Realignment talk not going away

[Wulaw Horn 19097]

15 minutes ago, statsman said:

With no changes, in two years, there will be a 32 team “super D1”, and it will consist of the B10 and SEC. If there are four playoff spots, these two leagues will take 2-4 of them. If there are 12 playoff spots, it will be set up so that those conferences take 7-9 of the slots. These two conferences will make 2-3 times as much in media money as the next tier. 
As more money comes into the game, having money to spend will be more important than ever. The ACC/PAC/B12 will crave games with the big boys, for the gate and to keep the alums happy. I imagine the terms will be 2 home and 1 away. How will the Power-lite 3 schools respond?

I imagine that eventually, the SEC and B10 will offer the PL3 schools the chance to join the SEC and B10 junior divisions, with a chance to earns a promotion up. In return, they get media contracts every bit as big, a home and home game scheduled with a senior division school, and a chance for a promotion up (and the corresponding big media money) for as long as they can keep it. And that’s how D-1 segmentation will happen. 

That sounds unlikely but possible and maybe fun. 

[Wulaw Horn 19097]

15 minutes ago, statsman said:

With no changes, in two years, there will be a 32 team “super D1”, and it will consist of the B10 and SEC. If there are four playoff spots, these two leagues will take 2-4 of them. If there are 12 playoff spots, it will be set up so that those conferences take 7-9 of the slots. These two conferences will make 2-3 times as much in media money as the next tier. 
As more money comes into the game, having money to spend will be more important than ever. The ACC/PAC/B12 will crave games with the big boys, for the gate and to keep the alums happy. I imagine the terms will be 2 home and 1 away. How will the Power-lite 3 schools respond?

I imagine that eventually, the SEC and B10 will offer the PL3 schools the chance to join the SEC and B10 junior divisions, with a chance to earns a promotion up. In return, they get media contracts every bit as big, a home and home game scheduled with a senior division school, and a chance for a promotion up (and the corresponding big media money) for as long as they can keep it. And that’s how D-1 segmentation will happen. 

That sounds unlikely but possible and maybe fun. 

[statsman 5472]

16 minutes ago, thunderlounge said:

2 years? It’s not that close yet, but like winter, it’s coming.

In two years there will be a Super D-1. It will be de facto, and not by charter, but it will be real. 

[statsman 5472]

Maybe. And Texas will be in danger of relegation like Man United or Liverpool is

[Trey3216 15347]

 

 

[Hurtlocker 2213]

4 minutes ago, Trey3216 said:

 

 

John is definitely fighting the good fight on Twitter for the Pac 12

[Trey3216 15347]

1 minute ago, Hurtlocker said:

John is definitely fighting the good fight on Twitter for the Pac 12

He's really fighting the fight for Cal and Stanford.  

[camel at sea 589]

5 minutes ago, Trey3216 said:

He's really fighting the fight for Cal and Stanford.  

It's pretty bizarre that these media guys continue to pretend that TV wouldn't continue getting their late night kicks if the Big 12 raided the Four Corners.  They'd just have those late kicks tacked onto a conference that is stronger during the rest of the day, too.  

[Trey3216 15347]

2 minutes ago, camel at sea said:

It's pretty bizarre that these media guys continue to pretend that TV wouldn't continue getting their late night kicks if the Big 12 raided the Four Corners.  They'd just have those late kicks tacked onto a conference that is stronger during the rest of the day, too.  

I think they're finally seeing the writing on the wall and they're just throwing shit at it to see what sticks.  "We own the night kick!!!"  Well, you won't anymore, son.  We'll have kicks at 11, 2:30, 6 and 9:30.  And you'll like it.  

[clapclapclap 9000]

18 minutes ago, Trey3216 said:

He's really fighting the fight for Cal and Stanford.  

Looks like Wilner thinks they may need a landing spot, in the last few weeks he ditched his long time twitter avatar of Fauci's face on the Heisman.

Edited July 20, 2022 by clapclapclap

[DFW Horn 6124]

38 minutes ago, Trey3216 said:

He's really fighting the fight for Cal and Stanford.  

Fuck 'em both

[LTtxfan 49249]

3 hours ago, Trey3216 said:

Full on bargaining and moving towards acceptance.

Maybe forget the two California teams -- not worth the political hassles in that state.

B12 + 4 Corners + 4 in Wash/Oregon = 20

['stache 21819]

I don't care about the political hassles, but they are too snooty to see past academics to dare associate with us lowly mid-America colleges and Universities. Might have been okay with USC, UCLA, and even UW to feel okay with the rest of the PAC, but they'll die on that hill. I think Stanford could survive as an independent, although their income would take a big hit. Cal might be completely fucked unless they completely rebrand and launch independence with ND and Stanford. It's why I'm not real big on them joining, I just don't think they'd give us a second thought. They'd rather burn it all down than dare have their names associated with Texas Tech or Oklahoma State.

[Sir Ulrich 5187]

5 minutes ago, 'stache said:

I don't care about the political hassles, but they are too snooty to see past academics to dare associate with us lowly mid-America colleges and Universities. Might have been okay with USC, UCLA, and even UW to feel okay with the rest of the PAC, but they'll die on that hill. I think Stanford could survive as an independent, although their income would take a big hit. Cal might be completely fucked unless they completely rebrand and launch independence with ND and Stanford. It's why I'm not real big on them joining, I just don't think they'd give us a second thought. They'd rather burn it all down than dare have their names associated with Texas Tech or Oklahoma State.

Mpst of the Tech fans I know want to see the whole thing die after not inviting them last year. Leaving the Cal schools out and killing the Pac in one swoop would probably suffice for those that were left out to dry last year

[Satchel 6938]

6 minutes ago, Sir Ulrich said:

Mpst of the Tech fans I know want to see the whole thing die after not inviting them last year. Leaving the Cal schools out and killing the Pac in one swoop would probably suffice for those that were left out to dry last year

When greed is the driving force, in politics and in sports, there are no permanent friends and no permanent friends.

[Wulaw Horn 19097]

41 minutes ago, Satchel said:

When greed is the driving force, in politics and in sports, there are no permanent friends and no permanent friends.

And then you have UT and OU with a fucking relationship like the UK and the US.  Why did we get ourselves hooked to those fucktards?   I guess b/c they aren't immature morons like aggy.  Still, why couldn't we be like UNC and Duke, instead of getting stuck with OU

[Satchel 6938]

3 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

And then you have UT and OU with a fucking relationship like the UK and the US.  Why did we get ourselves hooked to those fucktards?   I guess b/c they aren't immature morons like aggy.  Still, why couldn't we be like UNC and Duke, instead of getting stuck with OU

Good question. I guess there are no permanent enemies either.

[statsman 5472]

5 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

And then you have UT and OU with a fucking relationship like the UK and the US.  Why did we get ourselves hooked to those fucktards?   I guess b/c they aren't immature morons like aggy.  Still, why couldn't we be like UNC and Duke, instead of getting stuck with OU

I compare it to the US-USSR alliance in WWII. Once the grand goal is achieved, we need to arm the borders again (no CR, talking about Red River). 

[bullet 1597]

1 hour ago, Hurtlocker said:

John is definitely fighting the good fight on Twitter for the Pac 12

but that stack should have George's picture on it, not Ben's.

[Hurtlocker 2213]

The best adds for the Big 12 from an eyeball standpoint, and they'll need all the eyeballs they can get, would be ASU, Colorado, Washington, and Cal or Stanford.  That would net them around 9m new households and swipe all of the Pac's major markets.   At that point Oregon says hi and you let Arizona and Utah knife fight for the last spot.

The Big 12 could never build a linear channel because they didn't have the households and they didn't have the glut of inventory you get after you reach 14 schools.   Now they can and, while its not BTN/SECN numbers, its not nothing.

And if NBC wants ND, maybe you can dangle a bigger carrot to Stanford for their home against the Irish.   Only chance they have to join the B1G is if ND falls in their lap.  

 

[PilotsError 2294]

You guys are vastly overrating Phil Knight's influence and power. 

[statsman 5472]

25 minutes ago, PilotsError said:

You guys are vastly overrating Phil Knight's influence and power. 

How so?

[thunderlounge 7866]

How’s that “influence and power” workin out for him thus far?

 

2 hours ago, Hurtlocker said:

John is definitely fighting the good fight on Twitter for the Pac 12

I wouldn’t call it a good one. Sad, perhaps. 

[Francisco 2.0 32395]

54 minutes ago, statsman said:

How so?

Because he's 84? 85?

Sure, he can leave a boatload of money to Oregon, and his will probably can dictate some things, but no network or conference is going to listen to him.

He can get a new building built, or even donate to a handful of schools to get some things.  But he alone isn't going to get enough votes  for Oregon from the B1G through bribery.  

 

 

 

['stache 21819]

7 minutes ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

Because he's 84? 85?

Sure, he can leave a boatload of money to Oregon, and his will probably can dictate some things, but no network or conference is going to listen to him.

He can get a new building built, or even donate to a handful of schools to get some things.  But he alone isn't going to get enough votes  for Oregon from the B1G through bribery.  

 

 

 

I don't think he can get them into the Big 10, but he can put the new league on a hell of a good start using his resources and influence. I don't know what that would look like necessarily, but something NIL relating comes to mind.

[Not a Sock 2313]

40 minutes ago, 'stache said:

I don't think he can get them into the Big 10, but he can put the new league on a hell of a good start using his resources and influence. I don't know what that would look like necessarily, but something NIL relating comes to mind.

His resources and influence are limited, Oregon has been his pet project but Nike is absolutely not going to let’s its swoosh cash cows in the SEC or B1G be challenged. If you want to talk about his fortune that he leaves when he kicks the bucket, we’ll he isn’t special in that case.

[Sandbagging Steve 982]

13 hours ago, sportsbay said:

The EPL is a table.  They don't have a playoff.  Forming a super league without many of the current toxic fanbases will drive many away.  I love the toxicity in college sports.

Similarly, creating a 4 team beauty pageant kills the chance for Cinderella. It takes a lot of the fun out of it.  Fans will leave and the pie shrinks.... everyone loses.

Do you enjoy the lack of integrity in the college game? It's worse than FIFA, by a wide margin. 

Do you enjoy money being paid illegally under the table and glorified prostitutes thrown in front of students and their parents? Do you enjoy the life lessons these universities teach young athletes?

Do you enjoy people not getting paid fairly for their hard work?

Do you enjoy the fact that there is so many teams it's impossible to get good, unbiased officiating at the college game? And sometimes just straight up unprofessional cheating? The end result, at times, is refs determining the outcome of games. Games that kids have worked their tails off to win. That fans have spent a ton of money and invested a lot of time in. 

Do you enjoy the fact that no one plays anyone anymore? And that college football is the only sport where the champion hasn't earned it? All that time and money and the champion usually doesn't even earn the championship. Think about all the hard work kids and coaches put into this and the fans that invest their time and money. Is that fair to them?

[The Beast 585]

5 minutes ago, Sandbagging Steve said:

Do you enjoy the lack of integrity in the college game? It's worse than FIFA, by a wide margin. 

Do you enjoy money being paid illegally under the table and glorified prostitutes thrown in front of students and their parents? Do you enjoy the life lessons these universities teach young athletes?

Do you enjoy people not getting paid fairly for their hard work?

Do you enjoy the fact that there is so many teams it's impossible to get good, unbiased officiating at the college game? And sometimes just straight up unprofessional cheating? The end result, at times, is refs determining the outcome of games. Games that kids have worked their tails off to win. That fans have spent a ton of money and invested a lot of time in. 

Do you enjoy the fact that no one plays anyone anymore? And that college football is the only sport where the champion hasn't earned it? All that time and money and the champion usually doesn't even earn the championship. Think about all the hard work kids and coaches put into this and the fans that invest their time and money. Is that fair to them?

Yes

[CooterBrown 18014]

Because he's 84? 85?
Sure, he can leave a boatload of money to Oregon, and his will probably can dictate some things, but no network or conference is going to listen to him.
He can get a new building built, or even donate to a handful of schools to get some things.  But he alone isn't going to get enough votes  for Oregon from the B1G through bribery.  
 
 
 

He may not even remember his name at his age.

[billfromlaketravis 11515]

Phil Knight is 84 years young. So I fully expect him to run for president in 2024. 

[TrashMaster G 17563]

58 minutes ago, Sandbagging Steve said:

Do you enjoy the lack of integrity in the college game? It's worse than FIFA, by a wide margin. 

Do you enjoy money being paid illegally under the table and glorified prostitutes thrown in front of students and their parents? Do you enjoy the life lessons these universities teach young athletes?

Do you enjoy people not getting paid fairly for their hard work?

Do you enjoy the fact that there is so many teams it's impossible to get good, unbiased officiating at the college game? And sometimes just straight up unprofessional cheating? The end result, at times, is refs determining the outcome of games. Games that kids have worked their tails off to win. That fans have spent a ton of money and invested a lot of time in. 

Do you enjoy the fact that no one plays anyone anymore? And that college football is the only sport where the champion hasn't earned it? All that time and money and the champion usually doesn't even earn the championship. Think about all the hard work kids and coaches put into this and the fans that invest their time and money. Is that fair to them?

Wtf is this shit?

[Sandbagging Steve 982]

35 minutes ago, TrashMaster G said:

Wtf is this shit?

That's college football right now. I don't think it's a good thing.

[Steelers Roll Left 1179]

https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/34273667/california-governor-gavin-newsom-demands-ucla-explain-how-leaving-pac-12-big-ten-beneficial

 

[thunderlounge 7866]

58 minutes ago, Sandbagging Steve said:

That's college football right now. I don't think it's a good thing.

You don’t like hookers or cheap floozies?

 

[FartingDreamer 138]

3 hours ago, Sandbagging Steve said:

Do you enjoy the lack of integrity in the college game? It's worse than FIFA, by a wide margin. 

Do you enjoy money being paid illegally under the table and glorified prostitutes thrown in front of students and their parents? Do you enjoy the life lessons these universities teach young athletes?

Do you enjoy people not getting paid fairly for their hard work?

Do you enjoy the fact that there is so many teams it's impossible to get good, unbiased officiating at the college game? And sometimes just straight up unprofessional cheating? The end result, at times, is refs determining the outcome of games. Games that kids have worked their tails off to win. That fans have spent a ton of money and invested a lot of time in. 

Do you enjoy the fact that no one plays anyone anymore? And that college football is the only sport where the champion hasn't earned it? All that time and money and the champion usually doesn't even earn the championship. Think about all the hard work kids and coaches put into this and the fans that invest their time and money. Is that fair to them?

I want to hear more about these glorified prostitutes, I'm intrigued (on behalf of a friend of course)....

Edited July 21, 2022 by FartingDreamer

[BachelorTrek 3033]

4 hours ago, Sandbagging Steve said:

Do you enjoy the lack of integrity in the college game? It's worse than FIFA, by a wide margin. 

Do you enjoy money being paid illegally under the table and glorified prostitutes thrown in front of students and their parents? Do you enjoy the life lessons these universities teach young athletes?

Do you enjoy people not getting paid fairly for their hard work?

Do you enjoy the fact that there is so many teams it's impossible to get good, unbiased officiating at the college game? And sometimes just straight up unprofessional cheating? The end result, at times, is refs determining the outcome of games. Games that kids have worked their tails off to win. That fans have spent a ton of money and invested a lot of time in. 

Do you enjoy the fact that no one plays anyone anymore? And that college football is the only sport where the champion hasn't earned it? All that time and money and the champion usually doesn't even earn the championship. Think about all the hard work kids and coaches put into this and the fans that invest their time and money. Is that fair to them?

Username checks out.  Lulz.

[Sandbagging Steve 982]

1 minute ago, BachelorTrek said:

Username checks out.  Lulz.

All that stuff happens, if you keep up. Ole Miss is just one example

I think NIL and conference realignment are good for the game. It's going to solve a lot of the issues in college football. It just takes some time to get there. Some people don't like the current movement in the game because they fear change. You see that in all walks of life. But if you look at the game at face value, you see that there are a lot of variables that could see improvement with a different approach.

 

[DanTheHorn 4934]

6 hours ago, Steelers Roll Left said:

https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/34273667/california-governor-gavin-newsom-demands-ucla-explain-how-leaving-pac-12-big-ten-beneficial

 

[Gidnik 3284]

wonder how full of shit these guys are

 

[Al_4_ISU 12464]

10 minutes ago, Gidnik said:

wonder how full of shit these guys are

 

The main Sideline account posted "it's being reported...." about the 4 corners applying today an hour ago.

Their "report" is probably MHver3.

I think this will eventually happen, but I don't think it's happening today.  ISU insiders seem pretty confident that this will go down first week of August.  Yormark will officially be the commissioner, and the Pac's rights negotiations will be over.

[Laxtonto 12090]

10 minutes ago, Al_4_ISU said:

The main Sideline account posted "it's being reported...." about the 4 corners applying today an hour ago.

Their "report" is probably MHver3.

I think this will eventually happen, but I don't think it's happening today.  ISU insiders seem pretty confident that this will go down first week of August.  Yormark will officially be the commissioner, and the Pac's rights negotiations will be over.

If I was those 4 and my options were to either wait on the Pac12 tv deal, in which UW and OU are dictating what is happening, or make an early move to protect myself, I do the latter.

 

There are no friends in conference realignment. You are beholden only to be longterm good of your institution.

[DFW Horn 6124]

PAC needs to count on SDSU and SMU to save them? Somebody get Wilner a straightjacket and padded cell. He's lost it.

[Al_4_ISU 12464]

14 minutes ago, Laxtonto said:

If I was those 4 and my options were to either wait on the Pac12 tv deal, in which UW and OU are dictating what is happening, or make an early move to protect myself, I do the latter.

 

There are no friends in conference realignment. You are beholden only to be longterm good of your institution.

Exactly.

Having been in their shoes many times, if we had an opportunity in the past to get out for a more stable and lucrative deal we would.  The 4 corner schools are in a similar position with UO and UW that the Irate 8 were with Texas and OU.  We knew you guys viewed us as more or less pond scum and wanted out to play as many blue bloods as possible.  But we all felt our best option was to stay because no one was offering a lifeline.

The 4 corners have that lifeline, and they will likely make more money on the other side.  It's a no brainer for them.  Oregon and Washington want out.  Unlike Texas and Oklahoma, they aren't going to command major $ while they wait for the Big 10 invite that probably isn't coming.

[Steelers Roll Left 1179]

38 minutes ago, Laxtonto said:

If I was those 4 and my options were to either wait on the Pac12 tv deal, in which UW and OU are dictating what is happening, or make an early move to protect myself, I do the latter.

 

There are no friends in conference realignment. You are beholden only to be longterm good of your institution.

Yeah, the real question is whether the conference they are petitioning wants to add them now or play wait and see on other options (such as NoCal & The Pacific NW). Everyone’s playing chess and the wrong move could lead to your own checkmate so move well

[cochamps 1879]

6 minutes ago, Steelers Roll Left said:

Yeah, the real question is whether the conference they are petitioning wants to add them now or play wait and see on other options (such as NoCal & The Pacific NW). Everyone’s playing chess and the wrong move could lead to your own checkmate so move well

Seems that acting now will collapse the options of PNW and No Cal.

[Vertigo 20290]

20 minutes ago, Al_4_ISU said:

Exactly.

Having been in their shoes many times, if we had an opportunity in the past to get out for a more stable and lucrative deal we would.  The 4 corner schools are in a similar position with UO and UW that the Irate 8 were with Texas and OU.  We knew you guys viewed us as more or less pond scum and wanted out to play as many blue bloods as possible.  But we all felt our best option was to stay because no one was offering a lifeline.

The 4 corners have that lifeline, and they will likely make more money on the other side.  It's a no brainer for them.  Oregon and Washington want out.  Unlike Texas and Oklahoma, they aren't going to command major $ while they wait for the Big 10 invite that probably isn't coming.

I think pond scum is a bit strong but I see your point. I think at the end of the day, Texas and OU were tired of Bowlsby and the other school leaders all looking at them when it came to making any sort of decisions or setting strategic direction. From my knowledge, not once did Bowlsby ever come to a meeting with an original thought on how to solve a problem. Hence, the feeling that the two schools were totally propping up the conference. That, plus the obvious money gain by joining the SEC for the next media deal kind of sealed it. If Yormark had been the commissioner during round 1 of realignment, I think there is a chance Texas and OU are still in the B12 and moves would have been made years ago to expand. 

[Sir Ulrich 5187]

If the Big 12 goes west then my next purely fun hypothetical would be the ACC grabbing Kansas and Kstate to continue their Bball dominance and help expand their footprint. WVU and UCF would also be candidates that would also be perfect fits if they were trying to get to 20+ 

[LTtxfan 49249]

19 hours ago, LTtxfan said:

Maybe forget the two California teams -- not worth the political hassles in that state.

B12 + 4 Corners + 4 in Wash/Oregon = 20

 

[Uncle Nate 2097]

Interesting development...no mention of CU or ASU.  Haven't seen UDub mentioned w/o Oregon until now:

 

 

 

[Al_4_ISU 12464]

12 minutes ago, Vertigo said:

I think pond scum is a bit strong but I see your point. I think at the end of the day, Texas and OU were tired of Bowlsby and the other school leaders all looking at them when it came to making any sort of decisions or setting strategic direction. From my knowledge, not once did Bowlsby ever come to a meeting with an original thought on how to solve a problem. Hence, the feeling that the two schools were totally propping up the conference. That, plus the obvious money gain by joining the SEC for the next media deal kind of sealed it. If Yormark had been the commissioner during round 1 of realignment, I think there is a chance Texas and OU are still in the B12 and moves would have been made years ago to expand. 

Sure, pond scum might be strong, but I was just illustrating a point.  I saw a lot of posts here, and on OU boards about how bored fans were playing Big 12 schools and wished they could play someone better - even as Texas was struggling mightily to beat said bottom feeders.  We (the 8 leftovers) all kinda knew that y'all wanted out (even though we didn't really think you'd do it for competitive reasons) but we didn't have a better option ourselves.  And OU/UT were much more capable of financially driving value for a 10 team league than Oregon and Washington.  So we were stuck together until we weren't.

That's not the case for the Pac schools.  They have an out, and the schools who feel like they're above them can't provide nearly as much financial benefit.

Edited July 21, 2022 by Al_4_ISU