House of the Dragon

[MNLonghornFUKM 8817]

I have to ask. If you feel that way, why do you continue to watch it?

1) thrones kicked ass.

B) honestly- it started with footballs off-season going on so may as well stick with it

And D) somethings bound to go down. I think when king V kicks the bucket, it’ll get good.

There needs to be a damn battle. Fuck what’s there been? 9 deaths? And 4 of those were pregnant ladies and their kids?

[Kel Varnsen 8458]

1 hour ago, shadow_operative said:

of course i watched GoT. i just don't remember ever hearing this "greenseer" term.

They were called Wargs in the TV series. This greenseer thing reeks of papyrus people.

[Eskimohorn 5630]

Alt Shift X put forth a theory that Larys is a Greenseer and uses rats/the weirwood to spy in the palace. 
 
It’s possible. House Strong has the blood of the first men and I believe they worship the old gods. Additionally, Greenseers are usually deformed. 

I think he’s a Morlock or a Grendel or some other literary creature

[DDD Dad 14325]

7 hours ago, Eskimohorn said:

I think he’s a Morlock or a Grendel or some other literary creature

More likely the Derel. 

[Scary Stranger 1714]

More likely the Derel. 

The Derel was the worst.

[DDD Dad 14325]

Just now, Scary Stranger said:

The Derel was the worst.

 

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4975]

Yeah, something needs to happen. As others have echoed, there really isn't someone to root for. There also aren't many interesting characters with more than one dimension or likeable side characters. GOT also had plenty of plotting characters with unclear motivations. This show has Prince Philip and Larry the cripple, but everybody else is completely one dimensional and transparent. There needs to be more to the plot so that they have room to flesh out more of the characters, and there needs to be some sort of Ned Stark type honorable character(s) to be able to root for.

We also need a Bron.

[texanbychoice 354]

The Derel was the worst.

Hate the Derel.

[Kel Varnsen 8458]

58 minutes ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

We also need a Bron.

Or a Hound

Edited September 27, 2022 by Kel Varnsen
cunts

[huge 3793]

Greenseer might have been a book term.

[T’Boo Ted Marshall 2732]

Good episode.  A little choppy.

 

Wacking prince had me rolling.  

[Hozz 1017]

It's funny how polarizing this and Rings of Power are.  People seem to really love or hate them both.  Not saying you are gonna hate one if you love the other but if you browse the threads you get a lot of strong opinion on both sides.  Personally I am finding this show to be better than Rings.  Have not even watched that most recent episode and I am not sure when we will vs this which is appointment viewing for us.

I thought the aged up versions of the actors universally outplayed their juniors.  I will say I am surprised Vis is still around considering they showed his shit falling apart in the first episode which was like 20 years ago now.

[52-80 19147]

new rhynaera is really good

[Guest]

19 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

nobody in here hates the show, and absolutely nobody who is critical of it is posting about to somehow ruin it for the rest of you. i can't even wrap my head around this phenomenon which permeates this forum like wildfire. how in the hell does someone else's differing opinion from yours ruin a show for you? i cannot even imagine someone else's opinion of a show i like ruining it for me, and yet we have to relive this same exact song and dance in every single tv show thread in this forum. the people who like the show wail and cry and lash out at those who are critical of it, claiming these posts ruin the show for you, while you angrily and seemingly through tears ask why we all can't just leave you to your safe space and stop ruining your show for you. my god y'all need to grow up. 

btw, why do y'all keep watching UT football if you hate it so much? and why do y'all complain about it, ruining it for the rest of us? i still like UT football, but every week you guys come here and trash the team and their performance and you ruin it for me. why are you guys like this? why don't you just stop watching and leave this forum to those of us who always think that every single game is great and perfect? why guys?????

I can’t imagine typing two long paragraphs like that if you’re critical of a show. And yes, the messenger here matters. Just shut the fuck up. 

[DDD Dad 14325]

4 hours ago, huge said:

Greenseer might have been a book term.

2 hours ago, Porterhouse said:

I can’t imagine typing two long paragraphs like that if you’re critical of a show. And yes, the messenger here matters. Just shut the fuck up. 

[Pig Bellmont 8712]

5 hours ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

Yeah, something needs to happen.

Babies/mothers dying in child birth and sitting in castles having conversations about how to rule isn’t enough. GRRM made a name for himself killing off characters and creating interesting fallout, which is part of the reason Viserys still living still pains me. 
 

Like episode 1 he was dying and there was conflict created with the lack of heir. Then like 20 years pass and he’s still alive being useless. Clearly nothing important happened in most of those years because we didn’t even see it. Just die already so we can see a war or something. Im going to need more than kids teasing each other and training with wooden swords. 
 

I like the show, but I could use more plot in the story. Did we really need like 8 hours to get to this point?

[bschoolprof 6252]

2 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

I like the show, but I could use more plot in the story. Did we really need like 8 hours to get to this point?

Narratively, no. But for HBO to stretch this thing as long as they can, yes.  

[mdmost 42999]

15 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

Babies/mothers dying in child birth and sitting in castles having conversations about how to rule isn’t enough. GRRM made a name for himself killing off characters and creating interesting fallout, which is part of the reason Viserys still living still pains me. 
 

Like episode 1 he was dying and there was conflict created with the lack of heir. Then like 20 years pass and he’s still alive being useless. Clearly nothing important happened in most of those years because we didn’t even see it. Just die already so we can see a war or something. Im going to need more than kids teasing each other and training with wooden swords. 
 

I like the show, but I could use more plot in the story. Did we really need like 8 hours to get to this point?

He wasn't dying in episode 1. It was because his heir died in childbirth and he had to kill his wife to try to get the kid to survive that Otto mentioned we need to plan your succession. So he had no heir to speak of and Otto did not want that to be Daemon. Part of that was because he knew Daemon would lead them to war but also because he knew he would no longer be Hand. So then he puts his daughter out there to be an option for the King. The tension is directly because Otto is right. Alicent's kids are a threat to Rhaenyra's claim. So the King hanging on prolongs the tension while each jockey for their claim. Alicent is trying to discredit Rhaenyra just as her father did. I expect the tension to amp up and the preview seemed to indicate that. 

You guys need to calm your tits. Robert didn't die until episode 7 of the first season. Ned didn't die until episode 9. It wasn't until episode 8 that the series really ramped up. A lot of that early season was setting up the players, underlining the tension between Cersei and everyone else, exploring Robert's bastards which led to the discovery of why Jon Arynn died, and giving the backstory of the Mad King and Robert's Rebellion. Interspersed in that was Jon going to the Wall with Tyrion. The only extra tension came from Cat taking Tyrion prisoner and Jaime attacking Ned's men.  

Edited September 27, 2022 by mdmost

[Pig Bellmont 8712]

2 minutes ago, mdmost said:

He wasn't dying in episode 1.

I haven’t re-watched but weren’t the maesters already working on wounds that weren’t healing right?

I get the rest of your post, tho. I’m just looking for more events that force change to make it more interesting 

[Guest]

17 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

Babies/mothers dying in child birth and sitting in castles having conversations about how to rule isn’t enough. GRRM made a name for himself killing off characters and creating interesting fallout, which is part of the reason Viserys still living still pains me. 
 

Like episode 1 he was dying and there was conflict created with the lack of heir. Then like 20 years pass and he’s still alive being useless. Clearly nothing important happened in most of those years because we didn’t even see it. Just die already so we can see a war or something. Im going to need more than kids teasing each other and training with wooden swords. 
 

I like the show, but I could use more plot in the story. Did we really need like 8 hours to get to this point?

Are you not entertained (by afterbirth)?

[Eskimohorn 5630]

He wasn't dying in episode 1. It was because his heir died in childbirth and he had to kill his wife to try to get the kid to survive that Otto mentioned we need to plan your succession. So he had no heir to speak of and Otto did not want that to be Daemon. Part of that was because he knew Daemon would lead them to war but also because he knew he would no longer be Hand. So then he puts his daughter out there to be an option for the King. The tension is directly because Otto is right. Alicent's kids are a threat to Rhaenyra's claim. So the King hanging on prolongs the tension while each jockey for their claim. Alicent is trying to discredit Rhaenyra just as her father did. I expect the tension to amp up and the preview seemed to indicate that. 
You guys need to calm your tits. Robert didn't die until episode 7 of the first season. Ned didn't die until episode 9. It wasn't until episode 8 that the series really ramped up. A lot of that early season was setting up the players, underlining the tension between Cersei and everyone else, exploring Robert's bastards which led to the discovery of why Jon Arynn died, and giving the backstory of the Mad King and Robert's Rebellion. Interspersed in that was Jon going to the Wall with Tyrion. The only extra tension came from Cat taking Tyrion prisoner and Jaime attacking Ned's men.  

Comparing this show to early GOT is like comparing a rookie to Jordan.

The first 6 episodes could have been pared down pretty easily

[mdmost 42999]

18 minutes ago, Eskimohorn said:

Comparing this show to early GOT is like comparing a rookie to Jordan.

The first 6 episodes could have been pared down pretty easily

If HBO was doing a limited series, sure. They're wanting to get multiple seasons out of one book's worth of content. 

[Skipper 6127]

15 minutes ago, Eskimohorn said:

The first 6 episodes could have been pared down pretty easily

Not sure I agree with that.  Just because there hasn't been a lot of "action" doesn't mean all of the backstory leading up to whatever is about to break out hasn't needed to be explained.  What do you think they could they have just glossed over?  My only complaint is I don't think some of the writing has been up to par and some of the story hasn't been developed enough (i.e. the motivation for the gimp taking out his family).  If he's going to have a major role I feel like we needed to see more of his backstory.  Instead, one day he decides to start manipulating Alicent out of nowhere then is taking out his family/the Hand the next episode.  But considering you have half of this thread thinking it's moving too fast and the other half bitching about it being too slow/not enough action I can see how there probably wasn't a perfect answer.

[52-80 19147]

So targaryen and velaryons all have jet white hair. Its basically their most prominent feature. 

And rhaenyra pops out 3 black haired kids and their parentage is sort of a hush-hush until it finally reaches a fever pitch. Like its not already the realms #1 debacle from day 1?

Also viserys 2 kids - particularly the younger one - are supposed to show obvious physical signs of incestuous deformities right 

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4975]

How come she is the only Targ that pops out brown headed kids when the father ain't a Targ? How come none Alicent's little shitheads are brown headed?

[Mr. Drummond 2198]

44 minutes ago, mdmost said:

If HBO was doing a limited series, sure. They're wanting to get multiple seasons out of one book's worth of content. 

So far this is about 6 pages of book's worth.   And i am loving the slow build up.   If you would have told me we would be 6 episodes in before any dance of dragons stuff, i would have thought it would have been a disaster, but i really like it.   

But my favorite show is mad men and lots of people complained that nothing ever happened in that show too.

[kingkoopa6 8345]

 

[DanRydell 799]

How come she is the only Targ that pops out brown headed kids when the father ain't a Targ? How come none Alicent's little shitheads are brown headed?

Yeah, this makes no sense George.

[52-80 19147]

25 minutes ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

How come she is the only Targ that pops out brown headed kids when the father ain't a Targ? How come none Alicent's little shitheads are brown headed?

Maybe in the non-scientific logic the “stronger” targ traits win out, which is why alicents kids are white. 
 

but it conflicts with rhaenyras. 
 

also isnt it weird she just delivered a kid, and then walks across the castle, and virtually nobody bats an eye except for one person. Is she that much of a persona non grata that none of the courtiers care?

[DanRydell 799]

1 hour ago, Eskimohorn said:

Comparing this show to early GOT is like comparing a rookie to Jordan.

The first 6 episodes could have been pared down pretty easily

The pacing of this show so far is all sorts of fucked IMO.

They're throwing a lot of plot at viewers but then not really giving the show room to breathe or doing the work that's necessary to let people really get to know and love/hate the characters. If these characters aren't really important and we just need to some major plot points for later, this is pure prologue and probably should have just been done through interspersed flashbacks or something. If they're intending to convey something other than prologue, then the first five episodes should have been drawn out for a full season.

This show feels like it would have chopped Ned's head off halfway through episode two, which doesn't land remotely the same as doing so in episode 9. 

[mdmost 42999]

23 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

Maybe in the non-scientific logic the “stronger” targ traits win out, which is why alicents kids are white. 
 

but it conflicts with rhaenyras. 
 

also isnt it weird she just delivered a kid, and then walks across the castle, and virtually nobody bats an eye except for one person. Is she that much of a persona non grata that none of the courtiers care?

If Alicent is painting her as a whore to everyone in court then it would stand to reason that most in her Red Keep are against Rhaenyra. Part of me does agree with Alicent, you really couldn't get hubby to stick it in just once to have a proper child? It's pretty blatant. 

Based on GOT, the father's features being more prominent in the sons was directly what led Ned to figure out Jaime was the father of Joffrey. 

[Eskimohorn 5630]

GOT universe wasn’t about character development as much as cultural development and what fear and greed and the environment and beliefs do to humans. And what drives these people. What the world is. Early GOT was similar to The Wire in that regard.

The show needs to breathe, but this last episode could have been the series premiere and I’m guessing it would be a better starting point. They could have made this episode into 2 or 3 episodes.

Things like the Kings decision to tap out his wife could have been a dramatic confrontation or confession in the present. Just like when Tyrion and Cersei fought over his role in his own mother’s death. Great scenes. Better than actually seeing it. Get some blood boiling and direct conflict at times.

This past episode was closest to GOT, and the early episodes reminded me of the dreary storytelling of Dune, except without stunning visuals throughout.

[Jerry Callo 8698]

6 minutes ago, DanRydell said:

The pacing of this show so far is all sorts of fucked IMO.

They're throwing a lot of plot at viewers but then not really giving the show room to breathe or doing the work that's necessary to let people really get to know and love/hate the characters. If these characters aren't really important and we just need to some major plot points for later, this is pure prologue and probably should have just been done through interspersed flashbacks or something. If they're intending to convey something other than prologue, then the first five episodes should have been drawn out for a full season.

This show feels like it would have chopped Ned's head off halfway through episode two, which doesn't land remotely the same as doing so in episode 9. 

It's a little slow and a little clunky, but I'm not sure how the plot gets developed without the starting episodes and then the jump. 

Information that seems essential to the story (I haven't read anything, but have a pretty good idea where things are headed based upon spoilers in GOT): 

Act 1:  Viserys gets the throne over the other lady.  Viserys first born son and wife dies in child birth.  Viserys brother is a PITA and Viserys names Rhae as heir to the throne.  Rhae and Ali are good friends who are driven apart mainly due to Ali's concerns about succession - ignited by her father.  Rhae and Uncle have some mutual feelings for each other since she was about 14.  Remaining house of Strong guy is devious, conniving, and has Ali's ear.  Ser Cole tapped that ass and then was made to feel like a little whore.  Ali gets Ser Cole as her ally.  Rhae marries gay cousin.  Viserys health is steadily declining.

Act 2:  Viserys health continues its inevitable, but very slow decline.  Rhae has a bunch of kids that everyone knows aren't from the gay cousin.  Ali has a bunch of kids that would be heirs to the throne but for Rhae.  Devious Strong guy gains power by killing his father and brother and subtly implicating Ali in the plot.  Uncle's wife dies putting him back on the market. (all in one episode)

If they would have split the acts into separate seasons, it would have stretched out too much.  Flashbacks to get all of the information from Act 1 would have been choppy and confusing.     

[Haphap 741]

I noticed that the Grand Maester  who only knows leeching was gone from the last episode.  I had the impression since episode 1 that he was an incompetent healer, probably what making the King's health worse.  

[kingkoopa6 8345]

30 minutes ago, mdmost said:

Based on GOT, the father's features being more prominent in the sons was directly what led Ned to figure out Jaime was the father of Joffrey. 

[52-80 19147]

27 minutes ago, mdmost said:

If Alicent is painting her as a whore to everyone in court then it would stand to reason that most in her Red Keep are against Rhaenyra. Part of me does agree with Alicent, you really couldn't get hubby to stick it in just once to have a proper child? It's pretty blatant.

even if she was abhored in the court, fact stands that she was the declared heir to a king on his way out.  she should have more than a few allies hedging on that bet alone. 

the show makes it seem like she lives in isolation with her fuckboi guard.

[Buzzrock 14902]

6 hours ago, Hozz said:

It's funny how polarizing this and Rings of Power are.  People seem to really love or hate them both.  Not saying you are gonna hate one if you love the other but if you browse the threads you get a lot of strong opinion on both sides.  Personally I am finding this show to be better than Rings.  Have not even watched that most recent episode and I am not sure when we will vs this which is appointment viewing for us.

I thought the aged up versions of the actors universally outplayed their juniors.  I will say I am surprised Vis is still around considering they showed his shit falling apart in the first episode which was like 20 years ago now.

Wasn't it a ten year jump between episodes?

RoP turns me off because a megacorp spent a bunch of money on beloved art and then made up a bunch of shit to satisfy their own wants because they couldn't think of anything good on their own. I checked out of that one and I don't shit in that thread, but I do read it, hoping that I see some "Wow that was awesome!" to make me go back and try again. So far that hasn't happened. I'll give it another chance when I can binge the whole thing.

Hot D is based on actual source material (which I haven't read) so that's not the problem. Most of the complaints around Hot D seem to be the slow pacing, and that's fair. But I always liked all the political maneuvering in GoT and I like it here too. It's like they are playing some sort of Game...

[Jerry Callo 8698]

1 minute ago, 52-80 said:

even if she was abhored in the court, fact stands that she was the declared heir to a king on his way out.  she should have more than a few allies hedging on that bet alone. 

the show makes it seem like she lives in isolation with her fuckboi guard.

I think the issue comes with the bastard sons.  

[mdmost 42999]

6 minutes ago, Jerry Callo said:

I think the issue comes with the bastard sons.  

Right. Alicent is not the only one who thinks she's illegitimate as heir. That's even before you get into the bastard children. The mother-in-law spelled it out for Rhaenyra after she was named heir. The kingdom will tear itself apart when the King dies and she is supposed to take over. Why she gave people fresh ammo doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Yeah, the husband is gay but there's a bit of you need to do your duty and knock her up just to keep your grasp on the throne and your family's legacy. 

And I'm sure being the third wheel while waiting around for the King to die is pretty isolating. Especially if the Queen is freezing you out at every turn. 

Edited September 27, 2022 by mdmost

[Hozz 1017]

46 minutes ago, Buzzrock said:

Wasn't it a ten year jump between episodes?

I was talking total across the series from when we first see him to the last episode.

[billfromlaketravis 11447]

I admire Viserys resolve. Alicent hasn't been able to wear him down in 10 years. That’s a long time to keep telling your wife no.

It feels like Alicent is in over her head. Trusting Larys was a mistake. 
 

Meanwhile, Rhae has a screw you attitude that isn’t conducive for ruling Westeros. Leaving King’s Landing for Dragonstone was a curious move. Thousand of people saw her bastards. They’re not going to forget about it because she moved to a different town. 
 

GRRM said an interview that all of the characters on HOTD are gray. They’re all good and evil. It’s hard to see any good in Larys, but hey we’ll see. 

 

I’m probably Team Alicent right now, but that could be subject to change. I’ll probably root for whomever the Starks/The North support. 

[closetohumping 17434]

Fuck Alicent.  Team nobody for now

 

 

 

 

[Catdaddyhorn 3444]

22 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

of course i watched GoT. i just don't remember ever hearing this "greenseer" term.

The kid who led Bran up north was a greenseer. 

[shadow_operative 15932]

24 minutes ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

The kid who led Bran up north was a greenseer. 

i know who jojen reed is, but i don't ever remember hearing the term "greenseer". at this point it just seems that someone has outed themselves as a bookfag.

[kingkoopa6 8345]

i though reed sis was a cutie.. was thinking she was gonna be jonny's sis or something .

she was draggin that crippled fuck like a beast too

[Buzzrock 14902]

Team Daemon

[Hank_Hill 18791]

Just Google the family tree to see where the drama is heading. Or don’t, cuz spoilers.

[52-80 19147]

10 hours ago, Buzzrock said:

Team Daemon

always back the dark horse

[DDD Dad 14325]

12 hours ago, Catdaddyhorn said:

The kid who led Bran up north was a greenseer. 

 

11 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

i know who jojen reed is, but i don't ever remember hearing the term "greenseer". at this point it just seems that someone has outed themselves as a bookfag.

 

[thrillhammer 683]

On 9/27/2022 at 7:05 AM, Scary Stranger said:

The Derel was the worst.

as was his other cousin derel