IRS tax question

[orange dream 1265]

I have a co-worker who relocated from Canada.  He is a US citizen but his wife and kids were not.  Once they moved to the US in 2019 they began the process of applying for green cards for wife and kids. Also applied for SSN's for wife and kids through the same process with the immigration lawyer they were using.  Due to general government delays and COVID, the SSNs were not issued until 2021.

He filed his 2020 taxes claiming his kids as dependents at the extended deadline in 2021 after he had received the SSNs.  Additionally he amended his 2019 return to include his kids as dependents under their newly issued SSNs.

Yesterday he received a letter from the IRS stating that they were denying the "dependent" status for 2020 because the SSNs were not issued until 2021.  Presumably he will get a similar letter soon regarding his amended 2019 return on which he also claimed his kids as dependents. His immigration lawyer isn't offering any advice or assistance.

Seems like there should be some vehicle to allow for the dependent election as long as it (SSN) has been applied for but I don't know.  Does anyone have any experience with something like this or a referral to someone (CPA,etc.) that he should talk to?

[Fudge Nuggets 19280]

Your “co-worker’s” wife and kids are getting deported. 

[Victor Lazlo 1788]

The IRS has their collective heads up their asses. No telling what you are going to hear from them.

For example, my wife died in early 2021, and later I filed our 2020 taxes jointly as I’d done for many years, and which was perfectly legal and correct to do.

Couple of months later I get a letter from the IRS, “Hey, you filed a joint return with a person whose SSN belonged to a someone that is deceased.” Well, no shit, assholes. Can’t you look at your records and see that we’ve filed together for the last 25 fucking years?

I had to fill out forms explaining why I filed that way and I included a copy of the death certificate. Got a refund a few months later.

This year tax season rolls around, I file jointly for the last time - as is my right - and a few weeks later get the exact same letter as last year. They couldn’t be bothered to update the file last year. So I have to fill out the same bullshit forms and send another copy of the death certificate.

Sorry to hijack your thread, but this is all to say that the IRS doesn’t know what the fuck they are doing, and your friend is probably going to have find a competent attorney that can walk the IRS through exactly how he did everything correctly.

It is disgusting just how bad that organization is.  Good luck to your co-worker.

[Sam Lin 3566]

I'm not a specialist at all, but from here:

https://www.irs.gov/faqs/filing-requirements-status-dependents/dependents

Quote

Please note that for tax years 2018 through 2025, you may not claim the child tax credit on either your original or an amended return if your child doesn't have an SSN valid for employment before the due date of your return (including extensions).

 

[Fudge Nuggets 19280]

4 hours ago, Victor Lazlo said:

The IRS has their collective heads up their asses. No telling what you are going to hear from them.

For example, my wife died in early 2021, and later I filed our 2020 taxes jointly as I’d done for many years, and which was perfectly legal and correct to do.

Couple of months later I get a letter from the IRS, “Hey, you filed a joint return with a person whose SSN belonged to a someone that is deceased.” Well, no shit, assholes. Can’t you look at your records and see that we’ve filed together for the last 25 fucking years?

I had to fill out forms explaining why I filed that way and I included a copy of the death certificate. Got a refund a few months later.

This year tax season rolls around, I file jointly for the last time - as is my right - and a few weeks later get the exact same letter as last year. They couldn’t be bothered to update the file last year. So I have to fill out the same bullshit forms and send another copy of the death certificate.

Sorry to hijack your thread, but this is all to say that the IRS doesn’t know what the fuck they are doing, and your friend is probably going to have find a competent attorney that can walk the IRS through exactly how he did everything correctly.

It is disgusting just how bad that organization is.  Good luck to your co-worker.

When my wife died in November of 2014 I had to file as head of household for that year according to the muppets at KPMG. 

[TwiceHorn 31695]

Seems odd to have dependents conditioned on SSN.  Maybe just to encourage people to get SSNs for their kids quick.

[immamac 43577]

21 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Seems odd to have dependents conditioned on SSN.  Maybe just to encourage people to get SSNs for their kids quick.

Or so that people who are illegal immigrants get a higher tax burden. 

[Pato del Muerto 52893]

8 minutes ago, immamac said:

Or so that people who are illegal immigrants get a higher tax burden. 

Illegal immigrants pay and file taxes?

[immamac 43577]

4 minutes ago, Pato del Muerto said:

Illegal immigrants pay and file taxes?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_impact_of_illegal_immigrants_in_the_United_States

50-75% of illegals pay SSN and Federal/state/local taxes. Per CBO study (so more than half) 

[Bevo 13653]

1 hour ago, immamac said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_impact_of_illegal_immigrants_in_the_United_States

50-75% of illegals pay SSN and Federal/state/local taxes. Per CBO study (so more than half) 

Interesting. I wonder how accurate their numbers are though for the true number of illegal immigrants. I don't see a lot of reason for guys in certain industries like construction to pay income tax.

[HornOnTheBayou 8967]

Hold up. This guy actually had a girl in Canada? Huh, I guess anything is possible. 

[Bevo 13653]

On 6/15/2022 at 7:20 AM, immamac said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_impact_of_illegal_immigrants_in_the_United_States

50-75% of illegals pay SSN and Federal/state/local taxes. Per CBO study (so more than half) 

So I spoke with someone who deals daily with immigration. She was saying that these numbers are pretty accurate. If you want to lead any kind of normal life in the US, you need to pay taxes. Basically, if you have a bank account the IRS knows. There were a decent number of illegals who weren't paying taxes the first couple of years of the Trump administration because they were scared of being deported. But, sometime during the middle of his presidency, that concern pretty much ended and there was a flood of illegals paying back taxes, etc.

For orange dream's question, there is a whole system set up for illegals. Basically, you need to attach a W7 with your filed tax return. You are then issued a tax identification number.

[horn4life 3819]

With penalties and interest, this is gonna sting...

 

It's possible you might be able to negotiate a reduction of penalties.

[Bevo 13653]

31 minutes ago, Bevo said:

So I spoke with someone who deals daily with immigration. She was saying that these numbers are pretty accurate. If you want to lead any kind of normal life in the US, you need to pay taxes. Basically, if you have a bank account the IRS knows. There were a decent number of illegals who weren't paying taxes the first couple of years of the Trump administration because they were scared of being deported. But, sometime during the middle of his presidency, that concern pretty much ended and there was a flood of illegals paying back taxes, etc.

For orange dream's question, there is a whole system set up for illegals. Basically, you need to attach a W7 with your filed tax return. You are then issued a tax identification number.

To add to what I was saying... The tax identification number is called an iTIN. Let's say you're working and earning money in the United States, but you don't qualify for a Social Security Number (SSN). An ITIN will serve as your identification number for filing your tax returns. If you do not qualify for an SSN, you will need to apply for an ITIN via the W7.

[JGrayDBU 347]

storytime...2012 I decided to buy back my years from ERS with IRA money, because I had decided I would make teaching a career....sometimes I can see the future...I knew the IRS would have a problem with me doing this.  I called the IRS...this was back when you could call the IRS and actually talk to a person-I got the person to agree I had done the procedure correctly, then asked for his first name and employee number, he happily complied, and I wrote myself an email with the info. 

Sure enough, six months after filing taxes the IRS sent letter saying they thought I had done the procedure incorrectly, I quickly found the email, filled out the forms the IRS wanted and sent it back to them... 3 months later got another letter from IRS agreeing I had done the procedure correctly. 

I think that event is partially why I am on an IRS Hitlist.  That and the 14 years of $2000 tax credits for the MCC are my two best guesses.  

 

[Enchubben 5563]

For a year or so I did federal income tax for low income/needy people. I’d estimate about 75% of the people I saw did not have ssn’s (illegal immigrant landscapers etc), but almost all had ITIN. None of them paid a dime, and most of them left with a 5 figure check incoming due to child tax credits and earned income tax credits. (This was over a decade ago) 

I think the number of illegals filing a return is much lower than estimated, because many are either are scared or don’t know where to start. I don’t blame them.