Active shooter thread

[Bevo14 8,380]

9 minutes ago, Grade of D as in David said:

I'm disgusted by the cowardice of the on scene police officers. Why do they have guns again?

So they can hold down the fort against concerned parents until some border patrol guy comes down from Timbuktu/wherever Todd Orlando stashes his blitzers

Edited May 26, 2022 by Bevo14

[Grade of D as in David 13,253]

1 hour ago, Revolution512 said:

Piggy backing off other ideas nationally and what happens at my kids school, one entry point will help a great deal.  Outer doors locked, one entry point monitored by personnel.  At my kids school you can enter the main door where you stand in a small lobby to speak with the person behind glass in the office but never have access to the school.  I'm on camera, I have to answer several questions and they see me every fucking day.  I'm never allowed in, they bring the kids out.  If you want to arm that person screening entry, that's an option.  Nothing will ever be 100% but we have to stop arguing in terms of black and white.  The gun restrictions will continued to be argued for years, you can't take away what already exists.  We can start protecting our kids immediately.

Why don't we just put landmines all over campus and teach the kids where they are and that way when shooters come in they blow the fuck up

 

As stupid as that sounds it's still better than the fucking shit you posted.

[Anastasis 23,491]

13 minutes ago, Patricio Swayze said:

Well let’s here it Einstein. What are your suggestions for fixing this American problem. And are you voting for people that can put that into action. Be specific.

*"Hear it" Einstein.

There are a good deal of measures that people with common sense on both ends of the spectrum can find agreement on. Our politics fail us. 

A few low hanging fruit starting points:

1. Raise the age for purchase of all semi-auto rifle and pistols.  I'd be good with as high up as 25, but that is just an arbitrary number tbh.

2. Universal background checks on all transfers through a no-cost government portal. Severe penalties for any transfers outside the portal. 

3. Requirements regarding firearms storage and minor access. Severe penalties for individuals that do not meet those standards, esp when firearm related death or injury results.

 

Those three measures would actually tie in to an outcomes oriented policy approach...but that is not what our system will allow. 

It's not like we have not had these discussions for years hear. The problem is not real life pro-2A people and the gun control people that you can actually engage with being able to find some common ground, the problem is that our dysfunctional political system will not allow it. 

Edited May 26, 2022 by Anastasis

[wildcat09 29,420]

1 minute ago, Anastasis said:

*"Hear it" Einstein.

There are a good deal of measures that people with common sense on both ends of the spectrum can find agreement on. Our politics fail us. 

A few low handing fruit starting points:

1. Raise the age for purchase of all semi-auto rifle and pistols.  I'd be good with as high up as 25, but that is just an arbitrary number tbh.

2. Universal background checks on all transfers through a no-cost government portal. Severe penalties for any transfers outside the portal. 

3. Requirements regarding firearms storage and minor access. Severe penalties for individuals that do not meet those standards, esp when firearm related death or injury results.

 

Those three measures would actually tie in to an outcomes oriented policy approach...but that is not what our system will allow. 

It's not like we have not had these discussions for years hear. The problem is not real life pro-2A people and the gun control people that you can actually engage with being able to find some common ground, the problem is that our dysfunctional political system will not allow it. 

Very cute how you blame “the system” when you know damned good and well that 95% of elected Dems would vote for all of that right now.

[Patricio Swayze 17,058]

*"Hear it" Einstein.
There are a good deal of measures that people with common sense on both ends of the spectrum can find agreement on. Our politics fail us. 
A few low handing fruit starting points:
1. Raise the age for purchase of all semi-auto rifle and pistols.  I'd be good with as high up as 25, but that is just an arbitrary number tbh.
2. Universal background checks on all transfers through a no-cost government portal. Severe penalties for any transfers outside the portal. 
3. Requirements regarding firearms storage and minor access. Severe penalties for individuals that do not meet those standards, esp when firearm related death or injury results.
 
Those three measures would actually tie in to an outcomes oriented policy approach...but that is not what our system will allow. 
It's not like we have not had these discussions for years hear. The problem is not real life pro-2A people and the gun control people that you can actually engage with being able to find some common ground, the problem is that our dysfunctional political system will not allow it. 

Lulz. So you are voting for politicians that would push these kinds of laws and regulations through? Be honest now.

[Brisketexan 105,438]

*"Hear it" Einstein.
There are a good deal of measures that people with common sense on both ends of the spectrum can find agreement on. Our politics fail us. 
A few low handing fruit starting points:
1. Raise the age for purchase of all semi-auto rifle and pistols.  I'd be good with as high up as 25, but that is just an arbitrary number tbh.
2. Universal background checks on all transfers through a no-cost government portal. Severe penalties for any transfers outside the portal. 
3. Requirements regarding firearms storage and minor access. Severe penalties for individuals that do not meet those standards, esp when firearm related death or injury results.
 
Those three measures would actually tie in to an outcomes oriented policy approach...but that is not what our system will allow. 
It's not like we have not had these discussions for years hear. The problem is not real life pro-2A people and the gun control people that you can actually engage with being able to find some common ground, the problem is that our dysfunctional political system will not allow it. 

No. The GQP will not allow it.
You are correct that a majority of people support measures like that. But half of us relentlessly vote for leaders in a political party that will not allow any of those things to happen.
Stop voting for republicans. For anything. And then we’ll have an actual chance to get some of these things done.

[Gourmand 7,774]

4 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

It's not like we have not had these discussions for years hear.

[Patricio Swayze 17,058]

No. The GQP will not allow it.
You are correct that a majority of people support measures like that. But half of us relentlessly vote for leaders in a political party that will not allow any of those things to happen.
Stop voting for republicans. For anything. And then we’ll have an actual chance to get some of these things done.

He won’t. It’s a team sport to him. He will just sit there and yell both sides. Pussy.

[Jersey Man10 3,550]

 

There’s nothing else to say.

[Anastasis 23,491]

Just now, Brisketexan said:

Stop voting for republicans. For anything.

OK, well I guess welcome to like to 20 years ago.

When was your last pull on the lever for a republican brisket?

[Anastasis 23,491]

6 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

Very cute how you blame “the system” when you know damned good and well that 95% of elected Dems would vote for all of that right now.

If the Ds were smart politically, I think that maybe they would put up a series of clean bills on very specific topics where there is broad agreement and put people on record. 

 

 

[Beantown Express 2.0 6,559]

14 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

*"Hear it" Einstein.

There are a good deal of measures that people with common sense on both ends of the spectrum can find agreement on. Our politics fail us. 

A few low hanging fruit starting points:

1. Raise the age for purchase of all semi-auto rifle and pistols.  I'd be good with as high up as 25, but that is just an arbitrary number tbh.

2. Universal background checks on all transfers through a no-cost government portal. Severe penalties for any transfers outside the portal. 

3. Requirements regarding firearms storage and minor access. Severe penalties for individuals that do not meet those standards, esp when firearm related death or injury results.

 

Those three measures would actually tie in to an outcomes oriented policy approach...but that is not what our system will allow. 

It's not like we have not had these discussions for years hear. The problem is not real life pro-2A people and the gun control people that you can actually engage with being able to find some common ground, the problem is that our dysfunctional political system will not allow it. 

So about your 3 points above.  I am pretty sure you could get 48 Dem Senators to vote for those.  Maybe even Sinema and Manchin also would vote for those.  You know the rules require 60 total votes so name me 10 R Senators that would agree to those?  Shit, name me 5 just for shits and giggles.  How again is this both sides?

[Jhawkmvp 1,505]

11 hours ago, Starfleet Command said:

It seems like the response from conservatives has coalesced to a degree around the idea of "soft targets."  That the real solution is to eliminate soft targets by fortifying all of our schools.  However, in this instance there were three cops who had an opportunity to stop the shooter but were flat out too fucking scared to stop him.  Three cops vs one high school kid.  Do the "soft target" folks plan on deploying the US Army to all of our schools because our cops clearly aren't up to the task even after being given every toy they could possibly want for decades.

Keep in mind that, as was the case with the Parkland shooting, we can't even discipline cops for behaving cowardly in these situations.

Studies from WWII that found that a a significant number (some as high as 75%) of soldiers would never fire their weapons directly on a person and the US military had to revamp a bunch of things to get the military to a point where like 90% of soldiers would fire at someone by Vietnam.  Many self-defense gun owners are living a fantasy that they will be the Billy Badass that saves the day, but many, or even most, will freeze up or even run when a deadly confrontation happens, just like soldiers from WWII.  It takes a certain inherent willingness to kill that most people lack (luckily) or special training to overcome the psychological barriers to killing another person, like the US military receives today, that most people will never have access too. Many cops are included in this group, if they are not veterans, or swat.

Adding more cops/security will not help much, as most will probably never receive the kind consistent training needed to ensure they can successfully square up on a shooter and take them out.  

 

[Anastasis 23,491]

2 minutes ago, Beantown Express 2.0 said:

So about your 3 points above.  I am pretty sure you could get 48 Dem Senators to vote for those.  Maybe even Sinema and Manchin also would vote for those.  You know the rules require 60 total votes so name me 10 R Senators that would agree to those?  Shit, name me 5 just for shits and giggles.  How again is this both sides?

Let's see 3 clean bills introduced and see where it goes.  

I realize that legislationing is hard.

 

[Hmbre97 6,332]

1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

Democrats control the executive and legislative branches. 

Edited May 26, 2022 by Hmbre97

[Patricio Swayze 17,058]

Deflection, the name of the game.

[Hermanator 7,178]

I do question Democrat politician's desire to really push the change. They just seem to sit on the sidelines and shake their heads at the republican idiocy then shrug it off. They refuse to engage in political war even though the insane side has been attacking them non stop in every absurd way possible for years. 

Americans are stupid. You have to beat them over the head. Democrats refuse to do that while Republicans do it constantly with lies and fear mongering. 

Edited May 26, 2022 by Hermanator

[RabidM 2,668]

1 hour ago, Revolution512 said:

Piggy backing off other ideas nationally and what happens at my kids school, one entry point will help a great deal.  Outer doors locked, one entry point monitored by personnel.  At my kids school you can enter the main door where you stand in a small lobby to speak with the person behind glass in the office but never have access to the school.  I'm on camera, I have to answer several questions and they see me every fucking day.  I'm never allowed in, they bring the kids out.  If you want to arm that person screening entry, that's an option.  Nothing will ever be 100% but we have to stop arguing in terms of black and white.  The gun restrictions will continued to be argued for years, you can't take away what already exists.  We can start protecting our kids immediately.

One point of entry also means one point of exit.  If anyone gets past the guards at the gate it turns the school into a kill box.  Anyone inside remains trapped inside with a psycho.  Also, as someone mentioned earlier, a single point of entry creates bottlenecks of people waiting to get in and out. That just means a killer has to time his attack during a mass entry or exit and all the people will just be sitting in a convenient clump of victimhood. 

It's not logistically possible to harden many schools in this way.  Look at Westlake. There's probably over a dozen individual buildings covering probably 6 to 10 football fields of land.  For many schools we're talking about huge buildings with tons of windows, doors, roof and maintenance access points etc... Shit ain't realistic even if it was economically feasible for 130k schools, which it isn't.  

[Irwin F Fletcher 3,550]

Democrats control the executive and legislative branches. 

I'll keep it simple. You are exactly what is wrong with America.

Hopefully you are some foreign troll. If you're not, hopefully we cross paths one day.

[Hagbard Celine 10,935]

3 hours ago, Longhornlove said:

People making accusations that this is what Republicans want is an insane statement.

Republicans have systematically deconstructed defunded and finally demolished the mental health system while simultaneously voting against every gun control measure every time possible in every state house and in dc.   It is impossible to argue that Republicans do not "want" the current paradigm, because if they wanted something different, they would have voted to make it so.  And they haven't.  It's prima facie, inarguable, unassailable, incontrovertible.

The Republican party is a death cult.

[Longhornlove 4,897]

https://www.secretservice.gov/sites/default/files/reports/2021-03/USSS Averting Targeted School Violence.2021.03.pdf

[Anastasis 23,491]

28 minutes ago, Irwin F Fletcher said:

I'll keep it simple. You are exactly what is wrong with America.

Hopefully you are some foreign troll. If you're not, hopefully we cross paths one day.

If you think that I am what is wrong with America you are extremely brain damaged. The second line in your post only confirms the pathology. 

Edited May 26, 2022 by Anastasis

[mchookem 16,408]

2 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

Jesus fuck. Those cops, man, I don’t know.
 

 

 

Edited May 26, 2022 by mchookem

[mchookem 16,408]

2 hours ago, wildcat09 said:

Every one of those cops should eat his fucking gun.

ive been at a concert tonight and just catching up...WHAT IN THE NAME OF GOD WAS HAPPENING HERE??? holy fucking shit...i didn't think i could still be stunned but that did it. i'm literally sick to my stomach. unbelievable. 

[Jhawkmvp 1,505]

This conservative utopia of unfettered access to guns seems to not be as cool as promised. 

[atomheartbevo 89,824]

Tell us how you really feel Ana

 

[DDD Dad 14,352]

4 hours ago, Anastasis said:

*"Hear it" Einstein.

There are a good deal of measures that people with common sense on both ends of the spectrum can find agreement on. Our politics fail us. 

A few low hanging fruit starting points:

1. Raise the age for purchase of all semi-auto rifle and pistols.  I'd be good with as high up as 25, but that is just an arbitrary number tbh.

2. Universal background checks on all transfers through a no-cost government portal. Severe penalties for any transfers outside the portal. 

3. Requirements regarding firearms storage and minor access. Severe penalties for individuals that do not meet those standards, esp when firearm related death or injury results.

 

Those three measures would actually tie in to an outcomes oriented policy approach...but that is not what our system will allow. 

It's not like we have not had these discussions for years hear. The problem is not real life pro-2A people and the gun control people that you can actually engage with being able to find some common ground, the problem is that our dysfunctional political system will not allow it. 

Those things sound like measures that “politicians” would have to enact.  And there aren’t people on both sides who agree on those. Otherwise those “politicians” would enact them. 

Edited May 26, 2022 by DDD Dad

[fattyflattie 4,638]

5 hours ago, Anastasis said:

OK, well I guess welcome to like to 20 years ago.

When was your last pull on the lever for a republican brisket?

A magical time when they weren’t the racist party (southern strategy?) and they weren’t pro 2nd, obviously.  

[cactusflinthead 27,606]

5 hours ago, Anastasis said:

If the Ds were smart politically, I think that maybe they would put up a series of clean bills on very specific topics where there is broad agreement and put people on record. 

 

 

Manchin Toomey Background Check Bill of 2013. Look it up. Tell us how that went.

[DigglerontheHoof 21,255]

12 hours ago, TexEx15 said:

If it is true that there were armed officers on the scene that did not make immediate entry then it is fucking criminal. The FIRST rule in an active shooter event is to IMMEDIATELY make your way to the sound of the gunfire. This is the Columbine lesson.

They're all cowards who should be lined up against a wall and riddled with bullets. 

[Neonmoon 38,130]

1 hour ago, cactusflinthead said:

Manchin Toomey Background Check Bill of 2013. Look it up. Tell us how that went.

But at least we put them on record! Totally changed everythIng 

[cactusflinthead 27,606]

@Neonmoon

West Virginia Sen. Joe Manchin watched his background checks proposal go down in defeat this month when it failed to attract enough votes to avert a Senate filibuster.

Edited May 26, 2022 by cactusflinthead

[Caponata 151]

8 hours ago, WhatTheBuck said:

You’re pro-Russia. 

Nope. Putin is a despot war criminal. 

[DigglerontheHoof 21,255]

3 minutes ago, Caponata said:

Nope. Putin is a despot war criminal. 

You're lying like a motherfucker all over this site.  Cunt. 

[CooterBrown 18,032]

[Fudge Nuggets 19,227]

10 hours ago, hookem2010 said:

I'm not a proud television owner. 

I would be with this bad boy

[Make em eat Taco Bell 1,549]

[Homercles 10,206]

10 hours ago, Longhornlove said:

We have lost our way as a society. We would all be better of getting away from social media and the entertainment industry. Get out in nature, meet people, learn to be kind to one another again. COVID didn't help locking us up, limiting our interaction to behind a computer screen and keyboard. I'm disappointed in some comments that appear to call for violence against Republicans. Something like this should be bringing us together, not tearing us apart. People making accusations that this is what Republicans want is an insane statement. I am a registered republican as his the majority of my family and friends and I know of no one that thinks that way. It's sick. The individual who carried out this attack was a animal and ultimately got what he deserved. I know you are pissed, I'm pissed. It sucks. I know a lot of people in here don't like me or my opinion but these are genuine thoughts, Neg me if you want, I'm sure some will but I genuinely care for all human life. We need to find a practical solution to thee problem. Blaming the other side doesn't give the country any traction on resolving the issue.

Mental health and social media decay are prevalent globally.  But school shootings are a distinctly American ‘phenomenon’.  

[Firemans4Horn 18,127]

 

The incompetence is stunning but not surprising. Anyone that preaches “good guys with guns” or “arm the teachers” should be punched in the dick. 

[Homercles 10,206]

9 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

Fuck you to hell.
You voted for this. You do it over, and over, and over. You don’t get to run away from that. You ensure that we all are forced to live under a state government that has installed a state religion, Worship of the Almighty Gun.
Fuck your and your complicity and collaboration. You don’t get to vote for people who promise to do exactly what they’ve done - make guns MORE ubiquitous and EASIER to get and carry - and then say “not me.”
Yea, it’s you. Burn in hell.

[Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand 13,588]

7 hours ago, WhatTheBuck said:

No, I was pointing out the absurdity of the argument that security at schools will solve the problem when THERE WAS FUCKING SECURITY AT THAT SCHOOL!

There was armed security, ex-law enforcement, who died shooting at the white supremacist in Buffalo as well.

[B00M 6,471]

15 hours ago, Tom said:

Fuck age limits and universal background checks.  I was for that in the past but we're way past that dozens of shootings and hundreds of dead kids ago. 

Let's just quit commercially selling guns in this country to citizens. Full stop. If you own a gun already, fine. You can keep it, pass it on to your kids, or whatever so long as it's not ever used in the commission of a crime.  Once you do something illegal with a gun, it gets confiscated.

But no new purchases going forward.  If you are caught selling a gun on the black market, first degree felony, maximum sentences.  Some pimple faced 18 year old incel who would shoot up a school full of kids likely won't be able to afford a black market gun. 

Maybe. Maybe not. Black market machine guns are like one fifth the price of legal machine guns.

Edited May 26, 2022 by B00M

[CooterBrown 18,032]

Maybe. Maybe not. Black market machine guns are like one fifth the price of legal machine guns.

Ban the private resale of firearms. You can only sale your firearms and accessories to the government, at your local PD or sheriff’s office, no questions asked, and the guns are then destroyed. Hell, even let the government pay current retail price so there’s no excuse not to sale it to the government.

[Captainant 27,826]

1 minute ago, CooterBrown said:

Ban the private resale of firearms. You can only sale your firearms and accessories to the government, at your local PD or sheriff’s office, no questions asked, and the guns are then destroyed. Hell, even let the government pay current retail price so there’s no excuse not to sale it to the government.

Hell, the fact that Joe Public doesn't have a way to run a background check himself is just insane. The few times I've sold a gun to an individual I've only sold em to a CHL holder since that's at least a degree of background checking, even if it's potentially years out of date.

More topically: this damn murderer bought his rifles LEGALLY through an FFL. Private sales are definitely a thing that should be reformed, but it didn't matter for this atrocity

[fattyflattie 4,638]

1 minute ago, Captainant said:

Hell, the fact that Joe Public doesn't have a way to run a background check himself is just insane.

All but 2 I’ve purchased second hand have gone thru FFL. All the auction sites require it, for both parties.  The other two were shotguns from friends, and I’d have 0 qualms if they were in the “system”. 

[Nice Guy Eddie 13,528]

9 hours ago, Revolution512 said:

 you can't take away what already exists.

Please don’t make this argument. We can create long prison sentences for possession of certain weapons, and there will be a line at the police station to hand them in.

Will some billy badasses or flat out criminals decide to hide their modified automatic weapon? Sure but those morons will be caught over time. And if the future still experiences massacres due to these weapons, it’s more deaths on us for allowing the weapons in the past.

[Gourmand 7,774]

 

[Pancho 45,062]

People like this guy deserve everything you can give him…

 

 

[B00M 6,471]

9 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Hell, the fact that Joe Public doesn't have a way to run a background check himself is just insane. The few times I've sold a gun to an individual I've only sold em to a CHL holder since that's at least a degree of background checking, even if it's potentially years out of date.

This. NICS should be available to the public. Asking for a CHL is smart but your only alternative is to transfer through an FFL and pay a fee.

[aggie08 21,555]

7 minutes ago, Pancho said:

People like this guy deserve everything you can give him…

 

 

He deserves a kick in this ass. Asking those questions as he's trying to create his own "gotcha" video is pretty damn hypocritical.

The media deserves some culpability, but "hey, let's just stop reporting on these mass shootings" isn't a realistic solution.