Alec Baldwin Shoots and Kills Cinematographer, Wounds Director

[Reagan1k 3002]

That's the thing that always held back my potential acting career....I just don't ever think I'd feel comfortable pointing a real weapon, even with blanks or empty, at a human unless it was necessary for self defense....

[SizzleChest 8243]

As a producer, Baldwin will be accountable for civil damages the dead DP and the injured Director will no doubt claim (her family / survivors).

So, this is not just going to be an emotional pain that will never go away for him, it’s likely to be a financial one as well, especially if insurance won’t pay.

[Archer 474]

[Judge Roybeanbag 11730]

6 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

Drink too much and be angry. Oh wait...

New surly motto.

[Steel Shank 9337]

9 minutes ago, Reagan1k said:

That's the thing that always held back my potential acting career....I just don't ever think I'd feel comfortable pointing a real weapon, even with blanks or empty, at a human unless it was necessary for self defense....

Me, too. But I got over it and now I'm a superstar.

Edited October 22, 2021 by Steel Shank

[Pato del Muerto 52114]

25 minutes ago, Judge Roybeanbag said:

New Mexico is an "open carry" state, which means that it's legal for most adults to openly carry guns and other deadly weapons in public without a license. 

The play guns and the real guns can get mixed up.  Don't point a gun at someone, ever, unless you want to kill them, I get.  On a movie set where you are actually tasked with shooting someone with a fake gun, not so much.  I don't have a point here other than this is a tragedy and it sucks for everyone involved.  

You still don’t have to point a gun at anyone. Camera perspective can allow you to point it to the side of who you are supposed to be aiming at. And there’s no reason for those behind the camera to ever be in the line of fire, or if they really do need to be there then provide shielding.  It’s a 100% avoidable situation, even on a set. 

[BabaYaga 15184]

12 minutes ago, Judge Roybeanbag said:

New Mexico is an "open carry" state, which means that it's legal for most adults to openly carry guns and other deadly weapons in public without a license. 

The play guns and the real guns can get mixed up.  Don't point a gun at someone, ever, unless you want to kill them, I get.  On a movie set where you are actually tasked with shooting someone with a fake gun, not so much.  I don't have a point here other than this is a tragedy and it sucks for everyone involved.  

I highly doubt anyone is allowed to open carry on any set, regardless of state laws.  

[Deej 76218]

14 minutes ago, Reagan1k said:

That's the thing that always held back my potential acting career....I just don't ever think I'd feel comfortable pointing a real weapon, even with blanks or empty, at a human unless it was necessary for self defense....

I've always been kind of a pacifist. When I was a kid, my father told me, "Never hit anyone in anger, unless you're absolutely sure you can get away with it." I don't know what kind of soldier I'm gonna make, but I want you guys to know that if we ever get into really heavy combat... I'll be right behind you guys. Every step of the way.

 

[Cheeseweasel 26437]

16 minutes ago, Reagan1k said:

That's the thing that always held back my potential acting career....I just don't ever think I'd feel comfortable pointing a real weapon, even with blanks or empty, at a human unless it was necessary for self defense....

[cabowabo 4390]

18 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

I highly doubt anyone is allowed to open carry on any set, regardless of state laws.  

An even if they are, they sure as hell aren't carrying anything that shoots 45 Long Colt.

Edited October 22, 2021 by cabowabo

[henrygandorf 28873]

21 minutes ago, SizzleChest said:

As a producer, Baldwin will be accountable for civil damages the dead DP and the injured Director will no doubt claim (her family / survivors).

So, this is not just going to be an emotional pain that will never go away for him, it’s likely to be a financial one as well, especially if insurance won’t pay.

[Sbbruin 21588]

36 minutes ago, South Austin said:

Wait, so you're confessing to have spent a week with Brandon Lee and subsequently communicated with him for a period of time, and then he's mysteriously killed?  Very suspect. 

[BabaYaga 15184]

7 minutes ago, cabowabo said:

An even if they are, they sure as hell aren't carrying anything that shoots 45 Long Colt.

Exactly

[RPM 26097]

30 minutes ago, Reagan1k said:

That's the thing that always held back my potential acting career....I just don't ever think I'd feel comfortable pointing a real weapon, even with blanks or empty, at a human unless it was necessary for self defense....

Trust me, I know what I'm doing.

 

[TriStone 1724]

He was consistently great on 30 Rock.  I forgive him.

[BabaYaga 15184]

9 minutes ago, cabowabo said:

An even if they are, they sure as hell aren't carrying anything that shoots 45 Long Colt.

['stache 21589]

37 minutes ago, SizzleChest said:

As a producer, Baldwin will be accountable for civil damages the dead DP and the injured Director will no doubt claim (her family / survivors).

So, this is not just going to be an emotional pain that will never go away for him, it’s likely to be a financial one as well, especially if insurance won’t pay.

That’ll be an insurance claim.

[Michael Knight 12725]

 

[BabaYaga 15184]

10 minutes ago, 'stache said:

That’ll be an insurance claim.

Don't claims require all union rules to be followed to the letter before action can be taken?

[Deej 76218]

59 minutes ago, South Austin said:

Wait, so you're confessing to have spent a week with Brandon Lee and subsequently communicated with him for a period of time, and then he's mysteriously killed?  Very suspect. 

What's really odd was he never heard from him again until after he died. 

[C-Man 26734]

Was just coming here to post that picture. Jesus, what a nightmare.

[Guest]

Uh oh...that's some plot thickening shit right there.

Now we're blaming Chile?

Edited October 22, 2021 by slorch

[C-Man 26734]

Don't claims require all union rules to be followed to the letter before action can be taken?

???

I’ve never done entertainment insurance but I don’t understand what you’re asking. Assuming they had proper insurance, I assume this will max out the primary and excess limits. The carrier will likely subrogate against the propmaster’s policy if he has one (not sure if they’re treated like subs in contractors world). That will likely max out. The propmaster’s career in movies is over.

HG probably has a better feel for this since I’m sure GGW’s insurance came up all the fucking time! Lol

[BabaYaga 15184]

Just now, slorch said:

Uh oh...that's some plot thickening shit right there.

Gruntled associate sabotages Baldwin?  or did I misread the sitaution?

If so, quite the stretch and a lot can go wrong.  Not hard to walk back who loaded the gun and gave it to Baldwin.  But who knows?

This is like the Captain of the sub that struck something.  The who/what/why doesn't matter.  It's your boat, and your ass....

['stache 21589]

Just now, BabaYaga said:

Don't claims require all union rules to be followed to the letter before action can be taken?

No, the possibility that something would occur outside those guidelines is precisely why insurance exists. There is often an exclusion for intentional conduct, but that only precludes coverage of the individual, the entity is still covered because, again, a purpose of insurance is to cover the possibility that on of your employees does something stupid, even if intentional on their part.

 

[Guest Lobo]

To Gandalph's point about could be a difference between principal photography/rehearsal and just general time between takes...Baldwin's clothing in that photo suggests they were not actively filming.  Maybe rehearsal, could just be blocking, could be something altogether different.  

[BabaYaga 15184]

2 minutes ago, 'stache said:

No, the possibility that something would occur outside those guidelines is precisely why insurance exists. There is often an exclusion for intentional conduct, but that only precludes coverage of the individual, the entity is still covered because, again, a purpose of insurance is to cover the possibility that on of your employees does something stupid, even if intentional on their part.

 

Gotcha - but going forward, I cant imagine any future coverage that doesn't' have draconian restrictions in place if he tries to produce another film.  

[MAUFRAIS 6561]

"I wonder how it must feel to wrongfully kill someone..."

Immediately after making this statement, Alec realized that it was true.

[C-Man 26734]

[/url]  

Well, that could definitely change the calculus from an insurance standpoint. If you’re willfully negligent, it could be a problem. Baldwin being a producer puts more skin in the game so to speak. Nightmare fuel.

If you believe Celebrity Net Worth, he’s worth $60M. This won’t ruin him financially but it’s gonna hurt bad if the insurance doesn’t take care of things.

[Cajun 11659]

Can't believe not posted yet...

[Guest Lobo]

2 minutes ago, Cajun said:

Can't believe not posted yet...

Just the third post of the entire thread.  I mean, I didn't know how to post the gif/meme/whatever.  

The next one is so demented, but what's new?  But I thought the "How do you make a crew wanna get off a nuclear submarine?" thing was actually pretty fucking clever.  Because of the word "Crew."  But again, I had no visual aids.  

[Armybrat 40559]

Terrible tragedy that could have easily been avoided.

RIP to the lady.

It really will be an awful thing to live with.

[Judge Roybeanbag 11730]

1 hour ago, Steel Shank said:

Me, too. But I got over it and now I'm a superstar.

Biscuits and gravy on a toilet paper square doesn’t make you Tom Selleck lol. 

[SizzleChest 8243]

1 hour ago, henrygandorf said:

Who is accountable then?

[Guest]

[Cajun 11659]

14 minutes ago, Lobo said:

Just the third post of the entire thread.  I mean, I didn't know how to post the gif/meme/whatever.  

The next one is so demented, but what's new?  But I thought the "How do you make a crew wanna get off a nuclear submarine?" thing was actually pretty fucking clever.  Because of the word "Crew."  But again, I had no visual aids.  

I skimmed pretty fast just looking for that particular gif to jump out.

[Guest Lobo]

You skim faster than Alec Baldwin watching his downrange background.

[Johnny Sack 8397]

3 hours ago, 'stache said:

Some prop guy is super fucked, as is the production company, etc., etc. Baldwin himself will be fine legally if it really was a prop error. No criminal intent, not even negligence, if someone else is responsible for ensuring the prop gun is safe to use for shooting. Of course the cloak room folks will have a field day because of his spot on and super mean portrayal of their most favorite person evar.

Laments the cloak room.  Then goes cloak room.

[Dennis Taylor 18610]

1 hour ago, SizzleChest said:

As a producer, Baldwin will be accountable for civil damages the dead DP and the injured Director will no doubt claim (her family / survivors).

So, this is not just going to be an emotional pain that will never go away for him, it’s likely to be a financial one as well, especially if insurance won’t pay.

Alec Baldwin is known for his emotions all right, like screaming voice-mail calling his daughter a "rude, thoughtless little pig". Or cussing out a flight crew and running to the bathroom because he doesn't want to turn his phone off. Or coming to blows with John Q Public over a parking spot. But Alec Baldwin cares first, last, and always about Alec Baldwin.  He can undoubtedly give an award winning performance (assuming his lawyers allow it) about his profound sadness over the accident and how it will always haunt him.  And it will seem sincere as hell and you will want to believe him. But it's still exactly that, a performance. That's what he does, about as good as anyone ever has. It can be about the leads, or a Russian submarine commander, or the Massachusetts State Police,  or dozens of other roles he's played. Can Comedy Central do a second roast on this prick?

[Gil Bang 25680]

3 minutes ago, Dennis Taylor said:

Alec Baldwin is known for his emotions all right, like screaming voice-mail calling his daughter a "rude, thoughtless little pig". Or cussing out a flight crew and running to the bathroom because he doesn't want to turn his phone off. Or coming to blows with John Q Public over a parking spot. But Alec Baldwin cares first, last, and always about Alec Baldwin.  He can undoubtedly give an award winning performance (assuming his lawyers allow it) about his profound sadness over the accident and how it will always haunt him.  And it will seem sincere as hell and you will want to believe him. But it's still exactly that, a performance. That's what he does, about as good as anyone ever has. It can be about the leads, or a Russian submarine commander, or the Massachusetts State Police,  or dozens of other roles he's played. Can Comedy Central do a second roast on this prick?

Selfish pricks don't donate millions of dollars to charity. 

[Scary Stranger 1711]

5 minutes ago, Gil Bang said:

Selfish pricks don't donate millions of dollars to charity. 

They do if they can make sure everybody knows they did.

[C-Man 26734]

No, the possibility that something would occur outside those guidelines is precisely why insurance exists. There is often an exclusion for intentional conduct, but that only precludes coverage of the individual, the entity is still covered because, again, a purpose of insurance is to cover the possibility that on of your employees does something stupid, even if intentional on their part.
 

True, but there could’ve been some subjectivities included and if they weren’t followed, or were misrepresented by the production company, I would think that opens up the possibility of the denial of a claim. Again, I have zero entertainment/film insurance experience.

[TriStone 1724]

5 minutes ago, Gil Bang said:

Selfish pricks don't donate millions of dollars to charity. 

Sure they do.  I've known people for whom the money was less important than the adulation that comes along with giving generously.

[Judge Roybeanbag 11730]

2 hours ago, BabaYaga said:

I highly doubt anyone is allowed to open carry on any set, regardless of state laws.  

You’re wrong.   Try again.  

[Underdog 28229]

[Deej 76218]

Alec Baldwin slaying the pussy.

[Cheeseweasel 26437]

1 hour ago, slorch said:

Uh oh...that's some plot thickening shit right there.

Now we're blaming Chile?

I blame Jade's chili. 

[Judge Roybeanbag 11730]

3 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

I blame Jade's chili. 

Velveeta gonna serve some time.  

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

4 hours ago, Gil Bang said:

He's all of those things.  He's also an incredibly generous and charitable man.  When he was doing those credit card commercials, he donated every penny of the millions that he made to the NYU Theater Department. 

When Comedy Central offered him $ 1 million to be "roasted", he said no.  Then, he had dinner with Tony Bennett, heard about a charity that Bennett was working with, and went back to Comedy Central and said "yes", and donated the million to Bennett's charity.  

There are a lot of stories like that.   

Hey ……everyone needs tax writeoffs.

[Brisketexan 103648]

So, is the read we're getting as follows:

1 - the gun was loaded with a live round.  Which is an insane thing to see on an active set.

2 -- the propmaster was a 24 year old, likely a dumbass.

3 -- the crew had been complaining about unsafe conditions, including firearms.

4 -- Baldwin actually pointed the gun -- thinking it was just a prop -- at the victims, and pulled the trigger.

 

Those first three items may make criminal liability for Baldwin, who, as the producer, had full knowledge of items 2 and 3, an actual possibility.  Maybe criminally negligent homicide or the equivalent.

And yes, regardless of criminal and civil liability, he also has to live with the fact that he just took an innocent person's life.  Even if it was completely and totally not his fault and a total accident, it would STILL be a nightmare for the rest of his days.

TLDR; this story may be some seriously fucked up shit.