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paypal can lick my nuts

Enchubben

By Enchubben
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Enchubben

Enchubben 5510

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These shitheads banned me for life from using their service and it's quite the inconvenience with certain online activities, stuff for kids etc. that only accept Paypal. 

High level - I used to receive cash gift cards (think VISA/AMEX etc) through work.  For various reasons I wanted those converted to real cash in areas of my life that require cash.  The best approach I could come up with was running them through a Paypal account acting as a vendor and selling "services" and paying with the cash gift cards.  At that point I could request a paper check from Paypal which could be cashed, and I was only out a small processing fee on the gift cards.  Seemed like it worked out for everyone involved, Paypal got paid, I got my cash.

That was up until they locked my account and accused me of money laundering.  They held on to $1500 of funds in my account for 6 months until they finally released it and then permabanned me from using Paypal (and eBay) claiming I violated their terms of service. I read those damn T&C's all the way through and no where did I violate anything, they just didn't like what I was doing because I wasn't operating a "true" business that couldn't provide invoices etc.  end of story - fuck paypal.

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conVINCEd

conVINCEd 21469

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1 minute ago, AUS-97HORN said:

In the last 18 months a lot of respectable places are now accepting venmo and cash app. 

of course, those are also well known apps to pay for "other" services.  So your job may not be as happy with you using them.

 

PayPal owns Venmo.

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Homercles

Homercles 10206

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Given the amount of scammers that find people dumb enough to think the IRS, FBI, etc want you to pay fees using gift cards…I can see why they shut that down.  For every fringe case like you, there’s probably a dozen ‘do the needful’ fake tech support guys out there laundering their spoils that way.  

Edited by Homercles
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Enchubben

Enchubben 5510

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17 minutes ago, slorch said:

Why can't you just use the gift cards for groceries/ gas/ massages?

Lawn guy doesn't take gift card, casino's don't take gift cards, etc.  To me it's silly.   @Dbeasy I'd have to go back and look now, but there was nothing in the terms of service or fine print that said I could not convert gift cards to cash through the service. I guess in hindsight I could have actually created some fake invoices etc.

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Enchubben

Enchubben 5510

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1 minute ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

I mean... how many gift cards were you putting through and in what amounts... I don't think they are shutting you down for $100 here and there.. 

I Mean Law And Order GIF by SVU... you sure you weren't laundering money??

you're right that they didn't do anything about it for years.  I probably pushed $5K in total through there in total at $500/$250 a pop.

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1 minute ago, Enchubben said:

Lawn guy doesn't take gift card, casino's don't take gift cards, etc.  To me it's silly.   @Dbeasy I'd have to go back and look now, but there was nothing in the terms of service or fine print that said I could not convert gift cards to cash through the service. I guess in hindsight I could have actually created some fake invoices etc.

Groceries and gas are not a substantial expense for you?

or are you bartering?  LOlz.

 

You sound like the employees we have who bitch about having to pay tax on giftcards.   Well just decline them then.

Then the tone changes.

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ztejas

ztejas 43532

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It isn't hard to sell cash gift cards for 90%+ of their value. Your idea wasn't bad but I'd kick you off the platform, too. Not worth PayPal's time to hear out your case when they deal with thousands of drug dealers and illicit businesses every year I'm guessing. They have bigger fish to fry and have no reason to take you at your word. 

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Enchubben

Enchubben 5510

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Just now, slorch said:

Groceries and gas are not a substantial expense for you?

or are you bartering?  LOlz.

You sound like the employees we have who bitch about having to pay tax on giftcards.   Well just decline them then.

Then the tone changes.

I think you are missing the point - it's not that I couldn't use them elsewhere - it's that in addition to legitimate expenses needing cash payment, I also had some others. And never once have I complained about getting a giftcard - though they were grossed up for tax when I got them.  This isnt an issue with getting gift cards - as I could have gotten nothing as you pointed out.  It's more of a eff paypal for a lifetime ban of using paypal for a setup that didn't harm a soul. 

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Enchubben

Enchubben 5510

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Just now, ztejas said:

It isn't hard to sell cash gift cards for 90%+ of their value. Your idea wasn't bad but I'd kick you off the platform, too. Not worth PayPal's time to hear out your case when they deal with thousands of drug dealers and illicit businesses every year I'm guessing. They have bigger fish to fry and have no reason to take you at your word. 

This is what I ultimately gathered but they can still lick my nuts.

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ztejas

ztejas 43532

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1 minute ago, Enchubben said:

This is what I ultimately gathered but they can still lick my nuts.

I'd be pissed too. It's one thing if they took issue after a few hundred bucks. To let you put thousands through then pop you for it is irritating - but that's how these things work. The IRS doesn't immediately come collecting when you owe $300. They'll get you years later.

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gyroprotagonist

gyroprotagonist 2595

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hits close to home.  don't even remember how it worked, but back many years ago, you could buy an Amex giftcard (think they were called Vanilla cards?) from like CVS using an Amex CC that gave out 5x points for buying stuff at CVS.  Then you could transfer that amount into another amex account that acted like a quasi bank acount (Bluebird maybe?).  You could then write checks from account to pay for stuff like rent/mortgage and essentially churn out a shitton of travel points.  I always felt shady as shit going in to multiple CVSs and buying all the gift cards of this certain type out.

they closed that loop hole not too long after, but it was sweet while it lasted.

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blacklab

blacklab 11950

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Paypal is cracking down on lots of stuff now.

Two guys at a poker game were banned from paypal and venmo for "suspicious activity". They both sent and received thousands in poker winnings/losses over the last few years. 

I got a nastygram from paypal after the last football pool I ran that I'd get banned if I did something like that again.

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Your Mom

Your Mom 4850

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So you got pics of all the whores you bought with the cash slush fund you kept hidden from your wife or what?

I mean, we all need cash. But unless you have reason for the wife not to know about it, a quick stop at an ATM or a cash back option at the grocery store seems a hell of a lot easier than funneling gift cards into checks to be cashed. That’s a shit ton of hassle just to avoid an ATM. 

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Dennis Taylor

Dennis Taylor 18861

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1 hour ago, Enchubben said:

These shitheads banned me for life from using their service and it's quite the inconvenience with certain online activities, stuff for kids etc. that only accept Paypal. 

High level - I used to receive cash gift cards (think VISA/AMEX etc) through work.  For various reasons I wanted those converted to real cash in areas of my life that require cash.  The best approach I could come up with was running them through a Paypal account acting as a vendor and selling "services" and paying with the cash gift cards.  At that point I could request a paper check from Paypal which could be cashed, and I was only out a small processing fee on the gift cards.  Seemed like it worked out for everyone involved, Paypal got paid, I got my cash.

That was up until they locked my account and accused me of money laundering.  They held on to $1500 of funds in my account for 6 months until they finally released it and then permabanned me from using Paypal (and eBay) claiming I violated their terms of service. I read those damn T&C's all the way through and no where did I violate anything, they just didn't like what I was doing because I wasn't operating a "true" business that couldn't provide invoices etc.  end of story - fuck paypal.

 

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Brew

Brew 3049

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PayPal has to issue 1099’s on activity as well as check identification numbers and names with the IRS database on business entities. If it doesn’t meet their verification process, it’s easier to kill it than investigate it. They also had too many people using the friends and family function and not paying fees as well as running fantasy and gambling activities not considered legal by certain entities to deal with all of the issues individually.

You had a fake business set up to convert gift cards to cash using an invoicing system, that was never going to last.

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immamac

immamac 42989

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10 minutes ago, Brew said:

PayPal has to issue 1099’s on activity as well as check identification numbers and names with the IRS database on business entities. If it doesn’t meet their verification process, it’s easier to kill it than investigate it. They also had too many people using the friends and family function and not paying fees as well as running fantasy and gambling activities not considered legal by certain entities to deal with all of the issues individually.

You had a fake business set up to convert gift cards to cash using an invoicing system, that was never going to last.

fun fact, no they don't. They do 1099-K for payments received though. 

PayPal has 0 problems with Surly, weird how if you follow the laws they don't care. 

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Brew

Brew 3049

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18 minutes ago, immamac said:

fun fact, no they don't. They do 1099-K for payments received though. 

PayPal has 0 problems with Surly, weird how if you follow the laws they don't care. 

I’m not sure what you’re arguing, but they have to issue 1099-K’s which is a 1099 type form for transactions processed above a threshold. 1099 is a classification for multiple types of 1099’s including INT, Misc, K, etc., there is no 1099 by itself if you want to debate semantics. They also are doing verifications on name and identifying numbers.

Edited by Brew
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Murfdogg21

Murfdogg21 4423

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3 hours ago, Enchubben said:

High level - I used to receive cash gift cards (think VISA/AMEX etc) through work.  For various reasons I wanted those converted to real cash in areas of my life that require cash.  The best approach I could come up with was running them through a Paypal account acting as a vendor and selling "services" and paying with the cash gift cards.  At that point I could request a paper check from Paypal which could be cashed, and I was only out a small processing fee on the gift cards.  Seemed like it worked out for everyone involved, Paypal got paid, I got my cash.

That was up until they locked my account and accused me of money laundering.  They held on to $1500 of funds in my account for 6 months until they finally released it and then permabanned me from using Paypal (and eBay) claiming I violated their terms of service. I read those damn T&C's all the way through and no where did I violate anything, they just didn't like what I was doing because I wasn't operating a "true" business that couldn't provide invoices etc.  end of story - fuck paypal.

So do you or don’t you sell drugs or hookers for a living?

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Spaulding Smails

Spaulding Smails 1555

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@Enchubben did they at least give you some warning?  A heads up?  An opportunity to stop those transactions?

When I launched my website after about two years in business (residential construction), our web designer defaulted to using PayPal for our "Make a Payment" button.  It worked pretty well at first.  Got our funds relatively quickly.  Easy interface for our clients.  After about two years, we started picking up some larger jobs.  One day, I get a call from PayPal saying that, due to my volume and the "risky business" I was in, they'd be holding my funds for SIX MONTHS.  So, they were going to hold $80K for half a year on a project that was going to take a little more than a month to complete.  Of course, it was buried in the T&Cs that I never read that they could do this, but as a service provider, a little proactive communication would have been nice.  They wouldn't budge.  Not an inch.  Not on the next transaction.  Not down to three months.  Nada.

I had my customer void the transaction and pay via check.  And, I promptly removed the PayPal option from the website.  

I'm all for protecting your own best interests and minimizing your risk as a service provider, but dammit, tell your customers ahead of time.  I think OnlyFans is going to tank with their decision, but at least they were proactive in communicating with their content providers and customers.  Can you imagine the shit storm if that went down without any heads up?

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Brothahorn

Brothahorn 10087

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7 hours ago, blacklab said:

Paypal is cracking down on lots of stuff now.

Two guys at a poker game were banned from paypal and venmo for "suspicious activity". They both sent and received thousands in poker winnings/losses over the last few years. 

I got a nastygram from paypal after the last football pool I ran that I'd get banned if I did something like that again.

Serious question. How did they know you had a football pool going? Did someone put in the comments?

 

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Harrison Bergeron

Harrison Bergeron 1798

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10 hours ago, Enchubben said:

These shitheads banned me for life from using their service and it's quite the inconvenience with certain online activities, stuff for kids etc. that only accept Paypal. 

High level - I used to receive cash gift cards (think VISA/AMEX etc) through work.  For various reasons I wanted those converted to real cash in areas of my life that require cash.  The best approach I could come up with was running them through a Paypal account acting as a vendor and selling "services" and paying with the cash gift cards.  At that point I could request a paper check from Paypal which could be cashed, and I was only out a small processing fee on the gift cards.  Seemed like it worked out for everyone involved, Paypal got paid, I got my cash.

That was up until they locked my account and accused me of money laundering.  They held on to $1500 of funds in my account for 6 months until they finally released it and then permabanned me from using Paypal (and eBay) claiming I violated their terms of service. I read those damn T&C's all the way through and no where did I violate anything, they just didn't like what I was doing because I wasn't operating a "true" business that couldn't provide invoices etc.  end of story - fuck paypal.

I'm pretty sure this is the textbook definition of money laundering (and I just finished a Sopranos re-watch, so #expert).

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ztejas

ztejas 43532

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, Harrison Bergeron said:

I'm pretty sure this is the textbook definition of money laundering (and I just finished a Sopranos re-watch, so #expert).

Not really because he didn't obtain the gift cards illegally. 

Now - it is definitely a textbook example of how you might launder money. Say you sold drugs then bought prepaid gift cards with cash at the grocery store then did this. 

Which is why he got kicked off the platform. PayPal isn't going to bother trying to find out if the cash stream is actually illegal. 

Edited by ztejas
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