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Horn Dog
Horn Dog

So our brain dead, demented president has managed to, without firing 1 shot, or risking 1 American life, and with the extremely limited tools at his disposal to respond to a mad man hell bent on irrat

BearSchlong
BearSchlong

The Biden 82nd airborne pizza eating photo? My son is in this photo.

cactusflinthead
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WhatTheBuck

WhatTheBuck 28929

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, DigglerontheHoof said:

Midterms?  Probably not.  DeSantis or dotard gets elected in 24?  Meet our new Russian allies. 

Yeah, this would be my take. It’s possible that McConnell’s visit was just for show but I think he’s old school enough that he’s on Ukraine’s side. I know he hates Trump who is Putin’s puppet. And he believes in NATO. As long as Biden is President then I don’t think the Republicans will be able to scuttle our support for Ukraine. And I don’t put much stock in the video compilation of propaganda from Fox News Russia talking about Ukrainian Nazis alongside propaganda from Tucker Carlson on Fox News America. No reasonable person should take either of them seriously.

But Trump is going to run. And if he wins, and if he should happen to have Republican majorities in the House and Senate, then he’ll cut off all aide to Ukraine and get back to work pulling us out of NATO. 

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Tuco

Tuco 5093

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Posted
Yeah, this would be my take. It’s possible that McConnell’s visit was just for show but I think he’s old school enough that he’s on Ukraine’s side. I know he hates Trump who is Putin’s puppet. And he believes in NATO. As long as Biden is President then I don’t think the Republicans will be able to scuttle our support for Ukraine. And I don’t put much stock in the video compilation of propaganda from Fox News Russia talking about Ukrainian Nazis alongside propaganda from Tucker Carlson on Fox News America. No reasonable person should take either of them seriously.
But Trump is going to run. And if he wins, and if he should happen to have Republican majorities in the House and Senate, then he’ll cut off all aide to Ukraine and get back to work pulling us out of NATO. 

If nothing else, there are enough defense industry lobbyists up the GOP’s ass to keep the support rolling after 2022. Every billion committed, is a billion in sales.

Disclaimer 1: the defense lobbyists are also up the Dems’ ass.

Disclaimer 2: I still agree with the spending. But we shouldn’t lose sight of who benefits and how it affects our rent-seeking political system.
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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 90647

Posted
Posted
12 hours ago, WhatTheBuck said:

I wouldn’t be so sure even if the Republicans win in November.

11 hours ago, DigglerontheHoof said:

Midterms?  Probably not.  DeSantis or dotard gets elected in 24?  Meet our new Russian allies. 

11 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

It’ll start now. Putin tried to kill NATO. Had Trump been re-elected, he would have succeeded. The cult will follow its leader.

11 hours ago, The Dog said:

Wishcasting by Russia.

Lend lease isn't going away after November. 

10 hours ago, Tuco said:

If nothing else, there are enough defense industry lobbyists up the GOP’s ass to keep the support rolling after 2022. Every billion committed, is a billion in sales.

Some things to keep in mind - Putin is extremely bad for American (and European) businesses.

  1. Russia fucked over a shitload of American/European companies financially just as they were starting to get to pre-COVID levels, and stole billions from them, with the nationalizing of various assets (airliners are just a part of it). Last I checked, those companies aren't getting compensated for those assets (and I've seen some say that not even insurance will help 100%).  Those companies didn't want to leave Russia voluntarily but they saw the writing on the wall, and what could have been a temporary withdrawal from Russia turned into a long-term one once Putin nationalized their assets and stole from them. Those companies have probably already bitched to the folks they own in Congress, and made it clear where they stand.
  2. Russia is deliberately creating a shit-ton of instability in the world markets, and American/European countries are furious at that, because it fucks with their bottom lines, and when you drive up the price of food and fuel or force companies to have to reroute shipping or change who they get their fuel, etc. from, that screws with the companies directly, but it also reduces the amount of consumer spending money available for other goods that the non-petro and non-agricultural  companies produce.
  3. America's commitment to NATO and America's overall projection of power since WWII has been in large part to keep markets free and open for American companies. Nobody is going to invade us, but we still built and maintain to this day a massive fucking navy with nearly a dozen super carriers because we want sea lanes open and we want open markets for American companies in as many countries as possible. You can argue that we exploited the hell out of a shit ton of countries with those markets, and you'll get no argument out of me, but the point is that we don't maintain our navy because we are afraid of Russia, we do it because it's good for American companies.

Do we have dumbasses in Congress who don't have a fucking clue about how the world works and how American companies need stability in the world and in world markets so that they keep on manufacturing and selling overseas?  Yep.

But the "adults in the room" also know that Putin is dangerous to the bottom lines of their biggest donors, and that he is dangerous to stability in general, which is really bad for American (and European/Asian) companies.

Do I think some Republicans are siding with Putin and will try and help Russia?  Fuck yeah, they aren't hiding it at all on social media or on Fox News, but I think plenty also realize the harm that Putin is doing in the long run.

Unfortunately Putin's invasion of Georgia and annexation of Crimea was tolerated because it didn't rock the world markets too much, but Putin's actions in Syria and elsewhere since then did cause a lot of problems, and now Putin is no longer trying to pretend that he's not trying to control world markets, so as far as most companies (and European countries) are concerned, Putin has to be put in his place and Russia has to be neutered, because if he's not, he'll just keep fucking with world markets.

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 90647

Posted
Posted (edited)

On a side note, and apologies if this was covered, I normally don't like or follow this thread, but any Russian banks that were holding debt from Trump (directly or through proxies), now that most of them have been cut off from the West, is Trump clear of them?

I'm probably not phrasing it right.

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Grade of D as in David

Grade of D as in David 13255

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, atomheartbevo said:

On a side note, and apologies if this was covered, I normally don't like or follow this thread, but any Russian banks that were holding debt from Trump (directly or through proxies), now that most of them have been cut off from the West, is Trump clear of them?

I'm probably not phrasing it right.

He may be legally clear of them, but people still need to find a way to kick up to the Mafia boss that ends up in prison.

 

It's a real fafo situation for Trump. He must either find a way to evade sanctions and pay his debt or end up drinking a polonium diet Coke.

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RomaVicta

RomaVicta 30586

Posted
Posted (edited)

It alarms me that this thread has dropped as has my attention to the war in Ukraine. I googled it and found this article in the Guardian that points up things to worry about.

 

Quote

Any way you count it, the figures are stark: Ukrainian casualties are running at a rate of somewhere between 6oo and 1,000 a day. One presidential adviser, Oleksiy Arestovych, told the Guardian this week it was 150 killed and 800 wounded daily; another, Mykhaylo Podolyak, told the BBC that 100 to 200 Ukrainian troops a day were being killed.

It represents an extraordinary loss of human life and capacity for the defenders, embroiled in a defence of the eastern city of Sievierodonetsk that this week turned into a losing battle. Yet the city was also arguably a place that Ukraine could have retreated from to the more defensible Lysychansk, across the Siverski Donets River, the sort of defensive situation that Ukraine has fared far better in.

High casualty rates are demoralizing and the article includes reporting that there have been some desertion in the Ukraine army.

There is also the questionable strategy of trying to hold a town at enormous cost to the army when a better strategic decision would be to find better ground to fight on. Fabius and Washington both saw the arch importance of preserving the army in the face of a strong and/or able opponent. Sun Tzu states that the general should choose a place to fight where victory is likely.

And now we, the American public, are losing interest. Time to move on to a new story because this TV series has just about played out.

I think Ukraine loses the lands on the border with Russia. I think Russia claims a victory no matter how Pyrrhic. I don't think they recover. I also don't think the conflict in the east of Ukraine will stay settled.

So bloody and useless. Like school massacres. Like insurrections. Like gun culture. Like cops shooting black people.

Henry Rollins: They say it's a man's world. Well, so far this man's world is a poorly run carnage fest.

I get tiresome on this, but I won't vote for white men where there are alternatives. 

Edited by RomaVicta
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Judge Roybeanbag

Judge Roybeanbag 11860

Posted
Posted (edited)

Does my life insurance policy cover me going to Ukraine to fight?   Probably not.  Should it?  Probably so, if we are so gung fucking ho on spreading democracy even though we have a plutocracy .  Oh well. We have  bitch McConnell shaking hands.  

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atomheartbevo

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Posted
Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, RomaVicta said:

I think Ukraine loses the lands on the border with Russia. I think Russia claims a victory no matter how Pyrrhic. I don't think they recover. I also don't think the conflict in the east of Ukraine will stay settled.

Russia can't recover - their demographics are spiraling in, and over the coming years, they'll have fewer and fewer eligible men for conscription, etc (and after this fiasco there will be plenty of men who do not renew their contracts).  They have lost over three years' worth of modern tank production, and given how the embargoes/sanctions/etc. are fucking over their automobile production and airline maintenance, I don't see how they can easily replace those tanks (they'll have to scavenge parts from wrecked or older tanks).  That's on top of all of the specialized armored vehicles (command, anti-air, comms, etc.) that haven't been in production for years, and that can't have their production lines started back up on a whim.

I think Ukraine will prevail in the long run.  Russia just doesn't have the manpower to actually occupy the border lands in the long run, and the Ukrainian insurgence has barely kicked off.  

As for the Ukrainian army holding on to a city or two in vicious fighting, yeah, it sucks for those guys there, but Ukraine does have high ground in the area (which is why Russia hasn't been able to fully take it), but it's also tying up Russian resources that would be used to reinforce Kherson, etc.

Later this month is when a lot of analysts think that Russia will hit their culmination point, and those analysts were right about Russia hitting a brick wall and having to pull out of Kyiv and then Kharkiv.

Edit: There was videos of Russian trains hauling wrecked/destroyed/disabled Russian (and a few Ukrainian) tanks back east a few weeks ago, and it seemed odd at the time given the Russians seem to just abandon shit all over the battlefield, but if you think in terms of spare parts, it makes absolute sense, especially since they are fielding fucking T-62s in Ukraine.

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InkaUtexas

InkaUtexas 26885

Posted
Posted
7 hours ago, RomaVicta said:

It alarms me that this thread has dropped as has my attention to the war in Ukraine. I googled it and found this article in the Guardian that points up things to worry about.

 

High casualty rates are demoralizing and the article includes reporting that there have been some desertion in the Ukraine army.

There is also the questionable strategy of trying to hold a town at enormous cost to the army when a better strategic decision would be to find better ground to fight on. Fabius and Washington both saw the arch importance of preserving the army in the face of a strong and/or able opponent. Sun Tzu states that the general should choose a place to fight where victory is likely.

And now we, the American public, are losing interest. Time to move on to a new story because this TV series has just about played out.

I think Ukraine loses the lands on the border with Russia. I think Russia claims a victory no matter how Pyrrhic. I don't think they recover. I also don't think the conflict in the east of Ukraine will stay settled.

So bloody and useless. Like school massacres. Like insurrections. Like gun culture. Like cops shooting black people.

Henry Rollins: They say it's a man's world. Well, so far this man's world is a poorly run carnage fest.

I get tiresome on this, but I won't vote for white men where there are alternatives. 

Casualty rates are high. But you are defending your home and family. It does not hit morale like it does when you are invading and getting your ass kicked. Ukraine still has not called up all their reserves. It is time to hit Belarus with a FAFO statement. Kick Ivan out or we are sanctioning your ass to Bolivia. That would allow the UA to move combat troops east and south. Go on the defensive, backed by artillery, and keep fucking up Ivan. 

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Pods

Pods 7637

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18 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

What are you prattling on about now, Boris?

Dude in the photo has a swastika tattoo on his arm.

I believe GRUHorn's attempted point is that if a single Ukrainian man has a swastika tattoo, then the whole country is full of Nazi's and Putin is vindicated. The US should stop supporting Ukraine and let Russia purge them. 

This is obviously stupid, even for GRUHorn, but that has never stopped him in the past. 

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927 E. 41st

927 E. 41st 1124

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, RomaVicta said:

I get tiresome on this, but I won't vote for white men where there are alternatives. 

I think you are focusing on the wrong thing. If you are voting for someone for any reason other than their abilities and position on issues you are doing yourself and everyone else a disservice. 

Not the color of their skin but the content of their character. 

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Thatguy

Thatguy 9366

Posted
Posted
20 minutes ago, 927 E. 41st said:

I think you are focusing on the wrong thing. If you are voting for someone for any reason other than their abilities and position on issues you are doing yourself and everyone else a disservice. 

Not the color of their skin but the content of their character. 

on-my-block-laugh.gif

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 90647

Posted
Posted
49 minutes ago, Pods said:

Dude in the photo has a swastika tattoo on his arm.

I believe GRUHorn's attempted point is that if a single Ukrainian man has a swastika tattoo, then the whole country is full of Nazi's and Putin is vindicated. The US should stop supporting Ukraine and let Russia purge them. 

This is obviously stupid, even for GRUHorn, but that has never stopped him in the past. 

6 minutes ago, Caponata said:

Media outlets unintentionally posting pictures of Ukrainians with swastikas, 1488, or other WS insignia. 

Post those kinds of photos, but then make sure and post this

 

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RomaVicta

RomaVicta 30586

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Posted
43 minutes ago, 927 E. 41st said:

I think you are focusing on the wrong thing. If you are voting for someone for any reason other than their abilities and position on issues you are doing yourself and everyone else a disservice. 

Not the color of their skin but the content of their character. 

How's that been working out for everybody except white men the last few thousand years?

I'm speaking collectively. I don't things change unless we do the impossible thing I describe. All white men aren't bad. Not even close. Collectively, yikes.

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927 E. 41st

927 E. 41st 1124

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Posted
20 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

I don't things change unless we do the impossible thing I describe. All white men aren't bad. Not even close. Collectively, yikes.

Things will change but very slowly (generations). Not really sure what you're on about with white guys, It seems to me there are plenty of bad guys and good guys of every race. 

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Caponata

Caponata 151

Posted
Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, atomheartbevo said:

Post those kinds of photos, but then make sure and post this

 

The caption of that Reuters article says it's an Ukrainian local, not sure he is a part of any battalion according to my knowledge. But yeah the Wagner Group are WS/Nazi mercenaries. Next time I will make sure to post other articles that inadvertently have men with swastikas. 

 

Edited by Caponata
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B00M

B00M 6734

Posted
Posted
38 minutes ago, Caponata said:

The caption of that Reuters article says it's an Ukrainian local, not sure he is a part of any battalion according to my knowledge. But yeah the Wagner Group are WS/Nazi mercenaries. Next time I will make sure to post other articles that inadvertently have men with swastikas. 

 

The point is, it's just some fucking middle aged guy with a gut and something that easily could be photoshopped. It is meaningless, even if real. Here's a shocker: Russia and former Soviet states are racist as fuck by American standards. So that justifies genocide over oil?

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B00M

B00M 6734

Posted
Posted (edited)
20 hours ago, RomaVicta said:

And now we, the American public, are losing interest. Time to move on to a new story because this TV series has just about played out.

I think Ukraine loses the lands on the border with Russia. I think Russia claims a victory no matter how Pyrrhic. I don't think they recover. I also don't think the conflict in the east of Ukraine will stay settled.

So bloody and useless. Like school massacres. Like insurrections. Like gun culture. Like cops shooting black people.

Henry Rollins: They say it's a man's world. Well, so far this man's world is a poorly run carnage fest.

I get tiresome on this, but I won't vote for white men where there are alternatives. 

I understand wanting to see more women in power if your goal is reducing state sponsored violence. Although it's undoubtedly misogynist to assume women are inherently less violent, gentler, calmer. The historical examples coming to mind (queens of england, Catherine in Russia) were generally at least as prone to war as their male counterparts.

Daily mail rag yada yada but still interesting

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-7667033/Queens-gone-war-kings-centuries-historic-study-finds.html

I'm struggling to come up with any color or race of man throughout history that is innocent of senseless brutality. It seems bizarre to try to connect war mongering in Ukraine with police brutality on the streets of the US.

As for US "gun culture" catching a stray here: Owning firearms, practicing with them, discussing the laws and learning about firearms is not the problem. US gun owners come in all colors and thats a good thing. Ignorance of the laws and violating basic safety practices is a problem. Violence is the problem.

Individual men and women satisfied with their lives are generally not violent. Groups of people often are.

As long as there are unsatisfied people, there will be violence at the individual level. As long as there are "us" and "them," there will be large scale, often state sponsored violence. 

Edited by B00M
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WhatTheBuck

WhatTheBuck 28929

Posted
Posted

A Ukrainian chemical plant has been hit and is on fire. Citizens are hiding in underground shelters there like they were at the factory in Mariupol. As serious as all this is, I still can’t help but chuckle at the news that “The first rebranded McDonald's restaurants are opening in Moscow with a new name that translates as ‘Tasty and that's it’”

https://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-europe-61764008

Summary

Russian shelling has caused a huge fire at a chemical plant in Severodonetsk as "non-stop" fighting rages in the city, the region's governor says

Serhiy Haidai told Ukrainian TV the fire at the Azot plant started after a leak of tens of tonnes of oil from damaged radiators

As many as 800 civilians are hiding in underground bomb shelters at the chemical plant, Ukrainian officials estimate

President Volodymr Zelensky has again asked for more weapons, amid fears his soldiers are running out of ammunition

Ukraine says its forces have recaptured areas from Russia in the south-eastern regions of Kherson and Zaporizhzhia

The first rebranded McDonald's restaurants are opening in Moscow with a new name that translates as "Tasty and that's it"

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Caponata

Caponata 151

Posted
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, B00M said:

The point is, it's just some fucking middle aged guy with a gut and something that easily could be photoshopped. It is meaningless, even if real. Here's a shocker: Russia and former Soviet states are racist as fuck by American standards. So that justifies genocide over oil?

You think Reuters photoshopped that picture? And I don't think it's meaningless, did you think the Charlottesville rally was meaningless?

Reuters in 2018:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-cohen-ukraine-commentary/commentary-ukraines-neo-nazi-problem-idUSKBN1GV2TY

 

 

image.png

Edited by Caponata
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RomaVicta

RomaVicta 30586

Posted
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, B00M said:

I understand wanting to see more women in power if your goal is reducing state sponsored violence. Although it's undoubtedly misogynist to assume women are inherently less violent, gentler, calmer. The historical examples coming to mind (queens of england, Catherine in Russia) were generally at least as prone to war as their male counterparts.

Daily mail rag yada yada but still interesting

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-7667033/Queens-gone-war-kings-centuries-historic-study-finds.html

I'm struggling to come up with any color or race of man throughout history that is innocent of senseless brutality. It seems bizarre to try to connect war mongering in Ukraine with police brutality on the streets of the US.

As for US "gun culture" catching a stray here: Owning firearms, practicing with them, discussing the laws and learning about firearms is not the problem. US gun owners come in all colors and thats a good thing. Ignorance of the laws and violating basic safety practices is a problem. Violence is the problem.

Individual men and women satisfied with their lives are generally not violent. Groups of people often are.

As long as there are unsatisfied people, there will be violence at the individual level. As long as there are "us" and "them," there will be large scale, often state sponsored violence. 

I brought up something that is derailing this thread which is ironic because I bumped the thread to remind us all of the topic.

I'll just repeat, that I'm speaking collectively. Most counterpoints coming at me are addressing person individually. We don't know the track record of non-white male control in the West because there isn't one. I am also now a subscriber to the idea that we white men are blind to a lot of things due to our comfort in the world our type have created.

I don't speak of inherent qualities to the biology of race or sex. I mainly refer to the resulting inequality of non-whites under white man-created national cultures and white man-dominated political/legal control. Hell, we had to pass affirmative action laws just to give non-white men some sort of entry into the white man world.

One of my biggest revelations over the black student's petition to UT was when I stepped back to see the bigger picture of the negotiation. White men talking to white men (I included) about how much we were willing to give up. WTF? We should reverse these negotiations and let the out group decide based on our arguments.

Even on this topic, here are white men expressing their feelings using a famous quote from MLK about the content of people's souls. The white man immediate response: We have good souls. Some black people don't. So all is fine. Case solved.

Black lives matter: All lives matter! How selfish of black people not to include white people in their complaint about their treatment!

Equal Rights Amendment: We'll all have to use the same bathrooms! We can't make it law that women get equal pay and equal treatment if it means forcing us all to use the same bathrooms. Sorry. (Not sorry.)

We. Need. To. Move. Aside.

Narrator: They won't.

If a moderator would like to start a new thread beginning with this post or one of the responses above, I'm fine with it. I have, again, thrown gas on the flaming derailment I've created. This subject has become very important to me. Typically, I'm seeking something basically impossible.

Edit to add: I don't find any of the responses to my post about voting to be rancorous or unintelligent. I appreciate that.

 

Edited by RomaVicta
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RomaVicta

RomaVicta 30586

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Posted
52 minutes ago, Caponata said:

You think Reuters photoshopped that picture? And I don't think it's meaningless, did you think the Charlottesville rally was meaningless?

Reuters in 2018:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-cohen-ukraine-commentary/commentary-ukraines-neo-nazi-problem-idUSKBN1GV2TY

 

 

image.png

Do you make your observations without accompanying illumination to suggest that supporting Ukraine is supporting Nazism in general and maybe even the rise of a Fourth Reich? Be specific. If you have been before, I've missed. 

What are you trying to persuade me to do in terms of US policy or my disposition towards Ukrainian resistance to a brutal, murderous, invasion that includes slaughter of civilians as part of the overall strategy? I strongly support our policy and Ukraine's struggle.

Am I to fear the potential of Ukraine becoming Nazi Germany more than I despise actual Russian imperialism?

What is your point beyond, "Oh look, a Nazi! Oh look, a swastika!"?

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 90647

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, B00M said:

The point is, it's just some fucking middle aged guy with a gut and something that easily could be photoshopped. It is meaningless, even if real. Here's a shocker: Russia and former Soviet states are racist as fuck by American standards. So that justifies genocide over oil?

Our Nazis wear khakis and blue shirts and hang out together in the back of Uhaul trucks.

Barack Obama Rainbow GIF by Stonewall Day

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