Fucking electric rates are nuts

[immamac 42852]

33 minutes ago, Quagmire said:

Have heard rumblings that it’s sometimes hard to sell your home with solar , especially if you still owe for the panels . Not sure if true

This is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. 

[Dahobbs 17534]

50 minutes ago, Quagmire said:

Have heard rumblings that it’s sometimes hard to sell your home with solar , especially if you still owe for the panels . Not sure if true

That's a different circumstance where the homeowner leases the panels. I own them. I don't even have a second lien on the house since it was part of a cash out mortgage refinance. 

[Serak The Preparer 3431]

50 minutes ago, immamac said:

This is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. 

It is 100% true <if> as Quagmire noted you owe for the panels because of a lease (not just through a loan). The lease payments are generally not favorable after the first few years and most purchasers don't want to make high payments for panels that are a generation (or two) out of date. Are there exceptions? Of course, but every realtor I know suggested we avoid panels until we could purchase rather than lease as they tend to subtract from house value.

[luke duke 6413]

This is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. 

I guess you’ve never heard the Aggy War Hymn.

[Gil Bang 25960]

3 hours ago, Quagmire said:

Have heard rumblings that it’s sometimes hard to sell your home with solar , especially if you still owe for the panels . Not sure if true

 

3 hours ago, immamac said:

This is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. 

 

3 hours ago, Dahobbs said:

That's a different circumstance where the homeowner leases the panels. I own them. I don't even have a second lien on the house since it was part of a cash out mortgage refinance. 

 

2 hours ago, Serak The Preparer said:

It is 100% true <if> as Quagmire noted you owe for the panels because of a lease (not just through a loan). The lease payments are generally not favorable after the first few years and most purchasers don't want to make high payments for panels that are a generation (or two) out of date. Are there exceptions? Of course, but every realtor I know suggested we avoid panels until we could purchase rather than lease as they tend to subtract from house value.

Realtor here.  

A few years ago, solar contracts torpedoed many a deal.   A few years back, I helped a relative purchase a home.  I got his mortgage approved in 9 days, and it took almost 3 months for the solar company to approve him assuming the contract. 

With the tremendous appreciation in home values, most sellers (out here anyway) are offering the system free and clear, and are paying off the contract at the close of escrow. And those that don't, the buyers aren't having such a rough time taking over the contract.

Now, "power purchase agreements" fucking suck and only an idiot would get involved with one. 

[immamac 42852]

36 minutes ago, Gil Bang said:

 

 

 

Realtor here.  

A few years ago, solar contracts torpedoed many a deal.   A few years back, I helped a relative purchase a home.  I got his mortgage approved in 9 days, and it took almost 3 months for the solar company to approve him assuming the contract. 

With the tremendous appreciation in home values, most sellers (out here anyway) are offering the system free and clear, and are paying off the contract at the close of escrow. And those that don't, the buyers aren't having such a rough time taking over the contract.

Now, "power purchase agreements" fucking suck and only an idiot would get involved with one. 

This is tremendously stupid how is any buyer even entertaining this fuckery? 

[Gil Bang 25960]

5 minutes ago, immamac said:

This is tremendously stupid how is any buyer even entertaining this fuckery? 

Right house, right neighborhood, right price. 

[immamac 42852]

4 minutes ago, Gil Bang said:

Right house, right neighborhood, right price. 

Oh, idiots. My bad. 

[HiggyBaby 2529]

Cancelled energy other and used Texas power guide. Got 14.3 on 36 month. Only a 99 cancellation fee so if rates drop no big deal .

Not sure how people are getting 12 cent range

I think luck played into it. Mine was renewed in April at 12.3. Can’t wait to see the options in a year when it’s up.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13512]

I've run into another situation where even though I have a relatively high credit score and never missed a payment in ~30 years, electric providers are requiring I pay a $300 deposit to sign with them.

It's hard not to assume that a large deposit today is offsetting cash flow problems due customers that are locked into a $.10 contract when the market is 50-70% higher now.

[Moby Ric 2058]

 

On 6/7/2022 at 9:40 AM, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I've run into another situation where even though I have a relatively high credit score and never missed a payment in ~30 years, electric providers are requiring I pay a $300 deposit to sign with them.

It's hard not to assume that a large deposit today is offsetting cash flow problems due customers that are locked into a $.10 contract when the market is 50-70% higher now.

That is not how it works.  The cheap rates two years ago and before were done because the power company bought all the natgas for their specific deal at the price it was at the time.  If you did a deal today you pay todays price for the term of the contract.  The price changes daily and legit power suppliers don't have cash flow issues.  They are just passing along the high costs for purchasing the gas to the consumer.

For those of you in the middle of this shitshow do not sign a deal longer than 2 years and do not do a deposit, move on if you can't negotiate it away.  Natgas is really high and the forecast is for it to potentially start coming down in 2024.  By then you may start seeing prices come down a bit.  After 24 months on a deal you can re evaluate.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13512]

29 minutes ago, Moby Ric said:

 

That is not how it works.  The cheap rates two years ago and before were done because the power company bought all the natgas for their specific deal at the price it was at the time.  If you did a deal today you pay todays price for the term of the contract.  The price changes daily and legit power suppliers don't have cash flow issues.  They are just passing along the high costs for purchasing the gas to the consumer.

For those of you in the middle of this shitshow do not sign a deal longer than 2 years and do not do a deposit, move on if you can't negotiate it away.  Natgas is really high and the forecast is for it to potentially start coming down in 2024.  By then you may start seeing prices come down a bit.  After 24 months on a deal you can re evaluate.

I understand what you're saying about not signing for more than 2 years but I went with a 3-year deal with a $100 termination.  I haven't signed a deal longer than 6 months in the last 10 years so I hated signing a 3-year deal but that was the only way to get a "decent" rate today.

I'm looking forward to cancelling this contract.

[Moby Ric 2058]

25 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I understand what you're saying about not signing for more than 2 years but I went with a 3-year deal with a $100 termination.  I haven't signed a deal longer than 6 months in the last 10 years so I hated signing a 3-year deal but that was the only way to get a "decent" rate today.

I'm looking forward to cancelling this contract.

Just know that when/if you cancel that will ding your credit with the power suppliers.

[Dahobbs 17534]

1 hour ago, Moby Ric said:

 

That is not how it works.  The cheap rates two years ago and before were done because the power company bought all the natgas for their specific deal at the price it was at the time.  If you did a deal today you pay todays price for the term of the contract.  The price changes daily and legit power suppliers don't have cash flow issues.  They are just passing along the high costs for purchasing the gas to the consumer.

For those of you in the middle of this shitshow do not sign a deal longer than 2 years and do not do a deposit, move on if you can't negotiate it away.  Natgas is really high and the forecast is for it to potentially start coming down in 2024.  By then you may start seeing prices come down a bit.  After 24 months on a deal you can re evaluate.

You're talking about power generators. He is talking about retail electric providers. In Texas, they are different (except in places like Austin with municipal utilities). Retail Electric Providers don't buy gas. They buy electricity. And they aren't buying all their supply years in advance. They are making predictions about prices that get incorporated into contracts.  I wouldn't be surprised if @Nice Guy Eddie is right. Some of those Retail Electric Providers probably are in a cash crunch and probably are using upfront deposits to help manage their cash flow issues. 

Edited June 10, 2022 by Dahobbs

[Dahobbs 17534]

7 minutes ago, Moby Ric said:

Just know that when/if you cancel that will ding your credit with the power suppliers.

No it will not. Your credit will get hurt if you don't pay. It isn't going to get hurt by paying an early termination fee. 

[Moby Ric 2058]

58 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

You're talking about power generators. He is talking about retail electric providers. In Texas, they are different (except in places like Austin with municipal utilities). Retail Electric Providers don't buy gas. They buy electricity. And they aren't buying all their supply years in advance. They are making predictions about prices that get incorporated into contracts.  I wouldn't be surprised if @Nice Guy Eddie is right. Some of those Retail Electric Providers probably are in a cash crunch and probably are using upfront deposits to help manage their cash flow issues. 

I am not talking about power generators, I am  specifically talking about retail providers (REP's) in Texas.  And yes, that is exactly how they work.  NRG, Champion, MP2, TXU, you name it operate this way in both commercial and residential power to set their prices. 

And yes, you will take a hit on your credit if you cancel a contract.  Call your REP and ask them if you do not believe what I am telling you.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13512]

If a new electric provider doesn't want me as a customer because I terminated my contract with another provider, then so be it.

[Dahobbs 17534]

8 minutes ago, Moby Ric said:

I am not talking about power generators, I am  specifically talking about retail providers (REP's) in Texas.  And yes, that is exactly how they work.  NRG, Champion, MP2, TXU, you name it operate this way in both commercial and residential power to set their prices. 

And yes, you will take a hit on your credit if you cancel a contract.  Call your REP and ask them if you do not believe what I am telling you.

Retail Electric Providers do not buy gas, which seemed to be you original assertion and focus.  And Retail Electric Providers are, for the most part, not cash rich businesses. Many of them are quite lean, which is why we see so much changeover in the Texas market. This is because it is an inexpensive business to enter as you don't really have any upfront expenses. You just need to have a little bit of credit and enough confidence in your projections. 

And you do not take a hit to your credit by cancelling a contract under the terms of the contract. Whoever is telling you that is wrong. That's not how credit reporting works. Utilities pretty much only affect your credit if you fail to pay and force them to go collections. 

[Nice Guy Eddie 13512]

1 hour ago, Moby Ric said:

I am not talking about power generators, I am  specifically talking about retail providers (REP's) in Texas.  And yes, that is exactly how they work.  NRG, Champion, MP2, TXU, you name it operate this way in both commercial and residential power to set their prices. 

And yes, you will take a hit on your credit if you cancel a contract.  Call your REP and ask them if you do not believe what I am telling you.

What exactly do they put on the credit report? That the customer legally executed the termination clause and paid the agreed fee? The horror.

I've missed that section on my credit report where it states that I screwed up by living up to my agreements.

Now if you terminate and don't pay the termination fee, I can see that ultimately showing up as uncollected debt but we're not talking about that.

 

[Quagmire 2147]

I am not talking about power generators, I am  specifically talking about retail providers (REP's) in Texas.  And yes, that is exactly how they work.  NRG, Champion, MP2, TXU, you name it operate this way in both commercial and residential power to set their prices. 
And yes, you will take a hit on your credit if you cancel a contract.  Call your REP and ask them if you do not believe what I am telling you.

Lol wtf ? Credit dinged for legally cancelling a contract ?

[NeverMarryAStripper 21907]

Banks also ding your credit along with that substantial penalty for early withdrawal