Trump’s NFL Flag Bullshit Not Going Away

[Hornius Emeritus 12,416]

12 hours ago, JimmyJames said:

Cakes, bathrooms, anthems, and kneeling.

Meanwhile the top .1 percent is laughing it’s ass off on their yacht.

 

Remember when it was flag burning?
 

[David Dennison 18,652]

2 minutes ago, EMAWesome said:

What do you mean where no one sees it?  It's a press conference there are media holding cameras everywhere in the room.

What gets more eyeballs? The game or a press conference?

[ChickenSandwich 9,798]

12 minutes ago, slorch said:

Why not do it in the press conference then?

 

If you ignore the value of the anthem, then it just reiterates how convoluted the whole message has been.

 

The very fact that it happens during the anthem proves that it's bigger than just police brutality.  It's about how unfair and imperfect ole America is.

 

Guess what?  It wasn't perfect when the rest of us got here either.  Move forward or deal with the shit that comes with stirring the pot.

 

Wanna talk cops?  then lose the Che Guivera bullshit and anti-flag speech.  Own what the fuck you're doing and stop changing your message if it's so gotdam profound.

 

IMHO, the fact that they demonstrate during the anthem without governmental interference only bolsters the liberty and freedom they allege not to exist.

Or at least vote.

 

I look forward to hearing the politicals view at the drive thru window at Whataburger. 

[bad_teammate 13,132]

11 minutes ago, slorch said:

Why not do it in the press conference then?

They do. Why should they restrict their speech to one venue?

Quote

If you ignore the value of the anthem, then it just reiterates how convoluted the whole message has been.

Define what you mean by "the value of the anthem". Because it doesn't seem to mean jack shit, actually.

Quote

The very fact that it happens during the anthem proves that it's bigger than just police brutality.  It's about how unfair and imperfect ole America is.Guess what?  It wasn't perfect when the rest of us got here either.  Move forward or deal with the shit that comes with stirring the pot.

And this is the reality of your objection. You're mad at blacks for whining. Everyone who is telling you you're mad because they are black is right. This is not about the anthem and your supposed respect for it (which is fucking horseshit), this is about your grievance against blacks who demand civil rights.

Also, they're dealing with it very well. Far better than you. Richer, more attractive, more physically active, more famous, and almost universally smarter than you.

You're just another pathetic white conservative guy furious at the blacks. Fuck off, you're garbage.

[bad_teammate 13,132]

Just now, ChickenSandwich said:

I look forward to hearing the politicals view at the drive thru window at Whataburger. 

This fucking idiot on a message board making fun of literal millionaires who fly dick-first through life. The lack of self-awareness of the angry conservative is mind-obliterating.

[hayden_horn 11,360]

2 minutes ago, ChickenSandwich said:

Or at least vote.

 

I look forward to hearing the politicals view at the drive thru window at Whataburger. 

or hobby lobby, amirite

[David Dennison 18,652]

Just now, hayden_horn said:

or hobby lobby, amirite

Or Chik-fil-A.

[TornACL 7,675]

Quote

 

Guess what?  It wasn't perfect when the rest of us got here either.  Move forward or deal with the shit that comes with stirring the pot.

 

Here's a little hint. America didn't get to where it got by citizens accepting bullshit treatment and unfairness.

If any of you lazy dipshits got this worked up when a cop blew away an unarmed man by shooting him while he's handcuffed and then filing a false police report, police brutality would be drastically reduced by now.

Edited June 6, 2018 by TornACL

[bad_teammate 13,132]

3 minutes ago, TornACL said:

Here's a little hint. America didn't get to where it got by citizens accepting bullshit treatment and unfairness.

Slorches never change.

[Brian Fantana 6,667]

28 minutes ago, slorch said:

I disagree with Kaepernick because he's black.

I dislike Jason Garrett and Bill OBrien as coaches because they are black.

Chris Long is the sorriest black dude ever, because I disagree with a shit-ton of his commentary.

See how easy this is?  Everything boils down to racism, regardless of the merit of one's arguments/ actions in the discussion

Chris Long is white dumbass

[GW Hayduke 1,952]

Are most folks under the impression that this entire conflict is manufactured by trump to drive a wedge in America to further solidify tribalism/identity politics/us vs them?

Is there anyone out there who can’t see this?

[David Dennison 18,652]

 

5 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Slorches never change.

Look at all them honkies.

[Mole 4,320]

4 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

Quote

 

I disagree with Kaepernick because he's black.

I dislike Jason Garrett and Bill OBrien as coaches because they are black.

Chris Long is the sorriest black dude ever, because I disagree with a shit-ton of his commentary.

See how easy this is?  Everything boils down to racism, regardless of the merit of one's arguments/ actions in the discussion

 

Chris Long is white dumbass

 

[Brian Fantana 6,667]

[phdhorn 6,224]

5 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

Chris Long is white dumbass

1) You need a comma. "Chris Long is white, dumbass."  Otherwise you're calling Chris Long a white dumbass.  He wouldn't like that and would probably kick your ass.

2) How do you know?  Howie got around pretty regularly.

3) The NFL is tanking anyway.  This national anthem bullshit only adds to it.

[TahoeHorn 107]

15 minutes ago, GW Hayduke said:

Are most folks under the impression that this entire conflict is manufactured by trump to drive a wedge in America to further solidify tribalism/identity politics/us vs them?

Is there anyone out there who can’t see this?

What is your recommendation to the players?

[GW Hayduke 1,952]

8 minutes ago, TahoeHorn said:

What is your recommendation to the players?

I recommend that they vote and that they use their platform to remind others to vote and to bring awareness to others on whatever issues they feel is important. 

I would also recommend that they specifically call out trump for manufacturing a conflict to sow discord in the US.

i would also recommend that they use their platform to remind fans about the ideas of citizenry. 

Edited June 6, 2018 by GW Hayduke

[simplicity 9]

16 hours ago, TornACL said:

I don't know, I fight for the right to party. But also that other stuff too, I guess.

 

[Ted Lange 16,041]

13 minutes ago, TahoeHorn said:

What is your recommendation to the players?

I’d LOVE to hear Trump’s answer to that.  Every dog in the nation would go deaf.

[SubliminalHorn 6,673]

1 hour ago, slorch said:

Why not do it in the press conference then?

 

If you ignore the value of the anthem, then it just reiterates how convoluted the whole message has been.

 

The very fact that it happens during the anthem proves that it's bigger than just police brutality.  It's about how unfair and imperfect ole America is.

 

Guess what?  It wasn't perfect when the rest of us got here either.  Move forward or deal with the shit that comes with stirring the pot.

 

Wanna talk cops?  then lose the Che Guivera bullshit and anti-flag speech.  Own what the fuck you're doing and stop changing your message if it's so gotdam profound.

 

IMHO, the fact that they demonstrate during the anthem without governmental interference only bolsters the liberty and freedom they allege not to exist.

You sound triggered. Poor thing. I thought conservatives were tough guys. The last 3 years have proved y’all are the biggest snowflakes around. 

[hayden_horn 11,360]

24 minutes ago, phdhorn said:

3) The NFL is tanking anyway.  This national anthem bullshit only adds to it.

there is this narrative that black folks' peaceful protest during the national anthem is driving away viewers because of the disrespect to the flag and the troops and whatever the fuck else. i have a different theory. i think the nfl has reached saturation, and a natural falling off is expected as younger demographics care less about it. sure, some older demographics are going to blame the black folks' peaceful protest during the anthem, but that's so they can have their identity politics. 

honestly, it's like people forget that it was a fucking green beret and badass longhorn football player that counseled kaepernick to take a knee rather than sit down, because of the inherent respect that taking a knee engenders. 

oh wait. they haven't forgotten, they just aren't interested because black people are protesting. you can hear it in all the dog whistles. "these spoiled millionaire athletes " might as well be "these uppity nigras." the protest is poignant, but it's been twisted by hateful old white men.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, SubliminalHorn said:

You sound triggered. Poor thing. I thought conservatives were tough guys. The last 3 years have proved y’all are the biggest snowflakes around. 

If i sounded mad, i certainly did not mean to convey that.

oh i'm sorry...  a different point of view is a threat to you folks.  So scary.

 

Duly noted.

Edited June 6, 2018 by slorch

[simplicity 9]

1 minute ago, hayden_horn said:

there is this narrative that black folks' peaceful protest during the national anthem is driving away viewers because of the disrespect to the flag and the troops and whatever the fuck else. i have a different theory. i think the nfl has reached saturation, and a natural falling off is expected as younger demographics care less about it. sure, some older demographics are going to blame the black folks' peaceful protest during the anthem, but that's so they can have their identity politics. 

honestly, it's like people forget that it was a fucking green beret and badass longhorn football player that counseled kaepernick to take a knee rather than sit down, because of the inherent respect that taking a knee engenders. 

oh wait. they haven't forgotten, they just aren't interested because black people are protesting. you can hear it in all the dog whistles. "these spoiled millionaire athletes " might as well be "these uppity nigras." the protest is poignant, but it's been twisted by hateful old white men.

That and cable cutting.

[wildcat09 29,225]

55 minutes ago, TornACL said:

Why does it matter? Why does a protest have to confirm strictly to what you think is appropriate?

I get the general concept that some people are trying to make here - honestly or dishonestly - that players are hurting their cause by making a protest during the national anthem.

 My response to that is. It was inappropriate when CKaep sat down during the anthem. Then it was inappropriate when players took a knee instead. Let's not kid ourselves, it will still be inappropriate when they protest during a press conference. And it will be inappropriate on and on and on until they just be quiet. That will be deemed appropriate. That's ultimately what people want. Be quiet so I don't have to think about the country's problems, because everything is fine in my living room where the beer is cold and I have lots of potato chips and no cop is going to bust down my door and shoot me and then say "whoops I have the wrong address, welp, mistakes happen".

There's no such thing as an effective protest that didn't make people uncomfortable. The same people who angrily demand that the players speak out outside of games or do more to help their communities completely ignore that they're already doing those things, because they avoid seeing those. 

[TahoeHorn 107]

1 minute ago, Ted Lange said:

I’d LOVE to hear Trump’s answer to that.  Every dog in the nation would go deaf.

If this is a non-issue manufactured by Trump,  the obvious smart thing to do is not to bite - to ignore it.  They could render Trump's rhetoric useless if they used a different tactic to send their message.

My recommendation would be to use post-game interviews as their vehicle.  That would have the support of people who think as I do, where using the anthem, flag or even the game as the vehicle does not.  My recommendation to any employee is to find a platform that you own, not one your employer owns, unless your employer endorses your use of the company's platform.

[simplicity 9]

 

Just now, slorch said:

If i sounded mad, i certainly did not mean to convey that.

oh i'm sorry...  a different point of view is a thread to you folks.

 

Duly noted.

Different opinions don't "threaden" me dipshit

[wildcat09 29,225]

Just now, hayden_horn said:

there is this narrative that black folks' peaceful protest during the national anthem is driving away viewers because of the disrespect to the flag and the troops and whatever the fuck else. i have a different theory. i think the nfl has reached saturation, and a natural falling off is expected as younger demographics care less about it. sure, some older demographics are going to blame the black folks' peaceful protest during the anthem, but that's so they can have their identity politics. 

honestly, it's like people forget that it was a fucking green beret and badass longhorn football player that counseled kaepernick to take a knee rather than sit down, because of the inherent respect that taking a knee engenders. 

oh wait. they haven't forgotten, they just aren't interested because black people are protesting. you can hear it in all the dog whistles. "these spoiled millionaire athletes " might as well be "these uppity nigras." the protest is poignant, but it's been twisted by hateful old white men.

This. Players take a knee to pray and to show respect when other players are down injured, which is pretty much the perfect symbol for the statement they're trying to make. Anyone who takes it as a sign of disrespect is a racist or a total idiot.

[SubliminalHorn 6,673]

1 minute ago, slorch said:

If i sounded mad, i certainly did not mean to convey that.

oh i'm sorry...  a different point of view is a threat to you folks.  So scary.

 

Duly noted.

Not mad. You just sound like a whiny snowflake. Thanks for clarifying. 

[Guest]

42 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

Chris Long is white dumbass

That's the point of the post, dumbass.

[Ted Lange 16,041]

Heroes, Back the Blue!

 

[TahoeHorn 107]

4 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

there is this narrative that black folks' peaceful protest during the national anthem is driving away viewers because of the disrespect to the flag and the troops and whatever the fuck else. i have a different theory. i think the nfl has reached saturation, and a natural falling off is expected as younger demographics care less about it. sure, some older demographics are going to blame the black folks' peaceful protest during the anthem, but that's so they can have their identity politics. 

honestly, it's like people forget that it was a fucking green beret and badass longhorn football player that counseled kaepernick to take a knee rather than sit down, because of the inherent respect that taking a knee engenders. 

oh wait. they haven't forgotten, they just aren't interested because black people are protesting. you can hear it in all the dog whistles. "these spoiled millionaire athletes " might as well be "these uppity nigras." the protest is poignant, but it's been twisted by hateful old white men.

If that's the case the owners should aggressively support the players.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, simplicity said:

 

Different opinions don't "threaden" me dipshit

Threaten.

 

Why did you think I was triggered by offering a differing POV?  Nothing in my language in that post is threatening or pissed off.

 

 

[Ted Lange 16,041]

4 minutes ago, TahoeHorn said:

If this is a non-issue manufactured by Trump,  the obvious smart thing to do is not to bite - to ignore it.  They could render Trump's rhetoric useless if they used a different tactic to send their message.

My recommendation would be to use post-game interviews as their vehicle.  That would have the support of people who think as I do, where using the anthem, flag or even the game as the vehicle does not.  My recommendation to any employee is to find a platform that you own, not one your employer owns, unless your employer endorses your use of the company's platform.

So what do you think Trumps answer would be Ii asked, how should players protest bad cops?

Edited June 6, 2018 by Ted Lange

[simplicity 9]

Just now, slorch said:

Threaten.

 

Why did you think I was triggered by offering a differing POV?  Nothing in my language in that post is threatening or pissed off.

 

 

I was mocking your stupid ass post and typo.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, SubliminalHorn said:

Not mad. You just sound like a whiny snowflake. Thanks for clarifying. 

whiny about what?

 

liberty?

 

yep.  So trivial.

[SubliminalHorn 6,673]

2 minutes ago, Ted Lange said:

Heroes, Back the Blue!

 

What pieces of shit. Cops are pieces of shit

[SubliminalHorn 6,673]

Just now, slorch said:

whiny about what?

 

liberty?

 

yep.  So trivial.

Yes crying about a song and piece of cloth really shows your love of liberty. 

 

Jfc

[wildcat09 29,225]

Just now, TahoeHorn said:

If that's the case the owners should aggressively support the players.

Ownership doesn't support labor. Don't pretend like you don't know this.

[hayden_horn 11,360]

1 minute ago, TahoeHorn said:

If this is a non-issue manufactured by Trump,  the obvious smart thing to do is not to bite - to ignore it.  They could render Trump's rhetoric useless if they used a different tactic to send their message.

My recommendation would be to use post-game interviews as their vehicle.  That would have the support of people who think as I do, where using the anthem, flag or even the game as the vehicle does not.  My recommendation to any employee is to find a platform that you own, not one your employer owns, unless your employer endorses your use of the company's platform.

protests are not supposed to be PC. by nature, a protest is an uncomfortable affair. that trump co-opted their message to preach to bugtussle alabama about the uppity blacks is not their fault.

 

3 minutes ago, TahoeHorn said:

If that's the case the owners should aggressively support the players.

well, the are the old white demographic. they've presided over possibly the most unfair collective bargaining agreement in professional sports. so, i'm not at all surprised that they do not support the players.

[Ted Lange 16,041]

1 minute ago, SubliminalHorn said:

What pieces of shit. Cops are pieces of shit

Nah, there are tons of great cops.  But the good ones taking a knee and not turning on the bad ones is at the heart of the issue. 

[David Dennison 18,652]

7 minutes ago, slorch said:

If i sounded mad, i certainly did not mean to convey that.

oh i'm sorry...  a different point of view is a threat to you folks.  So scary.

 

Duly noted.

Ironing.

[SubliminalHorn 6,673]

1 minute ago, David Dennison said:

Ironing.

Funny, right? The little snowflake is so threatened and whiny about some people taking knee during a song. Poor thing. Fascists love worshipping symbols like flags, pins, and songs.  

[CooterBrown 17,904]

And Africans sold slaves a hundred years ago as well. 
Adding to you tally of worthless one line posts. Tell us about the Crusades. 

Whites enslaved blacks because they were black. African slavers would’ve sold any skin color if available and if there was a buyer. It wasn’t a race issue on their side.

[David Dennison 18,652]

7 minutes ago, Ted Lange said:

Heroes, Back the Blue!

 

Legally armed thugs. 

Murica.

[RomaVicta 29,775]

1 hour ago, slorch said:

I disagree with Kaepernick because he's black.

I dislike Jason Garrett and Bill OBrien as coaches because they are black.

Chris Long is the sorriest black dude ever, because I disagree with a shit-ton of his commentary.

See how easy this is?  Everything boils down to racism, regardless of the merit of one's arguments/ actions in the discussion

Therefore, there is no racism. Excellent point.

[phdhorn 6,224]

8 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

there is this narrative that black folks' peaceful protest during the national anthem is driving away viewers because of the disrespect to the flag and the troops and whatever the fuck else. i have a different theory. i think the nfl has reached saturation, and a natural falling off is expected as younger demographics care less about it. sure, some older demographics are going to blame the black folks' peaceful protest during the anthem, but that's so they can have their identity politics. 

honestly, it's like people forget that it was a fucking green beret and badass longhorn football player that counseled kaepernick to take a knee rather than sit down, because of the inherent respect that taking a knee engenders. 

oh wait. they haven't forgotten, they just aren't interested because black people are protesting. you can hear it in all the dog whistles. "these spoiled millionaire athletes " might as well be "these uppity nigras." the protest is poignant, but it's been twisted by hateful old white men.

I've never had a problem with these guys taking a knee inasmuch as I've never really thought ball games are the greatest place for the anthem.  You have one, you get the other.

However, I've never thought that this method was the most effective.  It's really not in an arena where the message is forefront, in fact, in some ways I think it kind of demeans the message because they have to "rely" on broadcasts to have a "captive" audience, the significant majority either 1) is deadset against it, and actually hinders the intent of the message, or 2) gives absolutely no shits about it, nor thinks one second about "the message;" and is more likely either grabbing the plate of nachos anyway.  

It's kind of like the #blacklivesmatter people blocking interstates.  It's completely counterproductive and really is way, way out of the scope of the most effective protesting.

But, whatever.

Trump antagonized the whole situation last fall when he called it out.  But the public didn't like it even before that.  If it's a matter of simply expressing protest, fine (Carlos/Smith holla!). But if it's a matter to garner empathy or even more in depth exposure, it's totally the wrong way to go about it.  The public doesn't like it, and one can say the public is a bunch of idiots (whch has always been kind of a condescending, ignorant reaction to me, but again whatever), but it's still the case.

If what they want to do is simply kneel then get on with the game, it's a good idea.  If they have any intent to increase empathy/understanding of the issue, it's a bad idea.

[hayden_horn 11,360]

Just now, phdhorn said:

I've never had a problem with these guys taking a knee inasmuch as I've never really thought ball games are the greatest place for the anthem.  You have one, you get the other.

However, I've never thought that this method was the most effective.  It's really not in an arena where the message is forefront, in fact, in some ways I think it kind of demeans the message because they have to "rely" on broadcasts to have a "captive" audience, the significant majority either 1) is deadset against it, and actually hinders the intent of the message, or 2) gives absolutely no shits about it, nor thinks one second about "the message;" and is more likely either grabbing the plate of nachos anyway.  

It's kind of like the #blacklivesmatter people blocking interstates.  It's completely counterproductive and really is way, way out of the scope of the most effective protesting.

But, whatever.

Trump antagonized the whole situation last fall when he called it out.  But the public didn't like it even before that.  If it's a matter of simply expressing protest, fine (Carlos/Smith holla!). But if it's a matter to garner empathy or even more in depth exposure, it's totally the wrong way to go about it.  The public doesn't like it, and one can say the public is a bunch of idiots (whch has always been kind of a condescending, ignorant reaction to me, but again whatever), but it's still the case.

If what they want to do is simply kneel then get on with the game, it's a good idea.  If they have any intent to increase empathy/understanding of the issue, it's a bad idea.

a certain demographic of the public didn't like it, and won't like it no matter the way it is presented. that's my thesis here.

[David Dennison 18,652]

1 minute ago, phdhorn said:

I've never had a problem with these guys taking a knee inasmuch as I've never really thought ball games are the greatest place for the anthem.  You have one, you get the other.

However, I've never thought that this method was the most effective.  It's really not in an arena where the message is forefront, in fact, in some ways I think it kind of demeans the message because they have to "rely" on broadcasts to have a "captive" audience, the significant majority either 1) is deadset against it, and actually hinders the intent of the message, or 2) gives absolutely no shits about it, nor thinks one second about "the message;" and is more likely either grabbing the plate of nachos anyway.  

It's kind of like the #blacklivesmatter people blocking interstates.  It's completely counterproductive and really is way, way out of the scope of the most effective protesting.

But, whatever.

Trump antagonized the whole situation last fall when he called it out.  But the public didn't like it even before that.  If it's a matter of simply expressing protest, fine (Carlos/Smith holla!). But if it's a matter to garner empathy or even more in depth exposure, it's totally the wrong way to go about it.  The public doesn't like it, and one can say the public is a bunch of idiots (whch has always been kind of a condescending, ignorant reaction to me, but again whatever), but it's still the case.

If what they want to do is simply kneel then get on with the game, it's a good idea.  If they have any intent to increase empathy/understanding of the issue, it's a bad idea.

What is the most effective form of public protest?

[Nice Guy Eddie 13,410]

42 minutes ago, EMAWesome said:

Considering the only time they take a knee is during the national anthem I struggle with the idea that it isn't.   (Full disclosure, my father volunteered to serve in the Marines in WWII.  He had a get out of the draft free card being the eldest son on a family farm and enlisted anyways.  So I take it kind of personally when anyone reacts to the national anthem in anyway other than how my parents taught me to react to it.)  If it has nothing to do with the national anthem then why don't they do it at the coin toss, or the two minute warning, or any of the 500 commercial breaks in the game?  Saying that an action has nothing to do with the national anthem when the only time that person ever performs that action is during the national anthem doesn't cut it as an explanation to me.

 

By the way I'm in agreement with the comment about the Trump supporters not taking their hats off during the national anthem too.

I don't understand why you take it personally.  You father didn't fight to force people to stand for the anthem.   He fought to allow them the freedom to do as they please without the worry of the govt preventing them.  And now that same govt is attempting to pressure them by suggesting they lose their jobs if not be deported???  If anything kneeling during the national anthem is honoring your father's sacrifice much more than the guy drunk in the stands at noon.  

And  kneeling during a commercial break would be the most ridiculous protest in the world.  Part of a protest is to bring awareness or stopping an action.  I do agree that the players need to continue to speak up against why they are kneeling.  Of course now, it's more of a protest against Trump than police brutality.

I don't begrudge certain citizens/groups from being skeptical or critical of the US.  We've treated some citizens poorly not that long ago.  And even though many of the issues have been resolved, definitely not all, even the resolved ones may take multi-generations to overcome.    If you're white, your grandparents or great-grandparents had the right to buy property anywhere which led to future prosperity.  Black families were legally kept from buying in certain areas as recently as 1968.   Informally the practice may still continue.

[David Dennison 18,652]

1 minute ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I don't understand why you take it personally.  You father didn't fight to force people to stand for the anthem.   He fought to allow them the freedom to do as they please without the worry of the govt preventing them.  And now that same govt is attempting to pressure them by suggesting they lose their jobs if not be deported???  If anything kneeling during the national anthem is honoring your father's sacrifice much more than the guy drunk in the stands at noon.  

And  kneeling during a commercial break would be the most ridiculous protest in the world.  Part of a protest is to bring awareness or stopping an action.  I do agree that the players need to continue to speak up against why they are kneeling.  Of course now, it's more of a protest against Trump than police brutality.

I don't begrudge certain citizens/groups from being skeptical or critical of the US.  We've treated some citizens poorly not that long ago.  And even though many of the issues have been resolved, definitely not all, even the resolved ones may take multi-generations to overcome.    If you're white, your grandparents or great-grandparents had the right to buy property anywhere which led to future prosperity.  Black families were legally kept from buying in certain areas as recently as 1968.   Informally the practice may still continue.

There's no may about it. The practice does still continue.