audiences, they are still a good deal off from the 6-10 million range that some of the largest Big Ten and SEC games routinely get. It’s early and conference play is just getting underway, but no game between two Big 12 teams is among the top 20 games this year.

This past weekend, four college football games garnered over 4 million viewers. The Big 12’s most-watched game got just 1.51 million.

When the smoke clears on this season, I’m not sure any of the top 25 regular season games will include a Big 12 team and no Big 12 conference game may crack the top 40. While that might be a strong proclamation, you tell me which one of these games over the next three weeks you’ll be going out of your way to watch.

The Big 12 will get at least one team, if not two, into the College Football Playoff. For most fans, it won’t matter who emerges. Utah? BYU? Kansas State? Oklahoma State? Colorado?  Sure…. whatever. People aren’t going to flip away from Georgia, Clemson, Ohio State, Texas, and Penn State to prioritize watching how these games play out.

The hate and interest aren’t there like it was when Texas and Oklahoma were around. Those schools had enough history and, by extension, grating fanbases that earn that level of hate that interests the college football masses. The most-watched Big 12 games from years past were not only highly watched because Oklahoma and Texas fans tuned in, but other fans tuned in to see which scrappy Big 12 program would knock those Goliaths off.

Now it’s just David vs. David. That’s not enough to stand out.

Look, all of the current Big 12 teams are fine and, if pressed, I could think of notable grievances about many of them. But ultimately, they haven’t had the level of success that triggers hate-watching at scale to drive TV ratings. This is a collection of generally good but not championship-winning teams. They, along with their fans, have not been annoying enough to join the fraternity of successful teams that we all hate together.

Perhaps in a decade, Utah or Iowa State will ascend to powerhouse status and the haters will follow. Until then, the Big 12 offers solid football on mostly second-tier channels and time slot windows, which result in second-tier national discussion and coverage. The Big 12 outmaneuvered the Pac 12 and will live on, but their place in the college football world is pretty clear.

They aren’t relevant enough to hate. While that sounds good, it’s actually bad for business.

 

[Deej 76755]

1 hour ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

Which conference member would you tune in to watch lose a game

Trick question. They are all losers.

[Crockett 490]

 

[Ghost of LL 15531]

On 10/11/2024 at 8:21 PM, Francisco 2.0 said:

https://awfulannouncing.com/college-football/big-12-hate-watch-texas-oklahoma-problem.html

 

 

 

  Hide contents

I attended Ohio State’s 35-7 win over Iowa this past weekend. During the game, you could feel the stadium gravitate towards the news that Alabama was on the ropes to Vanderbilt. The cell network within the stadium seemed to crash when that score was shared with the crowd. Stepping into my Uber after the game, Alabama’s perilous situation was the first thing the driver mentioned. He had the game on the radio and I did him one better by getting it on my phone for all to enjoy.

Hours later, highly ranked Tennessee, Michigan, and USC all went down in exciting fashion with Miami barely escaping the same fate. So much delight was taken in these developments because being a hater of teams, coaches, and fanbases is core to a college football fan’s DNA.

People were interested in these podcasts

That’s where the Big 12’s problem is. Which conference member would you tune in to watch lose a game?

I know the obvious answer is Colorado, but at the end of last year, nobody was watching the Buffaloes lose. There are strong cases to be made that Deion Sanders will not be there within five years, one way or another. Would you still hate-watch Colorado without him coaching there? Would you even care about Colorado?

A trio of Colorado games have registered as the conference’s most-watched games so far, with Week 5’s Colorado-UCF getting 4.17 million viewers, Week 2’s Colorado-Nebraska getting 5.67 million viewers, and Week 1’s Colorado-NDSU getting 4.76 million viewers.

While these are impressive audiences, they are still a good deal off from the 6-10 million range that some of the largest Big Ten and SEC games routinely get. It’s early and conference play is just getting underway, but no game between two Big 12 teams is among the top 20 games this year.

This past weekend, four college football games garnered over 4 million viewers. The Big 12’s most-watched game got just 1.51 million.

When the smoke clears on this season, I’m not sure any of the top 25 regular season games will include a Big 12 team and no Big 12 conference game may crack the top 40. While that might be a strong proclamation, you tell me which one of these games over the next three weeks you’ll be going out of your way to watch.

The Big 12 will get at least one team, if not two, into the College Football Playoff. For most fans, it won’t matter who emerges. Utah? BYU? Kansas State? Oklahoma State? Colorado?  Sure…. whatever. People aren’t going to flip away from Georgia, Clemson, Ohio State, Texas, and Penn State to prioritize watching how these games play out.

The hate and interest aren’t there like it was when Texas and Oklahoma were around. Those schools had enough history and, by extension, grating fanbases that earn that level of hate that interests the college football masses. The most-watched Big 12 games from years past were not only highly watched because Oklahoma and Texas fans tuned in, but other fans tuned in to see which scrappy Big 12 program would knock those Goliaths off.

Now it’s just David vs. David. That’s not enough to stand out.

Look, all of the current Big 12 teams are fine and, if pressed, I could think of notable grievances about many of them. But ultimately, they haven’t had the level of success that triggers hate-watching at scale to drive TV ratings. This is a collection of generally good but not championship-winning teams. They, along with their fans, have not been annoying enough to join the fraternity of successful teams that we all hate together.

Perhaps in a decade, Utah or Iowa State will ascend to powerhouse status and the haters will follow. Until then, the Big 12 offers solid football on mostly second-tier channels and time slot windows, which result in second-tier national discussion and coverage. The Big 12 outmaneuvered the Pac 12 and will live on, but their place in the college football world is pretty clear.

They aren’t relevant enough to hate. While that sounds good, it’s actually bad for business.

 

I guess to precisely that point, . . . I was looking at the schedule of weekday games this week, because those are often a lot of fun and I like having them in the background while I do other shit around the house after work.  And so I see Okie State at BYU on Friday.  And it occurs to me . . . I don't have the first fucking clue what Okie State's record is.  Are they any good?  Are they terrible?  Is Coach Whatshisface on the hotseat?  

I have no clue.  Do any of you?

And what about Tech.  Or Baylor.  Or TCU.  Ok--I know TCU got its shit pushed in by SMU, and that was awesome.  But apart from that?  Absolutely no fucking clue.

God, I love this post-Big12 reality in which not only do I not have to care about those programs; I'm blissfully unaware that they even exist.

[WBT 20561]

6 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

And it occurs to me . . . I don't have the first fucking clue what Okie State's record is.  Are they any good?  Are they terrible?  Is Coach Whatshisface on the hotseat?  

I have no clue.  Do any of you?

And what about Tech.  Or Baylor.  Or TCU.  Ok--I know TCU got its shit pushed in by SMU, and that was awesome.  But apart from that?  Absolutely no fucking clue.

Yes, I'm a college football fan.  Okie State and TCU are having rough years.  After almost losing to Abilene fucking Christian, Tech has somehow only lost 1 game.  BYU and Iowa State are undefeated.