Rockets vs Warriors

[MNLonghornFUKM 8817]

lmao @ joe johnson

[Stella Link 534]

On to game 4

[Patrick Bateman 3911]

GSW with the 3 Center lineup is hilarious..... Javale!!!!  He's like a modern day Kareem!

[MNLonghornFUKM 8817]

lulz swaggy P launching a contested 26 footer  with 19 seconds on the shot clock and complaining he was fouled

[Brothahorn 10087]

Wow. That was uglee.

[immortal13 4059]

57 minutes ago, texasstrong12 said:

Once the Rockets win a game in Oracle I'll think this is a series. Until then, more of the same. 

Good call

[immortal13 4059]

40 minutes ago, ernest_t_bass said:

Is there a more unlikeable douchebag in the NBA than Steph Curry?  He's worse than Draymond, and that says a ton.

Yeah, his name is Lebron

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

Getting a little tired of blowouts.  The only people that like blowouts are the winning teams fans.

[aggie08 21496]

Just now, dingleberryswitzer said:

Getting a little tired of blowouts.  The only people that like blowouts are the winning teams fans.

Unfortunately, it's only going to get worse going forward with the amount of 3's teams will continue to take. When one team's off from deep (and layups), and the other isn't, blowouts are inevitable.

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

48 minutes ago, ernest_t_bass said:

Is there a more unlikeable douchebag in the NBA than Steph Curry?  He's worse than Draymond, and that says a ton.

He's a cocky little bastard for sure but hes way down the list of unlikable.    He also seems to have a chip in his shoulder for no reason. 

[TtomTerrific 200]

15 minutes ago, immortal13 said:

Yeah, his name is Lebron

and Ginobli 

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

16 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Unfortunately, it's only going to get worse going forward with the amount of 3's teams will continue to take. When one team's off from deep (and layups), and the other isn't, blowouts are inevitable.

Yea but I'll still watch because a 20 point lead late in the 3rd isn't a guaranteed win anymore.  When a team closes that 20 point gap its amazing.  When it ballons to 40 it's annoying.

[hobbes2702 13032]

15 minutes ago, dingleberryswitzer said:

He's a cocky little bastard for sure but hes way down the list of unlikable.    He also seems to have a chip in his shoulder for no reason. 

He has a chip on his shoulder because no one thought he would cut it in the NBA.

[Eskimohorn 5633]

He has a chip on his shoulder because no one thought he would cut it in the NBA.

He was the 7th overall pick in the draft.

[hobbes2702 13032]

Just now, Eskimohorn said:

 

He was the 7th overall pick in the draft.

 

Fair. I overstepped in phrasing. People certainly doubted him going into that draft.

[texasstrong12 4668]

I can understand why Curry is cocky. 

Curry was the #256 player coming out of HS, a lot of people said he would be a failure in the NBA when he was drafted, and then a lot of people said he was done because of injury issues. 

Curry has a "chip on his shoulder" because people keep doubting him. 

Edited May 21, 2018 by texasstrong12

[Dutchrudder 11137]

3 hours ago, texasstrong12 said:

Curry was the #256 player coming out of HS, a lot of people said he would be a failure in the NBA when he was drafted, and then a lot of people said he was done because of injury issues. 

The Timberwolves got to declare it twice!

[texasstrong12 4668]

5 hours ago, MNLonghornFUKM said:

lulz swaggy P launching a contested 26 footer  with 19 seconds on the shot clock and complaining he was fouled

Swaggy P has his normal moments but I've actually been impressed with him this series. Swaggy P has been really good defensively when he's played. I didn't know he had that in his game. 

Swaggy P was +20 tonight (7 points higher than any bench player that played) and I'm not even shocked by that. 

The Warriors should probably play Swaggy P more. He's pretty much locked down CP3 with his defense. 

 

Edited May 21, 2018 by texasstrong12

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

Not saying you're wrong about swaggy , but using +/- in a blowout is sort of meaningless.  

[dingleberryswitzer 2724]

8 hours ago, hobbes2702 said:

He has a chip on his shoulder because no one thought he would cut it in the NBA.

I guess he is the least respected two time mvp out there.

[d2o 1602]

57 minutes ago, dingleberryswitzer said:

I guess he is the least respected two time mvp out there.

He gets a LOT of benefit of the doubt.    Whenever he plays poorly we see a lot of questioning if he is hurt.   Then he plays like last night and proves that he isn't then those poor games seem to be completely forgotten.

[Pam Cummings 9640]

"Not a juggernaut". You know you're a fag when you're having to downplay how good your team is.

Edited May 21, 2018 by Pam Cummings

[aggie08 21496]

33 minutes ago, d2o said:

He gets a LOT of benefit of the doubt.    Whenever he plays poorly we see a lot of questioning if he is hurt.   Then he plays like last night and proves that he isn't then those poor games seem to be completely forgotten.

I agree that it's stupid, especially this year, when he wasn't rushed back onto the court. But I have no idea how other superstars would be treated if they came back from significant injury in the middle of the playoffs. It's a pretty rare occurrence.

On the other hand, he hasn't quite been able to shake off the playoff choker label, despite only having one truly poor series in the '16 Finals. He's been terrific in almost all others for 6 years now. Even the other two series that he gets knocked for (the '15 Finals and '16 WCF), he was absolutely lights out for the final 3 games of each, when they needed him the most. It only took LeBron one year to shake off the Dallas series (for most people not named Skip); Steph hasn't gotten that benefit of the doubt yet.

[Thatguy 8686]

15 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

I agree that it's stupid, especially this year, when he wasn't rushed back onto the court. But I have no idea how other superstars would be treated if they came back from significant injury in the middle of the playoffs. It's a pretty rare occurrence.

On the other hand, he hasn't quite been able to shake off the playoff choker label, despite only having one truly poor series in the '16 Finals. He's been terrific in almost all others for 6 years now. Even the other two series that he gets knocked for (the '15 Finals and '16 WCF), he was absolutely lights out for the final 3 games of each, when they needed him the most. It only took LeBron one year to shake off the Dallas series (for most people not named Skip); Steph hasn't gotten that benefit of the doubt yet.

    I disagree at least on this board. All I hear around here is Steph was hurt for the 16 Finals, not that he was a choker. Seems to be the default whenever he has a bad game. Last year he was good in game one and 5, but the three in the middle he was mediocre at best. Cleveland pretty much turned him into a volume shooter. One game in there he shot like a bazillion free throws to get his numbers up, but the shooting was awful. I personally think he is a great shooter, but like most great shooter's playoff level defense affects their game.

[aggie08 21496]

1 hour ago, Thatguy said:

    I disagree at least on this board. All I hear around here is Steph was hurt for the 16 Finals, not that he was a choker. Seems to be the default whenever he has a bad game. Last year he was good in game one and 5, but the three in the middle he was mediocre at best. Cleveland pretty much turned him into a volume shooter. One game in there he shot like a bazillion free throws to get his numbers up, but the shooting was awful. I personally think he is a great shooter, but like most great shooter's playoff level defense affects their game.

Uh, that game, Game 2, where he was padding his stats with free throws, he also put up a 32 point triple-double, so he's doing a little more out there than just shooting.  Other than Game 4, when the entire team was awful, Game 2 was his worst shooting night, and he was 7-17 (4-11).  Not great, but not terrible.  His numbers for the '17 Finals were 27, 9, and 8.  What else do you want from your point guard?

In last year's playoffs on the whole, he averaged 28, 7, and 6 on 48%/42%/90% shooting with a +20.6 on/off net rating (better than his regular season numbers in every category).  That's a far cry from being a volume shooter.

His career playoff numbers are 26, 6, and 5 on 46%/41%/89% shooting; for comparison, his regular season career numbers are 23, 7, and 4 on 48/44/90 shooting.

 

For the record, I do think that they rushed him back in 2016, and he never totally got right.  He hardly ever drove to the basket that entire postseason and looked tentative, even when he had an obvious mismatch; this time, he's putting Capela and Harden on skates at will.  BUT, he was out there, and he made about a billion mental mistakes in the '16 Finals that had nothing to do with injury, so he doesn't get a pass.  He was really, really bad for all but games 2 and 4 and deserved all the criticism that he received.

Edited May 21, 2018 by aggie08

[Orca of Peace 109]

i'm getting tired of the GS dynasty. Our only hope is KL to Philly or Bron to Houston. Make it happen Surly!

[angryhomer 98]

12 hours ago, immortal13 said:

Yeah, his name is Lebron

Be careful there.  You might be cheering for him next year.

[aggie08 21496]

Speaking of guys coming back from significant injury mid-playoffs , what's the inside word on Mbah a Moute?  Is there anything still physically limiting him, or is it all mental at this point? From linchpin of that defense to completely unplayable.  Sucks to see. 

[pacman 7355]

3 hours ago, dingleberryswitzer said:

I guess he is the least respected two time mvp out there.

It's a hard knock life for a former NBA player's son...that silver spoon doesn't move itself

[aggie08 21496]

51 minutes ago, pacman said:

It's a hard knock life for a former NBA player's son...that silver spoon doesn't move itself

I wonder how LeBron's kid is going to be treated if he makes the league.  Something tells me not even close to the same.  Players seem to be very selective [read: petty] in deciding when being from the suburbs or a rich kid matters. 

[Patrick Bateman 3911]

5 hours ago, dingleberryswitzer said:

Not saying you're wrong about swaggy , but using +/- in a blowout is sort of meaningless.  

He was like +8 in the first half too.  It's funny, I think we're more astounded because it's Swaggy P not because of the production.  I mean really he's only shot well (6-14 from 3) but he has 0 turnovers and only taken 1 or 2 smh Swaggy P shots and as 12 pointed out he's been giving effort on defense.  It's like when Javale McGee plays well.  Both are such knuckleheads, you're waiting for the other shoe to drop but he's probably been their bench player, maybe Livingston although he was sort of invisible the first two games.... They have to get scoring off the bench somehow... Ha, ha, ha.... Swaggy P.  Hilarious.  

To keep it topical..... Interesting Kerr went away from David West, venerable veteran, in game 3.  No minutes last night, not even in scrub time (Kerr probably didn't want to disrespect him).  They went with Jordan Bell, who is far more athletic and bouncy.  I thought Bell played pretty well although he's very green.

 

[Patrick Bateman 3911]

31 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

I wonder how LeBron's kid is going to be treated if he makes the league.  Something tells me not even close to the same.  Players seem to be very selective [read: petty] in deciding when being from the suburbs or a rich kid matters. 

Was Kobe given this much shit?  Or is this a skin color issue?

[GotThatFire 166]

14 hours ago, dingleberryswitzer said:

   He also seems to have a chip in his shoulder for no reason. 

You know what that usually means...

[MNLonghornFUKM 8817]

i'm getting tired of the GS dynasty. Our only hope is KL to Philly or Bron to Houston. Make it happen Surly!

I bet the NBA just loves the fact that fans are just going to start saying "barring 2 ACL tears to the right players, why am I spending 75/ticket for a family of 4 when the game doesn't matter?

Especially when a 65 win team is just lost by 40

[Thatguy 8686]

3 hours ago, aggie08 said:

Uh, that game, Game 2, where he was padding his stats with free throws, he also put up a 32 point triple-double, so he's doing a little more out there than just shooting.  Other than Game 4, when the entire team was awful, Game 2 was his worst shooting night, and he was 7-17 (4-11).  Not great, but not terrible.  His numbers for the '17 Finals were 27, 9, and 8.  What else do you want from your point guard?

In last year's playoffs on the whole, he averaged 28, 7, and 6 on 48%/42%/90% shooting with a +20.6 on/off net rating (better than his regular season numbers in every category).  That's a far cry from being a volume shooter.

His career playoff numbers are 26, 6, and 5 on 46%/41%/89% shooting; for comparison, his regular season career numbers are 23, 7, and 4 on 48/44/90 shooting.

 

For the record, I do think that they rushed him back in 2016, and he never totally got right.  He hardly ever drove to the basket that entire postseason and looked tentative, even when he had an obvious mismatch; this time, he's putting Capela and Harden on skates at will.  BUT, he was out there, and he made about a billion mental mistakes in the '16 Finals that had nothing to do with injury, so he doesn't get a pass.  He was really, really bad for all but games 2 and 4 and deserved all the criticism that he received.

Bro, during that 3 game stretch I am talking about Steph was under 40% from the field in both 2's and 3's, and averaged 4 turnovers a game. That is the epitome of a volume shooter. I would let him score 60 if he was going to do it at a 38% clip. Lucky for GSW Durant was mauling Cav defenders.

[angryhomer 98]

15 hours ago, immortal13 said:

Yeah, his name is Lebron

Pussy can't take the truth?  Or just being a pussy for the sake of being a pussy, pussy?

Edited May 21, 2018 by angryhomer

[aggie08 21496]

43 minutes ago, Thatguy said:

Bro, during that 3 game stretch I am talking about Steph was under 40% from the field in both 2's and 3's, and averaged 4 turnovers a game. That is the epitome of a volume shooter. I would let him score 60 if he was going to do it at a 38% clip. Lucky for GSW Durant was mauling Cav defenders.

You are aware how small sample sizes work, right? 

One terrible game makes it almost impossible for anyone to reach their usual percentages in a 3-game window (which I why I zoomed out and included the entire postseason).

He went 32, 11, 10 in Game 2 on 7-17 (4-11), and 26, 8, 13 on 8-19 (5-9) in Game 3 (45% from 3 in those two games, hooray small sample sizes!) before the Game 4 letdown (when the series was already effectively over).  If those are considered his volume shooting, mediocre games, I think they'll fucking take it.

I know he's a victim of his own success, but shooting 50%/45% on 2's/3's with the sheer amount of threes that he takes isn't fucking normal.  Every other player who has ever lived would kill for his playoff 46%/41% "dip" in shooting if they were taking 10 threes a game. 

 

Edited May 21, 2018 by aggie08

[immortal13 4059]

8 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

You are aware how small sample sizes work, right? 

One terrible game makes it almost impossible for anyone to reach their usual percentages in a 3-game window (which I why I zoomed out and included the entire postseason).

He went 32, 11, 10 in Game 2 on 7-17 (4-11), and 26, 8, 13 on 8-19 (5-9) in Game 3 (45% from 3 in those two games, hooray small sample sizes!) before the Game 4 letdown (when the series was already effectively over).  If those are considered his volume shooting, mediocre games, I think they'll fucking take it.

 

Dude, everybody knows Curry is just a volume shooter.

[d2o 1602]

3 hours ago, pacman said:

It's a hard knock life for a former NBA player's son...that silver spoon doesn't move itself

yeah I don't really think him being son of a former player matters.    And this notion that he is disrespected is nuts.   He gets coddled and has fewer expectations than I have ever seen a two time MVP get.

[Patrick Bateman 3911]

Curry had his best playoff run last year and was pretty awesome.  He simply paled in comparison to KD in the Finals but he was damn good in the series and the entire run. 

In 2016 he was still pretty good but was poor in comparison to his regular season.  There was a significant drop off from his regular season.

In 2015, he again was good but was somewhere between his 2016 and 2017 runs in the playoffs, but it was a drop off from his regular season and the delta between Lebron and the MVP Curry was significant and obvious.

Before those years, he was always good but yes skewed towards more of a volume scorer who hadn't put it together yet.  His playoffs were also significant drop offs from his regular seasons.  

[Dutchrudder 11137]

I have never heard anyone call Curry a "choker" as in a habitual one. There are definitely those who would say he choked away Game 7 in 2016 with turnovers and getting D'd up by Kevin Love in crunch time. Member this?

 

[Vic Mackey 47019]

Harden is one of the worst defenders I have seen. He should be embarrassed about last night. Rockets seemed to quit during that game. Harden gave little effort on the defensive end.

Also, just another blowouts in these shitty playoffs. Has every game of these conference finals been a blowout? 

[MNLonghornFUKM 8817]

Yes. I miss the Milwaukee Boston series.

[aggie08 21496]

8 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

Curry had his best playoff run last year and was pretty awesome.  He simply paled in comparison to KD in the Finals but he was damn good in the series and the entire run. 

In 2016 he was still pretty good but was poor in comparison to his regular season.  There was a significant drop off from his regular season.

In 2015, he again was good but was somewhere between his 2016 and 2017 runs in the playoffs, but it was a drop off from his regular season and the delta between Lebron and the MVP Curry was significant and obvious.

Before those years, he was always good but yes skewed towards more of a volume scorer who hadn't put it together yet.  His playoffs were also significant drop offs from his regular seasons.  

Agreed.  Though, I think he was much better in 2015 than the fan's/media's collective memory of him.  He averaged 28/6/5 on 46/42 shooting.  He's remembered for "struggling" in the Finals, but that was really only one game: his nightmarish Game 2 where he was 5-23 (2-15), and the Delly "Curry stopper" narrative stupidly took hold.  The other 5 games he shifted between good and exceptional.  He only had one "holy shit" game (37 in game 5), but part of that was realizing around game 4 that, rather than trying to fight through the constant trapping, he could just give it up, and the Warriors would have a 4-on-3 literally every time down (enter Dray and Iggy).  If they weren't going to give the Finals' MVP to a player from the losing team, it was a joke that they gave it to someone other than Steph, as fun as the Iggy story was.

Those first two pre-Kerr postseasons were all Steph all the time.  They fell apart without him on the court to LeBron levels.  They had Jarrett Jack, the occasional Klay or Barnes spot-up in Mark Jackson's archaic offense, and that's about it.  Still managed to beat a 57 win Denver team, and gave San Antonio their only two losses in the Western Conference Playoffs on a bum ankle.  That's about as close as he's ever been to being quantified a volume shooter. 

But what qualifies as a volume shooter? Even in those first two playoffs, he still shot around 44%/40%.  Those are better than any regular season numbers that Dame Lillard--expected first-team All-NBA--has ever had.

[Thatguy 8686]

1 hour ago, aggie08 said:

You are aware how small sample sizes work, right? 

One terrible game makes it almost impossible for anyone to reach their usual percentages in a 3-game window (which I why I zoomed out and included the entire postseason).

He went 32, 11, 10 in Game 2 on 7-17 (4-11), and 26, 8, 13 on 8-19 (5-9) in Game 3 (45% from 3 in those two games, hooray small sample sizes!) before the Game 4 letdown (when the series was already effectively over).  If those are considered his volume shooting, mediocre games, I think they'll fucking take it.

I know he's a victim of his own success, but shooting 50%/45% on 2's/3's with the sheer amount of threes that he takes isn't fucking normal.  Every other player who has ever lived would kill for his playoff 46%/41% "dip" in shooting if they were taking 10 threes a game. 

 

  Um, you accuse me of not looking at his supposed one bad shooting game, and then you do the same thing with his one good shooting game? One game was 7-17(41%) and 4-11(36% fro 3). Another game was 4-13(30%) and 2-9from 3(22%). The one supposed good game he was 5-9 from 3(55%). However, he was still 8-19(42%) from the field. Of the 3 games I was talking about he shot a shitty percentage from the field in all 3. If you asked a coach how he would feel if they played Steph Curry over a series and he would average under 40% shooting that coach would giddily accept that as a job well done. Westbrook went 18-43(41%) and we torched him for being a volume shooter. Steph shoots a worse percentage over a 3 game stretch and it's job well done?

[aggie08 21496]

Way to completely miss the point.  I thought that was you, P.  Troll away, my friend, troll away.

[Patrick Bateman 3911]

36 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Agreed.  Though, I think he was much better in 2015 than the fan's/media's collective memory of him.  He averaged 28/6/5 on 46/42 shooting.  He's remembered for "struggling" in the Finals, but that was really only one game: his nightmarish Game 2 where he was 5-23 (2-15), and the Delly "Curry stopper" narrative stupidly took hold.  The other 5 games he shifted between good and exceptional.  He only had one "holy shit" game (37 in game 5), but part of that was realizing around game 4 that, rather than trying to fight through the constant trapping, he could just give it up, and the Warriors would have a 4-on-3 literally every time down (enter Dray and Iggy).  If they weren't going to give the Finals' MVP to a player from the losing team, it was a joke that they gave it to someone other than Steph, as fun as the Iggy story was.

Those first two pre-Kerr postseasons were all Steph all the time.  They fell apart without him on the court to LeBron levels.  They had Jarrett Jack, the occasional Klay or Barnes spot-up in Mark Jackson's archaic offense, and that's about it.  Still managed to beat a 57 win Denver team, and gave San Antonio their only two losses in the Western Conference Playoffs on a bum ankle.  That's about as close as he's ever been to being quantified a volume shooter. 

But what qualifies as a volume shooter? Even in those first two playoffs, he still shot around 44%/40%.  Those are better than any regular season numbers that Dame Lillard--expected first-team All-NBA--has ever had.

In 2015, he was good and easily the Warriors best player overall but he fattened up on some backcourts who weren't exactly known for their defense in Houston and New Orleans.  Memphis and Cleveland he struggled shooting the ball.  Most people will struggle vs Tony Allen but eFG% was .529 with 24 turnovers.  He shot 42/40/78 if you want top line numbers.

In the Finals, again, still good, .545 eFG% with 28 turnovers (4.67) vs 38 assists, but not as good as his regular season.

In the regular season, he .595 eFG% with about 3.5 turnovers per game.  His PER was an elite 28.0% overall in the regular season but 24.5% for the postseason so there was definitely a drop off and it was more pronounced vs teams who had the personnel to play some better defense on him.   Remember, no Beverley in that series with Houston..

As far as what he was in the previous offense, it was much more of a traditional PG role and therefore his AST% was much higher but his TOV% was higher too.  His PER, TS, and eFG were all much lower so he was less efficient while turning it over more than even 2015 and 16 where those percentages were down in the playoffs anyway.   I didn't call him a volume shooter as much as scorer.  A lot more was put on his shoulders in those year too.  Draymond hadn't come into his own and there was no Iggy or Livingston as well as a smaller sample size.  He was very good but didn't have as much help and over time he's really started to morph into a combo guard....

I mean, it's really not a huge deal..... In most playoffs until last year, Curry was their best player overall but not necessarily in certain series.  Interestingly, Curry and Harden's impacts need to be similar for their teams to reach their potential.  Both have to be elite on offense because it's become obvious that both are challenged defensively.  I would theorize for different reasons, Harden because he gives inconsistent effort and Curry because he's limited physically.  Curry always seems to really try....

Edited May 21, 2018 by Patrick Bateman

[immortal13 4059]

6 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Way to completely miss the point.  I thought that was you, P.  Troll away, my friend, troll away.

I knew there was a reason for the smell of Lebron's ballsack on this thread.

[Patrick Bateman 3911]

Oh shit..... Iggy doubtful for game 4!

Houston..... you gotta take this game!

Edited May 21, 2018 by Patrick Bateman

[aggie08 21496]

11 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

I mean, it's really not a huge deal..... In most playoffs until last year, Curry was their best player overall but not necessarily in certain series.  Interestingly, Curry and Harden's impacts need to be similar for their teams to reach their potential.  Both have to be elite on offense because it's become obvious that both are challenged defensively.  I would theorize for different reasons, Harden because he gives inconsistent effort and Curry because he's limited physically.  Curry always seems to really try....

And I'd say that really only 3 teams in the league--Cleveland, Houston, and GS (maybe OKC?)--are currently built to attack those deficiencies so completely.  I mean, it's an obvious strategy: Steph can't guard LeBron or Harden (who can?), and Harden can't guard KD or Steph, they'll wear themselves out and get frustrated trying, and it will impact them on the offensive end whether we score or not.  Duh, sounds so easy.  But other teams don't have the personnel, and/or it would throw off their normal scheme too much to do consistently.

You almost wonder if it's better to give effort (Steph) and still be largely over-matched, or to just play ole defense (Harden), and save the energy.

But, obviously, it's the former.  Even though Dirk was always terrible defensively, it meant something to his teammates when he battled, sweated, and bled on that end later on in his career.