Realignment talk not going away

[El Squared 1,838]

On 8/25/2021 at 6:48 PM, Deej said:

This triumvirate shit always works out well.

 

 

the Alliance is the Football League of Nations

[El Squared 1,838]

On 8/25/2021 at 8:49 PM, BachelorTrek said:

Veni, Vidi, Vici!

i prefer : vidi, vici, veni 

[maninblack 7,975]

Ah yes, how sweet the wine.

[TrashMaster G 18,029]

5 hours ago, BluTechsan said:

You know what else gives them a shit ton of money?

ESPN’s League of Blue Blood College Football which is where this is all going.

There’s actually several things that can be all happening at the same time.

* the ESPN and SECSECSEC want an expanded CFP ($$$$$$)

* the “hand shake alliance” is a voting block against CFP expansion unless concessions are made that guarantees they each get 2 teams in

* the PAC not expanding might be an indication that it is they who might implode with USC and Oregon heading west to join the League of Blue Blood College Football

* the remaining B12 are scrambling to find new landing spots for both the long term and short term (short term being 3-5 yrs)

* The non SEC blue bloods are posturing and saying one thing publicly while trying to figure out how to leave their respective conferences and media deals

* If no “alliance” blue bloods leave now, the the League of Blue Blood College Football will take other teams as a stop gap for the short term to get things rolling. This is how Tech and oSu get in the mix. 

* It’s possible that Big12 expansion talks are including non-blue bloods from the “alliance” conferences just to test the water. If true, the League of non-Blue Blood College Football could be pretty good and be worthy of decent media attention ($$$)

It’s fascinating to watch how all the pieces and moving parts are playing out.

But, having said all that, I hope none of it happens. And I don't say that because I pull for a team that isn’t a blue blood. I say that because I don’t wish to see CFB become NFL lite.

Or maybe, and just hear me out, the SEC did the math and realized that a 16-team league with Texas and OU is more valuable for each school than the current 14-team league.

It's just crazy enough to be true.

[billfromlaketravis 11,784]

4 hours ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

 

Actually:

 

 

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_football_in_Japan

 

 

Better or worse than the Texas team that lost to Kansas? I'd say better. 

Edited August 28, 2021 by billfromlaketravis

[Azbadlands 109]

14 hours ago, CooterBrown said:

I wonder if they the Irate 8 could somehow finagle ASU and UA into joining if they do land BYU first. Could probably get UNM as a bridge out west.

That ain't happening...All of ASU / AU's Alums and Boosters mostly end up in California... All of their recruiting is in Cali...It would be like Oklahoma State  going to the PAC alone and isolating themselves from Texas recruiting...

Edited August 28, 2021 by Azbadlands

[Azbadlands 109]

23 hours ago, BluTechsan said:

 

They don't.

But the BIG/PAC just proved they are no longer interested in big boy football - well, the future of big boy anyway - they still want to hold onto the past.

The SECSECSEC would have been fine with 16 if everyone else moved that way too. Why? Because the Big12 would have been spread around and it would be officially dead. No GORs. No payouts. 

The news of this week shows that the BIG/PAC are unwilling to play their role in this re-imagining of CFB as we know it.

The SECSECSEC will move the needle forward on their own if they have to and it is at that juncture we now sit. ESPN is driving this as well as it is they who are writing the checks. If taking a couple more BIG12 teams does that (dissolving the conference) then yeah, that's exactly what they'll do.

The SEC got what they wanted from the Big 12, and now they will focus on breaking the Alliance, and getting the playoffs expanded before it can go to the open market for bidding...

I bet they offer the ACC more money next to get them out of the Alliance and get their votes on playoff expansion...

They will also get Texas and OU over to the SEC schedule by next year...

[TKthunder2 5,058]

12 minutes ago, TrashMaster G said:

Or maybe, and just hear me out, the SEC did the math and realized that a 16-team league with Texas and OU is more valuable for each school than the current 14-team league.

It's just crazy enough to be true.

The SEC only has one of the eight football blue bloods currently (Alabama).

When UT/OU join they will have 3 of the 8 (same as the Big Ten) and they will have 8 of the top 16 FBS teams in all time wins with 4 others in the top 30. Giving Kentucky a pass for basketball and Vanderbilt a pass for academics, the only schools that are historically at the bottom of the conference are South Carolina and Mississippi State.

The only thing that could come close to replicating this move would be for the Big Ten to take USC and Notre Dame.  The best the ACC could do would be ND and West Virginia (surprisingly, to me at least, they are #15 on the all time FBS wins).

Also of note other than #15 WVU, the only other Big 12 school in the top 50 FBS all times wins is TCU at #36.

[BachelorTrek 3,268]

7 hours ago, DFW Horn said:

Funny, but I've had one of Useless Trinity's oversized Tongans stomp on my big toe while officiating one of their games. Sumbitches are huge.

FIFY

[BachelorTrek 3,268]

3 hours ago, maninblack said:

Ah yes, how sweet the wine.

"Osmanthus wine tastes the same as I remember.... But where are those who share the memory?"  #GenshinImpact

[notre dame joe 202]

14 hours ago, mdmost said:

This is why the Pac 12 didn't have to expand. If each school in the Pac 12 is getting an ACC and Big 10 team twice a year while keeping their existing slice of the pie, why bring on schools that don't really add that much in the Big 8 leftovers? Maybe the Pac 12 goes away after their TV ends but Tech, oSu, and others weren't going to make a new TV deal any better.  

This could work.  I always thought 5 ACC games was too many.  With ND counting as an ACC team they would likely take 1 or 2 of them and rotate through PAC and BUG teams.  And while I'm happy to see even less of Cousin Oliver College, eventually the ACC teams will notice they are swapping out ND for Utah.

[Pimphand 6,266]

This thread is so much less fun without aggy tears.

[Dnaguy 12,572]

5 minutes ago, Pimphand said:

This thread is so much less fun without aggy tears.

It’ll pick up when all the articles start coming out on how Baylor has to mortgage their Toilet bowl to pay the light bills due to their loss of TV $. 

[JFKFC 4,965]

29 minutes ago, Pimphand said:

This thread is so much less fun without aggy tears.

 

[Francisco 2.0 32,543]

50 minutes ago, Dnaguy said:

It’ll pick up when all the articles start coming out on how Baylor has to mortgage their Toilet bowl to pay the light bills due to their loss of TV $. 

 

Actually, you have it in reverse.  They will mortgage the hilt out of everything but their stadium, quit paying light bills, shut down complete buildings and eliminate degree programs, and gut every sport (including basketball) in order to keep the appearance of having a P5 program.  

[Pato del Muerto 53,330]

8 minutes ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

 

Actually, you have it in reverse.  They will mortgage the hilt out of everything but their stadium, quit paying light bills, shut down complete buildings and eliminate degree programs, and gut every sport (including basketball) in order to keep the appearance of having a P5 program.  

Their tuition is already overpriced but paid for anyway by people of certain beliefs. I’m sure they could Jack tuition up even more and also accept more students.  That ought to cover a 20 million per annum loss, right?

[bullet 1,626]

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/college-football-picks-schedule-predictions-against-the-spread-odds-for-week-0-games/

 

Not much new, but Bowlsby is still speaking "truth to power."  Yes, he REALLY said that.  What?  Does he think he's an 18 year old college student?

 

"...Bowlsby still believes ESPN conspired with SEC and American to (perhaps mortally) wound his league. Bowlsby has not shared evidence to this end; both ESPN and AAC commissioner Mike Aresco denied the accusation.

 

"You know me well enough," Bowlsby told CBS Sports this week. "I wouldn't have said it unless it was absolutely true."

Bowlsby hasn't lost any part of his bravado since that day. Asked if it's possible to mend fences with a powerful rights holder in future negotiations, Bowlsby did not relent.

"Any time you speak truth to power, you run risks," he said...."

[Pato del Muerto 53,330]

Time to change the name of the big12 to MyConference

[Asu2215 258]

19 hours ago, DFW Horn said:

* East

Unless there's a Japanese CFB league they wish to be a part of.

What about Univ of Hawaii and Hawaii Tech U?

[DFW Horn 6,637]

13 minutes ago, Asu2215 said:

What about Univ of Hawaii and Hawaii Tech U?

Yes, Hawaii Tech is in the same league as the Texas State Armadillos.

Suck it, SWT Bobcats

[utee94 16,065]

4 minutes ago, DFW Horn said:

Yes, Hawaii Tech is in the same league as the Texas State Armadillos.

Suck it, SWT Bobcats

I think these guys are in that league, too:

 

 

[camel at sea 589]

3 hours ago, bullet said:

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/college-football-picks-schedule-predictions-against-the-spread-odds-for-week-0-games/

 

Not much new, but Bowlsby is still speaking "truth to power."  Yes, he REALLY said that.  What?  Does he think he's an 18 year old college student?

 

"...Bowlsby still believes ESPN conspired with SEC and American to (perhaps mortally) wound his league. Bowlsby has not shared evidence to this end; both ESPN and AAC commissioner Mike Aresco denied the accusation.

 

"You know me well enough," Bowlsby told CBS Sports this week. "I wouldn't have said it unless it was absolutely true."

Bowlsby hasn't lost any part of his bravado since that day. Asked if it's possible to mend fences with a powerful rights holder in future negotiations, Bowlsby did not relent.

"Any time you speak truth to power, you run risks," he said...."

This leads me to believe he thinks that he has a post-expansion media rights buyer who is not Disney.  Maybe he does.  If someone like CBS wants into the college athletics space for their streaming app, they could probably pick up the Big 12 v.4 at a discount and get some relatively good return on that.  

[Dnaguy 12,572]

51 minutes ago, camel at sea said:

This leads me to believe he thinks that he has a post-expansion media rights buyer who is not Disney.  Maybe he does.  If someone like CBS wants into the college athletics space for their streaming app, they could probably pick up the Big 12 v.4 at a discount and get some relatively good return on that.  

They do need more than Paw patrol and bing bang theory…..

[TKthunder2 5,058]

11 minutes ago, Dnaguy said:

They do need more than Paw patrol and bing bang theory…..

It’s called programming fusion:

The Baylor thinking Sheldons verse the K State firefighting Marshall pups 

[Dnaguy 12,572]

1 minute ago, TKthunder2 said:

It’s called programming fusion:

The Baylor thinking Sheldons verse the K State firefighting Marshall pups 

Baylor is more CSI due to the rape, murder, and animal abuse.

[iamjethro 98]

UCLA cheerleaders today remind us that they, along with Oregon cheerleaders and USC Song Girls, demand that some aspects of the PAC must survive re-alignment.

[bullet 1,626]

2 hours ago, camel at sea said:

This leads me to believe he thinks that he has a post-expansion media rights buyer who is not Disney.  Maybe he does.  If someone like CBS wants into the college athletics space for their streaming app, they could probably pick up the Big 12 v.4 at a discount and get some relatively good return on that.  

Or maybe NBC wants someone to fill days they don't have Notre Dame?

[camel at sea 589]

30 minutes ago, bullet said:

Or maybe NBC wants someone to fill days they don't have Notre Dame?

Yep.  That's the other likely option.  If Bowlsby is still popping off at Disney then I think he feels pretty good about the conference having a landing spot with a major broadcast partner.  Otherwise, the path of least resistance seems like it would be to play nice with the Mouse and leverage the Texas-Oklahoma buyout negotiation for favorable terms on B12 expansion and a new rights deal... with Disney.  

[Doc Sam Beckett 5,854]

On 8/27/2021 at 1:13 PM, mdmost said:

This is why the Pac 12 didn't have to expand. If each school in the Pac 12 is getting an ACC and Big 10 team twice a year while keeping their existing slice of the pie, why bring on schools that don't really add that much in the Big 8 leftovers? Maybe the Pac 12 goes away after their TV ends but Tech, oSu, and others weren't going to make a new TV deal any better.  

 

Not sure how this is going to work. Clemson, for example, plays 8 conference games and 2 power five OOC games, South Carolina and ND/sec team. They're not giving up Georgia or LSU for a Pac 12 team. I think FSU follows a similar set up. 

[Deej 77,667]

1 hour ago, camel at sea said:

Yep.  That's the other likely option.  If Bowlsby is still popping off at Disney then I think he feels pretty good about the conference having a landing spot with a major broadcast partner.  Otherwise, the path of least resistance seems like it would be to play nice with the Mouse and leverage the Texas-Oklahoma buyout negotiation for favorable terms on B12 expansion and a new rights deal... with Disney.  

Like Bowlsby has a fucking clue what he is doing.

Disney/ABC: We have a deal lined up for you guys. 

Bowlsby: Hold up, assholes. MeTV is on the other line. 

Edited August 29, 2021 by Deej

[BB65 489]

7 minutes ago, Deej said:

Like Bowlsby has a fucking clue what he is doing.

Disney/ABC: We have a deal lined up for you guys. 

Bowlsby: Hold up, assholes. MeTV is on the other line. 

What the hell is wrong with MeTV?

[Deej 77,667]

4 minutes ago, BB65 said:

What the hell is wrong with MeTV?

Nothing, if you're good with each team making less than Svengoolie. 

[Dewey 3,325]

I swear to God if they put the big xii on Metv, I'm unplugging my antena. 

[Gaffords 774]

2 hours ago, camel at sea said:

Yep.  That's the other likely option.  If Bowlsby is still popping off at Disney then I think he feels pretty good about the conference having a landing spot with a major broadcast partner.  Otherwise, the path of least resistance seems like it would be to play nice with the Mouse and leverage the Texas-Oklahoma buyout negotiation for favorable terms on B12 expansion and a new rights deal... with Disney.  

It doesn't matter who they have, the contract itself is going to fall way short of the other conferences.  And I have a feeling that Bowlsby's projected 50% loss is optimistic.  

If the duck could have made even 10 cents to the dollar, don't you think the Big 12; would be at 12/14/16 with a real conference title game and a network by now?  There wasn't any available teams to move the mark past where it stood...   

Now there isn't any combination of available teams (even if the Ir8 jumped to 20) to put them within half of what they lost with the exit of OU and Texas.   

Conferences are anchored by blue bloods for a reason...  Someone has to keep the lights on when the entire league is down... Blue bloods still get National viewers even if not in contention.  But unless TT/OSU/ect... is undefeated late in the year, AND in serious conversations of taking it all, they don't get National interest unless playing a National Brand (which seldom happens at all). 

So the real question becomes; once the butthurt subsides and reality of the cash cow(s) having been stolen,will the Ir8 really care to compete at P5 level when they can't afford to keep facilities, stadiums, coaches salaries, ect. which will kill recruiting and such, just for the prestige of status?  10 to 15 mill off TV deals competing against conferences pulling between 50 - 60 mill is a huge gap will just keep getting wider and wider...  

99.9% those on the outside looking in, want in for the money.  It will be interesting to see if they still want in when they will be making a few million more as a P5 but needing to spend  that and more, just in the new travel expenses. Not to mention P5 coaching salaries, and all the bells and whistles needed to draw in recruits.  

Football drives the bus when it comes to $$$.  But when it becomes a cash drain instead of the money tree, teams step down to lower divisions or shit can it completely....  This is something i could see Kansas do.  Even if they lost two or three million a year playing in a BB conference instead of losing 6 or 7 million a year paying for a football program that can't pay for it's own toilet paper.

[BB65 489]

1 hour ago, Deej said:

Nothing, if you're good with each team making less than Svengoolie. 

That’s about what they are worth. 

[camel at sea 589]

5 hours ago, Gaffords said:

It doesn't matter who they have, the contract itself is going to fall way short of the other conferences.  And I have a feeling that Bowlsby's projected 50% loss is optimistic.  

If the duck could have made even 10 cents to the dollar, don't you think the Big 12; would be at 12/14/16 with a real conference title game and a network by now?  There wasn't any available teams to move the mark past where it stood...   

Now there isn't any combination of available teams (even if the Ir8 jumped to 20) to put them within half of what they lost with the exit of OU and Texas.   

Conferences are anchored by blue bloods for a reason...  Someone has to keep the lights on when the entire league is down... Blue bloods still get National viewers even if not in contention.  But unless TT/OSU/ect... is undefeated late in the year, AND in serious conversations of taking it all, they don't get National interest unless playing a National Brand (which seldom happens at all). 

So the real question becomes; once the butthurt subsides and reality of the cash cow(s) having been stolen,will the Ir8 really care to compete at P5 level when they can't afford to keep facilities, stadiums, coaches salaries, ect. which will kill recruiting and such, just for the prestige of status?  10 to 15 mill off TV deals competing against conferences pulling between 50 - 60 mill is a huge gap will just keep getting wider and wider...  

99.9% those on the outside looking in, want in for the money.  It will be interesting to see if they still want in when they will be making a few million more as a P5 but needing to spend  that and more, just in the new travel expenses. Not to mention P5 coaching salaries, and all the bells and whistles needed to draw in recruits.  

Football drives the bus when it comes to $$$.  But when it becomes a cash drain instead of the money tree, teams step down to lower divisions or shit can it completely....  This is something i could see Kansas do.  Even if they lost two or three million a year playing in a BB conference instead of losing 6 or 7 million a year paying for a football program that can't pay for it's own toilet paper.

In 2019-2020, the ACC's distribution averaged $32.3M per school and they can't negotiate a new rights deal for another decade+.  Assuming that the IR8 are worth about half of the Big 12's $40M per school distribution, then they have a chance to be alright.  The Big 12's current deal is a decade old.  Big 12 v.4 just need live TV to continue escalating in value.  Pretty much all live TV is seeing huge pay increases.   If they can get per-school payout into the high 20s and keep P5 status (with the CFP access and money that comes with it) they'll have the worst house in the neighborhood but they'll still be in the P5 neighborhood.  

It's not realistic to try competing financially with the SEC or B1G.  But if money can be competitive-ish with the ACC and PAC, then it's probably good enough to keep Big 12 football programs in roughly the same spot they've been in.  

[Not a Sock 2,362]

5 hours ago, camel at sea said:

In 2019-2020, the ACC's distribution averaged $32.3M per school and they can't negotiate a new rights deal for another decade+.  Assuming that the IR8 are worth about half of the Big 12's $40M per school distribution, then they have a chance to be alright.  The Big 12's current deal is a decade old.  Big 12 v.4 just need live TV to continue escalating in value.  Pretty much all live TV is seeing huge pay increases.   If they can get per-school payout into the high 20s and keep P5 status (with the CFP access and money that comes with it) they'll have the worst house in the neighborhood but they'll still be in the P5 neighborhood.  

It's not realistic to try competing financially with the SEC or B1G.  But if money can be competitive-ish with the ACC and PAC, then it's probably good enough to keep Big 12 football programs in roughly the same spot they've been in.  

They aren’t getting anywhere close to 25-30 million. The networks grossly overpaid the Big12 to stay together in 2011. There was going to be a market correction and that’s why OU and Texas are bolting, if the Big12 was going to get a hair cut with OU-UT in it  it will get scalped with out them.

[TKthunder2 5,058]

1 hour ago, Not a Sock said:

They aren’t getting anywhere close to 25-30 million. The networks grossly overpaid the Big12 to stay together in 2011. There was going to be a market correction and that’s why OU and Texas are bolting, if the Big12 was going to get a hair cut with OU-UT in it  it will get scalped with out them.

And they (ESPN/FOX) made this very clear during the exclusive negotiation window as neither wanted to even bid on the rights with UT/OU included. That was likely the final straw that convinced UT that it was time to go (OU had been trying to leave for years already).

[thunderlounge 8,318]

8 hours ago, camel at sea said:

It's not realistic to try competing financially with the SEC or B1G.  But if money can be competitive-ish with the ACC and PAC, then it's probably good enough to keep Big 12 football programs in roughly the same spot they've been in.  

On the floor in front of the door?

[camel at sea 589]

8 hours ago, Not a Sock said:

They aren’t getting anywhere close to 25-30 million. The networks grossly overpaid the Big12 to stay together in 2011. There was going to be a market correction and that’s why OU and Texas are bolting, if the Big12 was going to get a hair cut with OU-UT in it  it will get scalped with out them.

OU and Texas are bolting b/c the Big 12 cannot get close to the B1G/SEC w/r/t payout.  They're probably also bolting to help with fan apathy and to be in the room when the SEC determines NIL policy.  They aren't bolting b/c they weren't about to sign a deal that pays a lot more than the ACC (and probably the PAC.).  The TV ratings for the IR8 back that up, too.  

The Big 12's current deal with ESPN/FOX was signed with its current membership in place.  The 2011 season was played with 10 teams on the old 12 team deal.  But all parties negotiated a new deal - with the current ten teams - in 2012.  To the extent there might have been a gross overpayment from there forward, it was on the LHN (and even that I'd disagree with b/c it was at least breaking even if not doing better than even a couple of years in.)  The Tier 1/2 deals were based on actual value and the TV numbers back that up.  The Big 12 is 3rd in payout.  It's 3rd in TV ratings.

[TKthunder2 5,058]

15 minutes ago, camel at sea said:

The Big 12 is 3rd in payout.  It's 3rd in TV ratings.

You pay a bunch of money for something, you’re going to advertise and promote it and give it good placement on your channels because it’s your 2nd or 3rd highest expense.  3rd in payout equals 3rd in viewership isn’t all that difficult to manifest.

Why pay 25% more money for the Big12 over the PAC/ACC when they only pull 10% more in viewership and much of that bump is driven by optimal game placement and network promotion?

If the Big12 justified its current 3rd place, why would both Disney and FOX decline to bid on the Big 12’s new TV deal (with UT/OU still included) if they were such a clear cut #3 at a time when every media group is paying out the ass for premium live sports content?

[bullet 1,626]

21 hours ago, Gaffords said:

It doesn't matter who they have, the contract itself is going to fall way short of the other conferences.  And I have a feeling that Bowlsby's projected 50% loss is optimistic.  

If the duck could have made even 10 cents to the dollar, don't you think the Big 12; would be at 12/14/16 with a real conference title game and a network by now?  There wasn't any available teams to move the mark past where it stood...   

Now there isn't any combination of available teams (even if the Ir8 jumped to 20) to put them within half of what they lost with the exit of OU and Texas.   

Conferences are anchored by blue bloods for a reason...  Someone has to keep the lights on when the entire league is down... Blue bloods still get National viewers even if not in contention.  But unless TT/OSU/ect... is undefeated late in the year, AND in serious conversations of taking it all, they don't get National interest unless playing a National Brand (which seldom happens at all). 

So the real question becomes; once the butthurt subsides and reality of the cash cow(s) having been stolen,will the Ir8 really care to compete at P5 level when they can't afford to keep facilities, stadiums, coaches salaries, ect. which will kill recruiting and such, just for the prestige of status?  10 to 15 mill off TV deals competing against conferences pulling between 50 - 60 mill is a huge gap will just keep getting wider and wider...  

99.9% those on the outside looking in, want in for the money.  It will be interesting to see if they still want in when they will be making a few million more as a P5 but needing to spend  that and more, just in the new travel expenses. Not to mention P5 coaching salaries, and all the bells and whistles needed to draw in recruits.  

Football drives the bus when it comes to $$$.  But when it becomes a cash drain instead of the money tree, teams step down to lower divisions or shit can it completely....  This is something i could see Kansas do.  Even if they lost two or three million a year playing in a BB conference instead of losing 6 or 7 million a year paying for a football program that can't pay for it's own toilet paper.

Well the interesting thing is that the Big 12 was making $9-$10 million in conference distributions back before the 2010 Pac 16 plan.  So they will be making 50% more than the Big 12 was making then if Bowlsby's prediction was accurate.

[bullet 1,626]

15 hours ago, camel at sea said:

In 2019-2020, the ACC's distribution averaged $32.3M per school and they can't negotiate a new rights deal for another decade+.  Assuming that the IR8 are worth about half of the Big 12's $40M per school distribution, then they have a chance to be alright.  The Big 12's current deal is a decade old.  Big 12 v.4 just need live TV to continue escalating in value.  Pretty much all live TV is seeing huge pay increases.   If they can get per-school payout into the high 20s and keep P5 status (with the CFP access and money that comes with it) they'll have the worst house in the neighborhood but they'll still be in the P5 neighborhood.  

It's not realistic to try competing financially with the SEC or B1G.  But if money can be competitive-ish with the ACC and PAC, then it's probably good enough to keep Big 12 football programs in roughly the same spot they've been in.  

And the Big 12 schools are the most financially healthy.  They run pretty lean athletic departments and do a lot fewer sports than the Big 10 and Pac 12 schools and a little fewer than the ACC.

[bullet 1,626]

7 hours ago, TKthunder2 said:

And they (ESPN/FOX) made this very clear during the exclusive negotiation window as neither wanted to even bid on the rights with UT/OU included. That was likely the final straw that convinced UT that it was time to go (OU had been trying to leave for years already).

To be accurate they didn't want to bid early.  They both wanted to keep their options open to bid on the Big 10.  They didn't want to commit slots to the Big 12 until they knew how much of the Big 10 they had.

[Goodbye and Good Luck 33]

 

I made a thing for this thread, better than the shitty B1G version upthread.  If you like it maybe make it into a new thread, I'm too new.  I included a few easter eggs for Surly.

[camel at sea 589]

1 hour ago, TKthunder2 said:

You pay a bunch of money for something, you’re going to advertise and promote it and give it good placement on your channels because it’s your 2nd or 3rd highest expense.  3rd in payout equals 3rd in viewership isn’t all that difficult to manifest.

Why pay 25% more money for the Big12 over the PAC/ACC when they only pull 10% more in viewership and much of that bump is driven by optimal game placement and network promotion?

If the Big12 justified its current 3rd place, why would both Disney and FOX decline to bid on the Big 12’s new TV deal (with UT/OU still included) if they were such a clear cut #3 at a time when every media group is paying out the ass for premium live sports content?

The Big 12 made better decisions re: monetization than the PAC a decade ago.  The Big 12 parked inventory on FS1 and got paid for it.  The PAC parked similar inventory on the PACN and didn't make any money from it.  So the Big 12 ended up making money on a bunch of games for which the PAC was making nothing w/ similar games.  That accounts for a lot of the difference between the two conferences.  Going forward though, you compare apples to apples, and the Big 12 has been pulling better TV numbers than the PAC for the last decade despite having a larger percentage of its games rated.  Think about that.  Even with the worst games included into the Big 12 average, and not included into the PAC average, the Big 12 is still beating the PAC. 

I'm not convinced that the status quo gap between the Big 12 and the ACC is only 10% in viewership.  BC, Duke, WF, Cuse, Pitt, and GT would all have bottom rung fan support in the Big 12.  Like the PAC, the ACC inflates its average TV ratings by only putting about half of it on a national network to be rated.  The Big 12 consistently put nearly all of its inventory on a national platform and was still beating the ACC in average TV numbers for most of the last decade.  The last couple of years, with a thumb on the scale, the ACC has been only edging out the Big 12.

The Big 12 makes 3rd place money right now b/c it's TV ratings are in 3rd place.  I'm arguing that the Big 12 - going forward - will be in 5th place and that its TV ratings will be in 5th place.  However, the gap between the IR8 and the PAC/ACC, when it comes to TV, is not all that wide.  Fans in the center of the country care more and they watch more.  There's reason to think the money will therefore not be that far behind.  There are going to be a lot of weekends when the IR8's best game is better than the best game being played in the PAC or ACC that same weekend.  We occasionally had weekends like that with the American over the last few years.  

The Big 12's media rights partners declined to negotiate b/c they had bigger fish to fry first (pro sports deals, the B1G, an expanded CFP, etc.)  Disney may have also known something about what was coming with Oklahoma and Texas, too.  

Edited August 30, 2021 by camel at sea

[LTbear 4,209]

51 minutes ago, Goodbye and Good Luck said:

 

I made a thing for this thread, better than the shitty B1G version upthread.  If you like it maybe make it into a new thread, I'm too new.  I included a few easter eggs for Surly.

I'm a Baylor fan and have no problem saying that's fucking hilarious. Well done. 

[Doc Sam Beckett 5,854]

6 minutes ago, camel at sea said:

The Big 12 made better decisions re: monetization than the PAC a decade ago.  The Big 12 parked inventory on FS1 and got paid for it.  The PAC parked similar inventory on the PACN and didn't make any money from it.  So the Big 12 ended up making money on a bunch of games for which the PAC was making nothing w/ similar games.  That accounts for a lot of the difference between the two conferences.  Going forward though, you compare apples to apples, and the Big 12 has been pulling better TV numbers than the PAC for the last decade despite having a larger percentage of its games rated.  Think about that.  Even with the worst games included into the Big 12 average, and not included into the PAC average, the Big 12 is still beating the PAC. 

I'm not convinced that the status quo gap between the Big 12 and the ACC is only 10% in viewership.  BC, Duke, WF, Cuse, Pitt, and GT would all have bottom rung fan support in the Big 12.  Like the PAC, the ACC inflates its average TV ratings by only putting about half of it on a national network to be rated.  The Big 12 consistently put nearly all of its inventory on a national platform and was still beating the ACC in average TV numbers for most of the last decade.  The last couple of years, with a thumb on the scale, the ACC has been only edging out the Big 12.

The Big 12 makes 3rd place money right now b/c it's TV ratings are in 3rd place.  I'm arguing that the Big 12 - going forward - will be in 5th place and that its TV ratings will be in 5th place.  However, the gap between the IR8 and the PAC/ACC, when it comes to TV, is not all that wide.  Fans in the center of the country care more and they watch more.  There's reason to think the money will therefore not be that far behind.  There are going to be a lot of weekends when the IR8's best game is better than the best game being played in the PAC or ACC that same weekend.  We occasionally had weekends like that with the American over the last few years.  

The Big 12's media rights partners declined to negotiate b/c they had bigger fish to fry first (pro sports deals, the B1G, an expanded CFP, etc.)  Disney may have also known something about what was coming with Oklahoma and Texas, too.  

 

 

Nobody gives a shit about the Big 12 without Texas and Oklahoma. It sucks, because oSu, ISU, and....well those two are cool, but without a bell cow or two, the Big 12 isn't comparable. It's ridiculous to compare the Irate 8 to the ACC with Clemson, FSU, and UNC. You keep saying Pitt and BC like the top tier doesn't exist. The Pac 12 is a better comparison, but SC, UCLA, and Oregon are still light years above anything in the Big 12-2-2.

 

Nobody fucking cares about Midwest and Texas second tier football, and honestly nobody really gives a shit about west coast football either. Nobody is going to pay anything for a Kansas State and Texas Christian match up and nobody is going to put that on any channel worth a damn. Oklahoma State and Iowa State will sneak into a decent time slot on a decent channel when they are ranked, but you aren't getting a contract close to the ACC in hopes of nailing that shit, especially with Oklahoma and Texas out.

[Vertigo 20,461]

1 hour ago, Goodbye and Good Luck said:

 

I made a thing for this thread, better than the shitty B1G version upthread.  If you like it maybe make it into a new thread, I'm too new.  I included a few easter eggs for Surly.

This is epic. The aggy thing made me lol. Twitter worthy @immamac

Edited August 30, 2021 by Vertigo

[Not a Sock 2,362]

47 minutes ago, camel at sea said:

The Big 12 made better decisions re: monetization than the PAC a decade ago.  The Big 12 parked inventory on FS1 and got paid for it.  The PAC parked similar inventory on the PACN and didn't make any money from it.  So the Big 12 ended up making money on a bunch of games for which the PAC was making nothing w/ similar games.  That accounts for a lot of the difference between the two conferences.  Going forward though, you compare apples to apples, and the Big 12 has been pulling better TV numbers than the PAC for the last decade despite having a larger percentage of its games rated.  Think about that.  Even with the worst games included into the Big 12 average, and not included into the PAC average, the Big 12 is still beating the PAC. 

I'm not convinced that the status quo gap between the Big 12 and the ACC is only 10% in viewership.  BC, Duke, WF, Cuse, Pitt, and GT would all have bottom rung fan support in the Big 12.  Like the PAC, the ACC inflates its average TV ratings by only putting about half of it on a national network to be rated.  The Big 12 consistently put nearly all of its inventory on a national platform and was still beating the ACC in average TV numbers for most of the last decade.  The last couple of years, with a thumb on the scale, the ACC has been only edging out the Big 12.

The Big 12 makes 3rd place money right now b/c it's TV ratings are in 3rd place.  I'm arguing that the Big 12 - going forward - will be in 5th place and that its TV ratings will be in 5th place.  However, the gap between the IR8 and the PAC/ACC, when it comes to TV, is not all that wide.  Fans in the center of the country care more and they watch more.  There's reason to think the money will therefore not be that far behind.  There are going to be a lot of weekends when the IR8's best game is better than the best game being played in the PAC or ACC that same weekend.  We occasionally had weekends like that with the American over the last few years.  

The Big 12's media rights partners declined to negotiate b/c they had bigger fish to fry first (pro sports deals, the B1G, an expanded CFP, etc.)  Disney may have also known something about what was coming with Oklahoma and Texas, too.  

This is actually why the Networks over paid for the Big 12, adding OU and Texas to the Pac would bring massive brands and markets for the Pac12 network and should the Pac12 had succeeded in getting their networks in peoples houses it could have been a huge problem for them when all the other conferences followed suit. So over paying for the Big 12 and throwing UT the LHN and OU FSSW would have kept the networks as the middle men and severly hurt the Pac12's attempt to circumvent them.