[News/Updates] Mass Shooting at Robb Elementary Uvalde - 5/24/2022

[Pato del Muerto 52560]

31 minutes ago, BillyGoatHill said:

Correct.

The south tower (2nd to be hit) collapsed first.

Which also meant that many of those firefighter's killed were from outlying companies from other boroughs. The french documentary of the probie (downtown company) had ALL of their firefighters return to the station (even though they were a first arriving company and thus in the north tower), the last one back at the station was the probie, who many thought had died in the collapse.  Later alarm(s) arriving companies went into and up the south tower and died when it collapsed and fell first. 

For those saying that many joining now wouldn't or don't act like those killed on 9/11, there is some small truth to that.

Some join for the benefits, some for the time off, others for some whatever reason.

But many, if not MOST, that I saw come into my FD after 9/11, I think there was a greater understanding of what was expected (putting others before self) and what could happen to you on while on the job. Those that didn't or don't understand that, you try and weed them out as much as you can. Unfortunately, some still get in and remain in the profession. 

Maybe not so much knowing you are going to , but KNOWING that there is a distinct possibility of it. You have to put trust in yourself, your crew, your training, and those that are leading you to get you through.

My dad and mom called me on 9/12.

Even though I had worked in the Fire Service for 13 years, I believe that was the first time they realized what I did for a living (when I became a firefighter, they were just happy that I was no longer jumping out of "perfectly good" military aircraft).

My dad asked me a direct question of "Why did they go into the towers?" And my answer was that is what you are supposed to do. They went in to get as many (ALL) of the people that they could save, and to put the fires out.

It was then, and still is the expectation.

 

Just want to clarify if it was not already clear, that my comment upthread about not going into the towers if they thought they might collapse was specific to the police, not the firefighters. 
 

FF make calls all the time to fight defensively when circumstances dictate, as it’s likely that the places they go are no longer structurally sound, but when it’s time to go in they go in. 
 

I doubt anyone could have surmised, with the information available prior to the first collapse, that the entire structure was capable of pancaking like that. 
my guess is after the first one fell, the order was to get everyone out of the other one, turning around any FF or police that were headed up. And whoever made it out, made it out. 

[Herbie Hancock 7370]

Uvalde ISD police chief Arredondo has been placed on administrative leave. Now flush this turd

[Goredho 17413]

8 hours ago, Pam Cummings said:

Sucks that people who need their asses kicked never get that anymore.

I’m pretty sure that’s a big part of some people’s love for guns.

[Captainant 27725]

38 minutes ago, Herbie Hancock said:

Uvalde ISD police chief Arredondo has been placed on administrative leave. Now flush this turd

He's going to be on paid vacation until he resigns to move to another small town to continue being cop, and then will eventually retire and seek disability for PTSD related to allowing 19 children to be slaughtered. Cops almost never face consequences for their malfeasance. 

[DigglerontheHoof 21212]

He needs to do himself and the rest of us a favor and eat his gun.

[Pato del Muerto 52560]

43 minutes ago, Herbie Hancock said:

Uvalde ISD police chief Arredondo has been placed on administrative leave. Now flush this turd

From the PD, right?  He still on the city council?

[Saint Tacky 1614]

1 hour ago, Pato del Muerto said:

From the PD, right?  He still on the city council?

Until he misses his third meeting because he's afraid to show up for his job and face the public. On the news last night they said that after his third unexcused absence from a council meeting the remainder of the council can vote him off.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, DigglerontheHoof said:

He needs to do himself and the rest of us a favor and eat his gun.

I gotta say, I've seen a bit of this. I don't like it. There's been too much destruction. Too much tragedy. Too much death. 

More doesn't solve it.

Edited June 23, 2022 by FirstTimeCaller

[TexasEd 8071]

MSNBC tearing everyone involved a new one tonight.  Here are some of the things reported on national news:

• Everyone was keeping hushed about it to not release anything before the November election to protect Abbot
• The Uvalde District Attorney was the front person for the messaging to not release anything but she apparently was not investigating anything since the shooter was dead.
• There were 91 State Troopers on site most of them part of Abbott's operation Lone Start Border Interdiction including all the high leaders of that operation, Numerous City and School Police
• There were at least 12 officers with body armor, ballistic shields and AR-15s in place within a few minutes of the shooting
• They had a door breaching device
• The doors were never checked by the police in the hall but they were looking for a key
• The doors could only be locked with a key from the outside so the shooter could not have locked it from inside
• At least one door was not locked or the lock was inoperable
• They were there in numbers with equipment within minutes, they never checked the door, at least 3 more volleys of fire were shot over the next hour
• Governor Abbott was trying to cover up these facts until after the election and his task force is in the crosshairs now.
• The School Police Chief has been suspended and the City council voted not to give him a leave of absence from his council seat so that when he misses his third meeting his seat is vacated
• The Mayor of Uvalde who berated Beto for saying they are doing nothing is now criticizing Abbot and the DPS.  He is fighting back against Austin
• A FOIA request for the DPS body cam video was ignored and has turned into a lawsuit against DPS
• The Federal Border Patrol showed up, assessed the incompetent dipshits they were dealing with and they breached the room and shot the killer while all the DPS and City guys were outside holding their dicks.

 

Edited June 23, 2022 by TexasEd

[TexasEd 8071]

Oh, and my wife is now a receptionist at our local High School.  She's the one responsible for tripping the alarm, locking the school down and trapping a threat in the "corral" at the entrance.  I'm sure state leadership will want her to carry a gun now instead of preventing people from getting them that should have red flags or are too young and violent to responsibly own them.

[Larry T. Spider 1747]

Don’t take this as a defense of the local and ISD police, but the DPS grandstanding comes across as shifting the blame more than an honest investigation. I would be very wary of taking what they are saying publicly as fact. The locals are pushing back but seem unorganized and completely unable to wage a PR war against Austin. If they have a bit of truth on their side, we will likely never know it.

[TexasEd 8071]

Just now, Larry T. Spider said:

Don’t take this as a defense of the local and ISD police, but the DPS grandstanding comes across as shifting the blame more than an honest investigation. I would be very wary of taking what they are saying publicly as fact. The locals are pushing back but seem unorganized and completely unable to wage a PR war against Austin. If they have a bit of truth on their side, we will likely never know it.

This is why the FOIA on the body cams was ignored.  Not even responded to, which is a requirement under the law.

[Brisketexan 105261]

I gotta say, I've seen a bit of this. I don't like it. There's been too much destruction. Too much tragedy. Too much death. 
More doesn't solve it.

Counterpoint: when no solutions are forthcoming, rate and counter-destruction is all that humanity has left. Our leadership’s utter contempt for humanity leads only to more suffering, pain, and violence.
I wish it weren’t so. But I’m also sick of waiting for them to become decent humans. Fuck em.

[BurdineBandit 815]

1 hour ago, TexasEd said:

MSNBC tearing everyone involved a new one tonight.  Here are some of the things reported on national news:

• Everyone was keeping hushed about it to not release anything before the November election to protect Abbot
• The Uvalde District Attorney was the front person for the messaging to not release anything but she apparently was not investigating anything since the shooter was dead.
• There were 91 State Troopers on site most of them part of Abbott's operation Lone Start Border Interdiction including all the high leaders of that operation, Numerous City and School Police
• There were at least 12 officers with body armor, ballistic shields and AR-15s in place within a few minutes of the shooting
• They had a door breaching device
• The doors were never checked by the police in the hall but they were looking for a key
• The doors could only be locked with a key from the outside so the shooter could not have locked it from inside
• At least one door was not locked or the lock was inoperable
• They were there in numbers with equipment within minutes, they never checked the door, at least 3 more volleys of fire were shot over the next hour
• Governor Abbott was trying to cover up these facts until after the election and his task force is in the crosshairs now.
• The School Police Chief has been suspended and the City council voted not to give him a leave of absence from his council seat so that when he misses his third meeting his seat is vacated
• The Mayor of Uvalde who berated Beto for saying they are doing nothing is now criticizing Abbot and the DPS.  He is fighting back against Austin
• A FOIA request for the DPS body cam video was ignored and has turned into a lawsuit against DPS
• The Federal Border Patrol showed up, assessed the incompetent dipshits they were dealing with and they breached the room and shot the killer while all the DPS and City guys were outside holding their dicks.

 

I don't believe this for one second. Abbott and his public-serving compadres like Rafael were telling people not to ask questions about the response or about guns right now because "this is not the time for politics". I, for one, believe that they care about the victims' families and only had their fellow Texans' best interests in mind after this tragedy.

 

/s

[BehoId, The Underminer! 11669]

14 hours ago, DigglerontheHoof said:

He needs to do himself and the rest of us a favor and eat his gun.

 

12 hours ago, FirstTimeCaller said:

I gotta say, I've seen a bit of this. I don't like it. There's been too much destruction. Too much tragedy. Too much death. 

More doesn't solve it.

i guarantee you he thinks about it.  even a sociopath that cannot feel anything about all those kids he let die would know that his own life as he knows it is over. 

[ABSR 5321]

11 hours ago, Larry T. Spider said:

Don’t take this as a defense of the local and ISD police, but the DPS grandstanding comes across as shifting the blame more than an honest investigation. I would be very wary of taking what they are saying publicly as fact. The locals are pushing back but seem unorganized and completely unable to wage a PR war against Austin. If they have a bit of truth on their side, we will likely never know it.

The real question is who had (knew) they had jurisdiction?   Plenty of Blame to go around and everyone covering their ass and pointing fingers and everyone but themselves.

If DPS showed up and that meant they had jurisdiction, then it is on them.   However, not sure how DPS fits into the hierarchy, and my guess is that the city PD still likely had jurisdiction, and that the ISD PD still likely were saying they had jurisdiction.

Shit show no matter what, but if someone actually has a real factual answer on this it would be appreciated.

[Brisketexan 105261]

2 minutes ago, ABSR said:

The real question is who had (knew) they had jurisdiction?   Plenty of Blame to go around and everyone covering their ass and pointing fingers and everyone but themselves.

If DPS showed up and that meant they had jurisdiction, then it is on them.   However, not sure how DPS fits into the hierarchy, and my guess is that the city PD still likely had jurisdiction, and that the ISD PD still likely were saying they had jurisdiction.

Shit show no matter what, but if someone actually has a real factual answer on this it would be appreciated.

All of that gets short-circuited by 1) ONE PERSON in a leadership position (the local DPS top man, the Uvalde PD top man, shit, the SECOND in command at Uvalde ISD PD) 2) asking urgently "who the fuck is in charge?  Get me to him, because we need to enter NOW!"  That's it.  Not sit around with your thumb up your ass thinking someone else is in charge, AND knowing that person is violating the #1 rule for dealing with an active shooter.

You know how we've all been watching the war in Ukraine, and there has been much discussion about what makes the American military so successful (and has been passed on to the Ukrainian military) is leadership and initiative at all levels -- an NCO corps that can see an objective that needs to be taken, and take it, WITHOUT paralysis  of waiting for specific instructions from an officer.  In combat type situations, initiative and an "everyone has authority to act to take the objective" is how you win.  Paralysis waiting for detailed instructions from somebody with lots of gold on their uniform is how you lose, or how you become Russian, but I repeat myself.

This was a failure by EVERY SINGLE COP ON THE SCENE.  EVERY.  SINGLE.  ONE.

[Pato del Muerto 52560]

7 minutes ago, ABSR said:

The real question is who had (knew) they had jurisdiction?   Plenty of Blame to go around and everyone covering their ass and pointing fingers and everyone but themselves.

If DPS showed up and that meant they had jurisdiction, then it is on them.   However, not sure how DPS fits into the hierarchy, and my guess is that the city PD still likely had jurisdiction, and that the ISD PD still likely were saying they had jurisdiction.

Shit show no matter what, but if someone actually has a real factual answer on this it would be appreciated.

That kind of shit is supposed to be figured out during training and paper exercises. It’s not like multiple entities responding is a novel thing. 
 

just like first on scene is IC until a real IC arrives, then everything gets communicated and roles shift as manpower arrives. 

[Brisketexan 105261]

1 minute ago, Pato del Muerto said:

That kind of shit is supposed to be figured out during training and paper exercises. It’s not like multiple entities responding is a novel thing. 
 

just like first on scene is IC until a real IC arrives, then everything gets communicated and roles shift as manpower arrives. 

Except not in an active shooter scenario.  In that case, the IC is the first responding officer.....if someone more senior responds WITH him, then it's that guy.   But that's it.  Because there IS NO protocol of "hold off, wait till everyone gets here, establish a perimeter, order donuts and coffee...."  The #1 protocol, with no meaningful exceptions, is "make entry and engage the shooter to end the incident."  That's it.  That's the ENTIRE MOTHERFUCKING PLAYBOOK.  If ANY LEO is on an active shooting scene and that playbook isn't being followed.....he should know immediately that shit is fucked and he should unfuck it.

Instead, we have cops that are militarized as shit, but apparently modeled on the Russian military: no functional leadership, mostly effective at brutalizing civilians.

[Pato del Muerto 52560]

2 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Except not in an active shooter scenario.  In that case, the IC is the first responding officer.....if someone more senior responds WITH him, then it's that guy.   But that's it.  Because there IS NO protocol of "hold off, wait till everyone gets here, establish a perimeter, order donuts and coffee...."  The #1 protocol, with no meaningful exceptions, is "make entry and engage the shooter to end the incident."  That's it.  That's the ENTIRE MOTHERFUCKING PLAYBOOK.  If ANY LEO is on an active shooting scene and that playbook isn't being followed.....he should know immediately that shit is fucked and he should unfuck it.

Instead, we have cops that are militarized as shit, but apparently modeled on the Russian military: no functional leadership, mostly effective at brutalizing civilians.

One thing I don’t know is what happens when cops (or military, I guess in the abstract) receive orders that are contrary to their training.  
 

bypassing the part where the first on scene didn’t follow protocol and go in immediately, once there was a group of them that were supposedly only being stopped from breaching by an order from arronondo, is it within their duty to ignore the order and execute the standing protocol?  What is the expectation?

im sure they can get around this by saying that once it was said that it was a barricaded person protocol and not active shooter, the order and protocol matched up.  One would think that continuing to hear shots fired would eliminate that as logical thinking though. 
 

apparently the BP guys ignored the order and went in anyway.  Is that the correct action per their training, or were they technically violating procedure by ignoring an order?

[Brisketexan 105261]

1 minute ago, Pato del Muerto said:

One thing I don’t know is what happens when cops (or military, I guess in the abstract) receive orders that are contrary to their training.  
 

bypassing the part where the first on scene didn’t follow protocol and go in immediately, once there was a group of them that were supposedly only being stopped from breaching by an order from arronondo, is it within their duty to ignore the order and execute the standing protocol?  What is the expectation?

im sure they can get around this by saying that once it was said that it was a barricaded person protocol and not active shooter, the order and protocol matched up.  One would think that continuing to hear shots fired would eliminate that as logical thinking though. 
 

apparently the BP guys ignored the order and went in anyway.  Is that the correct action per their training, or were they technically violating procedure by ignoring an order?

I suspect that BP both violated procedure (ignored the IC) and followed it (always always always engage an active shooter).  When lives are on the line, it's almost always better to ask for forgiveness instead of permission.

Every cop until the BP breached the room failed.  None of them should ever carry a badge or gun again.  They aren't up to the job.  Let 'em go join the Russian army, where their skillset is a better fit.

[El Tri 412]

13 hours ago, FirstTimeCaller said:

I gotta say, I've seen a bit of this. I don't like it. There's been too much destruction. Too much tragedy. Too much death. 

More doesn't solve it.

not all deaths are the same

[InkaUtexas 26052]

The procedure as I know it since Columbine is engage the shooter. They did not do that. 

Act now and ask for forgiveness later would have been the best approach. 

 

[Brisketexan 105261]

^^^ Inka gets it.  It's really that simple.

[InkaUtexas 26052]

@Brisketexan  My dad ran the review group after Columbine for the US Army. They studied the shit out of it. And yes, engage the target, eliminate the target, and rescue all you can. 

Also, the average shooter is not good in tactical situations. If you have the training you can get them. Being shot at in real time is not the same as playing call of duty. 

What gets me is how many littles bled out because no one went in to clear it and get medical teams into those classrooms. 

The response at Uvalde was an embarrassment and agree all the UPD officers should give up their badges. They are lucky they are not facing massive lawsuits. 

[Guest]

27 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Except not in an active shooter scenario.  In that case, the IC is the first responding officer.....if someone more senior responds WITH him, then it's that guy.   But that's it.  Because there IS NO protocol of "hold off, wait till everyone gets here, establish a perimeter, order donuts and coffee...."  The #1 protocol, with no meaningful exceptions, is "make entry and engage the shooter to end the incident."  That's it.  That's the ENTIRE MOTHERFUCKING PLAYBOOK.  If ANY LEO is on an active shooting scene and that playbook isn't being followed.....he should know immediately that shit is fucked and he should unfuck it.

Instead, we have cops that are militarized as shit, but apparently modeled on the Russian military: no functional leadership, mostly effective at brutalizing civilians.

It's really dumbfounding. If a firefighter shows up, sees a kid in a window of a burning building, you think they are just going to stand there and wait for the supervisor? You think a lifeguard is going to see a kid drowning and hold off on jumping in to save them until they get an ok from a higher up? Yet all these cops waited... and waited... and waited.

If you take out the horrifying aspect of 19 CHILDREN and 2 TEACHERS being MURDERED, there is some really interesting psychological aspects to study about organization and training. Sort of like the bystander effect you learn about in Psych 101.

[Brisketexan 105261]

5 minutes ago, InkaUtexas said:

@Brisketexan  My dad ran the review group after Columbine for the US Army. They studied the shit out of it. And yes, engage the target, eliminate the target, and rescue all you can. 

Also, the average shooter is not good in tactical situations. If you have the training you can get them. Being shot at in real time is not the same as playing call of duty. 

What gets me is how many littles bled out because no one went in to clear it and get medical teams into those classrooms. 

The response at Uvalde was an embarrassment and agree all the UPD officers should give up their badges. They are lucky they are not facing massive lawsuits. 

Cool bit about your dad, would love to hear more.

And on your second point.....absolutely.  Shit, most ANYONE isn't an all-star when the bullets are coming BACK your direction.  My uncle was ATF on the border, told the story of a buddy of his who ended up in a gunfight around a gas station pump island.  Distances were maybe 15 yards.  Both he and the bad guy emptied their guns with zero hits.  Ended up in a fistfight with empty weapons.  Because when someone is shooting back at you, your aim ain't too great.  But you know what that bad guy WASN'T doing when he was in the shootout with the ATF guy?  Shooting anyone else, because he was engaged.

We learned one fucking lesson after Columbine.  We just didn't realize it would be trumped by the only value that cops actually have - "do whatever is best for me, the cop."  Turns out, that's the only rule, protocol, or procedure that ever matters.

[Jameslaw121 4448]

13 hours ago, FirstTimeCaller said:

I gotta say, I've seen a bit of this. I don't like it. There's been too much destruction. Too much tragedy. Too much death. 

More doesn't solve it.

nah.

[Pato del Muerto 52560]

9 minutes ago, FirstTimeCaller said:

It's really dumbfounding. If a firefighter shows up, sees a kid in a window of a burning building, you think they are just going to stand there and wait for the supervisor? You think a lifeguard is going to see a kid drowning and hold off on jumping in to save them until they get an ok from a higher up? Yet all these cops waited... and waited... and waited.

If you take out the horrifying aspect of 19 CHILDREN and 2 TEACHERS being MURDERED, there is some really interesting psychological aspects to study about organization and training. Sort of like the bystander effect you learn about in Psych 101.

There’s a certain amount of scene evaluation that firefighters do when they arrive.  And yeah they might wait on a hose line to get run, they might wait for this or that.  Maybe walk the scene for better intel on ingress/egress, other hazards, structural dangers. 
 

I had a trainer that was a ff for decades and he said you don’t go in alone and you don’t go in without a rapid intervention team outside. But there’s also times to bend or break those rules. 

[BillyGoatHill 4312]

37 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

 
 

apparently the BP guys ignored the order and went in anyway.  Is that the correct action per their training, or were they technically violating procedure by ignoring an order?

Standard practice throughout the country since Columbine is to actively move in, rescue those found while searching for, and engaging the shooter. There should have been NO WAITING (especially with continued gunshots).

Not sure why, but those that didn't act or engage upon arrival on the campus/school, failed miserably.

 

 

[Helobious 9464]

9 minutes ago, BillyGoatHill said:

Standard practice throughout the country since Columbine is to actively move in, rescue those found while searching for, and engaging the shooter. There should have been NO WAITING (especially with continued gunshots).

Not sure why, but those that didn't act or engage upon arrival on the campus/school, failed miserably.

 

 

You don’t rescue anyone or tend to any wounded while the shooter is still active. Priority #1 is stopping him. 

[BillyGoatHill 4312]

1 minute ago, Helobious said:

You don’t rescue anyone or tend to any wounded while the shooter is still active. Priority #1 is stopping him. 

Of course priority one is stopping the shooter. 

But you still see people out or point them the way out if encountered before finding the shooter. This is what was done during Columbine and lessons learned training after. 

And with STOP THE BLEED programs now, you are not passing up someone with an extremity bleed. It takes less than a minute to properly apply a CAT or similar tourniquet.

[statsman 5474]

Summary of studies of why US soldiers refuse to engage:

https://www.historynet.com/men-against-fire-how-many-soldiers-fired-weapons-vietnam-war/
 

I wonder if this applies to police as well? For 99.9% of a police career, unwillingness to engage and fire is a good thing. Uvalde was in the .1%. 

[staboner 4984]

1 hour ago, FirstTimeCaller said:

It's really dumbfounding. If a firefighter shows up, sees a kid in a window of a burning building, you think they are just going to stand there and wait for the supervisor? You think a lifeguard is going to see a kid drowning and hold off on jumping in to save them until they get an ok from a higher up? Yet all these cops waited... and waited... and waited.

If you take out the horrifying aspect of 19 CHILDREN and 2 TEACHERS being MURDERED, there is some really interesting psychological aspects to study about organization and training. Sort of like the bystander effect you learn about in Psych 101.

 

1 hour ago, Pato del Muerto said:

There’s a certain amount of scene evaluation that firefighters do when they arrive.  And yeah they might wait on a hose line to get run, they might wait for this or that.  Maybe walk the scene for better intel on ingress/egress, other hazards, structural dangers. 
 

I had a trainer that was a ff for decades and he said you don’t go in alone and you don’t go in without a rapid intervention team outside. But there’s also times to bend or break those rules. 

I think a big reason for the inaction in Uvalde is that it was a political event of sorts, not a tragedy. Humans can act quite heroically when the unthinkable happens. However, school shootings are no longer tragedies and no longer unthinkable. its BAU and everyone fucking froze. 

arming more people, teachers, security, more departments will simply add up to more inaction, finger pointing and dead kids. There is no solution to this crisis any longer as its firmly now 100% absorbed into the political culture war. 

[Goredho 17413]

I am honestly not surprised at the failed police response in Uvalde.  A Barney Fife, keystone cops type of response is about what I would expect from such a town.  Maybe not to the degree that happened, but the best and the brightest aren't populating the Uvalde ISD police department.  They don't have Jason Bourne working the truancy beat.

What fucking blows my mind and infuriates me, though, is the active cover up.  I could forgive the actions on that day if there was any hint of regret and remorse from those who failed so miserably.  But there is not.  Just an attempt to obfuscate, deflect and otherwise cover thy asses.

With cops like these, who needs criminals?

[Brisketexan 105261]

12 minutes ago, Goredho said:

With cops like these, who needs criminals?

How about THIS deal?

[Captainant 27725]

Once again, chief arredondo took way longer than it should to do the right thing

PBS: Uvalde schools’ police Chief Pete Arredondo resigns from City Council

[High Plains Drifter 11050]

On 6/21/2022 at 8:48 PM, Immaculate Vibes said:

 

 

Leave it. With all the bodies and casings and blood and gore intact.

Every legislator, every governor or president, every judge, should have to spend a hour sitting in that room with the dead bodies.

 

[tbone_ 14144]

So much this

[atomheartbevo 89777]

https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/05/us/texas-uvalde-mayor-don-mclaughlin/index.html

Quote

Uvalde Mayor Don McLaughlin told CNN he's lost faith in Texas leaders investigating how law enforcement responded to the shooting at his town's elementary school that killed 19 children and two adults. 

"I'm not confident, 100%, in DPS because I think it's a cover-up," he said of the Texas Department of Public Safety, the lead agency tasked with identifying what led to well-armed officers waiting outside a classroom for more than an hour before engaging the gunman.

"McGraw's covering up for maybe his agencies," McLaughlin continued in his sharpest attack yet on Col. Steven McCraw, the DPS director. 

McCraw told the Texas Senate that the police response was an "abject failure" and placed sole blame on school police chief Pedro "Pete" Arredondo. 

But McLaughlin told CNN on Tuesday he did not feel the full story of the May 24 massacre was coming out, partly because Texas DPS was not being transparent. 

"Every agency in that hallway is gonna have to share the blame," he said. Personnel from multiple law enforcement agencies gathered inside and outside the school before the gunman was challenged and killed.

McLaughlin said in an interview: "At this point, I don't know what to believe and what not to believe." 

And while he said he trusted the DPS individuals serving his community, he no longer believed the upper management.

Quote

McLaughlin said he had not had a briefing "from anybody" since the day after the shooting when Texas Gov. Greg Abbott and others had traveled to Uvalde to be told what had happened. 

Still, he said, key facts in the timeline did not align -- a timeline that has already been changed massively since the hours after the attack when law enforcement was praised by Abbott and others.  "I lost confidence because the narrative changed from DPS so many times and when we asked questions, we weren't getting answers."

McLaughlin asked the US Department of Justice to investigate the law enforcement response and that work has now begun. 

 

[TexEx15 17566]

5 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/05/us/texas-uvalde-mayor-don-mclaughlin/index.html

 

Isn’t this the dude that got all pissy with Beto when he called out Abbot at the PC for failing to do anything. That aged well.

[Biff Tannen 45710]

1 hour ago, TexEx15 said:

Isn’t this the dude that got all pissy with Beto when he called out Abbot at the PC for failing to do anything. That aged well.

Yes

[Larry T. Spider 1747]

Don’t take this as defending Arredondo, because he was an absolute failure, but all the talk about him seems like scapegoating. This was a massive fuckup across multiple agencies and the higher ups are pointing fingers at one local yokel.

Where is the pressure on McCraw to answer for why his officers stood around for so long? And don’t give me any jurisdiction bullshit because nobody knew who was in charge. If Arredondo was so inept and not following basic procedures, as McCraw states, why were all his guys standing there watching him break protocol for an hour? 

I don’t want to hear anything else about Arredondo until others are facing the same scrutiny.

[Seasick Sailor 3747]

 

[DigglerontheHoof 21212]

New video of cops arriving at the scene. 

[Brisketexan 105261]

1 hour ago, Seasick Sailor said:

 

If that's true......for fuck's sake, just get rid of all police altogether.  

Situation 1: dealing with any number of unarmed citizens, or dogs -- SHOOT IMMEDIATELY.

Situation 2: armed nutbar attacking a school -- WAIT TO GET SUPERVISOR  PERMISSION.

Our country has a terminal case of complete fucking stupidity.   100% terminal.

[Seasick Sailor 3747]

13 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

If that's true......for fuck's sake, just get rid of all police altogether.  

Situation 1: dealing with any number of unarmed citizens, or dogs -- SHOOT IMMEDIATELY.

Situation 2: armed nutbar attacking a school -- WAIT TO GET SUPERVISOR  PERMISSION.

Our country has a terminal case of complete fucking stupidity.   100% terminal.

Yep. And for those who may not have clicked through to the thread, there's this little tidbit, which is a close to an admission that more people died as a result of the cops' cowardice as you will see at this point:

 

Edited July 6, 2022 by Seasick Sailor

[Pato del Muerto 52560]

14 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Our country has a terminal case of complete fucking stupidity.   100% terminal.

And it’s not helping the perception when every 4th comment on that tweet refers to the shooter as white.  People not in possession of basic facts are arguing with complete certainty. 

[Brisketexan 105261]

4 minutes ago, Seasick Sailor said:

Yep. And for those who may not have clicked through to the thread, there's this little tidbit, which is a close to an admission that more people died as a result of the cops' cowardice as you will see at this point:

 

It seems pretty clear: if you want innocent people to die, either from action or inaction, the cops should be first on your list of people to call.

[4th and 5 4915]

ALERRT report can be found here

https://alerrt.org/