Cowboys vs 49ers: Wild Card Round

[JimmyJames 12271]

40 minutes ago, Hagbard Celine said:

i've been surfing looking for contemporary accounts of any of this, and in particular a potential move to LA

granted i was on the 40 at the time but i was home enough that i think i would have remembered hearing about this, and i don't

any contemporary sources on the intertrons for the above?

The Cowboys weren’t moving to LA. That’s some ludicrous bullshit. 

[Pato del Muerto 52498]

The rams were in LA through 1995 and the raiders thru 1994. The cowboys weren’t moving there in the 80s.

[Richard Kimball 1495]

1 hour ago, Hagbard Celine said:

i've been surfing looking for contemporary accounts of any of this, and in particular a potential move to LA

granted i was on the 40 at the time but i was home enough that i think i would have remembered hearing about this, and i don't

any contemporary sources on the intertrons for the above?

Took a look, and couldn't find a whole lot, but here's what I remember. 

Bum Bright was going through a divorce, and his bank, oil company, and the Cowboys were all losing money. He put the Cowboys up for sale. One of the guys that wanted to buy the Cowboys was Marvin Davis, a billionaire oil man from New Jersey. Davis moved to Denver and was an extremely shady businessman, who also owned 20th Century Fox and the Pebble Beach golf course. He'd sold most of his Denver holdings after getting 20th Century Fox, and was planning on consolidating in the LA area, and planned on moving the Cowboys to LA. It was weird, because the Raiders and Rams were both there, but he thought the area could support three teams. The Cowboys already had a big fan base in the LA area, as they'd been having their training camps in Thousand Oaks, CA, since 1963. In 1999, Davis was the guy that tried to get a stadium built in LA to get a new franchise there, when the NFL decided to expand. That franchise eventually went to the Houston Texans. 

Davis' son met with Bright and tried to work out a deal. According to legend, Bright sold to Jerry Jones because Jones was the only one who would agree to fire Landry and Schramm. He also didn't like or trust Davis. 

 

Edited January 18, 2022 by Richard Kimball

[dcar00 14208]

2 hours ago, Richard Kimball said:

 

Yeah, and it's easy to forget how insanely out of the ordinary Emmitt Smith was. He played fifteen years, when the average NFL running back plays about 2 1/2. With Sanders, Smith and Walter Payton, it wasn't just that they had great seasons, they had long careers. In his prime, I still think Earl Campbell was the best running back ever, but after the injuries...he was a shadow of himself. Also, you can't take five years to build a line. 

agreed.  that's why you need a very good OL coach.  Philbin sucks IMO but they fucked it all up in an effort to pacify Collins.  the dude is a potential All Pro Guard and a JAG Right Tackle.

[Hagbard Celine 10864]

4 hours ago, dcar00 said:

If I were Jerry I'd beg Payton to come(have no idea how this would work in the NFL) and then pay Quinn a boatload to stay.

no way Payton signs up to be a sycophant for the tyrant and his modus operandi

it is known

[dcar00 14208]

18 minutes ago, Hagbard Celine said:

no way Payton signs up to be a sycophant for the tyrant and his modus operandi

it is known

yeah, one can dream though...

[Texzilla58 4735]

i've been surfing looking for contemporary accounts of any of this, and in particular a potential move to LA
granted i was on the 40 at the time but i was home enough that i think i would have remembered hearing about this, and i don't
any contemporary sources on the intertrons for the above?

Kirk Kerkorian was making very public overtures about buying the Cowboys, with the intention of moving them to LA at some point. This would have been around 87/88. I don’t know if it progressed to KK actually making a formal offer. He had tried to buy teams previously and his ownership of the original MGM in Vegas (now Ballys) had blocked him due to the gambling issue back then. He sold the MGM in 86 so he came a knocking.

At the time Jerry bought the team they were losing a million a month. The payroll was loaded with a bunch of featherbed do nothing jobs. The facilities sucked with an outdoor weight area.

Jerry as an owner is responsible for the groundbreaking Fox deal and licensing deals.

[statsman 5470]

For the record, Landry and Schwann (two Texas Exes) had a good reason to treat Bright like a know-nothing shithead- Bright was a know nothing shithead. 
Bright was head of the Aggie regents when they tried to money whip Schembechler to TAMU, and did hire Sherrill. He actually thought Sherrill was a good football mind. 
His financial problems were more a function of the bets he made in banking going bad (S&L crisis) than profits and losses from owning the premier NFL franchise. 
Jerry Jones is a crappy owner, but I’m struggling to think of any way that Bright was better. 

[lilMAC25 3794]

20 hours ago, pyrohornIII said:

It wasn't the firing of Landry, but how it was handled.   A lot of fans had grown accustomed to the class of Landry, and Jones was the polar opposite.  

Those first SBs happened because he listened to JJ and didn't interfere.  And the Walker trade was big.  If there was ever a cake to be baked it was the team Switzer stepped into.

Like Pescado and Kimball said, it's always been about Jones' ego.  

Lol, fuck Jerry for personally flying to see Tom to give him the news. How low class was that?

 

 

and Jerry didn’t interfere? Jimmy wanted to trade Irvin after 99. Jerry stopped him. Dallas doesn’t win it all without 88.

[Hate 20108]

99? Do you mean 89? And I’ve never seen anything to indicate Jimmy wanted to trade Irvin. That was his guy and he needed people like Irvin in the locker room.

[statsman 5470]

It was low class because Jerry and Jimmy had already been photographed eating and drinking together, celebrating their new team, before he flew to Austin. In other words, he hired the new guy before he let the other guy go. 
 

As for Jerry’s role in building the team, and not letting Johnson trade Irvin…what is your source? Because if it’s from the Jones camp, you should be skeptical of accuracy. Jones is much like Switzer in that he is always ready to embellish (and even make up) stories to make himself look better. 

[statsman 5470]

It is possible for these three things to all be true:

1. It was time for Schramm and Landry to retire. 
2. Bum Bright was an asshole that didn’t know nearly as much about football as he thought. 
3. Jones is a classless hillbilly that doesn’t know nearly as much about football as he thought. 

[Trey3216 15346]

45 minutes ago, lilMAC25 said:

Lol, fuck Jerry for personally flying to see Tom to give him the news. How low class was that?

 

 

and Jerry didn’t interfere? Jimmy wanted to trade Irvin after 99. Jerry stopped him. Dallas doesn’t win it all without 88.

I actually think it is the gentlemanly thing to do.  Would you rather have had Jerry look Tom in the eye and tell him he was fired or Tom find out through the media that Jerry had fired him?  

[statsman 5470]

Tom did find out through the media that Jerry fired him. 

[Fudbelty 2788]

Tom and Jerry talk not going away.

[lilMAC25 3794]

33 minutes ago, statsman said:

Tom did find out through the media that Jerry fired him. 

Not really. 
 

Jerry took Jimmy to dinner. A cowboys beat writer saw them together and called in a photog. They took a picture and the beat writer wrote a story that Jerry was hiring Jimmy. People twist this to say that Jerry used the media to fire Landry, which isn’t true.
 

When Jerry actually hired Jimmy, he flew out to meet Tom personally. Tom tried to avoid Jerry by leaving his home. Jerry drove to the golf course to break the news.

 

There are plenty of reasons to loathe Jerry, a BS “he treated Tom Landry wrong” narrative isn’t one of them.

Boys Will Be Boys: The Glory Days and Party Nights of the Dallas Cowboys Dynasty https://smile.amazon.com/dp/0061256811/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_i_P3SVN18389KPG6ZPZY0W

 

 

 

Edited January 18, 2022 by lilMAC25

[lilMAC25 3794]

51 minutes ago, Trey3216 said:

I actually think it is the gentlemanly thing to do.  Would you rather have had Jerry look Tom in the eye and tell him he was fired or Tom find out through the media that Jerry had fired him?  

Considering Jerry did tell Tom face to face…

[Trey3216 15346]

1 minute ago, lilMAC25 said:

Considering Jerry did tell Tom face to face…

Exactly what I'm saying.  It's better to tell someone face to face.  

[lilMAC25 3794]

1 minute ago, Trey3216 said:

Exactly what I'm saying.  It's better to tell someone face to face.  

My bad. I misunderstood.

[statsman 5470]

Jerry screwed it up by going out to eat in public with Jimmy. That was a screw up. At that point, it doesn’t matter what back channels agreements are in work- the word is out that Tom is fired, and in a way that is demeaning to Landry. 
 

Have you noticed, in big time college coaching searches, what pains ADs and coaches go to in order to avoid premature public notification? That didn’t happen here. 
 

Jerry was a rube. He should have kept Jimmy in a hotel, out of view, until he met with Landry. He blew it. After that pic was published, Landry couldn’t go out in public without being hounded with media questions about being fired, a firing that had not yet happened. Jerry’s screwup put Landry in an embarrassing situation. 
 

Landry didn’t deserve to keep his job, but after almost 30 years, he didn’t deserve this embarrassment. 

[Landomatic 3813]

13 minutes ago, lilMAC25 said:

Not really. 
 

Jerry took Jimmy to dinner. A cowboys beat writer saw them together and called in a photog. They took a picture and the beat writer wrote a story that Jerry was hiring Jimmy. People twist this to say that Jerry used the media to fire Landry, which isn’t true.
 

When Jerry actually hired Jimmy, he flew out to meet Tom personally. Tom tried to avoid Jerry by leaving his home. Jerry drove to the golf course to break the news.

 

There are plenty of reasons to loathe Jerry, a BS “he treated Tom Landry wrong” narrative isn’t one of them.

Boys Will Be Boys: The Glory Days and Party Nights of the Dallas Cowboys Dynasty https://smile.amazon.com/dp/0061256811/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_i_P3SVN18389KPG6ZPZY0W

I always found the choice of Mia's Tex Mex to be odd for that dinner. I mean, it's a dinner between the owner of the Dallas fucking Cowboys and his new head coach, which hadn't been announced publicly yet, and you go to fucking Mia's? Nothing against Mia's, but of all the gin joints in town.

[tbone_ 14123]

Of course it’s bullshit.

It’s also not at all uncommon in the business world. New owners clean house. Usually unceremoniously.

Doesn’t mean Landry didn’t deserve better.

[tbone_ 14123]

And the Cowboys def needed a shot in the arm when he came along. But he lost me forever, and as a lifelong Cowboys fan from the early 70s, when he hired Barry Fucking Switzer.

I don’t give a shit about Barry’s background. I’ve read his book. Fuck him.

[Dennis Taylor 18823]

19 hours ago, Gravy Train said:

Why the fuck did HKS design a stadium with that much glass (non-diffuse, mind you) where the fucking endzones aren't oriented NORTH and SOUTH?!

Shithouse

I have it on good authority that one of the architetects at HKS HATES the Cowboys,  and his brother-in-law is an NFL referee. They got together and figured out that on the afternoon of January 16 , 2022 the sun would be in precisely the right place to fuck the Cowboys over if ATT was east/west oriented instead of north/south, and the rest is history

 

/Surly Cowboy fans

 

[Jiggy-Z 3432]

11 hours ago, Texzilla58 said:

Kirk Kerkorian was making very public overtures about buying the Cowboys, with the intention of moving them to LA at some point. This would have been around 87/88. I don’t know if it progressed to KK actually making a formal offer. He had tried to buy teams previously and his ownership of the original MGM in Vegas (now Ballys) had blocked him due to the gambling issue back then. He sold the MGM in 86 so he came a knocking.

At the time Jerry bought the team they were losing a million a month. The payroll was loaded with a bunch of featherbed do nothing jobs. The facilities sucked with an outdoor weight area.

Jerry as an owner is responsible for the groundbreaking Fox deal and licensing deals.

Not only all of of that , but Texas, in general, was floundering from the early 80's economic collapse in  real estate, oil, banking, and tech. The whole state was sagging with empty buildings, abandoned properties, and just a whole lot of nothing going on economics wise.

Much like the Longhorns, at the time, the Cowboys were living off of past glories. 

I actually credit both Jimmy and Jerry for putting together those championship teams.  Dallas was able to get a shit load of players through Walker trade and draft deals.  They also took advantage of the lack of salary cap.  Jimmy was not some kind of football genius as evidenced by his Miami tenure and we already know about Jerry's shortcomings. In addition, J & J just got real lucky on some things too.  Drafting Steve Walsh #1 in the supplemental draft was a huge mistake but accidentally worked out for them when they no longer had the #1 pick and had to take E. Smith #13 or something.  Drafting Russell Maryland #1 was not the best thing either.

But Jimmy sure did get a lot out of his players, many of which were drafted or otherwise acquired under Landry.

[BabaYaga 15298]

It was nice to see Kyler move around in the pocket last night...

[dcar00 14208]

57 minutes ago, lilMAC25 said:

Not really. 
 

Jerry took Jimmy to dinner. A cowboys beat writer saw them together and called in a photog. They took a picture and the beat writer wrote a story that Jerry was hiring Jimmy. People twist this to say that Jerry used the media to fire Landry, which isn’t true.
 

When Jerry actually hired Jimmy, he flew out to meet Tom personally. Tom tried to avoid Jerry by leaving his home. Jerry drove to the golf course to break the news.

 

There are plenty of reasons to loathe Jerry, a BS “he treated Tom Landry wrong” narrative isn’t one of them.

Boys Will Be Boys: The Glory Days and Party Nights of the Dallas Cowboys Dynasty https://smile.amazon.com/dp/0061256811/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_i_P3SVN18389KPG6ZPZY0W

 

 

 

correct.  Jerry did the right thing in telling Tom face to face.  It wasn't his fault(other than being seen with Jimmy) that the media screwed it up.  Everyone knew that Tom was likely to get fired.