Ukraine War

[Gatorubet 30,313]

38 minutes ago, Kyrie Eleison said:

sometimes one “skunks the room” intentionally as part of a strategy, and that move includes walking it back.  

Not a single one of our allies will say, “I was going to support Putin leaving, but now POTUS said it I’m wanting Putin to stay. “

So the next question is: “Will a happy-with-the-West Putin change policy and not like us now?”   Silly, really. 

 I like it because it gives Putin’s internal enemies pause (and talking points) to consider options more seriously.    

 

 

[Gatorubet 30,313]

38 minutes ago, Kyrie Eleison said:

sometimes one “skunks the room” intentionally as part of a strategy, and that move includes walking it back.  

Not a single one of our allies will say, “I was going to support Putin leaving, but now POTUS said it I’m wanting Putin to stay. “

So the next question is: “Will a happy-with-the-West Putin change policy and not like us now?”   Silly, really. 

 I like it because it gives Putin’s internal enemies pause (and talking points) to consider options more seriously.    

 

 

[Bullneck 19,206]

1 hour ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

That is what I heard. In addition, there is a charity named No Kid Hungry and they are affiliated with Share Our Strength. They have been around for at at least a decade and partner with schools, etc. Their website lists all of their BoD, their partners, etc. But I don't think this is to whom Ivanka is referring.

HOWEVER, digging around for "No Child Hungry" I discovered a different charity that is registered (according to their website)  as a Florida 501c based in Orlando. I have no idea who is running it because their website just lists them as a partner program with My Neighbor's Children. My Neighbor's Children is only slightly more transparent and lists a couple of names and contact emails.

As for City of Destiny--that is Paula White's church. You remember Trump's spiritual advisor, don't you? Yeah. Her.

I also noticed how Ms. Brown Roots mentioned the brave *truckers. That was important. And you know why.

 

 

 

*I have no issue with sane, hard working truckers. Just crazy patriot convoy truckers.

Of course I remember.  Who could forget this solid groove?

 

[Hookah Horns 3,083]

2 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

The US has had high level officials promoting the removal of Putin for at least a decade.  It would ostensibly be done through an election.

Now, that's the hilarious part.  That said, we haven't exactly been quiet on the concept.

I still wonder why it's OK for Biden to call Putin a "butcher", a "war criminal", a "killer", but it's not OK to say he needs to go?  I mean, that would be the logical preferred outcome.  This is nothing but political posturing.

Because the US has an extensive history of trying to change regimes by means other than elections.

[Tuco 5,077]

6 minutes ago, Hookah Horns said:

Because the US has an extensive history of trying to change regimes by means other than elections.

And you think anyone interpreted Biden's comment as a prelude to the invasion of a nuclear power? Really?   

It's a controversy for anyone desperate for a controversy.  

[HenryJames 66,171]

 

[Dutchrudder 11,151]

7 minutes ago, HenryJames said:

 

Wtf is Bellingcat? Why would anyone believe a story like this without any other human sources reporting it?

[Brisketexan 105,334]

1 minute ago, Dutchrudder said:

Wtf is Bellingcat? Why would anyone believe a story like this without any other human sources reporting it?

I mean....I don't think Bellingcat is an actual CAT......

[bolverk 29,717]

1 minute ago, Dutchrudder said:

Wtf is Bellingcat? Why would anyone believe a story like this without any other human sources reporting it?

Bellingcat is one of the best, most respectable outfits that conducts open-source intelligence.

[GW Hayduke 1,953]

3 minutes ago, Dutchrudder said:

Wtf is Bellingcat? Why would anyone believe a story like this without any other human sources reporting it?

WSJ is reporting it also

https://www.wsj.com/articles/roman-abramovich-and-ukrainian-peace-negotiators-suffer-symptoms-of-suspected-poisoning-11648480493

[jimmyjazz 46,130]

3 minutes ago, bolverk said:

Bellingcat is one of the best, most respectable outfits that conducts open-source intelligence.

No doubt.  I don't trust Bellongcat one bit, though.

[Hookah Horns 3,083]

16 minutes ago, Tuco said:

And you think anyone interpreted Biden's comment as a prelude to the invasion of a nuclear power? Really?   

It's a controversy for anyone desperate for a controversy.  

🙄 We usually haven't done it via invasion. Sorry but it's a pretty big deal especially when the subject of the comment is a paranoid, aggressive lunatic consumed by fear of being overthrown. 

[Hookah Horns 3,083]

7 minutes ago, GW Hayduke said:

WSJ is reporting it also

https://www.wsj.com/articles/roman-abramovich-and-ukrainian-peace-negotiators-suffer-symptoms-of-suspected-poisoning-11648480493

Can we get some copypasta?

[956 Worldwide 34,770]

People need to get up off the fainting couch when it comes to Biden’s “ad lib.”  Russia does not actually respond to speeches and offenses.  At most, they will use the comments as justification to do what they wanted to do anyway, whether that is breaking all diplomatic relations or committing more horrendous crimes in Ukraine or cyber attacks or whatever.  Russia responds to actions and pain, and I promise you that they care far more about sanctions and weapons supplies and economic boycotts than an applause line in Warsaw.  

 

Russia and Vladimir Putin are well versed in the tactic of making outrageous statements and trying to deliberately offend and provoke.  Let’s remember that they regularly and predictably threaten the world with nuclear annihilation if things don’t go their way.  We have gotten so used to hearing it that we forget that it’s something no Western leader save Trump (and his big button) has ever done. Official Russian statements are a barrage of insults and outrageous lies. Dmitri Medvedev said that Biden was insane and senile, their Embassy in London claimed that the mothers who got bombed in Mariupol are crisis actors.  
 

Normal diplomatic behavior and rhetoric from Russia is simply behind the realm of civilized and they understand this very well. If this was almost any another country— yes, that line would provoke a complete melt-down. But not Russia. They watch what we do far more than what we say. 

[justhookit 4,191]

11 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

I mean....I don't think Bellingcat is an actual CAT......

[956 Worldwide 34,770]

11 minutes ago, Dutchrudder said:

Wtf is Bellingcat? Why would anyone believe a story like this without any other human sources reporting it?

Bellingcat is an investigative group that is among the best in the world in using data journalism and open sources.  Some of their best work has been on Russia and former Soviet Union but they’ve also nailed the U.S. on drone strikes, Syria for war crimes, etc.

Probably their biggest coup was figuring out the identity of the GRU operatives that tried to kill Sergei Skripal in the UK with a nerve agent, which led to the same operatives getting burned for other dirty tricks in Europe.

Christo Grozev is the best follow on Twitter for any Russian spooky shit. 

[Brisketexan 105,334]

3 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

People need to get up off the fainting couch when it comes to Biden’s “ad lib.”  Russia does not actually respond to speeches and offenses.  At most, they will use the comments as justification to do what they wanted to do anyway, whether that is breaking all diplomatic relations or committing more horrendous crimes in Ukraine or cyber attacks or whatever.  Russia responds to actions and pain, and I promise you that they care far more about sanctions and weapons supplies and economic boycotts than an applause line in Warsaw.  

 

Russia and Vladimir Putin are well versed in the tactic of making outrageous statements and trying to deliberately offend and provoke.  Let’s remember that they regularly and predictably threaten the world with nuclear annihilation if things don’t go their way.  We have gotten so used to hearing it that we forget that it’s something no Western leader save Trump (and his big button) has ever done. Official Russian statements are a barrage of insults and outrageous lies. Dmitri Medvedev said that Biden was insane and senile, their Embassy in London claimed that the mothers who got bombed in Mariupol are crisis actors.  
 

Normal diplomatic behavior and rhetoric from Russia is simply behind the realm of civilized and they understand this very well. If this was almost any another country— yes, that line would provoke a complete melt-down. But not Russia. They watch what we do far more than what we say. 

So much this.  When a party's currency is lies and outrageous statements, they impose that same way of thinking on their counterparty.  Russia doesn't give any weight to what we say because they don't give any weight to what THEY say -- it's all bullshit and posturing, meaning nothing except creating (im)plausable deniability.  "We are not planning to invade Ukraine.  These are just exercises, we don't know why anyone is getting freaked out about this."  Russia just "says shit," and it means literally nothing.  So, they impose that take on their counterparties as well.

[956 Worldwide 34,770]

11 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

No doubt.  I don't trust Bellongcat one bit, though.

Bellingcat is THE gold standard in OSINT reporting and transparency. 

[bolverk 29,717]

5 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Bellingcat is THE gold standard in OSINT reporting and transparency. 

Pretty sure it was just turrible, turrible joke. Bel...longcat. Get it? Long cat

[Hookah Horns 3,083]

Assuming that the poisoning story is true, that's pretty mind blowing. I didn't know Abramovich was involved in the talks. Is he doing so without permission from the Kremlin, or what? And did those responsible think killing the Ukrainian envoys would keep another meeting from ever happening? If it was ordered by someone who could have simply called off the negotiations instead, i.e. Putin, then it's totally insane.

[956 Worldwide 34,770]

2 minutes ago, bolverk said:

Pretty sure it was just turrible, turrible joke. Bel...longcat. Get it? Long cat

Ha, need to read closer.  Been a long day. 

[Jive Turkey 12,642]

 

[The Royal We 3,072]

6 minutes ago, Jive Turkey said:

 

"unclear who had targeted the group"  -Yea, it's a real fucking head scratcher idnnit!?

[956 Worldwide 34,770]

6 minutes ago, Hookah Horns said:

Assuming that the poisoning story is true, that's pretty mind blowing. I didn't know Abramovich was involved in the talks. Is he doing so without permission from the Kremlin, or what? And did those responsible think killing the Ukrainian envoys would keep another meeting from ever happening? If it was ordered by someone who could have simply called off the negotiations instead, i.e. Putin, then it's totally insane.

He was asked by Ukraine to be a go-between.  Likely trying to walk a fine line between getting sanctioned and incurring Kremlin wrath, and he had been putting daylight between himself and the Kremlin. 
 

The GRU are not known for clean operations and in fact some people think they are sloppy on purpose just to show that they can be. Let’s remember that they targeted Skripal but killed a bystander. They don’t give a shit.  Likely a show of displeasure to Abramovich and the others either just got caught in the wrong place or potentially had also been seen at one point as Russia-friendly.  It is absolutely true that Russia cultivated assets all through every Ukrainian institution, these guys maybe had gone off script. 

[Hookah Horns 3,083]

2 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

He was asked by Ukraine to be a go-between.  Likely trying to walk a fine line between getting sanctioned and incurring Kremlin wrath, and he had been putting daylight between himself and the Kremlin. 
 

The GRU are not known for clean operations and in fact some people think they are sloppy on purpose just to show that they can be. Let’s remember that they targeted Skripal but killed a bystander. They don’t give a shit.  Likely a show of displeasure to Abramovich and the others either just got caught in the wrong place or potentially had also been seen at one point as Russia-friendly.  It is absolutely true that Russia cultivated assets all through every Ukrainian institution, these guys maybe had gone off script. 

Damn, that's a very fine line to walk, indeed. Some radical going off script makes the most sense, I think. 

[jimmyjazz 46,130]

23 minutes ago, bolverk said:

Pretty sure it was just turrible, turrible joke. Bel...longcat. Get it? Long cat

Hey, there wasn't much to work with.

[Brisketexan 105,334]

41 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

He was asked by Ukraine to be a go-between.  Likely trying to walk a fine line between getting sanctioned and incurring Kremlin wrath, and he had been putting daylight between himself and the Kremlin. 
 

The GRU are not known for clean operations and in fact some people think they are sloppy on purpose just to show that they can be. Let’s remember that they targeted Skripal but killed a bystander. They don’t give a shit.  Likely a show of displeasure to Abramovich and the others either just got caught in the wrong place or potentially had also been seen at one point as Russia-friendly.  It is absolutely true that Russia cultivated assets all through every Ukrainian institution, these guys maybe had gone off script. 

Interesting angle.  Perhaps a message of "look fuckers, when you're bought, you STAY bought, understand?"  Could be that.

30 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Hey, there wasn't much to work with.

[Mrs Whiggins 13,050]

4 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

The US has had high level officials promoting the removal of Putin for at least a decade.  It would ostensibly be done through an election.

Now, that's the hilarious part.  That said, we haven't exactly been quiet on the concept.

I still wonder why it's OK for Biden to call Putin a "butcher", a "war criminal", a "killer", but it's not OK to say he needs to go?  I mean, that would be the logical preferred outcome.  This is nothing but political posturing.

In support of your post, I'm going to 'but Trump' this page by recalling the time when the former president called Chancellor Angela Merkel 'stupid' in a phone call which was rather news to her, being that she is anything but. Like all people, she may, on occasion, do stupid things, but she is quite smart. Putin, on the other hand, is a butcher, a war criminal, a killer, and really does need to go. But as you say and with Victor Orban  in Hungary and perhaps the soon to come election cycle here in the US, the voting in authoritarian countries such as Russia is shambolic.

[Hagbard Celine 10,923]

20 hours ago, Anastasis said:

sources and methods

[Hagbard Celine 10,923]

20 hours ago, aggie08 said:

I don't think paid Russian trolls waste their time on a regional sports' message board when Twitter and Facebook exist. There are just lots of idiots out there and people who troll for the love of the game who unknowingly carry the water for said trolls.

tradecraft exclusion self-censoring myself

[Hagbard Celine 10,923]

19 hours ago, Anastasis said:

Jesus you are a super sleuth. BTW, there

 

 

Mods, this should be pretty easy to confirm, yes?

Socks intended to mislead and amplify one voice should get perma banned on sight.  I could care a lot less about iterative handles created after crowd sourcing cause you have dipshits like Penelope spam negging, but a poster using multiple socks in a single thread to amplify perspective should be a pretty straight forward kill shot. 

it's not that simple

[Brisketexan 105,334]

Just an FYI for those who casually dismiss pro-Russia trolls posting on even "small-fry" forums such as this one: https://www.rand.org/pubs/perspectives/PE198.html

Quote

The producers and disseminators include a substantial force of paid Internet “trolls” who also often attack or undermine views or information that runs counter to Russian themes, doing so through online chat rooms, discussion forums, and comments sections on news and other websites.4 Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty reports that “there are thousands of fake accounts on Twitter, Facebook, LiveJournal, and vKontakte” maintained by Russian propagandists. According to a former paid Russian Internet troll, the trolls are on duty 24 hours a day, in 12-hour shifts, and each has a daily quota of 135 posted comments of at least 200 characters.5

 

[Hagbard Celine 10,923]

18 hours ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

That's not how you ferret out a troll. You have to devise a question that is not Googleable. I got rid of TCU Fan by asking him to name a restaurant owned by a famous Horned Frog family in Central Texas. It's obvious to me and I am only aware of TCU players because they played against Texas or chose TCU of Texas in recruiting battles. TCU Fan never posted again. Poof. Gone.

(The answer is Schobel's, which any "TCU Fan" would know,)

i remember that and that's why i asked "connection to 40" which as we saw was easily mastered by the algorithm

 

[OneOfTheOutOfFocusGuys 2,082]

3 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Just an FYI for those who casually dismiss pro-Russia trolls posting on even "small-fry" forums such as this one: https://www.rand.org/pubs/perspectives/PE198.html

 

 

3 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

trolls are on duty 24 hours a day, in 12-hour shifts, and each has a daily quota of 135 posted comments of at least 200 characters.5

leave lobo out of this

[Hagbard Celine 10,923]

18 hours ago, Anastasis said:

To put my wife and you in a room together would surely be interesting. 

pics of your daughters?

[Hagbard Celine 10,923]

18 hours ago, F250 said:

This thread was supposed to be about the Ukrainian war.

 

we have both types here, country, and western

[Hagbard Celine 10,923]

17 hours ago, cactusflinthead said:

 

it's 60 miles to the russian border, we've got a pack of cigarettes, half a tank of gas, and 8 million pounds of ordnance.

hit it.

[Macanudo 13,012]

16 hours ago, Sawbonz said:

I wonder if all the donations also had note from her Dad.

[C-Man 27,262]

Former Chelsea FC owner Roman Abramovich and two others were potentially poisoned by some kind of nerve agent after taking park in Ukraine/Russia peace talks in early March.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60904676

 

[Tuco 5,077]

4 hours ago, Hookah Horns said:

🙄 We usually haven't done it via invasion. Sorry but it's a pretty big deal especially when the subject of the comment is a paranoid, aggressive lunatic consumed by fear of being overthrown. 

So, it wasn't through elections and it wasn't invasion.  How, specifically, do you think Biden's comments should be interpreted?  Let's stop playing faux-outrage bingo and why don't you use your fucking words and tell us why this was a "pretty big deal."  You know, maybe you can compare and contrast how serious we should take this when compared to supplying munitions that are killing Russian soldiers daily.  Or maybe compare it to leading global sanctions which will crash Russia's economy in an attempt to weaken Putin's control.  We are in the middle of a fucking proxy war with Russia and Russia is shelling civilians, so please tell me why this is supposed to be headline news.  Be specific, and be sure to clutch those pearl tightly. 

[WhatTheBuck 28,798]

5 hours ago, 956 Worldwide said:

Official Russian statements are a barrage of insults and outrageous lies. Dmitri Medvedev said that Biden was insane and senile, their Embassy in London claimed that the mothers who got bombed in Mariupol are crisis actors.

How very Trumpublican of them.

[WhatTheBuck 28,798]

3 hours ago, Hagbard Celine said:

pics of your daughters?

Yeah, this. Russian chicks are hot. 

[Brisketexan 105,334]

24 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

How very Trumpublican of them.

This.

When your chosen party's rhetoric and that of Putin's party are fucking IDENTICAL in tone and technique....well, more self-reflective types would look in the mirror and say "holy shit, we should cut that shit right out."

But they won't.  They'll double down.  Because the dream of a nationalist authoritarian leader is too big a dream for them to just let it go.

[Brisketexan 105,334]

2 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

Yeah, this. Russian chicks are hot. 

 

Armybrat:

[Hagbard Celine 10,923]

5 hours ago, The Royal We said:

"unclear who had targeted the group"  -Yea, it's a real fucking head scratcher idnnit!?

SEE!!!  hunter is importing antifa agents to turkey!  WE KNEW IT!

[Anastasis 23,485]

4 hours ago, Hagbard Celine said:

pics of your daughters?

Yeah no thanks. I figure you’re more into young boys anyways. 

[Anastasis 23,485]

7 hours ago, Dutchrudder said:

Wtf is Bellingcat? Why would anyone believe a story like this without any other human sources reporting it?

Fwiw, Reuters has a us official saying that it is was not poisoning but an environmental exposure. Too many spooks involved to figure out what is truth vs fiction. Both sides of the story have their purposes. Esp for abramovich. 
 

 

https://www.reuters.com/world/intelligence-suggests-environmental-factor-sickened-abramovich-ukrainian-2022-03-28/

Edited March 29, 2022 by Anastasis

[Degenerate Gardner 4,085]

7 hours ago, Jive Turkey said:

 

Probably those goddamn Canadians again.

[Bullneck 19,206]

21 hours ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

No. He just went away. A thousand plus posts and he just vanished. I was all set to nag him to answer my question or explain why he could not, but he just never came back. He just either switched handles or left altogether. 

Imagine the shame of being outed as a fake TCU fan.

[Bullneck 19,206]

11 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

call Putin a "butcher", a "war criminal", a "killer" . . .  but he's a mate.  So what can you do?