2022 Houston Rockets Offseason Thread - Lottery, Lottery, Lottery

[LCHorn 2639]

9 hours ago, Fud said:

Lack of foot speed makes him a poor matchup defensively against any perimeter player he switches onto, and he's not a rim protector so he's potentially a net negative playing at the five

Terrific offensive player though. Excellent passer. His offensive game at Duke was mostly iso and post-ups, so he probably needs some off the ball and pick and roll (both as the ball hander and screener), but those things are doable. He's not an NBA three point shooter yet, but his shot looks good and he projects to be a fine shooter from there

The way the NBA is going, your defense will get exposed against the contenders, and he'll have to work his ass off to be average there, and he'll have to be outstanding on offense to justify having him on the court in high leverage situations

Julius Randle is a popular comp for him right now, but I think he's a level higher offensively due to his passing/playmaking ability. Maybe think of him as more of a upper-middle class man's Chris Webber on offense 

I’m stealing this from elsewhere but he’s a regular season player, not a playoff’s type player.  He has a skillet that’ll rack up counting stats but can be negated by longer, better defensive players and simply doesn’t have the athleticism to grow into something else.  

[Fud 9560]

 

[Aqua Buddha 14653]

I've heard some of the analysis on Orlando.  They can't take a big because of Franz, Carter, and Bamba and they can't take a guard because of Suggs and Anthony.  If they have so many good players, why are they so bad?

If I were them, I'd look at trading down to the 3-6 range.  Get some players, future picks, and then pick Ivey or Sharpe.

[Fud 9560]

53 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

I've heard some of the analysis on Orlando.  They can't take a big because of Franz, Carter, and Bamba and they can't take a guard because of Suggs and Anthony.  If they have so many good players, why are they so bad?

If I were them, I'd look at trading down to the 3-6 range.  Get some players, future picks, and then pick Ivey or Sharpe.

I don’t think their current bigs will keep them from taking any of the top three 

[Aqua Buddha 14653]

6 minutes ago, Fud said:

I don’t think their current bigs will keep them from taking any of the top three 

Of the top three teams, none of them have bigs that will keep them from taking a big.  Thunder have 4 guards/wings who would be starters/rotation guys on a contender.  Players 5-12 are borderline NBA guys.

[billfromlaketravis 11601]

Not. Ideal. 
https://www.nba.com/news/2022-consensus-mock-draft?amp=1

[Aqua Buddha 14653]

10 hours ago, billfromlaketravis said:

Not. Ideal. 
https://www.nba.com/news/2022-consensus-mock-draft?amp=1

I'd agree with that.  Banchero seems to either suck at defense or not like playing and given Sam Presti's focus on defense, I'd say they'll take whoever Orlando doesn't, leaving Banchero to the Rockets.  I guess that leaves the Rockets with Sengun and Banchero on the floor at the same time, which could be awful.  I remember Presti passed on Sengun specially because of the defense.

Could be wrong, though.

[Fud 9560]

19 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

I'd agree with that.  Banchero seems to either suck at defense or not like playing and given Sam Presti's focus on defense, I'd say they'll take whoever Orlando doesn't, leaving Banchero to the Rockets.  I guess that leaves the Rockets with Sengun and Banchero on the floor at the same time, which could be awful.  I remember Presti passed on Sengun specially because of the defense.

Could be wrong, though.

I will say that OKC/Presti are a bit of a wildcard. Presti has made unexpected picks in the lotto in the past, isn't afraid to do so, and runs a tight ship 

[Aqua Buddha 14653]

31 minutes ago, Fud said:

I will say that OKC/Presti are a bit of a wildcard. Presti has made unexpected picks in the lotto in the past, isn't afraid to do so, and runs a tight ship 

Yeah, whatever rumors you hear out of them, I'd ignore them.  They're CIA level secret there, which is kind of impressive.

[Fud 9560]

25 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

Yeah, whatever rumors you hear out of them, I'd ignore them.  They're CIA level secret there, which is kind of impressive.

And on top of that, Presti evaluates outside of the box from time to time

[billfromlaketravis 11601]

I could Presti do some weird shit and draft Sharpe. Just a wild ass guess. 

[BigOrange1 6538]

i think that would be a lot more likely if he had the 3rd or 4th pick.  i doubt he passes on chet or jabari with the #2 pick.

if orlando likes banchero, maybe they'd take the #17 pick this year and milwaukee's pick next year to trade back to 3 from 1.

[HtownHorn 14916]

4 hours ago, billfromlaketravis said:

I could Presti do some weird shit and draft Sharpe. Just a wild ass guess. 

Absolutely he would. He's a horrible GM. He could think he would get Mark Williams at 12.

[billfromlaketravis 11601]

LeBron’s praise of Presti was strange and out of the blue. The guy doesn’t take a piss without an ulterior motive, so my guess is he wants to get Rich Paul a piece of the Thunder. 
 

LeBron would rather eat glass than play with rookies, and Presti loves draft picks more than his kids. 

 

Edited May 20, 2022 by billfromlaketravis

[Fud 9560]

12 hours ago, HtownHorn said:

Absolutely he would. He's a horrible GM. He could think he would get Mark Williams at 12.

He has one of the better draft track records in the NBA

[Fud 9560]

17 hours ago, billfromlaketravis said:

I could Presti do some weird shit and draft Sharpe. Just a wild ass guess. 

He measured in a little smaller than expected, so I'm thinking he likely remains in the 4-7 range 

https://www.nba.com/stats/draft/combine-anthro/

[HtownHorn 14916]

22 minutes ago, Fud said:

He has one of the better draft track records in the NBA

Which explains all his recent on court success leading to him drafting in the lottery. All those draft picks and still no star.

Edited May 20, 2022 by HtownHorn

[Fud 9560]

3 minutes ago, HtownHorn said:

Which explains all his recent on court success leading to him drafting in the lottery. All those draft picks and still no star.

I'm not going to argue about this one today. Feel free to believe that he's a shitty gm. It's your prerogative. 

[Aqua Buddha 14653]

1 hour ago, Fud said:

He measured in a little smaller than expected, so I'm thinking he likely remains in the 4-7 range 

https://www.nba.com/stats/draft/combine-anthro/

He’s only 6’4”?  Welp….

[Fud 9560]

Just now, Aqua Buddha said:

He’s only 6’4”?  Welp….

He does have a good wingspan, but I think to jump into the top three, he'd have needed to profile as more of a big wing than a big two-guard, since he's such an unknown 

[Murfdogg21 4481]

I’m starting to hope Chet is the player that falls because the smart people convinced me they shouldn’t take him at #1, but now it’s sort of in destiny’s hands (unless Stone takes some scrub that was universally projected in the #10-20 range). The Green-Sengun-Chet combo could be some good shit. 

[BigOrange1 6538]

would you do this trade? rockets trade #3 and christian wood to indiana for #6, #31 and next year's unprotected first round pick.  

you take someone like keegan murray at #6 and maybe use #31 to help you move up from 17 to get tari eason and role into next season with a lineup of:

kpj, jalen green, eason, murray, turner with guys like sengun, christopher, kj martin, and tate getting heavy minutes.  that team isn't gonna win a lot of games, but would be fun to watch develop and you give yourself another shot at lottery gold next year if indiana sucks again.

i don't know that i would do it, but i'd at least think about it.

[Fud 9560]

1 hour ago, BigOrange1 said:

would you do this trade? rockets trade #3 and christian wood to indiana for #6, #31 and next year's unprotected first round pick.  

you take someone like keegan murray at #6 and maybe use #31 to help you move up from 17 to get tari eason and role into next season with a lineup of:

kpj, jalen green, eason, murray, turner with guys like sengun, christopher, kj martin, and tate getting heavy minutes.  that team isn't gonna win a lot of games, but would be fun to watch develop and you give yourself another shot at lottery gold next year if indiana sucks again.

i don't know that i would do it, but i'd at least think about it.

Wood for their 2023, which is most likely in the teens with an outside chance to go into the top four, is fine. I would do that in isolation 

Is moving back from #3 to #6 for #31 worth it this year? I don’t think so, unless you just don’t like whoever is going to be at #3, and love someone like Murray, Mathurin, Sochan, etc 

Eason might be at #17, and if he’s not, I think someone else who’s more or less in the same tier will be there. I’d move up for Sochan, but he’s trending towards going pretty high now 

[HtownHorn 14916]

2 hours ago, Fud said:

Wood for their 2023, which is most likely in the teens with an outside chance to go into the top four, is fine. I would do that in isolation 

Is moving back from #3 to #6 for #31 worth it this year? I don’t think so, unless you just don’t like whoever is going to be at #3, and love someone like Murray, Mathurin, Sochan, etc 

Eason might be at #17, and if he’s not, I think someone else who’s more or less in the same tier will be there. I’d move up for Sochan, but he’s trending towards going pretty high now 

Banchero is just an awful fit for the Rockets and is duplication of Sengun. If Smith and Holmgren are gone, you have a trade ready to go. Sochan and Murray are much better fits with the current Rockets team, and I like Eason too.

Edited May 20, 2022 by HtownHorn

[UDontKnow 10502]

5 minutes ago, HtownHorn said:

Banchero is just an awful fit for the Rockets and is duplication of Sengun. If Smith and Holmgren are gone, you have a trade ready to go. Sochan and Murray are much better fits with the current Rockets team, and I like Eason too.

Sengun will become better defensively and was a decent defensive player in Turkey. I don't want Banchero because it appears he lacks the commitment to play defense. Hope Chet is gone because I'd rather some other team take on the project and risk that he is. I'm with you that that the Rockets should be ready for a trade at #3. Wish Jabari Smith would be available at #3, but he's probably going to #1 overall and if not #1, then definitely #2. I would love to be proven wrong.

[maninblack 7975]

I like the offer posted earlier for 1

[Wulaw Horn 19236]

4 hours ago, BigOrange1 said:

would you do this trade? rockets trade #3 and christian wood to indiana for #6, #31 and next year's unprotected first round pick.  

you take someone like keegan murray at #6 and maybe use #31 to help you move up from 17 to get tari eason and role into next season with a lineup of:

kpj, jalen green, eason, murray, turner with guys like sengun, christopher, kj martin, and tate getting heavy minutes.  that team isn't gonna win a lot of games, but would be fun to watch develop and you give yourself another shot at lottery gold next year if indiana sucks again.

i don't know that i would do it, but i'd at least think about it.

In a heart beat I’d do that. 

How about Sacramento- do they have anything we’d like, to move down from 3 to 4 (I want Ivey over Paolo anyway)?

What I’d really be all over though is trying to get Zion from NO. No idea what that would take, but if he wants out let’s make that happen. 

[Fud 9560]

24 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

In a heart beat I’d do that. 

How about Sacramento- do they have anything we’d like, to move down from 3 to 4 (I want Ivey over Paolo anyway)?

What I’d really be all over though is trying to get Zion from NO. No idea what that would take, but if he wants out let’s make that happen. 

Sacramento might be wanting to trade their pick for an impactful current player. Their owner is desperate to make the playoffs, even if it hurts their future. Wood is probably redundant with Sabonis, but they’d probably want Gordon 

Gordon should be in demand this offseason 

[Wulaw Horn 19236]

17 minutes ago, Fud said:

Sacramento might be wanting to trade their pick for an impactful current player. Their owner is desperate to make the playoffs, even if it hurts their future. Wood is probably redundant with Sabonis, but they’d probably want Gordon 

Gordon should be in demand this offseason 

Ok- how about Wood, Gordon and the third for the 4th and an unprotected in 26 or something. 

[Fud 9560]

12 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

Ok- how about Wood, Gordon and the third for the 4th and an unprotected in 26 or something. 

I think most likely Wood and Gordon get traded separately for a protected first for each 

[Wulaw Horn 19236]

53 minutes ago, Fud said:

I think most likely Wood and Gordon get traded separately for a protected first for each 

Yeah. Feels like it would be awesome to get an unprotected Sacto pick. 

[HtownHorn 14916]

Couple of interesting ideas from NBA rumors. I'd do either deal, but Toronto would likely not do either one.

Indiana Pacers Receive: G John Wall, 2023 First-Round Pick (MIL), 2024 First-Round Pick (BKN)
Toronto Raptors Receive: C Myles Turner, G Buddy Hield
Houston Rockets Receive: F Pascal Siakam

or

Toronto Raptors Receive: C Christian Wood, G Eric Gordon, 2023 First-Round Pick (MIL), 2024 First-Round Pick (BKN)
Houston Rockets Receive: F Pascal Siakam

 

The rationale would be to get Toronto a starting level C, while allowing Barnes to become the primary playmaking wing for Toronto. Rockets would be giving up draft capital, but getting rid of salary and gaining Siakam would be well worth it.

 

[Fud 9560]

I prefer the slow build right now given how brutal the west is going to be for the next few years. Keep adding guys through the draft who can grow with Green with an eye towards making the playoffs in three years or so 

[UDontKnow 10502]

3 hours ago, Fud said:

I think most likely Wood and Gordon get traded separately for a protected first for each 

Hopefully Gordon can be dealt to a contender after his years of service to the Rockets. 

2 hours ago, HtownHorn said:

Couple of interesting ideas from NBA rumors. I'd do either deal, but Toronto would likely not do either one.

Indiana Pacers Receive: G John Wall, 2023 First-Round Pick (MIL), 2024 First-Round Pick (BKN)
Toronto Raptors Receive: C Myles Turner, G Buddy Hield
Houston Rockets Receive: F Pascal Siakam

or

Toronto Raptors Receive: C Christian Wood, G Eric Gordon, 2023 First-Round Pick (MIL), 2024 First-Round Pick (BKN)
Houston Rockets Receive: F Pascal Siakam

 

The rationale would be to get Toronto a starting level C, while allowing Barnes to become the primary playmaking wing for Toronto. Rockets would be giving up draft capital, but getting rid of salary and gaining Siakam would be well worth it.

 

That is a lot to give up for Spicy P and nothing else in return. He had a great season, but he's 28 and maybe in his prime with this club still not close to being a playoff contender. 

1 hour ago, Fud said:

I prefer the slow build right now given how brutal the west is going to be for the next few years. Keep adding guys through the draft who can grow with Green with an eye towards making the playoffs in three years or so 

The Rockets need to make the playoffs in the 2023-2024 season, otherwise Silas needs to be shown the door (in the event he's still here).

[HtownHorn 14916]

12 hours ago, Fud said:

I prefer the slow build right now given how brutal the west is going to be for the next few years. Keep adding guys through the draft who can grow with Green with an eye towards making the playoffs in three years or so 

Well the other big trade idea I saw was giving NO #3 for Williamson. I'd rather take Banchero than a guy that is eating his way out of the NBA.

[Fud 9560]

1 hour ago, HtownHorn said:

Well the other big trade idea I saw was giving NO #3 for Williamson. I'd rather take Banchero than a guy that is eating his way out of the NBA.

Yeah I’m out on trading for Zion too

[Rockethorn1978 6153]

I don’t want to trade for anyone else. I want draft picks for Gordon and wood. Build through the draft then use your picks down the road when you have a great roster and want to add a possible superstar and need 1st rounders to get it done. 

[Aqua Buddha 14653]

Supposedly, Okie City is very active with the #12 pick to move up.  Houston's #3 is prolly too high for that along with whatever else they'd offer up but still.....

Maybe a pick swap between the two with Dort and future 1st's or something.

Highly, highly doubt it.

 

[Aqua Buddha 14653]

Spin the wheel of fantasy trades.  Okie City figures out they want Banchero and pick swaps with Houston at 2/3 for a player, future picks, or something.  Then they take #12 and package that with something to move up to Portland or Sacramento's pick and take Murray, Sharpe, Ivey, or somebody.  

Yeah, that's it.

[HtownHorn 14916]

I wonder if the Knicks would be interested in #3 for Tobin, Robinson, and #11. We could send back another player or 2, like Tate and/or Nwaba. 

[Slacks 6917]

On 5/18/2022 at 4:53 PM, TonyTexas said:

If they were picking 4 or 5 then maybe. Given their needs and with one of the 3 bigs available, I’d be absolutely shocked. 

Take Ivey at 3 and Williams at 17.  Word.

[billfromlaketravis 11601]

So if Ivey is the pick, KPJ has to move small forward right? Would he be open to move?

[billfromlaketravis 11601]

On 5/21/2022 at 9:59 AM, Fud said:

Yeah I’m out on trading for Zion too

The Zion situation sucks. I loved watching him play at Duke and his rookie season with the Pelicans. Not sure why he isn’t more motivated to play to get the second supermax contract. 

[HtownHorn 14916]

1 hour ago, billfromlaketravis said:

So if Ivey is the pick, KPJ has to move small forward right? Would he be open to move?

If he isn't then don't extend him. He's not good enough at PG, to keep him there over others. This is a big season for him, he needs to show he can be a serious part of the future.

[HtownHorn 14916]

16 minutes ago, longhornmatt said:

Who cares about anyone on the roster except Green? Take the best player available.  Why anyone would let Sengun scare them off Banchero, or KPJ scare them off Ivey, etc., just baffles me.   Your future is Green and the guy they pick this year, not any of these other scrubs.  They’re all irrelevant to the long term plan.

Sengun isn't a scrub.

[Murfdogg21 4481]

36 minutes ago, longhornmatt said:

Who cares about anyone on the roster except Green? Take the best player available.  Why anyone would let Sengun scare them off Banchero, or KPJ scare them off Ivey, etc., just baffles me.   Your future is Green and the guy they pick this year, not any of these other scrubs.  They’re all irrelevant to the long term plan.

I think Sengun will be part of the core, but agree on the sentiment. Take the best player left on the board. There have been championships built on the two best players being bigs (not so much recently) or two guards. This isn’t building out a fantasy roster. I’d take Ivey if they are convinced that the Chet is too big of an injury risk or won’t translate with NBA-level competition, or if Banchero really sucks that bad at defense and has no hope of improving upon his 18 year old self.

I wish they would trade KPJ yesterday or whenever he is at peak value. They might have missed their window to get first rounders for either Wood or Gordon, and will probably take some junk for them from a contender wanting them and their expiring contracts. 

[Fud 9560]

They’ll get a first for each of Gordon and Wood. It’s just a matter of how protected the picks are, and which year they are  

You should draft best player available, within reason. The biggest tissue is all of these guys have warts. Banchero might legitimately suck on defense, and Ivey has zero midrange game, is a questionable playmaker, and he’s a two-guard with combo guard potential if he develops when you already have Green; you’re potentially going to run into the issue that Portland had (and Utah had this year) with the team being build around two guards (nobody is winning championships that way)

If you’re sold on Banchero, take him and trade Sengun either this year or next. I don’t think the two can really play together, and having both just hampers their development

Not sure what to do with KJP at this point. I guess just kick the can down the road with him for another year 

Hopefully LAL pulls the trigger on throwing a first in for the Westbrook for Wall trade, and then we could tell Westbrook to fuck off unless he’s interested in a buy-out 

[Murfdogg21 4481]

8 hours ago, Fud said:

Hopefully LAL pulls the trigger on throwing a first in for the Westbrook for Wall trade, and then we could tell Westbrook to fuck off unless he’s interested in a buy-out 

Does the media watch less basketball than the average non-Comcast subscribing Rockets fan? Westbrook was broke by the time he was here, but the narrative was that he was max level guy. Morey got robbed having to give up  picks and pick trades for the worse player. Wall was busted, but at least we picked up a first that contributed to getting Sengun. Why would anyone think Wall is healthy and still in shape enough to contribute in a meaningful way to the Lebron Lakers? I’m all for the trade if LA is dumb enough to do it. Then immediately try to reach a buyout agreement with Westbrick.  

[Fud 9560]

9 minutes ago, Murfdogg21 said:

Does the media watch less basketball than the average non-Comcast subscribing Rockets fan? Westbrook was broke by the time he was here, but the narrative was that he was max level guy. Morey got robbed having to give up  picks and pick trades for the worse player. Wall was busted, but at least we picked up a first that contributed to getting Sengun. Why would anyone think Wall is healthy and still in shape enough to contribute in a meaningful way to the Lebron Lakers? I’m all for the trade if LA is dumb enough to do it. Then immediately try to reach a buyout agreement with Westbrick.  

Regarding Wall and Westbrook, I think there's a very limited market for Westbrook at this point both due to teams not dying to have the player himself but also his contract being tough to move, and Wall is one of the few contracts you can easily move him for without having to make a creative deal. Isn't Wall mostly not playing at this point because he doesn't want to come off the bench, and Houston would prefer others to get those minutes anyway? In any event, it shouldn't be difficult for the LAL to figure out if Wall is healthy and in shape considering he's a Klutch guy 

[Murfdogg21 4481]

I doubt Lebron/Klutch cares about a 2027 first round pick when he plans to be out of there in a year.