Renewable Energy Saving Texas' Ass Right Now

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20,400]

40% of Texas electricity not coming from fossil fuel:

 

"Texans are cranking on the air conditioning this week amid an unusually early heat wave, setting new records for electricity demand in the state, which surpassed 75 gigawatts on Sunday and smashed the 2019 record. Texas grid operator ERCOT projects it could approach that peak again on Tuesday.

But unlike previous extreme weather events in Texas which led to deadly blackouts, the grid is holding up remarkably well this week. Several experts told CNN that it's owed in large part to strong performances from wind and solar, which generated 27 gigawatts of electricity during Sunday's peak demand -- close to 40% of the total needed."

.....

 

"Texas is, by rhetoric, anti-renewables. But frankly, renewables are bailing us out," said Michael Webber, an energy expert and professor at the University of Texas at Austin. "They're rocking. That really spares us a lot of heartache and a lot of money."

"Wind and solar would not have been available in years in the past, so the growing capacity helps to alleviate reliance on natural gas and coal," said Jonathan DeVilbiss, operations research analyst at the US Energy Information Administration.

Not only have renewables helped keep the power on during a scorching and early heatwave, they have also helped keep costs low. Prices for natural gas and coal are high amid a worldwide energy crunch, but renewables -- powered by the wind and sun -- have no fuel cost.

"Because the price of wind and sunlight hasn't doubled in the past year like other resources, they are acting as a hedge against high fuel prices," said Joshua Rhodes, an energy researcher at UT Austin."

https://www.cnn.com/2022/06/14/us/texas-energy-record-solar-wind-climate/index.html

[SydneyCarton 48,107]

Guessing this thread will die like a fart in the wind. 

[Trey3216 15,346]

By investment, Texas is anything but anti-renewables.   Fucking stupid ass comment 

[mdmost 43,002]

But sometimes I want to watch TV and the wind isn't blowing so I tell the wife just turn off the TV darling, please, there's no wind, please turn it off quickly. And then she tells me the kids came home from school and said "Mom, I wanna vape!". 

[Captainant 27,676]

Just now, Trey3216 said:

By investment, Texas is anything but anti-renewables.   Fucking stupid ass comment 

Do you not remember when the state froze a year and a half ago and renewables were blamed as the primary cause of the failure?

The real revolution with renewables will be improved energy storage capacity so we can get more flexibility from them

[WBT 20,576]

Yeah, how

Just now, Captainant said:

Do you not remember when the state froze a year and a half ago and renewables were blamed as the primary cause of the failure?

The real revolution with renewables will be improved energy storage capacity so we can get more flexibility from them

That's probably why he said by investment and not by blowhard politician commentary while trying to cover their ass.

[The Dog 44,056]

Quote

Building out more solar will be important to deal with heat waves in the depths of summer, when wind speeds tend to drop, experts told CNN.

Clearly these "experts" haven't heard of the power of OU sucking - which keeps wind speeds high in the panhandle and west Texas.

[Homercles 10,205]

9 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

Guessing this thread will die like a fart in the wind. 

Which is a lost opportunity to extract 0.00000000121 gigawatts from it

[Immaculate Vibes 114]

 

[dcbc 14,485]

2 hours ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

which generated 27 gigawatts of electricity

What the hell is a gigawatt?!?

 

/obligatory

[elfenix 34,243]

1 hour ago, Captainant said:

 

The real revolution with renewables will be improved energy storage capacity so we can get more flexibility from them

huh:

Quote

Texas also surpassed other states in the amount of storage it has under construction or in advanced development, reaching nearly 20,000 megawatts, followed by California at nearly 14,000 megawatts.

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/02/18/texas-led-the-country-in-new-renewable-energy-projects-last-year.html

[Judge Roybeanbag 11,819]

4 minutes ago, elfenix said:

huh:

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/02/18/texas-led-the-country-in-new-renewable-energy-projects-last-year.html

How much of that is going to bitcoin? 😅

[Dahobbs 17,534]

1 hour ago, Trey3216 said:

By investment, Texas is anything but anti-renewables.   Fucking stupid ass comment 

Texas isn't doing the investment. Private entities within Texas are doing that, driven by the superior economics of renewables. The government of Texas is pretty clearly anti-renewable based on its rhetoric. Fortunately, that rhetoric hasn't really resulted in substantial anti-renewable legislation (although there has been some), largely I suspect because Texas is also very pro-business. 

[Trey3216 15,346]

1 minute ago, Dahobbs said:

Texas isn't doing the investment. Private entities within Texas are doing that, driven by the superior economics of renewables. The government of Texas is pretty clearly anti-renewable based on its rhetoric. Fortunately, that rhetoric hasn't really resulted in substantial anti-renewable legislation (although there has been some), largely I suspect because Texas is also very pro-business. 

[Pato del Muerto 52,501]

It’s strange and unusual to discover politicians saying one thing but behaving in a contrary manner. 

Edited June 15, 2022 by Pato del Muerto

[Storm the Field 5,294]

So, I work in O&G and obviously have a vested interest, but I just don't get the shit I see on LinkedIn from other people in O&G that don't simply harbor doubts about renewables but actively discourage them and point to them as the source of all of our energy woes. The argument is basically that every cent invested in "failed" renewables is a cent that was stolen away from reliable O&G. 

 

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20,400]

1 hour ago, Trey3216 said:

By investment, Texas is anything but anti-renewables.   Fucking stupid ass comment 

The comment was ""Texas is, by rhetoric, anti-renewables .."

[CooterBrown 18,014]

Texas isn't doing the investment. Private entities within Texas are doing that, driven by the superior economics of renewables. The government of Texas is pretty clearly anti-renewable based on its rhetoric. Fortunately, that rhetoric hasn't really resulted in substantial anti-renewable legislation (although there has been some), largely I suspect because Texas is also very pro-business. 

Texas is pro-donor first. Our politicians would ban business if someone donated enough.

[Trey3216 15,346]

2 minutes ago, Horn Under a Bad Sign said:

The comment was ""Texas is, by rhetoric, anti-renewables .."

I, too, am capable of reading.  

[ShaggyBevo RIP 3,868]

Need to find the article about how 19th century wars lead to the coal overtaking wood and the rise of the steam engine came from war not the industrial revolution, WWI lead the change from coal to oil and internal combustion engines over steam engines, WWII gave us nuclear power, and the article then predicted Putin’s war on Ukraine would be the big change agent for renewable energy so that nations can be independent of fossil fuel exporters.

It was written before EU banning, last week or so, the sales of ICE vehicles starting in 2035. EU combined is a bigger economy than the US, making it as an aggregate second to China, and China is already going big into renewables as they have to import a lot of the fossil fuel they use.

[Eastwood 4,394]

This political jousting with our energy security is exhausting, pointless, and dangerous. We need both. We need both to work well. We need both to be reliable. We need to be open to maximizing the efficiencies of both. We need to work on minimizing the environmental impact of both.

Both. Not one or the other. This isn't a winner take all cage match. For energy security and stability, we need both.

[Trey3216 15,346]

6 minutes ago, Eastwood said:

This political jousting with our energy security is exhausting, pointless, and dangerous. We need both. We need both to work well. We need both to be reliable. We need to be open to maximizing the efficiencies of both. We need to work on minimizing the environmental impact of both.

Both. Not one or the other. This isn't a winner take all cage match. For energy security and stability, we need both.

[ryskey 447]

Need better distribution and grid expansion to alleviate bottlenecks.  More CREZ lines from West Texas, grid upgrades to connect population centers to generation, and more connectivity between ERCOT and other states.  That'd be a win for renewables and oil & gas.  The time to do that, unfortunately, is when interest rates are low.  Maybe next time.

[texasdago 7,573]

1 hour ago, Storm the Field said:

So, I work in O&G and obviously have a vested interest, but I just don't get the shit I see on LinkedIn from other people in O&G that don't simply harbor doubts about renewables but actively discourage them and point to them as the source of all of our energy woes. The argument is basically that every cent invested in "failed" renewables is a cent that was stolen away from reliable O&G. 

 

I have quite a few O&G clients... while the majors may not be very pro-renewables, I can tell you the oilfield service companies are certainly trying to figure out how to do more and more with wind, solar, etc.  They know where money can be made.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13,512]

If I owned land that had high winds above it or oil/gas below it, anyone is invited to pay me a royalty. 

[Storm the Field 5,294]

10 minutes ago, texasdago said:

I have quite a few O&G clients... while the majors may not be very pro-renewables, I can tell you the oilfield service companies are certainly trying to figure out how to do more and more with wind, solar, etc.  They know where money can be made.

Yep, I know some field land guys/brokers that have definitely embraced renewables work. Lots of wind and solar projects to go along with their traditional O&G.

[Okie State 3,821]

So, I work in O&G and obviously have a vested interest, but I just don't get the shit I see on LinkedIn from other people in O&G that don't simply harbor doubts about renewables but actively discourage them and point to them as the source of all of our energy woes. The argument is basically that every cent invested in "failed" renewables is a cent that was stolen away from reliable O&G. 
 

Same for me. These people are shortsighted fools and honestly we'd be better off if they moved on to a different industry.

[Armybrat 40,850]

Where are nukes in this discussion?

I have been a proponent of “do it all” since the getgo.

[deadshank 24,653]

1 hour ago, Eastwood said:

This political jousting with our energy security is exhausting, pointless, and dangerous. We need both. We need both to work well. We need both to be reliable. We need to be open to maximizing the efficiencies of both. We need to work on minimizing the environmental impact of both.

Both. Not one or the other. This isn't a winner take all cage match. For energy security and stability, we need both.

How dare you make a sensible comment on this board. 

[Nice Guy Eddie 13,512]

12 minutes ago, Armybrat said:

Where are nukes in this discussion?

I have been a proponent of “do it all” since the getgo.

Limited appetite for new plants or reactors in the US. I believe the last new reactor was in 2016. Prior to that was 95. There are 2 new reactors under construction in GA but I haven't heard of any others even being planned.

The South Texas Project in Bay City has been approved for 2 new reactors for at least a decade but I don't think they've progressed with it. Maybe it's officially scrapped now.

If the price of electricity remains high and is not thought to drop to "normal" levels, more Texas reactors could be economically feasible. Of course, if you're the generation company perhaps you would prefer to spend the capital on wind or solar. Less financially risky and your return on capital is faster.

[Dahobbs 17,534]

28 minutes ago, Armybrat said:

Where are nukes in this discussion?

I have been a proponent of “do it all” since the getgo.

Not economically viable. Same place they've been for a very long time. 

[immamac 42,852]

2 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

Not economically viable. Same place they've been for a very long time. 

Nuclear is the most economically viable energy generation and if you leverage thorium it's incredible. 

The biggest lie in nuclear is how dangerous it is and how much there is a waste problem, it's only a problem because of the fuel they decide to use and enrich. 

[Captainant 27,676]

33 minutes ago, Armybrat said:

Where are nukes in this discussion?

I have been a proponent of “do it all” since the getgo.

 

Just now, immamac said:

Nuclear is the most economically viable energy generation and if you leverage thorium it's incredible. 

The biggest lie in nuclear is how dangerous it is and how much there is a waste problem, it's only a problem because of the fuel they decide to use and enrich. 

The challenge with nukes is that they require billions of upfront expenditure and damn near a decade of operation to reach breakeven and start turning a profit. America does not like long-term delayed gratification when shareholders want a profit next quarter and not a decade from now.

The latest gen nuke reactors (gen 4) are passively safe and have relatively benign waste, but the economics are going to kill nukes without a subsidy or guarantee from the federal government

[Armybrat 40,850]

You could say the same about the renewables….and a lot of that capital expenditure seems to be going to China and Germany.

[immamac 42,852]

7 minutes ago, Captainant said:

 

The challenge with nukes is that they require billions of upfront expenditure and damn near a decade of operation to reach breakeven and start turning a profit. America does not like long-term delayed gratification when shareholders want a profit next quarter and not a decade from now.

The latest gen nuke reactors (gen 4) are passively safe and have relatively benign waste, but the economics are going to kill nukes without a subsidy or guarantee from the federal government

If only there was a guaranteed revenue source that without fail over the last 100 years has proven to increase in demand tied to it. If only that was the case! 

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20,400]

2 hours ago, Eastwood said:

This political jousting with our energy security is exhausting, pointless, and dangerous. We need both. We need both to work well. We need both to be reliable. We need to be open to maximizing the efficiencies of both. We need to work on minimizing the environmental impact of both.

Both. Not one or the other. This isn't a winner take all cage match. For energy security and stability, we need both.

We CURRENTLY need both. The future? Doubtful. 

[YChang 3,446]

I'm hopeful for the micro-nuclear grid concept. 

[hullabelew 3,724]

The wind farm in Archer and Young counties (no idea how many windmills are there,...maybe 200-300) had to have all of their generators and blades replaced 7-8 years after they were initially installed.  According to a couple of the land owners I talked to, they cut the blades in half, loaded them on trucks and drove them to NM to bury them.   Apparently, the blades can't be recycled.    Those fuckers are ugly and annoying, even in that God-forsaken part of the world.   

That wind farm has benefitted Young Co (Olney in particular).  They did a great job of earmarking the money to prop up the local hospital.  

 

[Pato del Muerto 52,501]

I happen to like the way wind farms look. 
 

I especially like it when they are raised above a working farm field. They take very little in terms of a footprint, and I assume some ingress egress for maintenance and repairs.  The farm loses little farmable ground. 

[SydneyCarton 48,107]

41 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Limited appetite for new plants or reactors in the US. I believe the last new reactor was in 2016. Prior to that was 95. There are 2 new reactors under construction in GA but I haven't heard of any others even being planned.

The South Texas Project in Bay City has been approved for 2 new reactors for at least a decade but I don't think they've progressed with it. Maybe it's officially scrapped now.

If the price of electricity remains high and is not thought to drop to "normal" levels, more Texas reactors could be economically feasible. Of course, if you're the generation company perhaps you would prefer to spend the capital on wind or solar. Less financially risky and your return on capital is faster.

Generators don't want to add more generation, because then the price drops. If you're the generation company, you only want to spend the money on the exact amount of extra generation that allows you to charge the premium without eating into your massive profits. 

[Dahobbs 17,534]

35 minutes ago, immamac said:

Nuclear is the most economically viable energy generation and if you leverage thorium it's incredible. 

The biggest lie in nuclear is how dangerous it is and how much there is a waste problem, it's only a problem because of the fuel they decide to use and enrich. 

Eh, I guess in theory it could be viable. But in practice, at least in the US, it hasn't been. Maybe that changes. 

[crash_davis 23,113]

Japan is developing ocean turbines driven by ocean currents. Won't someone think of the dolphins!

https://www.designboom.com/technology/japan-new-ocean-turbine-could-harvest-endless-green-power-06-13-2022/

For over a decade, Japan’s IHI Corporation has been working on Kairyu, a sea turbine that can harness the power of the ocean currents. Developed in collaboration with NEDO, the 100kW and 330-ton tidal power plant features a 66-foot central cylinder with two extra ones on each side, each carrying 36-foot turbine blades attached to them.

Japan is located near the Kuroshio, one of the world’s most powerful ocean currents, and one estimate states that if the energy present in the Kuroshio could be harnessed, it would amount to approximately 205 GW, which is comparable to Japan’s total electric power generation. Ocean current power generation is a harvesting method of ocean renewable energy. This energy regeneration technology is intended to effectively utilize the Kuroshio Current and is suited to Japan.

 

Just think of all that electricity generation when the next tsunami hits, as long as the bodies don't clog up the turbines!

[Dahobbs 17,534]

31 minutes ago, hullabelew said:

The wind farm in Archer and Young counties (no idea how many windmills are there,...maybe 200-300) had to have all of their generators and blades replaced 7-8 years after they were initially installed.  According to a couple of the land owners I talked to, they cut the blades in half, loaded them on trucks and drove them to NM to bury them.   Apparently, the blades can't be recycled.    Those fuckers are ugly and annoying, even in that God-forsaken part of the world.   

That wind farm has benefitted Young Co (Olney in particular).  They did a great job of earmarking the money to prop up the local hospital.  

 

This is largely a misunderstanding of the economics of wind farms. Old blades generally don't need to be replaced in the sense that they stop working. It is just economical to do so because we've learned that in general, bigger blades are better. So, replacing old blades with larger ones and combining them with larger generators is a relatively small expense vs the increased efficiency. Recycling is possible, it just isn't done much yet. You'll likely see that industry spring up as more wind farms get built, the same way you're now seeing increases in lithium ion battery recycling. 

Some sources below:

Quote

 

Since 2009, the average swept area of a turbine has doubled, thanks to 20% longer blades, Energy Department researchers said on a webinar yesterday.

That has allowed today’s turbines to capture more of the wind that flows past, making them far more efficient and slashing the cost of their energy by as much as 50% on wholesale markets.

 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/longer-turbine-blades-have-slashed-wind-energy-costs/

https://www.energy.gov/eere/articles/wind-turbines-bigger-better

https://blog.ucsusa.org/james-gignac/wind-turbine-blades-recycling/

https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2020-02-06/wind-turbine-blades

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2021/11/30/fact-check-recycling-can-keep-wind-turbine-blades-out-landfills/8647981002/

 

 

Edited June 15, 2022 by Dahobbs

[Immaculate Vibes 114]

3 hours ago, Eastwood said:

This political jousting with our energy security is exhausting, pointless, and dangerous. We need both. We need both to work well. We need both to be reliable. We need to be open to maximizing the efficiencies of both. We need to work on minimizing the environmental impact of both.

Both. Not one or the other. This isn't a winner take all cage match. For energy security and stability, we need both.

I’ve seen a good suggestion that we onshore polysilicon production from China. It would require more energy generation here, but we could utilize our natural gas resources to help it happen. Win/win. Then we aren’t depending on coal and literal slave labor in China for our solar panels here. That’s a big part of why they’re “cheap”. 
 

Overall a good discussion and understanding of the trade offs are what’s lacking today. 
 

 

 

[Neonmoon 38,129]

 

5 hours ago, Trey3216 said:

By investment, Texas is anything but anti-renewables.   Fucking stupid ass comment 

Why is it a “fucking stupid ass comment” to say Texas is anti-renewable rhetorically even when Texas is pro-renewables investment wise? 
 

[phdhorn 6,224]

I've had this little thing on my desk for over a month.  Since this is DT and not SHITROOM I can finally get rid of it.  But it's a good article (a lot of discussion on ERCOT and Texas energy on here is decent, but naturally, a lot of it is pure bullshit).  Posting in its entirety since I think it's behind a paywall.  And the bold is mine, but a damn good point.   

Sum:  Texas power resources, driven by market competiton and not by governmental dictate or fiat, is quietly upping - a whole shitload - renewables, and has for awhile.  

What I love about this article is that it shows that politics is overblown as a driver for good - or bad.  Yeah it exists, but it's definitely not the main definer of it.  I'll leave it to you to decide.  I already have/know (and as a "weather guy", I've had a keen interest in this stuff for years).  Anyway, I can finally get this of my desk.
 

THIS IS MEMBER-EXCLUSIVE CONTENT

OPINION

Renewables supplied a third of Texas’ electricity in 1Q. Why that gives us hope for grid reliability

The competitive electricity market is a powerful tool.

Dust from strong southerly winds partially obscure wind turbines spinning on the Texas plains near Southland on Jan. 18, 2022.(Tom Fox)

By Dallas Morning News Editorial

2:00 AM on May 2, 2022

This editorial is part of a series published by The Dallas Morning News Opinion section to explore ideas and policies for strengthening electric reliability. Find Keeping the Lights On at dallasnews.com/opinion.

As the country turned to Texas in the past couple of months to boost oil and gas production to supply our allies against Russia, something else happened, something quiet and extraordinary.

In March, Texas oil and gas regulators issued a record number of drilling permits. That’s no surprise; Washington politicians have been calling on the Permian Basin to produce more fossil fuels to support European nations that are cutting off or being cut off from Russian oil and gas. High oil prices are a good signal to the industry to produce more.

Also in the first quarter, Texas hit an entirely different energy record. The state produced more renewable energy than ever before. According to the Electric Reliability Council of Texas, about a third of the power on the Texas grid came from wind and solar.

Some folks thought this kind of success for renewables could be best achieved by protesting outside of an Exxon shareholder meeting or climbing in trees scheduled to be bulldozed to build a pipeline. Turns out market forces are more powerful than bullhorns.

The Texas wholesale electricity market was designed to favor low-cost electricity, which at the time when the market was first established meant nuclear and coal power. Lawmakers added some incentives for renewables with modest expectations.

A competitive market plus incentives for renewables turned out to be a powerful combination. It also helps that Texas hardly ever rejects a wind or solar project, as regulators in many other states do. Soon renewables on the ERCOT grid became so plentiful, that they knocked many older, more expensive fossil fuel plants out of business. Great for consumers: cheaper, cleaner energy. At times, wind is so plentiful that market prices dip below zero, because of the way the renewable energy credit system is set up to subsidize investment in clean energy.

It all worked better than anyone could have anticipated. So well, that ERCOT has to change the way it manages the grid to make sure that when the wind stops blowing and the sun stops shining, there is enough back-up power to keep the lights on.

In fact, keeping the grid reliable is getting dicey, because investors do not want to build expensive fossil fuel plants, nor do they want to keep operating old coal and gas plants that don’t make money. Our electricity market that incentivizes cheap, clean energy has failed to incentivize reliability.

Regulators are on it, planning to buy back-up power and subsidize the cost. It’s a good start, but not nearly enough. The success of competitive markets in growing renewable energy in Texas should give us great hope that market forces can also be used to grow reliable energy, too.

There’s no need to give an advantage to certain fuel types or technology. Instead, by changing market rules, the Public Utility Commission can ensure that the Texas electricity market is fertile ground for investments in plants and equipment that can produce power on demand. That could be a new natural gas plant, an old coal plant outfitted to meet environmental standards, batteries, or some technology that, like wind and solar 20 years ago, we can hardly imagine will ever become reality in Texas.

https://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/editorials/2022/05/02/renewables-supplied-a-third-of-texas-electricity-in-1q-why-that-gives-us-hope-for-grid-reliability/

This is akin to my own life.  I recycle prodigiously because I want to, and there are incentives to.  Not because I have to.  I like it.

As far as the topic, no one's saying that ERCOT and the energy situation in Texas is all butterflies and unicorns - but  - gasp!  There are some good things happening.  And renewables are part of it.

And finally, staying way the hell out of personal politics, I can say that "Texas government" has indeed gotten the message, and I'll just say that in the past year since The Big Chill, they've uniformly begun to take an "all fuels" tack, including renewables (and I'm looking at about 6-7 articles in the last six months to prove this right now on my screen - but I'll refrain because some of it is political). Anyway, this is my stance - provide incentives for all forms of energy - including fossil - because we're gonna need all of 'em.  The biggest threat to our energy livelihood is not political, it's demographic.  As in the many, many people moving here, to a place that was never designed to hold as many climatologically as it is starting to (see: Southern California Basin circa 1935ff).

Anyway, this is actually some "good news" I hope we can all agree on without getting twisted about which political direction this comes from.  In reality, both parties have a hand in the bad's - and the good's like this.  I hope it stays that way.

(Whew, finally got rid of this!).

[Captainant 27,676]

5 minutes ago, phdhorn said:

Sum:  Texas power resources, driven by market competiton and not by governmental dictate or fiat, is quietly upping - a whole shitload - renewables, and has for awhile.  

Counterpoint: our state has frequently taken direct action to counter federal renewable subsidies. In fact, our state imposed new fees last summer that target renewables and charge them when not producing (when the sun isn't shining or wind isn't blowing) to put their thumb on the scale in favor of fossil fuels.

I do agree that market economics are what's driving our energy policy, but it's certainly not free market economics.

[Trey3216 15,346]

17 minutes ago, Neonmoon said:

 

Why is it a “fucking stupid ass comment” to say Texas is anti-renewable rhetorically even when Texas is pro-renewables investment wise? 
 

I'm not going to get into a Cloaky conversation.  It's a fucking stupid ass comment because legislatively, monetarily, electrical generationally, and a hundred other -ly's, it's not even in the realm of reality.  So it's a fucking stupid ass comment.  

[Trey3216 15,346]

2 minutes ago, Captainant said:

Counterpoint: our state has frequently taken direct action to counter federal renewable subsidies. In fact, our state imposed new fees last summer that target renewables and charge them when not producing (when the sun isn't shining or wind isn't blowing) to put their thumb on the scale in favor of fossil fuels.

I do agree that market economics are what's driving our energy policy, but it's certainly not free market economics.

Hey, as long as it's your business getting the freebies all is good, amirite?  

[Judge Roybeanbag 11,819]

1 hour ago, hullabelew said:

The wind farm in Archer and Young counties (no idea how many windmills are there,...maybe 200-300) had to have all of their generators and blades replaced 7-8 years after they were initially installed.  According to a couple of the land owners I talked to, they cut the blades in half, loaded them on trucks and drove them to NM to bury them.   Apparently, the blades can't be recycled.    Those fuckers are ugly and annoying, even in that God-forsaken part of the world.   

That wind farm has benefitted Young Co (Olney in particular).  They did a great job of earmarking the money to prop up the local hospital.  

 

I read an interesting blog on the blade recycling issue.  

https://blog.ucsusa.org/james-gignac/wind-turbine-blades-recycling/