Effing jury duty

[TwiceHorn 31510]

7 hours ago, Knoxtnhorn said:

LOL

This part was weird when I served 4 years ago.  It was a pretty big civil trial (made the papers/news) re: a guy that had been scamming Park Place Motors to the tune of missing millions, missing car titles, even a missing person that may have been whacked by the mob.  Anyway.  One of the pre-selection questions asked about possible prior experience as an accountant.  We were asked if we had ever been an accountant, ran an office, handled money for a business, etc...  Those that raised their hands were dismissed.  I figured they'd look for folks that had some experience with this type of stuff.

Well, the prosecution probably did want people that could handle the numbers.

The defense absolutely did not.

Peremptory challenge ftmfw.

A grand jury is different from a petit jury, though.  They don't sit for a specific case, usually, and there is no defense attorney challenging jurors for bias or attempting to strike them.  They're mostly about statutory qualifications, and they'll probably excuse someone that doesn't really want to serve.

Edited July 31, 2022 by TwiceHorn

[Armybrat 40853]

[BigDHornfan 6549]

My wife got called for the 4th time since we have been together.  Meanwhile, I have been eligible in 7 different counties in my lifetime and never once called.

I’ve never been called either.

[Doc Daneeka 6769]

Only made it out of the cattle room once. I was asked, I believe, whether I think cops are more believable than the average person. I said I don’t think they are and, based on the lies they’ve told about me in traffic court, probably less believable. I wasn’t in the final 12.

 

[HouTex 1887]

My jury duty notice is in today’s mail.  

[fattyflattie 4639]

March 7.  Never comes at a convenient time. 

[mdmost 43008]

I had deferred multiple times out of civil jury duty. I was on my final deferral when I went down the day after the Super Bowl. Was the 2nd person called to go up to the Family Court floor where about 75 of us waited to be called in. Since I was juror #2, I knew I would be picked unless there was something significant to disqualify me. We waited around till about 11am when the sheriff came out and told everyone that the lawyers didn't need us and we were free to go. I've never had that happen and I booked it out of there. 

[Felix 607]

Got called recently and went down to the cattle call.  Judge came in and gave us the spiel asked for anyone who really needed to not be there.  Ten or so went up and gave their story's. He released them all.  Time to get down to brass tacks and start the selections process.  Defendants attorney approaches the bench.  Prosecutor called up.  Whispered conversation.  Judge clears to court room and asks us to wait in the hall.

Thirty minutes later they call us back in and release us. Defendant fired his attorney and went back to jail.  Judge said it was the second time he had done this.  Counted as having served so won't get a criminal one for a while I guess.

[wild_turkey 3168]

I got summoned for the first time back in the fall. I filled out the online form and deferred it. The next summons came a couple months ago and I couldn’t defer online, so I emailed them and they gave me a one month deferral. My next date is March 20 which I plan to go to. I’m not sure if I could’ve deferred again but I didn’t want to eventually get stuck with a very bad date down the road.

I’m a physician and these have all been relatively short notice, requiring me to reschedule 30+ appointments that were already booked. Very frustrating for me and not all patients are super understanding of that because they had already made their own arrangements to be at their appointment.

I definitely do not want to be picked. I don’t care about my civic duty because my primary duty is to my patients and if I’m selected for the jury and have to miss multiple days or even weeks, that’s highly problematic for everyone. I realize other people also have important jobs and jury duty is rarely convenient, but this is potentially a huge pain in the ass and it’s understandable why people really wouldn’t want to do it.

[royiv 9326]

47 minutes ago, wild_turkey said:

I don’t care about my civic duty because my primary duty is to my patients and if I’m selected for the jury and have to miss multiple days or even weeks, that’s highly problematic for everyone. I realize other people also have important jobs and jury duty is rarely convenient, but this is potentially a huge pain in the ass and it’s understandable why people really wouldn’t want to do it.

So other people have important jobs, but it’s just that yours is MORE important than everyone else’s. GTFO with that bullshit, doc. I hope you get seated on a six week trial.

[Armybrat 40853]

Just stare closely at the questioning lawyer’s neck or forehead and comment, “You should have that checked out”.

[wild_turkey 3168]

41 minutes ago, royiv said:

So other people have important jobs, but it’s just that yours is MORE important than everyone else’s. GTFO with that bullshit, doc. I hope you get seated on a six week trial.

I never said anywhere in my post that my job is more important than anyone else's job. I said that it's problematic with my line of work, and I can understand that it would be problematic for many other working people as well, and it's no surprise that people want to get out of it, myself included.

[royiv 9326]

3 minutes ago, wild_turkey said:

I never said anywhere in my post that my job is more important than anyone else's job. I said that it's problematic with my line of work, and I can understand that it would be problematic for many other working people as well, and it's no surprise that people want to get out of it, myself included.

Oh, sorry, I must have implied that when you said you don’t give a fuck about your civic duty because of your all important job. Eat a dick. You’re no more important than anyone else. Get over it.

[MonkeyDoughnut 10326]

I've always wanted to serve on a jury... 50+ years old and have only been summoned 3 times, picked and served once for about an hour process....

It seems being available and wanting to serve is a recipe for never getting to serve.

[mdmost 43008]

37 minutes ago, royiv said:

Oh, sorry, I must have implied that when you said you don’t give a fuck about your civic duty because of your all important job. Eat a dick. You’re no more important than anyone else. Get over it.

[wild_turkey 3168]

30 minutes ago, royiv said:

Oh, sorry, I must have implied that when you said you don’t give a fuck about your civic duty because of your all important job. Eat a dick. You’re no more important than anyone else. Get over it.

Man, sorry if I struck a nerve with that, but yeah I do care more about my job than I care about being on a jury. That doesn't mean my job is more important than yours or anyone else's, nor did I ever say anything along those lines. It simply means that in my own personal list of priorities, showing up for work is more important to me than whatever civic duty I am supposed to feel in regards to being on a jury.

I try pretty hard to avoid unplanned absences because I know how that affects other people, especially on short notice. I feel like when someone makes an appointment to see me, that I have a commitment to them and I need to be respectful of their time. Maybe they've scheduled their own work around that appointment, or maybe they have a family member traveling from out of town to help them. Whatever the case, there's a ripple effect for some people and I try to minimize that as much as possible.

Am I unique in this? Certainly not, which is why I said that I understand why other people would also want to get out of jury duty.

[TwiceHorn 31510]

I get summoned every other year, just about.  Seems like more in the last 10 years.  I'm fairly unlikely to be selected as lawdogs are not popular jurors.

I did get to the point of actual voir dire for a criminal case about 25 years ago and was like 15th on the panel.  On the one hand, it would be a helluvan experience for a lawdog.  On the other, I was thinking of all the shit I had to do in the next 10-14 days.

I also was on a JP voir dire panel and did not get struck or challenged for cause, but because it was only a six-person jury, I didn't make it.

I think they pled it out, because they came back and dismissed us all.

[royiv 9326]

2 hours ago, wild_turkey said:

Man, sorry if I struck a nerve with that, but yeah I do care more about my job than I care about being on a jury. That doesn't mean my job is more important than yours or anyone else's, nor did I ever say anything along those lines. It simply means that in my own personal list of priorities, showing up for work is more important to me than whatever civic duty I am supposed to feel in regards to being on a jury.

I try pretty hard to avoid unplanned absences because I know how that affects other people, especially on short notice. I feel like when someone makes an appointment to see me, that I have a commitment to them and I need to be respectful of their time. Maybe they've scheduled their own work around that appointment, or maybe they have a family member traveling from out of town to help them. Whatever the case, there's a ripple effect for some people and I try to minimize that as much as possible.

Am I unique in this? Certainly not, which is why I said that I understand why other people would also want to get out of jury duty.

God forbid you ever get sued for malpractice and need to rely upon a jury to determine whether or not you fucked up. 

[Celery Man 20975]

I got summoned last year but my wife was out of town and we had nobody to watch the kid. Asked to be rescheduled as I would actually love to serve on a jury but nope, canceled.

[shadow_operative2.0 16008]

@wild_turkey, what court did you get? They sent me to the new civil one last year, that shit was sweet. No cattle call room. 

[Revolution512 1491]

2 hours ago, royiv said:

God forbid you ever get sued for malpractice and need to rely upon a jury to determine whether or not you fucked up. 

His jury room will be filled with folks whose compensation for serving pays more than their day job. Best of fucking luck.

Get your asses in those jury rooms. The level of intelligence in those rooms is absolutely frightening.

[Gil Bang 25980]

On 10/20/2021 at 8:44 AM, Knoxtnhorn said:

The jury I sat on 3 years ago awarded something like 11 million against one person.  Dude was scamming Park Place Autos (DFW).  His scheme was amazingly dumb.  I don't recall the specifics, but it was something along the lines of buying a car as a sales manager, then reselling it for profit.  But, he wouldn't deliver the car title.  Then he'd shift funds from one bank to another to cover for older debts. 

I wish I could remember how he did it.  Suffice to say, it all caught up with him at the end ala a pyramid scheme.

[wild_turkey 3168]

4 hours ago, royiv said:

God forbid you ever get sued for malpractice and need to rely upon a jury to determine whether or not you fucked up. 

Wow, okay. Let's back up for a second because I'm honestly interested in some adult discord on this subject, beyond you telling me to eat a dick or you hoping that I eventually get sued.

1. Do I want to have jury duty or be selected to be on the jury?  No. (simple answer, as I stated before)

2. What is my reason for not wanting jury duty?  I feel a strong sense of responsibility to my patients and don't want to reschedule a day of clinic, let alone multiple days or even weeks of clinic and/or surgical appointments. That responsibility applies to any unplanned absences - personal illness, family emergencies, ice storms, jury duty, etc. 

Which of my responses do you have a problem with?

If it is #1, do you feel that everyone should welcome jury duty with open arms? Look forward to it? Feel honored to take part in it? Any negative feelings towards jury duty make someone a bad person? 

If it is #2, where do you draw the line between a valid reason for wanting out of jury duty vs. an invalid reason or selfish reason? Please note that I am not asking for a list of actual legal exemptions because that has already been provided and I have already stated that I am going. I would merely be wondering, what in your mind constitutes a valid reason for an individual person to not want to do it?

[Prepuce of Doom 21091]

Nobody should like it. 

Everyone should do it. 

Why are you special? 

[wild_turkey 3168]

7 hours ago, Prepuce of Doom said:

Nobody should like it. 

Everyone should do it. 

Why are you special? 

I'm not special.

There seems to be some confusion between not wanting to do something and not doing something. At least for me, those are 2 different things.

I don't want to have jury duty.

I am going to jury duty.

I gave my reasons for not wanting jury duty, which seems to have struck a nerve with a couple people, but it doesn't change the fact that I am going to jury duty.

Although if I'm one of the people that gets dismissed before showing up, that would make me pretty happy. Sorry if that's a bad attitude to have, but I'm never going to want jury duty and I don't think that's a minority opinion on the matter.

[wild_turkey 3168]

12 hours ago, shadow_operative2.0 said:

@wild_turkey, what court did you get? They sent me to the new civil one last year, that shit was sweet. No cattle call room. 

I don't know yet. They are supposed to send a new summons in the mail soon. All I know is the date.

[MonkeyDoughnut 10326]

Jury duty is up there with voting and something I think every citizen should openly want to do.  I get that many don't want to do either.

People will also spend hours and hours talking about wanting a better neighborhood, better community, better society, but it won't happen if they don't participate and expect their neighbors to do the same.  It requires such a miniscule amount of time yet you'll get people already at the courthouse, already sitting waiting... complaining and yabbering about they have better things to do, places to be, all while the plaintiff and defendent have absolutely no more important time or place to be in their life than right there.

Jury duty falls into a category of hoping you are lucky enough and fortunate enough in life to only have to be at the courthouse as a juror and never as a plaintiff or defendent or family/friend of one.

[South Austin 52521]

As a trial lawyer who relies on people showing up for jury duty, I'll gladly appear if called.  But I've only been summoned once as far as I can recall, and it was a JP trial about four years or so ago.  I got an email the week before telling me the case had settled so I never had to show up.  For whatever reason I just don't get summoned.

[Doc Daneeka 6769]

48 minutes ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

Jury duty is up there with voting and something I think every citizen should openly want to do.  I get that many don't want to do either.

People will also spend hours and hours talking about wanting a better neighborhood, better community, better society, but it won't happen if they don't participate and expect their neighbors to do the same.  It requires such a miniscule amount of time yet you'll get people already at the courthouse, already sitting waiting... complaining and yabbering about they have better things to do, places to be, all while the plaintiff and defendent have absolutely no more important time or place to be in their life than right there.

Jury duty falls into a category of hoping you are lucky enough and fortunate enough in life to only have to be at the courthouse as a juror and never as a plaintiff or defendent or family/friend of one.

Yes and no.

Consider:

• I was a lawyer for a while.
• I was a programmer after that and pedantically detail oriented to the point I’d probably have been diagnosed with some sort of something if I’d been born a few years later.
• I will openly express my belief that cops, judges, and prosecutors are no more noble or honest than the public at large and they, like the public at large, often put results and ego ahead of honesty.
• I was one of the victims, though I hate that word I can’t think of another, in an attempted capital murder case.

It is not quite metaphysically impossible that I’d ever make it through voir dire to a criminal jury, but it’s pretty close. 

There’s some possibility I could make it onto a civil jury, but I probably have a better chance of winning $5000 a week for life from Publisher’s Clearinghouse. 

I’m not sure why I should openly want to deal with the hassle of the process for no real reason. 

[Jerry Callo 8707]

If you're an engineer, try to get out of jury duty.  Engineers are terrible jurors.  That's all - carry on.

[NeverMarryAStripper 21909]

The sad fact is that most Americans are just as bad at being a juror as they are at geography 

[Speedtrucker 2071]

If you're an engineer, try to get out of jury duty.  Engineers are terrible jurors.  That's all - carry on.

Engineers, teachers, commercial pilots…

I will find any reason to cut you from a fed trial.

[South Austin 52521]

25 minutes ago, NeverMarryAStripper said:

The sad fact is that most Americans are just as bad at being a juror as they are at geography 

I personally believe that US Americans are unable to do so because some people out there in our nation don’t have maps.

[royiv 9326]

13 hours ago, wild_turkey said:

Wow, okay. Let's back up for a second because I'm honestly interested in some adult discord on this subject, beyond you telling me to eat a dick or you hoping that I eventually get sued.

1. Do I want to have jury duty or be selected to be on the jury?  No. (simple answer, as I stated before)

2. What is my reason for not wanting jury duty?  I feel a strong sense of responsibility to my patients and don't want to reschedule a day of clinic, let alone multiple days or even weeks of clinic and/or surgical appointments. That responsibility applies to any unplanned absences - personal illness, family emergencies, ice storms, jury duty, etc. 

Which of my responses do you have a problem with?

If it is #1, do you feel that everyone should welcome jury duty with open arms? Look forward to it? Feel honored to take part in it? Any negative feelings towards jury duty make someone a bad person? 

If it is #2, where do you draw the line between a valid reason for wanting out of jury duty vs. an invalid reason or selfish reason? Please note that I am not asking for a list of actual legal exemptions because that has already been provided and I have already stated that I am going. I would merely be wondering, what in your mind constitutes a valid reason for an individual person to not want to do it?

It strikes a nerve because you're whining about something that, while it may be inconvenient to you, is an absolutely vital part of being a contributing member of society in this country. You should feel sense of responsibility to participate in the things that keep our system functional because you never know when you may be sitting in a courtroom at the plaintiff's or defendant's table. Having a sense of responsibility to your job and a sense of responsibility to our justice system are not mutually exclusive things.

[Jerry Callo 8707]

3 minutes ago, Speedtrucker said:

Engineers, teachers, commercial pilots…

I will find any reason to cut you from a fed trial.

I had Sam Sparks call the attorneys into his chambers for some Batson questioning.  I explained my reasoning for wanting to strike the potential juror for being an engineer.  Plaintiff's attorney agreed that engineers suck as jurors.  Judge accepted my strike with no issue.  Teachers were struck as well.

[UnivTex34 1763]

3 hours ago, Doc Daneeka said:

Yes and no.

Consider:

• I was a lawyer for a while.
• I was a programmer after that and pedantically detail oriented to the point I’d probably have been diagnosed with some sort of something if I’d been born a few years later.
• I will openly express my belief that cops, judges, and prosecutors are no more noble or honest than the public at large and they, like the public at large, often put results and ego ahead of honesty.
• I was one of the victims, though I hate that word I can’t think of another, in an attempted capital murder case.

It is not quite metaphysically impossible that I’d ever make it through voir dire to a criminal jury, but it’s pretty close. 

There’s some possibility I could make it onto a civil jury, but I probably have a better chance of winning $5000 a week for life from Publisher’s Clearinghouse. 

I’m not sure why I should openly want to deal with the hassle of the process for no real reason. 

Wait what now?

 

 

Have you told this story before, because, holy shit. 

(wait, were you the dude from the old site that had the druggies hold you hostage for days in your house? In Oklahoma I think? That was the only story on the site I remember that would come close to that.)

If not, holy shit, would love to hear details.

[Doc Daneeka 6769]

Just now, UnivTex34 said:

Wait what now?

 

 

Have you told this story before, because, holy shit. 

(wait, were you the dude from the old site that had the druggies hold you hostage for days in your house? In Oklahoma I think? That was the only story on the site I remember that would come close to that.)

If not, holy shit, would love to hear details.

You want to know about why I was a lawyer? It’s pretty embarrassing. Or do you mean the attempted capital murder thing?

[UnivTex34 1763]

3 minutes ago, Doc Daneeka said:

You want to know about why I was a lawyer? It’s pretty embarrassing. Or do you mean the attempted capital murder thing?

I bolded the capital murder line.

 

We have lots of lawyers here, regular hive of scum and villainy.

 

The attempted capital murder thing seems much rarer. 

[Native Horn 3504]

2 hours ago, NeverMarryAStripper said:

The sad fact is that most Americans are just as bad at being a juror as they are at geography 

Bro, if you don't like AMERICA, why don't you just move to a foreign country like Hawaii!!??

[Doc Daneeka 6769]

13 minutes ago, UnivTex34 said:

I bolded the capital murder line.

 

We have lots of lawyers here, regular hive of scum and villainy.

 

The attempted capital murder thing seems much rarer. 

I didn’t expand the quote (though I didn’t really need to).

Yeah, as long as it’s not too off topic, I can throw that in here. 

[UnivTex34 1763]

Just now, Doc Daneeka said:

I didn’t expand the quote (though I didn’t really need to).

Yeah, as long as it’s not too off topic, I can throw that in here. 

Hell, just start a new thread if you are worried about it (you could even put it in IPIHB to keep it away from prying eyes).

[Doc Daneeka 6769]

2 hours ago, UnivTex34 said:

Hell, just start a new thread if you are worried about it (you could even put it in IPIHB to keep it away from prying eyes).

I’m not sure what IPIHB is, but I suspect I don’t have access. 

Anyway, let’s get in the Wayback Machine to a time of landlines and no cellular. 

GF is moving to a different apartment. Her phone is turned off at her soon-to-be-old place and is on at her new place. I’m over there helping her move. We’re in bed and it’s maybe 1AM. A knock on the door. Fuck. Maybe he’ll just go away. Another knock. I really don’t want to get up to answer the door. Another knock. A pause. Wait, did he get in?

A hand holding what looks like a hunting knife flips on the light then the guy steps into the bedroom doorway. Well, hell. I get up, wearing nothing but underwear, and the guy backs up. He heads back toward the front door and I’m following him. GF gets up, also wearing just underwear, wraps a blanket around herself and follows. 

Shes asking what he wants, he’s babbling some bullshit. He gets to the door and, IMO, realizes he’s mid-felony with a couple of witnesses. He comes at me with the knife. I grab his wrist and hold the knife away from me. He squirming around, kinda sweaty by this point, and my hand slips off his wrist. He punches me in the gut with the knife. I don’t really feel anything, but blood is instantly everywhere. 

He heads toward the GF. By the time I get there he has her by the hair with the knife at her throat. He tells me to back up, I back up. He says to get in the bathroom, I say fine, just don’t do anything stupid to her. He says get over in the bathtub. I get in and he closes the door. I go right back out as he’s out the front door. GF is bleeding like a stuck pig from her chest. I get her blanket, tell her to keep pressure on her chest, and that I’m going to get someone to call 911. 

I knock on a couple of doors — well, pound on them is probably more accurate — but of course no one answers. I go down the stairs, across the parking lot, and head across a 5-lane road toward a Stop-n-Go. I’m holding my intestines in with my left hand. I’m pretty lightheaded by this point and my vision is swimming, but I get to the store and tell the guy working there to call 911. I sit on the sidewalk and watch this poor fucker mopping up my blood while I wait. 

Cop shows up first and wants to be Columbo. I’m telling him my GF has been stabbed, definitely dying if not dead, and he needs to go help her. He says he can’t leave me but calls another cop and another ambulance. I’m like “Go, go, go, fucking go” and he won’t. We can hear the ambulance by now and I tell him to send it to the apartment. That’s against policy, apparently. They get me in the ambulance and off I go. I’m trying to tell them to go to the apartment. Not happening. We hear sirens heading in the opposite direction and they tell me that’s the ambulance for the GF.

Detective is waiting for me at the hospital. They’ve already called my parents. I found out later they all figured I was as good as dead. Detective says they found a wallet in the apartment and they’re bringing it ASAP to see if I can identify the guy from the DL before I go into surgery. As they’re wheeling me down the hall he shows me the DL and I say, yeah, that’s him.

GF had been stabbed in the heart. She wasn’t breathing when the cop there because she’d fallen awkwardly. He straightened her head, the EMTs saved her. As it turns out, I didn’t die basically because I’m so big. I lost well over 5 pints of blood and they say a normal sized person wouldn’t have made it to the store. 

Anyway, they find the guy. They want to try him for burglary. I convince them to go for attempted capital murder. Both of our doctors say, basically, we should both be dead. The jury is terrified of this guy and want to know if there’s any way he could get their personal information. They convict him in less than an hour and give him 99 years and $10k.

DA is supposed to keep us informed about parole. Doesn’t happen. Twenty-ish years later, I find out he’s on parole. I get a CHL. Shortly after, he violates parole and goes back. He’s still there. 

[UnivTex34 1763]

[Jerry Callo 8707]

Ok.  Now the embarrassing story of why you used to be a lawyer.

[Doc Daneeka 6769]

4 minutes ago, Jerry Callo said:

Ok.  Now the embarrassing story of why you used to be a lawyer.

I liked LA Law and thought this whole fiasco seemed interesting. It turned out that dealing with lawyers was a lot like dealing with toddlers in nicer clothes. 

[Gil Bang 25980]

Got my summons today.   See you in court at the end or March.

[South Austin 52521]

15 hours ago, Doc Daneeka said:

GF is moving to a different apartment. Her phone is turned off at her soon-to-be-old place and is on at her new place. I’m over there helping her move. We’re in bed and it’s maybe 1AM.

This story started out with so much promise.

[Doc Daneeka 6769]

2 minutes ago, South Austin said:

This story started out with so much promise.

And I didn’t even include that she was a gymnast in high school. 

[MonkeyDoughnut 10326]

That is a crazy story, but I gotta know -  was this a stabbed together, stay together love story or a sign of things aren't great when we're together tragic breakup?

[Doc Daneeka 6769]

39 minutes ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

That is a crazy story, but I gotta know -  was this a stabbed together, stay together love story or a sign of things aren't great when we're together tragic breakup?

This was during the first semester of my sophomore year of college — my professors were uniformly douches about this — and we were together until the end of law school.