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Chelsea 2022-2023: America... fuck yeah?

ztejas

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MoJames
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Made it in.  

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Scenes today from training.    

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Finally got him it appears.  

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ztejas

ztejas 43425

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14 minutes ago, Doug E. Fresh said:

£33

This team just look lost right now. Hope I’ve seen the end of Ziyech. If he doesn’t play for his national team, why is he playing for us?

 

 

11 minutes ago, dieucla98 said:

He doesn't play for his national team because he had a falling out with the coach, it's not for lack of talent.

Looks like everyone has had a falling out with Tuchel at this point.

Correct. That said, he was a special brand of terrible today. 

Idk. I said weeks ago we should have just blown the whole thing up instead of adding more random puzzle pieces. There's zero chemistry right now and the tactics are bad on top of it. Which we could get away with if we weren't doing stupid shit like overplaying 50/50 balls as the last defender (which Koulibaly did at least twice) and just straight up giving the ball away. 

For the price tag this is an awful team right now. I'm extremely doubtful that the solution is to just play through it. I'm not sure many - if any - of these guys are enjoying themselves right now. 

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shnsajax

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£33
This team just look lost right now. Hope I’ve seen the end of Ziyech. If he doesn’t play for his national team, why is he playing for us?
 

He doesn’t play for Morocco cause his coach accused him and Mazraoui of faking an injury and both rejected the latest call ups to the national team. The Moroccan coach has had issues at every stop, and Ziyech had zero issues at Ajax under ten Hag.

Based on the track record at Chelsea under Tuchel, I would tend to believe the players and not the coach.
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Doug E. Fresh

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5 hours ago, shnsajax said:


He doesn’t play for Morocco cause his coach accused him and Mazraoui of faking an injury and both rejected the latest call ups to the national team. The Moroccan coach has had issues at every stop, and Ziyech had zero issues at Ajax under ten Hag.

Based on the track record at Chelsea under Tuchel, I would tend to believe the players and not the coach.

Ziyech has been awful for Chelsea. He had a few spectacular goals last year but otherwise has been shit. His two penalty kicks straight into the line, along with his poor touches, we’re a disaster. Reece should never have let him take the second one. I’m done with him and Pulisic. They need to move on (and want to) as they rarely deliver when given their opportunities. Complete opposite of a guy like Chilwell.

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ztejas

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3 hours ago, Doug E. Fresh said:

Ziyech has been awful for Chelsea. He had a few spectacular goals last year but otherwise has been shit. His two penalty kicks straight into the line, along with his poor touches, we’re a disaster. Reece should never have let him take the second one. I’m done with him and Pulisic. They need to move on (and want to) as they rarely deliver when given their opportunities. Complete opposite of a guy like Chilwell.

CP hasn't been utilized properly for over a year now. He isn't a good enough player to excel when he's getting inconsistent minutes, being played out of position and not a featured part of the attack. It's why it was dumb to not sell him in the latest window with TT at the helm. Who knows what we see under a different manager. This goes for a lot of guys on the team that have struggled to make an offensive impact. It isn't a fluke that CP plays much better for the NT. 

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MoJames

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3 hours ago, Doug E. Fresh said:

Ziyech has been awful for Chelsea. He had a few spectacular goals last year but otherwise has been shit. His two penalty kicks straight into the line, along with his poor touches, we’re a disaster. Reece should never have let him take the second one. I’m done with him and Pulisic. They need to move on (and want to) as they rarely deliver when given their opportunities. Complete opposite of a guy like Chilwell.

Agree on Pulisic. It will be refreshing when this thread will no longer have posts in regards to how a specific player on the team is being mistreated or misused and more about the team and tactics.

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ztejas

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2 minutes ago, Doug E. Fresh said:

I like CP but think he’s better suited at a smaller club and not quite the talent we need at Chelsea.

I probably agree but my point is that it's difficult to know when we keep playing a 5'7" winger at striker and wingback. It's not like he hasn't excelled in the past here. We'll see.

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  • ztejas changed the title to Chelsea 2022-2023: America... fuck yeah?
ztejas

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I hope TT lands on his feet. He's a good manager and represented the club well. I don't think he deserved to be fired but he needed to be. He got too in the weeds here both with roster management and lineups. Too many square pegs being fit into round holes. There needed to be a commitment to a full rebuild over the summer and there wasn't - it didn't take much insight to acknowledge the possibility that this wasn't going to work and we'd hit a brick wall. The Kante injury unraveled everything extremely quickly (shocker). 

Unfortunately, we're now stuck with this roster and not only need to find the right manager, but need to find a manager willing to try and sort this mess out. Fortunately, there's a fuck ton of talent to work with - it just needs to be assembled properly.

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APMP

APMP 688

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I hope TT lands on his feet. He's a good manager and represented the club well. I don't think he deserved to be fired but he needed to be. He got too in the weeds here both with roster management and lineups. Too many square pegs being fit into round holes. There needed to be a commitment to a full rebuild over the summer and there wasn't - it didn't take much insight to acknowledge the possibility that this wasn't going to work and we'd hit a brick wall. The Kante injury unraveled everything extremely quickly (shocker). 
Unfortunately, we're now stuck with this roster and not only need to find the right manager, but need to find a manager willing to try and sort this mess out. Fortunately, there's a fuck ton of talent to work with - it just needs to be assembled properly.
It's amazing how many failures a healthy Kante can cover up.
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ztejas

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1 minute ago, APMP said:
5 minutes ago, ztejas said:
I hope TT lands on his feet. He's a good manager and represented the club well. I don't think he deserved to be fired but he needed to be. He got too in the weeds here both with roster management and lineups. Too many square pegs being fit into round holes. There needed to be a commitment to a full rebuild over the summer and there wasn't - it didn't take much insight to acknowledge the possibility that this wasn't going to work and we'd hit a brick wall. The Kante injury unraveled everything extremely quickly (shocker). 
Unfortunately, we're now stuck with this roster and not only need to find the right manager, but need to find a manager willing to try and sort this mess out. Fortunately, there's a fuck ton of talent to work with - it just needs to be assembled properly.

It's amazing how many failures a healthy Kante can cover up.

Avatar checks out. 

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crash_davis

crash_davis 23109

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https://theathletic.com/3576054/2022/09/08/tuchel-sacking-chelsea-potter/?source=twitteruk

It seems like Tuchel stopped giving a shit and that his and his boss' relationships hit rock bottom. That and his shit drove many players to want to leave. 

 

Tuchel did not initiate a single conversation with one first-team player for more than a year, offering no guidance on how the player could get back into his team whenever they fell out of the starting XI. Others who found themselves on the bench or left out of matchday squads entirely for stretches felt they were left similarly isolated, rather than being given advice on how to improve their situations.

The Athletic first reported in January that several of Chelsea’s attackers were beginning to consider leaving the club at the end of the 2021-22 season as a result of how Tuchel used and treated them, and Romelu Lukaku, Timo Werner, Hakim Ziyech, Christian Pulisic and Callum Hudson-Odoi all went into the summer deeply unhappy with their situations. This level of discord presented unwelcome complications for Boehly and Clearlake, who already knew significant spending would be required to re-stock the squad’s heavily depleted defensive options.

Lukaku was allowed to rejoin Inter on loan terms highly favourable to the Serie A club but some close to the Belgian believe he would have been far more open to staying at Chelsea if he had known Tuchel would be leaving.

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But in the second half of his tenure, that approach shifted dramatically. Tuchel did not initiate a single conversation with one first-team player for more than a year, offering no guidance on how the player could get back into his team whenever they fell out of the starting XI. Others who found themselves on the bench or left out of matchday squads entirely for stretches felt they were left similarly isolated, rather than being given advice on how to improve their situations. Despite this, most of the squad sent Tuchel messages to say thank you and good luck when he was dismissed.

The Athletic first reported in January that several of Chelsea’s attackers were beginning to consider leaving the club at the end of the 2021-22 season as a result of how Tuchel used and treated them, and Romelu Lukaku, Timo Werner, Hakim Ziyech, Christian Pulisic and Callum Hudson-Odoi all went into the summer deeply unhappy with their situations. This level of discord presented unwelcome complications for Boehly and Clearlake, who already knew significant spending would be required to re-stock the squad’s heavily depleted defensive options.

Lukaku was allowed to rejoin Inter on loan terms highly favourable to the Serie A club but some close to the Belgian believe he would have been far more open to staying at Chelsea if he had known Tuchel would be leaving. Werner’s desire to leave brought him into open conflict with Tuchel during the US tour, with the two men engaged in a heated argument in the days after Chelsea’s second pre-season friendly against Charlotte FC that was overheard by the other players. The former head coach was surprised when told about the possibility of Werner joining Newcastle United on a cut-price deal. He was eventually granted a permanent transfer back to RB Leipzig at a reduced price.

TuchelStats_Tables-1.png

Pre-season was also the setting for Tuchel to employ the unusual tactic of arranging two separate player meetings: one for those who wanted to stay and fight for the club, and another for those either uncertain about their futures or minded to leave.

The fact that some of those who wanted to leave were then included in Tuchel’s squad to face Everton on the Premier League’s opening weekend, while others who signalled their desire to stay were not, severely undermined his dressing room authority in the view of many inside Chelsea.

Tuchel’s ability as a world-class tactician is not doubted within the Chelsea squad, and there remains huge gratitude towards him from those who played regularly throughout his tenure and those who shared career-defining success with him in Porto — but there is a feeling that he fell short in his ability to manage people.

During the takeover process, the consensus among Chelsea’s new owners was that Tuchel would be central to the project: a proven world-class coach on a par with Pep Guardiola and Jurgen Klopp who was believed to have the emotional intelligence to manage a large squad of international stars, and who could be further empowered within a stable structure. But the extensive time that Boehly and Eghbali spent around the squad throughout pre-season and in the early weeks of the new campaign opened their eyes to the problems on the ground.

In the dressing room and the boardroom, a perception formed of Tuchel as a more detached figure than he had once been. This was also partly fuelled by the upheaval in his private life over recent months: the collapse of his 13-year marriage and his new relationship, both covered in some UK newspapers.

Chelsea’s new owners were determined to take a longer view on whether or not Tuchel was the right fit for the club’s broader new direction. Youth development — both of Cobham graduates and top talents signed from elsewhere, some at significant expense — is being emphasised by Boehly and Clearlake.

Within that context, Tuchel becoming only the second Chelsea coach to give no league minutes to teenagers last season was noted. The impression of distrusting youth was reinforced by his insistence following the Southampton defeat that he had “no one left” to play in central midfield, while leaving Billy Gilmour and summer signing Carney Chukwuemeka unused on his bench.

Then there were the on-field performances: inhibited players making unforced errors, wilting in adversity and looking unable to sustain the level of intensity required to compete in the Premier League or Champions League beyond short bursts. Chelsea’s owners contrasted the first 50 matches of Tuchel’s tenure with the second 50 and found only negative trends, with the defence suffering an alarming dip and the attack continuing to lack fluidity, imagination and ruthlessness.

TuchelStats_Tables3-1.png

Tuchel did not give off the air of a man with the answers, and by the end there was no real confidence he could turn it around.

 

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trythisathome

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1 hour ago, crash_davis said:

https://theathletic.com/3576054/2022/09/08/tuchel-sacking-chelsea-potter/?source=twitteruk

It seems like Tuchel stopped giving a shit and that his and his boss' relationships hit rock bottom. That and his shit drove many players to want to leave. 

 

Tuchel did not initiate a single conversation with one first-team player for more than a year, offering no guidance on how the player could get back into his team whenever they fell out of the starting XI. Others who found themselves on the bench or left out of matchday squads entirely for stretches felt they were left similarly isolated, rather than being given advice on how to improve their situations.

The Athletic first reported in January that several of Chelsea’s attackers were beginning to consider leaving the club at the end of the 2021-22 season as a result of how Tuchel used and treated them, and Romelu Lukaku, Timo Werner, Hakim Ziyech, Christian Pulisic and Callum Hudson-Odoi all went into the summer deeply unhappy with their situations. This level of discord presented unwelcome complications for Boehly and Clearlake, who already knew significant spending would be required to re-stock the squad’s heavily depleted defensive options.

Lukaku was allowed to rejoin Inter on loan terms highly favourable to the Serie A club but some close to the Belgian believe he would have been far more open to staying at Chelsea if he had known Tuchel would be leaving.

 

A lot of this sounds like the same generic shit that comes out about every manager that gets fired, so it's hard for me to put much stock in it. At the same time, The Athletic's reporting is usually pretty good, so Idk. 

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