Dear Texas, we need to have a conversation about Louie Gohmert

[RDCanecutter 26282]

12 hours ago, Hornius Emeritus said:

Gohmert advocating violence is really funny for this reason: my girlfriend could beat him up. I'm serious. She's a 60 year old kickboxer and I have no doubt that she could beat the crap out of Louie. She kinds of wants to, too. 

I don't believe you. Here's 50 cents says Louie can beat your girl. What? She knocked him out? Oh no. I lost all that money.

[TwiceHorn 31283]

1 hour ago, pyrohornIII said:

A lot of our rural areas have become deserts. Economic deserts, dotted here and there with Buccee's oases living off those who travel through.  It's like a slow burn into  Mad Max.  Maybe the apocalypse has already happened, no one said it had to be nuclear and instantaneous.   Could be like what we are doing to our climate, a slow death, like that pot of boiling frogs.  

You are right, there are less opportunities, less hope, more meth and booze.  The smart ones do get out, leaving two types, those who live on inherited acreage, or those too dumb or afraid to leave.   

The American Gothic and Norman Rockwell are losing their sheen.  

Can we change that?  I think we can.  How, I am not certain, but I do know it will not be an overnight thing.  But it needs to start somewhere.  

Yes.  What I meant to say or make clear, too, is that our societal elevation of the rural farm folk have kept them from seeing themselves as what they are and that is not very much different from the poors in the city or anywhere else.  So they see themselves as good conservative bootstrappers that have been fucked over by elites and new world order types, and implicitly or explicitly, the browns.

[Fudge Nuggets 19151]

1 hour ago, Mrs Whiggins said:

You can see that, but seems like a large number of folks can't or won't or think it works just fine...

They see it clear as day, but it’s all that God damn Pelosi’s fault.

[hayden_horn 11360]

4 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Yes.  What I meant to say or make clear, too, is that our societal elevation of the rural farm folk have kept them from seeing themselves as what they are and that is not very much different from the poors in the city or anywhere else.  So they see themselves as good conservative bootstrappers that have been fucked over by elites and new world order types, and implicitly or explicitly, the browns.

i wanted to quote so much of this conversation, but i'll just start here.

the rural people in this country have been fucking betrayed by leadership, and they are rightly pissed about it. this has largely manifested the donald trumps and louie gohmerts of this country.

look, the fact that we cannot get basic fucking infrastructure out to the country is a major problem. broadband should be a fucking utility, not a luxury. my mom has lived out in east texas off highway 80 for the last decade or so, and she still relies on fucking hughesnet, which is fucking terrible. worse than dialup.

the nordic countries got broadband (fiber, mind you) out into their hinterlands fucking 15 years ago, because they merged utility with broadband. the fact that this has not happened here has resulted into people with directv or dish, and that's their info. they tune into whatever channel they like, most likely fox, and they gorge upon that content. 

this country has done a massive, intentional disservice to people living in the country. people have been talking about broadband to the rural communities for years, but precious little has been done. only visionaries, many in utility, have been able to make use of government grants which are woefully small. this should be a priority, but it is not. 

to finish off your thought, twice, you are right but also wrong. i'll hearken to an old movie my dad showed me and i showed my son: sergeant york. our country is made up of simple, hard working country folks. i have many in my family, though life has kind of passed them by. but if you look around texas, the farmer has given way to the roughneck oil dudes. the ranchers are still here, but mostly wealthy. and nobody from the democratic party is doing anything to appeal to them, and, given my travels through east and west texas, they have a lot of general anger. they feel betrayed by everyone, and so the fuck what, i'll vote for donald trump. 

there is a reason that middle america is red. they are pissed off. nobody does anything for them, and they have been fooled into thinking that maybe republicans do. one day that veneer will wear off, but i don't think that day is as soon as i hope. pissed off voters are so much more effective than content ones. and that's a big part of the urban/rural divide. and i think republicans have a lot of blame in that, intentionally so, because they understand the value of pissed off people. 

[pyrohornIII 4809]

25 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

i wanted to quote so much of this conversation, but i'll just start here.

the rural people in this country have been fucking betrayed by leadership, and they are rightly pissed about it. this has largely manifested the donald trumps and louie gohmerts of this country.

look, the fact that we cannot get basic fucking infrastructure out to the country is a major problem. broadband should be a fucking utility, not a luxury. my mom has lived out in east texas off highway 80 for the last decade or so, and she still relies on fucking hughesnet, which is fucking terrible. worse than dialup.

the nordic countries got broadband (fiber, mind you) out into their hinterlands fucking 15 years ago, because they merged utility with broadband. the fact that this has not happened here has resulted into people with directv or dish, and that's their info. they tune into whatever channel they like, most likely fox, and they gorge upon that content. 

this country has done a massive, intentional disservice to people living in the country. people have been talking about broadband to the rural communities for years, but precious little has been done. only visionaries, many in utility, have been able to make use of government grants which are woefully small. this should be a priority, but it is not. 

to finish off your thought, twice, you are right but also wrong. i'll hearken to an old movie my dad showed me and i showed my son: sergeant york. our country is made up of simple, hard working country folks. i have many in my family, though life has kind of passed them by. but if you look around texas, the farmer has given way to the roughneck oil dudes. the ranchers are still here, but mostly wealthy. and nobody from the democratic party is doing anything to appeal to them, and, given my travels through east and west texas, they have a lot of general anger. they feel betrayed by everyone, and so the fuck what, i'll vote for donald trump. 

there is a reason that middle america is red. they are pissed off. nobody does anything for them, and they have been fooled into thinking that maybe republicans do. one day that veneer will wear off, but i don't think that day is as soon as i hope. pissed off voters are so much more effective than content ones. and that's a big part of the urban/rural divide. and i think republicans have a lot of blame in that, intentionally so, because they understand the value of pissed off people. 

That's pretty much what that second article says.   But it gets more into some explicit examples.  

[pyrohornIII 4809]

13 hours ago, Hornius Emeritus said:

Gohmert advocating violence is really funny for this reason: my girlfriend could beat him up. I'm serious. She's a 60 year old kickboxer and I have no doubt that she could beat the crap out of Louie. She kinds of wants to, too. 

I think you should start a PAC for rural broadband, and ask her to do PPV matches with these pasty white Trumpists in office.   Love to see Gaetz, Jordan or Crenshaw put down by her.  

[Ten Bears 2479]

I used to want to beat the crap out of Louie.  

I still do, but I used to too.

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4968]

22 hours ago, pyrohornIII said:

You are right.  They resent being talked down to, and made promises no one keeps.  Beto tapped into this, and really exposed how left out the rural area has been.  The local papers are filled with State and US level Republican columns.  That's where a lot of them get their news.  They read the Concho Star to see if there's a picture of there boy and his prize heifer, or running a football.   There is no other significant news feed other than local and FOX.   

Covid made most of those counties Zoom into counties for candidates, instead of simply drive through.  But cell phones don't work in many rural parts, much less Zoom.  That is also a weakness for distance learning.

Pushing for high speed broadband would be a good start.

If there is on thing Beto did, it was confirm that there is no value in private property ownership, because the government could just decide what you've done with it is too ugly and they need to take it from you and sell it to their buddies who will then make a killing off of its development. But you'll get a few pennies to keep you warm at night. 

[NotActuallyALonghorn 4968]

8 hours ago, hayden_horn said:

i wanted to quote so much of this conversation, but i'll just start here.

the rural people in this country have been fucking betrayed by leadership, and they are rightly pissed about it. this has largely manifested the donald trumps and louie gohmerts of this country.

look, the fact that we cannot get basic fucking infrastructure out to the country is a major problem. broadband should be a fucking utility, not a luxury. my mom has lived out in east texas off highway 80 for the last decade or so, and she still relies on fucking hughesnet, which is fucking terrible. worse than dialup.

the nordic countries got broadband (fiber, mind you) out into their hinterlands fucking 15 years ago, because they merged utility with broadband. the fact that this has not happened here has resulted into people with directv or dish, and that's their info. they tune into whatever channel they like, most likely fox, and they gorge upon that content. 

this country has done a massive, intentional disservice to people living in the country. people have been talking about broadband to the rural communities for years, but precious little has been done. only visionaries, many in utility, have been able to make use of government grants which are woefully small. this should be a priority, but it is not. 

to finish off your thought, twice, you are right but also wrong. i'll hearken to an old movie my dad showed me and i showed my son: sergeant york. our country is made up of simple, hard working country folks. i have many in my family, though life has kind of passed them by. but if you look around texas, the farmer has given way to the roughneck oil dudes. the ranchers are still here, but mostly wealthy. and nobody from the democratic party is doing anything to appeal to them, and, given my travels through east and west texas, they have a lot of general anger. they feel betrayed by everyone, and so the fuck what, i'll vote for donald trump. 

there is a reason that middle america is red. they are pissed off. nobody does anything for them, and they have been fooled into thinking that maybe republicans do. one day that veneer will wear off, but i don't think that day is as soon as i hope. pissed off voters are so much more effective than content ones. and that's a big part of the urban/rural divide. and i think republicans have a lot of blame in that, intentionally so, because they understand the value of pissed off people. 

Lots of truth here. If the Democrats just allowed their candidates to adjust to their constituents and actually advocate for issues that might be in conflict with issues for their more urban members then I think we would see much better results.

[pyrohornIII 4809]

42 minutes ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

If there is on thing Beto did, it was confirm that there is no value in private property ownership, because the government could just decide what you've done with it is too ugly and they need to take it from you and sell it to their buddies who will then make a killing off of its development. But you'll get a few pennies to keep you warm at night. 

That has nothing to do with what I was referring to.  But go on, grind your ax.   My jury on Beto is still out.

[Mdhorn 5911]

2 hours ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

Lots of truth here. If the Democrats just allowed their candidates to adjust to their constituents and actually advocate for issues that might be in conflict with issues for their more urban members then I think we would see much better results.

Dems definitely need to work on messaging.  But it has to appeal to a lot of different groups of people which requires a lot of different voices.  It's complicated.  

[wildcat09 29258]

15 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Yes.  What I meant to say or make clear, too, is that our societal elevation of the rural farm folk have kept them from seeing themselves as what they are and that is not very much different from the poors in the city or anywhere else.  So they see themselves as good conservative bootstrappers that have been fucked over by elites and new world order types, and implicitly or explicitly, the browns.

Meanwhile:

 

[NameAlreadyInUse 5106]

21 hours ago, pyrohornIII said:

That thing about chains.  I grew up in a town that had a great mom and pop burger place.   Then whataburger came in and for a while everybody went there,  even though (sacrilege, i know) the burgers at WB weren't near as good.  Power of advertising, I guess.  Look!  We made the big time, we have a WB!  Now it's a Dollar General.

Additional drains on those small town coffers by tax abatements granted to Walmart, which means that loss in revenue must be made up by the small business owners Walmart is competing with.  Small business owner has to raise prices to stay afloat.  Walmart wins, little guys shut down, town loses.

Also counties are overpowered legally by large corps (mining, power generation, etc) who keep challenging their property tax valuations.  Huge scam.  The state should have a commission on evaluating and setting said values statewide.

Who am I kidding?  Right?

 

You just described why I will not shop at Walmart.  Walmart came to my hometown when I was in high school.  Within a year, the entire downtown district was boarded up except a jewelry store and a mexican restaurant.  The hardware store, the clothing stores, the office supply store, all out of business.  

Walmart picked up their money and deposited it in the local bank every day and it would sit there for 15-30 minutes before it got auto-wired out to Bentonville, so even the local bank didn't get an opportunity to earn anything off that money.  

Oh, and eventually the Walmart decided that decimating the local business of the town was a-ok, but they weren't making enough money on that store anymore so they shut down operations.  Now my hometown has no Walmart and no mom and pop stores either.  On the bright side, it's only a 40 minute drive to Lubbock to actually do some shopping.

[TwiceHorn 31283]

20 hours ago, hayden_horn said:

i wanted to quote so much of this conversation, but i'll just start here.

the rural people in this country have been fucking betrayed by leadership, and they are rightly pissed about it. this has largely manifested the donald trumps and louie gohmerts of this country.

look, the fact that we cannot get basic fucking infrastructure out to the country is a major problem. broadband should be a fucking utility, not a luxury. my mom has lived out in east texas off highway 80 for the last decade or so, and she still relies on fucking hughesnet, which is fucking terrible. worse than dialup.

the nordic countries got broadband (fiber, mind you) out into their hinterlands fucking 15 years ago, because they merged utility with broadband. the fact that this has not happened here has resulted into people with directv or dish, and that's their info. they tune into whatever channel they like, most likely fox, and they gorge upon that content. 

this country has done a massive, intentional disservice to people living in the country. people have been talking about broadband to the rural communities for years, but precious little has been done. only visionaries, many in utility, have been able to make use of government grants which are woefully small. this should be a priority, but it is not. 

to finish off your thought, twice, you are right but also wrong. i'll hearken to an old movie my dad showed me and i showed my son: sergeant york. our country is made up of simple, hard working country folks. i have many in my family, though life has kind of passed them by. but if you look around texas, the farmer has given way to the roughneck oil dudes. the ranchers are still here, but mostly wealthy. and nobody from the democratic party is doing anything to appeal to them, and, given my travels through east and west texas, they have a lot of general anger. they feel betrayed by everyone, and so the fuck what, i'll vote for donald trump. 

there is a reason that middle america is red. they are pissed off. nobody does anything for them, and they have been fooled into thinking that maybe republicans do. one day that veneer will wear off, but i don't think that day is as soon as i hope. pissed off voters are so much more effective than content ones. and that's a big part of the urban/rural divide. and i think republicans have a lot of blame in that, intentionally so, because they understand the value of pissed off people. 

Yeah, good point.  The rural poor have indeed been fucked over, but it's not by the people they think.  It's the corporatists, from big ag, to walmart, to telcos.

But D messaging to the rural poors has been really bad ("deplorables,"  "guns and religion") and left them wide open to Trump.

But I also submit that the false reverence that America has held agricultural people in for decades creates an artificial arrogance that won't let that set of poors see who is actually balls deep in them.

[TwiceHorn 31283]

12 minutes ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

You just described why I will not shop at Walmart.  Walmart came to my hometown when I was in high school.  Within a year, the entire downtown district was boarded up except a jewelry store and a mexican restaurant.  The hardware store, the clothing stores, the office supply store, all out of business.  

Walmart picked up their money and deposited it in the local bank every day and it would sit there for 15-30 minutes before it got auto-wired out to Bentonville, so even the local bank didn't get an opportunity to earn anything off that money.  

Oh, and eventually the Walmart decided that decimating the local business of the town was a-ok, but they weren't making enough money on that store anymore so they shut down operations.  Now my hometown has no Walmart and no mom and pop stores either.  On the bright side, it's only a 40 minute drive to Lubbock to actually do some shopping.

This is a problem that dates back to A&P, who was a favorite target of the anti-trusters for accomplishing similar things.

It's a bit of a dilemma, because the big box stores do deliver better prices and selection than the moms and pops.

You could at least theoretically hang Walmart and the old A&P up on antitrust, but it would be after the fact and would not save the mom & pops.  I don't know what kind of prospective regulatory solution would work.

Something that creates or enforces a "corporate conscience" seems to be the best bet.

[safe sex 11684]

2 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Something that creates or enforces a "corporate conscience" seems to be the best bet.

Funny concept.

[wildcat09 29258]

9 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

This is a problem that dates back to A&P, who was a favorite target of the anti-trusters for accomplishing similar things.

It's a bit of a dilemma, because the big box stores do deliver better prices and selection than the moms and pops.

You could at least theoretically hang Walmart and the old A&P up on antitrust, but it would be after the fact and would not save the mom & pops.  I don't know what kind of prospective regulatory solution would work.

Something that creates or enforces a "corporate conscience" seems to be the best bet.

Careful with talk like that. Before you know it, one of the DT posters will storm in here saying a corporation's only duty is to its shareholders and that's the way it has to be because that's the way it's always been.

[Mrs Whiggins 13049]

They keep closing grocery stores and creating food deserts and 'eat the rich' may come sooner rather than later.

[NameAlreadyInUse 5106]

1 hour ago, TwiceHorn said:

 

Something that creates or enforces a "corporate conscience" seems to be the best bet.

Well in order for them to have a conscience they'd have to be considered people.  Oh wait.

[Guest Lobo]

1 hour ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

You just described why I will not shop at Walmart.  Walmart came to my hometown when I was in high school.  Within a year, the entire downtown district was boarded up except a jewelry store and a mexican restaurant.  The hardware store, the clothing stores, the office supply store, all out of business.  

Walmart picked up their money and deposited it in the local bank every day and it would sit there for 15-30 minutes before it got auto-wired out to Bentonville, so even the local bank didn't get an opportunity to earn anything off that money.  

Oh, and eventually the Walmart decided that decimating the local business of the town was a-ok, but they weren't making enough money on that store anymore so they shut down operations.  Now my hometown has no Walmart and no mom and pop stores either.  On the bright side, it's only a 40 minute drive to Lubbock to actually do some shopping.

I don't know what was more depressing about your story what Wal-Mart did to your town, or that 'the bright side' to you is driving 40 minutes to get to Lubbock to 'do some shopping.'    

I think we all discussed this story a couple years ago about the proliferations of Wal-Mart is no longer the threat it once was, probably because of e-commerce/online retail to some extent, The exodus from rural areas, etc.  But that the real bad sign now for a community is when a Dollar Store comes into town (General, Dollar Tree, Family Dollar, Alco, et. al.).  They tend to wreak just as much havoc as Wal-Mart with even less economic benefit.  They drive local merchants out of business all the same but at least Wal-Mart offers optometry, 'banking' services, an improving grocery selection of 'fresher' options, and offers a handful of decent paying jobs in management.  Not the case at all with the Dollar Stores.  https://www.fastcompany.com/90278384/why-dollar-stores-are-bad-business-for-the-neighborhoods-they-open-in

Speaking of Wal-Mart, I'd be curious to see...statistically speaking some Surly poster out near the Woodlands either works for Woodforest Banks or knows well someone who does.  Their growth inside Wal-Mart stores has slowed dramatically.  In-store banking is no longer the convenience it once was with the expanse of mobile banking (particularly during Covid-19 when the idea of in-person banking went from inconvenient to just fucking dumb).  Our bank has taken a lot of cues from Woodforest on what not to do.  And they keep everything they are doing very close to the vest as a private OCC bank, but I'd be curious what their vision is for the next ten years as branch-banking, even inside where you shop, gets less and less viable.  And as Wal-Mart's growth in many markets is reaching peak capacity. 

Also, Gohmert seems like a dick.  

 

[pyrohornIII 4809]

4 hours ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

You just described why I will not shop at Walmart.  Walmart came to my hometown when I was in high school.  Within a year, the entire downtown district was boarded up except a jewelry store and a mexican restaurant.  The hardware store, the clothing stores, the office supply store, all out of business.  

Walmart picked up their money and deposited it in the local bank every day and it would sit there for 15-30 minutes before it got auto-wired out to Bentonville, so even the local bank didn't get an opportunity to earn anything off that money.  

Oh, and eventually the Walmart decided that decimating the local business of the town was a-ok, but they weren't making enough money on that store anymore so they shut down operations.  Now my hometown has no Walmart and no mom and pop stores either.  On the bright side, it's only a 40 minute drive to Lubbock to actually do some shopping.

This is a good read on Walmart.  Your probably already have it.  

https://www.amazon.com/How-Walmart-Destroying-America-World/dp/1580086683

2 hours ago, Lobo said:

I don't know what was more depressing about your story what Wal-Mart did to your town, or that 'the bright side' to you is driving 40 minutes to get to Lubbock to 'do some shopping.'    

I think we all discussed this story a couple years ago about the proliferations of Wal-Mart is no longer the threat it once was, probably because of e-commerce/online retail to some extent, The exodus from rural areas, etc.  But that the real bad sign now for a community is when a Dollar Store comes into town (General, Dollar Tree, Family Dollar, Alco, et. al.).  They tend to wreak just as much havoc as Wal-Mart with even less economic benefit.  They drive local merchants out of business all the same but at least Wal-Mart offers optometry, 'banking' services, an improving grocery selection of 'fresher' options, and offers a handful of decent paying jobs in management.  Not the case at all with the Dollar Stores.  https://www.fastcompany.com/90278384/why-dollar-stores-are-bad-business-for-the-neighborhoods-they-open-in

Speaking of Wal-Mart, I'd be curious to see...statistically speaking some Surly poster out near the Woodlands either works for Woodforest Banks or knows well someone who does.  Their growth inside Wal-Mart stores has slowed dramatically.  In-store banking is no longer the convenience it once was with the expanse of mobile banking (particularly during Covid-19 when the idea of in-person banking went from inconvenient to just fucking dumb).  Our bank has taken a lot of cues from Woodforest on what not to do.  And they keep everything they are doing very close to the vest as a private OCC bank, but I'd be curious what their vision is for the next ten years as branch-banking, even inside where you shop, gets less and less viable.  And as Wal-Mart's growth in many markets is reaching peak capacity. 

Also, Gohmert seems like a dick.  

 

I'm pretty sure he was being facetious about that 40 miles.    I detest Dollar Generals too, but I will shop there faster than the convenience gas stations out here in the sticks.   They come in handy when the closest grocery store is 30 miles away, and you need a bag of sugar or gallon of milk.   Like you said the drawback is no fresh food or meat.   People then eat more processed stuff and junk.  Not good.  

Also, Gohmert is a dick.

 

4 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

This is a problem that dates back to A&P, who was a favorite target of the anti-trusters for accomplishing similar things.

It's a bit of a dilemma, because the big box stores do deliver better prices and selection than the moms and pops.

You could at least theoretically hang Walmart and the old A&P up on antitrust, but it would be after the fact and would not save the mom & pops.  I don't know what kind of prospective regulatory solution would work.

Something that creates or enforces a "corporate conscience" seems to be the best bet.

Sears and Roebuck was the new way to buy, put everything under one roof.   Look at the catalog, order and wait for it to be dropped at your door.  Others like Montgomery Wards followed.

Walmart took it's place.  

Now Amazon is taking Walmart's place, Covid assisted.  Just a different catalogue.  

I used to live in Huntsville 30 years ago.  I wanted a waffle iron and went looking. There were no mercantiles around, the only place in a town of 45K was Walmart, and they had one model.  No variety.  And once they corner a market, their price and selection goes out the window.  Though online shopping tends to give them competition.  Now at least Target and some of the larger grocers are challenging for some of those items.  

I think we need some sort of government program to help revitalize local small businesses.  Help people set up and run hydroponic farms, or free range meat.  Processing plants and truck farming.  My grandfather every year sold sweet corn from his moderate size garden to Baenziger's.   That's been regulated to death.  

I'm not talking little arts and crafts shops, antique shops or 2nd hand resales.  Small local hamburger joints to compete with the chains.  We see it now with a proliferation of food trailers/trucks.   Businesses again.  But people have not run their own businesses for years, if ever.  Give them education on budgeting, start up, marketing, employment law, taxes, etc.   SBA used to have a program like that, a small business mentoring program.  Would be even easier now with online capacity...if we had reliable broadband.  Drat.

I'm just saying put some money back into the places they have been draining for years.   Take it back from Bezos and the billionaires and trickle it down for them, since they don't seem to be able to figure out  how to do anything with money but make more for themselves.  

Edited January 4, 2021 by pyrohornIII
added link

[PenelopeWitherspoon 19093]

4 minutes ago, pyrohornIII said:

This is a good read on Walmart.  Your probably already have it.  

https://www.amazon.com/How-Walmart-Destroying-America-World/dp/1580086683

I'm pretty sure he was being facetious about that 40 miles.    I detest Dollar Generals too, but I will shop there faster than the convenience gas stations out here in the sticks.   They come in handy when the closest grocery store is 30 miles away, and you need a bag of sugar or gallon of milk.   Like you said the drawback is no fresh food or meat.   People then eat more processed stuff and junk.  Not good.  

Also, Gohmert is a dick.

 

Sears and Roebuck was the new way to buy, put everything under one roof.   Look at the catalog, order and wait for it to be dropped at your door.  Others like Montgomery Wards followed.

Walmart took it's place.  

Now Amazon is taking Walmart's place, Covid assisted.  Just a different catalogue.  

I used to live in Huntsville 30 years ago.  I wanted a waffle iron and went looking. There were no mercantiles around, the only place in a town of 45K was Walmart, and they had one model.  No variety.  And once they corner a market, their price and selection goes out the window.  Though online shopping tends to give them competition.  Now at least Target and some of the larger grocers are challenging for some of those items.  

I think we need some sort of government program to help revitalize local small businesses.  Help people set up and run hydroponic farms, or free range meat.  Processing plants and truck farming.  My grandfather every year sold sweet corn from his moderate size garden to Baenziger's.   That's been regulated to death.  

I'm not talking little arts and crafts shops, antique shops or 2nd hand resales.  Small local hamburger joints to compete with the chains.  We see it now with a proliferation of food trailers/trucks.   Businesses again.  But people have not run their own businesses for years, if ever.  Give them education on budgeting, start up, marketing, employment law, taxes, etc.   SBA used to have a program like that, a small business mentoring program.  Would be even easier now with online capacity...if we had reliable broadband.  Drat.

I'm just saying put some money back into the places they have been draining for years.   Take it back from Bezos and the billionaires and trickle it down for them, since they don't seem to be able to figure out  how to do anything with money but make more for themselves.  

This is part of the argument for a UBI.  In some small towns, that UBI may be enough that someone can start that small business easier.

But yes, the SBA is supposed to have resources, for free, that helps people.  There are organizations that are doing similar things with volunteers.  

The other thing some of these folks do not have access to is capital.  Banks may not want to serve them as they are small potatoes, and again, the banks have underwriters who are looking at things, who are basically just using a computer program to spit out a yes or no.  For some of these businesses, that isn't going to work.  It would be interesting to start an investment fund (Mainvest is something similar, but I would want to have something more hands on and in very specific areas) that also gives advice to these business owners (i.e. has people that can help them).  What is hard about brick and mortar is the cost to buy or rent space.  NYC is a prime example of what rich international buyers do to the market.  I think the city needs to take a hard look at itself and do some soul searching post COVID.

[NameAlreadyInUse 5106]

2 hours ago, Lobo said:

I don't know what was more depressing about your story what Wal-Mart did to your town, or that 'the bright side' to you is driving 40 minutes to get to Lubbock to 'do some shopping.'    

I think we all discussed this story a couple years ago about the proliferations of Wal-Mart is no longer the threat it once was, probably because of e-commerce/online retail to some extent, The exodus from rural areas, etc.  But that the real bad sign now for a community is when a Dollar Store comes into town (General, Dollar Tree, Family Dollar, Alco, et. al.).  They tend to wreak just as much havoc as Wal-Mart with even less economic benefit.  They drive local merchants out of business all the same but at least Wal-Mart offers optometry, 'banking' services, an improving grocery selection of 'fresher' options, and offers a handful of decent paying jobs in management.  Not the case at all with the Dollar Stores.  https://www.fastcompany.com/90278384/why-dollar-stores-are-bad-business-for-the-neighborhoods-they-open-in

Speaking of Wal-Mart, I'd be curious to see...statistically speaking some Surly poster out near the Woodlands either works for Woodforest Banks or knows well someone who does.  Their growth inside Wal-Mart stores has slowed dramatically.  In-store banking is no longer the convenience it once was with the expanse of mobile banking (particularly during Covid-19 when the idea of in-person banking went from inconvenient to just fucking dumb).  Our bank has taken a lot of cues from Woodforest on what not to do.  And they keep everything they are doing very close to the vest as a private OCC bank, but I'd be curious what their vision is for the next ten years as branch-banking, even inside where you shop, gets less and less viable.  And as Wal-Mart's growth in many markets is reaching peak capacity. 

Also, Gohmert seems like a dick.  

 

No Walmart never invested in pharmacy or grocery or banking  in my home town, it was more like a giant dollar store.  It was next door to the United which was all things considered a pretty good grocery store except that there was no alcohol in it.  Had to drive to Lubbock for that too, or the bootlegger.

And yes, the other depressing part was I grew up there which is why I GTFO as soon as I graduated high school.

18 minutes ago, pyrohornIII said:

This is a good read on Walmart.  Your probably already have it.  

https://www.amazon.com/How-Walmart-Destroying-America-World/dp/1580086683

I'm pretty sure he was being facetious about that 40 miles. 

I used to live in Huntsville 30 years ago.  I wanted a waffle iron and went looking. There were no mercantiles around, the only place in a town of 45K was Walmart, and they had one model.  No variety.  And once they corner a market, their price and selection goes out the window.  Though online shopping tends to give them competition.  Now at least Target and some of the larger grocers are challenging for some of those items.  

 

I just checked, I guess I was, it's actually 39.1 miles.  

Also, yeah that's the other thing I forgot about.  Walmart also raised their prices as soon as they put everyone else out of business.  So the price breaks people were so looking forward to were short lived, then disappeared altogether when they closed down.  It's been years now and the shell is still there and still empty.  So let's add small town blight to the list.  

[Guest Lobo]

^

Yeah, there is so much commercial blight coming in the next few years.  What was going to take 10-20 years to happen inevitably with shifts in where live, how we shop, what we look for in a retailer, has been amplified by Covid-19.  We are going to be stuck, particularly in rural/exurb areas, with so many empty spaces that will have zero options for repurposing, except for maybe the local school district.  The countryside is going to get so ugly so fast here in Texas.  

[Beau Vine 54003]

 

[Js1 85112]

 

[Beau Vine 54003]

37 minutes ago, Js1 said:

 

Too bad they didn't shoot him.

[Beau Vine 54003]

 

[Nice Guy Eddie 13414]

On the rural discussion, there really isn't much to be done for many rural residents. Capitalism has no reason to overly support them.  I'm not saying to forget them but the govt can only do so much.

[atomheartbevo 89449]

edit: out of context

 

Edited January 13, 2021 by atomheartbevo

[High Plains Drifter 10978]

On 1/4/2021 at 10:42 AM, NameAlreadyInUse said:

You just described why I will not shop at Walmart.  Walmart came to my hometown when I was in high school.  Within a year, the entire downtown district was boarded up except a jewelry store and a mexican restaurant.  The hardware store, the clothing stores, the office supply store, all out of business.  

Walmart picked up their money and deposited it in the local bank every day and it would sit there for 15-30 minutes before it got auto-wired out to Bentonville, so even the local bank didn't get an opportunity to earn anything off that money.  

Oh, and eventually the Walmart decided that decimating the local business of the town was a-ok, but they weren't making enough money on that store anymore so they shut down operations.  Now my hometown has no Walmart and no mom and pop stores either.  On the bright side, it's only a 40 minute drive to Lubbock to actually do some shopping.

 

ITs even worse than this. They open the walmart in the small towns with the intention of destroying the local businesses, knowing they will close that wal mart down in 10 or so years and forcing everybody to drive to the bigger walmart in the bigger town over. this is their business model.

And its very hard to feel any sympathy for those small towns when they abandon the moms and pops for the new wal mart (or even worse the new dollar general), and vote to give the walmart a tax abatement.

This is only one example of how they are fucking themselves. Another example would be spending millions on a new football stadium, but refusing to spend a fucking penny on decent science labs in the high school.

I live in a small town, actually 10 miles down the highway and two miles down a gravel road from a small town. You drive through town, and the roads are so filled with potholes (if they are even paved) that you literally destroy your car driving on them. But by gawd, you better not try to raise my taxes. The increase in local taxes it would take to fix the fucking roads would probably be less than what one would save in car repairs. The only decent road in town is the state highway that serves as the main road in town (another way you city dwellers subsidize rural living, btw).

The playground in the city park looks like something out of a third world country. A local doctor had to start up a non-profit to get new-ish play ground equipment. Which I and her husband had to put up ourselves because the city wouldn't use city workers because of "fiscal limitations" or some shit.

They cry about socialism and welfare queens, when their ranches would be insolvent if they didn't get federally subsidized insurance and agriculture tax breaks.

They drill wells and when the local groundwater districts suggests that maybe they need to dial back the pumping of groundwater they scream about regulations and big government but when their wells go dry they DEMAND the county DO SOMETHING!!

They bitch about restrictions on business due to covid then absolutely by gawd refuse to wear a mask. 

Their bullshit and hypocrisy goes on and on. Fuck them all.

I like where I live because its quiet and dark at night and I have space for a garden and fruit trees and outdoor fires and I can leave my keys in my ignition and my daugther can leave her bike in the front yard and the dogs can run through neighboring pastures and chase rabbits and I can hit golf balls with from my porch. But I also get absolutely sick of the hypocritical bullshit coming from my neighbors.

I feel absolutely no sympathy for these people. They are making their beds, knowingly and with forethought, and somehow its the democrats' fault their lives suck. When without the democrats, their lives would suck even more.

 

Sorry, rant over.

 

[High Plains Drifter 10978]

2 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

On the rural discussion, there really isn't much to be done for many rural residents. Capitalism has no reason to overly support them.  I'm not saying to forget them but the govt can only do so much.

 

More succinct that what i said, but not as rant-y.

 

[Beau Vine 54003]

Quote

Two Republican House members have been fined $5,000 for bypassing the security screening that was set up outside the House chamber in the wake of the Jan. 6 attack on the Capitol by a pro-Trump mob, a senior Democratic aide said Friday.

Reps. Louie Gohmert (Tex.) and Andrew S. Clyde (Ga.) appear to be the first members punished under a rule approved by the House on Tuesday night.

Spokespeople for Gohmert and Clyde did not respond to requests for comment, but Gohmert issued a statement Friday night, explaining that he had stepped out to use the restroom and did not know that he needed to be rescreened on his way back in.

Quote

Press Releases
Rep. Gohmert Statement on Fine and Metal Detector
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Washington, February 5, 2021
Rep. Louie Gohmert (TX-01) has issued the following statement on the accusation he broke new House Rule on metal detectors:

"This should come as no surprise, but Democrats are making up the rules as they go. 
"For weeks, I have complied with Speaker Pelosi’s unconstitutional metal detector policy. 
"Yesterday, after complying with the metal detector screening, I was allowed to enter the House session where debate was occurring. Knowing that I would soon be giving a speech, I stepped off the House floor to use the restroom right beside the Speaker’s lobby as I have done many times since the metal detectors have been installed.
"At no time until yesterday did anyone mention the need to be wanded after entering the restroom directly in front of the guards. The three main entrances have metal detectors, but the House floor entrance from the Speakers’ Lobby does not. Originally I had gone around the metal detectors a few times until it was mandated. I have been complying for weeks since.
"I explained to the Capitol Police officer that I had never been required to be screened again from the restroom immediately by the House floor since the metal detectors had been in place at the other doors. I said they had witnessed me walk the few feet to the men’s room, enter and take the few steps back. No one ever mentioned or made that a requirement until yesterday. 
"Unlike in the movie The Godfather, there are no toilets with tanks where one could hide a gun, so my reentry onto the House floor should have been a non-issue.
"Since I had been complying with the metal detector requirement despite the Constitutional issue, I was surprised to receive a notice today stating that I had not complied with their policy and that I would be fined $5,000.
"I will be appealing the fine and taking whatever action is necessary, especially considering this policy is unconstitutional.
"Article 1, Section 6 of the U.S. Constitution contains specific language prohibiting Members of Congress from being detained on the way to or from a session of the House.

"This fine has nothing to do with following the rules and everything to do with furthering the Democrats’ never ending scheme to demonize and punish their political opponents. 
"Nonetheless, I have been trying to comply, but it gets difficult to do so when Democrats keep changing the rules and their enforcement."
 

 

[Satchel 6908]

Why can’t they just act like normal people and abide by the rules?

[Willfully Horn 7916]

Toilet tank that he is, Gohmert’s explanation is not unreasonable. Unless the Speaker’s lobby has access to other parts of the building. 

[Degenerate Gardner 4081]

34 minutes ago, Willfully Horn said:

Toilet tank that he is, Gohmert’s explanation is not unreasonable. Unless the Speaker’s lobby has access to other parts of the building. 

Gohmert's explanations are inherently unreasonable. Him conspicuously carrying the cross of 2nd amendment martyrdom and feigning concern for constitutionality after supporting the violent subversion of American democracy... that there is a red flag that Louie's portrayal of the situation may not be accurate or intellectually honest.

Edited February 6, 2021 by Degenerate Gardner

[Matuka 1305]

I'm no constitutional scholar, but I doubt the Constitution addresses metal detector policy of governmental institutions.

[Degenerate Gardner 4081]

3 minutes ago, Degenerate Gardner said:

 

.

Edited February 6, 2021 by Degenerate Gardner
Dreaded delayed dp

[Sawbonz 27436]

57 minutes ago, Willfully Horn said:

Toilet tank that he is, Gohmert’s explanation is not unreasonable. Unless the Speaker’s lobby has access to other parts of the building. 

[Willfully Horn 7916]

38 minutes ago, Degenerate Gardner said:

Gohmert's explanations are inherently unreasonable. Him conspicuously carrying the cross of 2nd amendment martyrdom and feigning concern for constitutionality after supporting the subversion of American democracy... that there is a red flag that Louie's portrayal of the situation may not be accurate or intellectually honest.

Much of toilet tank’s statement was political bs, it’s true. And I agree that the insurrection should be repeatedly carved into the Party’s forehead until it acts to expunge all of their seditionists, which includes Gohmert. But that group does not include all Republicans. That may be where we are heading, but we’re not there yet. 

I reread his statement, and had missed that the restroom was in a common, and not a secure, area. As stated, I assumed the restroom was in a secure area.

Time to put metal detectors on all doors leading into the chamber.

Edited February 7, 2021 by Willfully Horn
Wording

[TwiceHorn 31283]

45 minutes ago, Matuka said:

I'm no constitutional scholar, but I doubt the Constitution addresses metal detector policy of governmental institutions.

He's a lying cunt.

Here's what the Constitution says, and note that it is not "detained," or inconvenienced.

They (Senators and Representatives) shall in all Cases, except Treason, Felony and Breach of the Peace, be privileged from Arrest during their Attendance at the Session of their respective Houses, and in going to and returning from the same; and for any Speech or Debate in either House, they shall not be questioned in any other Place.

A sidenote on the final phrase..  "Shall not be questioned in any other Place" essentially means they cannot be held liable for statements or actions during a speech or debate.  It doesn't mean they can't be questioned outside of Congress in the more literal sense.

Edited February 7, 2021 by TwiceHorn

[Guest Lobo]

1 hour ago, Matuka said:

I'm no constitutional scholar, but I doubt the Constitution addresses metal detector policy of governmental institutions.

Do you even fucking Article XIII, bro?  

[pyrohornIII 4809]

 

On 1/13/2021 at 3:30 PM, High Plains Drifter said:

 

ITs even worse than this. They open the walmart in the small towns with the intention of destroying the local businesses, knowing they will close that wal mart down in 10 or so years and forcing everybody to drive to the bigger walmart in the bigger town over. this is their business model.

And its very hard to feel any sympathy for those small towns when they abandon the moms and pops for the new wal mart (or even worse the new dollar general), and vote to give the walmart a tax abatement.

This is only one example of how they are fucking themselves. Another example would be spending millions on a new football stadium, but refusing to spend a fucking penny on decent science labs in the high school.

I live in a small town, actually 10 miles down the highway and two miles down a gravel road from a small town. You drive through town, and the roads are so filled with potholes (if they are even paved) that you literally destroy your car driving on them. But by gawd, you better not try to raise my taxes. The increase in local taxes it would take to fix the fucking roads would probably be less than what one would save in car repairs. The only decent road in town is the state highway that serves as the main road in town (another way you city dwellers subsidize rural living, btw).

The playground in the city park looks like something out of a third world country. A local doctor had to start up a non-profit to get new-ish play ground equipment. Which I and her husband had to put up ourselves because the city wouldn't use city workers because of "fiscal limitations" or some shit.

They cry about socialism and welfare queens, when their ranches would be insolvent if they didn't get federally subsidized insurance and agriculture tax breaks.

They drill wells and when the local groundwater districts suggests that maybe they need to dial back the pumping of groundwater they scream about regulations and big government but when their wells go dry they DEMAND the county DO SOMETHING!!

They bitch about restrictions on business due to covid then absolutely by gawd refuse to wear a mask. 

Their bullshit and hypocrisy goes on and on. Fuck them all.

I like where I live because its quiet and dark at night and I have space for a garden and fruit trees and outdoor fires and I can leave my keys in my ignition and my daugther can leave her bike in the front yard and the dogs can run through neighboring pastures and chase rabbits and I can hit golf balls with from my porch. But I also get absolutely sick of the hypocritical bullshit coming from my neighbors.

I feel absolutely no sympathy for these people. They are making their beds, knowingly and with forethought, and somehow its the democrats' fault their lives suck. When without the democrats, their lives would suck even more.

 

Sorry, rant over.

 

My situation is much like yours, potholes and all.  Our tax district for the county, schools and ESD has been severely depleted by the decline in  O&G prices and production in the past 5 years.  Guess what's coming along to save all these MAGA loving assholes?   A solar farm.   Thank god they didn't have to vote on allowing it, or they'd have voted it down, being good Trumpkins.

[yoladu 4067]

On 2/6/2021 at 4:14 PM, Beau Vine said:

 

Drama Queen... did we really need a press release for you to explain your bathroom rituals?

[bolverk 29405]

4 hours ago, pyrohornIII said:

 

My situation is much like yours, potholes and all.  Our tax district for the county, schools and ESD has been severely depleted by the decline in  O&G prices and production in the past 5 years.  Guess what's coming along to save all these MAGA loving assholes?   A solar farm.   Thank god they didn't have to vote on allowing it, or they'd have voted it down, being good Trumpkins.

I've been hearing about the hubbub in Van Zandt County over some proposed solar farms because of a fear over the non-existent threat of what their queer panels will do to the soil. Oh, yeah, that and "what about if a tornado hits one!"

[Willfully Horn 7916]

The Hole

[WhatTheBuck 28713]

 

 

Edited February 8, 2021 by WhatTheBuck

[NameAlreadyInUse 5106]

1 hour ago, bolverk said:

I've been hearing about the hubbub in Van Zandt County over some proposed solar farms because of a fear over the non-existent threat of what their queer panels will do to the soil. Oh, yeah, that and "what about if a tornado hits one!"

Do they build all their houses underground out in Van Zandt County?  

[bolverk 29405]

16 minutes ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

Do they build all their houses underground out in Van Zandt County?  

No, but there are a tremendous number of Confederate flags flying in front of them.

[washparkhorn 9935]

Gohmert is an embarrassment to Texas - one of many.

_____________________________________________

Just a note: Rural broadband is coming rather quickly, thanks to one of Austin's newest residents (Elon). (I have no idea if he will actually live in Austin, but his foundation will).

New York (CNN Business)The US government plans to give SpaceX nearly a billion dollars to beam internet from space to people across rural America, where three out of five people say access to broadband is still a pressing issue.

The company will receive a total of $856 million, one of the largest subsidies handed out by the Federal Communications Commission under a new program designed to encourage companies to extend broadband access into the United States' most underserved areas over the next 10 years.

SpaceX's win is notable because the company competed against more established internet service providers, such as Charter Communications and CenturyLink, which rely on traditional fiber optic cables to deliver high-speed internet to customers. SpaceX's Starlink internet service, which is currently in beta testing and is not yet fully operational, relies on an experimental swarm of nearly 1,000 satellites whizzing around Earth at more than 17,000 miles per hour as they beam the internet to high-tech antennas mounted on people's homes.

The FCC did award the bulk of the $9 billion worth of subsidies to more traditional providers. Charter, for example, received more than $1.2 billion to bring high-speed internet into more than 1 million neighborhoods. And the Rural Electric Cooperative Consortium, a joint bid from smaller regional companies, was awarded $1.1 billion to more than 618,000 neighborhoods.

Allowing SpaceX to participate in the subsidy program at all was controversial. Traditional telecommunications companies and some broadband advocates argued that SpaceX's Starlink network was too new and unproven. Essentially, the FCC placed a bet that SpaceX's Starlink service will work just as the company promises, but if that turns out not to be the case, it could mean more lengthy delays in getting internet coverage to some of the most in-need areas of the United States.

But, if SpaceX's Starlink service does work as intended, it could be a major boon for rural economies in the United States and abroad. That's because the company's unique satellite system is designed to blanket the entire planet in connectivity, rather than stringing cables to individual rural areas.

From December 2020 - https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/08/tech/spacex-starlink-subsidies-fcc-scn/index.html

Edited February 9, 2021 by washparkhorn