IG Horowitz report on Clinton email due soon

[Sawbonz 27423]

22 minutes ago, VRHorn said:

Let's pretend we replace "Her" and "she" with "Him" and "he". By stating "other shit she did over the years" you are opening Trump up to a comparison of EVERY shady RE deal, EVERY shady Foundation action, and everything he has done in the last two years.

I imagine your mental gymnastics will be impressive.

It is truly astounding that we ended up with those 2 in the race. And more astounding it took electing that dipshit president for anyone to start looking into all his shady deals

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

2 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

Benjamin Wittes was on Morning Edition this am. He was sympathetic to Comey but conceded Comey fucked up. Said he assumed authority that wasn’t his and Lynch and Yates didn’t step in to stop him. I thought that part was rich considering Lynch likely pressed him to take on that authority rather than recuse herself after the grandkids talk. 

He really was in a lose lose situation from a personal career standpoint. I truly don’t know what I would have done in his place. Put it back on Lynch? That’s a whole lot of heat 

 

Sucks for the guy. He was damned if he did and damned if he didn't.

Having a sitting president try and strong arm you to not indict (thru Lynch of course) must suck.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

2 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

It is truly astounding that we ended up with those 2 in the race. And more astounding it took electing that dipshit president for anyone to start looking into all his shady deals

Worst 2 candidates in Presidential history.

[Sawbonz 27423]

11 hours ago, Bama Chick said:

You know why.

She's an openly ambitious, power seeking person with a vagina.

Ever since she uttered "I suppose I could have stayed home, baked cookies and had teas" and "You know, I’m not sitting here, some little woman standing by my man like Tammy Wynette", she has been hated by a certain type of person - both male and female.

I know several women who dislike Hillary. One common gripe they have is her staying with her serial philandering and (allegedly) sexual assaulting husband after being publicly humiliated by his actions. They saw it as either weakness or a coldly calculated business/political move. I guess that’s that internalized misogyny though

[Sawbonz 27423]

8 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Comey says he only told Lynch he was going to the press literally moments before the announcement.  There was no stopping him.

I believe Wittes was referring to Comey rather than Lynch making the decision not to bring charges but I may have misheard

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

17 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

Put it back on Lynch?

Yep, that’s what he should have done.  Perceptions be damned.

[Tyler Durden 132]

16 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Having a sitting president try and strong arm you to not indict (thru Lynch of course) must suck.

Got any support for this view?

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

10 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

I know several women who dislike Hillary. One common gripe they have is her staying with her serial philandering and (allegedly) sexual assaulting husband after being publicly humiliated by his actions. They saw it as either weakness or a coldly calculated business/political move. I guess that’s that internalized misogyny though

People fail to see that Bill and Hillary were always a package deal.  They were a political team from the beginning.  People got turned off real quick to Hillary when she took on health care as the First Lady.  Most people failed to realize she was always extremely politically influential when it came to Bill Clinton’s agenda.

 

[Longhornfan1024 1707]

3 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

People fail to see that Bill and Hillary were always a package deal.  They were a political team from the beginning.  People got turned off real quick to Hillary when she took on health care as the First Lady.  Most people failed to realize she was always extremely politically influential when it came to Bill Clinton’s agenda.

 

They also fail to consider that it's not uncommon for a woman to be cheated on by her husband yet choose to stay with him and try to salvage the marriage.  But when Hillary does it she's either weak or only cares about politics.  That is the misogyny that a powerful woman seeking a high position must face.  

[SmokeyTheBear 5562]

39 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

I won't be backing him for re election.  He served his purpose.

I'll bite. What was his purpose?

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

2 minutes ago, SmokeyTheBear said:

I'll bite. What was his purpose?

 

Really?!? To beat Hillary of course

[VRHorn 718]

2 minutes ago, SmokeyTheBear said:

I'll bite. What was his purpose?

Duh, it was to beat the worst person to ever walk the Earth in the 2016 election.

[SmokeyTheBear 5562]

To what end though? I want him to spell out that his vote for Trump was only to beat Hillary. That all that follows is acceptable because at least it is not Hillary. To document it and own it. 

[Jiggy-Z 3432]

3 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

People fail to see that Bill and Hillary were always a package deal.  They were a political team from the beginning.  People got turned off real quick to Hillary when she took on health care as the First Lady.  Most people failed to realize she was always extremely politically influential when it came to Bill Clinton’s agenda.

 

People also fail to realize that for people like the Clinton's and Trump's that the rules of marriage are different. It's not like trump is a truck driver with a drinking problem that has been married three times because can't stay sober-Shit gets stale, he thrives in chaos, arrangements are made, and there is image to think of.  In many ways the job/office/prestige is more important than the marriage. I'm not giving either of them or their wives a pass, but shit is just different for them-for marriage.  The sexual assault/rape stuff is entirely different, however.

Evidence of this is right there where supporters of either are willing to look past the infidelity, or worse-so in some ways, people do realize the rules are different-even if they can't see it for the "other" guy/team.

In fact, for either of them if serial philandering were the only thing they did, most would be OK with it-see Bob Hope, JFK.  The problem is that there are payoffs, slush funds, compromised situations, blackmail, and criminal cover ups along with hypocritical finger pointing. So not really the sex that's the problem-its all the other stuff.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

10 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Really?!? To beat Hillary of course

Pay this man. Pay this man his money.

[Onboard 2.0 9083]

28 minutes ago, Tyler Durden said:

Got any support for this view?

Other than the fact she wasn't  indicted for infractions  that pretty much anyone else would have been indicted and a meet and greet on the tarmac.  Those are just two things that you'd be crowing about if it had been a republican at issue.

Edited June 15, 2018 by Onboard 2.0

[Sawbonz 27423]

28 minutes ago, Longhornfan1024 said:

They also fail to consider that it's not uncommon for a woman to be cheated on by her husband yet choose to stay with him and try to salvage the marriage.  But when Hillary does it she's either weak or only cares about politics.  That is the misogyny that a powerful woman seeking a high position must face.  

What would the political prospects be for a man who stood by a wife who was repeatedly accused of sexually harassing / assaulting other men and who then publicly admitted to an affair with a much younger man? Other than head fb coach at aggy that is

[Tyler Durden 132]

18 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Other than the fact she wasn't  indicted for infractions  that pretty much anyone else would have been indicted and a meet and greet on the tarmac.  Those are just two things that you'd be crowing about if it had been a republican at issue.

And your view is supported by the IG report?

[Lagunamadre 1975]

20 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Other than the fact she wasn't  indicted for infractions  that pretty much anyone else would have been indicted and a meet and greet on the tarmac.  Those are just two things that you'd be crowing about if it had been a republican at issue.

Ya the IG report killed these talking points. Fuck off with that. 

[Satchel 6908]

3 hours ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Since before she even moved her bags into the Whitehouse she'd been in solved in illegal activities. (yep trumps got dirt too, much of hers was while serving in the gov't in some capacity).  If you don't know the list do your own homework.

She has a long list of dirt culminating in the private server scandal used to hide her shakedown and access bribes for her upcoming  presidency (snicker snicker giggle giggle). That act alone should have, and in effect did disqualify her from office.  Thanks Comey homey..........

Were anyone here caught doing what she did they'd have been prosecuted and convicted. She's a fucking crook 

Her memory was always shaky in front of a congressional inquiry, but it's always deep and minute in her many books. Why was that ?

She's precisely the type of person that should never be serving in office, 

It's the kind of emotional viscera unattached to any specific wrong doing that makes the irrational hatred of Hillary so stupefying. Unspecified illegal activities, crookery and dirt of an unknown nature is what Hillary is routinely accused of, and people settle for that. It's a strange manifestation of defiance disorder that says the worse Trump becomes, the more Hillary's perceived villainy is highlighted.

3 hours ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

 

 

 

[Sawbonz 27423]

Lynch should have made the decision not to charge or punted it to Yates rather than Comey take it on. It wouldn’t have changed the bitching, but it would have been cleaner. You still have the consideration of intent in deciding whether to charge, which per Comey’s congressional testimony is not a component of the statute, and people still would have bitched, but proper protocol would have been followed and (maybe) less political hay could be made

[Pods 7527]

@Sawbonz Agreed, sucks that he was in the situation he was, but he made the wrong call. He should have kicked it back to Lynch and told her to figure it out. 

[SKJ 1305]

4 hours ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Since before she even moved her bags into the Whitehouse she'd been in solved in illegal activities. (yep trumps got dirt too, much of hers was while serving in the gov't in some capacity).  If you don't know the list do your own homework.

She has a long list of dirt culminating in the private server scandal used to hide her shakedown and access bribes for her upcoming  presidency (snicker snicker giggle giggle). That act alone should have, and in effect did disqualify her from office.  Thanks Comey homey..........

Were anyone here caught doing what she did they'd have been prosecuted and convicted. She's a fucking crook and the love affair here that some deny is still being acted put under the sheets with a wad of Kleenex and some hand lotion nightly.  If you can't acknowledge that fact you're too stupid to hold a valid drivers license or be able to vote for your favorite Americas got talent candidate.

Her memory was always shaky in front of a congressional inquiry, but it's always deep and minute in her many books. Why was that ?

She's precisely the type of person that should never be serving in office, and she almost pulled it off almost....... hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.  Oh yeah she lost according to the rules of our Constitution. Waaaaah she got more votes waaaaah, she's a woman, and its her time......waaaaah I love her.

Would we be better off ? Would she have been more presidential than trump, (yep she would have). In the long run ?? hell no because her election would be a clear signal that the presidency can be had, just do what she did. Laws don't matter if you can lie and get away with it.  Her defeat shows the electoral college works.

 

 

Amazingly enough, all of this fits trumpy bear as well (noanastasis)

[Longhornfan1024 1707]

32 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

What would the political prospects be for a man who stood by a wife who was repeatedly accused of sexually harassing / assaulting other men and who then publicly admitted to an affair with a much younger man? Other than head fb coach at aggy that is

It's hard to say since we haven't seen it (that I can recall), but I suspect it would go along the lines of "He's a strong may who worked hard and made sacrifices to keep his family together.  He followed his Christian teachings and found the strength to forgive his wife for her adulterous sin."  

[Sawbonz 27423]

The Clintons do a great job of toeing the line wrt legalities. They do shady shit that isn’t quite illegal but is definitely questionable ethically or morally. That pisses a lot of people off even if they don’t want her arrested

Clearly her intent in having a personal server was to keep private shit private. Arrogantly and lazily she commingled private and official state communication for her own convenience. When people sent foia requests she got to decide what was state business vs private. Then when it was clear she had privileged content on her servers, acts Comey deemed gross negligence which is the standard for charges, she was  given an out based on intent not required by the relevant statute (Comey admitted this under questioning by Gowdy). Would any of us be given the same benefit of the doubt? Probably not. Many people see that as shady, but the govt has ruled it legal for her to do it so that is that.

While she was SOS her husband was paid 6 figures by a Russian oligarch and had a private audience with Putin. Obviously legal, questionably whether ethical, but I would argue not a moral thing to do, definitely not seemly. 

The Clinton Foundation angle has been beaten to death, but it definitely affected her popularity. It would be interesting though to see a comparison of donations during the 18 months leading up to the 2016 elections and those in the 18 months since trumps inauguration 

All that being said, trump has taken all the shit Clinton did and taken it to 11. He’s got to go

[Sawbonz 27423]

1 minute ago, Longhornfan1024 said:

It's hard to say since we haven't seen it (that I can recall), but I suspect it would go along the lines of "He's a strong may who worked hard and made sacrifices to keep his family together.  He followed his Christian teachings and found the strength to forgive his wife for her adulterous sin."  

The reason we haven’t seen it is men who are knowingly cuckolded are pretty much ostracized from high profile positions. Not sure that guy could get elected dogcatcher. 

[Skyline 325]

It's amazing how the 2016 election has become a flash point for our society in politics and outside of it. We will be discussing it for years to come, and even here we've beaten the subject into the ground. 

[Cheeseweasel 26437]

3 minutes ago, Skyline said:

It's amazing how the 2016 election has become a flash point for our society in politics and outside of it. We will be discussing it for years to come, and even here we've beaten the subject into the ground. 

It's the first election in which Social Media was truly prevalent. Everyone picked a team and rooted HARD for their team. Even though the game is over, the fight goes own because 'fuck the refs! They missed this call!".

 

[EMAWesome 101]

2 hours ago, VRHorn said:

Let's pretend we replace "Her" and "she" with "Him" and "he". By stating "other shit she did over the years" you are opening Trump up to a comparison of EVERY shady RE deal, EVERY shady Foundation action, and everything he has done in the last two years.

I imagine your mental gymnastics will be impressive.

Exactly when did Trump get the ambassador to Libya and three marines killed?

[EMAWesome 101]

27 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

The Clintons do a great job of toeing the line wrt legalities. They do shady shit that isn’t quite illegal but is definitely questionable ethically or morally. That pisses a lot of people off even if they don’t want her arrested

Clearly her intent in having a personal server was to keep private shit private. Arrogantly and lazily she commingled private and official state communication for her own convenience. When people sent foia requests she got to decide what was state business vs private. Then when it was clear she had privileged content on her servers, acts Comey deemed gross negligence which is the standard for charges, she was  given an out based on intent not required by the relevant statute (Comey admitted this under questioning by Gowdy). Would any of us be given the same benefit of the doubt? Probably not. Many people see that as shady, but the govt has ruled it legal for her to do it so that is that.

While she was SOS her husband was paid 6 figures by a Russian oligarch and had a private audience with Putin. Obviously legal, questionably whether ethical, but I would argue not a moral thing to do, definitely not seemly. 

The Clinton Foundation angle has been beaten to death, but it definitely affected her popularity. It would be interesting though to see a comparison of donations during the 18 months leading up to the 2016 elections and those in the 18 months since trumps inauguration 

All that being said, trump has taken all the shit Clinton did and taken it to 11. He’s got to go

If setting up the server in her house to begin with isn't a sign of intent (to dodge official government communication systems and therefore FOIA requests) then what is?  It's either intent or complete incompetence.  Either one is enough to deem her not qualified for the job of president.

[GW Hayduke 1952]

Benghazi! Right wing trolling is such a joke.  Anyone know why trolling is prevalent on one side?

[Skyline 325]

2 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

It's the first election in which Social Media was truly prevalent. Everyone picked a team and rooted HARD for their team. Even though the game is over, the fight goes own because 'fuck the refs! They missed this call!".

 

No, I think it's because Trump's celebrity and personality really turned everything into a spectacle (good or bad is up to your politics). We had heavy social media interaction before Trump. People that I know who hated politics also got involved just to meme and make fun of the process that we use to select our president. I also think it has more to do with the polarization of both candidates. People had a visceral reaction to both or at least one. It was a long time coming too so we could watch the twist and turns play out over a long period of time. 

[retread 2951]

3 minutes ago, Skyline said:

No, I think it's because Trump's celebrity and personality really turned everything into a spectacle (good or bad is up to your politics).  

Sadly a large portion of that spectacle's success was DOTUS repeating the buzz words that Bannon fed him. Big, beautiful Wall!

Edited June 15, 2018 by retread

[Cheeseweasel 26437]

4 minutes ago, Skyline said:

No, I think it's because Trump's celebrity and personality really turned everything into a spectacle (good or bad is up to your politics). We had heavy social media interaction before Trump. People that I know who hated politics also got involved just to meme and make fun of the process that we use to select our president. I also think it has more to do with the polarization of both candidates. People had a visceral reaction to both or at least one. It was a long time coming too so we could watch the twist and turns play out over a long period of time. 

I'm sure that plays into it, but the difference is that Granny and Grandpa figured out social media this election. How else would you explain all the memes?

[EMAWesome 101]

57 minutes ago, Lagunamadre said:

Ya the IG report killed these talking points. Fuck off with that. 

No it didn't. The IG report is the DOJ investigating the DOJ.  It's basically an internal affairs investigation and report.  Now replace DOJ with any police department in the country and tell me how many people here would have faith in the findings of such a report.  This is the same DOJ  that has flipped Congress the bird with regards to congressional oversight for over a year now.  Why should anyone believe they aren't just flipping the bird to the American public with this report?

[EMAWesome 101]

11 minutes ago, GW Hayduke said:

Benghazi! Right wing trolling is such a joke.  Anyone know why trolling is prevalent on one side?

Because the other side doesn't have the intellectual capacity to troll a bait line.

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

1 minute ago, EMAWesome said:

No it didn't. The IG report is the DOJ investigating the DOJ.  It's basically an internal affairs investigation and report.  Now replace DOJ with any police department in the country and tell me how many people here would have faith in the findings of such a report.  This is the same DOJ  that has flipped Congress the bird with regards to congressional oversight for over a year now.  Why should anyone believe they aren't just flipping the bird to the American public with this report?

So, fake news?

When I was in HS I dated a silver spoon Kinkaid girl. We were not aligned politically at all. I've been having this argument for over 30 years now. Whenever she read something in the NYT that was not aligned with her beliefs, she just said "liberal media" and wrote it off as false. There is no convincing you emotional snowflakes and there hasn't been in a very long time. 

[Pods 7527]

I'm going to believe the FBI instead of a bunch of right-wing lunatics. 

I'm also going to believe science instead of a bunch of right-wing lunatics. 

I'm also going to believe a free press instead of a bunch of right-wing lunatics. 

Edited June 15, 2018 by Pods

[Tom 2959]

1 hour ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Other than the fact she wasn't  indicted for infractions  that pretty much anyone else would have been indicted and a meet and greet on the tarmac.  Those are just two things that you'd be crowing about if it had been a republican at issue.

Let me know when the investigations and "lock them up" chants begin from your ilk for Trump's kids using private email for government business and for Trump using a non-secure phone in the white house.  We know how much these security issues matter to you guys 

[Sawbonz 27423]

5 minutes ago, EMAWesome said:

If setting up the server in her house to begin with isn't a sign of intent (to dodge official government communication systems and therefore FOIA requests) then what is?  It's either intent or complete incompetence.  Either one is enough to deem her not qualified for the job of president.

If she had kept only private communications on the server she would have been fine. It was the commingling that was the problem. And again she was given the benefit of the doubt on intent, but she paid a huge price politically. I actually think she would have been better off taking a deal on some misdemeanor and apologizing for not better understanding the rules rather than letting it play out like it did

 

 

[SmokeyTheBear 5562]

1 minute ago, Tom said:

Let me know when the investigations and "lock them up" chants begin from your ilk for Trump's kids using private email for government business and for Trump using a non-secure phone in the white house.  We know how much these security issues matter to you guys 

Or former President Bush. He should be in a prison by now if the same standards are to be met. 

[Tuco 5076]

This is my Congressman's Facebook post:

Quote

The IG report revealed that at the highest levels of the FBI, officials displayed unprofessionalism, political bias, and untrustworthy conduct. President Trump was clearly right to fire Director Comey. US citizens expect much more from our preeminent law enforcement agency. A major housecleaning is required now. No criminal investigations should ever be tainted by political bias.

(Don Bacon - Freshman Republican, NE-02 which is a purplish district.)

I assume this is straight from the GOP talking points.  He's doesn't typically wade into this shit if he can avoid it.  I think Trump is gearing up to fire Mueller and I think the GOP is looking to back him on it. 

Fuck. Them. All.

[jimmyjazz 45554]

7 minutes ago, EMAWesome said:

No it didn't. The IG report is the DOJ investigating the DOJ.  It's basically an internal affairs investigation and report.

Ah, it's always good to see the new talking points as they come out.  Newsletter must have been distributed this morning.

 

5 minutes ago, EMAWesome said:

Because the other side doesn't have the intellectual capacity to troll a bait line.

You're accusing others of lacking intellect.  If that ain't some good old-fashioned irony, I don't know what is. 

[Lagunamadre 1975]

7 minutes ago, EMAWesome said:

No it didn't. The IG report is the DOJ investigating the DOJ.  It's basically an internal affairs investigation and report.  Now replace DOJ with any police department in the country and tell me how many people here would have faith in the findings of such a report.  This is the same DOJ  that has flipped Congress the bird with regards to congressional oversight for over a year now.  Why should anyone believe they aren't just flipping the bird to the American public with this report?

Ohh. So you just don't believe anything that the FBI and DOJ conclude? Trump would be so proud of what you've become. 

[RomaVicta 29781]

6 minutes ago, EMAWesome said:

Because the other side doesn't have the intellectual capacity to troll a bait line.

Thanks for the lesson in the current state of political discourse. The anti-libs have looked at everything and made their minds up about everything. No need to analyze anything again. You've visited the mountaintop and learned the simple, elegant, God-endorsed Truth:

Liberals bad.

[RomaVicta 29781]

6 minutes ago, Pods said:

I'm going to believe the FBI instead of a bunch of right-wing lunatics. 

I'm also going to believe science instead of a bunch of right-wing lunatics. 

I'm also going to believe a free press instead of a bunch of right-wing lunatics. 

You poor, foolish dupe. See, you've been brainwashed. The right-wing lunatics have been trained to spot brainwashing. They're great at it.

[RomaVicta 29781]

7 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

I actually think she would have been better off taking a deal on some misdemeanor and apologizing for not better understanding the rules rather than letting it play out like it did

If she were a regular candidate, maybe so. She couldn't afford to allow the people accusing her of murder (Vince), rape-enabling, murder (Benghazi), fraud (charity organization), and murder (anybody connected to her who died of any causes other than natural) to be able to officially call her a criminal based on the misdemeanor plea.

Without Bill, she likely would have risen high in appointed positions in DC and quite possibly have gained national notoriety as a pubic servant of distinction. With Bill, she enters the arena on the electoral side for which she is ill-suited even if qualified. 

Throw in the hate campaign spearheaded by the American Spectator and amplified by the Radio Gods and she's been boxed in pretty tight. If she has a bunker mentality, it's because she was forced into a bunker.

 

 

[Sawbonz 27423]

5 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

 

I was going to say something about the catch 22 with admitting even to a misdemeanor. I do think a “golly I shouldn’t have done that and I’m truly sorry “ could only have been an improvement over “what do you mean wiped it? Like with a cloth?”

[RomaVicta 29781]

6 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

I was going to say something about the catch 22 with admitting even to a misdemeanor. I do think a “golly I shouldn’t have done that and I’m truly sorry “ could only have been an improvement over “what do you mean wiped it? Like with a cloth?”

Yes, more humility would have helped, but that's not her strong suit and part of what makes her a poor elective candidate. I think she said that the server had been checked or set up by the Secret Service.

"The server was set up by the Secret Service so I, wrongly, assumed it was secure to the standards of the State Department. That was a mistake on my part which will be corrected going forward. Frankly, I'm glad the mistake was discovered and I thank the security people who did so."

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23356]

This IG report is a pretty good trial run for how the Mueller findings will go in the court of public opinion.  If the Trump people can’t accept this IG report as fact, then there’s no use trying to persuade them to accept Mueller’s findings.  

Again, the worst part about all this is the Trump folks still have no idea how bad the Russian attack on the United States really was or the implications.  I put the 2015-201? Russian assault on the United States as the single worst unprovoked attack on America.  

The Russians didn’t just kill a bunch of civilians or soldiers defending the country. They assaulted the very things those soldiers and our elected officials are sworn to defend.  And because of Trump twisting public perception of the Mueller investigation, few will even acknowledge these facts when they are presented.

It’s depressing.