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Active shooter thread

Hugo Stiglitz

By Hugo Stiglitz
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4th&Five
4th&Five

Fuck off. You vote for this shit. Explain that to your kids. 

Pancho
Pancho

3rd leg of my move from Houston to the Bay Area, and I made it to LA.   I’m just now catching up on the news in my hotel.  I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again—I don’t have kids, but this e

royiv
royiv

WTF world are we living in when people are having a discussion about survival rates of certain rounds? People are being terrorized by gun violence and we're discussing which bullet has worse/better ch

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David Dennison

David Dennison 18952

Posted
Posted
50 minutes ago, American Swindle said:

I'm coming from a Constitutionally grounded position which is simply neither the 1A nor 2A shall be infringed upon so my opinion on whether one is more or less regulated vs the other matters not.  

Just cut to the chase and get to the gotcha moment!

Well, both are regulated, so there is a constitutionally acceptable level of infringement.

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Chuckie Finster

Chuckie Finster 22758

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, American Swindle said:

 I know it's difficult for many to look at things this way shortly after the wake of such atrocities, but I think Massie makes a great point here.  In the end, one inherently has the right to protect themselves and their property from the threat of violence and force.

 

 

Republicans: Six highly trained police officers took 58 rounds to take down a shooter.

Also Republicans:  GIVE EVERY TEACHER A GUN

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DDD Dad

DDD Dad 14364

Posted
Posted
You still can't deny history or the slippery slope example of the abridgment of 1A rights in the UK from the example I gave after they implemented strict gun control.  
And your Apache Helicopter example can arguably used as the same reason people should be armed.  It's literally why the 2nd amendment was so important to the founders.  I'm still against any infringement on the 2A and can acknowledge you aren't.  And guess what? It's ok.     

The U.K. has a 1A?
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Bozo_Casanova

Bozo_Casanova 26582

Posted
Posted

 

1 hour ago, American Swindle said:

 

infringe definition is - to encroach upon in a way that violates law or the rights of another. How to use infringe in a sentence:

The government shall make no law that infringes upon the 1st or 2nd amendment.  

Thus, I feel like being shot to death by a terrorist or mental ill graduate student enabled by poor Federal controls "infringes" on my right to bear arms. 

tenor.gif?itemid=11732011

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DixonHur

DixonHur 11395

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Brisketexan said:


Extrapolate that. If the right to protect property is absolute, then I should be able to rig claymores to take out intruders, right?
And of course....the REASON the cops needed overkill was because the killer had...a weapon and magazine that we shouldn’t have allowed in the first place.
If we start letting people walk tigers on a leash, then you’ll make the argument that we all need tigers to protect ourselves from the other tigers.

I just have one question...do I need a concealed carry permit for my suitcase nuke?  

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retread

retread 2951

Posted
Posted

I mean, think of all the scare tactics promulgated by right-wing radio and tv. RushFoxHannity told us over and over about dirty bombs, suitcase nukes, and suicide bombers in shopping malls. They got the terror part right, but they didn't tell us it would be their minions carrying it out.

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LonghornJudas

LonghornJudas 1109

Posted
Posted
14 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

9 dead, 27 injured in 30 seconds

4 dead, 2 injured in 7200 seconds

You didn't really expand on it, so are you saying that kills/injures/injuries leading to death per minute is a metric (not the only one) that you would use to define regulation of an object?

BTW, I do support stricter gun laws. I support a larger scale gun buyback program. I support stricter licensing and shorter renewal periods. I support not having magazines larger than 10 rounds (despite it really not making much of a difference). I'd also like to see more states with Red Flag type laws because I believe there's good faith intention to call attention to people who could be danger to themselves and others, and there's some small amount of quantifiable data showing this reduces the suicide rate. BUT I also support a person's right to due process, which states like Oregon don't give, especially those who have not ever committed a crime.

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DixonHur

DixonHur 11395

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, retread said:

I mean, think of all the scare tactics promulgated by right-wing radio and tv. RushFoxHannity told us over and over about dirty bombs, suitcase nukes, and suicide bombers in shopping malls. They got the terror part right, but they didn't tell us it would be their minions carrying it out.

They also warned us about activist judges...I'm seeing a pattern...

accusation = confession

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 46300

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, LonghornJudas said:

You didn't really expand on it, so are you saying that kills/injures/injuries leading to death per minute is a metric (not the only one) that you would use to define regulation of an object?

I certainly think it should be accounted for. 

I knew the moment I saw that headline early this morning that it would come up as an example of how ANY weapon can be used to kill multiple people.  (I'm not accusing you of making that argument, by the way, but I've seen it elsewhere.)  It's just such an intellectually stunted point of view.  Regulations exist for many reasons, but one is most certainly rooted in the concept of balancing public safety with individual freedom.  Yesterday's knife attackS (plural) were separated in time and place, and probably represented just about the "best" one could do in terms of killing multiple people with a knife in a relatively short length of time.  Had the killer tried to take out a crowded bar, he would have been subdued within seconds by bystanders -- perhaps he would have killed a couple of people, but there is no way in hell he would have killed or injured 36 victims.  For one thing, it's pretty easy to run away from a knife.  

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GW Hayduke

GW Hayduke 1953

Posted
Posted
21 minutes ago, LonghornJudas said:

You didn't really expand on it, so are you saying that kills/injures/injuries leading to death per minute is a metric (not the only one) that you would use to define regulation of an object?

BTW, I do support stricter gun laws. I support a larger scale gun buyback program. I support stricter licensing and shorter renewal periods. I support not having magazines larger than 10 rounds (despite it really not making much of a difference). I'd also like to see more states with Red Flag type laws because I believe there's good faith intention to call attention to people who could be danger to themselves and others, and there's some small amount of quantifiable data showing this reduces the suicide rate. BUT I also support a person's right to due process, which states like Oregon don't give, especially those who have not ever committed a crime.

A way to look at mass shootings/murder is by frequency and magnitude. Death per minute is a metric to understand magnitude. Rate of fire, caliber, capacity, etc. all have an influence on the magnitude of these mass shootings. 

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SuingToGetAMessageBoard?

SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861

Posted
Posted

interview with washington examiner the day before

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/trump-supporters-confront-protesters-at-el-paso-memorial

Quote

Thomas Bartram, 21, said he had driven his truck, complete with banner of the president dressed as Rambo, from Houston to make a point.

“It seemed like the right thing to do, to come out and support Trump. He’s getting a lot of criticism,” he said.

He added that he was “an open-carry kind of guy” at political rallies but had opted not to bring his gun because of the nature of the tragedy.  

“It’s a funeral so it didn’t seem like the right thing to do,” he said.

 

same dude:

 

https://www.alamy.com/dallas-texas-usa-5th-may-2018-thomas-bartram-20-of-houston-carries-a-ptr-91-rifle-on-his-back-and-a-come-and-take-it-gonzales-flag-during-a-protest-organized-by-open-carry-texas-oct-on-the-sidelines-of-the-national-rifle-association-nra-annual-meeting-on-saturday-may-5-2018-in-dallas-texas-2018-patrick-t-fallon-credit-patrick-fallonzuma-wirealamy-live-news-image244620562.html

 

same dude:

Quote
Thomas Graham BartramFebruary 20, 2019 at 3:06 pm

Open carry is how we protest and show loudly and proudly that the gun culture in this country is alive and well and growing in numbers and let people know yes you do in fact have the RIGHT to carry a firearm on your person.
FIGHTING TYRANNY AND FIGHTING FOR YOU RIGHTS THAT MIND YOU ARE BEING TAKEN INCH BY INCH EVERY DAY BY TRAITORS, STANDING UP FOR YOU !@#$ING BIRTHRIGHT, IS NOT “BAD MANNERS”!!!!!! us gun owners need to be open carrying every chance we get and if a store wont let you shop there because your exercising your 2ndA rights then they are AMERICAN the are the ENEMY, leave them a 1 star review every where and let them know im not going to do business with you because your UN-American and obviously give 0 !@#$s about what this country stands for !@!# u, maybe word it a little better but that is about the proper response to that kinda non sense.

“1776 WILL COMMONSENSE AGAIN IF YOU TRY TO TAKE OUR FIRE ARMS!!!!!!!”
-Alex Jones

same dude:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mGg1b7IziTc

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EMAWesome

EMAWesome 101

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, jimmyjazz said:

9 dead, 27 injured in 30 seconds

4 dead, 2 injured in 7200 seconds

Dead is dead.  I'm sure the victims families feel so much better that the victims weren't part of a mass shooting.  The issue isn't gun control.  The issue is people who want to kill other people control.

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hayden_horn

hayden_horn 11365

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, EMAWesome said:

Dead is dead.  I'm sure the victims families feel so much better that the victims weren't part of a mass shooting.  The issue isn't gun control.  The issue is people who want to kill other people control.

a94a24b2-7b3f-4f2d-ab3c-2f202254c359_scr

now imagine if that knife wielder had an assault rifle with 100 round mags.

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jimmyjazz

jimmyjazz 46300

Posted
Posted
13 minutes ago, EMAWesome said:

Kind of strange how the media is ignoring this one.  It's almost like they can't use it to promote their position on a political issue or something.

Except for the fact that it has been reported in every major media outlet, you might have a point.

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Longhornfan1024

Longhornfan1024 1707

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, jimmyjazz said:

Except for the fact that it has been reported in every major media outlet, you might have a point.

That's one of my favorite conservative moron arguments.  "It's nice how the media is ignoring this event" while posting a link to the media reporting on the event.  Okay, dumbass.

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105465

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Except for the fact that it has been reported in every major media outlet, you might have a point.

 

4 minutes ago, Longhornfan1024 said:

That's one of my favorite conservative moron arguments.  "It's nice how the media is ignoring this event" while posting a link to the media reporting on the event.  Okay, dumbass.

Gaslighting 101.  And the thing is, I actually think they're lying mostly to themselves, to validate their fucked-up worldview that everyone is out to silence them.

This happens all the goddamned time -- "you won't see this in the media".....and it's fucking all over all major media.  Truth and reality have no fucking place in the modern "conservative" worldview, and that's the foundational problem from which most of this asinine fuckery springs.

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Fudge Nuggets

Fudge Nuggets 19229

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, American Swindle said:

 I know it's difficult for many to look at things this way shortly after the wake of such atrocities, but I think Massie makes a great point here.  In the end, one inherently has the right to protect themselves and their property from the threat of violence and force.

 

 

Cop that killed the woman while shooting at a dog counters his "point" that police officers are brave, trained and alert.

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LonghornJudas

LonghornJudas 1109

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

I certainly think it should be accounted for. 

I knew the moment I saw that headline early this morning that it would come up as an example of how ANY weapon can be used to kill multiple people.  (I'm not accusing you of making that argument, by the way, but I've seen it elsewhere.)  It's just such an intellectually stunted point of view.  Regulations exist for many reasons, but one is most certainly rooted in the concept of balancing public safety with individual freedom.  Yesterday's knife attackS (plural) were separated in time and place, and probably represented just about the "best" one could do in terms of killing multiple people with a knife in a relatively short length of time.  Had the killer tried to take out a crowded bar, he would have been subdued within seconds by bystanders -- perhaps he would have killed a couple of people, but there is no way in hell he would have killed or injured 36 victims.  For one thing, it's pretty easy to run away from a knife.  

Agreed, and I was not trying to make an equivalence between the two. I was also being genuine with my question about using that data use. I work with data every day and am constantly getting people to try and separate their opinions from it.

I, too, believe that it can/should be considered to show magnitude. Credit to GW for picking a good word.

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RomaVicta

RomaVicta 30033

Posted
Posted

Trump supporters show up at a memorial to chant for Trump and brandish weapons.

Other obnoxious Trumpers showed up at a Warren rally a few days ago.

They're looking for a fight. It appears that they may be willing to be outnumbered and overwhelmed to make the case for white victimhood followed by white vengeance.

Shits ramping up.

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elfenix

elfenix 34344

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Longhornfan1024 said:

That's one of my favorite conservative moron arguments.  "It's nice how the media is ignoring this event" while posting a link to the media reporting on the event.  Okay, dumbass.

right up there with asking why twitter won't ban an account but not linking to tweets b/c the account has been banned

Edited by elfenix
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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105465

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

Trump supporters show up at a memorial to chant for Trump and brandish weapons.

Other obnoxious Trumpers showed up at a Warren rally a few days ago.

They're looking for a fight. It appears that they may be willing to be outnumbered and overwhelmed to make the case for white victimhood followed by white vengeance.

Shits ramping up.

But remember, we need to take Congressional action to declare Antifa to be the REAL threat.

I have pretty much zero chance of getting killed by an Antifa dude.  I have a now very real chance of being killed by one of these white nationalist fucksticks, simply because of where I shop and such.  But yeah....Antifa is what we should be worried about.  

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