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Star Wars - Ahsoka

UT_OB1

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CptnJiggleBits

CptnJiggleBits 915

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Just remembered the title of the episode was "Fallen Jedi". They could be referring to Anakin and if so that would reinforce the person in front of Ahsoka is in fact Darth Vader. Boy I hope Filoni pulls this off. I was thinking going into this series that however they present the World Between Worlds would either make this series crappy or awesome. I'm optimistic at this point now that they brought in Anakin/Vader

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They might be leaning a little too hard into the Japanese stereotypes when Thrawn said to kill any space whale, though. 

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It was always a cheap redemption. The dude was a genocidal maniac that served as an evil space wizard's right hand man but somehow earned redemption because he had a last minute change of heart while

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Surly Bevo

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Just remembered the title of the episode was "Fallen Jedi". They could be referring to Anakin and if so that would reinforce the person in front of Ahsoka is in fact Darth Vader. Boy I hope Filoni pulls this off. I was thinking going into this series that however they present the World Between Worlds would either make this series crappy or awesome. I'm optimistic at this point now that they brought in Anakin/Vader

Sabine isn’t a Jedi but she kind of fell.

Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate blah blah blah. She gave into her fear of losing Ezra forever.
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Smax

Smax 3800

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Fantastic episode
As someone mentioned above, not sure why Ahsoka didn't duel weild in either fight.

I know we need drama and suspense but, she bested Maul and held her own (sorta of) with Vadar.

Wondering if the map scared her hand has any significance

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Pig Bellmont

Pig Bellmont 8717

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I didn’t watch Rebels so I have no loyalty to Sabine as a character. She’s shitty. Gave them the map twice now - first by taking it off the ship, and second intentionally because she’s weak. I get that from a story telling point we need to advance bringing Thrawn back, but it’s Sabine’s shitty decision making that’s fucked the whole thing.

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Buzzrock

Buzzrock 14920

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Fantastic episode
As someone mentioned above, not sure why Ahsoka didn't duel weild in either fight.

I know we need drama and suspense but, she bested Maul and held her own (sorta of) with Vadar.

Wondering if the map scared her hand has any significance

I had the same thought. Raiders of the Lost Ark vibes.
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Murfdogg21

Murfdogg21 4412

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If Ahsoka is so righteous to sacrifice Ezra to avoid another war, she should have no problem using one of those world between world portals and hopping into Coruscant during Episode III and stopping Anakin’s fall, the republic/Jedi fall, and creation of the Empire. Or she could just go back and kill baby Sheev Palpatine on the toilet. FIN

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UT_OB1

UT_OB1 2220

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9 hours ago, CptnJiggleBits said:

Just remembered the title of the episode was "Fallen Jedi". They could be referring to Anakin and if so that would reinforce the person in front of Ahsoka is in fact Darth Vader. Boy I hope Filoni pulls this off. I was thinking going into this series that however they present the World Between Worlds would either make this series crappy or awesome. I'm optimistic at this point now that they brought in Anakin/Vader

The double entendre of the title amused me more than it should. Ahsoka was literally a fallen Jedi in the episode 

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MC Fresh Breath

MC Fresh Breath 4074

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I know that they need some kind of plot vehicle to get to Thrawn and maybe Ezra, but boy was I disappointed that they turned Sabine into a weak willed dumbass in order for it to happen.  Rebels era Sabine would have spray painted that Jedi's face and shot the map, imo.  If you love Ezra like family, why undo his sacrifice?    How many times did Ashoka ask if she could trust her? 

Otherwise enjoyed it.

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mdmost

mdmost 43001

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8 minutes ago, MC Fresh Breath said:

I know that they need some kind of plot vehicle to get to Thrawn and maybe Ezra, but boy was I disappointed that they turned Sabine into a weak willed dumbass in order for it to happen.  Rebels era Sabine would have spray painted that Jedi's face and shot the map, imo.  If you love Ezra like family, why undo his sacrifice?    How many times did Ashoka ask if she could trust her? 

Otherwise enjoyed it.

Baylon told you. She lost all her family in the Purge of Mandalore and she feels Ezra is the only family she has left. She's been sitting on Lothal since she and Ahsoka had a falling out. So she was easy to turn. She's not a Jedi. She's not worried about Thrawn. She only cares about getting Ezra back. 

I loved the episode but I'm not a fan of the World Beyond Worlds. I'm hoping it's not that and some other thread that will be revealed and make sense for Anakin/Vader to be there. 

Edited by mdmost
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Js1

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8 minutes ago, MC Fresh Breath said:

I know that they need some kind of plot vehicle to get to Thrawn and maybe Ezra, but boy was I disappointed that they turned Sabine into a weak willed dumbass in order for it to happen.  Rebels era Sabine would have spray painted that Jedi's face and shot the map, imo.  If you love Ezra like family, why undo his sacrifice?    How many times did Ashoka ask if she could trust her? 

Otherwise enjoyed it.

Considering how much force it took a lightsaber to destroy that map, her shot would have just ricochetted off into her face 

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oSuJeff97

oSuJeff97 3435

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11 hours ago, MissingInAction said:

Soo is Ahsoka dead now? I don't have the nerd peen the rest of you possess.

Not dead.

She's in the "World between worlds." 

Nerd mode: engage:

It's a plane of existence that exists between space/time. It was the original mode of faster-than-light travel in the SW universe before hyperspace travel was invented. It's accessible to some - but not all - force sensitive beings (both Jedi and Sith) from certain locations in the galaxy that are "inflection" or "nexus" points for the Force ... and typically there have been ancient temples built in those spots.

Ezra was able to access it in Star Wars Rebels and used it to essentially rescue Ashoka when she was dueling with Vader.

There's a lot of talk of it being "time travel" added to Star Wars but I don't think that's the intention. I think the idea is more akin to the "closed loop" time travel theory; e.g. Ezra didn't really "save" Ashoka or change anything by using the World between Worlds because that was always the thing that had happened.

I'm probably not explaining it very well but that's the concept.

 

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oSuJeff97

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12 minutes ago, mdmost said:

Baylon told you. She lost all her family in the Purge of Mandalore and she feels Ezra is the only family she has left. She's been sitting on Lothal since she and Ahsoka had a falling out. So she was easy to turn. She's not a Jedi. She's not worried about Thrawn. She only cares about getting Ezra back. 

I loved the episode but I'm not a fan of the World Beyond Worlds. I'm hoping it's not that and some other thread that will be revealed and make sense for Anakin/Vader to be there. 

She was definitely in the World Between Worlds there .... BUT.... it could also be a dream/hallucination since she has actually been there with Ezra.

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MC Fresh Breath

MC Fresh Breath 4074

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17 minutes ago, Js1 said:

Considering how much force it took a lightsaber to destroy that map, her shot would have just ricochetted off into her face 

Fair enough.   Can't recall if Sabine had her light sabre or not at that point in time.  And the whole Baylon telling her she lost everyone again to me wouldn't have played with Sabine previously.  Oh, I know, I'll give this thing to an obviously evil Jedi and hope it all works out.  Which, I guess thanks to plot stuff it just might.  It just really felt out of character for her imo.

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oSuJeff97

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9 minutes ago, MC Fresh Breath said:

Fair enough.   Can't recall if Sabine had her light sabre or not at that point in time.  And the whole Baylon telling her she lost everyone again to me wouldn't have played with Sabine previously.  Oh, I know, I'll give this thing to an obviously evil Jedi and hope it all works out.  Which, I guess thanks to plot stuff it just might.  It just really felt out of character for her imo.

Is he "obviously evil?" I'm not getting that vibe at all.

Yes he's one of the "antagonists" but it seems to me that they are going out of their way to show that he became disillusioned with the Jedi (just like Ashoka did) and his actions (in his mind) are for the "greater good", versus someone like Palpatine who is just craving power.

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UT_OB1

UT_OB1 2220

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37 minutes ago, oSuJeff97 said:

Is he "obviously evil?" I'm not getting that vibe at all.

Yes he's one of the "antagonists" but it seems to me that they are going out of their way to show that he became disillusioned with the Jedi (just like Ashoka did) and his actions (in his mind) are for the "greater good", versus someone like Palpatine who is just craving power.

I agree. He’s not black and white evil. Star Wars loves redemptions. Maybe setting up to redeem him in the end?

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Js1

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53 minutes ago, oSuJeff97 said:

Is he "obviously evil?" I'm not getting that vibe at all.

Yes he's one of the "antagonists" but it seems to me that they are going out of their way to show that he became disillusioned with the Jedi (just like Ashoka did) and his actions (in his mind) are for the "greater good", versus someone like Palpatine who is just craving power.

Yep, Fallen Jedi definitely applies to Bayland, Ahsoka and Anakin. 

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MC Fresh Breath

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2 hours ago, oSuJeff97 said:

Is he "obviously evil?" I'm not getting that vibe at all.

Yes he's one of the "antagonists" but it seems to me that they are going out of their way to show that he became disillusioned with the Jedi (just like Ashoka did) and his actions (in his mind) are for the "greater good", versus someone like Palpatine who is just craving power.

Obviously not on her side.  I type w/o thinking deeply sometimes.  Probably the wrong word to use. I didn't mean it judgmentally (although he did kill a bunch of folks already), but his very stated goal is the return of Thrawn.  As a viewer that's going to be awesome, but as a New Republic person that's not great.  I stick with my opinion, the Rebels era Sabine wouldn't have done this.  I mean, maybe she would have tried (and been unsuccesfu) to just run away with the map.  But it is only my opinion, ofc. 

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NorthLoop

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Damn that was too short. I think it's pretty obvious that we'll get some Purgill hyperspace action with Hera while Ahsoka will probably just otherworldwormhole her way to Thrawn. 

Also why does Hera bring her kid along? "Dangerous mission. We might die. Think I'll bring my young son instead of leaving him back on base." 

 

 

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oSuJeff97

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I think people who think Sabine is acting "out of character" need to go back and watch the episode where Kanan is training her with the darksaber.

She's petulant and pouty about needing to be trained. That's exactly how she's been acting, for the most part, when Ashoka is trying to train her.

Sabine is from a royal family on Mandalore. She's been trained to fight from a young age and she also just has that Mandalorian thing of not liking being told what to do.

The only person we've really seen her interact with in the Ashoka show (so far) is Ashoka and in student/learning mode. I think it fits exactly what we saw of her, in this regard, in Rebels.

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crash_davis

crash_davis 23108

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16 hours ago, CptnJiggleBits said:

That's what I'm thinking, and maybe Ahsoka has some way to guide/ help through the world between worlds. Just wondering where they're gonna go with it being Anakin or Vader. Opens up a lot of possibilities. Glad they're not just using him in a flash back. More I think on it, the possibilities could be pretty darn cool. A Vader Ahsoka battle? That would ignite my saber 

Ahsoka has the spirit/force of The Daughter in her. That and what someone pointed upthread about the temple place being a sacred place in time/space/realities may have something to do with her ending up in World between Worlds. 

 

The subtitles definitely stated "Vader theme" at the end of the episode.

Not loving the Sabine is an absolute fucking idiot shithead arc. Thrawn caused them and the galaxy so much pain in the Rebel series, especially the death of Kanan, it seems kinda stupid that she would ignore all of it and risk the galaxy just for a chance to see Ezra. But knowing Filoni, he's going to write an amazing redemption arc for Sabine. 

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ballrific

ballrific 215

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Not dead.
She's in the "World between worlds." 
Nerd mode: engage:
It's a plane of existence that exists between space/time. It was the original mode of faster-than-light travel in the SW universe before hyperspace travel was invented. It's accessible to some - but not all - force sensitive beings (both Jedi and Sith) from certain locations in the galaxy that are "inflection" or "nexus" points for the Force ... and typically there have been ancient temples built in those spots.
Ezra was able to access it in Star Wars Rebels and used it to essentially rescue Ashoka when she was dueling with Vader.
There's a lot of talk of it being "time travel" added to Star Wars but I don't think that's the intention. I think the idea is more akin to the "closed loop" time travel theory; e.g. Ezra didn't really "save" Ashoka or change anything by using the World between Worlds because that was always the thing that had happened.
I'm probably not explaining it very well but that's the concept.
 
Slightly alive!72fd302a252b98aacef59d3cfdfe5c5b.jpg
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Pig Bellmont

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1 hour ago, oSuJeff97 said:

I think people who think Sabine is acting "out of character" need to go back and watch the episode where Kanan is training her with the darksaber.

She's petulant and pouty about needing to be trained. That's exactly how she's been acting, for the most part, when Ashoka is trying to train her.

Sabine is from a royal family on Mandalore. She's been trained to fight from a young age and she also just has that Mandalorian thing of not liking being told what to do.

The only person we've really seen her interact with in the Ashoka show (so far) is Ashoka and in student/learning mode. I think it fits exactly what we saw of her, in this regard, in Rebels.

My comment was less of “she’s not making consistent choices” it was more that her choices are consistently shitty. Someone mentioned a redemption arc, but if you didn’t watch Rebels, there’s nothing redeeming about her character. Petulant and pouty is dead on

And for North Loop: HURRRR 🙄 god forbid we discuss the show

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oSuJeff97

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1 minute ago, Pig Bellmont said:

My comment was less of “she’s not making consistent choices” it was more that her choices are consistently shitty. Someone mentioned a redemption arc, but if you didn’t watch Rebels, there’s nothing redeeming about her character. Petulant and pouty is dead on

Well the "redemption" hasn't happened yet. I believe he was referring to the idea of her making a bad choice (giving the map back to Baylon instead of at least attempting to destroy it or run away) and then redeeming herself later in the show by coming to the point again where she has to make a tough choice but make the correct one.

I don't think it's any coincidence that they showed the recording of Ezra in the "previously on Ashoka" montage when he said (paraphrasing) "Sometimes you have to make the tough choice" or "the choice others can't make" (or whatever it was...something along those lines). 

She was put in a tough spot to make the tough choice and she didn't come through.  I'm willing to be she does later in the show.

And yeah - I'd think from a writing and characterization standpoint it's a tough line to walk -- establishing the character for those who didn't watch the 4 seasons of Rebels vs. fans who did watch.  Just from my perspective, I think the show is being written with the idea that you HAVE watched Rebels.  I don't know how it couldn't be since it really is basically a live action season 5. 

 

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oSuJeff97

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1 hour ago, A-Tex Devil said:

We aren’t supposed to know why Baylan thinks Thrawn is a good idea yet, right?  

Not exactly, but what I inferred from his speechifying was that he thinks the whole system of Old Republic/Empire/New Republic/Jedi/Sith needs to be razed to the ground. 

He was probably hoping the Galactic Civil War provided that in some form of mutually assured destruction, but when the Rebel Alliance miraculously won and just set itself up just like the previous "Republic" regime, he felt like we were right back where we started and there needed to be a new war that would hopefully burn the whole thing down so we could start over with something new.... sort of a galactic chaos agent to provide a hard reset.  And he thinks Thrawn is the man to help make that happen.

Just my .02

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crash_davis

crash_davis 23108

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As always, good and informative review from Screen Crush. Interesting what he says about Sabine. If it becomes true, the Fallen Jedi title also refers to her, in which case there wouldn't be a redemption arc, or maybe there is but it's a long play like Anakin/Darth/Anakin. Maybe Ezra ends up "saving" her.

 

 

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 89659

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On 8/26/2023 at 12:50 AM, atomheartbevo said:

If I were a betting man, I'd say either an unknown character (which could be a villain to setup future seasons) or Mara Jade.  We haven't seen her, and would be an extremely interesting way to bring her into Official Star Wars Canon, and the timeline would dovetail with her potentially hooking up with Luke.

Well, I was a little wrong about the inquisitor dude.

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