Moving the USS Texas

[TwiceHorn 31948]

As a warship (really all ships) lover, I have always found the "inverted bow" of late-19th-early-20th century warships to be kind of ugly.  Also the "tumblehome" where the ship is narrower at the main deck than at the waterline.

HMS Dreadnought.  Yuck.

USS Indianapolis.  😍😍

U

USS Zumwalt.  Yuck again.  The more things change, the more they stay the same.  Apparently, an inverted bow combined with a below-the-waterline bulb is the superior form, hydrodynamically.

[Hpara759 1787]

On 9/4/2022 at 1:59 PM, RPM said:

Strong stim.

 

[Bobby_Batronic 1994]

11 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

As a warship (really all ships) lover, I have always found the "inverted bow" of late-19th-early-20th century warships to be kind of ugly.  Also the "tumblehome" where the ship is narrower at the main deck than at the waterline.

HMS Dreadnought.  Yuck.

USS Indianapolis.  😍😍

U

USS Zumwalt.  Yuck again.  The more things change, the more they stay the same.  Apparently, an inverted bow combined with a below-the-waterline bulb is the superior form, hydrodynamically.

I thought the Zumwalt had issues with following seas. Seems like I read that somewhere. It might be a more attractive ship if the low observable requirements and design phase didn’t make it look like a foreshortened traffic cone.

I’ve wondered if “looks right, flies right” applies to ships at sea as the Indy certainly looks a lot more right, but the tumblehome hull does seem to be better suited to handling higher sea states. I’ve seen a move towards that with offshore service vessels, some smaller freighters and a cruise ship or two.

[Jkwellborn 6995]

I think they should drag it onto the land like the boats at Seawolf park in Galveston. In 50 years no one will really care about it, so If it's not cheap and easy to take care of, they'll eventually quit on her.  It will just cost too much.  

Took my little boy down there last year. He enjoyed it.

We went to Galveston on Labor Day weekend and went down to see the Texas. He was pretty excited since he’s really into WW2 stuff and it is on one of the Call of Duty games

[Ag with kids 581]

 

[TwiceHorn 31948]

On 9/11/2022 at 10:38 AM, Bobby_Batronic said:

I thought the Zumwalt had issues with following seas. Seems like I read that somewhere. It might be a more attractive ship if the low observable requirements and design phase didn’t make it look like a foreshortened traffic cone.

I’ve wondered if “looks right, flies right” applies to ships at sea as the Indy certainly looks a lot more right, but the tumblehome hull does seem to be better suited to handling higher sea states. I’ve seen a move towards that with offshore service vessels, some smaller freighters and a cruise ship or two.

Also interesting that Indy seems to have some tumblehome amidships, but I think that's the "torpedo bulge," also discussed in the Texas hull video above.  Tumblehome for a different purpose.

A lot of good it did her.

[elfenix 34636]

Drydock tours available

https://battleshiptexas.org/drydock/

[elfenix 34636]

the laws of quantum mechanics allow a particle to be in two states at once, and techincally that could apply to battleships

 

 

[Jkwellborn 6995]

Drydock tours available

https://battleshiptexas.org/drydock/

With that had been an option when I was down there. My son would have loved it.

[TwiceHorn 31948]

Question for anyone that might know, was the "bridge" on top of the tripod mast where commanding/senior officers fought the ship or more of an observation/fire-direction platform?

I learned not too long ago that the Royal Navy was dedicated to fighting a ship from an open bridge and built ships that way until I believe well into WWII and the USN sort of followed that for many years, but enclosed fighting bridges relatively early by comparison.

Edited June 26, 2023 by TwiceHorn

[Braff Zacklin 13675]

34 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:

Question for anyone that might know, was the "bridge" on top of the tripod mast where commanding/senior officers fought the ship or more of an observation/fire-direction platform?

I learned not too long ago that the Royal Navy was dedicated to fighting a ship from an open bridge and built ships that way until I believe well into WWII and the USN sort of followed that for many years, but enclosed fighting bridges relatively early by comparison.

I'm no naval architect, but I believe the structure beneath the tripod mast is the navigation bridge, where the ship is conned and steered, and the structure on top of the tripod is a flying bridge of sorts for fire control and observation.

There's a lot here to digest, the vast majority of it extraneous to your question, but given your interest in the subject matter, it seems like you won't mind. Interesting material as it was originally published in December 1942.

https://www.history.navy.mil/research/library/online-reading-room/title-list-alphabetically/s/ship-shapes-anatomy-and-types-of-naval-vessels.html

[TwiceHorn 31948]

9 hours ago, Braff Zacklin said:

I'm no naval architect, but I believe the structure beneath the tripod mast is the navigation bridge, where the ship is conned and steered, and the structure on top of the tripod is a flying bridge of sorts for fire control and observation.

There's a lot here to digest, the vast majority of it extraneous to your question, but given your interest in the subject matter, it seems like you won't mind. Interesting material as it was originally published in December 1942.

https://www.history.navy.mil/research/library/online-reading-room/title-list-alphabetically/s/ship-shapes-anatomy-and-types-of-naval-vessels.html

I believe you are correct.  And, normally the ship would be fought from a position near the helm or pilothouse, so the navigation bridge.  But stranger things.

Also, sometimes when operating as a flagship, there were two discrete bridges:  the captain's bridge, for fighting the ship, and a separate flag bridge from which the flag officer commanded the fleet/task force, etc.  And the flag bridge tended to be above, sometimes merely a deck, and sometimes a good bit higher.

[Macanudo 13227]

Holy shit, Twice.    Thanks for that rabbit hole.    That's an amazing website.

 

[TwiceHorn 31948]

6 minutes ago, Macanudo said:

Holy shit, Twice.    Thanks for that rabbit hole.    That's an amazing website.

 

Wasn't me, man.

[Macanudo 13227]

Oh, crap.   Thanks Braff.   That's a timewaster extraordinaire. 

[Armybrat 41270]

I prefer the physical books.

 

[Armybrat 41270]

Found this Battleship Texas pamphlet inside one of those books:

 

[Chad Fuck 18072]

21 minutes ago, Armybrat said:

Found this Battleship Texas pamphlet inside one of those books:

 

I used to have this tacked on my wall as a kid after a visit.

Man, I still need to get down there and see the dry dock tour.

 

[Deej 77612]

4 hours ago, Armybrat said:

I prefer the physical books.

 

I always figured you were unhappy with the move from sharing stories by spoken word to print. 

[Armybrat 41270]

21 hours ago, Deej said:

I always figured you were unhappy with the move from sharing stories by spoken word to print. 

I guess that is worth a grunt of rep.

[ConferenceRoom 6209]

On 11/21/2022 at 2:41 AM, elfenix said:

Drydock tours available

https://battleshiptexas.org/drydock/

Thanks for this. Went yesterday and had a blast. Highly recommend for anyone on the fence, well worth the price of admission. 

[hullabelew 3730]

On 8/30/2022 at 12:14 PM, Brisketexan said:

You missed the 4th spot:  somewhere in the Red River, where it can relentlessly shell Oklahoma.

I like this idea.  Put it on the Red River by I35, or in Wilbarger County where those bastards are still pushing BLM to take that stretch of land south of the Red River.  Fucking thieves.  

[RPM 26539]

Put her in Lake Texhoma and dare them sumbitches to get their feet wet.

[Bobby_Batronic 1994]

2 hours ago, hullabelew said:

I like this idea.  Put it on the Red River by I35, or in Wilbarger County where those bastards are still pushing BLM to take that stretch of land south of the Red River.  Fucking thieves.  

Honestly, they can have the stretch from Electra to Quanah imo. 

[Evil Bill Obrien 3479]

On 7/10/2023 at 10:52 AM, ConferenceRoom said:

Thanks for this. Went yesterday and had a blast. Highly recommend for anyone on the fence, well worth the price of admission. 

Want to echo this, my brother and myself took our Dad on a Drydock tour for Father's Day and it was awesome:

[Chad Fuck 18072]

Well that's that. I bought my ticket.  See you guys there.

[Chad Fuck 18072]

So they’re shutting down tours for August because it’s too damned hot. The Leg gave them $25m to fix some more stuff, so they’re likely in dry dock at least through the end of 2023, perhaps into the spring of 2024. They’re going to resume dry dock tours in September for an indefinite period. So if you want to see the ship, which I highly recommend, book it.




Here you can see the measurements of the steel depth on the bow in thousands of an inch. Anything below a third they consider replacing or patching.

One of 157 blocks on which the ship rests. Bottom to top it’s oak sheet, concrete block, sand table, oak sheet, oak block.



These are the new torpedo blisters. The guide explained that they were not sure if they could maintain buoyancy with the 1912 hulk profile, which some were advocating. It doesn’t need to have the fairing down underneath the hull as it’s never going to be under steam again.



Ship bottom with steel plate removed so you can see the state before sandblasting, steel replacement, reframing.


Marks for checking the torpedo blister welds.

[Chad Fuck 18072]

Permanently fixed rudder.


The ship is settling. They measure it very simply. They’ve welded a piece of angle iron to the stern and to the drydock. They mesure the bend to determine movement. It was slightly bent when they welded it.

The guide explained that the 88/89 drydock repairs were really effective. There has been almost no rust externally. So they’ve determined the ship is rusting from the inside out.


View aft to forward underneath starboard side.


There’s a very tiny green dot on a patch just top center of this photo. That’s were a German shell from Cherbourg penetrated the hull but did not explode. The shell currently remains aboard.




That crazy Dreadnaught bow.

Go check it out and drop them a little money. Every bit helps.

[elfenix 34636]

Moving just across the way to Pier 21

https://www.galvnews.com/news/final-agreements-dead-ahead-for-uss-texas-at-pier-21/article_de9877e7-acd3-553a-ae88-f2ef3f410e70.html

[Chad Fuck 18072]

15 minutes ago, elfenix said:

Moving just across the way to Pier 21

https://www.galvnews.com/news/final-agreements-dead-ahead-for-uss-texas-at-pier-21/article_de9877e7-acd3-553a-ae88-f2ef3f410e70.html

They were alluding to this on the tour, but didn't want to put out any specifics.  They said things like, "There's an open berth just across from the yard on Galveston Island.  But that's none of my business."  

[Nice Guy Eddie 13658]

why is the rudder permanently fixed at an angle? 

[Chad Fuck 18072]

2 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

why is the rudder permanently fixed at an angle? 

The guide said there are various rumors, but they're not exactly sure.  The primary rumor is that the Navy fixed it that way when they gave it up so that it couldn't be used again.  Of course, this seems dubious as it was an old ship in 1946 and no one was ever going to use it again anyhow.  While it may've been fixed at that time, it also seems likely that a lack of maintaining the steering mechanisms in general could've contributed.  There are some gaskets that have to be regularly changed out back there to keep the rudder turning, and no one has done any of that since it was handed over by the Navy.  There was never any reason to do so and other maintenance tasks were always more pressing.  There's a high likelihood all the mechanisms are frozen together at this point.   It isn't leaking, so they aren't messing with it.  

They are contemplating doing a t-shirt with the ship profile and the motto "Come and Straighten It", which I would buy if they did.  Pretty good inside joke there. 

Edited August 25, 2023 by Chad Fuck

[Braff Zacklin 13675]

Personally, the bow-on shots of the Texas in drydock are awesome.

What a leviathan!

And for good measure, here's one from astern, depicting the deflected rudder.

Jealous of those who get to see this landmark up close.

[BearSchlong 8209]

They were alluding to this on the tour, but didn't want to put out any specifics.  They said things like, "There's an open berth just across from the yard on Galveston Island.  But that's none of my business."  

Tillman gonna monetize. And in this case, that is the highest and best use for the ship IMO.

[Chad Fuck 18072]

16 minutes ago, BearSchlong said:

Tillman gonna monetize. And in this case, that is the highest and best use for the ship IMO.

Agreed.  You have to get paying customers onto the ship.  So the obvious answer is to park it where there are the most potential paying customers.

San Jacinto, unfortunately, was not that.  

[GoPokes83 2244]

Agreed.  You have to get paying customers onto the ship.  So the obvious answer is to park it where there are the most potential paying customers.
San Jacinto, unfortunately, was not that.  

What’ll happen to the SJ location?

[Chad Fuck 18072]

What’ll happen to the SJ location?

Great question. I haven’t seen or heard anything about it.

Maybe they’ll park this there when it’s days are through so they’ll have a smaller ship a few people can see?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_San_Jacinto_(CG-56)?wprov=sfti1

[Ghost of LL 15660]

On 6/26/2023 at 5:38 AM, TwiceHorn said:

I believe you are correct.  And, normally the ship would be fought from a position near the helm or pilothouse, so the navigation bridge.  But stranger things.

Also, sometimes when operating as a flagship, there were two discrete bridges:  the captain's bridge, for fighting the ship, and a separate flag bridge from which the flag officer commanded the fleet/task force, etc.  And the flag bridge tended to be above, sometimes merely a deck, and sometimes a good bit higher.

When I toured the USS Missouri over the summer, I was struck by the number of command centers.  You had the Combat Engagement Center, the navigation bridge, and a flying bridge (open air a deck above the navigation bridge)--all serving a different purpose.

The wildest thing was on the navigation bridge, the helm was located inside a bunker in the center of the bridge.  And when I mean a bunker, I mean a bunker.  It is a small circular room surrounded by probably three feet of steel.  They really didn't want that helm getting shot away.

[BachelorTrek 3254]

On 8/25/2023 at 2:17 PM, Braff Zacklin said:

Personally, the bow-on shots of the Texas in drydock are awesome.

What a leviathan!

And for good measure, here's one from astern, depicting the deflected rudder.

Jealous of those who get to see this landmark up close.

I saw it look just like that from across the Ship Channel when it was in drydock in Galveston in '89-90.

 

And this is a screengrab of her stern on May 14, 2023.

[BachelorTrek 3254]

On 8/25/2023 at 2:17 PM, Braff Zacklin said:

Personally, the bow-on shots of the Texas in drydock are awesome.

What a leviathan!

And for good measure, here's one from astern, depicting the deflected rudder.

Jealous of those who get to see this landmark up close.

One of my Mom's many uncles served on her during WWII, so soon after the Battleship Texas opened to the public at the San Jacinto Monument berth, my Mom, her brother, and her parents got a guided tour by her uncle, who showed them his duty stations, around the places he knew where he lived and worked on the ship, and especially "those damn brass fittings/(whatever) I was responsible for shining-up every goddamn day!" -- much to the amusement of his brother and sister-in-law (my grandparents) and his family, including my Mom.  Lulz.

[elfenix 34636]

The U.S.S. Texas, Once the World’s Most Formidable Battleship, Gets a Dramatic Makeover


https://www.texasmonthly.com/being-texan/battleship-texas/

[83Horn 1662]

 

[Chad Fuck 18072]

Looks like it is to be as we had expected:

https://www.chron.com/gulf-coast/article/battleship-texas-galveston-deal-18467432.php?utm_campaign=CMS&fbclid=IwAR2SxvaKgLYCbWZcUICHz8CEV8FKFTvkFIVw7Uca_BOPZnLtpv-sbicBmcE_aem_AVfVEUxwmpzWdfvoSW_LGByXDH5RtJZyPWWL3q4HkYbv8wWRfWtDDBLphFsvJzeX2Hk&mibextid=S66gvF

 

Quote

Battleship Texas much closer to securing permanent home in Galveston

The first step is a ten-year lease with the port, coming in at $20,000 a month or more depending on the weather

 

[CycleTex87 2998]

Signed up for this tour in December with my warship buff son.  Looking forward to it. 

[Braff Zacklin 13675]

Please take and share lots of pics, @CycleTex87.

[atomheartbevo 90480]

On 11/7/2023 at 2:16 PM, CycleTex87 said:

Signed up for this tour in December with my warship buff son.  Looking forward to it. 

Did you see it before or after the new paint job?

 

[CycleTex87 2998]

That is interesting. We saw it before all that painting was done.  I’ll have dig up my pictures. We saw it on Dec 3 and they were still doing bottom work and replacing sections of hull. 

[CycleTex87 2998]

Here are some pix from Dec 3:

[RPM 26539]

The old girl can still turn a head or two.

[TwiceHorn 31948]

Looks like New Jersey got next. https://www.inquirer.com/business/battleship-new-jersey-dry-dock-philadelphia-20240102.html