January 6th Committee Hearings Thread of Dominance

[WhatTheBuck 28791]

On 7/14/2022 at 5:02 PM, TXSG8R said:

What pillar was Joe Biden the candidate a moderate on exactly?  He promised to get rid of student debt, elect a black woman to the SC, kill fossil fuels, yada yada. He’s being crushed by the left for not eliminating student debt, and the majority of the party doesn’t want him to run again. It’s largely impossible to be a moderate in any party leadership position, and absolutely impossible on the right. 

 

14 hours ago, TXSG8R said:

I don’t know where you or BLKNSTY interpreted what I said meant anything radical or extreme. I said you couldn’t be in party leadership if you don’t support the party pillars. Joe electing a black woman is totally in line with the DNC platform. The two party system forces both sides to align more and more to rigid pillars, and that purity test is now moving down to the rank and file party members. 

It’s the natural interpretation of the words you used. Diversity is a pretty long-standing platform of the Dems. (Geraldine Ferraro says hello.) What was it when Donald Trump promised to nominate a woman? Amy Coney Barrett is a religious loon who lied during her confirmation hearings (and we all knew it) Her appointment was much more radical than that of Ketanji Brown Jackson. A reasonable person might conclude it’s the “black” part that you find immoderate. 

[RomaVicta 29941]

6 hours ago, NWBuck said:

And wasn't there a ton of phone call transcripts that were stored on a top-secret server and couldn't be accessed for the Mueller investigation? Wouldn't the current staff have those passwords and such?

Not to mention that President Trump's schedule and call logs were empty. Veddy unusual.

Having ruminated on the SS issue a little more I wondering what this inspector general is up to. I'll quote this again from my original Washington Post quotes:

Quote

Cuffari, nominated by Trump in 2019 and confirmed by the Senate, has faced significant criticism since he took over the office. His first-year audits plummeted to historic lows, he clashed with Immigration and Customs Enforcement over the veracity of an inspection of a detention center, and he blocked investigations into the Secret Service’s handling of protests in Lafayette Square following the murder of George Floyd and the spread of the coronavirus in the agency’s ranks, documents show.

I still think both sides of this tussle are dirty due to bowing to Trump.

As far as Cuffari, I now wonder if his play is actually to muddy the waters about whatever will be recovered. Trump and his band of liars can attack the evidence as incomplete or all fake because the SS had innocently not backed up the originals.

It's hard to see Cuffari as an honest party in all of this.

 

As for the committee seeking these texts earlier, they may have assumed the SS was acting neutrally. They may not have known about the conflict in the limo, and the SS laxing security to allow armed insurrectionists to get near the president. The second point seems the most damning. If you can refuse to let the president seize the steering wheel of the limo, you will likely be very inclined to ignore his order allowing armed people flook the area near him.

I don't know how much the committee knew about these things prior to Hutchinson. Or maybe they knew and are just making it part of the timeline they've so elegantly presented. 

There are very elite lawyers on that panel. Some prosecutors. I think it's fair to call the Dems in general bumblers, but I don't think it's true of this panel dominated by Dems.

 

 

[Hagbard Celine 10883]

4 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Goddammit.

"January 6 investigators, in conjunction with Cuffari, are also examining whether the missing texts can be reconstructed using forensic tools available to federal law enforcement, the Guardian first reported."

(narrator: they don't need to reconstruct anything; if they want to go get them, they are already stored in bluffdale)

 

[Bozo_Casanova 26504]

41 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

There are very elite lawyers on that panel.

Top. Men.

[chainsaw 9872]

Surely there is a way to recover these messages.

[immamac 42872]

Could be iMessage and apple will play ball with fed gov subpoena. 

 

Assuming the handsets with the private keys are still available, if they destroyed the physical phone and iMessage then it's gone. 

[Sawbonz 27580]

Has to be Snapchat right?

[chainsaw 9872]

23 minutes ago, immamac said:

Could be iMessage and apple will play ball with fed gov subpoena. 

 

Assuming the handsets with the private keys are still available, if they destroyed the physical phone and iMessage then it's gone. 

Is it possible to destroy iMessage but not the physical phone?

[GhostOfTomJoad 9340]

Cross posting because fuck traitors to this country.

[CooterBrown 18015]

I’d guess the feds don’t use iMessage or even traditional cellular carriers. Seems like they’d be too easily compromised by Russia. They probably have something like First Net for first responders.

[chainsaw 9872]

3 minutes ago, CooterBrown said:

I’d guess the feds don’t use iMessage or even traditional cellular carriers. Seems like they’d be too easily compromised by Russia. They probably have something like First Net for first responders.

If that is true, then I don't think anyone could delete their own messages unrecoverably unless they were given a gargantuan assist from a higher-up.

[atomheartbevo 89737]

 

[GopherRock 1765]

2 hours ago, GhostOfTomJoad said:

 

 

Cross posting because fuck traitors to this country.

 

And they're letting him do that time in civilian prison? Here's hoping he can do his stint in the stockade at Fort Leavenworth. 

[tokamak 6432]

The fact that the military is signing up known traitors seems like our concern, dude. 

[Horn Dog 9877]

3 hours ago, GhostOfTomJoad said:

 

 

Cross posting because fuck traitors to this country.

 

“"Those police officers did not deserve what happened to them," a tearful Mault told the judge before he was sentenced. "As a soldier ... I should have known better."

 

 

Edited July 16, 2022 by Horn Dog

[RDCanecutter 26454]

2 minutes ago, tokamak said:

The fact that the military is signing up known fat-ass elderly traitors seems like our concern, dude. 

fify bc dude looks like a greybeard bmi 38.

[Pig Bellmont 8719]

 

[Biff Tannen 45692]

1 hour ago, Pig Bellmont said:

 

This is actually WAY darker than it seems at first glance.  The idea that this woman thought they were there to "have fun" is illustrative of the complete disconnect from reality these people have and it permeates into their friends and family.  This is why half of this country is fundamentally broken.  This isn't just a fringe movement.  This is the VAST MAJORITY of people who consider themselves "conservative'.

[Underdog 28742]

Bring her in as an accomplice. 

[TXSG8R 3362]

9 hours ago, WhatTheBuck said:

 

It’s the natural interpretation of the words you used. Diversity is a pretty long-standing platform of the Dems. (Geraldine Ferraro says hello.) What was it when Donald Trump promised to nominate a woman? Amy Coney Barrett is a religious loon who lied during her confirmation hearings (and we all knew it) Her appointment was much more radical than that of Ketanji Brown Jackson. A reasonable person might conclude it’s the “black” part that you find immoderate. 

Holy shit dude go back and read page 66. You’re violently agreeing with me. I completely agree that Joe Biden is completely in line with the DNC platform. Even if he wasn’t a full on blue liberal (he is), the entire OP was that to get to any party leadership position, you can’t be on the fence (moderate) about any party pillars. Joe Manchin is the example of what I’m saying. You can’t hedge on either side, and it drives things towards binary, polarized positions. We don’t have blue dog democrats or country club republicans anymore. They can’t exist in our current hyper partisan reality. 

[scottsins 1968]

I still think both sides of this tussle are dirty due to bowing to Trump.
As far as Cuffari, I now wonder if his play is actually to muddy the waters about whatever will be recovered. Trump and his band of liars can attack the evidence as incomplete or all fake because the SS had innocently not backed up the originals.
It's hard to see Cuffari as an honest party in all of this.
 
As for the committee seeking these texts earlier, they may have assumed the SS was acting neutrally. They may not have known about the conflict in the limo, and the SS laxing security to allow armed insurrectionists to get near the president. The second point seems the most damning. If you can refuse to let the president seize the steering wheel of the limo, you will likely be very inclined to ignore his order allowing armed people flook the area near him.
I don't know how much the committee knew about these things prior to Hutchinson. Or maybe they knew and are just making it part of the timeline they've so elegantly presented. 
There are very elite lawyers on that panel. Some prosecutors. I think it's fair to call the Dems in general bumblers, but I don't think it's true of this panel dominated by Dems.
 
 

Shouldn’t the Committee been after these messages once the Pence kidnapping thing surfaced? That was some time ago, IIRC.

[Bullneck 19184]

On 7/15/2022 at 6:37 PM, Sawbonz said:

 

Who the fuck is is this guy in the orange shirt?  He's way too smug about letting in a bunch of loons to talk to a loon.  

[CooterBrown 18015]

If that is true, then I don't think anyone could delete their own messages unrecoverably unless they were given a gargantuan assist from a higher-up.

If communication protocols are so lax around the President’s security detail that it’s even possible to delete messages and for them to be unrecoverable, that’s a huge cause of concern in and of itself.

[RomaVicta 29941]

19 minutes ago, CooterBrown said:

If communication protocols are so lax around the President’s security detail that it’s even possible to delete messages and for them to be unrecoverable, that’s a huge cause of concern in and of itself.

Exactly. The Secret Service for the White House needs to be removed root and branch.

[Dutchrudder 11142]

3 hours ago, CooterBrown said:

If communication protocols are so lax around the President’s security detail that it’s even possible to delete messages and for them to be unrecoverable, that’s a huge cause of concern in and of itself.

What if those involved knew they shouldn't be doing what they were doing on their work phones, and instead used an app like Signal to avoid record keeping? What if they did this because they knew they were doing something illegal?  It almost sounds like it was premeditated, and everybody knew what they were doing was against the law...

[kevwun 15807]

The software we looked at for archiving texts on phones specified that you had to turn off imessaging on iPhones because of apple’s encryption.  Not sure if that’s the case with all of the systems that do that or not.

[CooterBrown 18015]

On 7/16/2022 at 10:21 PM, Dutchrudder said:

What if those involved knew they shouldn't be doing what they were doing on their work phones, and instead used an app like Signal to avoid record keeping? What if they did this because they knew they were doing something illegal?  It almost sounds like it was premeditated, and everybody knew what they were doing was against the law...

They would have to be using private phones which I would assume is a fireable offense for those positions. There's no way Secret Service provided cell phones allow users to install anything beyond what they provide.  

[TwiceHorn 31510]

On 7/16/2022 at 6:21 PM, scottsins said:

Shouldn’t the Committee been after these messages once the Pence kidnapping thing surfaced? That was some time ago, IIRC.

As noted upthread, between the Pence thing and what SS knew about the potential for violence on 1/6, you would have thought they'd have received a pretty serious document request/subpoena from the Committee.  And from what I have seen, the Committee has gone broad on those, sometimes overbroad.

[Gourmand 7774]

On 7/16/2022 at 5:51 PM, TXSG8R said:

Holy shit dude go back and read page 66. You’re violently agreeing with me. I completely agree that Joe Biden is completely in line with the DNC platform. Even if he wasn’t a full on blue liberal (he is), the entire OP was that to get to any party leadership position, you can’t be on the fence (moderate) about any party pillars. Joe Manchin is the example of what I’m saying. You can’t hedge on either side, and it drives things towards binary, polarized positions. We don’t have blue dog democrats or country club republicans anymore. They can’t exist in our current hyper partisan reality. 

This is complete nonsense, just as your previous post in which you declared Joe Biden made extreme left campaign promises such as eliminating student loan debt and "killing fossil fuels" when, in fact, he never made such promises and you are reinventing the past to fit a flawed argument. Biden's main campaign promise had everything to do with getting covid under control through vaccinations and mask policies while getting the economy back on track through the coronavirus relief package. He never promised to "kill the fossil fuel industry" unless you think that is synonymous with rejoining the Paris Accord, and he absolutely never made any promises to get rid of student debt. In fact, his stance on loan forgiveness of up to a max of 10K per person was a response to the actual meat that Bernie and Warren put on the table. His response was extremely moderate to their policy proposal wrt student loan forgiveness (they were saying cancel 95-100%), and you're arguing that to get to a leadership position in the party, you can't be moderate???? 

Joe Biden was the ultimate CENTRIST candidate put forth by Dem primary voters for the explicit purpose of defeating Donald Trump. His ultra-moderate positions and perceived electability was what propelled him to defeat Bernie and Warren, two partisan progressives who are clearly to his left. His moderate milquetoast belief that everything will be okay if we just strive for bipartisan agreement and believe really hard in the awesomeness of the D.C institutions is exactly why he is unpopular with Democratic voters.

 

[SizzleChest 8284]

 

[TXSG8R 3362]

8 hours ago, Gourmand said:

This is complete nonsense, just as your previous post in which you declared Joe Biden made extreme left campaign promises such as eliminating student loan debt and "killing fossil fuels" when, in fact, he never made such promises and you are reinventing the past to fit a flawed argument. Biden's main campaign promise had everything to do with getting covid under control through vaccinations and mask policies while getting the economy back on track through the coronavirus relief package. He never promised to "kill the fossil fuel industry" unless you think that is synonymous with rejoining the Paris Accord, and he absolutely never made any promises to get rid of student debt. In fact, his stance on loan forgiveness of up to a max of 10K per person was a response to the actual meat that Bernie and Warren put on the table. His response was extremely moderate to their policy proposal wrt student loan forgiveness (they were saying cancel 95-100%), and you're arguing that to get to a leadership position in the party, you can't be moderate???? 

Joe Biden was the ultimate CENTRIST candidate put forth by Dem primary voters for the explicit purpose of defeating Donald Trump. His ultra-moderate positions and perceived electability was what propelled him to defeat Bernie and Warren, two partisan progressives who are clearly to his left. His moderate milquetoast belief that everything will be okay if we just strive for bipartisan agreement and believe really hard in the awesomeness of the D.C institutions is exactly why he is unpopular with Democratic voters.

 

I feel like I’m taking crazy pills. I said to be in a party leadership position you have to support party pillars. Nothing Joe has done is counter to any DNC pillars. I never said he was hyper partisan or extreme in any of his positions. The things I listed aren’t extreme examples, they align with DNC party pillars. You are taking moderate out of the context I used it in. I completely agree Biden is a moderate. I said you couldn’t be moderate about a party pillar. You can’t be on the fence about being pro choice and be in DNC leadership. Same for being pro life as a Republican. You can’t avoid the answer or hem and haw about it. Hence the entire discussion about polarization and binary positions. 

[TXSG8R 3362]

On 7/16/2022 at 10:21 PM, Dutchrudder said:

What if those involved knew they shouldn't be doing what they were doing on their work phones, and instead used an app like Signal to avoid record keeping? What if they did this because they knew they were doing something illegal?  It almost sounds like it was premeditated, and everybody knew what they were doing was against the law...

I can’t speak for the SS, but I know for DoD phones you can’t install any apps. They are completely locked down and you consent to monitoring of everything you do on that phone. 

[TwiceHorn 31510]

2 hours ago, SizzleChest said:

 

It will be interesting if they can keep Trumpkins off the jury.  I don't think we've seen anything about jury makeup from the rioters cases and they are a bit less explicitly political.

[PhillyD 1257]

14 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

It will be interesting if they can keep Trumpkins off the jury.  I don't think we've seen anything about jury makeup from the rioters cases and they are a bit less explicitly political.

I say this in all seriousness as a DC resident over 15 years.  You would be hard pressed to find a Trumpkin if you were forced to put one on a DC jury.  There just aren't that many to choose from in the general population, and that population gets really small in a jury pool.

[Fastbreak 3988]

I say this in all seriousness as a DC resident over 15 years.  You would be hard pressed to find a Trumpkin if you were forced to put one on a DC jury.  There just aren't that many to choose from in the general population, and that population gets really small in a jury pool.

I was questioning this, so I googled.

67% turnout
92% to 5% vote

Good job DC!

[TexasEd 8067]

12 minutes ago, Fastbreak said:

I was questioning this, so I googled.

67% turnout
92% to 5% vote

Good job DC!

but their votes don't count towards the EC, do they.

 

Edit: I guess they get 3

Edited July 19, 2022 by TexasEd

[Fastbreak 3988]

but their votes don't count towards the EC, do they.
 
Edit: I guess they get 3

I’m for them getting 300

[David Dennison 18937]

[Dutchrudder 11142]

15 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

That rule seems pretty reasonable. The Attorney General wants any investigation into Presidential candidates to have his approval. It's not saying they cannot investigate, they just need his/her approval. Given the scrutiny of an investigation like that, it would seem to be a fair request, although I would have hoped any investigation by the DoJ into a super high profile person would get the AG's attention and review. That should be part of the job. 

[horn4life 3768]

Hell just add the Secret Service to the Department of Justice and the Supreme Court to the list of institutions Trump corrupted... With the gleeful participation of Republicans who actually believed they were doing the will of God, or trying to save the white race, or whatever other tin hat shit the Secret Service agents protecting Trump believed.

[TexPx 2323]

Bennie Thompson tested Covid positive.

[wildcat09 29355]

 

Abolish the Secret Service.

[Sbbruin 21864]

8 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

 

Abolish the Secret Service.

Don't abolish.  But hold people criminally accoun  table.

[PhillyD 1257]

1 hour ago, Sbbruin said:

Don't abolish.  But hold people criminally accoun  table.

I think there needs to be a huge purge and I know that must be a gargantuan task.  I also realize that finding qualified people to do all of those jobs would be a massive undertaking and you can't just abolish and expect things to run as normal.  However, a lot of heads need to roll.  Someone mentioned upthread that maybe some pensions need to go missing until those texts are found and that sums up how I feel about it.  Some high ranking (and probably quite a few low-ranking) officials need to sit in a jail cell as an example on this one.  Those lost messages are completely unacceptable, and I no longer trust that agency.  I'm not sure it can recover my trust.

[Brisketexan 105161]

1 minute ago, PhillyD said:

I think there needs to be a huge purge and I know that must be a gargantuan task.  I also realize that finding qualified people to do all of those jobs would be a massive undertaking and you can't just abolish and expect things to run as normal.  However, a lot of heads need to roll.  Someone mentioned upthread that maybe some pensions need to go missing until those texts are found and that sums up how I feel about it.  Some high ranking (and probably quite a few low-ranking) officials need to sit in a jail cell as an example on this one.  Those lost messages are completely unacceptable, and I no longer trust that agency.  I'm not sure it can recover my trust.

You shouldn't recover your trust.  They have clearly chosen a side in the ongoing civil war, and it's the wrong one.  They deleted incriminating information -- that was property of the United States, and had material relevance to an attempted overthrow of the United States government -- on purpose, knowing that it violated the law.

Based on the gravity of the underlying subject matter, they should each be subject to the maximum penalty of three years in prison.  Every.  Single.  One. who deleted messages from those days.

Quote

(a)

Whoever willfully and unlawfully conceals, removes, mutilates, obliterates, or destroys, or attempts to do so, or, with intent to do so takes and carries away any record, proceeding, map, book, paper, document, or other thing, filed or deposited with any clerk or officer of any court of the United States, or in any public office, or with any judicial or public officer of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.

(b)

Whoever, having the custody of any such record, proceeding, map, book, document, paper, or other thing, willfully and unlawfully conceals, removes, mutilates, obliterates, falsifies, or destroys the same, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both; and shall forfeit his office and be disqualified from holding any office under the United States. As used in this subsection, the term “office” does not include the office held by any person as a retired officer of the Armed Forces of the United States.

The USSS is a fifth column within the US government, working against the interests of the Republic in plain and open violation of US laws.  Treat them like what they are.

[wildcat09 29355]

It’s fucking absurd that we’re just learning about this 18 fucking months later. This should’ve been publicly known by the end of January 2021.

[Neonmoon 38129]

It's amazing how many layers of the government were involved in the coup. 

And yet zero accountability. 

If I were President, I wouldn't feel super confident about my protection. 

[Pato del Muerto 52531]

Yeah totally spontaneous and unplanned 

[jimmyjazz 45992]

Heads need to roll at the Secret Service from the top down (hey-o).  At some point you get to the rank and file, which constitute the vast majority of those in service, and most wouldn't need to be replaced.  Anyone who complied with what is an illegal order -- think US military -- would not get my sympathy and would (in my opinion) be subject to prosecution along with (obviously) loss of employment.

This shit needs to stop.  Biden and the DOJ need to go full tilt on all of it.

[Biff Tannen 45692]

Well I'm sure there was nothing important in those texts.  We should probably not worry.  Oh, also, we're fucked.