Succession -- HBO

[Chopper 16620]

I'm looking forward to the finale for a different reason that most of you. I've found the show interesting for what it says about the media world. But ultimately -- and more so with the last two episodes -- it's not anything I'll miss watching.

My favorite part of the last episode was when roman got punched, knocked over and trampled. From what little I recall that was the only moment any of the Roys have suffered from something done to them by mere plebes. He literally had to jump a barrier in order to pay any price for conspiring with a nazi-adjacent to steal an election. Other than that it's just been mere infighting. From my pov it's a shame none of the stampeders stopped to step on his throat. 

I don't see this show as satire. Sure there are satiric and comedic moments. But at heart, it's just a drama based on reality where they've made all the central characters as thoroughly repugnant as possible, and glamorized the ultra wealthy white men with power. There's no long satiric joke. It's mostly exaggerated tropes like the benefits of nepotism and how it enables wanton stupidity. There's no real price paid even for the nepotism. I understand why there's no anti-hero nor any outcome for which to cheer.

I suppose it's too close to reality for my escapist tv viewing preferences.

[4th&Five 41183]

I can’t disagree. I enjoyed the previous seasons a lot more than this one. 

[F250 28491]

55 minutes ago, Chopper said:

I'm looking forward to the finale for a different reason that most of you. I've found the show interesting for what it says about the media world. But ultimately -- and more so with the last two episodes -- it's not anything I'll miss watching.

My favorite part of the last episode was when roman got punched, knocked over and trampled. From what little I recall that was the only moment any of the Roys have suffered from something done to them by mere plebes. He literally had to jump a barrier in order to pay any price for conspiring with a nazi-adjacent to steal an election. Other than that it's just been mere infighting. From my pov it's a shame none of the stampeders stopped to step on his throat. 

I don't see this show as satire. Sure there are satiric and comedic moments. But at heart, it's just a drama based on reality where they've made all the central characters as thoroughly repugnant as possible, and glamorized the ultra wealthy white men with power. There's no long satiric joke. It's mostly exaggerated tropes like the benefits of nepotism and how it enables wanton stupidity. There's no real price paid even for the nepotism. I understand why there's no anti-hero nor any outcome for which to cheer.

I suppose it's too close to reality for my escapist tv viewing preferences.

I agree on wanting to see Roman be the recipient of a near life ending beat down. All of the characters need to be lined up against a wall in front of a partisan firing squad.

[YGIFS 19445]

the show started as eye candy filler.  Then it became satire.  It is now, almost straight parody.  That is the inherent genius of it all.  We can't talk about the real world entity and family it once satirized and now parodies, but this genius will be unpacked a decade from now for avant garde brilliance.  

There also should have been more butt sex shown.

[MissingInAction 24416]

I just binged the last 9 eps. I have to say that ep 3 was some powerful shit. Having experienced the death of someone close that one was perfectly done. I was right there with them. 

[billfromlaketravis 11290]

On 5/24/2023 at 7:57 PM, Bama Chick said:

From Mark Mylod, director of the finale -

Good post. Kendall takes over tonight, but at what cost? 
 

I think he’s already lost his kids and any relationship with his Rava. 
 

I guess losing his siblings is next. 

[Aqua Buddha 14216]

My prediction is that he leaves it all to Ewan (James Cromwell) and then he blows it up.  Logan knew his kids weren't "serious people" and Ewan owns a lot of shares anyway.  All the kids would then be left to twist.

I could be wrong but it would be awesome.

[MissingInAction 24416]

19 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

My prediction is that he leaves it all to Ewan (James Cromwell) and then he blows it up.  Logan knew his kids weren't "serious people" and Ewan owns a lot of shares anyway.  All the kids would then be left to twist.

I could be wrong but it would be awesome.

[Ted Lange 15934]

 

[kingkoopa6 8274]

#teamgreg 

 

 

Edited May 28, 2023 by kingkoopa6

[Aqua Buddha 14216]

Doubling down on my Ewan theory.  James Cromwell as an actor has the gravitas to pull it off.  Ewan was also out of the mix until last episode where he horned in on the funeral.

[TexEx15 17253]

On 5/24/2023 at 7:57 PM, Bama Chick said:

From Mark Mylod, director of the finale -

 

4 hours ago, billfromlaketravis said:

Good post. Kendall takes over tonight, but at what cost? 
 

I think he’s already lost his kids and any relationship with his Rava. 
 

I guess losing his siblings is next. 

 

[speed817 18917]

Beef ribs for the finale tonight....

[HamsterHookah 112]

Good little read on The New Yorker:

In his extraordinary eulogy for Logan, Kendall says, “There wasn’t a room, from the grandest state room where his advice was sought to the lowest house where his news played, where he couldn’t walk and wasn’t comfortable.” Kendall was never comfortable in any room he walked into, most of all the room of his own skin. Placed against more confident adversaries (Logan, Lukas Matsson), he could merely puff himself up with hot air, but he could never be at peace. The question hovering over the finale is who will, at long last, get control of Waystar Royco. Kendall seems bent on becoming the “killer” his father told him he was not. But Logan, having fucked off on his own time, isn’t around to dethrone. It’s clear that Kendall would be better suited living out his years in a nice villa in Tuscany than running a media empire, but he has the same misguided hunger that he did at the start, the same need to kill or impress or become his father, in lieu of winning his love. With or without Logan’s crown, he’ll never have his father’s spine. He’s a gloriously flawed, tragically ridiculous, comically inept Prince Hamlet for our pathetic times. Farewell, Kendall Roy. We loved you, but you are not a serious person.

[mchookem 15539]

wonder if Vegas is laying odds lol

see y'all on the other side 😯

Edited May 29, 2023 by mchookem

[speed817 18917]

Not surprised but.....

[Macklemore 2856]

Fuck Shiv. That’s all I got to say. Wish Tom was real because he and I would be besties and would be the true equal to his as a Disgusting Bro.

Edited May 29, 2023 by Macklemore

[Aqua Buddha 14216]

That's a terrible ending.  Sorry.  Great show.  Terrible ending.

 

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20304]

3 minutes ago, Macklemore said:

Fuck Shiv. That’s all I got to say. Wish Tom was real because he and I would be besties and would be the true equal to his as a Disgusting Bro.

Shiv is plain downright stupid. 

[4th&Five 41183]

Meh. Everyone had to know the dead kid would come back to haunt him. 

[Dbeasy 14783]

I thought the finale was fine. I still have ptsd from GOT. 

[Aqua Buddha 14216]

8 minutes ago, 4th&Five said:

Meh. Everyone had to know the dead kid would come back to haunt him. 

But that fact was known before the last few minutes.  That's why it's a bad ending.

 

[ATXhorn17 1591]

Kendall should’ve ascended the throne to complete his arc… Shiv’s last-minute flip flop didn’t make much sense. I was getting so amped when the siblings were working as a team. 

[Ted Lange 15934]

Tom “winning”

 

I thought for sure Kendall was gonna off himself before the series ended.  

[Party_Taco 3660]

Kendall should’ve ascended the throne to complete his arc… Shiv’s last-minute flip flop didn’t make much sense. I was getting so amped when the siblings were working as a team. 

Agreed - Having him ascend only to be torn down by his path to ascension once seated just makes too much sense.

As a statement towards how shallow the connection is between the siblings, and how their own jealousy and need for acceptance/respect (even from their father’s ghost) trumps all, I think it works.

But I just can’t buy the back-forth for Shiv… she had what she needed to kill Tom, and that was her firm determination mere seconds before. What is she holding onto that overcame those seemingly powerful emotions? Simply the need to have anyone other than her brothers win?

Shiv sucks.

[Texas St. Armadillos 1368]

Bitches, man.

[speed817 18917]

It's a win-win for Shiv IMHO. That's why she flipped. She and her baby were going to get taken care of anyways.

[hobbes2702 12533]

45 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

That's a terrible ending.  Sorry.  Great show.  Terrible ending.

 

[SizzleChest 8162]

It was a very solid finale.  Not spectacular.

Kendall was seated and dethroned in a nanosecond.

Shiv's last volley just nicked the net and Kendall couldn't get to it, so 40-40 / Deuce.

The result for her and Tom is an uneasy detente, but one that serves as the most plausible end (or really just where the story told to us stops).

Roman flirted with the dragon, but walks away free of expectations, guilt, and all the earthly family burdens.

Kendall fucked his life hard.  He chased it like an addict, but will desperately seek redemption.

Roman was correct - all three of them were bullshit.

[Party_Taco 3660]

It's a win-win for Shiv IMHO. That's why she flipped. She and her baby were going to get taken care of anyways.

FUCK that… she’s now beholden to two men who see her as broken and ineffectual. Kendal would have at least given her a seat at the table… she’ll be nothing now beyond inheriting the legacy of her mother… another child bearer set to abide the indiscretions of her powerful husband. Rich, but relatively powerless, watching from the balcony as history is made by the men around her.

[hobbes2702 12533]

30 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

But that fact was known before the last few minutes.  That's why it's a bad ending.

 

It wasn’t about the kid. It was about staying in power. She knew she could have Tom back and be in the drivers seat. 

[Bateshorn 9595]

Shiv, unable in the end to gather the throne, either because of gender or personality or whatever, choses to stay alive and get to the next frame via Tom, rather than rely on her brothers.  It’s a fairly powerful commentary on gender and power dynamics. 
 

As an actual TV show ending, despite having some powerful moments, The Expanse or MASH it was not. 

[SizzleChest 8162]

1 minute ago, Party_Taco said:

FUCK that… she’s now beholden to two men who see her as broken and ineffectual. Kendal would have at least given her a seat at the table… she’ll be nothing now beyond inheriting the legacy of her mother… another child bearer set to abide the indiscretions of her powerful husband. Rich, but relatively powerless, watching from the balcony as history is made by the men around her.

The thing with series finales is the tendency to look at these things as final moves.  But, if you extend your thinking beyond that construct, Shiv just made a move - that was all.  What happens next (or would happen next), who knows.

[Ben Tobin 372]

You could see it in Shiv’s face when she saw Ken in Daddy’s chair. Really thought Ken was gonna take the elevator to the roof and jump. 

[Bateshorn 9595]

Also, once again, Kieren Culkin should be locked away for scene theft of the first degree. 

[SizzleChest 8162]

2 minutes ago, hobbes2702 said:

It wasn’t about the kid. It was about staying in power. She knew she could have Tom back and be in the drivers seat. 

[skittlebrau 473]

1 minute ago, SizzleChest said:

The thing with series finales is the tendency to look at these things as final moves.  But, if you extend your thinking beyond that construct, Shiv just made a move - that was all.  What happens next (or would happen next), who knows.

Agree. She made the most self-interested move. And then the show ended. Feel like the post show wrap up explained it all quite well.

[hobbes2702 12533]

2 minutes ago, skittlebrau said:

Agree. She made the most self-interested move. And then the show ended. Feel like the post show wrap up explained it all quite well.

I haven’t watched any of the post show things but the part that I keyed in on was the hand “holding”. Tom extends his hand first and is bottom. Shiv doesn’t even hold his hand, just lays it on top. 
At first I thought maybe their power dynamic shifted but not after that. 
Logan would kick people to see if they came back, Shiv does the same. Tom came back

Edited May 29, 2023 by hobbes2702

[Red Five 40355]

This theory for the finale is as good as any. Bill Wambsganss in 1926, completed the only unassisted triple play ever in World Series history. So Tom obviously takes out all 3 siblings to assume the top spot of Waystar. 

Huh.

[Chuckie Finster 22321]

You could see it in Shiv’s face when she saw Ken in Daddy’s chair. Really thought Ken was gonna take the elevator to the roof and jump. 

Even moreso when he put his feet on the desk.

“You’re not serious people.”

[skittlebrau 473]

50 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

But that fact was known before the last few minutes.  That's why it's a bad ending.

 

I don’t think that had anything to do with her vote. It was just another thing she pretended was important completely in her own self interest.

[Horn Under a Bad Sign 20304]

28 minutes ago, Bateshorn said:

Shiv, unable in the end to gather the throne, either because of gender or personality or whatever, choses to stay alive and get to the next frame via Tom, rather than rely on her brothers.  It’s a fairly powerful commentary on gender and power dynamics. 
 

As an actual TV show ending, despite having some powerful moments, The Expanse or MASH it was not. 

The second Bob Newhart show had the all-time best ending. 

Edited May 29, 2023 by Horn Under a Bad Sign

[Party_Taco 3660]

The thing with series finales is the tendency to look at these things as final moves.  But, if you extend your thinking beyond that construct, Shiv just made a move - that was all.  What happens next (or would happen next), who knows.

Correct… who knows. What we’re left with is speculation based on the established traits of the players. You catch Tom’s initial response to Greg after the vote? It was 100% Logan in its equal recognition/dismissal. Tom is evolving while Shiv is cowing.

Sure, you could say that her decision was just another move on the chess board, but I would argue that play was akin to snatching a bishop out of spite only to leave her King exposed.

My conclusion is that Shiv all too easily became her mother.

[hobbes2702 12533]

1 minute ago, Party_Taco said:

Correct… who knows. What we’re left with is speculation based on the established traits of the players. You catch Tom’s initial response to Greg after the vote? It was 100% Logan in its equal recognition/dismissal. Tom is evolving while Shiv is cowing.

Sure, you could say that her decision was just another move on the chess board, but I would argue that play was akin to snatching a bishop out of spite only to leave her King exposed.

My conclusion is that Shiv all too easily became her mother.

It was the only play that could keep her with any sort of power. If Kendall wins all she gets ATN which she doesn’t want or care about. 

[hornian 5159]

On 5/22/2023 at 7:44 AM, hornian said:

It’s gonna be Tom. Calling it. 

Fucking nailed this one. 

[Celery Man 20607]

Something something about a show called Succession and pregnant Shiv anoints her husband king.

 

My first read as it was happening is that she can’t feel hate towards anything as much as she can feel petty towards he brothers. They decided to put Kendall in the chair and were stupid little kids doing the meal fit for a king game which is clearly some thing from their childhood. And she was a stupid little kid seeing big brother getting everything he ever wanted and not being able to bear it.

[veritas aequitas 436]

This was a really good show, it was really well made, I watched but in the end I never really liked a single character. None of them, they were all kind of shitty in their own way.

[Michael Knight 12718]

16 minutes ago, veritas aequitas said:

This was a really good show, it was really well made, I watched but in the end I never really liked a single character. None of them, they were all kind of shitty in their own way.

I mean how can you not like Greg

[Ben Tobin 372]

1 minute ago, Michael Knight said:

I mean how can you not like Greg

If I give you something incredible, will you give me something amazing?

[MissingInAction 24416]

Greg was unkowingly instrumental to everything.  Lucas played him like fiddle.