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2018 Rockets Offseason Thread - LeBron or bust

Chapo

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Chapo

Chapo 104

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Saw some chatter abt PG13 coming to the Rockets, it wouldn't be a bad plan B if no LeBron.  The Thunder will not have a significant way to improve besides the MLE if PG13 wants to leave so they would probably welcome the opportunity to add EG/ Tucker.  That's of course only a posibility if PG13 wants to leave money on the table ala CP3.

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Ricky Butler
Ricky Butler

The Rockets are slowly building a team of superstar players that nobody likes.

HtownHorn
HtownHorn

Just stop with Lebron. He's not leaving the East. Best spend your energy on resigning the core of the team, and going after a guy like Tyreke Evans or finally convincing Sergio Llull to come over. Thi

angryhomer
angryhomer

We hate you too.

Ricky Butler

Ricky Butler 2662

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45 minutes ago, Dutchrudder said:

Yup. Time to beat Kevin Durant and the Warriors at their own game by stacking the deck in his favor. It ain't happening anywhere but Houston or Boston.

Let me get this straight. You think Lebron James is the right person to teach people a lesson about creating super teams and stacking the deck. THE SUPER TEAM ERA OF THE NBA IS HIS CREATION. THIS IS ALL HIS FAULT.

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Machinator

Machinator 32098

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7 minutes ago, Ricky Butler said:

Let me get this straight. You think Lebron James is the right person to teach people a lesson about creating super teams and stacking the deck. THE SUPER TEAM ERA OF THE NBA IS HIS CREATION. THIS IS ALL HIS FAULT.

Who said anything about teaching a lesson? The goal is to win championships through whatever means necessary.

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Thatguy

Thatguy 8540

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51 minutes ago, Ricky Butler said:

Let me get this straight. You think Lebron James is the right person to teach people a lesson about creating super teams and stacking the deck. THE SUPER TEAM ERA OF THE NBA IS HIS CREATION. THIS IS ALL HIS FAULT.

um.........

USATSI_6054468.jpg

 

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Thatguy

Thatguy 8540

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6 hours ago, Ricky Butler said:

The Celtics gave up assets for those guys in trades. The Decision was two NBA free agents turning down more money to join a super team. Lebron started the era of player manipulated team building.

   It doesn't matter how you acquire a super team, it's still a super team. Durant going to GSW doesn't have any better feeling. Lebron doesn't make that move if the Celtics don't make theirs.

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Ricky Butler

Ricky Butler 2662

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3 hours ago, Thatguy said:

   It doesn't matter how you acquire a super team,

Yes it does. It screws with the competitive balance when you receive no assets for your superstar when they leave. If you don't see how The Decision changed team building, then I don't know what to tell you. The players realized the control they had by leaving money on the table and manipulating the system.

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Sidney Sherman

Sidney Sherman 66

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5 hours ago, Ricky Butler said:

Yes it does. It screws with the competitive balance when you receive no assets for your superstar when they leave. If you don't see how The Decision changed team building, then I don't know what to tell you. The players realized the control they had by leaving money on the table and manipulating the system.

Whatever sells. The league makes up the rules I'm sure they could figure out a way to control it if they wanted.

The Cavs also got 3 first lottery picks when after "the decision" despite the odds being 20%, 15%, and 1.7% lol. There is a 0.05% chance of that happening for real so who knows, a superstar leaves you could be impossibly lucky enough to win the lottery until you can build a good team for him to come back to.

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Ricky Butler

Ricky Butler 2662

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34 minutes ago, Sidney Sherman said:

The Cavs also got 3 first lottery picks when after "the decision" despite the odds being 20%, 15%, and 1.7% lol. There is a 0.05% chance of that happening for real so who knows, a superstar leaves you could be impossibly lucky enough to win the lottery until you can build a good team for him to come back to.

You know what would have been better for the Cavs? Getting fair value for one of the greatest players of all-time in his prime.

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Sidney Sherman

Sidney Sherman 66

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43 minutes ago, Ricky Butler said:

You know what would have been better for the Cavs? Getting fair value for one of the greatest players of all-time in his prime.

I don't think they wanted that. They wanted him to go so they could build a team from the ground up for Lebron to come back to. That was their plan all along, I think it was the league and Lebron's plan too. Lebron will stay with the cavs or at least the East for the rest of his career too, no matter if he gets swept in this finals, which he won't. I think Chitowndoc said Warriors in 6 based on the vegas odds so I think thats whats happening.

How about Gordon Hayward bailing on the Jazz for the Celtics?

Edited by Sidney Sherman
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Ricky Butler

Ricky Butler 2662

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15 minutes ago, Sidney Sherman said:

I don't think they wanted that. They wanted him to go so they could build a team from the ground up for Lebron to come back to. That was their plan all along,

I think we live in different realities. I'm done. Have a great weekend.

 

sn_gilbertletter_kd_576_1392.png

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dingleberryswitzer

dingleberryswitzer 2724

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3 hours ago, Sidney Sherman said:

I don't think they wanted that. They wanted him to go so they could build a team from the ground up for Lebron to come back to. That was their plan all along, I think it was the league and Lebron's plan too. Lebron will stay with the cavs or at least the East for the rest of his career too, no matter if he gets swept in this finals, which he won't. I think Chitowndoc said Warriors in 6 based on the vegas odds so I think thats whats happening.

How about Gordon Hayward bailing on the Jazz for the Celtics?

Who was responsible for coming up with the plan to draft Anthony Bennett?  Because to me, that sort of disproves your grand theory.

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runthebone

runthebone 7933

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On 6/1/2018 at 7:15 AM, HtownHorn said:

The 1st super team was the Rockets, when they traded for Barkley to add to Drexler and Hakeem. That was 3 HOFs, in the later stages of their prime. Of course, we surrounded them with Matt Maloney.

Maloney's probably still getting paid

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kopp0e

kopp0e 1135

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17 hours ago, Ricky Butler said:

I think we live in different realities. I'm done. Have a great weekend.

 

sn_gilbertletter_kd_576_1392.png

I think I see your point and Cleveland by no means wanted LeBron to take his talents anywhere other than Quicken Loans Arena...

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Dutchrudder

Dutchrudder 11124

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What if the Thunder buys out Carmelo & he could sign for the MLE on the Rockets, do you take the risk..?
He's basically Joe Johnson at this point, and I'd rather have Joe for the minimum. Plus, look who Morey and CP3 brought in with the MLE last year, PJ motherTucker! Another signing like that could be game changing for us.
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kopp0e

kopp0e 1135

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31 minutes ago, Dutchrudder said:
7 hours ago, kopp0e said:
What if the Thunder buys out Carmelo & he could sign for the MLE on the Rockets, do you take the risk..?

He's basically Joe Johnson at this point, and I'd rather have Joe for the minimum. Plus, look who Morey and CP3 brought in with the MLE last year, PJ motherTucker! Another signing like that could be game changing for us.

Agreed, and although I am still a fan of Kevin Durant; I was hoping for a Boston vs Houston NBA Finals... But I think next year will be the watermark moment for both teams..!

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Orca of Peace

Orca of Peace 109

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Melo is finished. Also, shooters who can't defend are being benched and I dont' think we'll see that kind of player in the NBA ever again.

Houston needs to get bigger somehow if they can't sign Lebron or a top FA. Another athletic Capela would be good since injuries are a curse on this team. 

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kopp0e

kopp0e 1135

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11 hours ago, Brothahorn said:
23 hours ago, kopp0e said:
What if the Thunder buys out Carmelo & he could sign for the MLE on the Rockets, do you take the risk..?

Fuck No!!

Yeah, there's no reason for the Rockets to take that deal now, the Thunder made 1 trade too many last year & will have to buy him out I think... #NextYearRocketsWinItAll...

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Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman 3903

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7 minutes ago, Orca of Peace said:

Morey would be a genius to get it done. The Rino contract will cost $100mil/yr in luxury tax + salary? My god that's a ton of money, how will Morey wiggle out of that?

Attach a guy like EG and maybe even add PJT as well to it along with a first or two..... Someone will probably take it.  It's the NBA and half the organizations have shitty management.

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Orca of Peace

Orca of Peace 109

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3 minutes ago, Patrick Bateman said:

Attach a guy like EG and maybe even add PJT as well to it along with a first or two..... Someone will probably take it.  It's the NBA and half the organizations have shitty management.

hate to see them go (you meant with RA right?).  i would rather unload Ariza than Tucker

 

Edited by Orca of Peace
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Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman 3903

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1 minute ago, Orca of Peace said:

hate to see them go (you meant with RA right?).  i would rather unload Ariza than Tucker

 

Ariza is a UFA and probably is easier to sign.  The Rockets would need to shed a ton of salary to get Lebron so yes, you have to make Anderson's contract palatable and sweeten it up.  Maybe a bad club would take on these contracts with those guys and hope to sell them off at the deadline.  It's not a great package, but Cleveland would be the best option in a S&T. 

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Ricky Butler

Ricky Butler 2662

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3 hours ago, Patrick Bateman said:

Attach a guy like EG and maybe even add PJT as well to it along with a first or two..... Someone will probably take it.  It's the NBA and half the organizations have shitty management.

EG would definitely be interesting for a lot of teams, but how do the Rockets do that without matching salary?

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Dutchrudder

Dutchrudder 11124

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So here's a crazy idea, assume Lebron goes somewhere other than Cleveland or Houston.  

Cavs go into tank mode and firesale assets. They start at 104m with Lebron gone, so slightly over the cap, but not in the tax. They want picks and young players to move forward, and want to get value, but Dan Gilbert also wants to save money. What if the Cavs send Kevin Love and Tyronn Lue to the Rockets for Ryan Anderson and a 2020 1st to the Cavs. The Cavs take on 41m of salary in total, but they drop Love's 50m remaining and the 21m off Lue's deal onto the Rockets, which doesn't hit their salary cap or cost luxury tax. The Cavs end up with another 1st round pick for their troubles, and rid themselves of Lue who they would likely fire and pay. The Rockets upgrade from Anderson to a true stretch 4 that can hit 3s, and have a player Morey can potentially trade if needed. Sure it costs Fertitta 21m to do this, but at least it's not luxury tax!  

Another option may be to send Love to a team with space like the Suns for a mid 1st in this draft, Anderson to Cle, and Lue to Houston for money savings.

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Slacks

Slacks 6792

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8 hours ago, Dutchrudder said:

So here's a crazy idea, assume Lebron goes somewhere other than Cleveland or Houston.  

Cavs go into tank mode and firesale assets. They start at 104m with Lebron gone, so slightly over the cap, but not in the tax. They want picks and young players to move forward, and want to get value, but Dan Gilbert also wants to save money. What if the Cavs send Kevin Love and Tyronn Lue to the Rockets for Ryan Anderson and a 2020 1st to the Cavs. The Cavs take on 41m of salary in total, but they drop Love's 50m remaining and the 21m off Lue's deal onto the Rockets, which doesn't hit their salary cap or cost luxury tax. The Cavs end up with another 1st round pick for their troubles, and rid themselves of Lue who they would likely fire and pay. The Rockets upgrade from Anderson to a true stretch 4 that can hit 3s, and have a player Morey can potentially trade if needed. Sure it costs Fertitta 21m to do this, but at least it's not luxury tax!  

Another option may be to send Love to a team with space like the Suns for a mid 1st in this draft, Anderson to Cle, and Lue to Houston for money savings.

Tyronn Lue?

I didn't know coaches counted against the salary cap.

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Ricky Butler

Ricky Butler 2662

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8 hours ago, Dutchrudder said:

So here's a crazy idea, assume Lebron goes somewhere other than Cleveland or Houston.  

Cavs go into tank mode and firesale assets. They start at 104m with Lebron gone, so slightly over the cap, but not in the tax. They want picks and young players to move forward, and want to get value, but Dan Gilbert also wants to save money. What if the Cavs send Kevin Love and Tyronn Lue to the Rockets for Ryan Anderson and a 2020 1st to the Cavs. The Cavs take on 41m of salary in total, but they drop Love's 50m remaining and the 21m off Lue's deal onto the Rockets, which doesn't hit their salary cap or cost luxury tax. The Cavs end up with another 1st round pick for their troubles, and rid themselves of Lue who they would likely fire and pay. The Rockets upgrade from Anderson to a true stretch 4 that can hit 3s, and have a player Morey can potentially trade if needed. Sure it costs Fertitta 21m to do this, but at least it's not luxury tax!  

Another option may be to send Love to a team with space like the Suns for a mid 1st in this draft, Anderson to Cle, and Lue to Houston for money savings.

So your idea is that the Cavs trade an all-star and a coach for probably the worst pick of the 1st round and one of the worst contracts in the NBA? Who says no?

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Dutchrudder

Dutchrudder 11124

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12 hours ago, Snacks said:

Tyronn Lue?

I didn't know coaches counted against the salary cap.

No they don't, that's the point. The rockets would be taking 21m guaranteed to a worthless coach off Dan Gilbert's payroll, which is why the Cavs would be open to taking on Ryan Anderson. It's sneaky, and would be an interesting way of giving value to the Cavs while not taking on salary cap. The Cavs will move Love if LBJ is out, that's almost a certainty. If they don't want to take back much salary, then they only have a few options, and one of those is Phoenix. If they want to be above the cap floor without having to commit too much, Anderson's not bad to help with the tank job for 2 years at most, or use in a deadline trade as a big expiring contract. 

Edited by Dutchrudder
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Patrick Bateman

Patrick Bateman 3903

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26 minutes ago, Dutchrudder said:

No they don't, that's the point. The rockets would be taking 21m guaranteed to a worthless coach off Dan Gilbert's payroll, which is why the Cavs would be open to taking on Ryan Anderson. It's sneaky, and would be an interesting way of giving value to the Cavs while not taking on salary cap. The Cavs will move Love if LBJ is out, that's almost a certainty. If they don't want to take back much salary, then they only have a few options, and one of those is Phoenix. If they want to be above the cap floor without having to commit too much, Anderson's not bad to help with the tank job for 2 years at most, or use in a deadline trade as a big expiring contract. 

Read up on the Doc Rivers/Kevin Garnett situation...... It's almost surely a non-starter, especially to just go about firing said coach.  Also the fallout amongst those in the coaching and front office profession towards Gilbert and Cleveland wouldn't be worth it anyway.  Also, IIRC, there is only 2 more years on the deal guaranteed and a new coach and staff's cost and offset would make the savings negligible.  Best just to have him oversee the tanking and get rid of him in a couple of years when you're hopefully ready to start contending for a playoff spot (if management rebuilds correctly).

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BigOrange1

BigOrange1 6422

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in non-lebron news, the draft is a week away and the rockets have the #46 pick.  who knows whether they keep the pick or not, but looking in to some guys who are projected to still be on the board and there are some guys i like:

  • devonte' graham - big time leader, not afraid of big moments
  • jarred vanderbilt - 3 & D wing who also rebounds
  • devon hall - 3 & D wing
  • jevon carter - think he has some pat beverley in him
  • gary trent jr. - shooter
  • malik newman - shooter
  • trevon duval - can't shoot (yet), but there were several duke games i watched where i thought he was the best player on the court. 
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HtownHorn

HtownHorn 14500

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8 hours ago, BigOrange1 said:

in non-lebron news, the draft is a week away and the rockets have the #46 pick.  who knows whether they keep the pick or not, but looking in to some guys who are projected to still be on the board and there are some guys i like:

  • devonte' graham - big time leader, not afraid of big moments
  • jarred vanderbilt - 3 & D wing who also rebounds
  • devon hall - 3 & D wing
  • jevon carter - think he has some pat beverley in him
  • gary trent jr. - shooter
  • malik newman - shooter
  • trevon duval - can't shoot (yet), but there were several duke games i watched where i thought he was the best player on the court. 

All those guys seem decent enough to pick at that point in the draft. I'd lean more towards a 3rd PG, considering we have to plan that Paul is going to get hurt again next year and probably at the worst possible time.

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