Realignment talk not going away

[Hagbard Celine 10864]

10 hours ago, LTbear said:

Adding to this, I think the B12 puts one game per team per year (usually the crappiest non-con) on ESPN+ or LHN, the P12 airs 35 games on the P12 network out of their 144 total game inventory, so he's discarding the bottom 25% of the lowest ratings from their averages. 

this

[BluTechsan 393]

Tech’s last decade of bed wetting really screws the pooch here.

However, I’m always amazed at how often Tech’s “market” is attributed to just Lubbock. Tech’s Dallas market might not equal that of UT or aggy but their Dallas fanbase is easily their largest alumni base.

[bullet 1597]

4 minutes ago, BluTechsan said:

Tech’s last decade of bed wetting really screws the pooch here.

However, I’m always amazed at how often Tech’s “market” is attributed to just Lubbock. Tech’s Dallas market might not equal that of UT or aggy but their Dallas fanbase is easily their largest alumni base.

I do remember that at my DFW HS in the 70s, more seniors went to Tech than any other 4 year school (Dallas County Community College-lovingly referred to as 13th grade-was first).

[BurntOrange&White 39932]

Rumors of an Arizona BoR meeting for Wednesday ?

Edited July 26, 2022 by BurntOrange&White

[BurntOrange&White 39932]

 

[Satchel 6938]

11 minutes ago, BluTechsan said:

Tech’s last decade of bed wetting really screws the pooch here.

However, I’m always amazed at how often Tech’s “market” is attributed to just Lubbock. Tech’s Dallas market might not equal that of UT or aggy but their Dallas fanbase is easily their largest alumni base.

What makes you think the aggy market is larger than Tech’s? Their market is more Houston centric. 

[statsman 5468]

14 minutes ago, BluTechsan said:

Tech’s last decade of bed wetting really screws the pooch here.

However, I’m always amazed at how often Tech’s “market” is attributed to just Lubbock. Tech’s Dallas market might not equal that of UT or aggy but their Dallas fanbase is easily their largest alumni base.

Question- on a weekend in late October, Texas, TAMU, OU and Tech are all scheduled to play a game (not with each other). Which channel does Tech get, in the DFW metroplex? I think FS1 at 11AM is their best bet, if it’s a solid matchup. 

[Hagbard Celine 10864]

10 hours ago, DFW Horn said:

Mandel’s calculations for the Pac 12 did not include tier 3 games. 

/jeffgoldblum

[thunderlounge 7831]

3 hours ago, sportsbay said:

If they don't like it, let them play on the Ophra channel or some such crap.

Well, that channel does show a lot of murder porn. Same diff. 
 

 

4 hours ago, demos said:

Anyone done a welfare check on Mandel?

Last check it was “no, it means 24.5 per game”

[billfromlaketravis 11476]

1 hour ago, statsman said:

Question- on a weekend in late October, Texas, TAMU, OU and Tech are all scheduled to play a game (not with each other). Which channel does Tech get, in the DFW metroplex? I think FS1 at 11AM is their best bet, if it’s a solid matchup. 

ESPN Plus’d

[clapclapclap 9000]

1 hour ago, BurntOrange&White said:

 

I doubt we'll see anything major until after the exclusive negotiating window ends Aug. 4 and the Pac can find out what other bidders offer.  

Being a basketball school, AZ fans may want to go B12, but these decisions are made by presidents and BOR's.  AZ is AAU, like 70% of the Pac10, I doubt any admin wants to leave the Pac unless they have to.  If AZ decided to go by themselves, is that enough to break the Pac?  Probably not, they could add a school, or 3, and just make them football only adds if the Pac wants to keep their snobbery.  

B12 is probably down to waiting on ND's decision and any resulting fallout.  And maybe waiting on Godot.

[flatdawgs 1278]

12 hours ago, ButtFumble said:

UW firing their coach in the middle of year two for being "mean"

Lol. The rot under Jimmy Lake went deep and grew quickly. The sideline incident was no more than perfect cover to dump him. I've never seen cancer in a program grow as quickly as it did here - particularly under a coach that had total support of both the administration and fan base at the beginning of the season. Ripping off the band-aid and starting over ASAP was the best thing that could've happened, and it did.

[Vermin 3043]

13 minutes ago, flatdawgs said:

Lol. The rot under Jimmy Lake went deep and grew quickly. The sideline incident was no more than perfect cover to dump him. I've never seen cancer in a program grow as quickly as it did here - particularly under a coach that had total support of both the administration and fan base at the beginning of the season. Ripping off the band-aid and starting over ASAP was the best thing that could've happened, and it did.

Is there a long form piece in this somewhere?

[ButtFumble 5178]

4 hours ago, BluTechsan said:

Tech’s last decade of bed wetting really screws the pooch here.

However, I’m always amazed at how often Tech’s “market” is attributed to just Lubbock. Tech’s Dallas market might not equal that of UT or aggy but their Dallas fanbase is easily their largest alumni base.

Tech does pretty well out of Houston too

especially the northern Montgomery County suburbs where schools are extremely competitive and being in the top 10% can be difficult even for smarter kids so getting into Texas is pretty damn hard

they look at aggy as well.....aggy.....or even more so as 1.5 hours away from mom and dad popping up unannounced and Texas State is not that much farther and does not have the rep of Tech.......Tech is 11 hours away from mom and dad or 4 hours by the time mom and dad get to the airport and get on the plane and fly into Lubbock

if Arkansas, Ole' Miss and the other out of states that offer "in state" rates or competitive financial packages are not appealing  well there Tech is a LONG ways away from mom and dad......Tech does not do as well in San Antonio now, but they are making a push and have been for a while so that they got the "hispanic serving institution" designation and the fed money that comes with it

[ButtFumble 5178]

looking here

https://www.depts.ttu.edu/irim/NEWFACTBOOK/FactSheets/FactSheet-Fall2020.pdf

2020 enrollment

5,175 Lubbock County

2,786 Harris

2,582 Tarrant

2,462 Collin

2,214 Dallas

1,726 Denton

1,675 Bexar

1,258 Travis

1,061 Williamson

994 Fort Bend

I thought they were pulling a lot more out of Montgomery County as well, but I would bet it is next on the list or perhaps this was just an off year for that.....I would imagine a lot of the Harris County ones are from suburban districts that are competitive for top 10% some of the Montgomery County students might be heading to Arkansas or Hotty Toddy

so the metromess is clearly first, but even the Austin area is landing Tech students now and the Houston area is getting them too

[billfromlaketravis 11476]

So the PAC 10 is in an exclusive negotiating window with ESPN until August 4? They can start talking to the streamers after this date? 

['stache 21815]

So are regent meetings the new flightaware?

[ButtFumble 5178]

lets be clear here this is a tweet from a 100% known IDIOT, but for entertainment purposes I will post it

 

it is fun to see a known idiot and some random known idiot follower putting out lots of garbage about the PAC 12 that makes them look like total crumbling shit

that is a complete kick in the balls......Cal and Stanford making double the rest hahahahahah what the fuck has Cal ever done...I mean I know Stanford brings it in mens water polo and rhythmic gymnastics, but Cal...

 

Edited July 26, 2022 by ButtFumble

[BurntOrange&White 39932]

7 minutes ago, ButtFumble said:

lets be clear here this is a tweet from a 100% known IDIOT, but for entertainment purposes I will post it

 

it is fun to see a known idiot and some random known idiot follower putting out lots of garbage about the PAC 12 that makes them look like total crumbling shit

that is a complete kick in the balls......Cal and Stanford making double the rest hahahahahah what the fuck has Cal ever done...I mean I know Stanford brings it in mens water polo and rhythmic gymnastics, but Cal...

 

If you're an AD or even president of any of the t3 schools in this dog shit made up scenario then there is no fucking way you take that deal at all. Also LOL at Cal being t2 in this scenario....dog shit program.

[DFW Horn 6123]

🤡

 

[Texas Wahoo 3395]

5 minutes ago, DFW Horn said:

🤡

 

He's right about one thing - they are definitely more unified.  There is nothing more unifying than realizing that none of them have any other options.

[bad_teammate 13195]

It's very common to make more money when the two biggest earners leave. Makes total sense. 

[statsman 5468]

Well, they are picking our pockets on the way out. 

[JFKFC 4879]

9 minutes ago, DFW Horn said:

🤡

 

[mdmost 43001]

I won't miss the moonshine inbreds. Mouthy bunch of cunts. 

[statsman 5468]

I don’t get the bad mouthing of Cal. Cal has a few things going for it- a huge endowment, a large alumni base (of high earners), and a location near a decent amount of HS talent (not as much as Southern California but more than pretty much every other PAC team). 
Compare Cal to the B12 remnants. The only thing holding Cal back from elite status is a lack of desire. The only things holding Baylor, ISU, TCU, OSU,  TT and KSU from elite status is money, talent base, tradition, fanbase size,…

[Deej 76786]

22 minutes ago, DFW Horn said:

🤡

 

[Hurtlocker 2212]

10 hours ago, BluTechsan said:

Tech’s last decade of bed wetting really screws the pooch here.

However, I’m always amazed at how often Tech’s “market” is attributed to just Lubbock. Tech’s Dallas market might not equal that of UT or aggy but their Dallas fanbase is easily their largest alumni base.

Technically one's market is only defined as the DMA that school resides, because the game is almost always guaranteed to be on in that area.   Most universities pull from outside their DMA, in about a 350 mile circle, so that is factored as well.   Boise's 350 is way less than WVUs.   It kind of gives you a top end of who you can market to.   The number of teams that are truly "national" are pretty small even people know who they are.   It changes with who is doing well.  The vast majority of people who casually watch sports just look for the "good games" 

[Not a Sock 2313]

34 minutes ago, DFW Horn said:

🤡

 

Fat chicks bragging about having big tits , energy there bud.

[closetohumping 17442]

52 minutes ago, DFW Horn said:

🤡

 

He seriously can't believe what he's tweeting right?  Also, don't count your chickens just yet.  You believe you're gonna get paid, but let's wait till we get to negotiations.

[closetohumping 17442]

40 minutes ago, statsman said:

I don’t get the bad mouthing of Cal. Cal has a few things going for it- a huge endowment, a large alumni base (of high earners), and a location near a decent amount of HS talent (not as much as Southern California but more than pretty much every other PAC team). 
Compare Cal to the B12 remnants. The only thing holding Cal back from elite status is a lack of desire. The only things holding Baylor, ISU, TCU, OSU,  TT and KSU from elite status is money, talent base, tradition, fanbase size,…

But those Cal alums probably don't give a rats ass about football.  They're focused on bigger things.  What do Baylor alums care about?  Football, Chip Gaines?  

[BurntOrange&White 39932]

11 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

But those Cal alums probably don't give a rats ass about football.  They're focused on bigger things.  What do Baylor alums care about?  Football, Chip Gaines?  

No shit.....Cal cares as much about football as most of our wives. 

 

 

Baylor alumn's tend to care more about football IMO.

[closetohumping 17442]

1 minute ago, BurntOrange&White said:

No shit.....Cal cares as much about football as most of our wives. 

 

 

Baylor alumn's tend to care more about football IMO.

I would think all of the "leftovers" have more rabid bases than most of the PAC.  People out here aren't exactly shy about it either.  They like football but it does not consume their lives.  Now, how much does that matter when we're negotiating tv deals?  

[LTbear 4169]

56 minutes ago, statsman said:

I don’t get the bad mouthing of Cal. Cal has a few things going for it- a huge endowment, a large alumni base (of high earners), and a location near a decent amount of HS talent (not as much as Southern California but more than pretty much every other PAC team). 
Compare Cal to the B12 remnants. The only thing holding Cal back from elite status is a lack of desire. The only things holding Baylor, ISU, TCU, OSU,  TT and KSU from elite status is money, talent base, tradition, fanbase size,…

I spent five years at Cal doing my PhD. Love the institution. Went to many a football game. And yet I can say they bring nothing athletically. Their best shot is to argue future potential and ride the academic prestige wave. 

[Al_4_ISU 12463]

The Dude is a moron.

A couple of his points are sort of right.  Because those left don't have more lucrative options, there isn't this attitude that "we deserve better than playing you pant shitting inbred fuckstains" that is absolutely toxic to a league.  So yes, the Big 12 is more unified than it was.  Because it has to be.

More profitable?  That's absolutely loaded language.  The new contract might be worth more than the old one, but it will be worth a hell of a lot less than if OU and UT were still in the league.  That's a real cherry picked definition of more profitable.

I think the Big 12 has come around to seeing the silver of lining of making less money, but not having to deal with the constant threat of the biggest brands leaving.  But we were absolutely pissed a year ago at this time.  Beyond pissed.  Lamenting is a very good word for it.  We've made peace with Texas and OU leaving and see the silver lining, but if we're being honest, I think we'd all have rather you guys looked at this league the way Ohio State and Michigan look at their leaches.

Edited July 26, 2022 by Al_4_ISU

[SL Xpress 7513]

55 minutes ago, statsman said:

I don’t get the bad mouthing of Cal. Cal has a few things going for it- a huge endowment, a large alumni base (of high earners), and a location near a decent amount of HS talent (not as much as Southern California but more than pretty much every other PAC team). 
Compare Cal to the B12 remnants. The only thing holding Cal back from elite status is a lack of desire. The only things holding Baylor, ISU, TCU, OSU,  TT and KSU from elite status is money, talent base, tradition, fanbase size,…

UC Berkeley is one of those schools that wants to keep its academic standards and yet be good in athletics, which is a trick only a few schools can pull off, and even then they can’t be consistent winners unless they relax their standards. Even Stanford, which is the one true unicorn, is now falling to Earth after being an anomaly for a while. 

They’re also saddled with a massive $500m stadium renovation debt that’s been taken on by the university as a whole, while receiving regular infusions of $25m from the university general fund simply to keep afloat. And they only average about 40k attendance per game. So when you say their only limitation is a lack of desire, you’re technically correct, but that lack of desire manifests itself in a myriad number of ways that are difficult to overcome for anyone choosing to be the head coach there. 

That said, I think the schools with the biggest concerns they’re going to get left out when the music stops are Wazzu and Oregon State. 

Given the chaotic nature of conference expansion, I could see a scenario where Cal is left out of an initial expansion, but later invited in after the dust settles for its footprint and to give a more national aspect of a national championship race (even though they’ll never actually be a factor). I don’t know for sure that it happens, but their chances of being invited are infinitely better than WSU and Oregon State. 

[closetohumping 17442]

13 minutes ago, Al_4_ISU said:

The Dude is a moron.

A couple of his points are sort of right.  Because those left don't have more lucrative options, there isn't this attitude that "we deserve better than playing you pant shitting inbred fuckstains" that is absolutely toxic to a league.  So yes, the Big 12 is more unified than it was.  Because it has to be.

More profitable?  That's absolutely loaded language.  The new contract might be worth more than the old one, but it will be worth a hell of a lot less than if OU and UT were still in the league.  That's a real cherry picked definition of more profitable.

I think the Big 12 has come around to seeing the silver of lining of making less money, but not having to deal with the constant threat of the biggest brands leaving.  But we were absolutely pissed a year ago at this time.  Beyond pissed.  Lamenting is a very good word for it.  We've made peace with Texas and OU leaving and see the silver lining, but if we're being honest, I think we'd all have rather you guys looked at this league the way Ohio State and Michigan look at their leaches.

But from what I sense you guys never respected us.  Just viewed us as a necessary evil. Remember it was your original big dogs that left us and we were on the side of equal revenue sharing.  We also ceded far more to you guys last go round, unnecessarily l.  That’s on deloss not you guys but in the end the landscape has changed and this was a move we had to make

['stache 21815]

2 minutes ago, SL Xpress said:

UC Berkeley is one of those schools that wants to keep its academic standards and yet be good in athletics, which is a trick only a few schools can pull off, and even then they can’t be consistent winners unless they relax their standards. Even Stanford, which is the one true unicorn, is now falling to Earth after being an anomaly for a while. 

They’re also saddled with a massive $500m stadium renovation debt that’s been taken on by the university as a whole, while receiving regular infusions of $25m from the university general fund simply to keep afloat. And they only average about 40k attendance per game. So when you say their only limitation is a lack of desire, you’re technically correct, but that lack of desire manifests itself in a myriad number of ways that are difficult to overcome for anyone choosing to be the head coach there. 

That said, I think the schools with the biggest concerns they’re going to get left out when the music stops are Wazzu and Oregon State. 

Given the chaotic nature of conference expansion, I could see a scenario where Cal is left out of an initial expansion, but later invited in after the dust settles for its footprint and to give a more national aspect of a national championship race (even though they’ll never actually be a factor). I don’t know for sure that it happens, but their chances of being invited are infinitely better than WSU and Oregon State. 

That's news to me. I can't think of a single thing Cal is good at athletically. They had Aaron Rodgers once upon a time. I think they have had some baseball success but can't really confirm in my own mind. Stanford has always been a good athletic program with success in pretty much every sport. It's not always consistent (i.e., football) but they put out some damn good teams every now and then. I can't recall Cal being good since they played a Rose Bowl I think with Rodgers? 

[SL Xpress 7513]

15 minutes ago, Al_4_ISU said:

The Dude is a moron.

A couple of his points are sort of right.  Because those left don't have more lucrative options, there isn't this attitude that "we deserve better than playing you pant shitting inbred fuckstains" that is absolutely toxic to a league.  So yes, the Big 12 is more unified than it was.  Because it has to be.

More profitable?  That's absolutely loaded language.  The new contract might be worth more than the old one, but it will be worth a hell of a lot less than if OU and UT were still in the league.  That's a real cherry picked definition of more profitable.

I think the Big 12 has come around to seeing the silver of lining of making less money, but not having to deal with the constant threat of the biggest brands leaving.  But we were absolutely pissed a year ago at this time.  Beyond pissed.  Lamenting is a very good word for it.  We've made peace with Texas and OU leaving and see the silver lining, but if we're being honest, I think we'd all have rather you guys looked at this league the way Ohio State and Michigan look at their leaches.

Wisconsin, Minnesota, Northwestern, Illinois, Indiana, Michigan State, Iowa, Purdue are in a different category as “leeches” than Baylor, TCU, Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, Kansas, Kansas State, West Virginia and Iowa State. As a collective they consciously chose to expand to include Penn State, Nebraska, Rutgers, and Maryland in an effort to penetrate media markets, so whatever their athletic prowess, calling those schools leeches is not accurate. 

The Big 12 has inherent population and market issues among its “leeches” that the Big 10 “leeches” did not have. I don’t blame you for any frustration you might feel, but this is not an apples to apples comparison, which you’re almost certainly aware, but I still think it’s fair to also explicitly point out. 

[bullet 1597]

7 hours ago, ButtFumble said:

looking here

https://www.depts.ttu.edu/irim/NEWFACTBOOK/FactSheets/FactSheet-Fall2020.pdf

2020 enrollment

5,175 Lubbock County

2,786 Harris

2,582 Tarrant

2,462 Collin

2,214 Dallas

1,726 Denton

1,675 Bexar

1,258 Travis

1,061 Williamson

994 Fort Bend

I thought they were pulling a lot more out of Montgomery County as well, but I would bet it is next on the list or perhaps this was just an off year for that.....I would imagine a lot of the Harris County ones are from suburban districts that are competitive for top 10% some of the Montgomery County students might be heading to Arkansas or Hotty Toddy

so the metromess is clearly first, but even the Austin area is landing Tech students now and the Houston area is getting them too

Seems to be a relatively new trend.  I can only think of one Tech person I ever worked with in 30 years in Houston.  Lots in DFW, but very few in Houston.

[bullet 1597]

16 minutes ago, 'stache said:

That's news to me. I can't think of a single thing Cal is good at athletically. They had Aaron Rodgers once upon a time. I think they have had some baseball success but can't really confirm in my own mind. Stanford has always been a good athletic program with success in pretty much every sport. It's not always consistent (i.e., football) but they put out some damn good teams every now and then. I can't recall Cal being good since they played a Rose Bowl I think with Rodgers? 

Water polo?  Swimming?  Cal is 10th in all time NCAA championships.

[SL Xpress 7513]

7 minutes ago, 'stache said:

That's news to me. I can't think of a single thing Cal is good at athletically. They had Aaron Rodgers once upon a time. I think they have had some baseball success but can't really confirm in my own mind. Stanford has always been a good athletic program with success in pretty much every sport. It's not always consistent (i.e., football) but they put out some damn good teams every now and then. I can't recall Cal being good since they played a Rose Bowl I think with Rodgers? 

I miscommunicated. What I mean by that is that they’d like to wave a magic wand and just be good without doing the things required to actually be good. Like having a meaningless general studies degree program with watered down requirements for athletes to graduate with a degree, large scale waivers for GPA and test scores for admittance proportional to height weight and 40 times, under the table payments for unlimited paid for unofficial visits, and other things which are necessary for high academic standard schools to compete. That aren’t named Stanford. 

And yes, Jeff Tedford was their lone bright spot. He’s still their winningest coach of all time with an overall record of 82-57, and they fired him. Another indication of their delusion and cognitive dissonance of wanting to be good in football without actually being willing to do the things necessary to be good in football. 

I hope that clarification makes more sense. 

[Gidnik 3269]

 

[bullet 1597]

1 minute ago, Gidnik said:

 

Are there any "right" reasons other than making more money for existing members?  "Right" time is when Fox/ESPN approve.

[Texas Wahoo 3395]

 

It looks like the Big Ten is coming for that sweet 10:30 time-slot.

[Hurtlocker 2212]

46 minutes ago, SL Xpress said:

Wisconsin, Minnesota, Northwestern, Illinois, Indiana, Michigan State, Iowa, Purdue are in a different category as “leeches” than Baylor, TCU, Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, Kansas, Kansas State, West Virginia and Iowa State. As a collective they consciously chose to expand to include Penn State, Nebraska, Rutgers, and Maryland in an effort to penetrate media markets, so whatever their athletic prowess, calling those schools leeches is not accurate. 

The Big 12 has inherent population and market issues among its “leeches” that the Big 10 “leeches” did not have. I don’t blame you for any frustration you might feel, but this is not an apples to apples comparison, which you’re almost certainly aware, but I still think it’s fair to also explicitly point out. 

This does make me wonder a bit on valuations and "what could have" after seeing who was ready to move.   The Big 12's valuations with no move was not going to reach the Big Ten's deals, due to the BTN, but they were still going to see a $75m check before T3 deals.   What would the environment look like today if Instead of Texas/OU moving to the SEC, USC/UCLA moved to the Big 12.   Without BYU/Cinci/USF/Houston, that would have left room for 4 other Pac12's to join at liking a lower figure than the Big Ten, because a linear network could be in the works.  Its likely you'd have three leagues all around $90-100m/each

[statsman 5468]

1 hour ago, Al_4_ISU said:But we were absolutely pissed a year ago at this time.  Beyond pissed.  Lamenting is a very good word for it.  We've made peace with Texas and OU leaving and see the silver lining, but if we're being honest, I think we'd all have rather you guys looked at this league the way Ohio State and Michigan look at their leaches.

Your anger is misplaced. Michigan and Ohio State would look differently at their conference mates if Penn State, Wisconsin and Michigan State had all bailed out for greener pastures (and The Spartans were using their new conference as a selling point to dominate in state recruiting). You should be angry at NU, CU, Missouri and TAMU (three of whom were Big 8 members). 
The game is changing fast. It’s clear new tiers are forming in FBS (ISU should know better than anyone- you’ve lost Milton and Young to the portal, to teams with good NIL payments). Texas and OU are making sure they end up in the right one. 

[Hurtlocker 2212]

4 minutes ago, Texas Wahoo said:

 

It looks like the Big Ten is coming for that sweet 10:30 time-slot.

Fox is pushing to take that away from ESPN.   Someone is going to grab Oregon and make them play all night games

[billfromlaketravis 11476]

5 minutes ago, Texas Wahoo said:

 

It looks like the Big Ten is coming for that sweet 10:30 time-slot.

Man alive. The networks are all about running games when there’s no competition. If Fox takes over the 1030 time slot, what value is the PAC to ESPN? 

['stache 21815]

54 minutes ago, bullet said:

Water polo?  Swimming?  Cal is 10th in all time NCAA championships.

And Oklahoma State is 4th all time, mainly from wrestling and golf, which all of maybe a dozen people outside of our alumni base knows anything about. I see they have a bunch of recent titles in swimming and water polo, so I learned that today.