Realignment talk not going away

[Surly Bevo 24692]

3 minutes ago, hornbri said:

That makes no sense unless tech and Kansas already have a home. 

Home on the range?

[SwAss 105]

8 minutes ago, Surly Bevo said:

Home on the range?

LOL... 

Home, home on the range
Where the deer and the antelope play
Where seldom is heard a discouraging word
And the skies are not cloudy all day

[bullet 1596]

What's a CR thread without a worthless Greg Swaim tweet?  (for those too new, it was a Greg Swaim tweet that started the Shaggy Bevo CR thread).

 

 

 

SWAIMVILLE 

 

@GSwaim

·

10h

 

This merger talk has been going on for almost two weeks, but a merger between the #Pac12 and remaining #Big12 allows both conferences to stay together, play their traditional rivals, add no additional travel (if two division winners play for the automatic Playoff qualifier spot.

Quote Tweet

 

 

 

SWAIMVILLE 

 

@GSwaim

· Jul 21

This moving fast, as I'm getting calls, texts and e-mails now saying #Pac12 wants to add #OKState, #TexasTech, #KState and #ISU to go to 16 teams and those four in division with #SunDevils, #BearDown, #Utes and #Buffs.

Show this thread

[BachelorTrek 2933]

2 hours ago, Royale with cheese said:

 

[maninblack 7974]

54 minutes ago, DFW Horn said:

SIAP

 

[Doc Reeves 6434]

So tech is left with out a chair at the moment. 

That’s a shame.

[DFW Horn 6117]

39 minutes ago, hornbri said:

That makes no sense unless tech and Kansas already have a home. 

I know. Where is Tech going if not the Pac?

[Gidnik 3251]

58 minutes ago, DFW Horn said:

SIAP

 

how the hell does he get verified? 

 

[markstanco 12501]

Enjoy your flight.

https://www.google.com/travel/flights/s/iwmk

[Hurtlocker 2208]

11 hours ago, Skipper said:

Someone walk me through the economics of a "scheduling alliance".   Is the theory that you bundle 4 games for each remaining big 12 team against a PAC team (2 home and home with some neutral sites sprinkled in) and sell rights to those 32 games?  It's not a bad idea if the numbers work although how many of those are "marquee" enough to drive revenue when split that many ways.  Also just don't see how this works for the irat8 long term.   I don't see how an 8 team league with no marquee name retains power 5 status. 

That's basically it, though I doubt it would be four, more likely 2 so you had a home and away each year.

The premise is basically that anything unknown in a schedule is worth, basically, nothing.   90% of a conferences broadcast value comes from conference games.   Since they don't know up front if you're scheduling well or shittily, and since they don't know if OOC is home or away, networks hate them.    However, if you could turn those OOC games into known match ups, you could get conference game value out of them.

A two game alliance, where it is always a home/away between the P12/B12 per year, would basically increase the value of each contract by about 22-25% and could provide a needed boost to both leagues in terms of schedule strength and audience.

[TKthunder2 4980]

My 64: Take all the P5 public flagships of every state —33

Take any blueblood football or basketball school that got left out: Notre Dame, USC, Duke, UCLA —37

add in elite private schools that other universities want to be associated with: Stanford, Vandy, Northwestern —40

add in any missing P5’s in the top 40 all time fb wins: Auburn, Clemson, aggy, VA Tech, GA Tech, Pitt, Syracuse, Michigan St, Boston College, TCU —50

add in any missing P5’s in top 25 all time bball wins: Purdue, Oregon St, NCSU, Louisville, Oklahoma St—55

add any schools that have won multiple national championships fb or bb in the modern era (1950 or after) Miami, Florida St —57

now looks at FBS fb playing schools with multiple fb/bb national championships in the modern era from outside the P5: SMU, Cincy, UConn —60

Finally you look for political coverage which will likely require another Texas school in Tech the largest public school remaining, WSU and ASU have laws that they have to be in the same conference as UW/AZ. —63 jeez

and then add Boise St because they are popular —64

This cuts out: Baylor, K State, ISU, Miss St, Wake Forest

 

 

But wait, here’s another way:
Take the 65 P5s and cut out any duplicate markets, if California has 4 and Florida has 3 Texas should have 4 and every other state should be capped at 2 until you get to states with less than 4 million in population which should be limited to 1.  This allows everyone to remain except Baylor, Purdue, NCSU, Wake Forest, Mississippi State, Kansas State, and Iowa St which drops the list down to 58, then add the best remaining non P5 following the same rules: Buffalo (#2 NY team, population 20mil/2=10mil), Cincy (#2 Ohio 12mil/2=6mil) UConn (#1 CT team 3.6 mil), UMass (#2 team 3.5 mil), Colorado St (#2 3 mil), Nevada (#1 3 mil), LA Tech or Tulane (#2 2.5 mil), UNM (#1 2.1 mil), Boise St (#1 1.8 mil)

 

My point simply is look at these two ways you can decide this, by history and success or by markets and you generally find the same group of schools getting cut: Baylor, Kansas St, Iowa St, Wake Forest, Mississippi St and half of this list is the left behind Big 12 schools.

This is why the outlook for Baylor, K State, and Iowa State aren’t so good.

[Hurtlocker 2208]

1 hour ago, bullet said:

What's a CR thread without a worthless Greg Swaim tweet?  (for those too new, it was a Greg Swaim tweet that started the Shaggy Bevo CR thread).

 

 

 

 

SWAIMVILLE 

 

@GSwaim

· Jul 21

This moving fast, as I'm getting calls, texts and e-mails now saying #Pac12 wants to add #OKState, #TexasTech, #KState and #ISU to go to 16 teams and those four in division with #SunDevils, #BearDown, #Utes and #Buffs.

Show this thread

Its not shocking that the Pac would not be interested in religious schools, but I cannot imagine a world where they leave KU out for KState.   Also, no way they'd do divisions though and deny everyone SoCal.   Colorado and the AZ schools would riot

Edited August 4, 2021 by Hurtlocker

[Wiler77 1556]

1 hour ago, Doc Reeves said:

So tech is left with out a chair at the moment. 

That’s a shame.

That scenario makes no sense. KU basketball is worth 10X KSt's entire athletic department. Why would KSt be included but not KU?

And why would Tech not be included but TCU and Baylor would? Small private schools add nothing.

[Hurtlocker 2208]

2 minutes ago, Wiler77 said:

That scenario makes no sense. KU basketball is worth 10X KSt's entire athletic department. Why would KSt be included but not KU?

And why would Tech not be included but TCU and Baylor would? Small private schools add nothing.

Ha, yeah, Tech and ISU's merged enrollment is larger than KSU, KU, Baylor, and TCU combined.   I'd be more worried if I were Baylor/TCU/KSU, than Tech/KU/ISU

[Hurtlocker 2208]

Playing this scheduling alliance out a bit further, what actually may make more sense is to go to 32.

For the sake of argument, let's say the Big Ten takes ISU/KSU and the Pac 12 takes Tech/OSU/KSU and likely TCU over Baylor because they played in the Rose Bowl once and, at least publicly, are less rapey.   If the Rose Bowl tie breaker doesn't work than I recommend a knife fight between the University presidents, "Beat It" style, where the winner gets the last spot once they've drank all the blood of the vanquished.

Both conferences could go 4 pods of 9 conference games, which gives you 3 in your own, and two in every other pod per year.   The B1G likely wouldn't gain money, but they wouldn't lose any either and the Pac would increase considerably with games in the central, especially Texas. 

Then the B1G and Pac could do a two game scheduling alliance, which would give said 25% boost and they'd be up to 11 P5 games a year, leaving one open for either ND or the Sisters of the Blind.

Want to increase it about 5-10% more?   Schedule more conference games the weekend of the champ game, like the Covid make ups this year, between schools who didn't play each other.   No reason everyone can't get 13 games in.   Add that up and the B1G is looking at a contract worth north of $75M per team and basically controls half of college football (the Pac can't say no with the B1G's dick in its mouth) from LA to NYC.

That could definitely boost value considerably and would likely force the ACC to get into bed fully with the SEC to match up.

You're welcome, Bowlsby.  

Edited August 4, 2021 by Hurtlocker

[BachelorTrek 2933]

43 minutes ago, Hurtlocker said:

Playing this scheduling alliance out a bit further, what actually may make more sense is to go to 32.

For the sake of argument, let's say the Big Ten takes ISU/KSU and the Pac 12 takes Tech/OSU/KSU and likely TCU over Baylor because they played in the Rose Bowl once and, at least publicly, are less rapey.   If the Rose Bowl tie breaker doesn't work than I recommend a knife fight between the University presidents, "Beat It" style, where the winner gets the last spot once they've drank all the blood of the vanquished.

Both conferences could go 4 pods of 9 conference games, which gives you 3 in your own, and two in every other pod per year.   The B1G likely wouldn't gain money, but they wouldn't lose any either and the Pac would increase considerably with games in the central, especially Texas. 

Then the B1G and Pac could do a two game scheduling alliance, which would give said 25% boost and they'd be up to 11 P5 games a year, leaving one open for either ND or the Sisters of the Blind.

Want to increase it about 5-10% more?   Schedule more conference games the weekend of the champ game, like the Covid make ups this year, between schools who didn't play each other.   No reason everyone can't get 13 games in.   Add that up and the B1G is looking at a contract worth north of $75M per team and basically controls half of college football (the Pac can't say no with the B1G's dick in its mouth) from LA to NYC.

That could definitely boost value considerably and would likely force the ACC to get into bed fully with the SEC to match up.

You're welcome, Bowlsby.  

More like:

[Longboard Horn 40102]

[Longboard Horn 40102]

🤣🤣🤣 the stupidity!!

[The University 851]

16 minutes ago, Longboard Horn said:

🤣🤣🤣 the stupidity!!

it's a bold strategy, cotton.

[Royale with cheese 1452]

45 minutes ago, Longboard Horn said:

🤣🤣🤣 the stupidity!!

". . . wants to participles in the playoff . . ."  I give up. That's either an autocorrect-strikes-again, an abysmal fuckup, or just waaay over my plebeian head. (Note: That last one there, it wouldn't be the first time.)

[Jebus 1300]

1 hour ago, Longboard Horn said:

🤣🤣🤣 the stupidity!!

There’s so much stupid in there, but one obvious flaw in that plan is that 3 nonconference games + Texas = 4, but I guess maybe that guy didn’t participles in math class in grade school. 

[Bill Lumbergh 7168]

So tech is left with out a chair at the moment. 
That’s a shame.

PAC taking Baylor and tcu but leaving out tech?

That doesn't add up, at all. Tech is actually more geographically aligned and doesn't break their long-standing no religious schools policy.

Kansas makes sense, assuming they're heading to the big 10, which just makes too much sense not to happen.

If he said only Kansas wasn't joining, ok. But they're actually proposing the PAC 12 is taking Baylor, tcu, and let's not forget Pacific coast West Virginia but not bringing tech along?

If it sounds wrong on the surface, it's probably wrong.

[DanTheHorn 4896]

2 hours ago, Longboard Horn said:

People actually do not think of aggy when they put together the four horsemen of the SEC?

[tonedeaf 56]

10 hours ago, lemonandaturd said:

Maybe the Big 12 under Bowlsby's watch will end up:  Baylor, Louisiana Tech, Louisiana-Monroe, Ragin Cajuns, Abilene Christian, Tarleton, Kansas State, Texas State, Lamar, Sam Houston, SFA, and McNeese.  Baylor and K State would be big daddies.   

With baylor non-conference games between Mary Hardin Baylor and Incarnate Word,  It would be a art briles schedule made in heaven.  Other than the big game with K-state.   

[Hiphopopotamos 20865]

Mandel's Mailbag

Quote

 

Mandel’s Mailbag: Amid realignment, why would anyone say no to a 12-team Playoff? Does West Virginia leave the Big 12?

By Stewart Mandel 1h ago 19 

After scanning this week’s questions, I quickly realized this was going to be another all-realignment edition. If things quiet down, perhaps we can go back to a more football-centric column next week, what with the season starting later this month (!).

(Note: Submitted questions have been edited for length and clarity.)

You and Bruce talked about the 12-team Playoff possibly being put on hold after the SEC shenanigans, but I still don’t understand which conference would say no. The Big Ten should still frequently get two teams in, G5 conferences still have a better chance of getting a team in the 12-team playoff, the ACC, Pac-12 and Irate 8 as well. Can you elaborate on why a conference might rationally say no to the 12-team Playoff expansion? — Jimmy M., Atlanta

We’re still going to get to 12 teams at some point, but the assumption most of us had a couple of months ago that they would move to tear up the four-team contract early and start this thing in 2023 seems much less likely today than it did then. In particular, the Pac-12, Big Ten and ACC — none of which were on the four-person working group that spent two years secretly devising the 12-team proposal — feel like Greg Sankey (who did serve on that group) pulled a fast one on them, and so if nothing else, they want to hit pause on the process. It now seems overly optimistic that they’d rubber stamp the thing at the next CFP meetings on Sept. 28.

The question is, would they only be hurting themselves to delay it? The Pac-12 in particular really shouldn’t wait another five years for Playoff expansion to kick in. The league’s reputation has suffered immensely from having missed the last four editions; what if that drought continues? The ACC is always one 9-3 Clemson season away from going MIA itself. And of course, you’d think the Big 12 would support it because if Oklahoma and Texas do manage to leave before 2025, the leftovers are really going to need those six automatic berths.

Meanwhile, do you know who needs it to move to 12 teams the least urgently? The SEC. The notion that Sankey helped author that proposal specifically to stack the deck with more of his teams, while a Grade A conspiracy theory, is quite the stretch, given he’s been defending four teams for far longer than the others. But I get why it ticked everyone off.

Ultimately, this whole thing is about ESPN. That network has exclusive negotiating rights through the duration of the CFP contact, so blowing it up early guarantees ESPN remains the sole partner. Even before realignment exploded, some commissioners feared they’d be leaving a lot of money on the table by not waiting until 2026 and taking the rights to open market. Now, with ESPN getting a 16-team SEC, there’s perhaps even a greater appetite among some of the other conferences to allow Fox or other bidders to at least drive up the price and perhaps even land some or all of the package.

It’s a question of whether that potential payday is worth sticking for another five years with a format that has become increasingly closed off to large swaths of the country.

Will West Virginia look to head out of the Big 12!? Preferably ACC. I thought the move to the Big 12 never made much sense because they’re located in Big Ten/ACC country.
— Anthony S., Rockland Co., NY

I have no doubt West Virginia is looking to flee the sinking Big 12, but I have no idea whether the ACC will be interested. The more I think about it, though, I kind of feel like that league should be.

Maybe it speaks to when I came up as a fan, but I’ve always viewed the Mountaineers as a major college football team. When I think of West Virginia, I think of Major Harris against Notre Dame for the 1988 national championship, another undefeated regular season in ’93, those Thursday night Big East games against Miami or Virginia Tech, and the unforgettable Pat White/Steve Slaton/Noel Devine mid-2000s era. West Virginia one inexplicable upset by Dave Wannstedt’s Pittsburgh Panthers from playing in the 2007 BCS national championship game. That they might be unwanted by a major conference less than 15 years later would have seemed impossible then, but it speaks to how much of their identity the Mountaineers have lost during their decade in the Big 12.

West Virginia belongs with its former Big East brethren. Ideally that would be in the ACC alongside the ‘Canes, Hokies, Syracuse and former rival Pitt. The Mountaineers could be very successful in that conference, in part by reestablishing their presence with East Coast recruits, particularly in Florida. The program has no real recruiting hub right now, and that’s not going to change if it remains in a conference anchored nowhere near Morgantown.

In fact, if the ACC still thumbs its academic nose at West Virginia, I think I’d still leave, though not until 2025 (or when Texas and Oklahoma leave, whichever comes first.) Mountaineers fans thumb their nose at this thought now, but they’d be a better fit in the AAC, reunited with Cincinnati and USF, and adding a new Sunshine State rival in UCF, then they would continuing on with Oklahoma State, TCU, et al. It would certainly be a big step down financially from the current Big 12, whose members make nearly four times the annual TV revenue as the AAC’s $7 million a year, but the current Big 12 is no longer an option.

Hopefully it doesn’t come to that. I wrote this last week, and I’ll write it again: West Virginia and Cincinnati to the ACC. Make it happen.

If OU and Texas leave in 2025, will they still owe a buyout? Lots of articles seem to imply not, but my reading of the bylaws is that the exit fee is distinct from the Grant of Media Rights. They could take their media rights with them in 2025 but I think they might still owe an exit fee? And would the ACC grant of media rights stand up in court if Clemson and FSU challenged it? — Rob, Atlanta

You are correct that those are two separate pots.

Per Big 12 bylaws, whenever OU and Texas leave, they essentially forfeit their last two years of conference distributions as a “buyout amount.” Last year that number was around $37 million a year per school, hence why you’re seeing the two-year $75 million figure being tossed around. However, conference distributions generally increase each year, so the actual number could be north of $80 million by 2025.

(Note: Those same bylaws say the schools agreed to remain members for 99 years, so perhaps they’re not worth the price of the paper they’re printed on.)

On top of that, as you mentioned, the conference owns both schools’ media rights through 2025. As it currently stands, if they left two years early, they wouldn’t be able to collect a dime of the roughly $50 million a year in TV revenue they’d expect to make from the SEC during that period. Their rights would still belong to the Big 12. So now we’re talking a total of $180 million per school in exit fees and withholdings.

Hence, why all parties currently insist they will not be breaking any contracts early, and hence, Bob Bowlsby’s fiery cease and desist letter to ESPN last week accusing the network of colluding with the AAC (a claim ESPN refutes) so as to dissolve the Big 12, which would theoretically free Oklahoma and Texas from those obligations.

As to your question about the ACC’s Grant of Rights? As much as we’ve heard that term thrown around, I have never seen one of those documents in the flesh. And no school has ever challenged one in court. However, they’ve always been described as ironclad. In theory, the Big 12 could say, “Knock yourself out Oklahoma, go play an SEC schedule this year, but your games remain part of its Big 12  package.”

That’s why I roll my eyes a little bit whenever I see the latest Clemson and FSU to the SEC “report.” That ACC Grant of Rights goes through 2036. Unless their lawyers have found some loophole, I don’t see how they can defect early without either forgoing roughly half a billion dollars in future TV revenue or leaving without their TV rights. Which would be kind of a deal-breaker.

With streaming becoming the priority, can a national basketball brand like Kansas move the needle enough for inclusion into the Big Ten or Pac-12 — Michael B.

Well, look it this way. ESPN+ already holds the rights to stream Kansas basketball. In fact, it carried seven of the Jayhawks’ men’s games last season. And yet, when the Big 12 wanted to go to the table for an extension this spring, with the rights to not just Kansas and Baylor basketball but Oklahoma and Texas football, the network said … sorry, not a high priority for us right now.

So, that’s probably your answer.

Stewart: As someone who’s spent time and broadband studying the state of the Pac-12, what are your initial thoughts on George Kliavkoff? Too early to tell, or at least staying in the news cycle long enough to show he means business? — Keary H., Brooklyn

I’ve had the chance to meet with Kliavkoff a couple of times already. The first thing that stands out to me is he’s truly a big college football and basketball fan. That wasn’t necessarily always obvious with his predecessor. But right now, he’s fan who’s finding out for the first time how those sports operate from the inside, and, as a pretty accomplished businessperson, seems pretty bemused and befuddled by the collective ineptitude and inefficiencies of the whole thing.

Since his hiring May 13, he’s observed the following: the NCAA getting smacked down by the Supreme Court and failing to achieve any resolution on NIL; a CFP subcommittee announcing a detailed 12-team Playoff proposal without having gotten approval of the full group and with no clarity whatsoever on when it might start; one of his peer conferences secretly destroying one of the others; and, last week, the NCAA’s grand announcement it will be holding a Constitutional Convention. At least he’s got a sense of humor about it.

If ever a situation could benefit from some outside perspective, this would be it. His reported meeting Tuesday with Big 12 commissioner Bob Bowlsby signals he’s at least open to creative solutions, which is good, because he’s been tasked with revitalizing a conference that’s inherently disadvantaged in a lot of key areas. It struck some people as odd when he said at Pac-12 Media Day that Oklahoma and Texas to the SEC “strengthens our unique position as the only Power 5 conference with teams in the Mountain and Pacific time zones.” What I think he meant was, given their upcoming TV negotiations, it wouldn’t hurt to have one less seller of major college football on the market, and access to the western half of the country is their calling card.

That’s fine, as long as he doesn’t assume that networks will just take the money they would have spent on the Big 12 and throw it at the Pac-12 instead. Oklahoma president Joe Harroz said it became apparent this spring that the Big 12 was “last in line” with the networks. If the Big 12 is no longer in line, then what does that make the Pac-12? I don’t know if the league absolutely has to expand, but Kliavkoff probably needs to do something ambitious before those 2024 negotiations begin next year to prove that his conference is a must-have product.

Why would Texas and Oklahoma not also reach out to the B1G? Wouldn’t it be equal financially but more winnable? — Josh F.

Texas president Jay Hartzell said at Monday’s state senate hearing that his school “explored” the Big Ten, ACC and Pac-12 but only reached out to the SEC. I made the point in a column a couple of days after the original July 21 bombshell that Oklahoma in a particular would be better off in a conference where it could remain one of two national title contenders at most rather than one of six-to-eight but got mostly laughed off by the commenters. (A lot of “this is one of the worst takes you’ve ever had.”)

With a little distance, I now see why this was probably always SEC-or-bust. It starts with recruiting. Texas and Oklahoma both rely heavily on the state of Texas, and have watched as not only Texas A&M but Alabama, LSU and others have made considerable inroads in that state by playing the SEC card. Texas and Oklahoma are looking to achieve that same bump. Going to the Big Ten would not likely help their cause in Texas, and might even hurt it. Look at what’s happened to Nebraska since it joined the Big Ten. It no longer has a natural recruiting footprint and is struggling because of it.

Less tangibly but no less relevant, though: Conference realignment is largely a playground for egos. Hartzell and Oklahoma president Joseph Harroz have only been in their jobs since 2020 and they’re already making a legacy-defining decision that completely uproots the entire college sports landscape. That’s some serious chutzpah.

If they’re going to go this big, it only makes sense they want it to involve an invitation to the best conference in college football. (That distinction was not necessarily as obvious back in 2010, when the schools flirted with the then-Pac-10, but after 11 national title over 15 years and roughly eight gazillion first-round picks later, the SEC’s superiority is indisputable, and figures to remain so for a long, long time.)

I’m sure once the ink was dry, Hartzell and Harroz enjoyed a couple of nice long toasts with their board members and ADs last Friday night. Not that joining the Big Ten wouldn’t be cause for celebration, but the SEC is their ultimate flex.

Stewart: Is there any hope for me as a Baylor fan? It feels like Baylor has almost no influence/reputation outside of the state of Texas, and that has me worried. I’m afraid when the music stops, we might be left without a chair. — Jake H, Waco

Baylor is a textbook example of the inherent unfairness of realignment. Baylor athletics as a whole is in a whole other stratosphere from where it was a dozen years ago. Since 2010, football, once the Big 12’s annual doormat, has won two conference titles and played for a third. Men’s basketball, which had to claw back from absolute rock bottom when it hired Scott Drew, just won the national championship. Women’s basketball, which did just lose a Hall of Fame coach, has won two national titles and reached seven Elite Eights or Final Fours.

And yet, for the third time now, Baylor is facing an existential crisis because of the defections of others.

But yes, there is hope, and it’s specifically because of all that success in the most prominent sports. Unlike Rice or SMU at the time the Southwest Conference crumbled, Baylor has established itself nationally in those sports. There’s no reason it can’t continue enjoying success in whatever the Big 12 ends up becoming or wherever else it may land. That’s especially true in basketball, but even with football, I keep coming back to how fortuitous it is to the Left-Behind 8 that a 12-team Playoff is coming. If anything, Baylor will be in better position to win its conference and earn one of those six automatic berths than it is currently playing in the same league as Oklahoma.

Clearly, the finances won’t be the same, and that’s the big concern for all of these schools. Baylor is a private school, so it’s hard to ascertain their latest athletics budget, but at Monday’s hearing, AD Mack Rhoades described it as “48 percent of what Texas does.” That would put it at about $100 million. A $15-$20 million drop in media revenue would be massive, and that’s before potential dips in ticket sales, donations, etc.

Baylor is going to need even more help than usual from the university and from donors to avoid having to make drastic cuts. But it can be done. UCF, Cincinnati and others are currently fielding very good programs and either hiring (Gus Malzahn) or retaining (Luke Fickell) very accomplished coaches without a Power 5 paycheck. It can be done.

Stew, the past two weeks have been filled with eviscerations of Greg Sankey, characterizing him as a villain who looked Bob Bowlsby in the eye during Playoff discussions and casually stabbed him in the back. It now seems clear from the Texas legislature hearings that Sankey was first contacted this spring, which means the playoff planning would have essentially been complete. Seeing seeing legit “journalists” quote “insiders” and tweet about what now seems to be wild speculation as fact is disappointing. Is this just the way news is reported now? — Chris S.

I think you’re mistaking “opinion” for “news.”

Sankey and Bowlsby met in the same room as recently as June 22 for the CFP meeting in Dallas. I know because I was there. Given the first day of summer is June 21, it’s not wild speculation to assume that “spring” phone call from Texas had already occurred by then. Therefore, it is my opinion that Sankey “looked Bowlbsy in the eye during Playoff discussions and casually stabbed him in the back.”

Not that I blame him. If Oklahoma and Texas call up wanting to join your conference, you don’t say, “No thanks, I don’t want to hurt my friend.” College sports is a cold, ruthless business — as you may have ascertained from some recent journalism.

 

 

[DanTheHorn 4896]

11 hours ago, Royale with cheese said:

 

 

Message board rumors anyone can make them up.

Edited August 4, 2021 by DanTheHorn

[Soliver465 398]

15 hours ago, DFW Horn said:

Do Mormons gamble? I'm kinda surprised BYU agreed to a neutral site game in Vegas. @SwAss ?

Las Vegas (and Nevada in genera) is filled with Mormons.  They work in education and state/local government.  They are more concerned about what they do as opposed to what you do.

[SwAss 105]

3 minutes ago, Soliver465 said:

Las Vegas (and Nevada in genera) is filled with Mormons.  They work in education and state/local government.  They are more concerned about what they do as opposed to what you do.

This.  

[billfromlaketravis 11357]

11 minutes ago, Soliver465 said:

Las Vegas (and Nevada in genera) is filled with Mormons.  They work in education and state/local government.  They are more concerned about what they do as opposed to what you do.

 

[thunderlounge 7750]

3 hours ago, Longboard Horn said:

🤣🤣🤣 the stupidity!!

 

 

[alphahorn 1637]

I'd love to see it of course, but I'm betting against the B1G taking Kansas

[markstanco 12501]

2 minutes ago, alphahorn said:

I'd love to see it of course, but I'm betting against the B1G taking Kansas

Same.  The other schools will take a hit, not a gain in revenue.  They will grab a little bit of the Kansas City market, but part of that market already is watching with Columbia an hour and 15 minutes down the road. 

[Gidnik 3251]

 

[NeverMarryAStripper 21781]

I'm sure he will be completely unbiased

[GTNY 280]

9 minutes ago, Gidnik said:

 

Another example of why we can't stay through 2025

[Aqua Buddha 14501]

Bob Stoops gave an interview and said him and Lincoln Riley have been talking about the SEC move for months.  So, OU’s former coach was in the mix while Aggy was still in the dark?

Lulz.

[GTX Horn 1707]

11 hours ago, DFW Horn said:

SIAP

 

Only reason they would not be asked is if they have another home. Those are arguably the 2 biggest brands left in the Big 12 (besides maybe Oklahoma State). KU to the B1G seems possible, but Texas Tech??? Suffice to say I doubt the B1G would take Texas Tech because of academics. Maybe the ACC? Seems far-fetched to me but I don’t know shit.

[thunderlounge 7750]

39 minutes ago, markstanco said:

Same.  The other schools will take a hit, not a gain in revenue.  They will grab a little bit of the Kansas City market, but part of that market already is watching with Columbia an hour and 15 minutes down the road. 

That isn’t quite accurate.

 

The KC market isn’t focused on Missouri. They are more of an afterthought vs KU. 
 

The columbia market is also more facing towards St Louis and what is going on there. 
 

KC was a huge B8, then B12 market. When Missouri left, that markets interest didn’t follow.

If KU were to join the B1G, they would capture more of a market than one would think.

 

[closetohumping 17386]

https://www.heartlandcollegesports.com/2021/08/03/kevin-kietzman-joe-castiglione-backstabbed-other-big-12-athletic-directors/?fbclid=IwAR1wqh_mnnt7tdbS1AN5gBtSD2SqmiHa4-4ONc1d4CANDTLY95m9xM1JhTA

[Hurtlocker 2208]

3 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

https://www.heartlandcollegesports.com/2021/08/03/kevin-kietzman-joe-castiglione-backstabbed-other-big-12-athletic-directors/?fbclid=IwAR1wqh_mnnt7tdbS1AN5gBtSD2SqmiHa4-4ONc1d4CANDTLY95m9xM1JhTA

Quote

Kietzman, who was a long-time host on Sports Radio 810 in Kansas City and now hosts his own podcast, Kevin Kietzman has issues, joined Pete Mundo on the Heartland College Sports podcast and shared this story about Oklahoma athletic director Joe Castiglione:

“I’ve known him since the late 80’s when I was working on the Mizzou beat for Channel 4 and he became the athletic director at Missouri. I covered them, I traveled with the team. Nobody in sports was ever nicer to me than Joe Castiglione. He was the nicest man ever. He’s got friends everywhere in college athletics. He’s one of the most respected guys in the country. Every other AD in the league loves Joe Castiglione. Now they hate him. He lied to them for a year. He sat at every table keeping in his mind that he was orchestrating a way for his team to be out, lying to them, hearing all the information about what’s going on the Big 12, likely sharing that information with ESPN and the SEC. And he turned around and stabbed them in the back. That’s not the Joe Castiglione I know. I think the biggest story here is the people in this league that are just shocked at the people that they liked, trusted and thought were there friends snuck around and did this.”

 

['stache 21744]

2 minutes ago, Hurtlocker said:

 

I know y'all are best friends now, but Joe C sucks. He's always sucked. Fuck him for this and for everything.

[PittsburghTiger 6137]

12 hours ago, Hagbard Celine said:

i repped this earlier because you live in pennsyltucky so you have the right to create and propagate your own meme...

however around these parts, you have to have a one-word name, because of aggy, and their nomenclature of "plurale tantrum"

yes, that is the latin name for nouns that are both singular and plural.....

some nouns have no singular form. Such a noun is called a plurale tantum......

which is totally fitting..... aggy... .plurale tantrum....

thus, the singular of nambly is pedder....

therefore, praise bob

praise the laser projekt

🤣 Sounds good to me.

[Eugene11 375]

Anyone with half a brain saw this all coming at some point when Nebraska and aggy left the conference.  I knew it was a matter of time. They both surprised the conference when they announced leaving. Or at least aggy certainly did. I never got this mad or upset and blamed them or their ADs or thought we should go to state legislature about it. 
wtf is going on with these fuck heads?   Is it really just that we carry them that much and they know it but can’t admit it? 

[markstanco 12501]

29 minutes ago, thunderlounge said:

That isn’t quite accurate.

 

The KC market isn’t focused on Missouri. They are more of an afterthought vs KU. 
 

The columbia market is also more facing towards St Louis and what is going on there. 
 

KC was a huge B8, then B12 market. When Missouri left, that markets interest didn’t follow.

If KU were to join the B1G, they would capture more of a market than one would think.

 

I will admit I dont know the TV markets in KC.  My point was would Kansas basketball bring in more money for each of the current teams in the B1G?  I dont see it happening. 

['stache 21744]

Mizzou to the BIG makes sense for Saint Louis and with KU, it would reignite the Border War rivalry, and I think Mizzou has some weird rivalry with Illinois that only they seem to care about, but it's a rivalry nonetheless.

[David Dennison 18646]

18 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

https://www.heartlandcollegesports.com/2021/08/03/kevin-kietzman-joe-castiglione-backstabbed-other-big-12-athletic-directors/?fbclid=IwAR1wqh_mnnt7tdbS1AN5gBtSD2SqmiHa4-4ONc1d4CAN DTLY95m9xM1JhTA

If you listen to the podcast, they're still wondering where Texas and Oklahoma are going to get the money for the buyout. They really think this has the potential to drag on for four years. Someone might want to remind these guys that ESPN still owes Texas $150 million for the LHN.

[Uncle Nate 2097]

12 hours ago, DFW Horn said:

SIAP

 

Wow, I feel like Tom Hagen all of a sudden.

Tech is out?  I didn't think we were bad a consigliere. 

[Gene Parmesan 3993]

14 minutes ago, markstanco said:

I will admit I dont know the TV markets in KC.  My point was would Kansas basketball bring in more money for each of the current teams in the B1G?  I dont see it happening. 

This is kind of where I am.  I realize basketball is called a revenue generating sport, but my assumption that's mainly because of the tournament.  How much of that goes back to the conferences to share?  It be one thing if they were elite basketball and okay other sports, but they are a shit show in everything else.

[Welshy 907]

26 minutes ago, Uncle Nate said:

Wow, I feel like Tom Hagen all of a sudden.

Tech is out?  I didn't think we were bad a consigliere. 

Yeah, not a chance. They may be out, but only with mostly everyone else. There is not a scenario where ONLY Tech is out. 

[JimmyJames 12271]

39 minutes ago, 'stache said:

Mizzou to the BIG makes sense for Saint Louis and with KU, it would reignite the Border War rivalry, and I think Mizzou has some weird rivalry with Illinois that only they seem to care about, but it's a rivalry nonetheless.

If this were to happen this is also the only scenario I can see for OSU getting in the SEC which I think they would beat out tech for. 
 

If the B1G expands, and that’s a big if, then Kansas, Virginia and Missouri are the three that most closely fit their criteria. Lots of TV sets in northern Virginia, St. Louis and Kansas City.