The Watch Fanatic Thread

[HoustonHorn 1062]

Dude !!  GTFO...

Do you need a safe space?

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

8 minutes ago, HoustonHorn said:

Do you need a safe space?

Heh heh heh, safe space, for damn sure, right down to the Buick sedan, polo shirt, and khakis, but Rolex has never been one of my touchstones.

[Beantown Express 2.0 6559]

Is the new Rolex going by Sprite or Riddler?  Not a fan of it and still prefer the other GMTs especially the Rootbeer.

[Beantown Express 2.0 6559]

How about the new Vacheron release?  Yellow gold 222. Maybe a nice Patek?  Someday I need to go to the Watches and Wonders show in Geneva.

 

Edited April 1, 2022 by Beantown Express 2.0

[BalancingAct 1]

2 hours ago, Beantown Express 2.0 said:

How about the new Vacheron release?  Yellow gold 222. Maybe a nice Patek?  Someday I need to go to the Watches and Wonders show in Geneva.

 

I'm really hoping to go next year.

Those are both greak looking watches. The PF Rattrapante GMT is probably my favorite release that I've seen.

 

 

Edited April 1, 2022 by BalancingAct

[HoustonHorn 1062]

Heh heh heh, safe space, for damn sure, right down to the Buick sedan, polo shirt, and khakis, but Rolex has never been one of my touchstones.

Rolex makes nice watches but I can't imagine paying over retail for one. Plus I just don't really care to wear something everyone else has. I personally think the Liminality is cool and I own another Holthinrichs that is much more subdued but still offbeat.

Holthinrichs Raw Ornament and my watch for today, Moser Pioneer Centre Seconds. For the price people are paying for a sub, you can get a Moser Pioneer which is a much better watch.

[tx 3 putt 76866]

2 hours ago, Beantown Express 2.0 said:

Is the new Rolex going by Sprite or Riddler?  Not a fan of it and still prefer the other GMTs especially the Rootbeer.

[G650 14229]

2 hours ago, Beantown Express 2.0 said:

How about the new Vacheron release?  Yellow gold 222. Maybe a nice Patek?  Someday I need to go to the Watches and Wonders show in Geneva.

 

I already asked my dealer about getting a 222

[HoustonHorn 1062]

20 minutes ago, G650 said:

I already asked my dealer about getting a 222

I know you have some nice watches, I hope a lot of them are VCs, because this will be crazy hard to get unless you're in for 6 figures already.

[G650 14229]

19 minutes ago, HoustonHorn said:

I know you have some nice watches, I hope a lot of them are VCs, because this will be crazy hard to get unless you're in for 6 figures already.

I know right. I have a few VCs. I basically asked "So what are the chances?". I do have a lot of spend with the dealer so I have that going for me. It's going to be more down to whether he can get the watch from VC.

[Beantown Express 2.0 6559]

47 minutes ago, G650 said:

I already asked my dealer about getting a 222

I am not a huge fan of the new 222 as all that gold is a little much for my style.  At this point I can sell my VC Overseas and use the money to buy house with how outrageous the pricing has become.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

1 hour ago, HoustonHorn said:

Rolex makes nice watches but I can't imagine paying over retail for one. Plus I just don't really care to wear something everyone else has. I personally think the Liminality is cool and I own another Holthinrichs that is much more subdued but still offbeat.

Holthinrichs Raw Ornament and my watch for today, Moser Pioneer Centre Seconds. For the price people are paying for a sub, you can get a Moser Pioneer which is a much better watch.

Yep, that's always been my knock on. Rolex, guys buy one because they think they should own a Rolex. I prefer less known brands.

[G650 14229]

2 hours ago, Beantown Express 2.0 said:

I am not a huge fan of the new 222 as all that gold is a little much for my style.  At this point I can sell my VC Overseas and use the money to buy house with how outrageous the pricing has become.

Yeah I looked at the valuation of the Overseas now and lol.

 

Tbh I'm not an all gold guy in general, but I've always thought about having a Texas Timex just because. This one excites me because you get that look but with a VC instead of a Rolex.

[utxmike05 1828]

6 hours ago, Beantown Express 2.0 said:

Is the new Rolex going by Sprite or Riddler?  Not a fan of it and still prefer the other GMTs especially the Rootbeer.

Damn that lefty crown would fuk up my world...just looking at it makes me cross eyed.  I do like some green though.

[HoustonHorn 1062]

54 minutes ago, G650 said:

Yeah I looked at the valuation of the Overseas now and lol.

 

Tbh I'm not an all gold guy in general, but I've always thought about having a Texas Timex just because. This one excites me because you get that look but with a VC instead of a Rolex.

I would absolutely get that VC if I had any in with VC. Actually, the guy in our Redbar group here is the North American Online Sales Manager for VC. He basically said that even if he wanted one, he goes to the back of the line. Another guy I have bought a watch (non-VC) from carries VC, but he already told me the Overseas is a several year waiting list. So I imagine this 222 is going to be at least as hard to get, if not harder.

[G650 14229]

Wow that's crazy about the sales manager.

 

Yeah, it's going to be tough. It was about a year to get my Overseas, I ordered it when then current model debuted. And it's only gotten harder.

[Beantown Express 2.0 6559]

3 hours ago, G650 said:

Wow that's crazy about the sales manager.

 

Yeah, it's going to be tough. It was about a year to get my Overseas, I ordered it when then current model debuted. And it's only gotten harder.

Forget the 222 and get this titanium VC.  If you’re gonna be a bear, be a grizzly.

 

[G650 14229]

9 hours ago, Beantown Express 2.0 said:

Forget the 222 and get this titanium VC.  If you’re gonna be a bear, be a grizzly.

 

I saw that too. I like to look at skeleton watches but there is no way I could wear one.

[52-80 19143]

cleaning shit off the memory card

 

[Chewbacca 7766]

How about the new Vacheron release?  Yellow gold 222. Maybe a nice Patek?  Someday I need to go to the Watches and Wonders show in Geneva.
 

That Patek is sex, which means it is unobtainium.

[HoustonHorn 1062]

Yep, that's always been my knock on. Rolex, guys buy one because they think they should own a Rolex. I prefer less known brands.

I know you've mentioned Sinn in the past. I definitely like Sinn alot (German watches in general) but haven't pulled the trigger on one yet. Interesting to see them get into some colored dials as well with the 556. I like them but a bit of a departure for a brand known as a tool watch company.

Rolex has nice watches. They have a formula and they don't deviate much from that formula and they are probably the best run company from an inventory control and marketing perspective in the history of the world. Watchmaking to me is about passion and creativity and creation of incredible mechanical devices. Rolex is the opposite of that, so they don't hold any appeal for me personally.

I think brands are realizing a few things. More women are getting into watches and 37-40mm watches work for both sexes. This had a LOT of impact for a variety of reasons that I'll probably expand on at some point. They also have seen microbrands explode in popularity with a large variety of colors and designs. A few big brands have been doing color for years now and it's finally getting more mainstream (thanks Rolex).

This isn't your father's watch market anymore. Especially since most brands are owned by luxury conglomerates (nobody understands marketing better) . Watches were strictly tools for the majority of their existence. Function over form. But watchmaking is truly an art and watches as tools are essentially useless in today's world other than very specific instances. They are simply luxury accessories now and as such more people are looking at them as an opportunity for individual expression. It's jewelery for men and another expensive jewelry item for women.

Modern technology has also allowed a lot of non-watchmaking designers/architects/etc. to become watch designers and bring those watches to market and market them very effectively with social media. You also have the creative element behind the watches, the watchmakers, stepping out from under their brands and creating incredible, unique, and beautiful products.

Add in the inate desire many people have for physical assets both for materialism and now investment assets and its a perfect storm. Microbrands are now generating an entirely new wave of higher end watch buyers for the future. I really don't see this slowing down for the next 5-10 years.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

57 minutes ago, HoustonHorn said:

I know you've mentioned Sinn in the past. I definitely like Sinn alot (German watches in general) but haven't pulled the trigger on one yet. Interesting to see them get into some colored dials as well with the 556. I like them but a bit of a departure for a brand known as a tool watch company.

Rolex has nice watches. They have a formula and they don't deviate much from that formula and they are probably the best run company from an inventory control and marketing perspective in the history of the world. Watchmaking to me is about passion and creativity and creation of incredible mechanical devices. Rolex is the opposite of that, so they don't hold any appeal for me personally.

I think brands are realizing a few things. More women are getting into watches and 37-40mm watches work for both sexes. This had a LOT of impact for a variety of reasons that I'll probably expand on at some point. They also have seen microbrands explode in popularity with a large variety of colors and designs. A few big brands have been doing color for years now and it's finally getting more mainstream (thanks Rolex).

This isn't your father's watch market anymore. Especially since most brands are owned by luxury conglomerates (nobody understands marketing better) . Watches were strictly tools for the majority of their existence. Function over form. But watchmaking is truly an art and watches as tools are essentially useless in today's world other than very specific instances. They are simply luxury accessories now and as such more people are looking at them as an opportunity for individual expression. It's jewelery for men and another expensive jewelry item for women.

Modern technology has also allowed a lot of non-watchmaking designers/architects/etc. to become watch designers and bring those watches to market and market them very effectively with social media. You also have the creative element behind the watches, the watchmakers, stepping out from under their brands and creating incredible, unique, and beautiful products.

Add in the inate desire many people have for physical assets both for materialism and now investment assets and its a perfect storm. Microbrands are now generating an entirely new wave of higher end watch buyers for the future. I really don't see this slowing down for the next 5-10 years.

Great post.  

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

To piggy back on your post. I've always loved watches. I mean from a little Kid I was fascinated by watches. I still remember to this day smashing my navy blue, diver watch against a brick hearth when the Cowboys lost to Pittsburgh in their first Super Bowl meeting, and immediately being more upset that I'd done that than the Cowboys losing (I was 12 or so). I consider my first real watch to be an F1 I bought in St. Barts back around 1992, still sits in my case, but it's small 38mm so it gets very little wrist time.

I gravitate to Divers, Pilots, and those unique, sportier, dressy watches (GO, and IWC are grail brands for me, in that I can afford to buy those). Pateks, VC's, etc. are amazing, but I know I won't have that kind of disposable income for a watch (even as an investment).

I've had six Sinn, but have sold or given away (my immaculately clean, 103 UTC to my son last year) all but my U2 which is among my favorite watches.  

I've been an Hublot fan since they first came out with their electric, cobalt, rubber strap, quartz (they've jumped the shark now in my opinion). I still have my Super B, and my first generation Big Bang (another of my never will sell watches).  I really dig the engineering, and multiple materials mixed together on a rubber deployment strap.

I collected Choppard Mille Miglias for a while, but have sold all those off.  

I've been focusing on lesser known brands since the 2008 melt down, and try to wear them all in a general monthly rotation of about 15 different watches. 

I'll be buying a GO sometime in the next year our so, once I settle on the example I think best captures their design philosophy, and my budget.  Beyond that I want an IWC Port-o- geezy.

[DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt 12301]

So, uh, anyone know a watchmaker in Austin that can service a vintage speedie?

[G650 14229]

4 hours ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

I mean from a little Kid I was fascinated by watches.

Yep, me too

[52-80 19143]

Kinda annoyed that in 2022 it's still difficult to get anything more than a shopping mall Seiko.  There's a gigantic vacuum of distribution for the wide product line that they make that sit between the Macys quartzers and a GS.  No obvious retail or e-tail for the King Seiko.

There's no Seiko Boutiques anywhere in the US.  There's 1 Boutique in Budapest but the website is  fucked.  1 in UK and 2 in Germany but don't offer online purchasing. 

Store Finder shows locally a bunch of jewelry store, and the 1 watch'y looking store doesn't respond to email.  Last option is to buy from Japan through Chrono24.  Meh.

Ordered a Nomos Club instead

[Sam Lin 3550]

Super lucky in that respect for Thailand. Seiko is quite easy to find at each tier here. Agree the US coverage is particularly bad. I wouldn't put too much on the "not respond to email" - I've found that most countries are not email-oriented yet. Calling or visiting is still the preferred method of communication (or social media - Thailand and Korea you'll always get your quickest, best answer finding the shop on social media and sending a message).

[Sam Lin 3550]

On 4/2/2022 at 10:53 AM, HoustonHorn said:

Rolex has nice watches. They have a formula and they don't deviate much from that formula and they are probably the best run company from an inventory control and marketing perspective in the history of the world. Watchmaking to me is about passion and creativity and creation of incredible mechanical devices. Rolex is the opposite of that, so they don't hold any appeal for me personally.

I'm with you on most of your post, and I agree with the overall message. But, think you greatly understate their manufacturing and engineering ability. They are quite likely also the best run watch mfg from a manufacturing standpoint. Their degree of "in-house" and vertical integration is nearly unmatched (GS is the only other that comes to mind, at much lower volumes). Their engineering innovation doesn't get much attention, but their watches are engineered as much as any other brand (or more). What's particularly stunning about Rolex is their ability to mass produce a very high end product (in terms of engineering, in terms of quality, in terms of fit/finish*) at a scale no one else can dream of. While it's easy to say they are limiting production and driving up their values (and yes they are, and so are a ton of other watchmakers), they are shipping more product than anyone at the high end.

Start about 2/3 down for a look at modern Rolex mfg. They test and hold their product to a tighter standard than most mass-produced watches (and likely tighter than most independents): https://www.hodinkee.com/articles/inside-rolex

*Counterpoint: Walt Odets' infamous Rolex Explorer analysis:
https://www.timezone.com/2002/09/16/the-rolex-explorer-ref-14270-part-1/
https://www.timezone.com/2002/09/16/the-rolex-explorer-ref-14270-part-2/

Is it the boring, safe choice? Yes. Is the majority of the customer base a turnoff? Yes. But is it any less a watch or mechanical device because of that? My opinion is no.

Not a Rolex owner, unlikely to ever be, for many of your same reasons. But I have huge respect for their mfg. (I work in automotive; it's much like Toyota for me. People mock Toyota for lack of innovation, for boring cars, for ancient infotainment, but they've dominated quality statistics and resale for nearly 20yrs, while at the same time maintaining profit margins above industry averages. Doing what Rolex/Toyota do, for as long as they've done it, is an amazing engineering/mfg feat, not achievable only through marketing or limiting production to drive demand.)

[Superhero 8827]

17 hours ago, DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt said:

So, uh, anyone know a watchmaker in Austin that can service a vintage speedie?

Didn't you just get it a few months ago?

[DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt 12301]

4 hours ago, Superhero said:

Didn't you just get it a few months ago?

Let's not get too bogged down in the details.

[HoustonHorn 1062]

On 4/3/2022 at 7:21 AM, Onboard 2.0 said:

To piggy back on your post. I've always loved watches. I mean from a little Kid I was fascinated by watches. I still remember to this day smashing my navy blue, diver watch against a brick hearth when the Cowboys lost to Pittsburgh in their first Super Bowl meeting, and immediately being more upset that I'd done that than the Cowboys losing (I was 12 or so). I consider my first real watch to be an F1 I bought in St. Barts back around 1992, still sits in my case, but it's small 38mm so it gets very little wrist time.

I gravitate to Divers, Pilots, and those unique, sportier, dressy watches (GO, and IWC are grail brands for me, in that I can afford to buy those). Pateks, VC's, etc. are amazing, but I know I won't have that kind of disposable income for a watch (even as an investment).

I've had six Sinn, but have sold or given away (my immaculately clean, 103 UTC to my son last year) all but my U2 which is among my favorite watches.  

I've been an Hublot fan since they first came out with their electric, cobalt, rubber strap, quartz (they've jumped the shark now in my opinion). I still have my Super B, and my first generation Big Bang (another of my never will sell watches).  I really dig the engineering, and multiple materials mixed together on a rubber deployment strap.

I collected Choppard Mille Miglias for a while, but have sold all those off.  

I've been focusing on lesser known brands since the 2008 melt down, and try to wear them all in a general monthly rotation of about 15 different watches. 

I'll be buying a GO sometime in the next year our so, once I settle on the example I think best captures their design philosophy, and my budget.  Beyond that I want an IWC Port-o- geezy.

I had a couple watches as a kid, but they were quartz and I never really connected. My dad wasn't a watch guy, and I played golf every day so I just never really got into them until about 6 years ago when buying my wife a Rolex. I tried a few on and liked them more than I figured I would. An Explorer II and a Milgauss. Maybe even then I knew a sub wasn't really something that caught my eye. My first real watch was a Magrette that I got after reading the thread on Shaggy and falling in love with Cushion-Shaped cases. My first big purchase was an IWC Spitfire and I remember trying on a blue Overseas Chronograph and absolutely loving it. But $20k on a watch was unfathomable to me. Wish I had that one now. My tastes are all over the place (what can I say, I appreciate beauty in all forms /novicmackey)  and as a result I own a lot of watches. My grail was a GO 70s, which I picked up about 6 months ago and is easily my favorite watch. Instead of satisfying my obsession, it basically fueled it as I really started to get into independent watches and high horology. That is a habit that I can't afford. But the watch industry being what it is right now, I think there are some investment possibilities outside of Rolex/AP/PP. As many smaller independent brands have just now started up in the past few years, the low production and increasing demand is already beginning to raise the prices for these watches at a pretty significant rate. I have convinced my wife of this and that has allowed me to continue making some purchases as an alternative investment strategy.

The ultimate goal is to move into the watch industry in the next 3-5 years full time, specializing in independent brands. While I still have a preference for "sports" watches, I'm moving more and more towards interesting, currently unknown bespoke brands (outside of watch circles) that trend dressier. I don't know that any will explode like FP Journe, but I do think the rarity will result in them maintaining value and increasing over time as more an more people become aware of the possibilities. Having a watch that is the only one in the world that is custom made to your exact desires is pretty fucking cool. Plus, you develop a relationship with the watchmaker themselves, and if one of them does eventually turn into the next FPJ, you have an opportunity to be high on the list to get other watches. As PP/AP/FPJ are now basically unobtainable unless you have an extensive purchase history, more and more people are moving to the next big thing. MB&F, DeBethune, Gronenfeld, Laurent Ferrier, etc. are all the same as FPJ from the standpoint of being difficult to get and extremely high priced. I missed that boat unfortunately (unless my financial situation changes dramatically), so working on the next wave of up and comers which are in the sub-$10k range.

A lot of collectors consider "investment" as a terrible word within the watch industry. I see it as an opportunity to build because these independents are so new and its like getting in on the 2nd floor (3+ years ago would have been the ground floor). For less bespoke, but still extremely limited brands, there are opportunities to upgrade over time. Moser, imo, is one of the most exciting independent brands. I'm not in a position to buy one of their perpetual calendars or a Streamliner at this point, but I can get an entry level Pioneer. If that ends up going up (and prices are already going up), then maybe I sell and get an Endeavour and if that goes up maybe it gets to a point where I can sell it and get the perpetual calendar that I'll keep. If it doesn't go up, I still have an incredible watch that I love wearing. Czapek and Parmigiani Fleurier are two others that are very limited, but have more extensive distribution channels and widening recognition (mostly because they offer incredible sports watches which is a big driver for generating interest). Both are incredible investments at this point if you can get them. I know the Czapek light blue that came out in the last couple months sold out almost immediately and had a waiting list into 2023. Some models are listed at double retail on Chrono24 right now and seem to be selling closer to 50% above retail. The PF Tonda is also extremely popular. The GMT Rattrapante they announced at W&W is probably my favorite watch from that entire show.

The IWC Portuguiser is a beautiful watch. IWC is killing it right now. My Spitfire isn't in the same league, but its still one of my favorite watches that I own.

Not sure what GO you are looking at, but they are fantastic watches. One of my favorite brands.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

17 minutes ago, HoustonHorn said:

I had a couple watches as a kid, but they were quartz and I never really connected. My dad wasn't a watch guy, and I played golf every day so I just never really got into them until about 6 years ago when buying my wife a Rolex. I tried a few on and liked them more than I figured I would. An Explorer II and a Milgauss. Maybe even then I knew a sub wasn't really something that caught my eye. My first real watch was a Magrette that I got after reading the thread on Shaggy and falling in love with Cushion-Shaped cases. My first big purchase was an IWC Spitfire and I remember trying on a blue Overseas Chronograph and absolutely loving it. But $20k on a watch was unfathomable to me. Wish I had that one now. My tastes are all over the place (what can I say, I appreciate beauty in all forms /novicmackey)  and as a result I own a lot of watches. My grail was a GO 70s, which I picked up about 6 months ago and is easily my favorite watch. Instead of satisfying my obsession, it basically fueled it as I really started to get into independent watches and high horology. That is a habit that I can't afford. But the watch industry being what it is right now, I think there are some investment possibilities outside of Rolex/AP/PP. As many smaller independent brands have just now started up in the past few years, the low production and increasing demand is already beginning to raise the prices for these watches at a pretty significant rate. I have convinced my wife of this and that has allowed me to continue making some purchases as an alternative investment strategy.

The ultimate goal is to move into the watch industry in the next 3-5 years full time, specializing in independent brands. While I still have a preference for "sports" watches, I'm moving more and more towards interesting, currently unknown bespoke brands (outside of watch circles) that trend dressier. I don't know that any will explode like FP Journe, but I do think the rarity will result in them maintaining value and increasing over time as more an more people become aware of the possibilities. Having a watch that is the only one in the world that is custom made to your exact desires is pretty fucking cool. Plus, you develop a relationship with the watchmaker themselves, and if one of them does eventually turn into the next FPJ, you have an opportunity to be high on the list to get other watches. As PP/AP/FPJ are now basically unobtainable unless you have an extensive purchase history, more and more people are moving to the next big thing. MB&F, DeBethune, Gronenfeld, Laurent Ferrier, etc. are all the same as FPJ from the standpoint of being difficult to get and extremely high priced. I missed that boat unfortunately (unless my financial situation changes dramatically), so working on the next wave of up and comers which are in the sub-$10k range.

A lot of collectors consider "investment" as a terrible word within the watch industry. I see it as an opportunity to build because these independents are so new and its like getting in on the 2nd floor (3+ years ago would have been the ground floor). For less bespoke, but still extremely limited brands, there are opportunities to upgrade over time. Moser, imo, is one of the most exciting independent brands. I'm not in a position to buy one of their perpetual calendars or a Streamliner at this point, but I can get an entry level Pioneer. If that ends up going up (and prices are already going up), then maybe I sell and get an Endeavour and if that goes up maybe it gets to a point where I can sell it and get the perpetual calendar that I'll keep. If it doesn't go up, I still have an incredible watch that I love wearing. Czapek and Parmigiani Fleurier are two others that are very limited, but have more extensive distribution channels and widening recognition (mostly because they offer incredible sports watches which is a big driver for generating interest). Both are incredible investments at this point if you can get them. I know the Czapek light blue that came out in the last couple months sold out almost immediately and had a waiting list into 2023. Some models are listed at double retail on Chrono24 right now and seem to be selling closer to 50% above retail. The PF Tonda is also extremely popular. The GMT Rattrapante they announced at W&W is probably my favorite watch from that entire show.

The IWC Portuguiser is a beautiful watch. IWC is killing it right now. My Spitfire isn't in the same league, but its still one of my favorite watches that I own.

Not sure what GO you are looking at, but they are fantastic watches. One of my favorite brands.

Yep, watch buying is an addiction, and not that long ago buying a watch (most brands that is) for investment purposes was snickered at by the other addicts.

I don't like quartz watches at all, kind of negates a major component of what really makes a watch something special.

[HoustonHorn 1062]

12 hours ago, Sam Lin said:

I'm with you on most of your post, and I agree with the overall message. But, think you greatly understate their manufacturing and engineering ability. They are quite likely also the best run watch mfg from a manufacturing standpoint. Their degree of "in-house" and vertical integration is nearly unmatched (GS is the only other that comes to mind, at much lower volumes). Their engineering innovation doesn't get much attention, but their watches are engineered as much as any other brand (or more). What's particularly stunning about Rolex is their ability to mass produce a very high end product (in terms of engineering, in terms of quality, in terms of fit/finish*) at a scale no one else can dream of. While it's easy to say they are limiting production and driving up their values (and yes they are, and so are a ton of other watchmakers), they are shipping more product than anyone at the high end.

Start about 2/3 down for a look at modern Rolex mfg. They test and hold their product to a tighter standard than most mass-produced watches (and likely tighter than most independents): https://www.hodinkee.com/articles/inside-rolex

*Counterpoint: Walt Odets' infamous Rolex Explorer analysis:
https://www.timezone.com/2002/09/16/the-rolex-explorer-ref-14270-part-1/
https://www.timezone.com/2002/09/16/the-rolex-explorer-ref-14270-part-2/

Is it the boring, safe choice? Yes. Is the majority of the customer base a turnoff? Yes. But is it any less a watch or mechanical device because of that? My opinion is no.

Not a Rolex owner, unlikely to ever be, for many of your same reasons. But I have huge respect for their mfg. (I work in automotive; it's much like Toyota for me. People mock Toyota for lack of innovation, for boring cars, for ancient infotainment, but they've dominated quality statistics and resale for nearly 20yrs, while at the same time maintaining profit margins above industry averages. Doing what Rolex/Toyota do, for as long as they've done it, is an amazing engineering/mfg feat, not achievable only through marketing or limiting production to drive demand.)

They are definitely an incredible manufacturer as well. As you said, they are able to produce a significant amount of watches of incredibly high quality. A large part of that is due to their iterative design process. If you don't change much year after year, you can refine it to the nth degree. And your R&D/engineering resources are focused specifically on that refinement and quality instead of creative design. It's a perfect marriage of engineering/manufacturing, quality, inventory control, and marketing. Rolex will be studied for decades to come as a model for success.

And you're also right that other brands are starting to do something similar. Tightening up supply, reducing AD margins, controlling inventory by moving from ADs to brand boutiques, and cracking down on the grey market which is resulting in scarcity and increased demand. Prices are rising as a result. Covid provided the perfect cover to accelerate that process. Gone are the days of 50%+ discounts on the grey market for new watches.

Regarding finishing, Rolex finishing is pretty industrial even compared to other major brands like Omega. It isn't in the same league as high-horology which is hand finished. Of course, they use a steel caseback, and most people don't really care about movement finishing (another thing I'm an outlier on). Rolex is the perfect watch for the masses.

 

 

 

 

[HoustonHorn 1062]

26 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Yep, watch buying is an addiction, and not that long ago buying a watch (most brands that is) for investment purposes was snickered at by the other addicts.

I don't like quartz watches at all, kind of negates a major component of what really makes a watch something special.

Agreed to a point. There is some level of appreciation for extremely innovative design and great finishing that has some worth. But I don't feel like its worth spending that much when its missing the heart (movement). If you need to know the time, look at your cell phone, work phone, computer, or the microwave/oven/appliance. The time is everywhere, but its the ability to create such an incredibly small, mechanical movement that requires nothing buy human interaction (either handwinding or by moving around) to tell the time to an unbelievable accuracy that fascinates me so much. The hand finishing is also what makes it truly something special and why I've graduated from more mainstream brands to independents. My Speemaster Racing has a beautiful movement. But its machined. Handmade craftsmanship to such a fine detail is just about as impressive to me as the movement itself.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

44 minutes ago, HoustonHorn said:

Agreed to a point. There is some level of appreciation for extremely innovative design and great finishing that has some worth. But I don't feel like its worth spending that much when its missing the heart (movement). If you need to know the time, look at your cell phone, work phone, computer, or the microwave/oven/appliance. The time is everywhere, but its the ability to create such an incredibly small, mechanical movement that requires nothing buy human interaction (either handwinding or by moving around) to tell the time to an unbelievable accuracy that fascinates me so much. The hand finishing is also what makes it truly something special and why I've graduated from more mainstream brands to independents. My Speemaster Racing has a beautiful movement. But its machined. Handmade craftsmanship to such a fine detail is just about as impressive to me as the movement itself.

So porn to you could be seeing a room filled with watch makers fabricating, and polishing, and assembling watches ... over and over and over ??

Yeah, all of your comments hit home about the process, and the incredible accuracy that can be achieved thru those beautifully engineered, and handcrafted components.

When I see a watch with a design I dig, and then see "quartz movement", it's like seeing what you think is a hot chick then noticing an Adams apple, and unusual crotch bulge.

Edited April 4, 2022 by Onboard 2.0

[52-80 19143]

 

[fattyflattie 4639]

Y'all are doing your best, but still want my Sea Dweller.  I like many others, but that's the one that's always done it for me.  Ideally I'd also have something dressy like some of the IWC/GO/JLC I love, for the times I get dolled up.  I'll be the basic bitch of the group.  

[utxmike05 1828]

On 4/3/2022 at 8:38 AM, DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt said:

So, uh, anyone know a watchmaker in Austin that can service a vintage speedie?

Uh-oh.  This the one recently obtained from Mexico?

I know one of the owners of "Martinez and Hood - Watches to Jeweler".....I know Martinez who handles jewelry side where I got wife's ring, and Hood handles watches.  He always had some vintage watches on display so assuming he may service also.  (512) 369-3895

[utxmike05 1828]

1 hour ago, fattyflattie said:

Y'all are doing your best, but still want my Sea Dweller.  I like many others, but that's the one that's always done it for me.  Ideally I'd also have something dressy like some of the IWC/GO/JLC I love, for the times I get dolled up.  I'll be the basic bitch of the group.  

I bet they hook u up with top shelf margaritas Lopez mex restaurant if you have a SeaDweller on that wrist...do it and invite me.

[fattyflattie 4639]

3 minutes ago, utxmike05 said:

I bet they hook u up with top shelf margaritas Lopez mex restaurant if you have a SeaDweller on that wrist...do it and invite me.

I'm waiting for you to buy, then tire of, then give the buddy price to. 

[DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt 12301]

5 hours ago, utxmike05 said:

Uh-oh.  This the one recently obtained from Mexico?

I know one of the owners of "Martinez and Hood - Watches to Jeweler".....I know Martinez who handles jewelry side where I got wife's ring, and Hood handles watches.  He always had some vintage watches on display so assuming he may service also.  (512) 369-3895

sweet thank you! yep, pushers are loose and the crown isn't engaging. i was planning on getting it fully serviced anyways, but yeah, poop.

[52-80 19143]

On 4/4/2022 at 6:04 PM, Onboard 2.0 said:

When I see a watch with a design I dig, and then see "quartz movement", it's like seeing what you think is a hot chick then noticing an Adams apple, and unusual crotch bulge.

 

[ChiTownDoc 21139]

2 hours ago, 52-80 said:

 

Totally worked too.  
 

Anyways, shit has gotten totally out of hand.  Guess I’m lucky I got so many before it became a shitshow but most high end pieces not even worn anymore.  Annoying to those who actually enjoy them for the right reasons.  

[G650 14229]

15 hours ago, ChiTownDoc said:

Totally worked too.  
 

Anyways, shit has gotten totally out of hand.  Guess I’m lucky I got so many before it became a shitshow but most high end pieces not even worn anymore.  Annoying to those who actually enjoy them for the right reasons.  

Where you been at stranger

[ChiTownDoc 21139]

23 minutes ago, G650 said:

Where you been at stranger

Tryin to keep my head above water, ha.  I’ll be back.  Things slowing a bit at least.  All work no play isn’t my style but got stuck in that rut last few months.  Hope all is well with my fellow degenerates…

[G650 14229]

8 minutes ago, ChiTownDoc said:

Tryin to keep my head above water, ha.  I’ll be back.  Things slowing a bit at least.  All work no play isn’t my style but got stuck in that rut last few months.  Hope all is well with my fellow degenerates…

I feel ya, I'm in the same boat. Surl is my one internets distraction, I've basically forgone the rest of the specialty fora as I don't even have time to breathe. Making money though, so fuck it.

[HoustonHorn 1062]

16 hours ago, ChiTownDoc said:

Totally worked too.  
 

Anyways, shit has gotten totally out of hand.  Guess I’m lucky I got so many before it became a shitshow but most high end pieces not even worn anymore.  Annoying to those who actually enjoy them for the right reasons.  

I unfortunately did not get into watches and especially high-end watches in time and have completely missed the boat on any of the high flyers. Without a long purchase history, there is no opportunity to get into brands like Patek/AP/VC. Its frustrating for sure. I've moved on to independent brands. I have Moser, a Holthinrichs, and anOrdain (on order) and hopefully a Sartory Billard at some point later this year. I think there is a LOT of value in the independents right now even though the prices have already gone up significantly over the past couple years and they are becoming increasingly difficult to get due to increasing demand. But they aren't unobtainable yet.

As part of this process, my desire to spend money on larger brands has greatly diminished. My appreciation for hand finishing, creative and unique designs, and the personal relationship developed with small independent watchmakers has surpassed my desire to buy a higher-end, but ultimately mass produced watch.  Its a different experience, probably much more akin to people who truly collect vintage watches. Their experience of buying the watch is enhanced by the extensive search to find the exact right watch and finally buying it. Mine comes from the interaction with the brand/watchmaker themselves and knowing the people behind the watch and interacting with them and in some cases being involved in the actual creative process to some degree (the level varies depending on the brand and the relationship).

 

 

[Moby Ric 2058]

On 3/24/2022 at 1:44 PM, davidg said:

So, who's giving the Mission to Uranus to their wife?

 

Honestly I am thinking of it since the color is her favorite.  These things are impossible to get your hands on for a decent price.  

Insert joke here.

Any clue to when these are going to be sold online?  I have my eye on a few of these.

Edited April 6, 2022 by Moby Ric

[52-80 19143]

Its got the kids name on the back but daddy will “take care” of it for the next 15 years 🥸😁

[tokamak 6391]

I love Nomoses(?) but I'm not so sure about the mix of Roman numerals and Arabic. Cool story/keepsake though.