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The Twitter Debate

Neonmoon

By Neonmoon
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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 107093

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He fired the two employees that pointed out he was wrong and why. What a complete jackass. Let's get rid of all the people that actually know how things work there. This guy is not an amazing genius. A smart person knows what they do not know and seeks out the people that understand what they do not. This guy is just a smarter Trump with more money and a smaller cult following.

TLDR; the words of wisdom from my salt-of-the-earth south texas rancher grandpa: “a smart man is a man smart enough to know how dumb he is.”
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immamac

immamac 44459

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All of you buying into the engineers dooming is funny. Elon musk is kind of a cunt and I can’t believe I’m half defending him, but the large majority of people in that organization at this point are worthless. Twitter hasn’t exactly been the bastion of incredible technologies that scale in quite some time. They solved the Hardest problems a while ago and now they aren’t even necessarily hard problems anymore. Twitter scale isn’t small but it’s not holy fuck omg how do they do it anymore. Twitter doesn’t have that many core features that actually make it twitter and I think that you will see a drastic simplification of the feature set soon to reflect that. 

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 107093

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4 minutes ago, immamac said:

and I think that you will see a drastic simplification of the feature set soon to reflect that. 

Yeah....you'll just get a screen of Elon's face asking "do you like me?  Check yes or no."  And if you check no, your account is locked.  It's gonna be SUPER simplified.

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Captainant

Captainant 28631

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1 hour ago, immamac said:

All of you buying into the engineers dooming is funny. Elon musk is kind of a cunt and I can’t believe I’m half defending him, but the large majority of people in that organization at this point are worthless. Twitter hasn’t exactly been the bastion of incredible technologies that scale in quite some time. They solved the Hardest problems a while ago and now they aren’t even necessarily hard problems anymore. Twitter scale isn’t small but it’s not holy fuck omg how do they do it anymore. Twitter doesn’t have that many core features that actually make it twitter and I think that you will see a drastic simplification of the feature set soon to reflect that. 

No doubt that twitter has massive bloat - fundamentally their service is delivering like 250KB of data one tweet at a time via GraphQL, which ain't exactly groundbreaking lol. But on the other hand, elmo is tanking their business strategy. Charging tree fiddy works when you have minimal infra and staff overhead costs - not when you just paid >$40,000,000,000 because your feefees got hurtyhurt

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Bateshorn

Bateshorn 9993

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1 hour ago, immamac said:

All of you buying into the engineers dooming is funny. Elon musk is kind of a cunt and I can’t believe I’m half defending him, but the large majority of people in that organization at this point are worthless. Twitter hasn’t exactly been the bastion of incredible technologies that scale in quite some time. They solved the Hardest problems a while ago and now they aren’t even necessarily hard problems anymore. Twitter scale isn’t small but it’s not holy fuck omg how do they do it anymore. Twitter doesn’t have that many core features that actually make it twitter and I think that you will see a drastic simplification of the feature set soon to reflect that. 

As somebody who was told their would be no math, I agree.  I’m not sure how Elon Musk walking in and throwing napalm on everything is going to fix it, but it’s very entertaining to watch.

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immamac

immamac 44459

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7 minutes ago, Captainant said:

No doubt that twitter has massive bloat - fundamentally their service is delivering like 250KB of data one tweet at a time via GraphQL, which ain't exactly groundbreaking lol. But on the other hand, elmo is tanking their business strategy. Charging tree fiddy works when you have minimal infra and staff overhead costs - not when you just paid >$40,000,000,000 because your feefees got hurtyhurt

I don't even think their graphql api/framework/whatever is actually even graphql. They run off Manhattan which at the end of the day is KV based on RocksDB using mostly the mysql dialect to communicate through the stack. They may have written some abstraction layers, but those abstractions honestly serve little purpose except for making it easier for an army of thousands of devs to not have credentials to do stupid shit in production basically. 

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Captainant

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6 minutes ago, immamac said:

I don't even think their graphql api/framework/whatever is actually even graphql. They run off Manhattan which at the end of the day is KV based on RocksDB using mostly the mysql dialect to communicate through the stack. They may have written some abstraction layers, but those abstractions honestly serve little purpose except for making it easier for an army of thousands of devs to not have credentials to do stupid shit in production basically. 

Eh the abstractions are moreso an artifact of business strategy to build with minimal dependency couplings to let their devs move more quickly and autonomously with generic service contracts. It's also enabled their architecture to gracefully fail as this and that microservice fail unexpectedly, for what it's worth.

Either way, it does result in a shitload of overhead because they're using generic models for most functions that really could and should be leaned down - but who's got the tiiiiiiime to pay down all that tech debt, mayyyyne? Just throw some more cores and bandwidth at that bitch and let future you deal with it!

 

...

 

At least, that's normally how large scale enterprises end up buried in a mountain of technical debt that a new engineer can inspect once and naively proclaim "you're doing it wrong!". Nevermind that there's this whole continuity of business thing because customer REALLY hate service interruptions and it's significantly damaging to your brand and customer trust

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Bullneck

Bullneck 19640

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18 minutes ago, immamac said:

I don't even think their graphql api/framework/whatever is actually even graphql. They run off Manhattan which at the end of the day is KV based on RocksDB using mostly the mysql dialect to communicate through the stack. They may have written some abstraction layers, but those abstractions honestly serve little purpose except for making it easier for an army of thousands of devs to not have credentials to do stupid shit in production basically. 

Roger that, Mustang, we've got bogies at four o'clock.

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 90714

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3 hours ago, immamac said:

Twitter doesn’t have that many core features that actually make it twitter and I think that you will see a drastic simplification of the feature set soon to reflect that. 

Given that every week, nearly every day, Elon is finding ways to make advertisers hesitate to spend money on twitter, there's going to be a massive simplification of things at twitter, both technical and otherwise.

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G650

G650 14463

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10 hours ago, immamac said:

All of you buying into the engineers dooming is funny. Elon musk is kind of a cunt and I can’t believe I’m half defending him, but the large majority of people in that organization at this point are worthless. Twitter hasn’t exactly been the bastion of incredible technologies that scale in quite some time. They solved the Hardest problems a while ago and now they aren’t even necessarily hard problems anymore. Twitter scale isn’t small but it’s not holy fuck omg how do they do it anymore. Twitter doesn’t have that many core features that actually make it twitter and I think that you will see a drastic simplification of the feature set soon to reflect that. 

I'll preface by saying I love you and all you do for us idiots dearly, but I have to be honest, given the reliability of Surly I can't put much stock in your opinion on this.

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GenXer

GenXer 3539

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11 hours ago, StassneyHorn said:

Elon gonna hire a bunch of freshers from India and JIRA is gonna be nothing but “What do you mean when you say give access to?”

I’ve been using snagit to record my demos of issues since 2010. I give a brief description of the issue, actual result and expected result and attach the video to the jira ticket. Saves a lot of time on writing a thesis explaining the issue and it’s easier for the dev to understand the issue.

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G650

G650 14463

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13 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Just wait and see what Twitter 2.0 is like with a bunch of sleep-deprived developers.

 

Everytime is see an Elon quote that says hardcore it just reinforces that clown has no idea what hardcore means.

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 107093

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5 minutes ago, Lurch said:

Oops
 

He gave them a poorly thought-out ultimatum.  Twitter engineers' response, being that 1) they have leverage, and 2) really don't want to work for an erratic sociopath who will just fire them next week because he stubbed his toe on his nightstand and blames them for it:

offer-go-fuck-your-self.gif

 

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 107093

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8 minutes ago, Chuckie Finster said:

 

Also....if true....this is simply amazing.  Nobody alive -- or who was ever alive -- has ever seen anything like this.  This is on track to be the most spectacular flameout-dumpster fire-trainwreck-goat rodeo-self immolation the world has ever seen.

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Dbeasy

Dbeasy 15618

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As a tech industry guy for so many years, I have a lot of thoughts.

Musk shaking things up is actually a good thing. However, the way he is interacting with his technical team is like the course Tech CEO 101  - What not to do with prickly dev people. 

Getting rid of half the people is fine. The entire tech world is amazingly bloated. I hear from ex-employees every week and NONE of them are working hard. They sit on sites like Surly all day long. However, the way he’s getting to 50% pretty much guarantees the best 50% leave. They always have great options. 

He probably has a decent vision of where the platform needs to go, so I can’t understand the constant eff ups so far. Moving fast is fine. Half baked ideas are not. In his zeal for speed, he looks like a moron. 

I still maintain that at the end of all this, he will have a success. Why? Employees are amazingly resilient in putting up with management stupidity. Other well compensated people will come in to replace the departed and while it will be a shit show for two years, on the other side will be a likable product. He will just burn through enormous amounts of money, like his other companies. But because investors are suckers they will fund him yet again. 
 


 

 

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Doc Sam Beckett

Doc Sam Beckett 5912

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23 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

As a tech industry guy for so many years, I have a lot of thoughts.

Musk shaking things up is actually a good thing. However, the way he is interacting with his technical team is like the course Tech CEO 101  - What not to do with prickly dev people. 

Getting rid of half the people is fine. The entire tech world is amazingly bloated. I hear from ex-employees every week and NONE of them are working hard. They sit on sites like Surly all day long. However, the way he’s getting to 50% pretty much guarantees the best 50% leave. They always have great options. 

He probably has a decent vision of where the platform needs to go, so I can’t understand the constant eff ups so far. Moving fast is fine. Half baked ideas are not. In his zeal for speed, he looks like a moron. 

I still maintain that at the end of all this, he will have a success. Why? Employees are amazingly resilient in putting up with management stupidity. Other well compensated people will come in to replace the departed and while it will be a shit show for two years, on the other side will be a likable product. He will just burn through enormous amounts of money, like his other companies. But because investors are suckers they will fund him yet again. 
 


 

 

 

Jennifer Lawrence Reaction GIF

I think you have more important shit to do right now, Elon 

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Jhawkmvp

Jhawkmvp 1514

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I did not know Elon has admitted to having Asperger's Syndrome. Maybe he is not the best person to lead a social media company; however, half the people posting on the internet seem to be somewhere on the autism spectrum so maybe it will work out in the end.

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