At least 4645 died in Puerto Rico due to Hurricane Maria

[lemonlime 5503]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/harvard-study-estimates-thousands-died-in-puerto-rico-due-to-hurricane-maria/2018/05/29/1a82503a-6070-11e8-a4a4-c070ef53f315_story.html?utm_term=.ba92fbd7b65a

 

Quote

At least 4,645 people died as a result of Hurricane Maria and its devastation across Puerto Rico last year, according to a new Harvard study released Tuesday, an estimate that far exceeds the official government death toll, which stands at 64.

The study, published in the New England Journal of Medicine, found that health-care disruption for the elderly and the loss of basic utility services for the chronically ill had significant impacts across the U.S. territory, which was thrown into chaos after the September hurricane wiped out the electrical grid and had widespread impacts on infrastructure. Some communities were entirely cut off for weeks amid road closures and communications failures.

Researchers in the United States and Puerto Rico, led by scientists at the Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health and Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center, calculated the number of deaths by surveying nearly 3,300 randomly chosen households across the island and comparing the estimated post-hurricane death rate to the mortality rate for the year before. Their surveys indicated that the mortality rate was 14.3 deaths per 1,000 residents from Sept. 20 through Dec. 31, 2017, a 62 percent increase in the mortality rate compared to 2016, or 4,645 “excess deaths.”

 

Our government is abandoning its basic duty to its citizens: physical protection.  While our so called leaders are tweeting "WINNING!" about NFL players or screaming about the WITCH HUNT HOAX!!!!, thousands of people died and this has been all but forgotten by our government.  I'm not sure what combination of money, the people in question being brown, and the utter lack of concern by the Trump WH for anyone who isn't a sycophant or donor caused this, but I also don't care.  As far as I can tell, our government hasn't done jack shit to fix this.  And before Smokey or whoever says that Puerto Rico had financial troubles.  I don't give a fuck.  I give a fuck about what the federal government, who I pay taxes to, does with those taxes.  Which apparently includes huge tax cuts to corporations while failing to provide basic government functions.

[WhatTheBuck 28812]

They can't vote for president. And they're brown. Trump doesn't care about them. 

[Whitman 694]

24 minutes ago, lemonlime said:

I give a fuck about what the federal government, who I pay taxes to, does with those taxes

So do I.  It's a shame that we would chose to give over $500 million per year to the leading abortion provider in the county than to add that to the help FEMA and others (both governmental and non) have sent into Puerto Rico.  Why won't the gov't just do what I want with the tax money?  How about all the poor in Appalachia living in substandard housing?  A fuck-ton more than 4000 will die because of a lack of available medical care.

[jimmyjazz 46277]

30 minutes ago, WhatTheBuck said:

They can't vote for president. And they're brown. Trump doesn't care about them. 

There is a good chance that Trump doesn't even know Puerto Ricans are US citizens.

[Johnny Sack 8397]

My best friend is down there with his company rebuilding.  There are a lot of challenges on an island that was hit that hard.  Our government is the one financing the rebuild that my friend and fellow contractors are performing.

I believe $16 billion worth of federal aid so far.  That is about $4,500 for every man, woman and child on the island.  

[wildcat09 29434]

2 minutes ago, Whitman said:

So do I.  It's a shame that we would chose to give over $500 million per year to the leading abortion provider in the county than to add that to the help FEMA and others (both governmental and non) have sent into Puerto Rico.  Why won't the gov't just do what I want with the tax money?  How about all the poor in Appalachia living in substandard housing?  A fuck-ton more than 4000 will die because of a lack of available medical care.

Or, instead of defunding Medicaid (which is how Planned Parenthood receives the overwhelming majority of federal tax dollars it receives), we could maybe not cut taxes on billionaires? Just a thought.

[Whitman 694]

1 minute ago, wildcat09 said:

Or, instead of defunding Medicaid (which is how Planned Parenthood receives the overwhelming majority of federal tax dollars it receives), we could maybe not cut taxes on billionaires? Just a thought.

I think we ought to have a balanced budget amendment.  It sucks, but they have shown they have no control so they give out tax cuts while at the same time raise spending.  Raise taxes or defund a program.  Let them fight over tax levels (not debt levels) and programs to fund.

[lemonlime 5503]

18 minutes ago, Whitman said:

So do I.  It's a shame that we would chose to give over $500 million per year to the leading abortion provider in the county than to add that to the help FEMA and others (both governmental and non) have sent into Puerto Rico.  Why won't the gov't just do what I want with the tax money?  How about all the poor in Appalachia living in substandard housing?  A fuck-ton more than 4000 will die because of a lack of available medical care.

My point is that the GOP talking point about Puerto Rican government problems is bullshit.  I'm sure the PR government is fucked up.  But that doesn't excuse the federal government from letting over 4000 people die there due to a hurricane.  The basic purpose of government is to protect its citizens.  Our government has failed them, and it's barely in the news.  

 There's an entire thread for abortion demagoguery on here.  But good to know you're consistent with the GOP about only caring for brown people when they're in the womb.

[Johnny Sack 8397]

45 minutes ago, lemonlime said:

My point is that the GOP talking point about Puerto Rican government problems is bullshit.  I'm sure the PR government is fucked up.  But that doesn't excuse the federal government from letting over 4000 people die there due to a hurricane.  The basic purpose of government is to protect its citizens.  Our government has failed them, and it's barely in the news.  

 There's an entire thread for abortion demagoguery on here.  But good to know you're consistent with the GOP about only caring for brown people when they're in the womb.

Since you obviously care a lot, you should send some money down there.  I am sure they would appreciate it.

[pyrohornIII 4823]

1 hour ago, Johnny Sack said:

Since you obviously care a lot, you should send some money down there.  I am sure they would appreciate it.

How do you know he hasn't done that already?

[InkaUtexas 26184]

if he paid taxes he did. 

[Whitman 694]

2 hours ago, lemonlime said:

  But good to know you're consistent with the GOP about only caring for brown people when they're in the womb.

I care enough to be open to have sexy time with either Halle Berry or Eboni Williams (or even both).  That's pretty caring.

[lemonlime 5503]

2 hours ago, Johnny Sack said:

Since you obviously care a lot, you should send some money down there.  I am sure they would appreciate it.

I did.  And that has fuck all to do with the federal government's response or lack thereof to over 4000 Americans dying as the result of a hurricane.

[jimmyjazz 46277]

2 hours ago, Johnny Sack said:

Since you obviously care a lot, you should send some money down there.  I am sure they would appreciate it.

You know, for being a smart guy you sure can post some dumb shit.

[JimmyJames 12271]

2 hours ago, Johnny Sack said:

Since you obviously care a lot, you should send some money down there.  I am sure they would appreciate it.

Dumb response. 

[Scholz 11970]

4 hours ago, WhatTheBuck said:

They can't vote for president. And they're brown. Trump doesn't care about them. 

Oh, he cares.  And he knows who they are.  You know he had some run-ins with Puerto Ricans in NYC at some point (i.e. having to wait in traffic for their annual parade or something) and has been waiting all this time to get even.  Not exaggerating.

[R2D2 91]

Trump is a disgrace.

[High Plains Drifter 11052]

OP obviously didn't see the video of Trump personally helping distribute paper towels to those people.

[Scholz 11970]

1 minute ago, High Plains Drifter said:

OP obviously didn't see the video of Trump personally helping distribute paper towels to those people.

With apologies to Larry Legend:

 

 

[Thetexashammer 1062]

So this might not confirm most of your ideologic biases, but you know that the level of disaster preparedness that existed eight months after Trump took office was likely to be exactly the same level of preparedness that Obama determined was appropriate after eight years of Obama guidance and planning.  

I would also add that the PR Emergency Management Agency, the entity designated to handle exactly this kind of  crisis, all of its personnel simply walked off the job. Lots of things that went on locally affected the situation. Local preparedness is even more important on an island hundreds of miles from the mainland when you know that resources will be delayed.

 

[WhatTheBuck 28812]

But Obama! (Would've done more for Puerto Rico after the hurricane than Trump.)

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

Obama would have probably deployed the military and approached it like a war zone complete with airdrops of food, water, supplies, and medical aid.

Trump?

Edited May 30, 2018 by Hugo Stiglitz

[futureman 22559]

do not minimize the utility of paper towels. 

[Jack Burton 35]

Gonna be interesting to watch how all the new Floridians via Puerto Rico will vote.

[El Diablo 4232]

Clearly the entire island should have been evacuated immediately after the damage was done. Move the entire population to some place safe until repairs are completed. How hard can it be? I know of a lady who supposedly died in Florida as an indirect result of the hurricane. Her niece told me that she succumbed to some mosquito borne illness she contracted due to lack of air conditioning I think. She got off the island but it was too late at that point. We should have moved them all off the island until we could fix the AC at least.

[NoBullshit 0]

15 hours ago, Thetexashammer said:

So this might not confirm most of your ideologic biases, but you know that the level of disaster preparedness that existed eight months after Trump took office was likely to be exactly the same level of preparedness that Obama determined was appropriate after eight years of Obama guidance and planning.  

I would also add that the PR Emergency Management Agency, the entity designated to handle exactly this kind of  crisis, all of its personnel simply walked off the job. Lots of things that went on locally affected the situation. Local preparedness is even more important on an island hundreds of miles from the mainland when you know that resources will be delayed.

 

It was sad how it immediately went from a disaster to a political battle. 

https://www.wsj.com/podcasts/the-puerto-rico-blame-game-catalonia-pr-stunt/618453B5-032D-4349-BB03-5D5D198520AF.html

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

 

[Johnny Sack 8397]

35 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

 

Maybe she can help like she did in Haiti

[hayden_horn 11365]

this is honestly a complete fucking catastrophe. this storm hit on september fucking 20th.  that's 8 months ago. i know there is local corruption, and i know there are data integrity issues, and i know there is an economic calamity on the island, but this is an american fucking territory. we have a fucking responsibility to straighten this shit out. i know it's unlikely, but what happens if another hurricane hits this season? there are already more than double the number of katrina deaths. this is horrifying, and we aren't really talking about it.

[Johnny Sack 8397]

We have sent $16 billion.  That's $4,500 for every person on the island.  There are a shitload of people down there rebuilding.  My buddy is one.  He said the local government is nothing but a hindrance.

[hayden_horn 11365]

5 minutes ago, Johnny Sack said:

We have sent $16 billion.  That's $4,500 for every person on the island.  There are a shitload of people down there rebuilding.  My buddy is one.  He said the local government is nothing but a hindrance.

i believe it. however, that's america's responsibility, just like trying to get louisiana, mississippi, and alabama rebuilt after katrina. i appreciate there is local corruption, as i mentioned it in my post, but it is still AMERICAN soil.

[Johnny Sack 8397]

1 minute ago, hayden_horn said:

i believe it. however, that's america's responsibility, just like trying to get louisiana, mississippi, and alabama rebuilt after katrina. i appreciate there is local corruption, as i mentioned it in my post, but it is still AMERICAN soil.

We are doing it.  It is a fucking island and there are major infrastructure issues.  It takes time.  The entire island was smoked.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23367]

1 minute ago, Johnny Sack said:

We are doing it.  It is a fucking island and there are major infrastructure issues.  It takes time.  The entire island was smoked.

This is horseshit and you know it. We could have done so much more.  Our military is fully capable to respond to a hurricane ravaged environment.  I’ve seen it first hand in Louisiana.

Those thousands of people died from neglect and incompetence, not the storm.

[MNLonghornFUKM 8823]

You mean those 3 guys from Montana failed to get electricity up and going for the entire island?

[lemonlime 5503]

Not only that but the government lied about the death toll.  At least 70 times the number of people in the official death toll died.  This should be a huge scandal.  Instead the GOP are taking a partisan side and yammering excuses.

[Mole 4333]

That's 1500 more than 9/11. How long did it take us to respond there?

[DaysOff 7977]

this is honestly a complete fucking catastrophe. this storm hit on september fucking 20th.  that's 8 months ago. i know there is local corruption, and i know there are data integrity issues, and i know there is an economic calamity on the island, but this is an american fucking territory. we have a fucking responsibility to straighten this shit out. i know it's unlikely, but what happens if another hurricane hits this season? there are already more than double the number of katrina deaths. this is horrifying, and we aren't really talking about it.

Because none of it's true. It's a made up number so people with trump derangement syndrome will lose their mind. Have you been to PR recently? I have. They ain't talking about.

Stress is a killer. People died due to the stress of the event. The number is bullshit.

[Scholz 11970]

Our country can't get big infrastructure projects done anymore.  12,000 homes in Flint, Michigan are still without clean drinking water 4 years later.  Pipes still need replacing there.

[JimmyJames 12271]

1 hour ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

This is horseshit and you know it. We could have done so much more.  Our military is fully capable to respond to a hurricane ravaged environment.  I’ve seen it first hand in Louisiana.

Those thousands of people died from neglect and incompetence, not the storm.

Yeah but your post doesn’t fit with his narrative that America and the whites did all they could do and the browns in control of the island fucked it all up anyway, probably because they’re libs. That’s his narrative and he’s sticking to it come hell or high water. 

[JimmyJames 12271]

2 hours ago, Johnny Sack said:

We are doing it.  It is a fucking island and there are major infrastructure issues.  It takes time.  The entire island was smoked.

Our military is incapable of reaching islands with supplies. And even if they could the browns would steal it all anyway. We got your argument. 

[JimmyJames 12271]

2 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

This is horseshit and you know it. We could have done so much more.  Our military is fully capable to respond to a hurricane ravaged environment.  I’ve seen it first hand in Louisiana.

Those thousands of people died from neglect and incompetence, not the storm.

And thank God the state government of Louisiana isn’t corrupt like those Puerto Rican’s.

[Jack Burton 35]

If you guys gave more to your local church they would have fixed this by now.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

5 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

 

I know, lets let Hillary and Co. activate the same plan they used to save Haiti....  That'll do the trick.

 

 

[JimmyJames 12271]

Just now, Onboard 2.0 said:

I know, lets let Hillary and Co. activate the same plan they used to save Haiti....  That'll do the trick.

 

 

Nice but Hillary you just pulled off there chief. you should move on to some other posts and copy the same tactic. 

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

Just now, JimmyJames said:

Nice but Hillary you just pulled off there chief. you should move on to some other posts and copy the same tactic. 

Thanks, it's a pretty relevant retort to her tweet.  She has some balls telling this admin . to take care of its citizens when she and her cronies fleeced Haiti.  It's cool, you love her, and want to have her love child, I get it.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

3 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

Nice but Hillary you just pulled off there chief. you should move on to some other posts and copy the same tactic. 

back at'cha on the neg vibes there sport.  I didn't know that posting about someones tweets was a but (fill in the blank) moment.

[JimmyJames 12271]

Just now, Onboard 2.0 said:

Thanks, it's a pretty relevant retort to her tweet.  She has some balls telling this admin . to take care of its citizens when she and her cronies fleeced Haiti.  It's cool, you love her, and want to have her love child, I get it.

I dont love her. In fact I intensely dislike her. She was a terrible Secretary of State. You seem to excuse trumps behavior by comparing it to hers. That makes you a hypocritical piece of shit much like our president. You should be condemning both, not using one to excuse the other. 

We clear?

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

1 minute ago, JimmyJames said:

I dont love her. In fact I intensely dislike her. She was a terrible Secretary of State. You seem to excuse trumps behavior by comparing it to hers. That makes you a hypocritical piece of shit much like our president. You should be condemning both, not using one to excuse the other. 

We clear?

I'm not excusing trumps actions. I'm responding to what she wrote.  Trying to make political hay, stay relevant, whatever when SHE stole millions from the relief efforts in Haiti. You think it's cool she did that ?  She's looking for attention, she got it.  

Glad you don't like her, yer not alone.

[JimmyJames 12271]

Just now, Onboard 2.0 said:

I'm not excusing trumps actions. I'm responding to what she wrote.  Trying to make political hay, stay relevant, whatever when SHE stole millions from the relief efforts in Haiti. You think it's cool she did that ?  She's looking for attention, she got it.  

Glad you don't like her, yer not alone.

So why don’t you just tell the board your opinion about the topic at hand, which is trumps failure to protect US Citizens after a hurricane? Care to share?

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

1 minute ago, JimmyJames said:

So why don’t you just tell the board your opinion about the topic at hand, which is trumps failure to protect US Citizens after a hurricane? Care to share?

Because the topic of my post was aimed at her lame ass, politically motivated, dishonest tweet. If Trump posts a tweet telling everyone how he saved the PR folks I'll respond to that. My love for him ends at his defeat of Hillary in 2016.