Realignment talk not going away

[LTbear 4168]

12 minutes ago, DanTheHorn said:

One can be rattled off for most but not all of these schools but then the second is a struggle and what about the third?

Just do what the B1G does - no arbitrarily forced number of perma-rivals, just whatever is a legitimate rivalry is protected. Makes scheduling a bit more complex but much better. 

[DanTheHorn 4922]

13 minutes ago, LTbear said:

Just do what the B1G does - no arbitrarily forced number of perma-rivals, just whatever is a legitimate rivalry is protected. Makes scheduling a bit more complex but much better. 

Yea, that is why I liked the proposed pods because it protects the few legitimate rivals that exist which is very few. All non Texas schools are going to want to play in Texas every year so how they rotate will be interesting. Maybe POD 2 and 3 flip two teams a piece. 

22 minutes ago, nineliveslost said:

force rivals

Pod 1

ASU - UA

Utah-BYU

Pod 2

Colorado - Iowa state

TCU - Baylor (flipped)

Pod 3

OSU - TTU

Kansas - KSU ( flipped)

Pod 4

Houston - Central Florida

Cincy - West V

 

Edited August 3, 2023 by DanTheHorn

[Jasper_Jester 356]

If rivalries have to be invented, it seems like other factors could be used instead of geography:

 

BYU and Baylor - Because God

Tech and WVU - Because screaming

ISU and Colorado - Because beer vs pot

KState vs Arizona - Wildcats vs Wildcats

Arizona State vs Central Florida - Devil horns vs Bull horns

Houston vs TCU - TCU got Houston's spot years ago, time for payback

OkState and Kansas - Because you are the man of the house now Cowboy and losing to Kansas sucks (we know)

Utah vs Cincinatti - Red and white vs red and black is basically black vs white, a classic rivalry

[DFW Horn 6123]

19 minutes ago, Jasper_Jester said:

If rivalries have to be invented, it seems like other factors could be used instead of geography:

Arizona State vs Central Florida - Devil horns vs Bull horns

[Jasper_Jester 356]

3 minutes ago, DFW Horn said:

Horns up vs shocker?

1 minute ago, Jasper_Jester said:

Horns up vs shocker?

oh shit, that is Southern Florida....Back to the drawing board

[DFW Horn 6123]

6 minutes ago, Jasper_Jester said:

Horns up vs shocker?

oh shit, that is Southern Florida....Back to the drawing board

Honest mistake, but UCF is the Golden Knights (or Citronauts) 

Edited August 4, 2023 by DFW Horn

[gatormarc 911]

4 minutes ago, Jasper_Jester said:

Horns up vs shocker?

oh shit, that is Southern Florida....Back to the drawing board

Florida Southern are the Mocs

[gatormarc 911]

Just now, DFW Horn said:

Honest mistake, but UCF is the Golden Knights

Just the Knights. 

They made a huge deal in the 90s about adding "Golden" and got pissed if anyone only called them the Knights.

Then they dropped it a decade later and are now pissed that people keep calling them "Golden" because it's harder to get someone to drop an adjective than add it.

It's rather funny.

[Jasper_Jester 356]

3 minutes ago, gatormarc said:

Florida Southern are the Mocs

I need to read the Know your Florida school thread! South Florida.

I'm gonna work on forcing a rivalry between ASU and UCF regardless.

[camel at sea 589]

I think the 3/6/6 model would work pretty well in the Big 12 with the 4C schools.  

Utah:  BYU, Colorado, OK St
BYU:  Utah, Arizona, TCU
ASU:  Arizona, Colorado, Tech
Arizona:  ASU, BYU, UH
Colorado: Utah, ASU, Baylor
ISU:  WVU, KSU, KU
KSU:  ISU, KU, OK St
KU:  KSU, Cincy, ISU
OK St: Tech, KSU, Utah
Tech:  ASU, OK St, TCU
TCU:  Tech, Baylor, BYU
Baylor:  TCU, UH, Colorado
UH:  Baylor, UCF, Arizona
WVU:  Cincy, UCF, ISU
Cincy:  WVU, UCF, KU
UCF:  WVU, Cincy, UH

[The Dog 44020]

 

[gatormarc 911]

1 minute ago, Jasper_Jester said:

I need to read the Know your Florida school thread! South Florida.

I'm gonna work on forcing a rivalry between ASU and UCF regardless.

 

South Florida (Tampa) - Bulls - this is the big public school that is in the AAC

Florida Southern (Lakeland) - Mocs - this is a small private Div II school that's been around a lot longer.

Both have a geography problem and are actually just about 30 miles apart both in Central Florida.

[gatormarc 911]

Just now, The Dog said:

 

Seems like an odd decision.

Unless they've decided that they're not going to play in the Pac12 in 2023.

 

[Crockett 490]

For BYU, obviously Utah, and then would add TCU (got beef from MWC days) and Baylor (religion component would make it spicier).

[Francisco 2.0 32389]

12 minutes ago, gatormarc said:

Seems like an odd decision.

Unless they've decided that they're not going to play in the Pac12 in 2023.

 

 

It's Nike.  Maybe they are modeling their 2024 threads early.

[gatormarc 911]

1 minute ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

 

It's Nike.  Maybe they are modeling their 2024 threads early.

Per some Oregon fan on Reddit, it looks like it was a one-off jersey from 2015, so probably a replica that never got the patch that the player wanted to wear.

[Francisco 2.0 32389]

1 minute ago, gatormarc said:

Per some Oregon fan on Reddit, it looks like it was a one-off jersey from 2015, so probably a replica that never got the patch that the player wanted to wear.

 

I honestly thought that someone photoshopped the logo out and it was passed of as some sort of official photo.  

 

[Texas Wahoo 3391]

Not that there was much doubt…

 

 

[royiv 9285]

8 hours ago, FartingDreamer said:

A big portion are (including many of the Apostles, some of the First Presidency and many in the Quorum of the Seventy), but the University as an institution and a large portion of it's faculty are openly hostile towards LDS and the church and towards BYU, though BYU is the superior/higher ranked institution.

I see what you are saying and I get the frustration and why they would feel the way they do.  But they take things too far re: harassing, pouring drinks on us, spitting on us, cussing at us and children at the games, openly mocking our religion.  One guy took a sacrament tray from a local church and repurposed a sacrament trey for jello shots.  A friend had her uncle punched in the stomach while at a game in Rice Eccles when we played them a few years back and someone else had their car vandalized.  They take it way beyond rivalry banter into pure hostility and the LDS Ute fans turn a blind eye to it and don't speak up about it.    I remember the reports of Ohio State fans from when Texas played them in Columbus in 2005, it was like that but worse as the hostility follows us into their stadium.

Get a life, dude. BYU has just as many shitty fans as Utah does. I've had a great time at Utah tailgates and never had to pay for a drink. Can't say the same thing about the zoobs.

[MuellerHorn 4229]

1 hour ago, Deej said:

I thought West Virginia's rival was the DEA?

Currently, West Virginia’s rival is fentanyl. And the Mountain State is down big. 

[royiv 9285]

7 hours ago, FartingDreamer said:

I get what you are saying. I have a great sense of humor (I nearly wet my pants to Orgazmo and the South Park episode making fun of Mormons)  To me it comes down to intent, but it can be hard to laugh at somebody intentionally mocking something I hold to be sacred and very personal in order to get at me and under my skin.  It just crosses a line as the intent is just completely different.  

How sacred can it be for a guy who doesn't even follow the teachings of his religion? You're a jack Mormon.

[Francisco 2.0 32389]

 

 

 

[closetohumping 17438]

So is getting Colorado and Arizona really scoreboard over the pac?

[Uncle Nate 2097]

6 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

So is getting Colorado and Arizona really scoreboard over the pac?

You really don’t get it, do you?

 

[royiv 9285]

5 hours ago, FartingDreamer said:

They don't expel anyone for being gay.  Gay or straight as long as you aren't having premarital sex you're fine.  

We've had and still do have LGBTQ faculty on staff and I've known some LGBTQ students while I attended BYU and none of them had any issues.  They were treated just like anyone else.  

What's wrong with getting laid?

[Francisco 2.0 32389]

 

 

[Texas Wahoo 3391]

 

 

Edited August 4, 2023 by Texas Wahoo

[billfromlaketravis 11456]

So if it’s the Four Corners, I assume everything is on the table? Friday night games, 930pm CST Saturday games, and whatever time slot they need the mountain time zone schools. 
 

It could work. And we probably won’t have a choice with the PAC on the Apple. I’m a junkie, but I’m not paying $100 a year to watch Stanford-Cal. 

[DFW Horn 6123]

1 hour ago, gatormarc said:

Just the Knights. 

They made a huge deal in the 90s about adding "Golden" and got pissed if anyone only called them the Knights.

Then they dropped it a decade later and are now pissed that people keep calling them "Golden" because it's harder to get someone to drop an adjective than add it.

It's rather funny.

Whatever...Golden Knights sound better to me

[notre dame joe 187]

4 hours ago, Jasper_Jester said:

That seems like they need a 2/3 or 3/4 majority according to Section 1.6 but it is a lot of words and I don't want to invest in figuring our which it is, 8/15 is less than both of those.

....Maybe that is FSU's fraud angle.

Something like "Lots of words, who could be expected to read all thet. Obvious intent to defraud!" Could work in a Florida court and you know it could.

We can that pleading legal conclusions.

 

It would be like a business plan made out of the 'Jump to Conclusions' mat in Office Space.

[FORTY NINE TO ZERO 2652]

I feel bad for wazzou and beavers

i miss early 2000s regional conferences before the acc ate big east… 

[gatormarc 911]

 

[Jasper_Jester 356]

6 minutes ago, gatormarc said:

 

First of all, that sounds like a win for them but, secondly, what about how it was so evil for the Big12 to not have even revenue sharing when the whole world wanted to steal those sweet University of Texas bucks?  But, third, how can Northwestern, Minnesota, Illinois, Indiana, and Rutgers make more than UO and that last long term?

Edited August 4, 2023 by Jasper_Jester

[Texas Wahoo 3391]

4 minutes ago, gatormarc said:

 

If this is a 5-6 year thing, you obviously take it for the life-raft.  If there is no guarantee of ever getting a full share, that's a much harder decision.  Competing in a conference with every other team making 30 million more than you for a long period of time is rough. 

[DanTheHorn 4922]

Did not see in the thread but the good news is Oregon will  save the PAC 12. He hedges his bets saying the PAC 12 could still die.

 

Edited August 4, 2023 by DanTheHorn

[Texas Wahoo 3391]

4 minutes ago, Texas Wahoo said:

If this is a 5-6 year thing, you obviously take it for the life-raft.  If there is no guarantee of ever getting a full share, that's a much harder decision.  Competing in a conference with every other team making 30 million more than you for a long period of time is rough. 

I just looked it up and apparently Rutgers is not getting a full share until 2027 - they joined in 2014...

[DFW Horn 6123]

6 minutes ago, Texas Wahoo said:

I just looked it up and apparently Rutgers is not getting a full share until 2027 - they joined in 2014...

Yeah, but it's Rutgers.

That's an AAC program that stuck their hands up the golden goose's ass when Delaney thought he could sell the B1G Network to NYC metro cable. Was he even successful? RU doesn't really deliver the market.

[Jasper_Jester 356]

4 minutes ago, Texas Wahoo said:

I just looked it up and apparently Rutgers is not getting a full share until 2027 - they joined in 2014...

Looks like Nebraska took 5 years to get a full share. The articles I found make it seem like USC and UCLA get full shares immediately. Its sports media, so who knows. 

[DFW Horn 6123]

1 minute ago, Jasper_Jester said:

Looks like Nebraska took 5 years to get a full share. The articles I found make it seem like USC and UCLA get full shares immediately. Its sports media, so who knows. 

Hard to believe USC and UCLA will be fully vested Day 1, but they actually deliver SoCal.

Maybe they're better negotiators than Corn?

[DanTheHorn 4922]

 

[Park Gothic 5018]

Is it over then?

[Francisco 2.0 32389]

7 minutes ago, DFW Horn said:

Hard to believe USC and UCLA will be fully vested Day 1, but they actually deliver SoCal.

Maybe they're better negotiators than Corn?

 

https://www.nj.com/rutgersfootball/2022/07/usc-ucla-will-receive-full-big-ten-revenue-share-before-rutgers-heres-why.html

 

Quote

In the midst of his Big Ten Media Day press conference Tuesday, Commissioner Kevin Warren dropped a nugget that turned some heads in Lincoln, College Park and Piscataway.

USC and UCLA, the newest members of the conference, will enter the league in 2024 as full members. That means immediate access to the full distribution of the revenue from an upcoming media rights deal that is expected to surpass $1 billion annually.

 

Quote

It is a departure from the precedent set by the league when it added Rutgers, Maryland and Nebraska under Warren’s predecessor Jim Delaney. Those three schools signed agreements that had them wait six years before earning a full share of the conference’s revenue.

Why did the California schools get treated differently?

 

Quote

“Every situation stands on its own merit and evaluating this circumstance with UCLA and USC, we felt it was prudent for them to come in as full members into the conference,” Warren told NJ Advance Media on Wednesday. “We evaluate everything on a case-by-case basis. On top of that, we have a lot of issues we are working through right now, but we are making sure we do everything we can to evaluate, as we go forward with all of our members, to make sure we address all the financial ramifications and impact and make sure we stay on the same page.”

 

 

Spoiler

There are some factors that contribute to the differing circumstances.

College football is in a state of flux, and the Big Ten needed to jump on the opportunity to add two historic programs or risk falling far behind the SEC -- which added Texas and Oklahoma last summer -- in the realignment arms race.

The Big Ten is also at the end of its current media rights deal; adding two huge brands in the second-largest media market in the country would be a huge boost to negotiations.

As Big Ten Network analyst and former Indiana head coach Gerry DiNardo put it when asked about the situation: It’s all about leverage, and UCLA and USC had a ton of it.

“Rutgers and Maryland did not have any leverage,” DiNardo told NJ Advance Media. “Nebraska, Coach Osborne thought Texas and Texas A&M were going to go to the Pac-12 and that Nebraska was not going to have a home. … That’s a lot different than USC and UCLA. You cut whatever deal you can. The Big Ten cut a deal with Rutgers, Nebraska and Maryland that benefitted both sides. I’m guessing UCLA and USC said ‘we’ll only come if we get a full share right away.’ Leverage.”

UCLA and USC will avoid the pitfalls that Rutgers and Maryland had to traverse in their transition to the Big Ten.

In order to remain competitive with the rest of the conference while awaiting its full membership, Rutgers took advances on its future distributions as well as a $38 million loan from the league; the Terrapins also took out loans from the league. As a result, Rutgers owed $48 million to the league as of 2020, while Maryland owed nearly $120.5 million, per The Athletic.

Rutgers is not going to receive a full share of its revenue distribution until 2027, according to a report commissioned by the school to College Sports Solutions that was released in 2019.

Warren said that ensuring every Big Ten member is “strong financially” is “top of mind.”

“Since I’ve come into the conference, I just want to make sure all our member institutions are strong financially,” Warren said. “I’m looking for ways to make sure everyone is treated in a financially-healthy manner.”

Head coach Greg Schiano, who was not at Rutgers when the Scarlet Knights entered the Big Ten, did not express concern over the differing treatment.

“Everything is based on what is the situation today,” Schiano said. “You can’t make decisions based on times that are eight years ago. What’s necessary and what’s needed? I ask this: Anybody can have an opinion, but how would we all like it if Rutgers wasn’t in the Big Ten? We’d be in a bad place, so I count my blessings every day.”

Maryland head coach Mike Locksley, who was also not at Maryland when the Terrapins entered the league, echoed a similar sentiment.

“I don’t worry about other people’s financials, man,” he said. “It’s none of my business what little Billy’s dad makes. You can’t go comparing yourself to little Billy and what he’s got. I’m happy to have them in the league. Would I like to be debt-free? Sure, but that was the landscape at that time. It’s a new day. I’m not really concerned about the financials from that standpoint.”

They both agreed with every other Big Ten coach who spoke this week in Indianapolis: USC and UCLA joining the conference is a positive, regardless of what it took to bring them in.

“I love the Big Ten,” Schiano said. “The reason I thought Rutgers belonged was because to me, it’s the last bastion of big-time, big-time football and great academics. Not good academics ... great. For us to be in it is a blessing. I’m exciting about the new members. People worry about the travel. I understand for other sports, but for us, it’s not a problem.”

 

[Sbbruin 21841]

10 minutes ago, DFW Horn said:

Hard to believe USC and UCLA will be fully vested Day 1, but they actually deliver SoCal.

Maybe they're better negotiators than Corn?

Bruins and Trojans indeed get full shares.  Those shares are collectively larger because of the SoCal market.

[DeadArmadillo 907]

11 hours ago, Frank Drebin said:

I know I don't wanna wait

[Chewbacca 7773]

Or maybe add Colorado State. Not a current P5 team so it might cause a $$ problem, but it stays in the Mountain time zone and there is a bit of nice symmetry with just having added Colorado. 
The big-12 could have an annual "Who's the big brother" weekend for the schools in Arizona, Kansas, Colorado, and Baylor/Houston/Tech/Tcu.

Fuck no on that.

[bullet 1596]

23 minutes ago, Jasper_Jester said:

Looks like Nebraska took 5 years to get a full share. The articles I found make it seem like USC and UCLA get full shares immediately. Its sports media, so who knows. 

Actually I think Rutgers is getting a full share now, but they took loans, so it will be a while before they pay it off.

[bullet 1596]

23 minutes ago, DFW Horn said:

Hard to believe USC and UCLA will be fully vested Day 1, but they actually deliver SoCal.

Maybe they're better negotiators than Corn?

Corn got screwed worse than anyone.  Rutgers still made a lot more than they would have in the AAC.  Nebraska made less than if they had stayed in the Big 12.  They got a minimum of the current Big 12 contract, but it was renegotiated for more than double.

[billfromlaketravis 11456]

58 minutes ago, gatormarc said:

 

So Fox/CBS/NBC are are willing to pay more to make Oregon a junior partner. 
 

Meanwhile, the SEC can’t get ESPN to pay for one fucking extra conference game. 

Edited August 4, 2023 by billfromlaketravis

[Neonmoon 38129]

4 hours ago, DanTheHorn said:

Mike was asked the question about permanent rivals if BIG 12 goes to a 6-3 schedule. Guy said Arizona State and................Utah just cuz everyone hates Utah right now and ........... crickets. So looking at the map who would be the permanent rivals. Even the Texas school don't have who they consider a rival.

Utah-BYU (Sinners & Saints)

ASU-UA (Desert Bowl)

TTU-OSU (Pew Pew Bowl)

CU-ISU (Flip Cup)

KSU-KU (Light Skirmish)

TCU-BU (Jesus Bowl)

Cincy-WVU (Trash Panda Fight)

UH-UCF (High School Duel)

 

 

[Lonestar88 4659]

Nebraska didn’t get a full share until their 7th year in the conference. Rutgers and Maryland didn’t get it until their 8th. USC and UCLA are getting full shares immediately. So that tells you how much the Big 10 wanted each school.

Washington and Oregon are desperate and have no leverage because they don’t really want to go to the Big 12 and the Big 10 is kind of lukewarm on them anyways. They aren’t going to get full shares for a while.