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Active shooter thread

Hugo Stiglitz

By Hugo Stiglitz
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4th&Five
4th&Five

Fuck off. You vote for this shit. Explain that to your kids. 

Pancho
Pancho

3rd leg of my move from Houston to the Bay Area, and I made it to LA.   I’m just now catching up on the news in my hotel.  I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again—I don’t have kids, but this e

royiv
royiv

WTF world are we living in when people are having a discussion about survival rates of certain rounds? People are being terrorized by gun violence and we're discussing which bullet has worse/better ch

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hayden_horn

hayden_horn 11362

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, dcar00 said:

holy shit dude.  Its pretty apparent I'm not the one who is brain damaged.  where the fuck do you live?

what are you talking about? there was and is a reason @Snacks would always post "please don't be black." white guy shooter = "had a bad day," brown person, "religion of peace."

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Vito Andolini

Vito Andolini 9126

Posted
Posted

I hate using the NY Post, but:

The suspect in the Boulder King Soopers shooting has been charged with 10 counts of first-degree murder, police said on Tuesday.

Boulder Police Chief Maris Harold identified the alleged gunman in Monday’s massacre as Ahmad Al Aliwi Alissa 21, of Arvada, about 20 miles south of Boulder.
 

https://nypost.com/2021/03/23/police-identify-ahmad-alyssa-21-as-suspect-in-boulder-shooting/
 

The shirtless, balding, bloody fat guy in handcuffs was a 21 year old of middle eastern ancestry? Does not compute.

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GW Hayduke

GW Hayduke 1953

Posted
Posted

 

36 minutes ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

I'm all for implementing a universal background check system that is free and can take place between two law abiding citizens without otherwise inconveniencing them.

This is root of most of our problems. Folks against solving problems in our society due to convenience.  

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BrazilHorn

BrazilHorn 6591

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, Vito Andolini said:

I hate using the NY Post, but:

The suspect in the Boulder King Soopers shooting has been charged with 10 counts of first-degree murder, police said on Tuesday.

Boulder Police Chief Maris Harold identified the alleged gunman in Monday’s massacre as Ahmad Al Aliwi Alissa 21, of Arvada, about 20 miles south of Boulder.
 

https://nypost.com/2021/03/23/police-identify-ahmad-alyssa-21-as-suspect-in-boulder-shooting/
 

The shirtless, balding, bloody fat guy in handcuffs was a 21 year old of middle eastern ancestry? Does not compute.

Now that is an alliteration.

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bolverk

bolverk 29671

Posted
Posted

Authorities on Tuesday identified the suspect in the shooting deaths of 10 people at a King Soopers grocery store in Boulder, Colorado, as 21-year-old Ahmad Al Aliwi Alissa, whose brother said he was deeply disturbed.

Alissa, who is from Arvada, has been charged with 10 counts of first-degree murder for the massacre. He was taken into custody after being shot during apprehension.

Ali Aliwi Alissa, the suspect’s 34-year-old brother, told The Daily Beast that authorities searched his house all night after the shooting.

Alissa described his brother as “very anti-social” and paranoid, adding that, in high school, he would describe “being chased, someone is behind him, someone is looking for him.”

“When he was having lunch with my sister in a restaurant, he said, ‘People are in the parking lot, they are looking for me.’ She went out, and there was no one. We didn’t know what was going on in his head,” Alissa said, admitting that he believes his brother is mentally ill.

https://news.yahoo.com/cops-identify-suspect-boulder-supermarket-150041598.html

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dcar00

dcar00 14181

Posted
Posted
27 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

what are you talking about? there was and is a reason @Snacks would always post "please don't be black." white guy shooter = "had a bad day," brown person, "religion of peace."

should I hope they aren't white?  or should I hope dumbasses don't murder people?

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GW Hayduke

GW Hayduke 1953

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

Lol, so I guess making it inconvenient for certain demographics to vote is cool in your book as long as it's done in the name of solving our problems?

People voting isn't a problem.  The problem with voting is that folks listen to right wing talking points.

High rates of mass shooting events and high rates of firearm deaths in the US is a problem.  

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lemonlime

lemonlime 5503

Posted
Posted

 

5 minutes ago, dcar00 said:

should I hope they aren't white?  or should I hope dumbasses don't murder people?

You should hope dumbasses shouldn't demonize all brown people and spout off about "religion of peace."  And that Fox News, who decided to ignore the story before finding out the shooter was Muslim, doesn't now decide to demagogue over this.  

Of course, we already know those hopes will never be realized.

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dcar00

dcar00 14181

Posted
Posted
Just now, lemonlime said:

 

You should hope dumbasses shouldn't demonize all brown people and spout off about "religion of peace."  And that Fox News, who decided to ignore the story before finding out the shooter was Muslim, doesn't now decide to demagogue over this.  

Of course, we already know those hopes will never be realized.

dude, Fox News didn't ignore the story.  quit with the conspiracy theories.  sorry to inform you, there are dumbasses everywhere, of all colors and religions.

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NotActuallyALonghorn

NotActuallyALonghorn 4976

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, GW Hayduke said:

People voting isn't a problem.  The problem with voting is that folks listen to right wing talking points.

High rates of mass shooting events and high rates of firearm deaths in the US is a problem.  

You are correct in that that is a problem, however you seem to be advocating for a solution that will have a disproportionately negative effect towards minorities when there are solutions that will not. We have a word for people who do that.

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horn4life

horn4life 3760

Posted
Posted

The best thing that could happen for Gun control is for black and brown people to take the mantle of mass killers from near complete domination by angry white men.

Something... and I can't put my finger on it. But something tells me that if most of these mass murders were committed by black and brown people I think the GOP might react in a manner other than "heartfelt prayers" and gun manufacturer high fives....

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GW Hayduke

GW Hayduke 1953

Posted
Posted
Just now, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

You are correct in that that is a problem, however you seem to be advocating for a solution that will have a disproportionately negative effect towards minorities when there are solutions that will not. We have a word for people who do that.

What are you talking about?

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wildcat09

wildcat09 29352

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, dcar00 said:

stop being a conspiracy theorist that because some dumbass kills people there is going to be a run on murdering middle easterners.

Eat shit you worthless cumstain. It's not a conspiracy theory, it happens all the fucking time. All you have to do is ask any racial, ethnic, or religious minority how treatment of them changes whenever someone who vaguely looks like them commits a very public crime. 

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Foosters

Foosters 17853

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, dcar00 said:

stop being a conspiracy theorist that because some dumbass kills people there is going to be a run on murdering middle easterners.

Probably a middle ground between "absolutely nothing" and "genocide", don't ya think?

For example, nonstop vilification of an entire religion followed by the POTUS announcing that he wants a complete and total shutdown of muslims entering the country.

Then again, you're one of the folks on DT telling Asians that they are imagining the increased hate, vitriol, and violence, so maybe you're not the best person to be evaluating this.

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TwiceHorn

TwiceHorn 31454

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Doc Holliday said:

Since I've moved to Denver, I've been curious as to why, if anything, creates such extreme violence here.  I have no answers.  My heart goes out to the concentric circles of impact starting with the family and loved ones of the murdered souls.  This stuff is gross sadness and all over the news here. 

I am going to hazard a guess that because most of western Colorado is still the wild, wild west, there are more than a few "law don't go round here" types that like their guns and "revolution" and other such ideas.

And Denver is just a hop, skip, and jump away.

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956 Worldwide

956 Worldwide 34706

Posted
Posted
13 minutes ago, horn4life said:

The best thing that could happen for Gun control is for black and brown people to take the mantle of mass killers from near complete domination by angry white men.

Something... and I can't put my finger on it. But something tells me that if most of these mass murders were committed by black and brown people I think the GOP might react in a manner other than "heartfelt prayers" and gun manufacturer high fives....

A plurality of mass shootings in the U.S. is committed by white men. But the demographics of mass shooters is slightly less white than the overall U.S. population.  I will leave it to the board to debate why there is a deep and lasting perception that mass shooters are overwhelmingly white. They are almost all men. 

 

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2017/10/what-the-white-mass-shooter-myth-gets-right-and-wrong-about-killers-demographics.html

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UpperWestside

UpperWestside 6163

Posted
Posted
10 hours ago, slorch said:

Pure bullshit.

My ownership of guns doesn't impact you.  Period.  Unless you happen to be some place/ act in a way you should not.  That's the part you fuckers ignore.

Blame forks for obesity.  Blame guns for crimes against other people.  It's idiotic.   

Okay, cool. Thank you for weighing in with your contribution to this thread. 

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Bozo_Casanova

Bozo_Casanova 26449

Posted
Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, Satchel said:

But for the AR 15 type weapon used by today's assassin, he would not have been able to mow down 10 innocent people as efficiently as he did. That's the part some of you ignore. Guns are made to kill, maim, injure and/or destroy targets. That's what happened yesterday when grocery shoppers happened to be some place a shooter was.

There really is no "AR-15 type weapon". There are lots of guns that can mow down 10 people, but American mass shooters don't really use Mini 14s, AK-47s, etc.  They use the AR-15.  The AR-15 platform is different, in my view, because it looks cool and the modularity offers so many accessory options that it encourages dressing up and standing in the mirror with it and fantasy play involving shooting people. And by the way, the vast majority of the time that's where it ends, and that's not different from what people have done since the advent of the colt revolver. But combine really cool looking guns with violent fantasy play,  social unrest/tension and a violent mental health condition and you have a recipe for bad stuff. 

57 minutes ago, bolverk said:

Authorities on Tuesday identified the suspect in the shooting deaths of 10 people at a King Soopers grocery store in Boulder, Colorado, as 21-year-old Ahmad Al Aliwi Alissa, whose brother said he was deeply disturbed.

Alissa, who is from Arvada, has been charged with 10 counts of first-degree murder for the massacre. He was taken into custody after being shot during apprehension.

Ali Aliwi Alissa, the suspect’s 34-year-old brother, told The Daily Beast that authorities searched his house all night after the shooting.

Alissa described his brother as “very anti-social” and paranoid, adding that, in high school, he would describe “being chased, someone is behind him, someone is looking for him.”

“When he was having lunch with my sister in a restaurant, he said, ‘People are in the parking lot, they are looking for me.’ She went out, and there was no one. We didn’t know what was going on in his head,” Alissa said, admitting that he believes his brother is mentally ill.

https://news.yahoo.com/cops-identify-suspect-boulder-supermarket-150041598.html

What do I win? If you really want to protect the 2nd amendment, support red flag laws. 

Edited by Bozo_Casanova
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henrygandorf

henrygandorf 29189

Posted
Posted

ok, so back to a bigger talking point that's been touched on a few times.

in some people's opinions, there is an "allowable amount" of these shootings that we, as a society, can "live with".

as it's been pointed out, there are car accidents, obesity issues, etc, without those industries being threatened or wrecked completely (sorry about the unintentional wordplay).  of course cars and food serve a real purpose, and one could argue guns do not, outside of recreation and the feeling of self-safety.

which brings around the greater point - if we are willing to deal with 2-3 mass casualty shootings per year without doing anything, then does that mean we don't care at all?  is 10 too many?  is 50 (one per week)?  is 100 per year?  if any of those numbers are not ok, then there becomes a tipping point.  people die in cars every day.  but if certain cars were causing deaths at alarming rates, something would be done (cue the fight club airplane speech - "you wouldn't believe")

so if we agree that there's a number that's deemed "too high", the rest is negotiation.  so how high is too high?

and to add, because i just read it, i agree any shooter that's not a troubled white middle aged male actually does help the case for gun control.  sad and sick but truthful.

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Bozo_Casanova

Bozo_Casanova 26449

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, henrygandorf said:

ok, so back to a bigger talking point that's been touched on a few times.

in some people's opinions, there is an "allowable amount" of these shootings that we, as a society, can "live with".

as it's been pointed out, there are car accidents, obesity issues, etc, without those industries being threatened or wrecked completely (sorry about the unintentional wordplay).  of course cars and food serve a real purpose, and one could argue guns do not, outside of recreation and the feeling of self-safety.

which brings around the greater point - if we are willing to deal with 2-3 mass casualty shootings per year without doing anything, then does that mean we don't care at all?  is 10 too many?  is 50 (one per week)?  is 100 per year?  if any of those numbers are not ok, then there becomes a tipping point.  people die in cars every day.  but if certain cars were causing deaths at alarming rates, something would be done (cue the fight club airplane speech - "you wouldn't believe")

so if we agree that there's a number that's deemed "too high", the rest is negotiation.  so how high is too high?

and to add, because i just read it, i agree any shooter that's not a troubled white middle aged male actually does help the case for gun control.  sad and sick but truthful.

Oh, let's be clear. I think we are willing to do almost anything to avoid acknowledging the depth of our mental health crisis in this country, including substituting gun control for compassion. It's a bit like dignifying homeless with the right to sleep under bridges as a substitute for supportive care and community. 

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Helobious

Helobious 9448

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

A plurality of mass shootings in the U.S. is committed by white men. But the demographics of mass shooters is slightly less white than the overall U.S. population.  I will leave it to the board to debate why there is a deep and lasting perception that mass shooters are overwhelmingly white. They are almost all men. 

 

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2017/10/what-the-white-mass-shooter-myth-gets-right-and-wrong-about-killers-demographics.html

Article doesn’t address non-hispanic whites. A bit flawed imo.

And the reality is in this country white men are the best at mass shootings. Of the top 10 mass shootings by death toll here, 7 were committed by white men. 8 if we include Nikolas Cruz, white kid adopted and raised by a hispanic parent.

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lemonlime

lemonlime 5503

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, henrygandorf said:

ok, so back to a bigger talking point that's been touched on a few times.

in some people's opinions, there is an "allowable amount" of these shootings that we, as a society, can "live with".

as it's been pointed out, there are car accidents, obesity issues, etc, without those industries being threatened or wrecked completely (sorry about the unintentional wordplay).  of course cars and food serve a real purpose, and one could argue guns do not, outside of recreation and the feeling of self-safety.

which brings around the greater point - if we are willing to deal with 2-3 mass casualty shootings per year without doing anything, then does that mean we don't care at all?  is 10 too many?  is 50 (one per week)?  is 100 per year?  if any of those numbers are not ok, then there becomes a tipping point.  people die in cars every day.  but if certain cars were causing deaths at alarming rates, something would be done (cue the fight club airplane speech - "you wouldn't believe")

so if we agree that there's a number that's deemed "too high", the rest is negotiation.  so how high is too high?

and to add, because i just read it, i agree any shooter that's not a troubled white middle aged male actually does help the case for gun control.  sad and sick but truthful.

We also regulate both driving and food production/safety.   We don't just say food is a public good, so fuck the FDA, fuck labeling, and we don't need food safety inspectors.

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horn4life

horn4life 3760

Posted
Posted (edited)
29 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

A plurality of mass shootings in the U.S. is committed by white men. But the demographics of mass shooters is slightly less white than the overall U.S. population.  I will leave it to the board to debate why there is a deep and lasting perception that mass shooters are overwhelmingly white. They are almost all men. 

 

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2017/10/what-the-white-mass-shooter-myth-gets-right-and-wrong-about-killers-demographics.html

Quote

In total, about 70 percent of the perpetrators in the database were white.

Heck I get your point, with only 7 out of 10 being white.  The fact that most of the databases include shootouts in clubs (more black and brown) in the mass shooting category is sort of misleading.  As those shootings are NOT random.  So I think I will safely stand by my statement regarding the statement that most of mass shootings, registered firmly in the white male column.  But yes the gang members with non-random kills, helps the math if you equate completely random and motiveless murder, with the non-random variety.

look at this list from Wiki - the non-random are very well represented. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mass_shootings_in_the_United_States_in_2021

Edited by horn4life
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4th&Five

4th&Five 41526

Posted
Posted
20 minutes ago, horn4life said:

The best thing that could happen for Gun control is for black and brown people to take the mantle of mass killers from near complete domination by angry white men.

Something... and I can't put my finger on it. But something tells me that if most of these mass murders were committed by black and brown people I think the GOP might react in a manner other than "heartfelt prayers" and gun manufacturer high fives....

Just have all black and brown people start applying for carry licenses.  There will be quick changes.

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TexArcher

TexArcher 37774

Posted
Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, slorch said:

My ownership of guns doesn't impact you.  Period.  Unless you happen to be some place/ act in a way you should not.  That's the part you fuckers ignore.

Blame forks for obesity.  Blame guns for crimes against other people.  It's idiotic.   

This would be a better analogy if fat people were going into schools and stabbing a bunch of children with forks several times a year.

Of course no one is saying ban forks because they make people fat.  And no one is saying ban all guns, either.  What most of us, 70+% last I checked, are saying is, "let's ban the guns that make it easy for some nutbar to kill double digit school children before he's stopped."

As far as I'm concerned, if you want to own a Glock pistol or a hunting rifle or even a shotgun for home defense, go right ahead.  And if you want to own an AR-15 that can be easily modified to fire 30 rounds in 4 seconds, no sir.  Join the military if you want a military grade weapon.  And the fact that 70+% of us agree on that means you're gonna lose the right to buy that gun and that ammo.  That's how democracy works.

It doesn't have to be an all-or-nothing conversation.

Edited by TexArcher
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Nivek

Nivek 16923

Posted
Posted
America: a nation that elects racists, denies the reality of a global pandemic and allows its citizens to shoot the shit out of each other.  Put simply: we are too evil to continue living on this planet.

Necropolitics is how we got here. It is not a solution.
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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 105105

Posted
Posted

Ho hum. So we have yet another case of a guy with paranoid delusions, hearing voices, who his family thought was completely off his rocker....able to easily procure a weapon made for shooting a lot of people in short order.

Sounds to me like a system working perfectly, and we shouldn’t do anything to prevent this exact same thing from happening for the 10,000th time, probably in the next couple of weeks.

Move along, nothing to see here. “We’ve tried nothing, and we’re all out of ideas.”

Bozo has been pointing out the actual issue for years here now. Nobody wants to hear it, and the NRA and it’s bought and paid for party will make sure that nothing ever comes of it. Because providing actual mental health care and having red flag laws is what pussy communists would do, and you don’t want to be a pussy communist, do you?

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TexArcher

TexArcher 37774

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, henrygandorf said:

the guns don't care about the motive of the shooters.

Right.  And they don't care if your kids come home for dinner or not.  They want their big dick toys and the Constitution says they get them (it doesn't, but they don't care about that, either).

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956 Worldwide

956 Worldwide 34706

Posted
Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, horn4life said:

Heck I get your point, with only 7 out of 10 being white.  The fact that most of the databases include shootouts in clubs (more black and brown) in the mass shooting category is sort of misleading.  As those shootings are NOT random.  So I think I will safely stand by my statement regarding the statement that most of mass shootings, registered firmly in the white male column.  But yes the gang members with non-random kills, helps the math if you equate completely random and motiveless murder, with the non-random variety.

look at this list from Wiki - the non-random are very well represented. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mass_shootings_in_the_United_States_in_2021

Yes, you are correct that if you take out most of the mass shootings perpetrated by non-white people, then you get a very different narrative and picture. 
 

Quote

The whites-are-overrepresented-among-mass-shooters meme does serve a useful purpose in that it helps displace another myth about mass shootings: that they’re most often perpetrated by angry immigrants from travel-banned countries, and that nothing is more dangerous to America that the scourge of Islamic terrorism. By shifting focus from this hazy, overstated foreign threat to something clearly U.S.-made, the meme also calls attention to the tilted rhetoric that surrounds such killings. It forces us to grapple with the biased language of “lone wolves” and who, exactly, gets to be a “terrorist.” It also makes us notice the opportunist invocation (or disregard) of mental illness, and it casts a light on our desperate need to find a motive for acts of utter evil. These are worthy ends, but we shouldn’t have to build another myth to reach them.

 

Edited by 956 Worldwide
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TexArcher

TexArcher 37774

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Ho hum. So we have yet another case of a guy with paranoid delusions, hearing voices, who his family thought was completely off his rocker....able to easily procure a weapon made for shooting a lot of people in short order.

Sounds to me like a system working perfectly, and we shouldn’t do anything to prevent this exact same thing from happening for the 10,000th time, probably in the next couple of weeks.

Move along, nothing to see here. “We’ve tried nothing, and we’re all out of ideas.”

Bozo has been pointing out the actual issue for years here now. Nobody wants to hear it, and the NRA and it’s bought and paid for party will make sure that nothing ever comes of it. Because providing actual mental health care and having red flag laws is what pussy communists would do, and you don’t want to be a pussy communist, do you?

To paraphrase an Onion article from years ago: "It's a shame there's nothing we can do to stop this" say leaders of only country where this happens with any regularity.

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956 Worldwide

956 Worldwide 34706

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Bozo has been pointing out the actual issue for years here now. Nobody wants to hear it, and the NRA and it’s bought and paid for party will make sure that nothing ever comes of it. Because providing actual mental health care and having red flag laws is what pussy communists would do, and you don’t want to be a pussy communist, do you?

Based on what reporting has come out, I predict you will find that a lot of this person’s mental illness is going to have manifested in religious or religious adjacent rhetoric (“Islamaphobes hacking my cell phone”). This phenomenon is hardly unique to religious Muslims, a lot of mentally ill people manifest with religious rhetoric. Whether that rationale accepted in public debate depends on what side of the aisle you fall on and the demographics of the shooter. 

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