[Discussion] Mass Shooting at Uvalde Elementary School

[hobbes2702 13045]

Apparently covering random people’s reaction to Beto’s protest is all thats news today… nothing else for them to cover I guess. Lulz

Edited May 25, 2022 by hobbes2702

[Eskimohorn 5635]

I don't think I want more of Steve Kerr.

B-Team ISD police forces arent always an effective or actual deterrent against mass shooters. What they are effective at is speeding up the school to prison pipeline, especially for kids without access to expensive attorneys.

[Pig Bellmont 8719]

1 hour ago, BurntOrange&White said:

If you think that outburst helps Beto, you're a fool. I dislike him and Abbott but that was not a smart move by him. Like I said, he's mostly correct but that wasn't the time to do that.

He’s not there to change your mind but to motivate people who otherwise would stay home. 

[Homercles 10206]

12 minutes ago, Message Board User said:

 

I’m fine with that.  They were probably too pussy to let him in otherwise.  

[sidis 9832]

13 minutes ago, Message Board User said:

 

i think one of the tweet replies pretty much nails the stupidity of this.

"Of course it was staged. Abbot was on a stage. What'd you expect, Beto would accidentally drop from the ceiling while he was painting it?"

[Wally Pryor 5261]

The whole presser today with Abbott and that roster of mannequins behind him plus the bonus, clown-like cameo of O'Rourke is just another example why I despise politicians regardless of party affiliation. 

Fucking nauseating. 

[Chopper 17238]

Just now, Wally Pryor said:

The whole presser today with Abbott and that roster of mannequins behind him plus the bonus, clown-like cameo of O'Rourke is just another example why I despise politicians regardless of party affiliation. 

Fucking nauseating. 

Yep. Gerg needed his safe space, the mayor of Uvalde bent over to give it to him, and O'Rourke showed up to try to make them a little uncomfortable.

[Pig Bellmont 8719]

 

[Neonmoon 38129]

Just now, Pig Bellmont said:

 

[Larry T. Spider 1746]

Considering the number of deaths, “it could have been worse” should be a massive call to action. What does that even mean? 40 dead kids?

[Loop 1604 227]

Might be time to move this to the cloak room, yeah?

[Harrison Bergeron 1798]

Is it too much even for Surl to take maybe 48 hours to mourn an unimaginably tragedy before starting to act like assholes?

[SquishMitten 10415]

26 minutes ago, Message Board User said:

 

What is her definition of staged? I don't think anyone thought he just happened to stroll into the auditorium with no idea that there was a press conference going on

[wildcat09 29355]

Nothing about this was unimaginable.

[mdmost 43004]

4 minutes ago, Harrison Bergeron said:

Is it too much even for Surl to take maybe 48 hours to mourn an unimaginably tragedy before starting to act like assholes?

You could always take 48 hours away from Surly to mourn. The rest of us want to actually discuss this shit. Go stick your head back in the sand. It’s been working so well since Sandy Hook.

[Pig Bellmont 8719]

5 minutes ago, Loop 1604 said:

Might be time to move this to the cloak room, yeah?

What’s the point of a discussion thread, as opposed to a news thread, if we can’t discuss what happened?

[Wally Pryor 5261]

8 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

 

Shocking, yet another exhibit. What a fucking tapeworm.

Any word on whether the emotional support animals at his presser today attended the fundraiser as well?

[Seasick Sailor 3747]

 

4 hours ago, PenelopeWitherspoon said:

This is what needs to happen.

1.  Complete ban on the sale of high capacity magazines and bump stocks.

2.  Before you are eligible to buy a gun, you have to take a mandatory gun safety and training course.  You must retake one every 10 years (like a passport).   And like a passport, a background check is required to be able to pass the class.

3.  Close the gunshow loophole.  All sales and purchases of guns must be done through a licensed third party, like a gun shop.  

4.  If you are purchasing a gun within 6 months of your licensure, a background check is not required.  However, any purchase more than 6 months from that licensure would require a new background check.  Also, for any gun purchase, there is a 30 day waiting period before you can take your gun (that should allow cooler heads to prevail).

5.  The federal registry and red flag laws need to be much more robust. 

That is all I have.

6. Require anyone who wants a gun to get liability insurance before they can purchase the gun and require the policy to payout to any victim of your improper use of the firearm and make it a felony to be n possession of an uninsured firearm. Let insurance companies decide whether you are insurable, and if not, tough shit, you don't get a gun. So maybe you pass a background check and avoid any red flags, but let a company with a financial interest in you not using that firearm improperly have a say in whether you owning a firearm is a safe bet. 

7. strict criminal liability for any crime committed using your gun. 

2 hours ago, SydneyCarton said:

At least cars require a license and registration. 

And insurance. 

[Captainant 27680]

10 minutes ago, Harrison Bergeron said:

Is it too much even for Surl to take maybe 48 hours to mourn an unimaginably tragedy before starting to act like assholes?

It's not that unimaginable my dude. That's the point. We've had a major casualty mass shooting of 15 or more dead every couple of years in TX. Know what we did since the last big one on El Paso? We made it easier to buy guns and removed the CHL requirement for concealed carry.

But yeah COMPLETELY UNIMAGINABLE tragedy. I've got a bridge to sell you in Lubbock too

[Doug E. Fresh 452]

6 hours ago, BabaYaga said:

He had to have passed a background check to get those if obtained legally.  So now what?  He was reported multiple times apparently.  Red Flag laws?  Define how in this instance it would have deterred his psychotic spree?  His parents tried to kick him out multiple times, but is there any indication he made threats about shootings?

Align red flag laws and mental health?  That has been the constant in every one of these?  The mental health of the young shooter.  I can get behind that, but how does the definition and implementation look like?

How about why the fuck does an 18 year old, or anyone really, need an AR-15? Explain that to me….if you can. This country has lost the plot.

[BERT 4380]

I don't know if this is the place or not, but i'm gonna ask it here anyway. 

So if this state ever goes blue and this shit still happens, what are y'all gonna say then? Who will y'all blame? It's an honest question, I'm not political at all and just curious to the answers. 

[Pig Bellmont 8719]

2 minutes ago, BERT said:

I don't know if this is the place or not, but i'm gonna ask it here anyway. 

So if this state ever goes blue and this shit still happens, what are y'all gonna say then? Who will y'all blame? It's an honest question, I'm not political at all and just curious to the answers. 

It’s telling that your assumption is that true gun control reform is either ineffective or impossible. 

[sidis 9832]

1 minute ago, BERT said:

I don't know if this is the place or not, but i'm gonna ask it here anyway. 

So if this state ever goes blue and this shit still happens, what are y'all gonna say then? Who will y'all blame? It's an honest question, I'm not political at all and just curious to the answers. 

if it did go blue (which is a truly idiotic hypothetical), and no legislative and executive efforts whatsoever were made on either front...both gun laws restricting access to weapons like the scenario that played out with this kid in uvalde as well as making actual progress to bolstering and improving the quality of the state's health care infrastructure...such as what we've seen over the last 30 years, then the blame would be with the legislators and executives that made no such efforts.

particularly if they take to twitter lamenting that fewer texans purchased guns than californians and boasting about the fact that anyone can walk around with a gun now without any training or licenses.  both of those things happened by the way.

[UnivTex34 1763]

8 minutes ago, BERT said:

I don't know if this is the place or not, but i'm gonna ask it here anyway. 

So if this state ever goes blue and this shit still happens, what are y'all gonna say then? Who will y'all blame? It's an honest question, I'm not political at all and just curious to the answers. 

“I’m not political”

”just asking questions”

 

the jokes write themselves

 

the answer is, it doesn’t matter. I’d be just as pissed if dems were all in power and were not doing anything to fix the problem. I’m actually quite pissed that the US govt is not doing anything either right now. Laws need to be passed at both levels.

Edited May 25, 2022 by UnivTex34

[ClubWhatever 12148]

It’s pretty disheartening if there really were 3 officers he had to get past to do this.  Ooof.  

[aggie08 21505]

12 minutes ago, Doug E. Fresh said:

How about why the fuck does an 18 year old, or anyone really, need an AR-15? Explain that to me….if you can. This country has lost the plot.

Because they're fun. And cool. And everyone needs a hobby. That's it.

I'm actually okay with that explanation from the few gun owners honest enough to give it. (Provided they pass a full background check and safety course, license their weapons, and prove safe and adequate storage.)

But, if I have to hear another person B.S. me about "protection" and "good guys with guns" and "standing up to tyranny" and "inalienable rights" I'm going to mother fucking lose it.

 

Edited May 25, 2022 by aggie08

[Doug E. Fresh 452]

1 minute ago, aggie08 said:

Because they're fun. And cool. And everyone needs a hobby. That's it.

I'm actually okay with that explanation from the few gun owners honest enough to give it. (Provided they pass a full background check and safety course, license their weapons, and prove safe and adequate storage.)

But, if I have to hear another person B.S. me about "protection" and "good guys with guns" and "standing up to tyranny" and "inalienable rights" I'm going to mother fucking lose it.

 

I knew the answer before I posted the question but wanted to see a response. The reality is the greater good is more important than one’s selfish interests. But we’re too selfish.

[StruggleBus 3922]

3 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

Because they're fun. And cool. And everyone needs a hobby. That's it.

I'm actually okay with that explanation from the few gun owners honest enough to give it. (Provided they pass a full background check and safety course, license their weapons, and prove safe and adequate storage.)

But, if I have to hear another person B.S. me about "protection" and "good guys with guns" and "standing up to tyranny" and "inalienable rights" I'm going to mother fucking lose it.

 

More like: They're fun for a week or two when you shoot a few hundred rounds at a ranch, and then they sit in your gun case for a decade. 

[Foosters 17858]

16 minutes ago, BERT said:

I don't know if this is the place or not, but i'm gonna ask it here anyway. 

So if this state ever goes blue and this shit still happens, what are y'all gonna say then? Who will y'all blame? It's an honest question, I'm not political at all and just curious to the answers. 

Need comprehensive Federal laws. Take a look at what New Zealand did within a week of the Christchurch massacre. 

[Planet Houston 4930]

17 minutes ago, BERT said:

I don't know if this is the place or not, but i'm gonna ask it here anyway. 

So if this state ever goes blue and this shit still happens, what are y'all gonna say then? Who will y'all blame? It's an honest question, I'm not political at all and just curious to the answers. 

If it goes blue and the gun laws don’t change, then I will blame the politicians that didn’t deliver on their promise. But at least for now they are the only ones looking for solutions rather than lining their pockets with NRA money. 

[ClubWhatever 12148]

Sadly (to me) laws are only the first step.  Then there will be the long and drawn out legal challenges in the courts up to and including scotus. 

[SydneyCarton 48110]

56 minutes ago, Pam Cummings said:

Yeah if you believe that it's hopeless anyway, then i don't see what Beto really had to lose here.

I guess I was hoping that this moment could have been different. Instead idiots are talking about the shit below instead of answering hard questions. And yes I know we should be asking and answering the hard questions as human beings, but clearly that is not happening. And now some segment of people are debating Beto’s behavior and not focusing on dead kids and that shit press conference photo op. I’m  culpable and this thread is proof. So is Twitter. Unforced distraction worked. 
 

i just feel like there is a way for politicians to directly call out the opposition in a way that’s so heinous it forces them to respond. one side knows how to do it. Because reporters will want that soundbyte if nothing else. “Governor abbot, your opponent says you are directly responsible for the death of these children. What do you have to say to that?”

Maybe it’s just my turn to be naive. Mostly I’m just tired. 

56 minutes ago, Message Board User said:

 

 

[Captainant 27680]

3 minutes ago, StruggleBus said:

More like: They're fun for a week or two when you shoot a few hundred rounds at a ranch, and then they sit in your gun case for a decade. 

this is exactly my arc with gun ownership. When I was in my early 20's and just graduated with some honest to go breathing room in my monthly budget I bought a couple rifles and pistols and a shotgun and a safe. I shoot my shotgun pretty often, carry a wheelgun with snakeshot on the ranch, but aside from that I've almost never actually gotten any of them even out of the safe.

On shaggy I was bigly progun and in the interim years I've definitely changed my position on guns and am ready for more fucking laws to at least apply a dampening effect to these mass shootings rather than tossing gas on the fire with more loosening of gun regulations. 

 

21 minutes ago, BERT said:

I don't know if this is the place or not, but i'm gonna ask it here anyway. 

So if this state ever goes blue and this shit still happens, what are y'all gonna say then? Who will y'all blame? It's an honest question, I'm not political at all and just curious to the answers. 

if the dems made it a platform plank to oppose any and all action to reduce the availability of guns to 18 year olds, then yeah I'd fucking blame them too. The current state of our gun culture in the US is the product of a decades long effort by the NRA and those who take NRA money. All the rhetoric, talking points, even the legislation has NRA fingerprints 

[atomheartbevo 89732]

54 minutes ago, hobbes2702 said:

Apparently covering random people’s reaction to Beto’s protest is all thats news today… nothing else for them to cover I guess. Lulz

Would have been nice if somebody called Paxton out on him going on the various news shows with a Ken Paxton for Attorney General campaign t-shirt on.  Doesn't need to be political, just say "why is the AG wearing campaign apparel while talking about dead kids?"

[Captainant 27680]

2 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

I guess I was hoping that this moment could have been different. Instead idiots are talking about the shit below instead of answering hard questions. And yes I know we should be asking and answering the hard questions as human beings, but clearly that is not happening. And now some segment of people are debating Beto’s behavior and not focusing on dead kids and that shit press conference photo op. I’m  culpable and this thread is proof. So is Twitter. Unforced distraction worked. 

Have you not been paying attention? These progun politicians and posters will do literally ANYTHING to avoid talking about the issue itself. They aren't intellectually honest or engaging in good faith. They're looking to find some snowflake complaint about decorum so they can NOT talk about the 18 dead kids.

It's not our job to play by the fascists rules and hope our speech doesn't hurt their feefees. They need to get with the fucking program and start taking SOME measures to reduce the frequency and severity of mass shootings.

You are being pretty pollyanna-ish here.

[bad_teammate 13217]

Repeal the 2nd amendment.

[wildcat09 29355]

Just now, bad_teammate said:

Repeal the 2nd amendment.

It seems easier to appoint some new justices to interpret it correctly.

[BERT 4380]

21 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

It’s telling that your assumption is that true gun control reform is either ineffective or impossible. 

Your assumption would be wrong, but that's ok.

 

19 minutes ago, sidis said:

if it did go blue (which is a truly idiotic hypothetical), and no legislative and executive efforts whatsoever were made on either front...both gun laws restricting access to weapons like the scenario that played out with this kid in uvalde as well as making actual progress to bolstering and improving the quality of the state's health care infrastructure...such as what we've seen over the last 30 years, then the blame would be with the legislators and executives that made no such efforts.

particularly if they take to twitter lamenting that fewer texans purchased guns than californians and boasting about the fact that anyone can walk around with a gun now without any training or licenses.  both of those things happened by the way.

Thank you for your responce

 

18 minutes ago, UnivTex34 said:

“I’m not political”

”just asking questions”

 

the jokes write themselves

 

the answer is, it doesn’t matter. I’d be just as pissed if dems were all in power and were not doing anything to fix the problem. I’m actually quite pissed that the US govt is not doing anything either right now. Laws need to be passed at both levels.

Not jokes

 

9 minutes ago, Foosters said:

Need comprehensive Federal laws. Take a look at what New Zealand did within a week of the Christchurch massacre. 

That's interesting

 

7 minutes ago, Planet Houston said:

If it goes blue and the gun laws don’t change, then I will blame the politicians that didn’t deliver on their promise. But at least for now they are the only ones looking for solutions rather than lining their pockets with NRA money. 

 

2 minutes ago, Captainant said:

this is exactly my arc with gun ownership. When I was in my early 20's and just graduated with some honest to go breathing room in my monthly budget I bought a couple rifles and pistols and a shotgun and a safe. I shoot my shotgun pretty often, carry a wheelgun with snakeshot on the ranch, but aside from that I've almost never actually gotten any of them even out of the safe.

On shaggy I was bigly progun and in the interim years I've definitely changed my position on guns and am ready for more fucking laws to at least apply a dampening effect to these mass shootings rather than tossing gas on the fire with more loosening of gun regulations. 

 

if the dems made it a platform plank to oppose any and all action to reduce the availability of guns to 18 year olds, then yeah I'd fucking blame them too. The current state of our gun culture in the US is the product of a decades long effort by the NRA and those who take NRA money. All the rhetoric, talking points, even the legislation has NRA fingerprints 

Thank y'all for the responses, smartass or not. Hell, i try not to pay attention to the news most of the time, so when i ask questions it's because i do not know what the answer is. More gun control? sure. Get rid of all guns? good luck.

btw, i don't own a single gun, have never shot a gun ( i know, hard to believe that a redneck from east texas hasn't done that before). 

[SydneyCarton 48110]

8 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Have you not been paying attention? These progun politicians and posters will do literally ANYTHING to avoid talking about the issue itself. They aren't intellectually honest or engaging in good faith. They're looking to find some snowflake complaint about decorum so they can NOT talk about the 18 dead kids.

It's not our job to play by the fascists rules and hope our speech doesn't hurt their feefees. They need to get with the fucking program and start taking SOME measures to reduce the frequency and severity of mass shootings.

You are being pretty pollyanna-ish here.

I think you’re being absurd. Of course they’re looking for any excuse not to talk about it. And you’re pleased Beto gave them one on a silver platter? 
 

if your idea of “not playing into the fascist’s hands” is literally playing directly into their hands, well, color me perplexed.  I’ve extensively written what I would have preferred to happen to attempt to ratchet up accountability. In a more effective manner. But if you want to play the “well it may not be useful but damnit it makes me feel good to see someone who thinks just like me” well guess what, that sounds like some MAGA groupthink bullshit to me. 
 

 

Edited May 25, 2022 by SydneyCarton

[atomheartbevo 89732]

1 hour ago, SydneyCarton said:

No. I want him to call the pieces of shit out in a way that people dont dismiss on the chance they find his behavior inappropriate. If it's about changing minds or calling people to account, that means getting people to hear your message without dismissing it if they find it tasteless.

......he should have found a more effective way to be more brutal and savage to the fucks on that stage.  

1 hour ago, softlynow said:

Y'all can argue it all you want, but nobody knows right now, whether Beto's move pays off.

It was a gamble, to be sure. Sydney's thinking is the mainstream. The safe play. Schedule a rebuttal. Hope it gets press coverage, beyond the Tribune and some local tv affiliates. In most situations, Beto's scheduled PC gets little play. So in the coverage vein, this move worked. He is now solidly a part of this discussion.

If anybody else running for office (or who is in office) wants to get a discussion going about actual policy, they needs to drop mention of specific political parties, and instead start running a shit-ton of ads on TV and online and put up billboards that do a few things:

1. Highlight all of the tone-deaf comments by various state leaders, such as somebody bitching that Texas doesn't buy as many guns as California.  Run the shit out of ads where they brag about how easy it is to get guns in Texas,  and plenty of ads with them offering thoughts and prayers, etc.  Also, highlight things like how much money is being funneled from the NRA, etc. to state officials.  Get really fucking specific with the quotes and the money trails.  Basically make them defend this shit.
2. Highlight how much money has been diverted from things like the mental health systems (DSHS - Human Services, etc.) to other areas that they weren't allocated for.
3. Highlight how many of these shooters would have set off red-flags and been stopped if we had solid red-flag laws, and how solid red-flag laws won't affect the average law-abiding gun owner.

Everything else is just political theater meant to distract everybody from the fact that we have 21 dead kids and teachers.  Arming teachers, turning schools into fortresses, etc. all just distracts from the actual perpetrators of these mass killings.

[Pam Cummings 9645]

6 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

I think you’re being absurd. Of course they’re looking for any excuse not to talk about it. And you’re pleased Beto gave them one on a silver platter? 
 

if your idea of “not playing into the fascist’s hands” is literally playing directly into their hands, well, color me perplexed.  I’ve extensively written what I would have preferred to happen to attempt to ratchet up accountability. In a more effective manner. But if you want to play the “well it may not be useful but damnit it makes me feel good to see someone who thinks just like me” well guess what, that sounds like some MAGA groupthink bullshit to me. 
 

 

Beto did what he did and they reacted very predictably. Perhaps that predictably should be used against them? I'm a fan of the strategy of keep creating sparks and eventually something will catch fire.

[Biff Tannen 45691]

35 minutes ago, UnivTex34 said:

I’m actually quite pissed that the US govt is not doing anything either right now. Laws need to be passed at both levels.

Texas passed a law last year that stops state officials from enforcing any federally enacted gun laws.  FYI.

[Js1 85417]

If a mass shooting is a “bad time” for one side to talk gun reform as a cure, why is it then a “good time” for one side to talk about religion as the cure? 

[bad_teammate 13217]

9 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

It seems easier to appoint some new justices to interpret it correctly.

It's a relic of an irrelevant time and was poorly-conceived to begin with.

[JesusSweatDuck 17784]

1 hour ago, softlynow said:

Hard hitting journalism right there. Lloyd Christmas would be riveted. But I guess the average tv news viewer needs this shit spelled out.

Fuck Beto, fuck Abbott.  Both attention whores.  That's all, no CR

[Captainant 27680]

2 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

if your idea of “not playing into the fascist’s hands” is literally playing directly into their hands, well, color me perplexed.  I’ve extensively written what I would have preferred to happen to attempt to ratchet up accountability. In a more effective manner. But if you want to play the “well it may not be useful but damnit it makes me feel good to see someone who thinks just like me” well guess what, that sounds like some MAGA groupthink bullshit to me. 

No, I'm saying that the people who are more OUTRAGED and OFFENDED by Beto's horrific lack of decorum were never going to change their stance. And the people who listen to the decorum snowflakes were never going to listen to reason - they're too busy charging schoolboard meetings to screech about CRT and homosexuality.

I honestly don't think there's anything that could motivate any action whatsoever. Not in the proto-fascist state of Texas where a 15 year old girl can be raped, forced to have the baby, and then murdered by an 18 year old gunman at school. Given that paradigm, ensuring that EVERYONE is talking about the horror and that it's at the center of the discussion is a fair sight better than more hollow goddamn thoughts and prayers and cashed NRA checks.

3 minutes ago, Pam Cummings said:

Beto did what he did and they reacted very predictably. Perhaps that predictably should be used against them? I'm a fan of the strategy of keep creating sparks and eventually something will catch fire.

To wit, Reuters snapped a pulitzer-worthy picture from the moment that really nicely encapsulates the general dialogue on the matter.

[SydneyCarton 48110]

4 minutes ago, Captainant said:

No, I'm saying that the people who are more OUTRAGED and OFFENDED by Beto's horrific lack of decorum were never going to change their stance. And the people who listen to the decorum snowflakes were never going to listen to reason - they're too busy charging schoolboard meetings to screech about CRT and homosexuality.

I honestly don't think there's anything that could motivate any action whatsoever. Not in the proto-fascist state of Texas where a 15 year old girl can be raped, forced to have the baby, and then murdered by an 18 year old gunman at school. Given that paradigm, ensuring that EVERYONE is talking about the horror and that it's at the center of the discussion is a fair sight better than more hollow goddamn thoughts and prayers and cashed NRA checks.

To wit, Reuters snapped a pulitzer-worthy picture from the moment that really nicely encapsulates the general dialogue on the matter.

But that’s my point. That’s not what EVERYONE is talking about now. This isn’t about winning votes, we know this state. But it could be winning the conversation. 
 

this is my last post on this topic, I’ve distracted this thread enough. Infer like I’ve made my point even if folks disagree. 
 

that’s a hell of a pic. I hope he has the balls to publicly draw the parallel to nazis. 

[softlynow 1816]

13 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

If anybody else running for office (or who is in office) wants to get a discussion going about actual policy, they needs to drop mention of specific political parties, and instead start running a shit-ton of ads on TV and online and put up billboards that do a few things:

1. Highlight all of the tone-deaf comments by various state leaders, such as somebody bitching that Texas doesn't buy as many guns as California.  Run the shit out of ads where they brag about how easy it is to get guns in Texas,  and plenty of ads with them offering thoughts and prayers, etc.  Also, highlight things like how much money is being funneled from the NRA, etc. to state officials.  Get really fucking specific with the quotes and the money trails.  Basically make them defend this shit.
2. Highlight how much money has been diverted from things like the mental health systems (DSHS - Human Services, etc.) to other areas that they weren't allocated for.
3. Highlight how many of these shooters would have set off red-flags and been stopped if we had solid red-flag laws, and how solid red-flag laws won't affect the average law-abiding gun owner.

Everything else is just political theater meant to distract everybody from the fact that we have 21 dead kids and teachers.  Arming teachers, turning schools into fortresses, etc. all just distracts from the actual perpetrators of these mass killings.

That sounds nice and all, but it isn't how policy is changed. Unfortunately you have to win at the theater to have a say in policymaking.

[pacman 7359]

52 minutes ago, Seasick Sailor said:

 

6. Require anyone who wants a gun to get liability insurance before they can purchase the gun and require the policy to payout to any victim of your improper use of the firearm and make it a felony to be n possession of an uninsured firearm. Let insurance companies decide whether you are insurable, and if not, tough shit, you don't get a gun. So maybe you pass a background check and avoid any red flags, but let a company with a financial interest in you not using that firearm improperly have a say in whether you owning a firearm is a safe bet. 

7. strict criminal liability for any crime committed using your gun. 

And insurance. 

Interesting take from an insurance salesman. j/k

I haven't heard this approach.

Of course, plenty of folks drive cars without insurance and I am not sure there is any evidence that insurance = safety. However, the financial barrier is at least a deterrent.

I really don't foresee taking action without first reviewing how we got here and working to reverse it.

Study our countries gun violence tendencies.

Study how to combat our citizens who get so isolated and polarized.

More support for families and inclusion in communities.

Mental health support.

More support for local violence prevention and intervention programs

Background checks for gun purchases.

 

•  

[softlynow 1816]

3 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

But that’s my point. That’s not what EVERYONE is talking about now. This isn’t about winning votes, we know this state. But it could be winning the conversation. 
 

this is my last post on this topic, I’ve distracted this thread enough. Infer like I’ve made my point even if folks disagree. 
 

that’s a hell of a pic. I hope he has the balls to publicly draw the parallel to nazis. 

There is no straight-forward way to keep the discussion about policy and the horrible outcomes that you want to prevent. That's not how mass media works.

It isn't how humanity works.

I'm reminded of a quip about Christianity (paraphrase): Jesus was a man who pointed towards a better way of living. Christianity fails us because it focuses not on where he was pointing but on his finger.

Every discussion will break down immediately from the initial message in the directions of all of our individual agendas. You "win" those discussions by realizing that and seizing the opportunity to become the authority on the subject, or a star worthy of many followers.

Your comment on this being a mistake for Beto is only right if it not only doesn't work, but worsens his position.