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Wulaw Horn

By Wulaw Horn
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crash_davis
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lulz

babysdaddy
babysdaddy

That house looks like Plano buttfucked the woodlands

alincoln
alincoln

You are both lying.  No one knows anyone who watches LIV

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Wulaw Horn

Wulaw Horn 19066

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I’m surprised Fox wants no part of this. It was offered to them for free and they said no thanks- we are good. 
no carriage coming from Disney, CBS, NBC/Golf Channel. Only shot maybe a streamer if Fox remains disinterested?  
But now they have an announcing name. Hell- maybe Faldo?  He didn’t want to quit, just wanted a more limited schedule which the LIV obviously would be. 
Weird. 

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htown85

htown85 159

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21 hours ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

Paying more out to players, not just top players. Stop pretending there wasn't more money to share. 

 

That said Cameron Smith to LIV rumors only getting louder....

There was a $300M reserve fund for years like 2020 when a pandemic alters the economics of the sport.  I suppose you could argue that reserve fund is too big, but it’s not like there are PGA execs who are making tens of millions of dollars.  And I thought the whole point was the guys that move the needle aren’t getting paid enough, not that the other guys aren’t getting enough.

 

the new TV deal will help the tour, but I’m not sure any sport generates enough money to fight off the Saudi government except maybe the NFL.

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heso

heso 2786

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19 hours ago, babysdaddy said:

Cam won $2.5mm today, about $1.5 mm less than Brenden Grace won at that abortion in Portland

I’ll remember Cam Smith shooting -6 on the back 9 plus that par save on 17 to win his first major when Rory had the engraver practicing his name Saturday night, probably forever. 

I forgot who won the event in Portland less than 48 hours after it was over. 

if I’m a top 10 golfer in the world I’m making more money than I’ll ever dream of spending (unless I have to keep Paulina honest). At that point my legacy is what’s important and the LIV tour means nothing more than an extra zero in my bank account that I’ll never spend down. 

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Wulaw Horn

Wulaw Horn 19066

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22 minutes ago, heso said:

I’ll remember Cam Smith shooting -6 on the back 9 plus that par save on 17 to win his first major when Rory had the engraver practicing his name Saturday night, probably forever. 

I forgot who won the event in Portland less than 48 hours after it was over. 

if I’m a top 10 golfer in the world I’m making more money than I’ll ever dream of spending (unless I have to keep Paulina honest). At that point my legacy is what’s important and the LIV tour means nothing more than an extra zero in my bank account that I’ll never spend down. 

FIGJAM Mickletits says you could find a way to spend it. 

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WBT

WBT 20561

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3 hours ago, htown85 said:

I’m not sure any sport generates enough money to fight off the Saudi government except maybe the NFL

Yep.  They've screwed up European soccer (along with Qatar and UAE) and have moved onto golf.  And will continue to do so until they lose interest or the world moves away from oil enough that they can't afford it.

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Pablo

Pablo 494

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42 minutes ago, WBT said:

Yep.  They've screwed up European soccer (along with Qatar and UAE) and have moved onto golf.  And will continue to do so until they lose interest or the world moves away from oil enough that they can't afford it.

Good point, which makes me feel better about not having gotten in following European soccer.....yet.

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Wulaw Horn

Wulaw Horn 19066

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2 hours ago, LTtxfan said:

John Daly WANTS in on LIV Golf 'party' 

I had said that they absolutely should have him in.  His signing bonus can be a case of jack and 10 cartons of Newports and a few crates of diet cokes.  
People will show up to watch him.  The bottom half of their fields are anonymous and they are ass. 

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thunderlounge

thunderlounge 7813

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Henrik Stenson announced he was joining and will play starting with upcoming tournament.

Yeah, that Henrik Stenson, whom was also just sacked as the captain of the European Ryder Cup team.

 

Whoopsie.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jul/20/henrik-stenson-stripped-of-ryder-cup-captaincy-liv-golf

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LTtxfan

LTtxfan 49143

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LIV is becoming the landing spot for 34+ aged guys looking for a big final payout 

  • DJ
  • Sergio
  • FIGJAM
  • Stenson
  • Poulter
  • Oosthuizen
  • 🎶Na Na Na Na🎶
  • Westwood
  • C.Howell III
  • Brandon Grace
  • Schwartzel
  • Pat Perez
  • Martin Kaymer
  • Graeme McDowell
  • Matt Jones
  • Richard Bland

 

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StruggleBus

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1 hour ago, ocugolf said:

It's truly laughable how bad the PGA Commissioner screwed this up.

Not really. There is nothing that could have been done. Letting your pros play in LIV events would have led to assured destruction of the PGA tour once LIV expands to 14 events per year. 
 

This will all come down to OWGR points. If LIV gets to the point where they can qualify for them, then look out. 

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ocugolf

ocugolf 1214

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Lots of things he could have done that some of the players leaving brought to him as what needed to change. 
 

Release shot footage to the players for their brand.

Move Champions Tour age to 45.

Appearance Fees where players/caddies don’t take a loss showing up

Allow them to play LIV events but have to play a minimum PGA Tour schedule. Make the players play every event once every 3-4 years. That boosts fields on your weaker events. 
 

PGA U gets top 5 players in college a PGA Tour card, not Korn Ferry.

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Pam Cummings

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None of that is realistic. None of that is gonna stop a person from taking a guaranteed $50m pay day. The only option they have is to fight it. It baffles me to think that there are actually people out there who view the PGA Tour's behavior as "being bullies". No, the bullies are the government-backed billion-dollar entity that are quite literally trying to just buy the sport, and cut out a lot of the people who put in hard work to make it what it is today.

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Revolution512

Revolution512 1487

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3 minutes ago, Pam Cummings said:

None of that is realistic. None of that is gonna stop a person from taking a guaranteed $50m pay day. The only option they have is to fight it. It baffles me to think that there are actually people out there who view the PGA Tour's behavior as "being bullies". No, the bullies are the government-backed billion-dollar entity that are quite literally trying to just buy the sport, and cut out a lot of the people who put in hard work to make it what it is today.

Maybe, maybe not. But you could’ve continued to exist. There are ways to work this out. A non-profit decided to draw a line in the sand with independent contractors…..pure brilliance. The tour will cave soon, just a matter of time. 

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StruggleBus

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I don't think there is an option to cave. Look at it this way: If a LIV player plays 14 LIV events and 4 majors, that's already 18 events on the year and essentially a full schedule. A LIV player might at that point have room for a few PGA tour events at best. So maybe the Players, Memorial, and Bay Hill still get good draws of players, but then every other PGA tour event is turned into a Korn Ferry Tour event.

At that point, the PGA tour is completely dead. They have to keep fighting this. 

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field

field 225

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1 minute ago, Revolution512 said:

Maybe, maybe not. But you could’ve continued to exist. There are ways to work this out. A non-profit decided to draw a line in the sand with independent contractors…..pure brilliance. The tour will cave soon, just a matter of time. 

Right, this would be a totally different situation if Tour players were employees.  There's no way an "employee" would leave one employer to work for another employer to earn millions of more dollars a year and to work less.  I never realized it was that simple.   

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Pam Cummings

Pam Cummings 9639

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10 minutes ago, Revolution512 said:

Maybe, maybe not. But you could’ve continued to exist. There are ways to work this out. A non-profit decided to draw a line in the sand with independent contractors…..pure brilliance. The tour will cave soon, just a matter of time. 

I mean, has anyone even thought about this in the long term? What if this prince guy that is doing all of this suddenly wasnt in power anymore and the new people wanted to pull the plug? Just seems like attaching 100% your business/employment opportunities to the stability of the middle east seems....not good?

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dcar00

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54 minutes ago, Pam Cummings said:

None of that is realistic. None of that is gonna stop a person from taking a guaranteed $50m pay day. The only option they have is to fight it. It baffles me to think that there are actually people out there who view the PGA Tour's behavior as "being bullies". No, the bullies are the government-backed billion-dollar entity that are quite literally trying to just buy the sport, and cut out a lot of the people who put in hard work to make it what it is today.

Are people viewing the PGA as a bully?   PGA isn't being a bully, they are/have been trying to protect their profits/IP.  And LIV is just the competition with a massive investor pumping money into them.  happens every day all around the world. 

The PGA tour just needs to protect the 22-45 year olds by giving them a deal that make sense.  they aren't going to be able to protect 40+ year old players who can only make half their cuts from cashing out. and why would you anyway?

gonna have to cut the back end of the tour players and make them go Korn Ferry.  maybe top 80?

PGA needs to use its muscle with the USGA, Masters, and R&A together to change the rules and ban them from Ryder Cup and all Majors.  Its the only leverage they have until LIV blows up.

everything will adjust and yes the current bottom guys on Korn Ferry are likely to be blown to the four winds.

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babysdaddy

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2 hours ago, StruggleBus said:

Not really. There is nothing that could have been done. Letting your pros play in LIV events would have led to assured destruction of the PGA tour once LIV expands to 14 events per year. 
 

This will all come down to OWGR points. If LIV gets to the point where they can qualify for them, then look out. 

Here is the current Board of the OWGR that will approve or not.  Jay will recuse.  The others will kill it.  No majors available unless you qualify from a previous victory.

PGA Tour commissioner Jay Monahan,

DP World Tour CEO Keith Pelley,

USGA CEO Mike Whan,

R&A CEO Martin Slumbers,

PGA of America executive director Seth Waugh,

Augusta National Golf Club executive director Will Jones and

Keith Waters, who represents the International Federation of PGA Tours.

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htown85

htown85 159

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I don’t see how the OWGR will change its formula given who is on the board and even if they do it takes over a year for them to do anything like that. So assuming the majors don’t go out of their way to may exceptions for the LIV guys that aren’t past champions (PGA won’t, R&A was pretty clear on their stance last weekend, US Open prides itself on the qualifying system, and The Masters won’t want to expand their field), the LIV guys are all fucked from playing the majors unless they go play Asian Tour events (which is hilarious) or they are exempt by already winning one.  The Saudis are going to have to buy golfers for like 5 years straight for this to stay relevant, otherwise…is anyone really going to watch?  The schedule is already terrible for TV, so even if they get a TV partner you have to go out of your way to find and watch it.

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Grade of D as in David

Grade of D as in David 13253

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Regarding OWGR points, I saw Ernie Els quoted as saying that they don't get points for the 54 hole tournaments on the champions tour.  That coupled with the fact that they require the tour to have 20 events, average field size of 75 players and be in operation for a year before they can get points make me think they won't ever get OWGR for the Saudi tour. They may get them from the Asian tour but they are going to have to play even more events that they would in the states to get points since they are essentially trading cash for points for 14 weeks a year. Non exempt guys are done playing majors, and some of the currently exempt ones (Masters) may see themselves not invited since they are an invitational and can so whatever they want.

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Hate

Hate 20106

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Some of the major winners on the LIV tour are about to come up on their 5 year exemption.  I guess DJ, Reed, Garcia, and Schwartzel will be content playing the Masters for the next 20 years...if they'll have them.  I haven't heard the Masters say anything on this yet. I would assume the Masters will still let former champs play.  One thing about those LIV players is they won't have the same edge to them in preparing for the majors.  There won't be the same pressure on them to win like there is on the PGA tour.  I wouldn't be surprised if nobody from that tour ever wins another major. 

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LTtxfan

LTtxfan 49143

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1 hour ago, Hate said:

Some of the major winners on the LIV tour are about to come up on their 5 year exemption.  I guess DJ, Reed, Garcia, and Schwartzel will be content playing the Masters for the next 20 years...if they'll have them.  I haven't heard the Masters say anything on this yet. I would assume the Masters will still let former champs play.  One thing about those LIV players is they won't have the same edge to them in preparing for the majors.  There won't be the same pressure on them to win like there is on the PGA tour.  I wouldn't be surprised if nobody from that tour ever wins another major. 

 

Not sure of accuracy, but found this...

The perks of winning a major championship

  • Prestige, obviously -- you're in a limited company of players to ever win a major
  • If you win the Masters, you're in the Masters for life, basically, and you're in the U.S. Open, Open Championship and PGA Championship for five years
  • If you win the U.S. Open, you're exempt in the U.S. Open for 10 years, and you're in the Masters, Open Championship and PGA Championship for five years
  • If you win the British Open, you're in the Open until you're 60, and you're in the Masters, U.S. Open and PGA Championship for five years
  • If you win the PGA Championship, you're in the PGA Championship for life, basically, and you're in the Masters, U.S. Open and Open Championship for five years
  • You get a 5-year exemption on the PGA Tour for winning a major, and you can pretty much set your schedule for two years
  • You get a spot in the Tournament of Champions
  • You get 100 Official World Golf Ranking points, which pretty much locks up a spot in the top 50 in the Official World Golf Ranking for 18 months, no matter what
  • You get 600 FedEx Cup points
  • You get big Ryder Cup points if you're an American or European player

https://thegolfnewsnet.com/golfnewsnetteam/2020/08/09/perks-winning-major-championship-tournaments-exemptions-103789/

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Wulaw Horn

Wulaw Horn 19066

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On 7/20/2022 at 12:01 PM, ocugolf said:

Lots of things he could have done that some of the players leaving brought to him as what needed to change. 
 

Release shot footage to the players for their brand.

Move Champions Tour age to 45.

Appearance Fees where players/caddies don’t take a loss showing up

Allow them to play LIV events but have to play a minimum PGA Tour schedule. Make the players play every event once every 3-4 years. That boosts fields on your weaker events. 
 

PGA U gets top 5 players in college a PGA Tour card, not Korn Ferry.

Those are all great changes IMO.  I don't know if it would have moved the needle on anything as to how it played out, but I suspect it would have (side note- it would have cost those LIV guys a lot of money as the LIV would no longer have to shell out 8 and 9 figure pay days to get them to jump) because then they can treat that like exhibition/silly season to go hit the LIV events up and still stay on tour for the OWGR points- who would bitch about that from a players perspective.  

Now- you'd get some events crushed that are opposite the LIV events, but I suspect you could have worked with those guys to not schedule the same event the same week multiple years in a row.  The every 3 or 4 year clause is good for the smaller events, obviously.  As far as that goes for the players that might be tough when it's a 14 event schedule on the LIV.  Call it 14 on the LIV, 4 majors, then to get to every event once every 4 years they would have to play another 8 tour events. That's I guess the thing that would kill it from the players perspective.  Maybe you could get an agreement from LIV to keep it at 10 events, or have 7 of those events be scheduled after the Open in July, so that the guys only have to make 7 events once every 4 years.  

There's lots of ways, to your point, where the tour could have compromised and kept their players.  Nobody that's left at this point in time is a deal breaker they can't deal with, but I feel like they are 8 or 10 top 50 types away (or 3 top 15 types) from really feeling this.  

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Wally Fairway

Wally Fairway 5541

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23 minutes ago, Wulaw Horn said:

I would assume Tiger could have that exemption if he made a phone call, but it is the USGA so who the hell knows. 

Can you imagine the USGA hearing that Tiger wants to play in a future US Open and telling him he has to play a 36 1-day qualifier. Fans would come with pitchforks and torches if that happened. 

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Wulaw Horn

Wulaw Horn 19066

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1 hour ago, Wally Fairway said:

Can you imagine the USGA hearing that Tiger wants to play in a future US Open and telling him he has to play a 36 1-day qualifier. Fans would come with pitchforks and torches if that happened. 

Yep.  But they are literally the only organization in the golf world I could imagine being that tone deaf.  The right USGA president would view it as a badge of honor and brag to all his asshole friends about it. 

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conVINCEd

conVINCEd 21469

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3 minutes ago, TonyTexas said:

I don’t think that’s right. They may have received special exemptions for certain years but not in perpetuity 

They offered Phil one last year but he fucked around and won the PGA so he didn’t need it.

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